| Time |
Nick |
Message |
| 00:11 |
|
luk3yx joined #minetest |
| 00:25 |
|
ShadowBot joined #minetest |
| 00:38 |
|
FreeFull joined #minetest |
| 01:01 |
|
jordan4ibanez joined #minetest |
| 01:25 |
|
smk joined #minetest |
| 01:46 |
|
v-rob joined #minetest |
| 02:04 |
|
Soni joined #minetest |
| 03:13 |
|
hmmmm joined #minetest |
| 03:14 |
|
v-rob joined #minetest |
| 03:25 |
|
gxt__ joined #minetest |
| 03:59 |
|
Lesha_Vel joined #minetest |
| 04:00 |
|
MTDiscord joined #minetest |
| 04:07 |
|
YuGiOhJCJ joined #minetest |
| 04:47 |
|
BuckarooBanzai joined #minetest |
| 04:56 |
|
BuckarooBanzai joined #minetest |
| 05:28 |
|
imi joined #minetest |
| 05:30 |
|
calcul0n joined #minetest |
| 05:46 |
|
calcul0n joined #minetest |
| 06:29 |
|
ln5 joined #minetest |
| 06:44 |
|
Fusl joined #minetest |
| 06:45 |
|
pounce joined #minetest |
| 06:50 |
|
appguru joined #minetest |
| 06:57 |
|
duds` joined #minetest |
| 07:28 |
|
duds` joined #minetest |
| 07:57 |
|
YuGiOhJCJ joined #minetest |
| 08:01 |
|
kamdard_ joined #minetest |
| 08:49 |
|
Markow joined #minetest |
| 08:59 |
imi |
why math.tointeger doesn't exist in my minetest lua? |
| 09:00 |
rubenwardy |
integers don't exist in our version of lua, use tonumber and math.floor |
| 09:00 |
rubenwardy |
MT uses Lua 5.1 and LuaJIT |
| 09:01 |
rubenwardy |
I believe integers were added in Lua 5.3 |
| 09:20 |
imi |
I see, thanks |
| 10:42 |
|
appguru joined #minetest |
| 10:55 |
|
FreeFull joined #minetest |
| 11:06 |
imi |
can I have hidden fields in formspec similar to html <input type="hidden"> ? |
| 11:07 |
rubenwardy |
you can make field have no width/height |
| 11:07 |
rubenwardy |
but I suspect what you actually want to do is store information between gui send/receive, in which case use a context |
| 11:07 |
rubenwardy |
~book formspec |
| 11:07 |
rubenwardy |
!book formspec |
| 11:07 |
MinetestBot |
rubenwardy: GUIs (Formspecs) - https://rubenwardy.com/minetest_modding_book/en/players/formspecs.html |
| 11:08 |
rubenwardy |
(a context is a per-player table stored on the server) |
| 11:25 |
|
proller joined #minetest |
| 11:26 |
|
appguru joined #minetest |
| 11:30 |
|
duds` joined #minetest |
| 11:40 |
|
appguru joined #minetest |
| 11:40 |
imi |
ok thanks |
| 12:12 |
|
appguru joined #minetest |
| 12:19 |
|
proller joined #minetest |
| 12:55 |
|
Noisytoot joined #minetest |
| 12:59 |
|
duds` joined #minetest |
| 14:19 |
|
sparky4 joined #minetest |
| 15:02 |
|
definitelya joined #minetest |
| 15:04 |
|
Leopold joined #minetest |
| 15:42 |
|
Desour joined #minetest |
| 16:09 |
|
fluxionary joined #minetest |
| 16:15 |
|
Talkless joined #minetest |
| 16:21 |
|
mrkubax10 joined #minetest |
| 16:27 |
definitelya |
|/!\ Cubees >>> Voxey /!\ |
| 16:39 |
|
dv^_^ joined #minetest |
| 17:43 |
MTDiscord |
<Flamore> i don't think that minetest engine features bees |
| 17:51 |
|
Boingo joined #minetest |
| 17:59 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> TBH, IDK of any rename for minetest that would work that doesnt involve a reference to cubes/voxels. Maybe OpenWorld. But, as minetest can already be used for non-openworld games, meh. |
| 17:59 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> Any idea kickstarts? |
| 18:00 |
Blockhead256[m] |
I prefer the name "Minet" |
| 18:00 |
Blockhead256[m] |
It's unique, but still a nod to the old name and to mining |
| 18:00 |
Blockhead256[m] |
the pronunciation is up in the air "minety" or "min-ette" |
| 18:01 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> oh, um, that actually works |
| 18:01 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> I'd post that on the issue |
| 18:02 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> if I were you |
| 18:02 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> "Minet" works well also because while we know it's Mineter than a lot of other games, it might not necessarily be the absolute Mintest anymore. |
| 18:02 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> :groan: |
| 18:03 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Also, I have a hard time not pronouncing it as "mi-NAY" |
| 18:03 |
Desour |
it's Minet => MinetEst *spongebob* |
| 18:03 |
|
proller joined #minetest |
| 18:04 |
Blockhead256[m] |
posted |
| 18:04 |
Blockhead256[m] |
yeah pronunciation is the problem posted by Minet |
| 18:04 |
Blockhead256[m] |
I still like it though |
| 18:04 |
Blockhead256[m] |
s/posted/posed |
| 18:05 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Plenty of names can work for a game engine that have nothing to do with cubes. If you can make it adjacent to cubes in a subtle way, then thats cute I suppose. |
| 18:05 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> Well, its not like godot's pronounciation is determined weither |
| 18:05 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> *either |
| 18:06 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> The fact that people would disagree on how to pronounce "minet" seems thematically appropriate for a game community that can't agree on how to pronounce "mese". |
| 18:06 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> You look jutht like buddy holly |
| 18:06 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> MINM <- Minetest is not Minecraft, continuing the old FOSS tradition |
| 18:06 |
celeron55 |
i propose that to officially mean: Minetest is not Minetest |
| 18:07 |
celeron55 |
that seems to partially be the theme anyway |
| 18:07 |
Desour |
MITM <- Minetest Is not a Test for Minecraft |
| 18:07 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> MAM <- Minetest aint Mine---- |
| 18:08 |
celeron55 |
or how about a logical upgrade to the name: Ourtest |
| 18:08 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> here we go again XD |
| 18:09 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> If it were "mytest" then "ourtest" would work, but since it's "minetest" it should be "ourstest" instead. |
| 18:09 |
celeron55 |
true |
| 18:09 |
MTDiscord |
<Bla> just call it "Renamed" |
| 18:09 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> I mean we wont have another opportunity to remove "test" |
| 18:09 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> MineStaging |
| 18:10 |
celeron55 |
Minerelease |
| 18:10 |
celeron55 |
we can restart from v1.0 while at it |
| 18:10 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> ouch |
| 18:11 |
MTDiscord |
<Bla> alphabetical versioning ;- ) |
| 18:12 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> I'm torn between doing the Minecraft "restart from 1 and make all version numbers confusing" thing, vs the evergreen browser "just give up on compat promises and bump major every time we sneeze" thing. So maybe we can compromise and release like v128.1.0.0, where "1.0.0" is the actual semver part of the version and we just bump the first number so that technically we never make compat promises that could be broken. |
| 18:12 |
Desour |
Ninetest |
| 18:12 |
Desour |
Neintest |
| 18:12 |
celeron55 |
Oursrelease, but shortened to O'release. Then everyone can make silly poems while waiting for a new release |
| 18:13 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Jamble, Messe, Oerken, Cluox, Boxshed, Im Making This Up As I Go |
| 18:13 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> voox |
| 18:13 |
Desour |
Boxshed yes |
| 18:13 |
celeron55 |
i like the obscure O'. The O'mese Engine |
| 18:13 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Better do a trademark search down the cleaning products aisle at your store first, just in case. |
| 18:13 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> actually, Boxshed +1 |
| 18:14 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> That was a joke |
| 18:14 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Boxshed looks like it would be hard to pronounce correctly. |
| 18:14 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Because its a cube (box) engine where all we do is bikeshed |
| 18:14 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> voxhed |
| 18:15 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> like it'd sound like bock-shed in a GA accent. We don't do that awkward stuff like "mathsths" stuff that Brits do. |
| 18:15 |
