IRC log for #minetest, 2013-11-11

Time	Nick	Message
00:05		arsdragonfly joined #minetest
00:10	OldCoder	Hey... minor question. VanessaE the new world is much cleaned up. But parts remain invisible even when I stand on them. Not sure if there is a node range bug. Anything to try but increasing the node range parameters?
00:15	SegFault22	camera update disabled, maybe?
00:16	OldCoder	Hmm... How would I check that?
00:16	SegFault22	press, like, F3 or something. If not, cycle back to the normal setting and try the next.
00:17	OldCoder	Is there a conf setting? I will check. And thanks regarding F# reminder.
00:17	SegFault22	if that's not it, that is
00:18	SegFault22	I do not know about conf settings for things like that, no...
00:19	OldCoder	SegFault22, Thanks; it's fine
00:19	OldCoder	The new worlds will be fun
00:19	SegFault22	you are welcome
00:19	SegFault22	What server is it?
00:19	OldCoder	Hm?
00:20	OldCoder	I will set up new servers of my own
00:20	OldCoder	Oh
00:20	OldCoder	Sorry
00:20	SegFault22	Oh okay
00:20	OldCoder	SegFault22, I thought this was a different window
00:20	OldCoder	The server is: minetest.org
00:20	SegFault22	Cool
00:20	OldCoder	The ports will range from 30000 to 30020 and up
00:20	SegFault22	You may see me there someday
00:21	SegFault22	Could you possibly use my mod, when I release a better 1.0 version?
00:23	OldCoder	Which mod?
00:23	OldCoder	I would be please to try one
00:23	OldCoder	Stargate? Sure
00:23	OldCoder	* pleased
00:23	OldCoder	You should try this world now
00:23	OldCoder	It is cool
00:24	SegFault22	I was talking about Morestuff2. Remember, stargate is not my mod
00:25	SegFault22	It is currently in development, and many stuff has been changed/removed/added.
00:25	SegFault22	So there is currently no version good for servers.
00:27	SegFault22	However, it is not really compatible with the nether mod, unless I set the harder-stone generation depths to above the nether depth. (harder stone is thicker, harder stone materials found deeper underground, requiring better tools to mine through)
00:30	OldCoder	Ah
00:30	OldCoder	Shall I try Morestuff2 now SegFault22 ?
00:31	SegFault22	No, it is still under development
00:31	OldCoder	All right
00:31	SegFault22	Many things have been altered, and thus would cause unnkown items/blocks if used. Sorry
00:31	OldCoder	It is fine
00:32	SegFault22	But I am working on a release that should be out soon, with almost everything except the machines, which requires either an API change or horrible hackwork.
00:32	OldCoder	k
00:32	SegFault22	So when the 0.7 is out, I will let you know
00:32	OldCoder	SegFault22, the viewing problem was fixed, I think, by setting a maximum node viewing range
00:32	OldCoder	Maybe there were too many nodes to render
00:32	SegFault22	Cool
00:33	OldCoder	The new world really is nice
00:36	OldCoder	VanessaE, cy1, us^0gb, kaeza the new world is good. Most unknown blocks so far fixed.
00:36	OldCoder	I will prepare another updated cache.
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00:52	Vazon	Does anyone know the delele unknown item mod by Pilz?
00:56	OldCoder	It has been mentioned
00:56	OldCoder	But I don't have a link
00:56	Vazon	hhmmm ok
00:59	Vazon	i found it :)
00:59	Vazon	hmmm the link is broken D:
01:02	SegFault22	What if I were to name it Unobtainium?...
01:03	SegFault22	the metal needed in the superalloy Ultimite, that is. I just need some other filler materials and cool applications for stuff
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01:06	OldCoder	Taoki, Hi!
01:07	OldCoder	Taoki, My worlds are upgrading and there are two new and large ones
01:10	RealBadAngel	https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=117725#p117725
01:11	OldCoder	RealBadAngel, May I coordinate with you at some point to upgrade Europe World?
01:11	RealBadAngel	sure
01:12	RealBadAngel	hi Taoki
01:12	Taoki	hi
01:12	RealBadAngel	read the last post ^^
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01:13	Taoki	Was hoping it says they're finally in master :P I don't have Windows so test build not needed for me
01:14	Taoki	Might test them later though, not tonight
01:14	RealBadAngel	to making pull theres long way ;)
01:14	Taoki	Hope there won't be any problems running them on the free driver BTW. Soon my Linux distro is getting a new release, and I might remove fglrx (the proprietary ATI driver) and use the free Radeon one
01:15	RealBadAngel	but it starts to look amazing imho
01:15	Taoki	Though it if's OpenGL <= 2 it should hopefully be fine. Though some things work with proprietary driver and others not
01:15	RealBadAngel	btw, i fixed many issues with opengl versions with latest code
01:15	RealBadAngel	many folks reported that shaders started to work for them
01:16	Taoki	Nice. Should hopefully not be a problem then
01:16	Taoki	I'll let you know if they don't work with the free drivers after the update
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01:18	RealBadAngel	ok
01:18	RealBadAngel	how do you like new Haven NG?
01:19	Taoki	From the screenshots it looks really good
01:19	Taoki	Though for high-res textures in Minetest, I personally prefer something in Minetoon's style
01:19	Peacock	lol nice http://youtu.be/P08B_lBUL0E
01:22	Taoki	RealBadAngel: Did you manage to integrate my directional fog colors with the sun tinting?
01:23	RealBadAngel	not yet, im all the time in shaders, when solids are done im planning to start with water
01:23	RealBadAngel	solids in fact are ready
01:23	Taoki	ok
01:24	RealBadAngel	thats why im creating now real texture pack for it
01:24	Taoki	http://realbadangel.pl/images/HavenNG_3.png This is shockingly amazing especially
01:26	RealBadAngel	thx
01:27	SegFault22	So... about the horrible hackwork...
01:28	SegFault22	It looks like, to make the machines, I will have to do horrible hackwork to make them accept certain groups as fuel, and add recipes...
01:29	SegFault22	However I know next to nothing about writing code, so I am lost until someone ackenowledges the stuff I said over at #minetest-dev (never likely to happen, because they always ignore me anyways)
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01:39	SegFault22	Wow, I have used up 9 hours of my time, working on machines for my mod, just to then find that custom crafting definition types are not possible, and trying to contact the developers for a change to be made. What a shame.
