IRC log for #minetest, 2013-12-21

Time	Nick	Message
00:03	* _Megaf	making a Snow Leopard VM
00:11	_Megaf	OMG
00:11	_Megaf	I just found the hugest cave in minetest history!
00:12	_Megaf	c55 would be proud of it
00:14	_Megaf	VanessaE, kaeza us`0gb thexyz
00:14	_Megaf	you got to enter on Megaf's TEST Server
00:14	_Megaf	its really impressive
00:15	_Megaf	!up megaf.no-ip.info 30005
00:15	MinetestBot	megaf.no-ip.info:30005 is up (419ms)
00:16	_Megaf	Just find go to my nick when you get there
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00:20	_Megaf	70 nodes high
00:20	_Megaf	!!!
00:21	_Megaf	I had never seen anything like that
00:21	_Megaf	MrBeNNy, megaf.no-ip.info 30005
00:21	arsdragonfly	_Megaf scrot?
00:21	_Megaf	you really need to see this cave
00:25	_Megaf	arsdragonfly, uploading
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00:29	_Megaf	HUGE cave, more than 70 nodes from top to bottom, http://www.zimagez.com/galerie/Minetest-huge-cave-31930-0.php
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00:43	us`0gb	_Megaf, I'll take a look in a bit. I need to finish helping my sister erase Windows. Her computer is NOT cooperating.
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00:49	_Megaf	That cave is so big that water from the ceiling does not get to the caves floor
00:52	MinetestBot	GIT: Uberi commited to Uberi/MineTest-WorldEdit: Full unified_inventory and inventory_plus support! https://gi 2013-12-20T16:50:13-08:00 http://git.io/0xha-w
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00:57	VanessaE	oooooooooo
00:57	VanessaE	UI support!
00:57	VanessaE	(piss off about I+ :) )
01:15	us`0gb	Adding Minetest repository ....
01:23	_Megaf	us`0gb, you ok there?
01:23	us`0gb	_Megaf, Still loading.
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01:38	_Megaf	Good night, I turned the server off
01:38	SirDigby	that cave is epic
01:39	us`0gb	I haven't seen one that large, but I also haven't played much since large caves were added.
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01:53	zeldak	Exio4, ha I know now why minetest is stragne
01:53	zeldak	"This is just base developement version" it says
02:16	Peacock	enough mf'ing cooking lol i swear people are gonna leave here 10lbs fatter XD
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02:43	kaeza	https://i.chzbgr.com/maxW500/7962235648/hBEE1D3DD/
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03:33	harrison	http://youtu.be/SPGmuexvw_A
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09:44	proller	50 ppl reached per server
09:45	VanessaE	and no doubt 90% of them are illegal android client users :(
09:45	VanessaE	they're coming out of the woodwork :(
09:45	proller	kill them all!
09:46	Issa2013	so why u don't get android free if is 90 % illegal ?
09:46	Issa2013	and add some publicity on it
09:46	VanessaE	Issa2013: your statement makes no sense
09:46	Issa2013	make no sense
09:46	Issa2013	so add minetest android for paid is a sense
09:46	Issa2013	yes
09:46	VanessaE	please try again with more proper English
09:46	VanessaE	oh
09:46	VanessaE	sorry, grammar FAIL
09:47	VanessaE	the problem is the illegal one is illegal because the people who made it violate the Minetest license
09:47	VanessaE	and thexyz is already working on a legal port of Freeminer to Android
09:47	VanessaE	I guess he's nearly done with it too
09:47	VanessaE	but to list it on Google Play will cost at least $25 anyway
09:49	thexyz	we should make a kickstarter
09:49	Issa2013	well we can make a paypal account to help him
09:50	thexyz	i feel that something is wrong when people volunteer to "make a paypal account" to raise 25 dollars
09:56	thexyz	VanessaE: i don't understand why do you want to ban android port users though
09:56	thexyz	it's not their fault that they're using "illegal" port
09:57	VanessaE	it is their fault if they continue to use that which I've just told them is illegal. At that point I don't want to have to support them, and if they're on my server, then as the admin I'm kinda expected to do that.
09:58	VanessaE	mind you the disconnect message would be incredibly polite, if one could have been possible.
10:00	VanessaE	to the tune of "Sorry, but you have been mislead into downloading a program from an illegal or disreputable author (insert name of here). Please instead download the official Minetest client from (insert address of your Android port here)."
10:00	VanessaE	misled?
10:00	VanessaE	(I can never be sure the tense of that verb)
10:02	VanessaE	when you tell the user they have been misled, they instinctively think "shit, I was LIED TO!" and since they don't see "minetest" anywhere except where they SHOULD have gone, seems to me they'll thing "aw shit, I got stupid"
10:02	VanessaE	s/Minetet client from/Freeminer client from/
10:02	VanessaE	(sorry, forgot)
10:02	VanessaE	whether that leads to a new download of your client or not is immaterial
10:02	VanessaE	the point here is to KILL the illegal client
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10:05	Calinou	<VanessaE> but to list it on Google Play will cost at least $25 anyway
10:05	Calinou	isn't it $5?
10:05	Calinou	but that's Google... so they probably raised it
10:05	VanessaE	Calinou: ShadowNinja looked it up a couple weeks ago.
10:05	VanessaE	$25 to register
10:06	VanessaE	then maybe it's another $5 on top of that to list a project
10:06	Calinou	maybe you could just do an .apk for now, and put it on F-Droid maybe
10:06	Calinou	then do the google stuff when you have the money
10:09	VanessaE	if it can be released as an .apk, what's left to do to make it actually work as a Google Play package?
10:09	VanessaE	just the formal listings + pay whatever fees, right?
10:10	Calinou	yes
10:10	Calinou	if people want to use .apk from the Web or from F-Droid they will have to allow "Unknown sources"
10:10	Calinou	at least Android allows downloading apps from the web, unlike iOS :)
10:16	specing	you could also contact some cs faculty, they surely have an account for pushing student's stuff
10:16	thexyz	VanessaE: please instead download an android port which doesn't exist
10:18	VanessaE	thexyz: well obviously the "please download X" would instead be something do the effect of "Please use your home PC with the official Freeminer or Minetest clients to access this server." or some words to that effect.
10:18	VanessaE	(hm, repetitive. sorry)
10:19	specing	well, if they installed minetest from minetest.net, they could also install the android port from there
10:19	VanessaE	I was going on the assumption that you would eventually release your point in some official capacity, possibly even through Google Play if not your own site or the resource Calinou mentioned.
10:19	VanessaE	specing: exactly my point.
10:20	VanessaE	but the whole point is moot
10:20	VanessaE	hmmmm already said this would be pretty much impossible to detect anyway
10:20	VanessaE	and in retrospect, doing so would put us in DRM waters, which is a dangerous place to be.
10:21	thexyz	uh
10:22	thexyz	that's basically saying "fuck off" to them because they're using the wrong client on a wrong platform
10:22	thexyz	and that's only because developers don't give a shit
10:22	thexyz	and didn't care about developing android client, so they have no right to be able to play from their android devices
10:23	VanessaE	thexyz: well what do you suggest we do to kill what is clearly a threat to what little bit of an ecosystem we have here?
10:24	VanessaE	they took our code (that includes shit that I wrote too) and artwork, closed-sourced it, and slapped ads on top (or charged money for it, depending on which one you downloaded). I see this as a threat to one of the central points of Minetest, that it remain free (as in freedom).
10:26	VanessaE	and then they tied it to an interface, oh, roughly every fourth user either can't figure out (and I can't help with -- and they're on one of MY servers), or which behaves in some weird way that makes minetest look like a piece of crap
10:27	VanessaE	Minetest already does a good enough job looking bad to some people (nevermind whether this is deserved or not, immaterial), it doesn't need help from these Buildcrap guys.