celeron55 |
bikengine |
| 18:15 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> I was going to suggest Reboxed, but that would conflict in a different department |
| 18:15 |
celeron55 |
the funny thing is, i think nobody would complain about any of these proposed names as they do about minetest if these are what the name would have originally been. so all of them are better |
| 18:15 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> Remine'd |
| 18:15 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> "Reboxed" sounds like a great way to get frivolous trademark threats from both game developers AND show developers. |
| 18:15 |
celeron55 |
of course assuming another brand didn't force a name switch due to trademark law |
| 18:15 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> *shoe developers |
| 18:16 |
celeron55 |
I like Remine'd |
| 18:16 |
Desour |
I'm worried that the new name will be hard to write correctly after hearing it. i.e. voxhed could be written vokshed, if I pronounce it correctly. and kutiko could be written with c |
| 18:16 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> VoxBox was also in my idea list but I wanted to steer clear of voxel names |
| 18:16 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> ok Ill post it |
| 18:16 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> I wonder if "untrademarkable" as a name would give pause to anyone reviewing a hostile trademark application 😄 |
| 18:17 |
celeron55 |
or, really, to be honest, i like any name, including minetest. the weirder the better |
| 18:17 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> My "backup" name for NodeCore, should I ever be compelled to do a rename, is "Capsicum" |
| 18:18 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Hmm, for Minetest, I like the name Build With Blocks, Then Get Bored (BWB:TGB for short) |
| 18:18 |
celeron55 |
just picking up a random spice or whatever and using that as the name of the project is fun |
| 18:18 |
celeron55 |
you always forget what the name was |
| 18:19 |
celeron55 |
a bit like every desktop linux program created in the 2010s |
| 18:19 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Hmm, spice ... how about Minelange 😄 |
| 18:19 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> Creeate |
| 18:19 |
celeron55 |
Bored Blocks World... wait |
| 18:19 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> If you want to follow a more unix naming pattern, just make the name "mt" |
| 18:20 |
celeron55 |
i almost suggested "MT", but "mt" is even better |
| 18:20 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Big Boredom Cube.. aha |
| 18:20 |
MTDiscord |
<ROllerozxa> uh oh |
| 18:20 |
celeron55 |
it's a bit like Qt, but more m |
| 18:21 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> As if we didn't already have issues with that one highly unfortunate anagram 😏 |
| 18:21 |
Desour |
mt pronounced englishly is "empty" |
| 18:21 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> so, that would be rather unfortunate |
| 18:22 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> That's sort of nicely subliminal |
| 18:22 |
celeron55 |
"mte", but the letters and words rotated to "emt". It's a finnish informal shorthand for "i don't know" |
| 18:22 |
Desour |
well, if you don't install anything, minetest is kinda empty |
| 18:22 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Tell that to builtin |
| 18:22 |
celeron55 |
Desour: that's perfect |
| 18:23 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> ok. well. mt, someone post it |
| 18:23 |
celeron55 |
now just tell me what sort of web domain it could possibly have |
| 18:23 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> mt.world |
| 18:24 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> that would be bad |
| 18:24 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Minétest |
| 18:24 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> (minimal malicious compliance rename) |
| 18:24 |
Desour |
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MT_Framework?useskin=vector |
| 18:24 |
celeron55 |
ok that sounds slightly risky |
| 18:24 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> oh well |
| 18:24 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> "Game? Engine?" |
| 18:25 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> "MT stands for Multi-Thread" ... pinnacle irony. |
| 18:25 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> we should just call MT VoxelManip ✨ |
| 18:25 |
Desour |
can we reverse-acronym mt? |
| 18:25 |
|
proller joined #minetest |
| 18:25 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> You might have to buy the rights off of Roller for that by now though. |
| 18:26 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> yeah how about, mt.tm |
| 18:26 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> IdentiT (crisis) |
| 18:26 |
celeron55 |
Sphere Engine |
| 18:26 |
celeron55 |
with only cubes to be found |
| 18:26 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> About that |
| 18:26 |
celeron55 |
that would be perfect too |
| 18:26 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> minetest grade sphere approximation: cube |
| 18:27 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> Cryptikube |
| 18:27 |
celeron55 |
Perttu's Mod |
| 18:27 |
celeron55 |
i mean it works for the other one |
| 18:28 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> then we might as well call this Boblox |
| 18:28 |
Desour |
how about human names, like "Bob" |
| 18:28 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Robary's World of Craft |
| 18:28 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Just call it Lox: Roblox but without the robbery. |
| 18:28 |
celeron55 |
ah i've always wanted to go to jail with millions of debt |
| 18:28 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> excellent |
| 18:28 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> Lox isnt bad |
| 18:29 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> Lox is just for learning |
| 18:29 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> (if we're talking about Bob's Lox) |
| 18:29 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Talking about Lox now makes me want bagels. |
| 18:29 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> but not ones dunked in liquid oxygen, thanks. |
| 18:29 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Let's accept our ecosystem and name it after food |
| 18:30 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Bagel seems fine |
| 18:30 |
Desour |
apple |
| 18:30 |
celeron55 |
8D |
| 18:31 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> ^^^^^^^ |
| 18:31 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Good thinking |
| 18:31 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> This can't go wrong |
| 18:31 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> Its happy, at least |
| 18:32 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> 8D? Where are the other 5 dimensions!? |
| 18:32 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> The AirSword Game Engine |
| 18:32 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> "This is Onion Engine" "What, does it have layers?" "No, it makes you cry once you cut into it." |
| 18:32 |
celeron55 |
well 8D was my reaction, but also yes that's a brand i use for various things. i wouldn't mind this engine/platform being named after that too |
| 18:33 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> if 8 == D then print("I wish I was in Dixie") end |
| 18:33 |
Desour |
GreenXenith: nice |
| 18:33 |
celeron55 |
altough, the actual brand is 8Dromeda. 8D by itself is very much taken |
| 18:33 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Re: "onion engine", the tor project would like to [not] know your location. |
| 18:34 |
celeron55 |
it would be 8Dromeda Engine or something in that case |
| 18:35 |
MTDiscord |
<Bla> Blo(r)cks "bugfixing is futile" |
| 18:35 |
Desour |
we could also choose some cool/stupid name, like MandelTür |
| 18:35 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> GameCube |
| 18:35 |
celeron55 |
i like Blorcks |
| 18:35 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> Blork? |