01:40	us^0gb	SegFault22: It is possible, just not in the way you're trying to do it.
01:40	us^0gb	PilzAdam pointed you to technic.
01:41	us^0gb	Technic does what you are trying to do, but in a different way.
01:41	SegFault22	Possible, with horrible hackwork. I can not do horrible hackwork.
01:41	us^0gb	Read the code. Then you will be able to do it too.
01:41	us^0gb	Ah,I didn't realize it was hacky. I haven't seen it myself.
01:41	RealBadAngel	hackwork? ive created my own furnaces simply
01:43	us^0gb	Hmm. Not hacky then? I'll have to take a look at it myself later and decide. I actually want to implement something similar myself when I have the time to do so.
01:43	RealBadAngel	there are many different types of machines in technic that are smelting alloys, grind, compress stuff and the like
01:43	SegFault22	I'll take a look at it.
01:44	SegFault22	What's this Unified Inventory code for?
01:45	RealBadAngel	to create table with all the recipes
01:45	SegFault22	it depends on unified inventory doesn't it...
01:45	RealBadAngel	both default ones and the new ones
01:45	RealBadAngel	no it doesnt
01:45	RealBadAngel	UI collects the recipes for its built-in crafting guide
01:46	SegFault22	I see
01:47	SegFault22	So it does work. I'll look into it, now that my day is almost over...
01:47	SegFault22	thank you
01:47	RealBadAngel	each machine has its own set of recipes that will work only in it
01:49	SegFault22	I will combine your recipe registry with the default furnace, to make a smelter, as a test of this method.
01:55	paramat	Peacock, hmmmm ... big assteroid http://i.imgur.com/MoJ9xmF.png large central fissure next to non-flowing molten core http://i.imgur.com/lXyAVov.png
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01:59	SegFault22	How about fixing the steel/iron problem?...
02:00	Peacock	not bad
02:02	SegFault22	So... There seems to be an issue with the code "minetest.get_craft_result({method = " - what should the method be, if it is defined within the mod like grinder recipes?...
02:05	Peacock	though using the new version would mean replacing all the ores, purging the lava and changing back the snode name since i already have a map started :/ does it use vmanip?
02:06	SegFault22	Um... so we are speechless to the question about what the crafting type is defined as?... -.-
02:06		arsdragonfly joined #minetest
02:07	SegFault22	Nothing? Not even an "uhm..." ?
02:09	paramat	P, indeed. i havent coded the LVM version yet
02:10	SegFault22	-.-
02:12	Peacock	you could probably write a single vmanip base mod and plug in your different ongen functions into that
02:12	paramat	i'll be happy with this basic version in a few days, then i'll write the LVM/perlinmap version
02:12	paramat	hmm i guess
02:13	SegFault22	What should I put after "method = " in "minetest.get_craft_result({method = "???
02:13	Peacock	well it changes nothing at my end, but it could make your job alot easier :P
02:13	SegFault22	IF I have defined a crafting type like the technic grinder recipes?
02:14	SegFault22	Peacock: Are you sure you're typing into the right window?
02:14	Peacock	unless paramat is on some other channel then yeah i'm pretty sure im in the right window :P
02:15	paramat	i am only here :)
02:15	SegFault22	Oh. Your names look almost identical at a glance. What an ugly font this is...
02:15	SegFault22	Is there no hope for my question?
02:16	paramat	im not good with crafting stuff
02:16	SegFault22	Is all suddenly LOST? All of this work for Nothing?...
02:16	SegFault22	Yeah, but I don't want to bug RealBadAngel
02:18	SegFault22	So it IS horrible hackwork after all! -.-
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02:25	hoodedice	Sokomine:
02:25		hoodedice joined #minetest
02:25		hoodedice joined #minetest
02:25	hoodedice	(PING)
02:25	paramat	P, at the moment i do copy and paste a lot from mod to mod, so im not rewriting the same code over and over :)
02:29	SegFault22	Why must everything be Horrible Hackwork around here? Even Minecraft isn't that broken'd -.-
02:29	SegFault22	*borken'd
02:30	hoodedice	It is not hackwork >.<
02:30	hoodedice	It's just...
02:30	hoodedice	beta
02:30	hoodedice	XD
02:30	SegFault22	Actually, it's not beta.
02:30	SegFault22	it's Technic.
02:32	SegFault22	Here's the hackwork: Alloy furnace has a few dozen dependent pieces of code, all in different places, far apart, where it is defined what crafting type it uses.
02:32	hoodedice	That must be the RBA style of doing things
02:32	SegFault22	Instead of just a few lines, understandable and readable.
02:33	hoodedice	That would totally miss the point you see
02:33	hoodedice	We are alpha stage
02:33	hoodedice	Everything should be hacky, buggy and laggy
02:33	hoodedice	If it were'nt we would be stable
02:33	SegFault22	But this is an issue carried over since whenever crafting was added
02:33	hoodedice	But we aren't so, alpha
02:34	hoodedice	XD
02:34	SegFault22	Instead of making an API, they hard-coded 5 crafting definition types
02:34	SegFault22	And now we have an API for modding, and that is still overlooked.
02:34	SegFault22	That is still overlooked.
02:34	hoodedice	There are ongoing commits to the API
02:35	hoodedice	0.4.x is directed towards improving the API after all
02:35	SegFault22	denied, would fit this better, as I have informed them already, but they insist upon doing nothing, like Always...
02:35	hoodedice	(Though in reality, all we've done is the mapgen)
02:35	hoodedice	"nothing"
02:35	hoodedice	lol, then why don't you commit?
02:35	SegFault22	Well if this is really improving the API, why not add a way to register crafting definition types!?!?!
02:36	SegFault22	Commit?
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02:36	SegFault22	I don't know C++
02:36	hoodedice	Make changes in the base source code
02:36	SegFault22	I don't speak C++.
02:37	hoodedice	What do you mean by "register crafting definition types"
02:37	SegFault22	There are 5 types: shaped, shapeless, toolrepair, fuel, and cooking
02:37	SegFault22	The furnace uses cooking and fuel.
02:37	hoodedice	wait a bit
02:38	SegFault22	It is not possible to make a mod use anything other than those 5, without dozens of lines of horrible hackwork
02:38	hoodedice	wait...
02:38	hoodedice	Which line should I be looking at in lua.txt
02:38	hoodedice	Sokomine: PING
02:39	SegFault22	lua.txt?