10:28	thexyz	in the end only users will suffer
10:28	VanessaE	(and yes I realize it's a weird double standard, as on the one hand I don't think they realize it's Minetest for the sake of legality, while on the other hand they may still realize it is and how it makes it look)
10:29	VanessaE	so the users suffer if they have no android client, or the users AND the server operators AND the modders all have to suffer (so to speak) by fielding a thousand "shitposts" as you like to call them?
10:30	VanessaE	I'd personally rather shut out that portion of the userbase temporarily until a proper, legal, fully-Free port (i.e. yours or someone else's) can be put up for distribution
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10:34	thexyz	that's the best way to get users angry at you
10:35	thexyz	although we're already doing that
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10:39	VanessaE	I'd rather they be angry at us for a legit reason, then.
10:39	VanessaE	and this is as legit a reason as one is likely to find in the software world, I'd like to think
10:40	VanessaE	er, for a reason that results from legit actions on the part of the core devs, of course
10:40	thexyz	haha
10:40	VanessaE	(to a user, almost any reason to get mad is legit)
10:40	thexyz	which reminds me of the story around VLC, its iOS port and GPL
10:47	VanessaE	I only vaguely remember hearing something about that, and I'm not even sure if I ever did
10:47	VanessaE	some random thing in slashdot, probaby
10:47	VanessaE	probably*
10:47	specing	Did you send a DMCA already?
10:48	VanessaE	specing: a DMCA was sent, Google responded, asking for evidence.
10:49	specing	was evidence provided?
10:49	nore	VanessaE, do you know if c55 answered?
10:50	VanessaE	nore: when he last spoke of it, he had not answered yet (he didn't know what to do), but he may have done so in the meantime.
10:50	thexyz	VanessaE: VLC port was pulled down from iOS appstore because one of devs complained appstore rules didn't comply with gpl
10:51	thexyz	err, pulled off
10:52	VanessaE	pulled from*
10:52	thexyz	VanessaE: if it includes the code you wrote too then just send a dmca to google play team
10:53	nore	thexyz, do you know which Minetest version they have?
10:53	thexyz	no
10:53	VanessaE	eh, it includes like 100 LoC at most. a DMCA complaint would be longer than the code. :P
10:53	VanessaE	nore 0.4.8-stable.
10:53	thexyz	so what?
10:53	thexyz	it doesn't matter
10:53	thexyz	if they infringe your copyright
10:53	thexyz	then you should send a dmca
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11:02	specing	Speaking of guests, proller: you have some kicking on sky to do
11:04	thexyz	why?
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11:59	PilzAdam	Hello everyone!
12:00	VanessaE	hi
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12:02	Megaf	Hi folks, huge minetestserver crash
12:02	Megaf	http://paste.debian.net/72064/
12:02	Megaf	* glibc detected * ./minetestserver: double free or corruption (out): 0x00007f6d70416bb0 ***
12:02	VanessaE	haven't seen one of those in a while...
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12:06	PilzAdam	Megaf, can we get a gdb backtrace with a debug build of this?
12:06	PilzAdam	also, which Minetest version is that and is it reproduceable?
12:06	Megaf	PilzAdam, I think you can not. It's not something that happens often
12:07	Megaf	PilzAdam, however, I'd like you to help me finish to port minetest to Mac later on
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12:16	XploitR	Hello
12:17	XploitR	Found A fork which violates licence
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12:17	PilzAdam	XploitR, where is that fork?
12:18	raffahacks	It's me :)
12:18	raffahacks	The fork
12:18	raffahacks	Is the android port
12:18	VanessaE	...
12:19	raffahacks	Searh on play store for buildcraft
12:19	raffahacks	Or on google
12:19	* VanessaE	refrains ....
12:19	raffahacks	They just changed the name
12:19	VanessaE	PilzAdam: sick him.
12:19	Megaf	raffahacks, I am close to get minetest working on Mac
12:19	raffahacks	But it's not open
12:19	Megaf	raffahacks, it compile already, but it's not running yet
12:19	raffahacks	Thanks megaf
12:20	VanessaE	oh wait.
12:20	VanessaE	we all know about that android port, unless you're somehow claiming responsibility for it.
12:21	raffahacks	Is the source online
12:21	raffahacks	Ok just received a mail
12:22	raffahacks	Am wrong, sorry
12:22	raffahacks	Source's online
12:22	VanessaE	the only sources we know of are our own as in what we've published on github
12:23	raffahacks	This is the pasted mail
12:23	raffahacks	Yes, we released the modified code under LGPL if you are looking.
12:23	raffahacks	https://github.com/lukepeng/Buildcraft
12:23	raffahacks	You also can find the url on credits bottom.p
12:24	raffahacks	Thank you, have to go to eat, bye
12:24	raffahacks	Bye
12:25	VanessaE	indeed?
12:30	VanessaE	echoed the substance of the above to -dev
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12:54	Megaf	cool, I love Linux
12:54	Megaf	I mean, GNU/Linux
12:54	Megaf	nah
12:54	Megaf	I love POSIX Operating Systems
12:55	Megaf	We can make some cool script for automation
12:55	VanessaE	bbl
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13:22	aldobr	hi all
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13:23	harrison	[07:08:40] <Megaf> I love POSIX Operating Systems
13:23	harrison	Are you posixtive about that?
13:23	Megaf	heh
13:23	Megaf	yep
13:24	Megaf	Can anyone please join my server to tell me about its performance?
13:24	Megaf	!up minetest.megaf.info 30003
13:24	MinetestBot	minetest.megaf.info:30003 is up (219ms)
13:25	harrison	briefly
13:25	harrison	i will briefly
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13:25	aldobr	do we have client side lua scripting ability ?
13:26	thexyz	no
13:27	aldobr	ok...
13:27	harrison	Megaf: still connecting....
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13:35	Jordach	can't sleep VanessaE?
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13:43	aldobr	is it possible to change player model size with lua ?
13:43	aldobr	i want to create a mod for growth and reduction potions
13:43	nore	aldobr, I don't think so
13:44	aldobr	:(
13:44	aldobr	its would be a very fun mod
13:46	thexyz	what about having multiple models of different sizes?
13:47	aldobr	yes, that would cut
13:47	thexyz	hm.. I'm not sure if the API allows us to do it
13:47	thexyz	guess it doesn't
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13:55	aldobr	https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=5957
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13:55	aldobr	this thing allows changing the player model (i will study the source code)
13:56	aldobr	but i dont know how the game would react to a bigger or smaller model, under various circunstances
13:56	aldobr	ex.: what happens to bounding boxes ?
13:56	aldobr	how to setup the camera (eyes) to the correct heigth ?
13:56	aldobr	etc
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14:05	SirDigby	hello
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14:15	kaeza	afternoons
14:19	iqualfragile	hi kaeza
14:37	aldobr	hi kaeza
14:39	aldobr	thats the mod that i want to do : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hmhUE9o_IDY
14:42	SirDigby	to much to do:
14:44	kaeza	aldobr, the only thing I see impossible to do there is changing the eye position/height
14:45	aldobr	theres a bounding box change when you are giant or small
14:45	aldobr	ex.: you can enter 1 block height passages when you are small
14:45	aldobr	you cant enter normal doors when you are giant etc
14:45	kaeza	yes, but in Minetest you can't change players' collisionbox (AFAIK)
14:47	kaeza	could be a nice feature
14:47	aldobr	very fun mod
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14:47	aldobr	i would add a mobzilla monster
14:48	aldobr	so you get to giant heigth to fight him etc :P
14:48	aldobr	or you use the potion on him to make him small
14:48	aldobr	lots of uses
14:50	aldobr	mobzilla : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IjbnW1-Rnio
14:53	harrison	make my monster ... grow!