| 18:35 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Blorcks sounds a lot like the kind of sound effect you'd make the first time you open up lua_api.md. |
| 18:35 |
Desour |
Blorks? |
| 18:35 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Blaks |
| 18:36 |
celeron55 |
blorks is fine too. a bit less ridiculous for those who enjoy not being ridiculous (not me) |
| 18:36 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Blokes |
| 18:36 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Blauks |
| 18:36 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> Vloxr |
| 18:36 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Since we can't agree on a single replacement name, maybe we should just generate a random one as part of the build scripts each time. |
| 18:36 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> Vluax |
| 18:36 |
Blockhead256[m] |
the blorg collective |
| 18:36 |
celeron55 |
that's what firefox tried back in the day |
| 18:36 |
celeron55 |
or, i mean mozilla |
| 18:36 |
MTDiscord |
<Bla> and I just tried to be ridiculous lol |
| 18:36 |
celeron55 |
firefox was one of names |
| 18:37 |
celeron55 |
then people stopped them from making up new names |
| 18:37 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> MineWeasel |
| 18:37 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> EMFMTG (Engine Made For Minetest Game) |
| 18:37 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> I always thought that Minecraft had mining and crafting, but Minetest had digging and crafting instead of mining and testing. It should really have been called Digcraft. |
| 18:37 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> That looks more like a curse word |
| 18:37 |
celeron55 |
blorg sounds cool also |
| 18:37 |
celeron55 |
blorg.org :D |
| 18:37 |
celeron55 |
i need this |
| 18:38 |
celeron55 |
it's taken though |
| 18:38 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> "Eh, MFing MineTest Game" does sometimes sum up how I feel at times too, so I could get behind EMFMTG. |
| 18:38 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> bl.org |
| 18:38 |
Desour |
Di**craft |
| 18:38 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> no |
| 18:38 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> There's no way that bl.org isn't taken and I'm a tad scared to try to open that URL. |
| 18:39 |
Blockhead256[m] |
that's where a WHOIS lookup can help |
| 18:39 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Let's find out |
| 18:39 |
celeron55 |
minet.net is a bit like blorg.org |
| 18:39 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> "Di**craft" but its pronounced "D. I. to the power of craft" |
| 18:39 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> yeah lets use minet |
| 18:39 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> inet |
| 18:39 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> net |
| 18:39 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> et |
| 18:39 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> t |
| 18:39 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> bl.org is a relic of the 90s |
| 18:39 |
Desour |
mi.net |
| 18:39 |
celeron55 |
minet.* is taken also though |
| 18:40 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> If we use minet it'd be really lovely if we could somehow negotiate for mi.net, but I can't imagine we'd ever see the kind of money necessary to buy something that short. |
| 18:40 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> minest |
| 18:40 |
celeron55 |
you need a longer more obscure name for the domains to be available, like, let's say... minetest.* back in the day |
| 18:40 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> mi.net isnt taken |
| 18:40 |
celeron55 |
for sure it is |
| 18:40 |
celeron55 |
there's just nothing there |
| 18:41 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> ah then it could be bought perhaps |
| 18:41 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Don't confuse "not taken" as "the people who own it have not opted to run a web server on it" |
| 18:41 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> and for something as short as mi.net, I have a hard time imagining a selling price under 5 figures USD. |
| 18:42 |
Blockhead256[m] |
this is why weird 2LDs like .id.au are good for getting short names :) |
| 18:42 |
Blockhead256[m] |
terrible for the brand probably though lul |
| 18:42 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Sometimes you'll find a short domain like that for like $50k or so, and sometimes it will be a few million, like if they know that somebody will really want it and nobody has a trademark case to just take it by force 😄 |
| 18:43 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Hmm, let's call it "Minetrust" and then have constant debates about rewriting it in Rust, but never actually get around to starting on that. |
| 18:43 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> qbuh |
| 18:43 |
Desour |
btw. minete.st could exist. (.st is São Tomé and Príncipe) |
| 18:43 |
Blockhead256[m] |
pfft trademark law |
| 18:43 |
Blockhead256[m] |
good luck if the registrant is in somewhere like Russia |
| 18:44 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> well if the domain authority isn't in russia... |
| 18:44 |
Blockhead256[m] |
one of my favourite domains I recently saw was gg.gg (in a spam email) |
| 18:44 |
MTDiscord |
<Bla> fsh = formspec hell lol |
| 18:45 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> Modding Hell |
| 18:45 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Hmm, let's see.. Lua is moon.. C++ is a terrifying monster... moon monster... wearwolf.. I don't know where I'm going with this |
| 18:45 |
Desour |
C++ never renamed |
| 18:46 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Werewolf* warewolf* |
| 18:46 |
Blockhead256[m] |
minetest.ru also exists - squatted/never used domain |
| 18:46 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> If I owned gg.gg, I would totally have subdomains like gg.gg.gg.gg.gg and stuff. |
| 18:46 |
Blockhead256[m] |
never renamed? What about C with classes? |
| 18:46 |
Desour |
ok, right |
| 18:46 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Werewolves also fit with the idea that Minetest looks sorta normal from the outside but is terrifying on the inside |
| 18:46 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> wherewolf ... wsorwolf ... |
| 18:47 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> self-awarewolf |
| 18:47 |
Desour |
ihmissusi? |
| 18:48 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> hypervox |
| 18:49 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Ick, I don't want to see "hyper" in the name of an engine with gaussian curvature == 1 |
| 18:49 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> That's false advertising. |
| 18:49 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Hypovox |
| 18:49 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> dypervox? |
| 18:49 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> 😆 |
| 18:50 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Hypvoxia |
| 18:50 |
MTDiscord |
<Bla> maybe instead of suggesting names it would be easier to vote for whose pet creates the new name by running over a keyboard |
| 18:50 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Can't be one of my cats. They have a tendency to either open devtools or just close the entire app. |
| 18:51 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Easier to run over a keyboard with my car |
| 18:51 |
Blockhead256[m] |
disadvantages those who don't have pets |
| 18:51 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Even if you don't have a pet, you have a forehead. |
| 18:51 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> Uncubate |
| 18:51 |
MTDiscord |
<Bla> just through your pet rock at the keyboard |
| 18:51 |
Blockhead256[m] |
yhju |
| 18:51 |
MTDiscord |
<Bla> *throw |
| 18:52 |
Blockhead256[m] |
the forehead hath spoken |
| 18:52 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Hypvoxia actually sounds like a real name I could imagine someone using, especially if they don't know what hypoxia means... |