02:39	hoodedice	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/blob/master/doc/lua_api.txt
02:39	ShadowNinja	hoodedice: Craft types are hardcoded in C++
02:39	EvergreenTree	Gotta go
02:40	hoodedice	I want to see what each of those definition types do
02:41	ShadowNinja	hoodedice: Try minetest.register_craft({ type="something" .... })
02:41	hoodedice	Try how?
02:41	hoodedice	blank mod?
02:42	SegFault22	Shaped = shaped crafting. Shapeless = shapeless crafting. Toolrepair = combining 2 tools to get a repaired tool. Fuel = fuels like coal (why is this even a craft, instead of a group?!?@!#?). Cooking = cooking in a furnace
02:42	ShadowNinja	hoodedice: fuel is used for fuel, normal is used for the 3x3 grid... And yes
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02:43	Sokomine	hoodedice: pong!
02:44	Sokomine	what can i do for you?
02:44	hoodedice	Hey about Realtest
02:44	Sokomine	yes?
02:44	hoodedice	Wait a bit
02:44	Sokomine	ok
02:44	Sokomine	i accidently posted in the wrong thread :-( was supposed to be in the thread for the game
02:44	hoodedice	lol
02:45	hoodedice	SegFault22: I finally got what those things do
02:45	hoodedice	But what exactly are we missing that might be a cause for something hacky?
02:45	hoodedice	Sokomine: You currently on the server?
02:45	SegFault22	The ability to use custom crafting definition types
02:46	Sokomine	er, which one?
02:46	Sokomine	i can log in. currently i'm on linuxgaming
02:46	hoodedice	You've lost me. I don't see the reason to have custom crafting whatever. Maybe because I never did mod seriously
02:46	hoodedice	RealTest
02:46	SegFault22	Like how groups don't need to be registered, the change could make it so that, for example, the crafting method of the furnace would be defined as "cooking" in the furnace's code, or for a smelter, "smelting" - and defining recipes which are of that type
02:47	hoodedice	by Danducombe
02:47	SegFault22	Not custom crafting, but custom methods, like a smelter using the method "smelting"
02:47	us_0gb	Or other fancy things. I'm making an "essencer" which needs this functionality.
02:47	SegFault22	So if a machine uses, say, "cooking" as its method, all recipes that are of type "cooking" will work in that machine
02:47	hoodedice	So, you mean that instead of items or nodes having the craft definition, the item which actually crafts must have it?
02:48	hoodedice	ooookay got it
02:48	SegFault22	the type would only be defined in the machine and recipes, much like how groups work
02:48	Sokomine	hm, and what about realtest? i think that the 2x2 crafting table in the inventory is bad for servers orientated towards building (always running to a crafting table is tiresome); but i definitely do like the idea to use machines of diffrent kinds to craft new things
02:48	hoodedice	Kinda cmplicated
02:48	SegFault22	Not really.
02:48	SegFault22	That's not it
02:49	hoodedice	then what?
02:49	Sokomine	there's a new on_craft lua api function (or similary called) that was recently added. perhaps it can be used to un-register certain craft receipes and enforce usage of certain machines
02:49	SegFault22	It would allow us to, say, in a machine's code, tell that it uses method "electrolyzing", and all crafting recipes registered, of the type "electrolyzing", would work in that machine.
02:50	hoodedice	hmm
02:51	SegFault22	Like: method = "smelting" would be defined in the machine's code, and in the recipe code.
02:51	SegFault22	This would make the machine be able to do those recipes
02:52	hoodedice	What happens now?
02:52	hoodedice	I mean, what is the situation now?
02:52	SegFault22	?
02:52	hoodedice	Without custom crafting definitions
02:53	SegFault22	The situation now, is that it must be one of those 5, and only one works like the ideal machine, that is cooking.
02:53	hoodedice	hmm
02:54	hoodedice	Hey Sokomine, how many mods are on this server?
02:54	SegFault22	We end up with a nuclear reactor being able to use coal as fuel or make steel, or a magic infuser using coal to enchant adamantite
02:54	Sokomine	on which one, hoodendice? realtest?
02:54	hoodedice	yeah
02:55	Sokomine	that has - like the normal minetest_game - several mods. the main ones are the trees, the metals and the decorative stuff. there are also mods for the crafting-, scribing- and joiner table and some other
02:55	Sokomine	you can see the list of mods if you type /mods
02:57	SegFault22	The ideal change is like groups - Tools are given a group that they work on, and all blocks in that group will be mine-able with the tool.
02:58	SegFault22	With the crafting definition type change, a machine can be assigned a "method", and all recipes that are defined as being via that method, will work in the machine.
02:58	hoodedice	hmm
02:59	SegFault22	This is better than dozens of lines of horrible hackwork to make, say, a smelter that takes only certain recipes.
02:59	hoodedice	ooookay
02:59	hoodedice	But how would one go about doing that?
03:00	us_0gb	I suppose tables might be the answer.
03:01	us_0gb	And some sort of registration functions than clean up the input.
03:01	SegFault22	There would be no changes at all to the current system, except how crafting types are handled by the engine - So one can make a furnace do cooking recipes the same way as now, and define the cooking recipes like now.
03:01	us_0gb	Yeah, that would be the best way.
03:01	SegFault22	But inside the engine, I guess tables would be made? I dunno...
03:02	us_0gb	My sugestion was only for use with the engine as-is.
03:02	SegFault22	?...
03:02	us_0gb	Using custom functions and tables, I mean.
03:03	SegFault22	Horrible hackwork?
03:03	us_0gb	It depends. It doesn't have to be horrible.
03:03	us_0gb	Especially for single input single output cases.
03:06	us_0gb	I don't know what to do about grid-based craft types though ...
03:06	SegFault22	What I mean is, the current method for defining within the mod's LUA code would not change - within the engine, it would act very similar to groups
03:07	hoodedice	Sokomine:
03:07	hoodedice	People pinging you on the RT server
03:07	hoodedice	And I need privs
03:07	SegFault22	minetest.get_craft_result() would not change at all
03:07	SegFault22	for example
03:07	us_0gb	Yes, I understand that. An engine change would be best. My suggestion only relates to what can be done if we don't get an engine change. We don't have to give up, it can be done in Lua.
03:08	SegFault22	Yeah, but the engine change solution would make mods simpler, elegant, and more easy to mannage.
03:08	SegFault22	And would open up more possibilities for the common modder not familiar with stuff not directly stated on the dev wiki
03:09	us_0gb	For sure. I completely agree.
