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| 11:44 |
shaft |
I had a really good idea but had to realize it's not possible to achieve with the current minetest api |
| 11:46 |
shaft |
Basically what people are missing to create the really cool mods Minecraft has is a mapchunk as an entity. I know that sounds really funny but think about it. The mod "Create" has buildings rotating (not in steps of 90deg) and there were mods that allowed you to build vehicles from blocks. |
| 11:46 |
shaft |
Even mods like woolen mesh creature and sculpture from Minetest suffer from the missing functionality |
| 11:47 |
shaft |
woolen mesh creator |
| 11:48 |
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| 11:49 |
shaft |
Anyone ever thought about that? |
| 11:50 |
MTDiscord |
<mistere_123> The idea is known as a voxel area entity. Its either on the roadmap or an idea supported by C55 so, if there was a pr for it, it would propably be merged sometime |
| 11:52 |
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| 11:55 |
shaft |
Oh thank you. It's this issue right? https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/10153 |
| 11:57 |
shaft |
Oh, it's not that issue |
| 11:58 |
shaft |
https://dev.minetest.net/TODO#Voxel_Area_Entities |
| 11:59 |
shaft |
>hasn't been done for 10 years |
| 12:01 |
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| 12:04 |
LauwCost |
Hello, I would like to contribute at https://wiki.minetest.net/Main_Page. Who can give me an acces please ? Thank you very much |
| 12:17 |
ROllerozxa |
LauwCost: I could create an account on the wiki for you. is there anything in particular about the wiki you would want to contribute? |
| 12:20 |
shaft |
While you two are at it, you could note down that cotton doesn't grow up fully on desert sand https://wiki.minetest.net/Desert_Sand |
| 12:21 |
shaft |
https://wiki.minetest.net/Desert_Sand_Soil wet desert sand soil I mean |
| 12:22 |
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| 12:27 |
ROllerozxa |
> Cotton Seed can be placed on it but it will only grow on Wet Desert Sand Soil. |
| 12:27 |
ROllerozxa |
should it be clarified here? |
| 12:31 |
shaft |
Yes. It grows to some stage but then it stop growing. |
| 12:32 |
shaft |
https://litter.catbox.moe/l241c2.jpg |
| 12:33 |
shaft |
Here's a screenshot you can use for illustration purposes. Right is the desert soil |
| 12:33 |
shaft |
Most never grow up fully, no matter how many real time hours you wait |
| 12:40 |
erle |
shaft look at meshnode |
| 12:40 |
shaft |
? |
| 12:41 |
erle |
shaft https://codeberg.org/cora/modern_meshnode |
| 12:41 |
erle |
> Meshnodes is a mod that transforms ordinary minetest nodes into a connected array of replica entities to which players can attach to and manoeuvre. |
| 12:41 |
erle |
you can use this to rotate your building |
| 12:42 |
erle |
> To use, simply build or place a model using nodes with a supported drawtype then place a meshnode controller in an appropriate position. Now use the special 'glue' that you will find in the controller node's inventory to connect your structure. |
| 12:54 |
shaft |
Looks like a start but not very smooth and lacking collisions |
| 12:56 |
erle |
why don't you improve it then |
| 12:56 |
erle |
i'm sure help is appreciated |
| 12:58 |
shaft |
Stairs work but torches don't. |
| 12:58 |
shaft |
Reacts weird to light |
| 12:59 |
shaft |
I think the proposal "voxel area entities" someone else already made is better |
| 12:59 |
shaft |
Simulating this with a bunch of entities is not gonna lead anywhere in the end. |
| 13:01 |
shaft |
Stairs look like they work but their collision is that of a full block |
| 13:03 |
shaft |
Meselamps stop emitting any light |
| 13:03 |
shaft |
Torches don't attach. I don't think you'll ever be done patching this without actual C++ implementation. |
| 13:05 |
shaft |
It's totally okay if they don't emit light on the actual world or other entities but they should at least keep themselves lighted. Otherwise it will all turn dark in the night. |
| 13:08 |
erle |
shaft something that is implemented is always better than something that is not implemented, no? |