| 18:52 |
Desour |
FAQ: Q: Why is this project called hhhhhhhhhhhhhhfshhhhhhhhhhhhhs? A: We've used a cat to choose the name. |
| 18:52 |
Blockhead256[m] |
I'm sure someone can figure out the right vowels to throw in there and make it a Finnish compound word |
| 18:53 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> I like the fact that hhhhhhhhfshhhhhhhhhs tells me a lot about the kind of cat, i.e. one who was calm enough to actually sit down on some keys instead of just running across. |
| 18:53 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> We should just have everyone post cat videos and then vote on cats. |
| 18:53 |
Desour |
(sorry, this was just me, not an actual cat) |
| 18:53 |
rubenwardy |
cats? wheres the cats? |
| 18:54 |
Desour |
!cat |
| 18:54 |
MinetestBot |
http://i.imgur.com/foNWNCA.jpg |
| 18:54 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> (yes, I could tell it wasn't a real cat, and that fact alone is kind of bizarre now that I think about it) |
| 18:54 |
potatoxel[m] |
meow |
| 18:54 |
potatoxel[m] |
i wub blobcats |
| 18:54 |
* potatoxel[m] |
uploaded an image: (44KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/matrix.org/FgVgtEaOneTGYABSdlXkebrc/meow_owo.png > |
| 18:54 |
potatoxel[m] |
so pwetty |
| 18:54 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> I'm scribbling on my android keyboard to see what it comes up with |
| 18:55 |
MTDiscord |
<Bla> "asdphniadsf" powered by cats on keyboards |
| 18:56 |
Desour |
we could also just translate minetest to finnish, something like miinatesti |
| 18:57 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Instead of using the cats, name it cat |
| 18:57 |
rubenwardy |
if you think about it, cat is the ideal program name |
| 18:57 |
Desour |
or: minet-set, sounds like some set described by a french mathematician |
| 18:57 |
Blockhead256[m] |
shame it's already taken |
| 18:58 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> WorldCore |
| 18:58 |
Desour |
miautest |
| 18:58 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Felen, Purcube, Meon, Nekube |
| 18:59 |
MTDiscord |
<Bla> kissa, cat in finnish |
| 18:59 |
Desour |
or miautset / miau-z / meow-z |
| 19:00 |
Blockhead256[m] |
meow-z would be the cat-anthropomorphic version of DayZ |
| 19:00 |
MTDiscord |
<Bla> imagines cats scaling a cat tree |
| 19:02 |
Blockhead256[m] |
I like Nekube |
| 19:02 |
Blockhead256[m] |
maybe that's a good idea for a cute game to publish onto ContentDB |
| 19:02 |
Blockhead256[m] |
the characters woul be like the old nyan cat node |
| 19:03 |
|
v-rob joined #minetest |
| 19:05 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> @Warr1024 nekocore |
| 19:05 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> My brain parsers nodecore as no deco re |
| 19:06 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> parses* |
| 19:06 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Heh, I've always wanted to use "Paamayim Nekodotayim" somewhere ::3 |
| 19:06 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Cats like boxes, surely we can make something work here |
| 19:07 |
muurkha |
*nekudotayim |
| 19:07 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Someone posted a ChatGPT thing in -dev where ChatGPT came up with a plausible but wrong explanation of what "nodebox" means, but it would have been funnier if it had said "it's a command line option that allows you to disable de-boxing" |
| 19:07 |
MTDiscord |
<Thresher> Voxey 😼 |
| 19:07 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> muurkha: yes, thank you for explaining the joke. |
| 19:08 |
Desour |
disable deboxing of cats |
| 19:08 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> the real joke is the turbocat operator (::3) |
| 19:08 |
muurkha |
I don't think it's possible in practice to rename minetest |
| 19:09 |
muurkha |
I wasn't explaining it, I was just correcting your spelling |
| 19:09 |
muurkha |
oh, now i see that the spelling error was itself a joke |
| 19:09 |
muurkha |
sorry, it whooshed over my muurkha head |
| 19:10 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Does celeron55 have a cat |
| 19:10 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> If so, whats its name |
| 19:10 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> And can we use it as the engine name |
| 19:10 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Does celeron55 have a cat, and if not, can we earmark donations so that they have to be spent towards getting and maintaining a cat? |
| 19:11 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Minetest: $10/month hosting budget, $90/month mascot budget. |
| 19:12 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> I have 3 cats and currently only one of them is serving mascot duty for Minetest content. 🤔 |
| 19:12 |
Desour |
~~buy me a coffee~~ buy my cat some food |
| 19:12 |
|
Wuzzy joined #minetest |
| 19:12 |
MTDiscord |
<Bla> would also allow rubenwardy to sell cat stuff next to server licenses lol |
| 19:12 |
Wuzzy |
I have to give credit where credit is due. |
| 19:13 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> send pics |
| 19:13 |
Desour |
Warr1024: I want to see the mascot |
| 19:13 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> With how much we are bikeshedding this, Boxshed becomes ever more accurate |
| 19:13 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Blockshed perhaps |
| 19:13 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Blorgshed, even |
| 19:14 |
Wuzzy |
Today, almost 5 years ago, nerzhul predicted Discord will still exist today. Well, I have to admit that nerzhul was right. XD |
| 19:14 |
Desour |
no de-shed |
| 19:14 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> Wuzzy: We're locked into the walled garden |
| 19:14 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> (also alternatives aren't as good as they ought to be) |
| 19:14 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> 3.2k trapped in the walled garden, oh no |
| 19:14 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Anyway |
| 19:15 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Messeshed |
| 19:15 |
Wuzzy |
you mean YOU are locked in the walled garden. not me :P |
| 19:15 |
Blockhead256[m] |
^^ this IRC channel looks fine to me |
| 19:15 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> Yes, we \ Wuzzy |
| 19:15 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> we \ {Wuzzy}* |
| 19:15 |
Desour |
I guess discord will now follow the social media life-cycle: be replaced by another proprietary service, loose all of its young-aged users, and slowly die |
| 19:15 |
Desour |
just like it replaced whatsapp |
| 19:15 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> mhm maybe |
| 19:16 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Who cares |
| 19:16 |
Wuzzy |
is this another prediction? |
| 19:16 |
Warr1024 |
"Locked inside the walled garden" and yet many of us can... |
| 19:16 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> ...enter and leave freely 😄 |
| 19:16 |
muurkha |
whatsapp is still the most mainstream communications system here, Desour |
| 19:16 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Back to bikeshedding |
| 19:16 |
muurkha |
lots of businesses only do business over whatsapp |
| 19:16 |
muurkha |
lots of people can only be contacted over whatsapp |
| 19:16 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> if this is a prediction, it hopefully be better than Minetest's node dig prediction |
| 19:16 |
muurkha |
lots of groups only chat over whatsapp |
| 19:17 |
Desour |
muurkha: yeah, but the young kids nowadays all use discord |
| 19:17 |
muurkha |
no, young kids too |
| 19:17 |
muurkha |
they might also use discord |
| 19:17 |
Desour |
yes, another prediction. idk when it will be fulfilled though |
| 19:17 |
Wuzzy |
well then i have nothing to put into my calender XD |
| 19:17 |
Blockhead256[m] |
muurkha: what in tarnation? what's wrong with the conventional phone system? You try to run a business that's not selling nudes online in Australia without a phone number and you won't get far |
| 19:17 |
muurkha |