03:11	SegFault22	but until then, we must resort to horrible hackwork. Horrible hackwork is hard to mannage, and if you accidentally scroll when trying to click, only god can help you then...
03:11	SegFault22	(well, if given enough time, one could find where they were working, but it sure is difficult and creates headaches...)
03:12	us_0gb	I don't think it has to be horrible just because it's in Lua though.
03:12	hoodedice	"accidentally scroll when trying to click"
03:12	hoodedice	XD
03:12	hoodedice	Sokomine
03:12	us_0gb	We can build an elegant Lua solution.
03:12	us_0gb	Actually, I plan to do just that.
03:13	hoodedice	=)
03:13	SegFault22	Not because LUA, but because (insert huge number of lines here)
03:13	us_0gb	I will need time though.
03:13	us_0gb	A huge number of lines in Lua is no worse than a huge number of lines in C++, elegance-wise.
03:14	SegFault22	Cool
03:14	hoodedice	There was this formspec tool released a while ago
03:14	hoodedice	I want to hug that guy
03:14	SegFault22	Yeah but, a huge number of lines occuring once in the engine is better than 10,000 mods with said huge number of lines in each mod...
03:15	us_0gb	SegFault22, It would be a dependency. One module woul dhave the 10000 lines of code, other modules would depend on it and reuse those functions.
03:15	us_0gb	*would
03:15	hoodedice	*have
03:15	hoodedice	=)
03:15	us_0gb	Oh, so that's where my "d" whent.
03:15	us_0gb	*went
03:16	SegFault22	xD
03:16	ShadowNinja	Actually the craft system could be moved to Lua...
03:16	hoodedice	Would mae it too slow
03:16	hoodedice	*make
03:16	SegFault22	But who wants to depend on Default?
03:16	us_0gb	It wouldn't be in default. Default is to bloated and needs to be modularized anyway.
03:17	SegFault22	Unless... Someone were to make said module, and upload it for community use
03:17	us_0gb	Right, that's what I said I'd do.
03:17	SegFault22	Yay :D
03:17	ShadowNinja	hoodedice: No, LuaJIT is comparable to C++ speed-wise.
03:17	hoodedice	hmm
03:17	us_0gb	I am a bit behind in my studies though, so as I said, it will take time before I can get to it.
03:17	ShadowNinja	It would be moved to builtin, not default.
03:18	hoodedice	Is LuaJIT in stable?
03:18	SegFault22	okay
03:18	ShadowNinja	hoodedice: Yes...
03:18	us_0gb	But I do have to build this for my own use, so it's not like I can skip it.
03:20	hoodedice	hmm
03:20	hoodedice	VanessaE
03:21	hoodedice	Sokomine:
03:27	SegFault22	What will we do if the Nodus team releases a minetest hack client? :O
03:27	us_0gb	Who are the Nodus team?
03:28	us_0gb	If you want, I'll build you a cracked client.
03:28	us_0gb	It isn't hard.
03:28	SegFault22	hackers. they maintain the nodus client, a minecraft hack client for griefing
03:29	us_0gb	Well, it would be even easier to do with Minetest.
03:29	hoodedice	haha lol
03:29	us_0gb	That said, if people cared, it would also be easier for us to build in better defenses against it.
03:29	ShadowNinja	Meh, a cracked client isn't that hard, but avoiding rollback is.
03:30	us_0gb	Right.
03:30	us_0gb	Assuming rollback is enabled.
03:30	us_0gb	We don't even have a defense against digging with the wrong tool yet though.
03:31	us_0gb	That's one thing we could work on if it ever became an issue.
03:31	hoodedice	digging with the wrong tool?>
03:31	hoodedice	How is that bad?
03:31	SegFault22	Yeah, but most hackers in minecraft are n00bs that use their client for xray-mining/dungeon-finding/etc.
03:31	us_0gb	For example, you could dig hard nodes with your hand.
03:32	us_0gb	It's good for the cracked client, bad for the server.
03:32	hoodedice	hmm
03:33	us_0gb	I knew a guy who added that feature to his client, too. It can be done.
03:35	SegFault22	Well, in the end it's negative for the community. Thus I think steps should be taken now to defend against hacking. Against hacking, not griefing in general, because some want to have grief/raid servers.
03:36	us_0gb	THe thing about cracked clients is that they need to be fixed on the server side. Server defense is the only solution, as client defense can be removed by the cracker.
03:36	SegFault22	Of course
03:37	us_0gb	If I ever have the time to read and understand the Minetest source code, that's one of a few areas I want to focus on.
03:39	us_0gb	Being completely paranoid, I like a good defense.
03:39	SegFault22	Of course, good defense keeps the crackers at bay
03:40	us_0gb	There are some actual features I want to work on as well. Even if they don't get pulled, I'll have them.
03:40	SegFault22	Cool
03:45	SegFault22	Well I'm going to leave now
03:46	SegFault22	goodbye all. I'll be back tomorrow possibly, with more rants and questions.
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03:51	DarinM1967	Hey everybody! Does anyone if the modf (a.k.a. Animals_modpack) wiki is still around and if so what's the address?
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03:52	DarinM1967	Oops! Sorry the forum page had it. I was using the one in the ReadMe file and it's a dead address. Sorry again for not checking there. Thanks.
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04:00	hmmmm	hmmm
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04:00	hmmmm	I really love how dugneons unintentionally spawn in the air
04:00	hmmmm	http://postimg.org/image/lqqkn73yb/
04:00	hmmmm	makes cool stuff like this happen
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04:08	OldCoder
04:09	OldCoder	News: Download this ZIP file: http://minetest.org/clients/minetest-cache.zip and merge the cache/media/ folder into your existing cache/media/ folder. Result: Faster loads. Especially of my worlds.
04:09	OldCoder
04:10	hmmmm	does anybody like this tiered mountain thing? http://postimg.org/image/njqghxlo7/
04:10	OldCoder	R
04:10	hmmmm	man shut up oldcoder nobody gives a rats ass about your server, you don't need to spam 4 lines to send one message
04:10	OldCoder	Sure. Not for EVERY mountain. But what's wrong with it?
04:10	hmmmm	oh you unmuted me
04:10	OldCoder	hmmmm, REDACTED you. And there is the response to your question.
