| Time |
Nick |
Message |
| 00:57 |
|
smk joined #minetest |
| 01:07 |
MisterE123 |
Is there a reason that setting param2 on nodes in bulk would be significantly slower than setting content in bulk? |
| 01:11 |
Desour |
as in minetest.set_node_bulk? |
| 01:11 |
MisterE123 |
no, as in regular VM node manipulation |
| 01:12 |
MisterE123 |
setting individual param2's in a list and then setting the list to the vm |
| 01:13 |
MisterE123 |
It could be I just have bad code |
| 01:14 |
Desour |
idk of any reason, but idk much about voxelmanips |
| 01:32 |
|
sparky4 joined #minetest |
| 01:54 |
MTDiscord |
<jordan4ibanez> Param2 is of dynamic type, probably needs to check if light updating |
| 01:55 |
Desour |
param2 can't change light propergation properties. param0 can |
| 02:10 |
|
Lesha_Vel joined #minetest |
| 02:13 |
|
lemonzest joined #minetest |
| 02:18 |
|
Guest54 joined #minetest |
| 02:20 |
|
Verticen joined #minetest |
| 02:20 |
MTDiscord |
<kimapr> param1... |
| 02:47 |
|
Verticen joined #minetest |
| 02:52 |
|
sweetiebot joined #minetest |
| 03:03 |
Guest54 |
muurkha i guess “kinda salty” means i do not have diabeetus but should drink more. thanks for the survival tip! |
| 03:04 |
Guest54 |
if i ever get lost in the wilderness i'll know what to expect |
| 03:38 |
Guest54 |
AncientMariner look, it seems that a) bonemeal can be used on fully grown melon stems to create a particle effect without being used up b) the alignment on bambus is wrong: https://mister-muffin.de/p/ueIJ.png |
| 03:38 |
Guest54 |
i was just fishing on the nether roof, coming across this |
| 03:39 |
Guest54 |
(nether roof canal is really nice, boat goes brrrr) |
| 03:42 |
|
v-rob joined #minetest |
| 03:43 |
|
v-rob joined #minetest |
| 03:55 |
Guest54 |
rubenwardy i noticed that if i have a mod that depends on a mod that is available in the base game but also in a modpack the modpack is enabled, which is … unexpected, but also leads to bugs unless i manually disable the modpack. |
| 03:55 |
Guest54 |
rubenwardy can i, as author of the mod in question change my dependencies to say “if the user has installed this mod already, do not enable a modpack” or is the automatic dependency activation just broken? |
| 03:57 |
Guest54 |
in anyway, i think it is a bit weird to enable a modpack if the dependency is already fulfilled by the base game |
| 03:57 |
Guest54 |
(it also crashes, i think) |
| 03:59 |
Guest54 |
interestingly this does not seem to be a situation in which it is a problem to have two mods with the same name (even identical) as there are good reasons to … well, make modpacks, and have the thing standalone. |
| 04:00 |
|
MTDiscord joined #minetest |
| 04:19 |
|
Leopold_ joined #minetest |
| 04:47 |
|
Lesha_Vel joined #minetest |
| 04:49 |
|
Leopold joined #minetest |
| 05:46 |
|
calcul0n joined #minetest |
| 06:14 |
|
Leopold joined #minetest |
| 06:25 |
|
olliy joined #minetest |
| 06:29 |
|
YuGiOhJCJ joined #minetest |
| 06:33 |
|
nuala joined #minetest |
| 06:49 |
|
Leopold_ joined #minetest |
| 07:30 |
|
pounce joined #minetest |
| 08:08 |
|
definitelya joined #minetest |
| 08:13 |
|
Lesha_Vel2 joined #minetest |
| 08:14 |
|
Lesha_Vel2 joined #minetest |
| 09:29 |
|
mrkubax10 joined #minetest |
| 09:41 |
|
Lesha_Vel2 joined #minetest |
| 11:00 |
|
Lesha_Vel joined #minetest |
| 11:08 |
rubenwardy |
!tell Guest54 Minetest won't enable a third-party mod if the dependency is in the base game |
| 11:08 |
MinetestBot |
rubenwardy: yeah, yeah |
| 11:24 |
MTDiscord |
<AncientMariner> probably not the highest priority, because it ain't meta breaking, but you can raise a bug, and then it isn't forgotten |
| 11:25 |
MTDiscord |
<AncientMariner> but i'm afk, so cannot raise now |
| 11:25 |
MTDiscord |
<AncientMariner> by later, i will have forgotten 🙂 |
| 11:28 |
|
Markow joined #minetest |
| 11:28 |
rubenwardy |
Reply contexts don't send to IRC |
| 11:32 |
|
AlexBrownSobinec joined #minetest |
| 11:46 |
|
AlexBrownSobinec joined #minetest |
| 12:44 |
|
Markow joined #minetest |
| 12:46 |
|
lemonzest joined #minetest |
| 13:27 |
MTDiscord |
<AncientMariner> Ah, my mistake, it was to guest54 in regards to the bug raised. |