| 13:09 |
erle |
> Simulating this with a bunch of entities is not gonna lead anywhere in the end. |
| 13:09 |
erle |
why not? |
| 13:09 |
erle |
seems to me like with better collision boxes and light sources on entities it could work |
| 13:10 |
shaft |
Because of all the problems I already named. People might have higher demands now. In Minecraft microblock stuff they already made doors and restone work |
| 13:10 |
shaft |
How are you gonna make Mesecons work with entities? |
| 13:10 |
erle |
probably not at all |
| 13:11 |
shaft |
I respect honour the attempt but the entitiy pile approach not gonna work. |
| 13:11 |
shaft |
I respect and honour the attempt but the entitiy pile approach is not gonna work. |
| 13:12 |
erle |
then make one that works ig |
| 13:13 |
shaft |
Easier said then done. |
| 13:14 |
erle |
well, how about “look at what they do, not what they say” |
| 13:20 |
shaft |
Yeah go steal the code of the minecraft mods that implement this :) |
| 13:21 |
erle |
the average person swallows the code 3 stolen minecraft mods over the course of a year, in their sleep |
| 13:22 |
shaft |
Nothing can be done about that |
| 13:36 |
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| 14:35 |
shaft |
@celeron55 you already worked on it or thought about it almost exactly 10 years ago. Do you still remember? Want to share something about voxel area entities with us? |
| 14:36 |
shaft |
The irc logs show some old debate |
| 14:38 |
shaft |
It also says, it could increase performance for falling nodes which is on the rode map too. |
| 14:39 |
shaft |
Different topic: Why does z_index for my gui element not work at all? |
| 14:48 |
sfan5 |
in case you're referring to the list of values in lua_api.md: that's just a suggestion, not something the engine does |
| 14:50 |
shaft |
So there is no way to get a gui element to be behind the item bar instead of on top of it? |
| 14:51 |
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| 14:57 |
shaft |
https://minetest.gitlab.io/minetest/definition-tables/#hud-definition |
| 14:57 |
shaft |
z_index is mentioned here. |
| 15:13 |
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| 15:35 |
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| 15:38 |
shaft |
Anyone else here? How do you handle gui overlapping in the right order? |
| 15:42 |
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| 15:47 |
MTDiscord |
<warr1024> In theory the built-in GUI elements were supposed to have a specific z_index so you could draw over/under them by using positive/negative indexes or something. In practice, the built-in elements were drawn entirely separately from custom ones, so there was no way to draw on both sides of them. I filed an issue for this years ago and forgot what has become of it. |
| 15:47 |
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| 15:48 |
MTDiscord |
<warr1024> https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/9270 - concept approved, awaiting implementation. |
| 15:51 |
MTDiscord |
<warr1024> You can hide most(?) of the built-in HUD elements and draw your own, but figuring out viable substitutes for the built-in ones can be highly non-trivial. |
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| 17:22 |
shaft |
Thanks warr1024. I really have to make sure to check IRC logs more often if I write something and then leave. |
| 17:24 |
shaft |
I think HUD needs to be client side anyway. Why should server performance suffer for screen effects? Servers also don't know about screen dimensions and such |
| 17:25 |
shaft |
I already made a mod to replace bloodhud! It's "finished" within the limitations of what is currently possible in minetest but I'm not satisfied with the result and wouldn't call it finished |
| 17:26 |
shaft |
When low health the screen is always bloody but if it's over the item bar, players will have a hard time selecting an item to heal themselves. |
| 17:28 |
shaft |
So my attempt kinda goes in the trash or is on hiatus until api functionality is available. |
| 17:35 |
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| 17:45 |
MTDiscord |