04:10	OldCoder	Heh
04:10	OldCoder	yes; after 5 minutes
04:10	OldCoder	:P
04:11	OldCoder	^ tongue sticking out at hmmmm
04:11	OldCoder	BTW What four lines? That is one line.
04:12	OldCoder	And without servers like mine hmmmm WTF good are your efforts? Hmm, hmmmm?
04:12	OldCoder
04:13	OldCoder	Oh, hmmmm BTW that cache ZIP helps with EVERY server. Not just mine. :P again.
04:13	OldCoder
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04:17	us_0gb	hmmmm, Nice dungeon, I wish I had one like that. The tiered mountain is also interesting. OldCoder, Many of us DO care.
04:17	us_0gb	I don't have time to get on tonight, but I do care.
04:17	OldCoder	us_0gb, It is fine. Let me know if you need help with your own stuff.
04:18	Peacock	eww https://i.chzbgr.com/maxW500/7890570752/h6F91A00B/
04:18	OldCoder	And I don't see what's wrong with the tiered mountain. We can use it to make a cake.
04:18	OldCoder	Peacock, R
04:18	us_0gb	My own stuff is schoolwork, it'd be cheating if you did that for me.
04:18	OldCoder	Not if I teach you techniques
04:18	Peacock	R?
04:18	OldCoder	I've been doing THAT for 35 years
04:18	OldCoder	Peacock, Reading or Reviewing
04:19	Peacock	ah, well its just an image :P but still, the pizzaburger look gross lol
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04:19	OldCoder	Hmm
04:19	OldCoder	Peacock, to each their own
04:19	us_0gb	Peacock, Ew indeed. Who would want one of THOSE devices?
04:19	OldCoder	EmmetCooper99, the Mjolnir world is great
04:19	OldCoder	Got everything working up to a point
04:19	us_0gb	OldCoder, I assumed that was a typo.
04:19	Peacock	well just looking at the pic theres barely any meat in it lol
04:19	OldCoder	us_0gb, What typo?
04:20	us_0gb	I would HOPE there's no meat in the machine.
04:20	OldCoder	That is a good title for a book
04:20	OldCoder	Meat in the Machine
04:20	OldCoder	Hmm
04:20	Peacock	later on (around 6am) im gonna make dinner - 2 kinds of sausage with spaghetti (the sauce has two kinds of pepperoni lol)
04:20	OldCoder	Cyberpunk?
04:20	OldCoder	Yum
04:20	us_0gb	OldCoder, I though "R" was a typo until you explained it to Peacock.
04:20	EmmetCooper99	what was the result of the long media loading OldCoder?
04:20	OldCoder	Ah
04:20	OldCoder	EmmetCooper99, Presently the world takes forever without a cache. But it is very nice once you are in.
04:21	Peacock	(and i still can't gain weight)
04:21	OldCoder	Pripyat is good too
04:21	OldCoder	Peacock, uh huh and you know people would kill for that
04:21	* OldCoder	lost 75 pounds but he does not recommend the Near Death Diet :P
04:21	Peacock	to them i say, don't sleep lol
04:21	OldCoder	Sleep?
04:21	OldCoder	Lose Weight While Sleep. $1B startup.
04:22	Peacock	fall and winter - barely sleep at all lol
04:22	OldCoder	Ah. That can be risky.
04:22	Peacock	you end up burning the same amount of calories over 20 hours waking
04:22	us_0gb	Near death? That' not good. I hope you're fine now.
04:23	OldCoder	That part is OK. I joke about weight loss with mixed feelings.
04:23	Peacock	near death sucks, was it heart failure? (otherwise can't relate)
04:23	OldCoder	Sleep Peacock it is good
04:23	OldCoder	Peacock, Nah. Excuse the mention here.
04:23	Peacock	it's all good
04:23	OldCoder	Sleep is to be respected; remember that
04:24	Peacock	well its not like i don't try :P i just dont get tired lol
04:24	OldCoder	If it helps, you can Code in your dreams
04:24	OldCoder	Or write
04:24	OldCoder	You can even... dance!
04:24	Peacock	odd you should mention that
04:24	OldCoder	How so?
04:24	Peacock	the other day i dream someone broke in, stole my computer, and i had to start over my space game from scratch lol
04:24	us_0gb	I wish I could use sleep productively. If code I wrote in dreams were saved to real hard drives ...
04:24	OldCoder	That is a sign of a subconscious fear
04:25	OldCoder	us_0gb, it would not parse
04:25	OldCoder	But it WOULD give you ideas
04:25	us_0gb	Most likely, no, it would not.
04:25	OldCoder	us_0gb, PM
04:25	OldCoder	I believe it is possible
04:25	Peacock	well i had a break in three years ago, so thats always been on the old subconscious since
04:25	us_0gb	But yeah, ideas.
04:25	OldCoder	Yes
04:26	Peacock	though it ended well - i held the guys at bay with a big-ass wrench tills the state police showed up lol
04:26	Peacock	i've been pro-NRA ever since lol
04:27	us_0gb	Gun control is when you can send a bullet right through another bullet's hole, eh Peacock?
04:28	Peacock	gun control is fine and dandy for legal guns, but it doesn't stop hoods from getting illegal guns, then what do you do? (if you're in the situation i was in)
04:29	Peacock	i was bloody lucky, i didn't think a wrench would scare them, it did, would i risk my life twice on that bet?
04:30	Peacock	i guess it's one of those things that has to happen to you before you can know how you'd react :-)
04:31	us_0gb	I agree. Making guns illegal handicaps the law abiders while not hindering the criminals.
04:32	Peacock	i wont lie though, most of the illegal guns in Canada come from the US
04:32	Peacock	i dont know if they were bought there illegally, my guess would be no
04:32	Peacock	they come in through the (native) reserves
04:33	Peacock	*my guess would be yes, lol
04:34	Peacock	ideally, if everyone had fewer guns, i'd be happy too lol
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04:47	Peacock	does this look good? http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-6ab3FSUtyMk/Tc1p55gzXyI/AAAAAAAABEE/6OBPYncL03U/s640/Galbi+Burger+at+MIRU8691.jpg
04:48	OldCoder	R
04:48	OldCoder	Umm
04:48	OldCoder	I like meat, but no
04:49	Peacock	lol looks kinda off to me too
04:49	Peacock	can't find a recipe i like
04:49	Peacock	oddly enough, these are the "fancy" burgers and they look gross
04:49	us_0gb	Um. Ew.
