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STB |
Anyone here? |
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* JimReed |
pokes rubenwardy |
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| 20:20 |
Xiong |
So... has anyone mined sulfur...? |
| 20:22 |
VanessaE |
why? |
| 20:22 |
Xiong |
Current technic requires sulfur to make batteries... kind of essential but no docs. I have been looking seriously online for any scrap of info. |
| 20:23 |
VanessaE |
well, it spawns in lava lakes |
| 20:23 |
VanessaE |
and when I last tried, it didn't take anything special to harvest it, aside from needing a heat shield :P |
| 20:23 |
Xiong |
Finally I resorted to cheating and spent an hour flying around underground. No sulfur. |
| 20:23 |
VanessaE |
you have technic_worldgen enabled, right? |
| 20:24 |
Xiong |
I did google up one shot showing sulfur around a lave cave... I've been looking for thatish. |
| 20:25 |
Xiong |
I do not... I think. Will that solve the rubber tree problem, too? |
| 20:25 |
VanessaE |
that's why you have no sulfur :) as for rubber, install moretrees. |
| 20:25 |
VanessaE |
that's where technic gets it from |
| 20:26 |
Xiong |
BTW, I loaded a ton of your mods, VE. Some real improvements and good stability. |
| 20:26 |
VanessaE |
:) |
| 20:26 |
VanessaE |
of course. that's because *I* coded them :) (with lots of help) |
| 20:26 |
Xiong |
Yes, of course I have moretrees. |
| 20:27 |
VanessaE |
I strive for performance and stability in my mods :) |
| 20:27 |
Xiong |
trees, ores, blocks. |
| 20:29 |
Xiong |
But no rubber trees in sight. Two days of hard searching. I don't think the biome requirements can be satisfied. |
| 20:29 |
VanessaE |
huh. |
| 20:29 |
VanessaE |
PRs welcome :) |
| 20:29 |
Xiong |
I read your docs as dirt on hot beach. If the beach is hot, it'll be sand. |
| 20:29 |
VanessaE |
I tried to make the biome defs realistic, but lots of overlap, you know? |
| 20:30 |
VanessaE |
maybe the temperature limit just needs adjusted then |
| 20:30 |
Xiong |
I figure the only spot possible is in a transition area. Temperate near desert, dunno. |
| 20:31 |
Xiong |
Those temps are in C. Must be. 32C is hot. |
| 20:32 |
Xiong |
I'd expect, IRL, to find rubber trees in jungles. |
| 20:33 |
VanessaE |
hm |
| 20:34 |
Xiong |
Mm... scarce, likely to be crowded out by canopy. Real rubber was only ever found in one place on Earth. |
| 20:34 |
VanessaE |
yeah, please poke around with the biome def for those and send me a merge request on https://gitlab.com/VanessaE/moretrees ? |
| 20:35 |
Xiong |
Sorry, not sufficiently up to speed on the code structure. Also stuck on Android, where just blowing my nose is a major project. |
| 20:36 |
VanessaE |
it's just a text file |
| 20:36 |
VanessaE |
a simple table :) |
| 20:36 |
VanessaE |
no code knowledge needed. |
| 20:37 |
Xiong |
If you knew what a chore it is just reading a text file on the tiny box. |
| 20:37 |
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| 20:37 |
Xiong |
Took me hours just to get IRC working. Android is hell. |
| 20:38 |
Xiong |
I want my machine back up. Not this year! |
| 20:41 |
VanessaE |
you can edit it on gitlab, too |
| 20:41 |
Xiong |
If you'll take the verbal suggestion... rubber trees in transition area between regular jungle biome and swamp jungle. Hard to find, hard to hack through the undergrowth, hard to carry the loot back home... but not rarer than diamonds. |
| 20:41 |
VanessaE |
no need to even download. just edit it online once you come up with a good def, then issue a merge request online |
| 20:41 |
VanessaE |
I don't know what swamp jungle is. is that a mgv6 biome? |
| 20:42 |
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| 20:44 |
Xiong |
VE, I know there are workarounds. I've been doing just that. It's just unholy difficult. Just to get idiot basic stuff done, must root. I rooted my old phone, not this one. Now Netflix refuses to run on a rooted phone. Android's not Linux. |
| 20:44 |
VanessaE |
ok |
| 20:45 |