| 14:05 |
|
Guest54 joined #minetest |
| 14:05 |
MinetestBot |
Guest54: Mar-25 11:08 UTC <rubenwardy> Minetest won't enable a third-party mod if the dependency is in the base game |
| 14:08 |
Guest54 |
rubenwardy re: “Minetest won't enable a third-party mod if the dependency is in the base game” – well, i tried https://content.minetest.net/packages/erlehmann/mcl_lever_status_indicator/ with mineclone2 while having mesecons installed. did mcl2 do anything to cause it? it used to work in the past without enabling mesecons modpack. |
| 14:09 |
Guest54 |
rubenwardy mcl_lever_status_indicator depends on mesecons_walllever, which is both provided by mesecons and mineclone2 (with a reskin, but it's basically the same thing). |
| 14:11 |
Guest54 |
AncientMariner, btw, i guess the mesecons_walllever case shows that if you rename the texture of a mod that exists outside mineclone2 you should rename the mod inside mineclone2, otherwise it may randomly not work if the mod outside mineclone2 does not rename its textures (and it probably will not). |
| 14:13 |
Guest54 |
rubenwardy to me it just looks as if the automatic dependency activation algorithm does not check the base game before going around activating dependencies |
| 14:13 |
Guest54 |
maybe it is different though |
| 14:20 |
|
lemonzest joined #minetest |
| 14:21 |
Guest54 |
rubenwardy another question, is there any way to tie dependencies to specific versions of other mods as a player? i guess cdb has no policies to require mods to not arbitrarily break compatibility and my proposals on how to not break mods by being smarter about API design and name changes have been steadily rejected for over 2 years now. |
| 14:21 |
rubenwardy |
Guest54: ok, I can reproduce the mesecons thing, time to open an issue |
| 14:21 |
rubenwardy |
Guest54: no, that introduces SAT issues which would make the dependency resolver a huge pain |
| 14:22 |
|
Talkless joined #minetest |
| 14:22 |
rubenwardy |
plus you get issues when different mods depend on different versions |
| 14:22 |
rubenwardy |
in some package managers, they install the same package multiple times - this works when it's a library with no global side effects, but won't work with MT mods |
| 14:22 |
Guest54 |
rubenwardy, well, here is an example: the “mineclone2 furniture mod” references textures from mineclone2 and has been working well for a year now. it works in current mineclone2, but due to renaming of textures, at least 6 furnitures have dummy textures in the new game. renaming textures also breaks texture packs, but AncientMariner already |
| 14:22 |
Guest54 |
knows that and does not seem to care too much (see chat from two days ago). |
| 14:23 |
rubenwardy |
maybe there's a way for the mod to detect the current mcl2 version and use the right texture |
| 14:24 |
Guest54 |
i guess the robust version is to steal the texture from the node you are copying (that works until they rename nodes again, lol) |
| 14:24 |
Guest54 |
i kinda did a think like that for carved pumpkin, just duplicate pumpkin node to start with |
| 14:26 |
Guest54 |
rubenwardy what exactly would be the issue in treating mod name + mod version as the dependency algorithm key instead of just mod name? possibly having multiple mods activated at the same time as a result i guess? |
| 14:26 |
rubenwardy |
<rubenwardy> plus you get issues when different mods depend on different versions |
| 14:26 |
rubenwardy |
<rubenwardy> in some package managers, they install the same package multiple times - this works when it's a library with no global side effects, but won't work with MT mods |
| 14:27 |
Guest54 |
true, but in the case of base games it could prevent the “mineclone2 changes something without putting in the work to make it work for the existing mods“ case, unless i am not seeing it. i guess that is not general enough. |
| 14:28 |
Guest54 |
by the way, is there a possibility a mod external from a game could be loaded instead of a mod in a base game? i have not managed to do so, but it would make quickfixes for some things possible. |
| 14:29 |
Guest54 |