04:50	* OldCoder	could go for chicken right now
04:51	Peacock	chickens are all frozen :(
04:51	OldCoder	No...
04:51	OldCoder	I will Google
04:51	OldCoder	And see if the BBQ place is open
04:51	OldCoder	google
04:52	OldCoder	Ah
04:52	OldCoder	Closed on Sunday
04:52	OldCoder	another time
04:52	paramat	hmmmm, i like that stepped mountain, not for all mountains though obviously
04:52	hmmmm	it's difficult to control
04:53	hmmmm	i don't really think I'm going to add that in
04:53	VanessaE	It looks very neat actually
04:54	Peacock	shit closes early on sundays, i noticed that earlier before knowing it was sunday lol
04:56	paramat	hmmmm, i love the dungeon glitches, they are so good they must not be fixed: http://i.imgur.com/IK7f0ma.png
04:56	Peacock	lol
04:56	hmmmm	it's actually very difficult to fix them
04:56	hmmmm	unless you like dungeons getting cut off at chunk boundaries
04:56	Peacock	not sure if that's a tree, hard to tell w/ textures
04:56	VanessaE	it's a dungeon.
04:57	VanessaE	that's paramat's weird 'minimalist' texture pack :)
04:57	Peacock	but why do all the textures look like those metallic panels from star trek? (with the squares in the corner)
04:57	VanessaE	idk
04:57	VanessaE	ask paramat ;)
04:58	paramat	heh
04:59	paramat	icon based textures
04:59	VanessaE	no, weird. ;)
04:59	VanessaE	everyone should just use HDX ;)
05:00	paramat	another floating dungeon http://i.imgur.com/NaFeswF.png
05:02	paramat	4 little squares = cobble, 1 large square = stone, consistent intuitive icons
05:03	Peacock	thats like algebra :P though HDX gives me headaches too so... lol
05:04	paramat	another http://i.imgur.com/dIQeQI4.png
05:05	us_0gb	I'm not even sure we can call these things glitches. I think it's more of an accedental feature.
05:05	us_0gb	It's not like the sneak ladders that are clearly glitches, fun or not.
05:06	Peacock	YouDontNeedThatâ„¢
05:06	us_0gb	We don't need that.
05:06	us_0gb	It should be fixed.
05:06	us_0gb	Especially because the fix has already been coded.
05:07	us_0gb	The dungeons would be sad to "fix" though.
05:07	Peacock	well last time i played MT classic they seemed to have a pretty good handle on them
05:07	paramat	i also love those little cobble portals that appear floating above the ground, they act as a marker for dungeons below, and have a 'stonehenge' type mystery to them
05:08	us_0gb	I haven't seen those in person, but the screenshots look cool.
05:08	paramat	... in a way they are parodies of MC's nether and end portals
05:09	us_0gb	I had a cool dungeon (though not as cool as some of these), but I no longer have it with my new map.
05:09	us_0gb	It was a simple dungeon though.
05:09	us_0gb	Just large and at the surface.
05:10	Peacock	jesus, watching boardwalk, already can't wait for agent Knox to die lol
05:11	hmmmm	paramat, have you ever messed around with blurring terrain
05:11	hmmmm	?
05:12	paramat	umm no
05:12	paramat	blurring is ... ?
05:12	hmmmm	you know, blur
05:12	us_0gb	Peacock, Who is Agent Knox?
05:12	Peacock	when you get really drunk and play MT
05:12	paramat	heh, gaussian?
05:12	hmmmm	like a low-pass filter
05:12	Peacock	agent Knox from Boardwalk Empire, if you watch that :P
05:12	hmmmm	gaussian is a kind of blur, sure
05:12	paramat	ah low pass filter okay
05:13	paramat	im into the maths of music
05:13	Peacock	maths is awesome
05:13	paramat	terrain is like music
05:13	Peacock	most languages translate well to maths
05:13	hmmmm	I'm going to try a bunch with a 4x4 kernel and see if that makes terrain any more buildable that way
05:14	paramat	my uniflat mod is there to create flat areas for building, terrain should not be too smooth
05:14	hmmmm	you can control how harshly it's averaged
05:14	Peacock	well if people are using a building-generate mod they should go with the flat map
05:15	Peacock	(if all they want is a pre-generated city)
05:15	hmmmm	e.g. [[0, 1/16, 1/16, 0], [1/16, 1/4, 1/4, 1/16], [1/16, 1/4, 1/4, 1/16], [0, 1/16, 1/16, 0]]
05:15	Peacock	interesting terrain is for the hands-on builder
05:15	paramat	people want large flat areas blended into normal terrain :)
05:16	hmmmm	and yeah, terrain is like music. except terrain is a 3d signal and music is 2d
05:16	hmmmm	all of this bullshit is just signal processing
05:16	Peacock	there's an idea though - 3d music
05:16	Peacock	paramat well i guess large plateaus on varied terrain would suit them
05:17	paramat	natural plateaus made by mapgen that are fairly smooth perhaps
05:18	Sokomine	i really ought to continue working on my villages mod to make use of the nice flat area generator paramat wrote for me
05:18	hmmmm	in order to do plateaus I'd try something like
05:18	paramat	heh Soko :)
05:18	hmmmm	if (height > 40)
05:18	Sokomine	i havn't forgotten :-)
05:18	hmmmm	height = 40 + log((height - 40)^5)
05:19	paramat	no problem, it has many uses
05:19	Sokomine	guess most people prefer flat terrain to build on. they even flatten it
05:19	Peacock	well plateaus would have to be a mg flag where it cuts off above a certain height, otherwise the hands-on types love mountains (real big ones)
05:19	hmmmm	except you want to vary the point at which the flattening kicks in
05:19	Sokomine	only very few are capable enough of using a given landscape or even sculpturing the landscape themshelves so that it looks natural and beautiful
05:19	paramat	hm'mm yes
05:19	hmmmm	shrug
05:19	hmmmm	well
05:20	Peacock	having maps like banff or aspen would be cool too
05:20	hmmmm	log() is too harsh, probably sqrt(height - 40) would do a better job
05:20	hmmmm	or pow(height - 40, 0.66)
05:21	Sokomine	thank you all for working on that. i'm curious how the new mapgen will be. perhaps time to start a new singleplayer map eventually
05:23	paramat	sounds like MGV7 in still very much in flux
05:23	hmmmm	yup it is
05:24	hmmmm	i was never satisfied with the terrain it produces
05:24	hmmmm	it's very hard to make a decent mapgen
05:24	us_0gb	I imagine it is.
