Time Nick Message 11:44 shaft I had a really good idea but had to realize it's not possible to achieve with the current minetest api 11:46 shaft Basically what people are missing to create the really cool mods Minecraft has is a mapchunk as an entity. I know that sounds really funny but think about it. The mod "Create" has buildings rotating (not in steps of 90deg) and there were mods that allowed you to build vehicles from blocks. 11:46 shaft Even mods like woolen mesh creature and sculpture from Minetest suffer from the missing functionality 11:47 shaft woolen mesh creator 11:49 shaft Anyone ever thought about that? 11:50 MTDiscord The idea is known as a voxel area entity. Its either on the roadmap or an idea supported by C55 so, if there was a pr for it, it would propably be merged sometime 11:55 shaft Oh thank you. It's this issue right? https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/10153 11:57 shaft Oh, it's not that issue 11:58 shaft https://dev.minetest.net/TODO#Voxel_Area_Entities 11:59 shaft >hasn't been done for 10 years 12:04 LauwCost Hello, I would like to contribute at https://wiki.minetest.net/Main_Page. Who can give me an acces please ? Thank you very much 12:17 ROllerozxa LauwCost: I could create an account on the wiki for you. is there anything in particular about the wiki you would want to contribute? 12:20 shaft While you two are at it, you could note down that cotton doesn't grow up fully on desert sand https://wiki.minetest.net/Desert_Sand 12:21 shaft https://wiki.minetest.net/Desert_Sand_Soil wet desert sand soil I mean 12:27 ROllerozxa > Cotton Seed can be placed on it but it will only grow on Wet Desert Sand Soil. 12:27 ROllerozxa should it be clarified here? 12:31 shaft Yes. It grows to some stage but then it stop growing. 12:32 shaft https://litter.catbox.moe/l241c2.jpg 12:33 shaft Here's a screenshot you can use for illustration purposes. Right is the desert soil 12:33 shaft Most never grow up fully, no matter how many real time hours you wait 12:40 erle shaft look at meshnode 12:40 shaft ? 12:41 erle shaft https://codeberg.org/cora/modern_meshnode 12:41 erle > Meshnodes is a mod that transforms ordinary minetest nodes into a connected array of replica entities to which players can attach to and manoeuvre. 12:41 erle you can use this to rotate your building 12:42 erle > To use, simply build or place a model using nodes with a supported drawtype then place a meshnode controller in an appropriate position. Now use the special 'glue' that you will find in the controller node's inventory to connect your structure. 12:54 shaft Looks like a start but not very smooth and lacking collisions 12:56 erle why don't you improve it then 12:56 erle i'm sure help is appreciated 12:58 shaft Stairs work but torches don't. 12:58 shaft Reacts weird to light 12:59 shaft I think the proposal "voxel area entities" someone else already made is better 12:59 shaft Simulating this with a bunch of entities is not gonna lead anywhere in the end. 13:01 shaft Stairs look like they work but their collision is that of a full block 13:03 shaft Meselamps stop emitting any light 13:03 shaft Torches don't attach. I don't think you'll ever be done patching this without actual C++ implementation. 13:05 shaft It's totally okay if they don't emit light on the actual world or other entities but they should at least keep themselves lighted. Otherwise it will all turn dark in the night. 13:08 erle shaft something that is implemented is always better than something that is not implemented, no? 13:09 erle > Simulating this with a bunch of entities is not gonna lead anywhere in the end. 13:09 erle why not? 13:09 erle seems to me like with better collision boxes and light sources on entities it could work 13:10 shaft Because of all the problems I already named. People might have higher demands now. In Minecraft microblock stuff they already made doors and restone work 13:10 shaft How are you gonna make Mesecons work with entities? 13:10 erle probably not at all 13:11 shaft I respect honour the attempt but the entitiy pile approach not gonna work. 13:11 shaft I respect and honour the attempt but the entitiy pile approach is not gonna work. 13:12 erle then make one that works ig 13:13 shaft Easier said then done. 13:14 erle well, how about “look at what they do, not what they say” 13:20 shaft Yeah go steal the code of the minecraft mods that implement this :) 13:21 erle the average person swallows the code 3 stolen minecraft mods over the course of a year, in their sleep 13:22 shaft Nothing can be done about that 14:35 shaft @celeron55 you already worked on it or thought about it almost exactly 10 years ago. Do you still remember? Want to share something about voxel area entities with us? 14:36 shaft The irc logs show some old debate 14:38 shaft It also says, it could increase performance for falling nodes which is on the rode map too. 14:39 shaft Different topic: Why does z_index for my gui element not work at all? 14:48 sfan5 in case you're referring to the list of values in lua_api.md: that's just a suggestion, not something the engine does 14:50 shaft So there is no way to get a gui element to be behind the item bar instead of on top of it? 14:57 shaft https://minetest.gitlab.io/minetest/definition-tables/#hud-definition 14:57 shaft z_index is mentioned here. 15:38 shaft Anyone else here? How do you handle gui overlapping in the right order? 