but the programming and math classes my wife is currently taking are full of 18-year-olds and they are using whatsapp for the class group, not discord |
| 19:18 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Shed work well outside of being a joke, since Minetest is a room full of scrap and tools to tinker with |
| 19:18 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Works* |
| 19:18 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> If you want a fun prediction, try to guess whether Discord usage will shift in age demographic and follow the cohort, or stick with the same demographic and find a new cohort. |
| 19:18 |
muurkha |
telegram and signal are far behind |
| 19:18 |
Wuzzy |
what was the command to show a message to a chatter who isnt here right now? |
| 19:18 |
MTDiscord |
Command sent from Discord by Lars: |
| 19:18 |
MTDiscord |
!talk |
| 19:18 |
MTDiscord |
Command sent from Discord by Lars: |
| 19:18 |
MTDiscord |
!tell* |
| 19:18 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> (another display of IRC inferiority) |
| 19:19 |
muurkha |
Blockhead256[m]: calling people on the phone costs money, and they won't answer because most phone calls are spam now |
| 19:19 |
Desour |
coolness* |
| 19:19 |
Blockhead256[m] |
WhatsApp is like a lingua franca for communication that is free unlike texting and supports multimedia |
| 19:19 |
Blockhead256[m] |
that's the perspective I get of it |
| 19:19 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> "Blockshed" also works well as a name for the engine in a "take it out behind the woodshed" kind of sense. |
| 19:19 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> IRC is cosy as long as everyone is online |
| 19:19 |
muurkha |
SMS also costs money and group SMSes don't work well |
| 19:19 |
Wuzzy |
the actual lingua franca is e-mail because it is supported by literally everyone. everyone should *at least* have a functional e-mail adress. what comes on top is up to you. my opinion |
| 19:20 |
muurkha |
and SMS doesn't support audio messages or give read notifications |
| 19:20 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> mhm yes e-mail |
| 19:20 |
Blockhead256[m] |
muurkha: so you exchange numbers.. heck, add contacts via whatsapp.. and so you see the name of the caller |
| 19:20 |
Blockhead256[m] |
I don't leave my mobile data and wifi on all the time, I'm not going to get your whatsapp if you need to contact me urgently |
| 19:20 |
muurkha |
you need a phone number for WhatsApp but you don't have to actually answer the phone |
| 19:20 |
|
FreeFull left #minetest |
| 19:21 |
Wuzzy |
!tell nerzhul Almost 5 years ago, you've predicted that Discord will still exist today. Well, you were right, congratulations. XD (I still hate Discord XXXXD) |
| 19:21 |
MinetestBot |
Wuzzy: I'll pass that on when nerzhul is around |
| 19:21 |
Warr1024 |
Since getting TheLounge, and being able to self-host it, Discord really has very few tangible advantages over IRC. Having a built-in file upload thing that doesn't require me to configure my web server and manage file lifecycles would be nice, I guess, but it's not like I need to pay $5 a month for a bunch of custom emoji. |
| 19:21 |
muurkha |
she says they do use discord sometimes to organize get-togethers, but WhatsApp is primary |
| 19:21 |
rubenwardy |
nrz |
| 19:21 |
muurkha |
she says WhatsApp is institutionalized here, which I think is correct |
| 19:21 |
rubenwardy |
Wuzzy: nerzhil is nrz on IRC |
| 19:21 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Whomst givest a damn which platform anyone be inclined to utilize. Live and let live. |
| 19:22 |
rubenwardy |
he appears to only be in #minetest-dev here |
| 19:22 |
|
v-rob joined #minetest |
| 19:23 |
Desour |
GreenXenith: discord is closed though. I can't even read without registering. and there are tons of invitation links everwhere pushing people to using it |
| 19:23 |
Desour |
+y* |
| 19:23 |
muurkha |
a bigger deal than the cost of making a phone call is that if your phone is out of credit you can't make the phone call |
| 19:23 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> The only truly universal chat platform I've ever seen is the "use a whole bunch of them so you have a better chance of finding one in common with somebody else" one. |
| 19:23 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> So? |
| 19:23 |
Blockhead256[m] |
the technical results of people using what works (and costs as little as possible, or provides as much convenience as possible) really are bizarre |
| 19:23 |
Blockhead256[m] |
that's human nature for you |
| 19:23 |
muurkha |
email is still pretty widely supported but I think people are a lot more likely to answer WhatsApp messages here |
| 19:23 |
Peter_Lankton |
that was an interesting decision from whoever runs the voxelmanip dot se server. usually verification systems are meant to keep bots out. but that one seems to be designed to allow bots but keep humans out. |
| 19:24 |
Desour |
it's like a religion that aggressively pushes you to follow their god and sacrifice your goods. I don't want to tolerate this. (religions that don't influence others don't have this issue though) |
| 19:24 |
Warr1024 |
Desour: you can read and write Discord via the IRC bridges ... and the portions of the Discord community that are not bridged (which is really just posts, not really *people*) is stuff that IRC users have, to varying degrees of emphasis, historically not actually cared about :-D |
| 19:24 |
rubenwardy |
Discord = cult confirmed? |
| 19:25 |
muurkha |
Warr1024: could you maybe use an ssh master socket and an IRC client script to upload a file to your web server and post the URL to the channel with a single command? |
| 19:25 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Do you feel compelled to click every link you see? Why would a public invite link push anyone? |
| 19:25 |
ROllerozxa |
Peter_Lankton: heh? |
| 19:25 |
Peter_Lankton |
oh wait i just remembered who runs it. yeah i totally get it then. anyone who is willing to make a bot to auto pass that verification would be worthy to play. |
| 19:26 |
muurkha |
Desour: "invitation links everywhere" depends on your environment; here there are WhatsApp links everywhere on people's web pages and stuff |
| 19:26 |
Warr1024 |
murrkha: TheLounge supports file uploads natively; getting the files there is not really the issue. It's managing the cruft it creates ... and the fact that I remain responsible for hosting the file throughout its lifecycle, and that there's no automatic essentially-permanent mirror for it. |
| 19:26 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Putting IRC channel addresses everywhere doesn't pressure me into using IRC, same way a discord link isn't pressuring you |
| 19:27 |
Blockhead256[m] |
so many youtubers have "their own" (Discord's) server nowadays |
| 19:27 |
Blockhead256[m] |
it gives them another metric and a free source of ideas.. and is itself free |
| 19:27 |
Blockhead256[m] |
the moderators will also do it for free |
| 19:27 |
Warr1024 |
IIRC there are only a couple of places where the Minetest Discord is officially linked to, and we are not deceptive about what people are getting into with it, and we *really* only intend discord links to be used on an "if you already happen to be on Discord" basis anyway. |
| 19:27 |
Peter_Lankton |
i guess its just funny really. that is an idea that i had for a fake joke captcha for a website designed to be annoying |
| 19:27 |
Desour |
Warr1024: the non-bridged portions would traditionally be posted elsewhere, like in a mailing list. |
| 19:27 |
ROllerozxa |
well, ever since the security question was put into place on my server there's been essentially no griefers, previously there would constantly be griefs whenever I joined it |
| 19:27 |
Warr1024 |
Yes, the pushing of Discord in SOME communities is problematic, but at least hopefully I don't think that's us. |
| 19:27 |
Blockhead256[m] |
but the pressure is there to join it because they will publish other links or files to that discord server |
| 19:27 |
muurkha |
she says "The youth of nowadays don't even know about IRC", which I think is also true |
| 19:27 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> We three thousand people over here enjoy the discord experience to a degree, and you are welcome to not join us |