05:24	us_0gb	The amount of math alone would overwhelm me.
05:24	paramat	i read you acheived 'v6 like ridges', you mean the cliffs?
05:25	hmmmm	yeah, I did
05:25	hmmmm	but it had a nasty side effect that I didn't notice at first and I needed to fix
05:25	hmmmm	and I lost it
05:25	hmmmm	I wanted to have both smaller v6 ridges and 3d noise ridges
05:27	paramat	now i seem to be contemplating the problem of how to make a mapgen with very large scale variation, that also doesnt feel 'too vast'
05:28	hmmmm	i have this checklist of things that i want v7 to be, but it's like every time i achieve one, something else is messed up
05:29	hmmmm	the "too vast" problem was probably due to a large terrain spread factor + most of the noise that modulated the terrain persistance was low so not many smaller features show up
05:31	paramat	i was thinking v6 scale terrain and biomes with that cute small MT character, and the larger scale variations are more subtle or surprising things
05:34	* paramat	prepares om-noms
05:40	Peacock	what's for om-noms tonight?
05:40	Peacock	or this morning as the case may be
05:41	paramat	:) im still here studying 4x4 kernel blur
05:42	Peacock	thats not omnoms lol
05:42	paramat	yeah this morning, i should go eat ... healthy organic food
05:42	Peacock	thats for hippies
05:42	Peacock	and as hippies often say, save a horse, eat a hippie lol
05:45	paramat	:P :)
05:47	us_0gb	I was unaware that hippies encouraged cannibalism. That's kind of scary.
05:47	Peacock	well, they like to save animals, and the worlds' overpopulated, in a purely mathematical point of view, we should eat people
05:47	* Peacock	looks forward to soylent green burgers
05:48	khonkhortisan	Eat the people, empty the jails
05:48	paramat	soylent green yes!
05:49	Peacock	well considering the prison population in the US, that might not help the obesity epidemic there
05:49	khonkhortisan	the government has to find a reason for your right to not be eaten to be taken away
05:50	VanessaE	ah so he IS still alive.
05:51	paramat	hm i dont feel MT terrain needs to be 'more buildable', if people want artificial flat area they can clear it themselves or use a mod, or worldedit
05:51	Peacock	agreed
05:52	Peacock	you already have the choice between asian and not flat, what more do you need?
05:52	paramat	yes between norfolk UK and not flat :)
05:53	khonkhortisan	convoluted mountains curving at the top into a tunnel, waterfalls going into half-filled caves leading to a rainbow above a desert oasis on an island in a floating ocean above a bottomless pit next to the edge of the world on the other side of...
05:53	VanessaE	khonkhortisan: oh, so a v5 map?
05:53	VanessaE	;)
05:53	khonkhortisan	yeah, pretty much.
05:54	Peacock	ive never been to Norfolk but i imagine now it must be terribly flat :P
05:54	paramat	indeed
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07:20	Peacock	not bad for Boardwalk Empire this week
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08:36	dmitryk1	Hi All!
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08:36	Peacock	request denied
08:38	Peacock	http://youtu.be/33VOGilOT0w
08:40	nore	!title
08:40	MinetestBot	nore: South Park Major Boobage Heavy Metal - YouTube
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08:48	nore	Peacock, don't do joining/leaving spam...
08:48	Peacock	connection troubles, what can i do?
08:48	nore	idk
08:49	Peacock	i didn't close xchat, it just kept connecting/disconecting as the signal went out
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09:23	JamesTait	Good morning all; happy Origami Day! :-D
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09:28	Peacock	origami day?
09:29	* Peacock	folds JamesTait
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09:30	JamesTait	\o/
09:30	JamesTait	Or maybe that would be something more like o\/\/
09:30	Peacock	look, you're a goose now!
09:31	JamesTait	Hah!
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10:24	nore	hi
10:32	RealBadAngel	hi
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11:42	Jordach	> Executable: quassel PID: 2088 Signal: Segmentation fault (11)
11:42	Jordach	ohshit.png
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11:54	Jordach	well, solved my problem
11:54	Jordach	clementine does not like cinnamon :>
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12:02	kaeza	mornings
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12:19	iqualfragile	Jordach: you might want to check your ram
12:20	dhbiker	^ +1
12:26	Jordach	iqualfragile,segfault
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13:26	Jordach	aw pilzy aint here
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13:45	zat	Jordach: http://www.leisurenouveau.com/images/prod/pilsen-beer-cr.jpg
13:50	Jordach	hahaha
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14:00	Jordach	hey BlockMe
14:00	Jordach	BlockMen*
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14:05		hoodedice joined #minetest
14:05	hoodedice	...
14:08	kaeza	....
14:11	hoodedice	... Indeed
14:11	hoodedice	*....
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14:35	BlockMen	hi Jordach
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14:43	kaeza	BlockMen, you can edit the main page at wiki.minetest.net, right?
14:45	BlockMen	kaeza, forgot to add these. will do now
14:45	kaeza	ah thanks :)
14:46	BlockMen	"##minetest-es", not "#minetest-es" ??
14:46	kaeza	yes
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14:47	kaeza	because it was not so official-ish at the time :P
14:47	nore	hey, why all those languages and not ##minetest-fr?
14:47	BlockMen	wasnt there also #minetest-ru?
14:50	nore	#minetest-mods should perhaps be removed from the website too...
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14:50	nore	no-one uses it anyway
14:51	kaeza	there's only CS on #-fr
14:52	nore	CS?
14:52	kaeza	ChanServ
14:53	nore	indeed... :(
14:53	nore	anyway, the very fact that #minetest-mods exists should be removed from the main site
14:54	BlockMen	we are talking about the wiki atm
14:54	nore	there are few people who come on it, and are said that they should go to #minetest
14:55	nore	is there any page about IRC on the wiki?
14:55	nore	ok, there is one
14:55	BlockMen	on the main page in resources is #minetest and finish #minetest atm
14:55	nore	#minetest-mods should be removed from there too
14:56	nore	http://wiki.minetest.net/IRC <-- that page
14:56	BlockMen	feel free to do that :P
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15:35	Jordach	grr
15:35	* Jordach	is now grumpy
15:36	Jordach	blender has decided to be smooth as butter now
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15:54	Jordach	aw, reactor isnt here
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16:20	Dan_D	Is anyone here good with particle spawners?