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15:11	proller	60 ppls online on one server!
15:12	proller	934M 792M usem 0 22.4H 86.77% freeminerserver
15:13	proller	2574 blocks in memory
15:14	nore	... that's a lot
15:19	proller	an it still playable
15:19	proller	(except problems with my bandwidth and serving media)
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15:42	specing	proller: Have you thought about adding unified_inventory onto your server? (having bags and a crafting guide would be cool)
15:42	proller	i want to add it to freeminer base
15:44	Megaf	VanessaE, Ping
15:44	specing	proller: laaaaaag
15:45	proller	yes 8(
15:50	* specing	slaps proller
15:51	Megaf	I have tones of lag on my server too
15:51	Megaf	but I don't know if a problem with my connection or server configuration
15:51	Megaf	I know my ISP have a broken fiber
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16:19	Megaf	now my servers peaks 54 KB/s
16:19	Megaf	where in reality it could do 12 MB/s easily
16:19	Megaf	and some players are lagged
16:19	Megaf	70 KB/s peak
16:20	Megaf	average 60 KB/s
16:21	Megaf	CPU load at 80 %
16:21	Megaf	could do 200 %
16:21	Megaf	or more
16:21	Megaf	So, I just cant understand the lag
16:21	Megaf	I got plenty of resources free
16:22	Megaf	380 MB of ram free too
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16:24	ShadowNinja	The protocol is very slow, and both sapier and xyz are working on fixing that.
16:24	thexyz	I'm not really "working" on it; I've just integrated enet
16:25	thexyz	and sapier apparently is trying to adapt the current protocol or fix it in some other way
16:25	Megaf	you could replace the protocol entirely
16:25	Megaf	no need for backwards compatibility
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16:28	Megaf	thexyz, that enet you said another day, thats the thing with a new protocol?
16:30	thexyz	yes
16:30	thexyz	sapier (and everybody else) wants backwards compatibility
16:30	thexyz	I also heard some talk about adding TCP on the top
16:30	Megaf	that will make things slower, will add overhead
16:30	Megaf	we dont need that
16:31	Megaf	we need something simple and lightweight by design
16:31	Megaf	so has to be redesigned
16:32	thexyz	why would that add any overhead?
16:34	specing	I think bags are too cheap to make
16:34	specing	only 27 tree trunks to make 4 large bags
16:34	Megaf	heh
16:34	Megaf	bags are useful
16:35	specing	yes, but too cheap to make
16:35	ShadowNinja	Megaf: You should turn down that 255 max, unless you're launching hundreds of bots at your server.
16:35	specing	should require cotton or something that is harder to get
16:35	Megaf	ShadowNinja, doest it makes the server more slow just for being a high number?
16:36	ShadowNinja	specing: Yes, before they took a lot more wood, but only woid.
16:36	ShadowNinja	wood*
16:36	ShadowNinja	Megaf: A high number makes your server vulnerable to DoS attacks.
16:37	Megaf	do we have DoS attacks already?
16:38	Megaf	Why would someone attack minetest? We are quite small
16:38	NakedFury	why would someone attack anything?
16:39	Calinou	NakedFury, because they are bored
16:39	Calinou	or for money
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16:40	kaeza	for teh lulz
16:40	NakedFury	^ there is your answer Megaf
16:40	Megaf	ok
16:41	ShadowNinja	I think there was one DoS attack, but it can be easily done without the server knowing your IP.
16:43	Megaf	Another cool thing that cool be implemented is
16:43	Megaf	I'm going to write that on a topic
16:43	Megaf	brb
16:45	thexyz	lol
16:45	thexyz	> DoS'ing minetest server
16:45	thexyz	> ever
16:50	thexyz	https://gitorious.org/opensuse
16:52	thexyz	what's the point if it lags anyway
16:53	thexyz	http://1-media-cdn.foolz.us/ffuuka/board/tg/image/1364/60/1364603166383.png
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17:10	harrison	i added the narrative essay to the yt page
17:10	harrison	http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SPGmuexvw_A
17:10	harrison	i xosted myself making that film
17:11	harrison	to please the cavilling critical masses
17:11	harrison	who complained that the didn't understand the previous films
17:11	harrison	i predict that those people will hate this one even more
17:14		Jordach joined #minetest
17:14	Jordach	eveni
17:14	Jordach	ing*
17:25	kaeza	anyone else having problems accessing the forums?
17:25		basxto joined #minetest
17:26	Jordach	Server load
17:26	thexyz	there are no problems
17:27	kaeza	eh lol
17:27	kaeza	restarting failfox fixed the problem
17:28	kaeza	this thing royally sucks sometimes
17:31	thexyz	install chromium
17:32	Calinou	firefox works for me
17:32	Calinou	but I use chromium
17:32	Jordach	I use it on droid
17:32	Jordach	works for me 8D
17:37	thexyz	why?
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17:40	Megaf	firefox works fine here too
17:40	Megaf	I used to be a firefox hater
17:41	Megaf	but now a days its a pretty decent browser
17:41	thexyz	I personally prefer chromium because I find it more convenient to use and faster
17:41	Megaf	its my main browser since Opera is not offering a Linux version for the last 8 releases
17:41	kaeza	firefox uses 100% of one CPU for me, while chromium doesn't
17:41	Megaf	I use midori a a lot too
17:42	harrison	and its is shiny -- objects plated with chromium have a mirrorlike appearance
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17:42	us^0gb	I used to like firefox. But then they introduced this one "feature" that really bothers me. The address bar no longer displays the real URI of a page, so I no longer use Firefox.
17:44	Calinou	chromium does that too?
17:45	us^0gb	Yeah, Chromium does it even worse. At least in Firefox, you can partially disable it. But only partially.
17:45	thexyz	what are you talking about?
17:47	us^0gb	The address bar in most popular browsers these days garbles URIs in the address bar in some way, thexyz.
17:47	thexyz	hm.. I think it looks fine for me in chromium
17:48	us^0gb	Firefox decodes URI-encoded characters. Chromium does that and stripps of the protocol prefix.
17:48	thexyz	ah
17:48	thexyz	is that a problem? why?
17:48	thexyz	it only strips off http://
17:49	us^0gb	Because it isn't showing me the real address of a page, but a permutation of it. For many people, that isn't an issue, but for me, it's quite annoying.
17:49	NakedFury	and who uses http to visit a website this days
17:49	thexyz	well not everything supports https
17:49	us^0gb	I visit all sorts of HTTP sites.
17:49	Calinou	if you copy the link, the http:// is taken
17:49	thexyz	us^0gb: don't know why's that a problem
17:50	Calinou	if you don't specify protocol, http or https is presumed
17:51	us^0gb	The problem is that it annoys me. Is is a problem of annoyance, not practicality. There is no good reason to strip that data. As long as there is a free browser that doesn't have that "feature" or that allows that "feature" to be fully disabled, I don't see why I should have to deal with it.
17:52	Calinou	it SAVES SPACE
17:52	thexyz	us^0gb: why, I think there's a reason
17:52	thexyz	it looks nice
17:52	Calinou	not everyone has big screens or likes scrolling through URLs
17:52	Calinou	it is also REDUNDANT
17:52	Calinou	redundant info is useless
17:52	thexyz	i.e.
17:52	thexyz	%E9%9B%BB%E6%92%83%E3%83%97%E3%83%AC%E3%82%A4%E3%82%B9%E3%83%86%E3%83%BC%E3%82%B7%E3%83%A7%E3%83%B3%E7%B7%A8%E9%9B%86%E9%83%A8/dp/4048660489/ref=pd_rhf_dp_p_t_1_HPZR
17:52	NakedFury	there is no good reason to NOT strip that data
17:53	thexyz	hmmm...