| 19:28 |
Desour |
and either there aren't that many bridges, or they are somewhere hidden, because I never see anyone posting a link to an alternative bridge |
| 19:28 |
Warr1024 |
Desour: I'd actually be okay with the idea of posting the non-bridged portions elsewhere, myself, but Discord makes this possible but not easy, and nobody has jumped at the opportunity to do the work, or provide the necessary hosting, to make that happen. |
| 19:28 |
muurkha |
Warr1024: maybe you could upload the file to a GitHub Gist if you want to not be responsible for hosting it? |
| 19:28 |
Desour |
GreenXenith: the link would lead to more information and up-to-date info. this compels ppl to click it |
| 19:29 |
Desour |
muurkha: everywhere on the web I mean. take minetest server descriptions, or github repo readmes as example |
| 19:29 |
Blockhead256[m] |
the youth of today have to be taught what a file directory ("folder") is, because they just open files in Word/Google Docs and save them to the cloud.. |
| 19:29 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Its a discord invite link, and should be clearly labeled as such. Its not a "click here for more info" |
| 19:30 |
Peter_Lankton |
fair enough, but i imagine that keeps out lots of legit players too. but hey, if you dont mind having an empty server then thats fine. im starting to understand that perspective myself. i created a second server where the spawn has 2 doors. one is a one way iron door trap and the other is the correct door. the signs clearly state you should NOT go in the iron door. but most people who join do go in there. |
| 19:31 |
Blockhead256[m] |
Need to install this mod |
| 19:31 |
Blockhead256[m] |
https://steamcommunity.com/workshop/filedetails/?id=1145223801 |
| 19:31 |
ROllerozxa |
if someone isn't able to solve the question then it's not my issue, I don't really mind |
| 19:31 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> The bots we use on Discord that are not 3rd-party are open-source, and anyone could send a PR if they think they have a good (or even just okay) solution to the "make discord conversations readable without having to use Discord" problem. Of course, you might need to have Discord to develop that solution, so that's not ideal, but I guess uninstalling is a thing too... |
| 19:31 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Discord is so high-volume, keeping historical data is both technically tedious and much of the time low-value. Not to mention discord messages are not immutable, making logs either outdated or in need of regular updating |
| 19:31 |
muurkha |
she also points out that Discord provides voice chat as well as text chat, which is maybe a more popular alternative to Mumble, as well as filesharing [as Warr1024 points out] |
| 19:31 |
ROllerozxa |
if you desperately want to get through then feeding it verbatim into wolfram alpha will get you the answer, even if you have no idea what a trigonometry is, but the same kids that hold down the mine button and then leave won't be able to do that |
| 19:32 |
ROllerozxa |
so really, the question is way too easy, yet it's effective |
| 19:32 |
Wuzzy |
I just find it fascinating how quick people in the FOSS community are to defend proprietary software just because that's what everyone else is using |
| 19:32 |
Peter_Lankton |
yeah i totally get that. though it does make the idea of making a spam bot tempting. because bots could solve it and get in lol |
| 19:33 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> tbh the mutability of Discord messages is something that I see as an annoyance ... Edits are okay, but having no audit trail aside from a select few is irritating. I suppose that Discord has to allow some "corrections" to the record that IRC doesn't because on IRC there is an assumption that what you say is more time-limited (even though, with public log bots, it's not really). |
| 19:33 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Wuzzy: we don't really care much about the proprietary software one way or the other. For us, it's just more about defending users and their choices. |
| 19:34 |
muurkha |
Desour: that still depends on which part of the web you're reading; I don't see a lot of Discord links on the Argentine web |
| 19:34 |
Desour |
(just to be clear, in minetest (excluding servers) the use of discord doesn't cause direct damage, as all relevant stuff is posted elsewhere, afaik. but it's causing indirect damage by increasing or not decreasing the number of discord users overall) |
| 19:34 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Discord users are sometimes characterized as "trash users" just because they're using "trash software" which is rather unfair. Also, for user choice to be meaningful, we have to allow users to sometimes make the wrong choices... |
| 19:34 |
muurkha |
she says she thinks young people here are more likely to answer emails than old people because they have mail on their cellphones |
| 19:34 |
Blockhead256[m] |
in the absence of an official discord, it would be unofficial, in which case moderation would be worse |
| 19:35 |
Blockhead256[m] |
so a harm reduction policy for discord seems to be the best :P |
| 19:35 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> The amount of Discord users has only increased and will likely continue to until either we (the administration) or Discord Inc. screws up massively |
| 19:36 |
Peter_Lankton |
but i dont i will bother making one. already made one to print images on kim map per's canvas server lol. that was pretty funny. |
| 19:36 |
Desour |
imho, people can be free of choice of the applications they use, as long as they don't negatively affect others with their actions too much. it's just like any other choices ppl can do |
| 19:37 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Us using Discord does not negatively affect you |
| 19:37 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> This conversation is negatively affecting everyone |
| 19:37 |
MTDiscord |
<Thresher> what is happening |
| 19:37 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Use your eyes |
| 19:38 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Anyway |
| 19:38 |
muurkha |
Wuzzy: I'm not a fan of Discord [because, as you say, it's proprietary] but I think it's important to understand why other people do like Discord if we want to displace it |
| 19:39 |
Desour |
GreenXenith: if your "Us" includes all discord users (which I was referring to), then you *are* negatively affecting me, e.g. by moving possibly interesting discussions to discord |
| 19:39 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> I haven't checked the name thread yet, if Blockshed/Boxshed isn't on there yet it should be |
| 19:39 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Desour: There are possibly interesting discussions in many places on the internet that you will never see |
| 19:40 |
muurkha |
if you institutionalize a proprietary software platform, the way we have with WhatsApp here, the users no longer have choices, so if you want to defend users and their choices you need to prevent that from happening |
| 19:40 |
Desour |
yes, but most of them I can look up and read without giving some cooperation my private data |
| 19:40 |
Peter_Lankton |
GASP i found a server with vore in it!!!! SOMEONE BAN IT!!!! |
| 19:40 |
MTDiscord |
<Thresher> that's terrible! where? |
| 19:41 |
Desour |
muurkha: exactly |
| 19:41 |
Peter_Lankton |
address 'daconcepts dot com' port 37000 located at -193,77,-6205 |
| 19:41 |
Blockhead256[m] |
It's not as simple as to say that one's choice to use Discord doesn't affect others negatively |
| 19:41 |
Blockhead256[m] |
you are simply viewing your right to choice as more important than community cohesion and principles of software freedom |
| 19:41 |
Blockhead256[m] |
and taking the easy route of letting a corporation share your information with others, host your files, your screenshots |
| 19:42 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> We make no effort to encourage using Discord, we only provide the doorway to enter. If people use Discord more its not because we tell them to, its because they already use Discord |