rubenwardy btw, i can not open the issue for the base game dependency thingy right now (still wrong computer, or i'd be logged in as erle), is it urgent? |
| 14:30 |
Guest54 |
also, i'll just quickly look if i can patch it |
| 14:38 |
Guest54 |
uh, i can't seem to figure it out right now. |
| 14:39 |
rubenwardy |
weird, can't reproduce using a bare min example |
| 14:40 |
Guest54 |
so what is your minimal example? |
| 14:40 |
rubenwardy |
mymod depending on farming |
| 14:40 |
rubenwardy |
modpack / farming |
| 14:40 |
rubenwardy |
minetest game |
| 14:41 |
Guest54 |
does alphabetic ordering play into this at all? |
| 14:41 |
rubenwardy |
perhaps the issue is that it's using minetest game as the base game instead of Mcl2 |
| 14:42 |
Guest54 |
how is base game determined? |
| 14:42 |
rubenwardy |
menu_last_game |
| 14:42 |
Guest54 |
when i am in the mcl2 tab, shouldn't that be mcl2 then? |
| 14:47 |
Guest54 |
rubenwardy mod auto-enabling order seems to be weirdly interleaved between base game and downloaded mods. could it depend on recursion depth? |
| 14:48 |
rubenwardy |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/13350 |
| 14:48 |
rubenwardy |
you don't need to ping me for every message |
| 14:49 |
Guest54 |
oh sorry |
| 14:50 |
Guest54 |
thanks for creating the issue. do you know where the unit tests are for pkgmgr? |
| 14:50 |
rubenwardy |
Haha |
| 14:51 |
rubenwardy |
Pkgmgr was written before lua unit tests were added |
| 14:51 |
Guest54 |
yeah, but it was modified after |
| 14:51 |
Guest54 |
i have worked on dependency resolution (e.g. redo build system) and without tests you are guaranteed to get it subtly wrong |
| 14:51 |
Guest54 |
i am guilty of refucktoring recursive dependency resolution a lot of times |
| 14:51 |
rubenwardy |
I've been meaning to rewrite it at some point to allow testing |
| 14:52 |
Guest54 |
i guess the message here is “the auto-activation thing was never tested” |
| 14:52 |
Guest54 |
i mean beyond normal use |
| 14:52 |
rubenwardy |
See https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/12295 |
| 14:52 |
Guest54 |
thx |
| 14:52 |
rubenwardy |
It was manually tested |
| 14:53 |
rubenwardy |
Following that plan |
| 14:54 |
Guest54 |
i see |
| 14:54 |
Guest54 |
there's a typo (mod / mob) btw |
| 14:54 |
Guest54 |
btw, is there some shortcut to disable an entire modpack? |
| 14:55 |
Guest54 |
maybe i am a dumbo |
| 14:55 |
rubenwardy |
Yes. There's a button when you select the modpack |
| 14:55 |
rubenwardy |
May need to click twice |
| 14:55 |
Guest54 |
oops, it is there |
| 14:55 |
Guest54 |
i am a dumbo |
| 14:56 |
Guest54 |
thx |
| 14:56 |
Guest54 |
i kept double clicking on the modpack name and it would not disable, probably due to auto-activation |
| 14:57 |
Guest54 |
btw, do you know of any guide how to design forwards-compatible lua packages? |
| 14:58 |
Guest54 |
so far i am doing the following: 1. if a function gains some more arguments, keep it backwards compatible to the old version (e.g. defaults chosen match the older version). 2 if i am unsure about number and ordering of arguments, the sole argument is a table (easy to do the defaults there). 3. if i change the meaning of a function, i rename it. |
| 14:59 |
Guest54 |
that way it will not silently fail |
| 15:01 |
Guest54 |
hmm, have you ever thought about having a test setup where every mod in cdb is installed (on a VM i guess) just to see if it leads to dependency resolution problems or crashes or error messages or so? |
| 15:01 |
Guest54 |
i guess it is infeasible for anyone having not entirely too much time and money |
| 15:02 |
|
Desour joined #minetest |
| 15:03 |
rubenwardy |
I've thought about it but never done it |
| 15:03 |
|
appguru joined #minetest |
| 15:04 |
appguru |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/blob/baf99f826c6e35519f68b666c27af6953f295159/builtin/mainmenu/pkgmgr.lua#L430-L441 |
| 15:05 |
Guest54 |
another question: is there a possibility of texture packs setting graphical settings? given that texture packs <16px don't work well with the connected glass (by design, i might add, the borders of the connected glass are 1/16px) and there are at least 5 of them on cdb and one more i know that is not on cdb, it seems kinda necessary. |