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| 20:45 |
Xiong |
I'm running v7. Not clear swamp jungle is a distinct biome. But jungles run out into the shallow shelf. |
| 20:46 |
VanessaE |
well, moretrees and biome_lib are meant for mgv6. no one's stepped up to help adapt them to v7 |
| 20:47 |
VanessaE |
and idk enough about mgv7's features to do it. |
| 20:48 |
Xiong |
Not to crab but moretrees seems to have little to do with biomes. You specify temp, alt, nearness to water, spawn block type. So you're kinda defining your own biomeish criteria. |
| 20:48 |
Xiong |
Microbiome... |
| 20:48 |
VanessaE |
yes |
| 20:49 |
VanessaE |
but it's still constrained by the perlin noise layers used in biome_lib |
| 20:49 |
Xiong |
Right, saw that. |
| 20:49 |
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| 20:50 |
* VanessaE |
<-- lazy |
| 20:50 |
VanessaE |
:) |
| 20:50 |
Xiong |
Anyway... I gather v7 is new. I started a world, ice and a few chunks of pine tundra... for a thousand blocks in every direction. |
| 20:50 |
VanessaE |
nah, it ain't new |
| 20:51 |
VanessaE |
but it's less-used than v6 |
| 20:51 |
VanessaE |
I first developed biome_lib before v7 was a thing |
| 20:51 |
Xiong |
Current world, spawned on a jungle island the size of a dollar pancake. |
| 20:51 |
VanessaE |
heh |
| 20:53 |
Xiong |
v7 is what comes with the app. May be time to switch. But I dislike v6. What about good old v5? Too old? |
| 20:53 |
VanessaE |
v5 is an oddity |
| 20:53 |
rubenwardy |
Xiong: v5 is newer than v7 |
| 20:53 |
VanessaE |
it's newer than v6, in a way, and also much older |
| 20:53 |
VanessaE |
it's meant to be 0.3.x-esque |
| 20:54 |
rubenwardy |
the mapgen versions are not how new the mapgen code is, it just describes which attempt at a map gen it is |
| 20:54 |
VanessaE |
right. what he said. |
| 20:54 |
Xiong |
ruben, I thought I was using v5 back on the desktop. |
| 20:54 |
rubenwardy |
so v5 was originally designed before v6, but the current code was written after v7 |
| 20:54 |
rubenwardy |
there was an older implementation of v5 that was removed |
| 20:55 |
rubenwardy |
but yeah, basically: |
| 20:55 |
rubenwardy |
v5 = 3d noise, lots of over hanging cliffs, etc |
| 20:55 |
rubenwardy |
v6 = plains, fairly standard langscape, no biomes support (ie: mods can't add custom biomes) |
| 20:55 |
rubenwardy |
v7 = something |
| 20:55 |
VanessaE |
^ hence the existence of biome_lib |
| 20:56 |
rubenwardy |
Lua biome implementations suck really |
| 20:56 |
rubenwardy |
because of limitations with threading |
| 20:56 |
Xiong |
That's the mt I loved. Negative slopes! Technical climbing! |
| 20:56 |
VanessaE |
yes, but for v6 it's all we have |
| 20:57 |
rubenwardy |
does biome_lib even add biome support? |
| 20:57 |
VanessaE |
not to v7 |
| 20:57 |
rubenwardy |
looks like it's just for spawning plants |
| 20:57 |
VanessaE |
it's pure lua. |
| 20:57 |
VanessaE |
that was the original purpose yeah, but it's used to do other stuff, too |
| 20:57 |
rubenwardy |
so can you add your own biomes? |
| 20:58 |
rubenwardy |
that's what I meant by biome support - ie: register_biome |
| 20:58 |
Xiong |
BTW VE, plantlife is looking very good. Really like the new inedible bushes and edible ferns. |
| 20:58 |
rubenwardy |
v6 obviously has biomes, they're just hard coded :) |
| 20:58 |
VanessaE |
for biome_lib, more or less yeah. |
| 20:59 |
VanessaE |
thanks, Xiong |
| 21:02 |
VanessaE |
rubenwardy: but anyway, you define a biome by defining what map conditions are needed to spawn something. biome_Lib batches all those defs together |
| 21:02 |
Xiong |
Also, dunno if I ever told you... autocrafter is better than all of mesecons and technic put together. I like them all but if stuck on a desert island, I want a default tree and an autocrafter. Really like the new on-off switch! |
| 21:02 |
VanessaE |
sort, unique, then split into steps that can be played-out during globalstep |
| 21:04 |
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| 21:06 |
VanessaE |
rubenwardy: https://i.imgur.com/G0ig34J.png |
| 21:07 |