| 19:43 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> I'll gladly sacrifice "cohesion" if the enforced platform is highly inconvenient |
| 19:43 |
Desour |
a big colorful door can be seen as encouragement tough... |
| 19:43 |
MTDiscord |
<Thresher> peter_lankton: checking it out right now so i can report it to the necessary authorities 🫡 |
| 19:43 |
Blockhead256[m] |
but as muurkha has said you need to understand why people make their choices and try to address that rather than tell them their choice is bad and they should feel bad |
| 19:43 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> If you HAVE Discord, then come join OUR Discord. If you don't, I'd point people toward IRC first, and then maybe Matrix if they have the stomach for some of the technical issues 😄 |
| 19:43 |
muurkha |
Blockhead256[m]: I concur with your statement |
| 19:44 |
Blockhead256[m] |
Personally Matrix is no less convenient to me than other platforms, but I'm not one of those people in two dozen discord servers who for the sake of ease of use, familiarity and wanting everything in one app, would rather just add another Discord server to their list |
| 19:44 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Whether people have discord or not is mostly pretty moot anyway, because there's a large community of Discord users who don't know what MT is, and a small community of MT users who wouldn't use Discord anyway. |
| 19:44 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Id gladly jump ship to another platform. If it had the conveniences necessary for hosting large communities. And if everyone else also jumped ship. |
| 19:45 |
muurkha |
right, the "if everyone else" thing is how incumbents gain market power they can use to extract all the surplus value from the community |
| 19:45 |
muurkha |
recently the term "enshittification" has come into vogue for describing this process |
| 19:45 |
muurkha |
because of course you have to become the incumbent before you can start extracting monopoly rents |
| 19:46 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Ultimately I'd have a hard time leaving any platform behind; I tend to just accumulate them unless they go completely dead like AOL Instant Messenger or something, or literally everyone I know drops off them. I tend to go where people are, and unfortunately some are locked into certain choices to certain degrees for whatever reason. |
| 19:46 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Why would I use a platform with less users and less access to communicating with people? |
| 19:46 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Its not practical |
| 19:47 |
muurkha |
right, nobody's self-interest is to sacrifice themself in order to unseat the incumbent |
| 19:47 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> "market power" and "surplus value" is a pretty weirdly capitalistic way of thinking about people interacting with people and community building. I don't deny that that's a thing people are trying to do to us, but I don't think it's a thing we should jump on the bandwagon for. |
| 19:47 |
muurkha |
that's how monopoly power survives |
| 19:47 |
Desour |
Warr1024: I'd prefer a formulation like: "If you happen to have discord, you CAN join our discord thing.", as opposed to "oh you have discord? then use it! and join." |
| 19:47 |
muurkha |
yes, Discord is a capitalist enterprise; I'm not saying we should copy them, but that we should understand their internal dynamics and motivational structure |
| 19:48 |
muurkha |
which is Zero-to-One monopolist thinking |
| 19:48 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> I understand their motivational structure every time I see the damn "super react" button 😏 |
| 19:49 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> "C'mon, it's ONLY like $5" as a business model 🙄 |
| 19:49 |
|
sugarbeet joined #minetest |
| 19:49 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Desour: Where do you see us saying "use discord!"? The minetest website has a link and nothing more |
| 19:49 |
muurkha |
(I don't know if they've taken Thiel's money, but his book expresses a zeitgeist that suffuses the venture capital world) |
| 19:50 |
Peter_Lankton |
testplayer dont know what vore is lmao |
| 19:50 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> I may use Discord, but I'm not going to pay them for the privilege of trying to lock me in, and I'm going to try to avoid wherever possible being part of the system that incentivizes paid use and further lock-in. |
| 19:50 |
Desour |
GreenXenith: I was replying to ""<Warr1024> If you HAVE Discord, then come join OUR Discord. |
| 19:51 |
muurkha |
Warr1024: it's amusing that you posted that message on Discord ;) |
| 19:51 |
muurkha |
anyway I see it via the MTDiscord bridge |
| 19:51 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> When I said "HAVE Discord," I meant like "if you have it installed and running" and such. Like, if you technically have a discord account but haven't opened it up in months and weren't going to otherwise, no, don't bother, just try IRC or something else first. But I don't feel the need to spell that out because not doing something they wouldn't have done anyway is basically already the default for humans anyway. |
| 19:52 |
Warr1024 |
I tend to have the Discord window on top more often because I'm actually responsible for moderating on Discord so I have to watch what happens there, whereas I don't have nearly as much duty on IRC. |
| 19:53 |
Peter_Lankton |
anyway hopefully sfan5 or someone sees my report i made here. maybe i should email him. after all vore has no place in minetest. as i have learned lol. |
| 19:53 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> It's all the same to me more or less. I'm just talking to people, and the furniture is just along for the ride. |
| 19:53 |
Warr1024 |
Peter_Lankton: true dat. If you want vore, go play Yoshi's Island or something instead. |
| 19:54 |
muurkha |
Warr1024: heh, you're subsidizing Discord's business model with your free labor ;) |
| 19:55 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> ...which I mitigate by doing the most useless kind of labor possible, so it all works out 😆 |
| 19:55 |
ROllerozxa |
Warr1024: you're saying all yoshi fans are into vore? 🤔 |
| 19:56 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> I don't know one way or the other, I've just played the game and noticed things. |
| 19:57 |
Wuzzy |
!tell nrzkt Almost 5 years ago, you've predicted that Discord will still exist today. Well, you were right, congratulations. XD (I still hate Discord XXXXD) |
| 19:57 |
MinetestBot |
Wuzzy: I'll pass that on when nrzkt is around |
| 19:57 |
Wuzzy |
!seen nrzkt |
| 19:57 |
MinetestBot |
Wuzzy: nrzkt was last seen at 2020-04-27 16:46:18 UTC on #minetest-hub |
| 19:57 |
Wuzzy |
!seen nrz |
| 19:57 |
MinetestBot |
Wuzzy: Sorry, I haven't seen nrz around. |
| 19:57 |
Wuzzy |
!seen nerzhul |
| 19:57 |
MinetestBot |
Wuzzy: nerzhul was last seen at 2020-10-10 12:06:44 UTC on #minetest-hub |
| 19:57 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Try -dev |
| 19:57 |
Desour |
!seen nrz-dev |
| 19:57 |
MinetestBot |
Desour: Sorry, I haven't seen nrz-dev around. |
| 19:57 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> 🙄 |
| 19:58 |
Desour |
(just wanted to try) |
| 19:59 |
Blockhead256[m] |
my life for nerzhul! |
| 20:04 |
Peter_Lankton |
vore may have no place in minetest, which is why i plan to make a fork of it lol |
| 20:10 |
Peter_Lankton |
man the dragonfire client is awesome. i should make an auto building script for it. |
| 20:39 |
|
duds` joined #minetest |
| 20:46 |
muurkha |
you could call it voretst |
| 20:47 |
Peter_Lankton |
heh, thats my plan. along with voretest_game. the default game which is just minetest_game with my vore blocks mod added to it. and it will have a special tab for my server. and a custom server list. |
| 20:50 |
muurkha |
hooray for free software and perversion |
| 20:51 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> New kinks with each release, for maximum perversion per version. |
| 20:53 |
muurkha |
I note that there's a well-known free software source control system called Subversion but so far nobody has been so bold as to name one "Perversion" |