| 15:07 |
Guest54 |
i mean the problem always kinda existed for smaller textures in that they require disabling smoothing of textures or everything is blurred, but blurry textures were not the default and connected glass is going to be as it seems |
| 15:11 |
Guest54 |
OH LOL |
| 15:12 |
Guest54 |
i just found out that the frame of the framed glass looks super-weird for any glass base texture with a border thinner than 1/16 of the texture |
| 15:12 |
Guest54 |
let's see if some *larger* texture packs are also broken now |
| 15:14 |
Desour |
Guest54: see https://github.com/minetest/minetest/blob/master/doc/texture_packs.txt for texture pack docs |
| 15:14 |
Guest54 |
Desour there does not seem to be any provision for this |
| 15:16 |
Guest54 |
oh yeah, i was right: hand painted pack also breaks, because it has bespoke borders |
| 15:34 |
|
Desour_ joined #minetest |
| 15:36 |
|
sparky4 joined #minetest |
| 15:39 |
Guest54 |
kimapr the issue for connected panes is this one: https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/11546 |
| 15:48 |
|
sparky4 joined #minetest |
| 16:48 |
|
sparky4 joined #minetest |
| 16:50 |
|
appguru joined #minetest |
| 17:27 |
|
sparky4 joined #minetest |
| 17:47 |
|
mrkubax10 joined #minetest |
| 17:55 |
|
appguru joined #minetest |
| 17:57 |
|
Thermoriax joined #minetest |
| 17:59 |
|
Noisytoot joined #minetest |
| 18:43 |
|
Verticen joined #minetest |
| 18:43 |
MTDiscord |
<jordan4ibanez> Guest54? That is an oddly cool name |
| 18:50 |
|
Noisytoot joined #minetest |
| 18:56 |
|
mazes_83 joined #minetest |
| 19:01 |
mazes_83 |
the "moveresult" passed to on_step is parent moveresult when object is attached ? |
| 19:15 |
mazes_83 |
ok, I receive a message stating: ""Collision info missing, this is caused by an out-of-date/buggy mod or game" |
| 19:15 |
mazes_83 |
from builtin/game/item_entity.lua: L204 |
| 19:17 |
Desour_ |
did you attach a dropped item? |
| 19:17 |
mazes_83 |
yes |
| 19:18 |
mazes_83 |
I think the assert should be done after checking and returning when attached |
| 19:19 |
mazes_83 |
as luaentitysao.cpp shown me there will be no collision info when attached |
| 19:22 |
mazes_83 |
In fact "chakram" mod attaches dropped items -> assert fails -> server restart |
| 19:24 |
mazes_83 |
a temporary fix for the mod itself will be not attaching items, so it does not "crash" (it may crash later if dropped item is removed) |
| 19:26 |
mazes_83 |
or is it intended none will attach __builtin ? |
| 19:27 |
Desour_ |
if moveresult does not exist if attached, that should be documented |
| 19:28 |
Desour_ |
considering that the builtin item does things if it's in a node and similar, I'd say it's not good to attach it |
| 19:34 |
mazes_83 |
everything that's done may be skipped if physical_state is false. "it's not good" seems to be valid in such a case |
| 19:37 |
mrkubax10 |
how do I make brass from basic materials? |
| 19:41 |
mazes_83 |
one line with 2 copper |
| 19:41 |
mazes_83 |
another with one silver |
| 19:42 |
mazes_83 |
ingots for both |
| 19:43 |
mrkubax10 |
weird that crafting guide doesn't show recipe for it |
| 19:43 |
|
behalebabo joined #minetest |
| 19:48 |
|
hmmmmm joined #minetest |
| 20:00 |
|
hrmmmm joined #minetest |
| 20:11 |
|
v-rob joined #minetest |
| 20:15 |
mazes_83 |
Desour: I ended up using '(en/dis)able_physics' for builtin_items, it works fine, finally chakram works back as before 5.3 |
| 20:17 |
Desour_ |
mazes_83: but builtin calls these itself. for your workaround you should probably also set force_out |
| 20:19 |
mazes_83 |
yes ofc, it's workaround, I still prefer this than my server restarting when using a chakram |
| 20:19 |
|
YuGiOhJCJ joined #minetest |
| 20:22 |
mazes_83 |
no if I set force_out, it may re-enable physics in an unintended way |
| 20:23 |
Desour_ |
set to false I mean |
| 20:24 |
mazes_83 |
no need, it's nil at init, and mod will attach those builtins as soon as spawned |
| 20:26 |
mazes_83 |
but who know, it may happen |
| 20:46 |
|
Noisytoot joined #minetest |
| 21:12 |
|
v-rob joined #minetest |
| 21:16 |
|
Noisytoot joined #minetest |
| 22:38 |
|
Unit193 joined #minetest |