VanessaE |
this is mgv6. here, you can see random plants, moretrees, ground litter under default trees, and elsewhere (offscreen) are giant ferns spawned inside jungles... |
| 21:10 |
VanessaE |
most of what biome_lib can do, mgv7 can do on its own, I think, but biome_lib doesn't know about mgv7 so it lacks any kind of "translation layer" |
| 21:10 |
Xiong |
Okay VE, my head is too blobby to chat much. I'm taking away I need to fiddle minetest.conf to enable technic worldgen... I'll look that up. And switch base worldgen away from v7. And that should solve both rubber and sulfur issues. Yay! Thanks. |
| 21:11 |
VanessaE |
Xiong: nah, you just need to enable that mod. it comes with technic |
| 21:12 |
Xiong |
You think that'll fix both? I'll find out. |
| 21:12 |
VanessaE |
it'll fix the lack of sulphur. |
| 21:13 |
VanessaE |
but for the rubber trees, you'll need to fiddle with moretrees' rubber tree biome def. |
| 21:13 |
Xiong |
Rather switch to v6. |
| 21:13 |
VanessaE |
because if you haven't found any yet, you probably won't. it's probably just not satisfyable. |
| 21:13 |
VanessaE |
i* |
| 21:14 |
Xiong |
Well, I've seen rubber trees in years past. Hasn't always been broken. |
| 21:14 |
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| 21:14 |
VanessaE |
ok. |
| 21:15 |
VanessaE |
so maybe it IS just v6 vs. v7 |
| 21:16 |
Xiong |
Dunno. Nobody is perfect but I don't think you've been ignoring years of rubber tree complaints. |
| 21:17 |
VanessaE |
I try not to ignore people :) |
| 21:17 |
Xiong |
They were scarce... and that's fine. That kind of complaint should be ignored. |
| 21:17 |
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| 21:17 |
VanessaE |
so you're finding them now? |
| 21:18 |
VanessaE |
oh, were |
| 21:18 |
VanessaE |
duh |
| 21:18 |
Xiong |
No no. Now, none at all. |
| 21:18 |
Xiong |
I'll fiddle with worldgen from both ends. |
| 21:18 |
VanessaE |
rubenwardy: feel like making biome_lib compatible with v7? ;) |
| 21:19 |
Xiong |
Gonna have to scratch another world. :( |
| 21:19 |
VanessaE |
Xiong: sowwy |
| 21:20 |
Xiong |
At least I paddled the boat. Never had so much water before. |
| 21:20 |
VanessaE |
heh |
| 21:21 |
Shara |
VanessaE: in what way isn't it compatible? I've never really understood why all the things that use it don't just use regular register_decoration and have done. |
| 21:21 |
Xiong |
Okay well bye and TFATF! |
| 21:22 |
Shara |
Is it just to add growth as well as placement? |
| 21:22 |
VanessaE |
Shara: aside from v7 using different perlin noise than v6 for e.g. desert and jungles, biome_lib doesn't take advantage of v7's own biome features, which would be much faster than mine |
| 21:24 |
VanessaE |
a way to detect which mapgen and adapt the perlin settings, and some kind of translation layer to convert existing biome_lib calls to mgv7 calls is needed |
| 21:25 |
Shara |
I just have memories of rage-deleting huge chunks of it because it and/or moretrees made my server lag way back then. I should probably look at it at some point, but there's plenty og other things I should really look at too. |
| 21:25 |
VanessaE |
it'll still lag, but it's way less heavy than it used to be |
| 21:26 |
VanessaE |
the code that adds the ground litter under default trees probably needs streamlined, though |
| 21:27 |
VanessaE |
(it doesn't use the globalstep method) |
| 21:27 |
Shara |
I also remember getting fed up of the different ways different mods handled growing trees and so on. |
| 21:34 |
Shara |
I think I had some grand plan to go back and look at them all and figure out what was best. :) |
| 21:34 |
Shara |
Then realised how much work that was. |
| 21:35 |
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| 21:35 |
VanessaE |
well biome_lib only has two ways: spawn a sapling and let the game handle growing later, or spawn a l-system tree. |
| 21:39 |
VanessaE |
(though moretrees uses biome_lib's ABM calls to handle its own saplings, if I remember right) |
| 21:43 |
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