17:53	thexyz	I think quassel fucked up
17:53	us^0gb	The reason is that it obscures the truth. Spaces are not allowed in addresses. Why should it look like they are? An address must have a protocol. Why should it look like none is used?
17:54	thexyz	here's the url I'm talking about: http://goo.gl/Nv8ZDD
17:54	thexyz	ah, you're just raging
17:54	Calinou	us^0gb, a default protocol is assumed, because it's the most used one
17:54	thexyz	then there's no point in talking
17:54	Calinou	it's the same reason tab list is not shown if you only have 1 tab open...
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17:54	us^0gb	I'm not raging, I'm not even upset. SO long as I have Midori.
17:55	us^0gb	*So
17:55	kaeza	and the same reason URLs are not shown inline for
17:55	kaeza	-for
17:56	us^0gb	To each their own. I just wish it could be disabled. Then both sets of beliefs could win.
17:57		Megaf_ joined #minetest
17:57	kaeza	http://static.fjcdn.com/pictures/Technologically_22450f_2347282.jpg
17:57	thexyz	you can just write a patch
17:57	thexyz	kaeza: this site looks like shit :(
17:58	thexyz	is this an image board?
17:59	kaeza	supposedly :<
18:00	us^0gb	Drats. It looks like Midori is decoding some, but not all, URI-encoded characters. That's even worse, it isn't even consistent.
18:00	kaeza	futaba ftw
18:00	thexyz	just write a patch
18:00	kaeza	(or *booru)
18:01	thexyz	and place it to /etc/portage/patches/www-client/chromium/
18:01	Megaf	Hold your hats!
18:01	thexyz	somewhere around
18:01	* Megaf	is compiling minetest on a Raspberry Pi
18:01	Megaf	0%!
18:01	kaeza	aww
18:01	kaeza	I thought you fixed the Mac port :<
18:01	thexyz	kaeza: it's not like the software matters
18:02	Megaf	kaeza, thexyz stopped helping me
18:02	thexyz	lol
18:02	thexyz	fuck me, right
18:02	thexyz	for not helping someone in need
18:02	kaeza	thexyz, still, it's a nice software
18:02	thexyz	dunno, I have never used it
18:02	Megaf_	ok
18:02	Megaf_	Lets do this shit
18:02	thexyz	kaeza: we should have a moebooru instance for Minetest
18:02	thexyz	instead of that godawful mediagoblin
18:03	kaeza	^
18:03	thexyz	although I honestly can't imagine this happening
18:03	Megaf_	thexyz: so, Here is where I am now http://paste.debian.net/72103/
18:04	Megaf_	Thats the debug stuff
18:04	thexyz	Megaf_: well I'm sorry but I'm not a fan of such remote debugging
18:04	thexyz	or, how we call it, debugging-over-irc
18:04	thexyz	gdb-over-irc
18:04	thexyz	if you want to ask something specific then go on
18:04	Megaf_	thexyz: Would you like remote access to a Mac?
18:05	thexyz	if you want to go the "fix this shit" route then I probably can't help
18:05	thexyz	what kind of remote access?
18:05	Megaf_	ssh
18:05	Megaf_	full root
18:05	thexyz	maybe
18:06	thexyz	and how will I debug a graphical app then?
18:06	Megaf_	I can give you VNC then
18:06	thexyz	okay
18:07	Megaf_	thexyz: Just let me get things ready
18:07	Megaf_	thexyz: Do you prefer to start from scratch or from I have stopped?
18:07	thexyz	no, not from scratch
18:07	thexyz	I'm also not willing to spend more than 1 hour on it, starting from now <3
18:07	Megaf_	lol
18:08	Megaf_	so I better fix that alone
18:08	thexyz	as you wish
18:08	Megaf_	I'm not giving you control over my Mac, I would give you a virtual machine
18:08	Megaf_	I still need to install some software there
18:08	thexyz	then I don't really see the point
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18:10	Megaf_	PilzAdam: Hi there
18:11		ImQ009 joined #minetest
18:14	Megaf_	ShadowNinja: You are not shadowzone are you?
18:14		Mossmanikin joined #minetest
18:14	ShadowNinja	Megaf: Nope.
18:14	Mossmanikin	Hi folks
18:14	kaeza	hey Mossmanikin
18:15	ShadowNinja	Hello Mossmanikin.
18:17	us^0gb	Hello, Mossmanikin!
18:18		arsdragonfly joined #minetest
18:22	us^0gb	It seems even Midori has this issue, though to a much lesser extent. Time to browser shop again.
18:24		darkangel joined #minetest
18:25	Mossmanikin	Just curious: what's the issue?
18:27	us^0gb	The issue is that URI-encoded characters in the address bar are being displayed incorrectly. That is to say, they are being displayed in their decoded state.
18:27	us^0gb	Midori only does this with some characters, but more popular browsers do it with all characters.
18:27	Mossmanikin	Ok, thanks
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18:34	thexyz	> year of linux desktop
18:34	thexyz	> wifi still can't just work
18:37	us^0gb	Yeah, also graphics cards.
18:38	us^0gb	Both my wireless card and my graphics card freeze my system if I don't use some workarounds.
18:39	Calinou	wifi works OOTB often, but often requirs non-free firmware
18:40	us^0gb	Even with non-free firmware, one laptop in my house won't even recognize the wireless card.
18:41	thexyz	Calinou: well, it sort of works
18:41	thexyz	but then just stopts
18:41	thexyz	stops working
18:41	thexyz	magic!
18:41	thexyz	so I have to reboot to fix it
18:41	thexyz	this is a bit irritating
18:42	Calinou	this never happened to me
18:43	Calinou	I have a netbook with atheros wifi, that rarely crashes, but wifi works again if you disable and enable it again hardware-wise (Fn+F2)
18:44	thexyz	uh, this is a desktop
18:45	thexyz	https://bugzilla.kernel.org/show_bug.cgi?id=61621
18:45	thexyz	known bug
18:45	Calinou	>wifi >desktop
18:45	thexyz	yes?
18:46	thexyz	> typical linux fanboy telling me some feature doesn't work because it's not needed
18:46	thexyz	and no one obviously uses that!
18:47	Calinou	why would you use wifi on a desktop?
18:49	thexyz	why would you ask a question and then quit?
18:49	thexyz	that's because running a cable to this room is not an option
18:49	thexyz	and wifi generally works well enough
18:50	thexyz	to not even bother with cables
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19:13	_Megaf	[100%] Built target minetestserver
19:13	_Megaf	real 72m19.510s
19:14	_Megaf	72 minutes to compile the latest minetestserver on my Pi
19:17	_Megaf	!up megaf.no-ip.info 30001
19:17	MinetestBot	megaf.no-ip.info:30001 is up (668ms)
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19:23	thexyz	oh wow nvidia is so awful
19:25	PilzAdam	I never had any problems with my nvidia card
19:25	thexyz	both my video card are running on the max performance level and I cannot lower it
19:25	thexyz	I cannot underclock the card either, without reflashing its bios
19:25	thexyz	what the fuck
19:29	us^0gb	Wifi is just so much easier. All the desktops in my house are on wifi.
19:32		mrtux joined #minetest
19:34	thexyz	indeed
19:34	thexyz	when it works
19:35		Calinou joined #minetest
19:38	thexyz	Calinou: why is nvidia so awful?
19:38		OldCoder joined #minetest
19:39	Calinou	because people keep buying their graphic cards?
19:40	Calinou	I'm very surprised to hear you saying nvidia is awful
19:40	Calinou	you're usually the kind of person who would say they are "the win"
19:41	thexyz	I heard that other video card are even worse
19:41	thexyz	I loved them until I got this crazy setup with two video cards
19:42	thexyz	maybe I should just build a htpc instead?