| 20:53 |
Peter_Lankton |
Warr1024 heh i like that pun. |
| 20:55 |
Peter_Lankton |
i suppose my fork is a sort of courtesy. if the pervs use it, they are kept away from minetest. and since it has a different server list, they wont discover those servers. |
| 20:56 |
muurkha |
the British National Corpus also suggests: version versions conversion diversion inversion conversions reversion aversion diversions seroconversion inversions diversionary reversionary reversions introversion extroversion aversions reconversion versioned seroconversions reversioner interconversions |
| 20:57 |
muurkha |
according to curl http://canonical.org/~kragen/sw/wordlist | grep -i version | awk '{print $2}' | grep -Ev 'subversion|perversion' | fmt -2222 |
| 21:01 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> If you create a subversion of the system, you subvert it. If you create a new version of Minetest, you vert it. |
| 21:02 |
muurkha |
we should switch from "forking" to "verting" |
| 21:03 |
muurkha |
if you use GitHub, does that imply that you're a git? |
| 21:03 |
potatoxel[m] |
a place for horrible people to meet |
| 21:03 |
potatoxel[m] |
: |
| 21:03 |
potatoxel[m] |
:3 |
| 21:04 |
Desour |
if you're a git, anything implies that you're a git |
| 21:13 |
MTDiscord |
<haukku> If I were to pick a Finnish word to name this project, I might wsnt to use a less common not directly translatable almost poetic word like Kaivanto. To understand the word you can't really use a translator. Running the Finnish Wikipedia article through Google Translate might give a good idea |
| 21:14 |
muurkha |
That sounds cool |
| 21:15 |
MTDiscord |
<haukku> Kaivanto is like a delicate hole in the ground made for a purpose, or something like that |
| 21:15 |
muurkha |
having an obviously Finnish name would also help stave off the "Minetest is hosted on GitHub so it's a US project" people |
| 21:16 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> Suggest that, sounds like a great name |
| 21:16 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> The idea of open source being tethered to national/geopolitical identities seems kind of weird to me. |
| 21:17 |
muurkha |
we had someone suggest that in here a few weeks ago |
| 21:17 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Like, an open source project can be a "USA thing" basically until you get your first non-USA contributor, and then it'll never really be entirely murrican anymore. |
| 21:17 |
muurkha |
but I don't think renaming the project is possible in practice |
| 21:17 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> I already renamed it to "minetest" (prounounced "min-eh-test") |
| 21:18 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Minetest is the "you can get it any color as long as it's black" of project names. |
| 21:19 |
Peter_Lankton |
Warr1024 i think thats how some TTS voices say it lol |
| 21:19 |
muurkha |
only people who are deeply involved in it will realize it's been renamed |
| 21:19 |
muurkha |
the larger public will just think it's disappeared |
| 21:20 |
muurkha |
in Spanish I pronounce it "meenaytest" |
| 21:22 |
muurkha |
that way people know how to spell it |
| 21:22 |
MTDiscord |
<haukku> That's at least close to the finnish pronounciation so welcome on board |
| 21:23 |
muurkha |
:D |
| 21:23 |
MTDiscord |
<haukku> I don't think the "larger public" knows about minetest |
| 21:23 |
muurkha |
I assumed people in Finland just pronounced it as English, since it's a compound of two loanwords |
| 21:23 |
muurkha |
well, there's different scales |
| 21:24 |
muurkha |
there's maybe 50 people in the credits; they form the Seventh Circle |
| 21:24 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Yeah, English vowels require all this analysis to figure out how you're supposed to actually pronounce them (ironic, considering that so many vowels in English just map to the schwa sound anyway) ... most other languages IIRC tend to have more regular pronunciation of vowels. An "e" just tends to sound like an "e" wherever you see one... |
| 21:24 |
muurkha |
the 150 or 300 people in this channel are the Sixth Circle |
| 21:24 |
muurkha |
the 3000 people or however many are on the forums are the Fifth circle |
| 21:24 |
Peter_Lankton |
i think making minetest chea- uh i mean, minetest "utility" mods is my new interest now. just made a nuker. glad to see it doesnt work in minetest_game though. MTG seems to limit how fast nodes can be diged. |
| 21:24 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> The public that knows minetest is larger than some publics but smaller than most. |
| 21:25 |
muurkha |
people who play regularly but don't use the forums are the Fourth Circle; about 1% of Debian installs have Minetest installed: https://popcon.debian.org/stable/main/by_inst |
| 21:25 |
|
MTDiscord1 joined #minetest |
| 21:26 |
muurkha |
maybe that's 100000 people? |
| 21:26 |
|
Steve_Head joined #minetest |
| 21:26 |
muurkha |
and then there are people who recognize the name "Minetest" and might start playing it sometime, which is maybe 1-10 million people, the Third Circle |
| 21:27 |
muurkha |
then you have the Second Circle, people who have computers Minetest could run on, and the First Circle, all humans who could conceivably play it if they had a computer |
| 21:27 |
MTDiscord |
<haukku> I think worldwide the amount of people that know minetest by the name minetest is probably about a million. Add some millions if you want to count those who knew for a minute but forgot |
| 21:27 |
muurkha |
I think a name change will reach out to the Fourth Circle |
| 21:27 |
MTDiscord |
<haukku> The people who know it by some other name are more numerous than that |
| 21:28 |
muurkha |
haha, because of shitty app store people? |
| 21:28 |
MTDiscord |
<haukku> Yes |
| 21:28 |
Steve_Head |
yeah most people know it as multicraft. in my experience as a server owner at least. most people seem to join using it. |
| 21:28 |
muurkha |
likely. what's the repackaging with the largest number of installs? |
| 21:28 |
|
staceee joined #minetest |
| 21:28 |
|
Evergreen5 joined #minetest |
| 21:29 |
MTDiscord |
<haukku> Well it can't be anything other than Multicraft |
| 21:29 |
MTDiscord |
<haukku> It has some changes of course |
| 21:29 |
MTDiscord |
<ROllerozxa> ah multicraft |
| 21:30 |
muurkha |
Steve_Head: oh, interesting! I didn't realize the repackagers used the same server list |
| 21:31 |
|
muurkha was kicked by ShadowBot: Message flood detected. Use a pastebin like paste.ubuntu.com. |
| 21:31 |
|
libera-staff joined #minetest |
| 21:31 |
MTDiscord |
<ROllerozxa> multicraft uses its own serverlist, but it overlaps with minetest's |
| 21:31 |
MTDiscord |
<haukku> It supports multiple server lists |
| 21:31 |
|
muurkha joined #minetest |
| 21:32 |
muurkha |
heh, that was amusing! I apparently typed so fast that ShadowBot thought I was pasting? |
| 21:32 |
|
pounce joined #minetest |
| 21:33 |
muurkha |
by my count I had sent 7 messages in the 5 minutes up to getting kicked, though, so maybe ShadowBot has gone haywire |
| 21:43 |
|
Oksanaa joined #minetest |
| 21:50 |
definitelya |
!tell Peter_Lankton Do you know Tales of Androgyny? Best game I swear, maybe it could "inspire" you. :| |
| 21:50 |
MinetestBot |
definitelya: I'll pass that on when Peter_Lankton is around |
| 21:54 |
Steve_Head |
i am peter lankton's other nickname i had some connection issue. almost though i was kicked for talking about the "utility" mod but it just seems to be a connection issue or something. it says "Disconnected (Invalid argument)" |
| 21:55 |
Steve_Head |
eh, thats not my thing. i prefer furry stuff |
| 21:56 |
potatoxel[m] |
tomatotest |
| 21:56 |
potatoxel[m] |
c; |
| 21:57 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Well maybe next time you'll make sure to only make valid arguments and then the server won't disconnect you 😏 |
| 21:59 |
definitelya |
lol |
| 22:18 |
|
duds` joined #minetest |
| 22:31 |
|
v-rob joined #minetest |
| 22:32 |
|
panwolfram joined #minetest |
| 22:58 |
|
est31 joined #minetest |
| 23:15 |
|
Leopold joined #minetest |
| 23:49 |
|
diceLibrarian joined #minetest |
| 23:52 |
|
Lesha_Vel joined #minetest |