15:47 MTDiscord In theory the built-in GUI elements were supposed to have a specific z_index so you could draw over/under them by using positive/negative indexes or something. In practice, the built-in elements were drawn entirely separately from custom ones, so there was no way to draw on both sides of them. I filed an issue for this years ago and forgot what has become of it. 15:48 MTDiscord https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/9270 - concept approved, awaiting implementation. 15:51 MTDiscord You can hide most(?) of the built-in HUD elements and draw your own, but figuring out viable substitutes for the built-in ones can be highly non-trivial. 17:22 shaft Thanks warr1024. I really have to make sure to check IRC logs more often if I write something and then leave. 17:24 shaft I think HUD needs to be client side anyway. Why should server performance suffer for screen effects? Servers also don't know about screen dimensions and such 17:25 shaft I already made a mod to replace bloodhud! It's "finished" within the limitations of what is currently possible in minetest but I'm not satisfied with the result and wouldn't call it finished 17:26 shaft When low health the screen is always bloody but if it's over the item bar, players will have a hard time selecting an item to heal themselves. 17:28 shaft So my attempt kinda goes in the trash or is on hiatus until api functionality is available. 17:45 MTDiscord HUDs ARE client-side, who do you think displays them? Gameplay is determined server-side, so responsibility for displaying that info in a HUD needs to be handed off from the server to the client at some stage in the process. If you're saying "these should be handled by CSM", then yeah, but we need to make CSM good enough to actually handle them first, then. 17:57 shaft Yes, you're right. I turned my repo to public, so you can look at it now. https://gitgud.io/blut/blood_screen 17:58 shaft There is nothing in there that can't be handled by the client because the client knows about the health (I think). 17:58 shaft Okay maybe not about the whole punching stuff 18:02 MTDiscord Whether the server sends the client a "your health is now ## hp" packet, or whether the server sends an "update health HUD to show ## hearts" packet is largely just an implementation detail. I actually lean toward the latter because games should not have to have a health mechanic imposed on them by the engine that they would then have to work around to customize. 18:03 shaft true 18:04 MTDiscord The whole engine-provided health mechanic itself is basically a vestige of when MTG was the only MT. It even goes so far as to have a built-in death/respawn mechanic. It means that I don't just have to implement my own health mechanics for my own games, but I also have to take a bunch of extra steps to work around the built-in one. 18:05 shaft But the client has control over the resolution and aspect ratio of the screen. I think at least how it is displayed should be left to the client partially. Playing an animation on the HUD on the server would also be stupid. 18:06 MTDiscord Most of my games don't use health/damage at all, and I have to change a handful of things (I forget; I have to look up the list every time) to remove it. NodeCore has its own, where (1) players can have 0 hp but don't die from it, and (2) players can have any floating point amount of health, so that gradual per-tick damage/healing is possible. It was easy to implement, but hard to integate into the existing health/damage system. 18:07 MTDiscord Animation support is kind of a mess right now because by necessity it has to be implemented differently in different places, so we end up with piecemeal support where it tends to be just unsupported at all unless somebody specifically thought of the need, and did the work to implement, support for it. 18:10 jonadab At least hunger isn't baked into the engine. 18:35 MTDiscord Ironically baking can cancel out hunger... 18:41 sfan5 !seen Wuzzy 18:41 MinetestBot sfan5: wuzzy was last seen at 2023-10-22 21:43:51 UTC on #minetest 18:41 sfan5 !seen Wuzzy2 18:41 MinetestBot sfan5: wuzzy2 was last seen at 2023-06-29 23:59:40 UTC on #minetest 18:43 Swift110-mobile hey all 20:25 MinetestBot 02[git] 04Desour -> 03minetest/minetest: Devtest: Add more connected nodebox test nodes 136410458 https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commit/64104585c5ace509b19721570eaff1ad9e49f7f9 (152023-10-30T20:23:47Z) 20:25 MinetestBot 02[git] 04Desour -> 03minetest/minetest: Reformat rot array in NodeDefManager::nodeboxConnects, to make it les… 131d31533 https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commit/1d315336013186ed925c57f0df64ca36c7f7c8ba (152023-10-30T20:23:47Z) 20:25 MinetestBot 02[git] 04Desour -> 03minetest/minetest: Fix out-of-bounds access in NodeDefManager::nodeboxConnects 13ec7a1f0 https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commit/ec7a1f02e7a36f062ecc40da1f17abd41f78b022 (152023-10-30T20:23:47Z) 20:25 MinetestBot 02[git] 04erlehmann -> 03minetest/minetest: Revert "Don't trigger a key event if a key with the same associated c… 132025dcf https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commit/2025dcffbd4d937afbac757931891172c4465614 (152023-10-30T20:23:59Z)