19:43	thexyz	or wait for steambox
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19:44	moldy	hi
19:45	moldy	how does minetest relate to minecraft? the screenshots look so similiar. is it more or less a clone?
19:46	kaeza	moldy, other than the genre, nothing
19:46	moldy	kaeza: hm, ok
19:47	kaeza	actually depends on what you are talking about
19:47	kaeza	minetest is the engine, and minetest_game is the game
19:48	moldy	kaeza: i see
19:50	Jordach	reading scrollback
19:51	Jordach	mostly ol xyz bitching about foss world problems
19:53	kaeza	moldy, you can more or less do anything by making a game to run on the engine; minetest_game has rather minimal minecraft-like gameplay, while games like MiniTest tries to actually emulate MC gameplay. There's also Realtest which tries to give a more "realistic" feel, or you can just mix and match mods to create your own game
19:53	kaeza	wow that was longer than I thought
20:04		Mossmanikin_ joined #minetest
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20:58	us^0gb	thexyz: I'm told Intel graphics cards work out of the box.
20:58	iqualfragile	us^0gb: they should
21:00	_Megaf	Is there anyway to fix a broken world?
21:00	_Megaf	17:54:22: ERROR[EmergeThread0]: Invalid block data in database (4,-1,4) (SerializationError): decompressZlib: inflate failed
21:00	_Megaf	17:54:27: ERROR[main]: ERROR: An unhandled exception occurred: Invalid data in MapBlock (4,-1,4)
21:00	w_laenger	they do not if you have installed wrong graphics drivers
21:00	iqualfragile	_Megaf: yes, you first need to aquire a goat or alternatively a virgin
21:00	iqualfragile	and at least 5 candles
21:01	iqualfragile	then you put the virgin/goat on your satans shrine
21:02	iqualfragile	cut its cartoid atery
21:02	iqualfragile	using the blood you now proceed to draw a pentagram
21:03	iqualfragile	make sure that the angle is off by less then 1 percent!
21:03	iqualfragile	then place the candles where lines cross, light them all using burning coal
21:04	iqualfragile	continue trading your soul to satan and he will fix your problem
21:04	iqualfragile	_Megaf: thats how you fix a broken map
21:05	w_laenger	How often can you repair a map in this way?
21:05		Jordach2 joined #minetest
21:08	us^0gb	w_laenger: Only once. It costs your soul to do it, and you only get one soul.
21:09		kaeza joined #minetest
21:09	w_laenger	And if you are SATAn?
21:10	us^0gb	I don't know another way to fix the maps though. If you know how to manipulate SQLite files, you could delete the broken map block, saving the rest of the map.
21:10	w_laenger	SATAN ?= Serial Advanced Technology Attachment New
21:10	_Megaf	iqualfragile, I dont think so
21:11	us^0gb	Maybe. I haven't used SATAN yet.
21:11	us^0gb	I'm waiting for the free version.
21:11	w_laenger	actually it's something different
21:11	w_laenger	http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Security_Administrator_Tool_for_Analyzing_Networks
21:12	Mossmanikin_	Can't help laughing
21:12	* us^0gb	busts up laughing that someone would use that acronym for their product
21:14	harrison	For those offended by the name, the package contains a program called repent, which changes everything named SATAN to SANTA.
21:15	Mossmanikin_	:D
21:15	kaeza	"Shortly before beginning the GNU project, I heard about the Free University Compiler Kit, also known as VUCK. (The Dutch word for "free" is written with a V.)" -- RMS
21:15	harrison	The Free University is also known as "Vuck U."
21:15	us^0gb	Nice.
21:16	harrison	Interestingly, they hired an American as the college president
21:16	harrison	Charles Urquhart Farley
21:16	harrison	his friends call him Chuck U Farley of course
21:17	us^0gb	Of course.
21:19	Mossmanikin_	Still interesting question: how to fix a broken world? ...
21:19	harrison	tikkun olam?
21:19	harrison	gosh i am quick
21:19	harrison	no wonder i am disliked
21:20	harrison	jealousy
21:20	w_laenger	you could use sqliteman
21:22	w_laenger	you could also do a right click onto it and click on "repair"
21:22	harrison	i live in a weaksauce world
21:23	harrison	where o where is the one proud enough, brave enough
21:23	harrison	to leave the first comment on my film?
21:23	harrison	http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SPGmuexvw_A
21:23	harrison	44 views and no comments and no likes and one dislike is a outrage
21:23	harrison	i shall register a complaint with the Committee
21:23	w_laenger	finally something to watch
21:28	w_laenger	Now I watch this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CvaGd4KqlvQ
21:29	w_laenger	now this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O04ErnJ8USY
21:32	w_laenger	and now I watch this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T3Bh7D9M-Ao
21:34	w_laenger	the last one has something to do with minetest
21:35	harrison	no comment?!
21:35	harrison	this is a outrage!!
21:36	w_laenger	an*
21:36	Mossmanikin_	I bet it's too scientific for a popular site like YouTube
21:36	harrison	I bet it is too scientific for any site
21:37	w_laenger	I changed the view count to 57 by reloading
21:38	harrison	do you think i should try xtube instead and make an mpeg-compressed porno film titled "Mmm, Peggy!"?
21:38	harrison	rimshot
21:38	Mossmanikin_	You'd surely get some likes...
21:38	harrison	not so
21:39	harrison	and no comments
21:39	w_laenger	I don't have a youtube account, so...
21:39	harrison	from the weaksauce gormless mooncalf crowd of plebeians called "people other than me"
21:40		RealBadAngel joined #minetest
21:40	MinetestBot	RealBadAngel: <nore> could you tell me what you think about that please? https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/1041
21:40	harrison	is it correct to use "weaksauce" as an adjective like that?
21:41	Mossmanikin_	Who cares? Creativity rules.
21:41	w_laenger	don't ask me, here are other people, too and they should write here sth
21:42	harrison	i am only pretending
21:42	harrison	it is just how i ,04droll
21:42	w_laenger	droll is red marked
21:43	w_laenger	how can you do this?
21:43	Mossmanikin_	First red word I ever seen here :D
21:44	w_laenger	I marked it with my mouse, now it's grey
21:44	Mossmanikin_	Still red here
21:45	harrison	w_laenger: my irc client is quasselclient with a remote core
21:45	harrison	you coulld use monolithic quassel to color text
21:46	harrison	or there are outside tools like jave
21:46	harrison	to make ascii art
21:46	harrison	i would post an example
21:46	harrison	but MinetestBot is strict and would kick me
21:46	Mossmanikin_	Yeah
21:47		NekoGloop joined #minetest
21:47	harrison	i have some lovely ascii art, too
21:47	harrison	hello kitty with the nazi battle flag
21:47	w_laenger	3(E>3=6+9- 1%>3)6+!?6*7."8,0$ï¿½Æ«ï¿½Î³Ñ½ï¿½ï¿½ÅªkQ2sY:M6U> M6U>"fM)nU18
21:47	harrison	hello kitty with an ak47
21:47	Mossmanikin_	:D
21:47		Jordach joined #minetest
21:48	w_laenger	Ã¯Â¿Â½zÃ¯Â¿Â½~rÃ¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½0)#(!0)#(!Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½zÃ¯Â¿Â½~rÃ¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½0)#(!Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½ MD;E<3Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½
21:48	harrison	an ad for an imaginary soft drink marketed to otaku types called tentacle grape
21:48	Mossmanikin_	See a lot of question marks...