<warr1024> HUDs ARE client-side, who do you think displays them? Gameplay is determined server-side, so responsibility for displaying that info in a HUD needs to be handed off from the server to the client at some stage in the process. If you're saying "these should be handled by CSM", then yeah, but we need to make CSM good enough to actually handle them first, then. |
| 17:57 |
shaft |
Yes, you're right. I turned my repo to public, so you can look at it now. https://gitgud.io/blut/blood_screen |
| 17:58 |
shaft |
There is nothing in there that can't be handled by the client because the client knows about the health (I think). |
| 17:58 |
shaft |
Okay maybe not about the whole punching stuff |
| 18:02 |
MTDiscord |
<warr1024> Whether the server sends the client a "your health is now ## hp" packet, or whether the server sends an "update health HUD to show ## hearts" packet is largely just an implementation detail. I actually lean toward the latter because games should not have to have a health mechanic imposed on them by the engine that they would then have to work around to customize. |
| 18:03 |
shaft |
true |
| 18:04 |
MTDiscord |
<warr1024> The whole engine-provided health mechanic itself is basically a vestige of when MTG was the only MT. It even goes so far as to have a built-in death/respawn mechanic. It means that I don't just have to implement my own health mechanics for my own games, but I also have to take a bunch of extra steps to work around the built-in one. |
| 18:05 |
shaft |
But the client has control over the resolution and aspect ratio of the screen. I think at least how it is displayed should be left to the client partially. Playing an animation on the HUD on the server would also be stupid. |
| 18:06 |
MTDiscord |
<warr1024> Most of my games don't use health/damage at all, and I have to change a handful of things (I forget; I have to look up the list every time) to remove it. NodeCore has its own, where (1) players can have 0 hp but don't die from it, and (2) players can have any floating point amount of health, so that gradual per-tick damage/healing is possible. It was easy to implement, but hard to integate into the existing health/damage system. |
| 18:07 |
MTDiscord |
<warr1024> Animation support is kind of a mess right now because by necessity it has to be implemented differently in different places, so we end up with piecemeal support where it tends to be just unsupported at all unless somebody specifically thought of the need, and did the work to implement, support for it. |
| 18:10 |
jonadab |
At least hunger isn't baked into the engine. |
| 18:11 |
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MTDiscord |
<warr1024> Ironically baking can cancel out hunger... |
| 18:41 |
sfan5 |
!seen Wuzzy |
| 18:41 |
MinetestBot |
sfan5: wuzzy was last seen at 2023-10-22 21:43:51 UTC on #minetest |
| 18:41 |
sfan5 |
!seen Wuzzy2 |
| 18:41 |
MinetestBot |
sfan5: wuzzy2 was last seen at 2023-06-29 23:59:40 UTC on #minetest |
| 18:43 |
Swift110-mobile |
hey all |
| 18:43 |
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| 20:25 |
MinetestBot |
[git] Desour -> minetest/minetest: Devtest: Add more connected nodebox test nodes 6410458 https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commit/64104585c5ace509b19721570eaff1ad9e49f7f9 (2023-10-30T20:23:47Z) |
| 20:25 |
MinetestBot |
[git] Desour -> minetest/minetest: Reformat rot array in NodeDefManager::nodeboxConnects, to make it les… 1d31533 https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commit/1d315336013186ed925c57f0df64ca36c7f7c8ba (2023-10-30T20:23:47Z) |
| 20:25 |
MinetestBot |
[git] Desour -> minetest/minetest: Fix out-of-bounds access in NodeDefManager::nodeboxConnects ec7a1f0 https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commit/ec7a1f02e7a36f062ecc40da1f17abd41f78b022 (2023-10-30T20:23:47Z) |
| 20:25 |
MinetestBot |
[git] erlehmann -> minetest/minetest: Revert "Don't trigger a key event if a key with the same associated c… 2025dcf https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commit/2025dcffbd4d937afbac757931891172c4465614 (2023-10-30T20:23:59Z) |
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