21:48	w_laenger	#(!0)#(!sadads
21:48	w_laenger	it's inderlined
21:48	w_laenger	under*
21:49	w_laenger	#(!0
21:49	w_laenger	#d
21:49	w_laenger	#minetest
21:50	Mossmanikin_	Interesting, but makes no sense
21:52	w_laenger	ï¿½ï¿½DEï¿½Zï¿½pZï¿½Iï¿½Dï¿½ï¿½ï¿½ï¿½ï¿½ï¿½ï¿½ï¿½ï¿½ï¿½ï¿½ï¿½ï¿½(ï¿½Ðï¿½ï¿½ï¿½ï¿½(7ï¿½Mï¿½ï¿½#ï¿½
21:52	w_laenger	I got this stuff with cat
21:52	w_laenger	(Ã¯Â¿Â½`Ã‹Â®=Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½hÃ¯Â¿Â½Ãâ€™Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½k{hAÃ¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½jÃ¯Â¿Â½{@(Ã¯Â¿Â½'PÃ¯Â¿Â½[-Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½.Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½fÃ¯Â¿Â½PÃŽâ‚¬FÃ¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½qÃ¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½U>Ã¯Â¿Â½cÃ¯Â¿Â½3VÃ¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½7Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã–â€˜Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½O;Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½XÃ¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½4ÃŠÂ½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã‹Â¼Ã¯Â¿Â½8Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½\2RÃ¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½qXntÃ¯Â¿Â½aÃ¯Â¿Â½eÃ¯Â¿Â½cÃ¯Â¿Â½H>vOÃ¯Â¿Â½aÃ¯Â¿Â½RÃ¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½@Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½KbÃ¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½-Ã¯Â¿Â½?Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½lÃ¯Â¿Â½}Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½AÃ¯Â¿Â½OzÃ¯Â¿Â½v&?Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½VÃ¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½`Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½:Ã¯Â¿Â½mÃ„â€ºÃ¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ãžï¿½Ã…â€¹Ã¯Â¿Â½+Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½0Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½W RÃ¯Â¿Â½~Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½cÃ¯Â¿Â½&9ÃƒÂÃ¯Â¿Â½79Ã‘Â¢Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã†Â¿nÃ¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½.Ã¯Â¿Â½Ã¯Â¿Â½uÃ¯Â¿
21:52	zash	you have a cat?
21:53	w_laenger	I had one
21:53	Mossmanikin_	Still just a lot of question marks, looks a bit like modern art
21:53	NekoGloop	don't use cat on non-text files
21:53	w_laenger	Ñ¢Æ¿
21:53	zash	looks like line noise
21:53	w_laenger	why not?
21:53	zash	just missing +++NO CARRIER
21:53	NekoGloop	because cat is for text files
21:53	w_laenger	why?
21:54	zash	cat is for concatenating multiple files
21:54	NekoGloop	because cat
21:54	Mossmanikin_	Noise can be art, but sometimes hard to say...
21:54	NekoGloop	so anyway
21:54	NekoGloop	how goes the testing of the mines
21:55	w_laenger	http://pastebin.com/i5hY2Unx
21:56	phantombeta	Hi
21:56	Mossmanikin_	Dunno if I should install something to encrypt it...
21:56	Mossmanikin_	phantombeta: Hi
21:56	zash	look in /dev/urandom
21:56	w_laenger	hi
21:56	phantombeta	'sup?
21:57	w_laenger	!help
21:57	MinetestBot	https://github.com/sfan5/minetestbot-modules/blob/master/COMMANDS.md
21:57	thexyz	what the fuck?
21:57	Jordach	leagner, stop spamming
21:57	Mossmanikin_	Just chattin a bit
21:58	w_laenger	!b32e ï¿½ ï¿½ï¿½ï¿½Hï¿½ï¿½ ï¿½"ï¿½ï¿½ ï¿½ ï¿½ï¿½1
21:58	MinetestBot	56732IAW56732BHPX66QJ357XVEO7P5556732IBA56732IXPX6667P55EDX37PJACLX37PIE56732MI=
21:58	Jordach	hey mossy
21:58	w_laenger	!b32d 56732IAW56732BHPX66QJ357XVEO7P5556732IBA56732IXPX6667P55EDX37PJACLX37PIE56732MI=
21:58	MinetestBot	\xef\xbf\xbd \x16\xef\xbf\xbd\x04\xef\xbf\xbd\x04\xef\xbf\xbdH\xef\xbf\xbd\xef\xbf\xbd \xef\xbf\xbd"\xef\xbf\xbd\xef\xbf\xbd \xef\xbf\xbd \x12\xef\xbf\xbd\x04\xef\xbf\xbd1
21:58	Mossmanikin_	Whattef?
21:58	Mossmanikin_	Hi Jordach :)
21:59	Jordach	dammit, last warning lawgner
21:59	Mossmanikin_	?
21:59	Jordach	cant spell on a tablet :P
21:59	Mossmanikin_	^^
21:59	Jordach	moss, generating channel flood / spam
22:00	w_laenger	!b32e ï¿½
22:00	MinetestBot	56732===
22:00	Mossmanikin_	Yeah, understood ;)
22:01	w_laenger	it looks like I woke Jordach
22:01	NekoGloop	Jordach, how goes the testing of the mines
22:01	Jordach	im acrually playjng mc360 right now
22:02	w_laenger	you was*
22:02	Mossmanikin_	I wish it would make any sense, those signs, but unfortunately it doesn't
22:02	Jordach	girlfriend plays splitscreen
22:02	NekoGloop	eugh
22:02	NekoGloop	I hate splitscreen MC
22:03	NekoGloop	though the MC360 controls are enough to be blech
22:03	Jordach	1080p 50in tv solces that
22:03	Mossmanikin_	The german "blech"?
22:03	w_laenger	that's the pointâ†’ Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£
22:04	w_laenger	ok, it looks like a small square
22:04	MinetestBot	GIT: RealBadAngel commited to minetest/minetest: Bugfix to get_all_craft_recipes. 7ae0b90ff7 2013-12-21T14:03:51-08:00 http://git.io/j0O0Yg
22:05		OldCoder joined #minetest
22:06	Jordach	\o/ finally solves that rather annoying bug in ui
22:08	RealBadAngel	it wasnt only UI bug
22:09	RealBadAngel	somebody made cleanup to the function i made and broke it
22:09	_Megaf	22:09:22: ERROR[ServerThread]: Map::setNode(): Not allowing to place CONTENT_IGNORE while trying to replace "moreblocks:horizontal_jungle_tree" at (58,-30,2) (block (3,-2,0))
22:09	_Megaf	VanessaE, Millions of these at different locations
22:09	_Megaf	whats going one?
22:10	Jordach	its your problem for writing bad code, rba
22:10	RealBadAngel	not really
22:10	RealBadAngel	my code was working one
22:10	RealBadAngel	the one who made it lookin nicer, fucked it up
22:12	RealBadAngel	some1 rewrote the function without knowing how it works and what it should do
22:13	w_laenger	I thought it's Calyou's code
22:14	w_laenger	!c 1+1
22:14	MinetestBot	IndexError: list index out of range (file "/home/user/mtbot/modules/calc.py", line 46, in c)
22:15	RealBadAngel	anyway its fixed now, issue closed
22:16	iqualfragile	RealBadAngel: are there any bump/normalmaps for the default tp?
22:17	RealBadAngel	iqualfragile, its Bumped tp
22:17	w_laenger	could you make a chocolate TP?
22:17	RealBadAngel	you can use only _normal.png 's from it
22:17	iqualfragile	link?
22:17	RealBadAngel	hold on
22:17	w_laenger	with bumpmapping
22:18	RealBadAngel	https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=7762
22:19	RealBadAngel	from the zip you can delete all the upscaled default textures, leaving only normals
22:19	RealBadAngel	the texture pack is discontinued however, that effect will be aviable as an option ingame
22:19	RealBadAngel	without need for any extra file
22:19	w_laenger	what happens if I would call something normal.png or normal_normal.png?
22:19	RealBadAngel	*s
22:20	RealBadAngel	normal map file name is generated based on texture file, adding "_normal" at the end
22:21	RealBadAngel	so if theres for example default_stone.png , engine will check for existence of default_stone_normal.png
22:21	iqualfragile	RealBadAngel: how would you add this efect without files?
22:21	RealBadAngel	its generated on the fly
22:22	iqualfragile	you can not do that
22:22	RealBadAngel	applying 3x3 sobel operator
22:22	iqualfragile	there is no explicit height information in ususal textures
22:22	RealBadAngel	ofc i can, its working already
22:22	RealBadAngel	wanna see the screenshots?
22:22	iqualfragile	yes
22:22	RealBadAngel	a sec
22:22		Jordach joined #minetest
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22:24	RealBadAngel	http://i.imgur.com/LEzebiX.png http://i.imgur.com/RX2BUjh.png
22:24	RealBadAngel	thats with sphax's 256x
22:24	RealBadAngel	without and with effect on
22:25	w_laenger	does bumpmapping depend on the look-position?
22:25	iqualfragile	w_laenger: it does depend on light
22:26	RealBadAngel	http://i.imgur.com/NcVNdwL.png http://i.imgur.com/Jh13V2j.png http://i.imgur.com/KHgOlOy.png
22:26	iqualfragile	and there is no real light in minetest yet
22:26	RealBadAngel	and ^^ some screenshots taken on VanessaE's survival server
22:26	kaeza	so much negativity in this channel lately
22:26	iqualfragile	i do not find these heightmaps to be satisfying
22:26	iqualfragile	kaeza: you think so?
22:26	w_laenger	and it doesn't work with openGL 2.0
22:27	Mossmanikin_	So glad you're working on realism, RBA
22:27	RealBadAngel	ofc you can make better normal maps
22:27	iqualfragile	good
22:27	RealBadAngel	point is to allow simple bumping feature for all folks without having to make them
22:27	w_laenger	when will water flow away torches?
22:27	iqualfragile	w_laenger: when you implement it?
22:28	RealBadAngel	if you would like to see better ones try HavenNG
22:28	w_laenger	I don't have time for it
22:28	w_laenger	and compiling minetest takes very long
22:28		Megaf joined #minetest
22:28	iqualfragile	w_laenger: but you do have time to play minetest?
22:28	w_laenger	yes
22:29	iqualfragile	RealBadAngel: might take a look allthought i dislike the look of those high-res non-comic tps
22:29	w_laenger	playing minetest is more important, isn't it?
22:29	RealBadAngel	w_laenger, what doesnt work with OpenGL 2.0?
22:29	w_laenger	liquid use of shaders
22:30	RealBadAngel	w_laenger, then please do provide me error logs you are getting, together with info on your os/drivers you are using
22:31	w_laenger	I don't get error logs if I enable the bumpmapping setting
22:32	w_laenger	it just works like with shaders and without bumpmapping
22:32	RealBadAngel	wait a sec, what are you talking about? bumpmapping or water waving shaders?
22:33	w_laenger	water waving is useless with 1 FPS
22:33	w_laenger	but ti works
22:33	w_laenger	it*
22:33	RealBadAngel	and bumpmapping is useless without texture pack that supports normal maps
22:34	w_laenger	it's useless for me, too if I use such a texture pack
22:34	RealBadAngel	useless in what meaning?
22:34	w_laenger	it doesn't seem to cause something
22:35	RealBadAngel	what texture pack have you tried actually?
22:35	w_laenger	VaE's texture pack
22:35	RealBadAngel	it doesnt support any normal maps
22:35	RealBadAngel	any other?
22:35	w_laenger	I read that it supports them
22:35	RealBadAngel	hold on for the link
22:36	w_laenger	and I didn't find other texture packs with normal maps
22:36	RealBadAngel	http://realbadangel.pl/minetest/HavenNG/HavenNG_256x.zip
22:36	RealBadAngel	because you dont read forums? ;)
22:36	w_laenger	ok, except your's
22:38	RealBadAngel	folks are free to create anothers, i just gave them ability to do so
22:39	iqualfragile	RealBadAngel: any progress on getting real lights into minetest?
22:39	w_laenger	I still don't see a difference between enabled and disabled bumpmapping
22:39	RealBadAngel	iqualfragile, i will get to it in the future, i still do have many ongoing projects
22:40		OldCoder joined #minetest
22:40	iqualfragile	RealBadAngel: while bumpmaping dos improve the looks of minetest quite a bit it actuall makes it look wore without lights
22:41	RealBadAngel	w_laenger, please check if you have selected mine texture pack, have enabled shaders, bumpmapping and parallax occlusion
22:42	RealBadAngel	iqualfragile, implementing real lighting is not so easy when theres already another light system ingame
22:44	w_laenger	I enabled these and don't really see a difference
22:46	RealBadAngel	can you make a screenshot?
22:47	w_laenger	https://f.cloud.github.com/assets/3192173/1796870/c089e882-6a91-11e3-873d-f6457a690be1.png
22:47	w_laenger	https://f.cloud.github.com/assets/3192173/1796872/c676b176-6a91-11e3-8ad1-c5d01d347d9e.png
22:47	iqualfragile	RealBadAngel: i know
22:47	w_laenger	the first one is without bumpmapping
22:48	w_laenger	or the second one
22:48	w_laenger	I think the second one
22:49	w_laenger	or not
22:49	w_laenger	I guess bumpmapping is enabled on the second picture
22:49	Mossmanikin_	matters not, there's no difference but daytime
22:50	w_laenger	I enabled bumpmapping, shaders and parallax occlusion
22:50	w_laenger	and anisotropic filtering
22:51		Megaf joined #minetest
22:52	sfan5	hi everyone
22:52	MinetestBot	sfan5: <nore> I found another way to take HD screenshots with Minetest without having to use a modified version... using xrandr
22:52	sfan5	WTF glibc
22:53	sfan5	!tell nore nice..
22:53	MinetestBot	sfan5: I'll pass that on when nore is around
22:53	sfan5	my hunger games server is down since 9 o'clock today because the glibc devs thought it would be good to halt the process when a memory corruption is detected instead of restarting it
22:54	Mossmanikin_	Gotta go, bye, later
22:55	w_laenger	bye
22:55	MinetestBot	w_laenger: <w_laenger> hi
22:56	RealBadAngel	w_laenger, please do try placing bricks block and walkin around it
22:57	RealBadAngel	see if the bricks are changing depending on the point of view
22:57	w_laenger	ok
22:57	MinetestBot	w_laenger: <w_laenger> nothing
22:57	w_laenger	oo
22:58	w_laenger	it seem to work but walking around doesn't work
22:58	w_laenger	s*
22:59	RealBadAngel	bricks shall follow your line of sight
22:59	w_laenger	https://f.cloud.github.com/assets/3192173/1796892/87900a14-6a93-11e3-9da8-5a3c3c1c6109.png
22:59	w_laenger	https://f.cloud.github.com/assets/3192173/1796893/8d120c76-6a93-11e3-9a83-400988994c4a.png
23:00	w_laenger	they don't follow it
23:00	RealBadAngel	btw, you should enable at least bilinear filtering
23:00	RealBadAngel	and they do
23:01	RealBadAngel	i can see from screenshots
23:01		john_minetest joined #minetest
23:01	RealBadAngel	move slowly cursor from left to right or up/down
23:01	RealBadAngel	and notice edges of the bricks
23:02	RealBadAngel	propably you could find the effect more visible on ores
23:02	RealBadAngel	try mese ore or iron for example
23:03	w_laenger	it does only work if I look into z direction
23:03	RealBadAngel	thats odd
23:03		arsdragonfl1 joined #minetest
23:04	RealBadAngel	what build are you using?
23:05	RealBadAngel	i like the bumps to be soft
23:05	w_laenger	0.4.8-dev
23:05	RealBadAngel	adding some shadows and give a slight feel of something being not so flat
23:05		fairiestoy joined #minetest
23:07	RealBadAngel	john_minetest, Haven or HavenNG?
23:07	RealBadAngel	Haven is discontinued
23:08		vsoftoiletpaper joined #minetest
23:09	RealBadAngel	w_laenger, so please do send me details on your system
23:09	w_laenger	ok
23:09	sfan5	w_laenger: could you please stop with this shit?
23:09	RealBadAngel	i need to know what os/drivers/GPU details you have
23:10	w_laenger	sorry
23:10	w_laenger	I was testing minetest bot
23:11	w_laenger	01:00.0 VGA compatible controller: NVIDIA Corporation NV34 [GeForce FX 5200] (rev a1)
23:11		MinetestBot joined #minetest
23:11	MinetestBot	w_laenger: Can I test you now?
23:11	w_laenger	yes
23:11	RealBadAngel	that may be the reason, i was developin it on ati
23:12	RealBadAngel	lately i found out thats a big difference and some code can work only on one of them
23:12	MinetestBot	w_laenger: what's 12351 * 2135 - 132123?
23:12	w_laenger	http://www.nvidia.de/page/fx_5200.html
23:13	w_laenger	MinetestBot: 26237262
23:13	MinetestBot	w_laenger: Are you lagging or just slow?
23:13	w_laenger	I'm lagging
23:14	RealBadAngel	w_laenger, its rather old GPU, what is your usual frame rate on it?
23:14	w_laenger	40
23:15	RealBadAngel	without shaders? or with?
23:15	w_laenger	without
23:15	w_laenger	and in a small tunnel
23:15	RealBadAngel	its AGP one, so i guess that your box is old one too
23:16	w_laenger	yes
23:16	RealBadAngel	i had 2 boards with AGP slots and trashed them lately because they were unusable anymore ;)
23:17	w_laenger	I get 25 FPS in the desert with view range 35 and no shaders
23:17	RealBadAngel	but seriously, i will try to find the reason why the shaders are behaving differently on nvidia boards
23:17	RealBadAngel	i guess i will have to buy an nvidia gpu for that
23:18	w_laenger	OpenGL 2.1.2, GLSL version: 1.2
23:18	RealBadAngel	shaders are limited to use 1.2 version
23:18	w_laenger	I don't think the new version of mesa supports a graphics card like mine
23:19	RealBadAngel	theyre not using anything above 1.2
23:19	w_laenger	you need at least opengl 1.4 to use a system where you can install minetest
23:20	w_laenger	the new version of minetest
23:20	RealBadAngel	i mean GLSL
23:20	w_laenger	ok
23:20	RealBadAngel	minetest shaders require GLSL 1.2
23:21	RealBadAngel	and are limited to that version
23:21	w_laenger	but I think bumpmapping needs a new version of opengl, too
23:24	RealBadAngel	if shaders do compile for you they should work
23:25	RealBadAngel	only thing is that same code can work differently on nvidia and ati
23:25	RealBadAngel	which is odd but true
23:26	w_laenger	I have a problem with nodeboxes, too
23:28	iqualfragile	wtF? pulseaudio seems to be a bit buggy
23:28	w_laenger	https://f.cloud.github.com/assets/3192173/1796937/8bf29ac8-6a97-11e3-9e24-5e34fc5919c7.png
23:28	w_laenger	have you installed jack?
23:28	iqualfragile	when another player wants to play stuff the stuff i allready play gets 20% louder
23:29	w_laenger	sounds in minetest?
23:29	iqualfragile	youtube video in the background gets louder when i start minetest
23:29	PilzAdam	PA is best
23:30		Lunatrius joined #minetest
23:30	w_laenger	MT is better
23:31	MinetestBot	GIT: RealBadAngel commited to minetest/minetest: Fix wrong names for parallax settings in config example. a58b47d0f6 2013-12-21T15:30:17-08:00 http://git.io/xpr47A
23:32		Weedy joined #minetest
23:32		Weedy joined #minetest
23:33		Leoneof joined #minetest
23:33	w_laenger	http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JACK_Audio_Connection_Kit
23:34	w_laenger	read this
23:34		zat1 joined #minetest
23:34	PilzAdam	w_laenger, no
23:34		harrison joined #minetest
23:34		dvere joined #minetest
23:34	w_laenger	PilzAdam, why not?
23:35	PilzAdam	I dont want you
23:35	PilzAdam	s/you/to
23:35	w_laenger	PilzAdam, ok, what about this? http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/JACK_Audio_Connection_Kit
23:35		Megaf joined #minetest
23:36	PilzAdam	that one neither
23:37	w_laenger	!b64d SSByZWFkIGl0LCB0b28u
23:37	MinetestBot	I read it, too.
23:38	w_laenger	!b64d L21l
23:38	MinetestBot	/me
23:38	w_laenger	interesting... for me
23:40	w_laenger	http://www.google.com/recaptcha/api/audio.mp3?c=03AHJ_Vutw1VZpl7xxHk-r7S_YVItL73EsaoBHYMvP63rD2vzSsQxVPpSQEnmSW1_Eajy_zJ1i3hygFkhnPuJzhhWpSnM5XSRNJ2KNNa0xtDoqdqLSB57oPiSorDfIpzLd6nV6NMd5KpaBdIRdR3sDyE_O_RcKKvllUfAdbpmyNxVSTzunN_CtzU0
23:41	PilzAdam	google link -> nope.avi
23:41	w_laenger	sorry, bit.ly/19jEqP2
23:41	PilzAdam	link shortener -> nope.avi
23:41	w_laenger	http://bit.ly/19jEqP2 *
23:41		jin_xi joined #minetest
23:42	w_laenger	why do you need avi?
23:42	w_laenger	just listen and use your imagination
23:42	w_laenger	for the visible stuff
23:43	PilzAdam	http://youtu.be/oHg5SJYRHA0
23:44	w_laenger	ogg: bit.ly/J5QNlD
23:44	w_laenger	http://bit.ly/J5QNlD
23:45	w_laenger	mkv: http://bit.ly/1cm35mq
23:45		Miner_48er joined #minetest
23:46	w_laenger	it: http://bit.ly/1l4YkwL
23:46	iqualfragile	could it be that the android version of minetest does not support loading from http server?
23:46	w_laenger	midi: http://bit.ly/195FYJZ
23:47	w_laenger	png: http://bit.ly/1juxkeD
23:48	PilzAdam	w_laenger, stop spamming
23:48	w_laenger	!sorry
23:48	iqualfragile	!stfu
23:48	MinetestBot	someone thinks you need to shut the fuck up before you get muted.
23:48	MinetestBot	john_minetest: Document isn't HTML
23:48	harrison	it is not spam
23:48	harrison	have you never listened to a john cage composition?
23:49	harrison	w_laenger is doing cage like art using irc and repetition
23:49	harrison	dk
23:49	harrison	art is not spam
23:50	w_laenger	Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£Ì£
23:50	w_laenger	so I can continue?
23:50	w_laenger	x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x
23:51	w_laenger	x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x
23:51	w_laenger	x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x
23:51	w_laenger	x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x
23:51	w_laenger	x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x
23:51	iqualfragile	!kick w_laenger
23:51	w_laenger	!kick me
23:51	PilzAdam	!kick w_laenger
23:51		w_laenger was kicked by MinetestBot: w_laenger
23:51	harrison	,03memehopper
23:51	harrison	i liked him
23:52	harrison	he was a noble true artist
23:52	harrison	yes john_minetest
23:52	harrison	i was listening to glass before you were born, i think
23:52	harrison	songs from liquid days

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