16:22	Dan_D	I need bonfire:self_active to spawn particles with bonfire_smoke.png and have the particles float upwards, be physical, and disappear after 5 seconds
16:23	Dan_D	And also it needs to stop spawning particles when removed in any way
16:23	kaeza	https://github.com/celeron55/minetest/blob/master/doc/lua_api.txt#L1418
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16:23	Dan_D	That is unhelpful
16:24	kaeza	the API description is pretty clear
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16:24	Dan_D	lua_api.txt has hardly ever helped me.
16:24	Dan_D	I wouldn't even be able to see how to define a node using it
16:25	Dan_D	And that doesn'tsayhow to remove if afaik
16:25	Dan_D	O wait I see
16:27	VanessaE	hi
16:27	kaeza	hi V
16:27	VanessaE	Jordach: RealBadAngel's shaders work perfectly in blender - smooth as glass, never seen anything like it.
16:27	Dan_D	Hi VanessaE
16:27	VanessaE	or at least, the original .blend he pointed me to does.
16:27	VanessaE	hey
16:28		general3214 joined #minetest
16:29	VanessaE	kaeza: thanks for dealing with aracnus' request :)
16:29	kaeza	no probs :)
16:30	kaeza	don't mind doing simple rebasing, but if the thing end up fucked up, blame proll^Waracnus :P
16:31	VanessaE	lol
16:31	VanessaE	I'd have rebased it myself, but when the rebase shows merge commits and entries that were already there before, I get confused.
16:42		lutoma joined #minetest
16:43		EvergreenTree joined #minetest
16:43	kaeza	VanessaE, he also asked how to do that in the future; see #minetestinchra logs :P
16:43	Sokomine	dan: please don't use particle spawners. those in the bees mod cause massive fps drops for me
16:43	general3214	I've made a Pokemon berries mod and I need your opinions: http://i.imgur.com/ybl5WH4.png
16:44	Calinou	heh
16:44	Sokomine	vanessa: tell that to inocudom :-) he seems to love shaders
16:44	Calinou	Sokomine: maybe that's because the particles are set to not disappear?
16:44	Calinou	also, big particles that cover your whole screen WILL slow you down, always
16:44	Sokomine	i'm not entirely sure about them myshelf. guess i like the...hard edges...more than the shaders. hard to tell what the difference really is
16:44	Calinou	I like shaders :P
16:44	Calinou	but not overly done ones
16:45	general3214	Does anyone like my trees?
16:45	Sokomine	calinou: i don't know why that fps drop occours. it's pretty drastic. not only on my not so good hardware but also on better one
16:45	kaeza	Calinou, particle spawners slow down client in the long term
16:45	Sokomine	the bees particles are not that big i think
16:46	kaeza	try playing with the weather mod for ~15 mins
16:46	Sokomine	there's just plenty of them. if you have any clue as to how the code can be improved there please do so! those bees flying around are great!
16:46	general3214	Do the bees attack the player?
16:46	Calinou	kaeza: then it's a bug, or the particules never actually disappear
16:47	Sokomine	general: i may be too old for pokemon. your plants as such look nice
16:47	kaeza	>too old for pokemon
16:47	kaeza	NEVAR!
16:47		blaze joined #minetest
16:47	general3214	Sokomine: I didn't make the textures; the screenshot uses textures from Bulbapedia
16:48	general3214	But maybe I should ask someone to make some...
16:48	Sokomine	general: in a way they attack. there are random places that are protected by the bees...(and most likely where the spawners are). if you enter such an area of intrest, the bees sting you
16:48	Sokomine	textures are quite important for most mods
16:48	general3214	Do they chase the player?
16:48	Sokomine	not really :-) it just looks like they do
16:48	general3214	What do you mean by important?
16:49	EvergreenTree	Oh hey general3214
16:49	general3214	There are many ways I can interpret that
16:49	general3214	Hi?
16:49	EvergreenTree	Just discovered the IRC channel?
16:49	EvergreenTree	:P
16:49	general3214	No...
16:49	general3214	I've joined quite a few times before
16:50	EvergreenTree	Strange, never noticed you before
16:50	general3214	You're probably either AFK or ignorant :D
16:50	general3214	Although, I don't talk often
16:50	Jordach	/ignorant *
16:50	general3214	*write/text/etc.
16:50	Sokomine	important as in: good textures make your mod attractive and make players want to use your nodes. it's not everything but it's an important point
16:51	general3214	Ah yes
16:51	general3214	Very good point
16:52	general3214	I'll give a screenshot of the berries themselves in a sec
16:52	general3214	Wait...
16:52	general3214	If you know Pokemon, then you'll know what the textures look like...
16:52	general3214	XD
16:52	general3214	I just copy & pasted from Bulbapedia
16:53	general3214	I'll just send a screenshot anyways
16:53	general3214	http://i.imgur.com/xrDlqVR.png
16:54	* general3214	may be talking to himself.
16:57	Sokomine	i don't know pokemon. i only know that it exists
16:58	Sokomine	strange berries. but since many players are young, they might enjoy them a lot
16:58	Sokomine	make a few screenshots and post them in the forum :-)
17:01	general3214	I'll post screenshots after I add a few more berries and make some more tweaks
17:01	general3214	*post a topic and screenshots
17:06		OWNSyouAll joined #minetest
17:06	Calinou	general3214\|AFK: don't use away nicks, use /away [reason] :)
17:06	thexyz	see? just like i said
17:06	thexyz	welcome to freenode
17:10		rsiska joined #minetest
17:10		markveidemanis joined #minetest
17:10		markveidemanis joined #minetest
17:11	markveidemanis	Hi
17:12	Calinou	hi
17:14	general3214\|AFK	Oh
17:16		Hunterz joined #minetest
17:17		rubenwardy joined #minetest
17:20	rubenwardy	Hi all
17:20	kaeza	hi ruben
17:21	rubenwardy	wuu2?
17:21	VanessaE	hi ruben
17:22	Jordach	rubenwardy, engrish
17:22	rubenwardy	What you up to?
17:22	rubenwardy	Engrish!
17:22	Calinou	hi
17:22	general3214	In an ABM, is the interval in seconds?
17:23	kaeza	yes
17:23	VanessaE	yes
17:23	VanessaE	real-world seconds that is
17:23	general3214	How do I un-away
17:23	rubenwardy	Two answers: Combo score!
17:23	kaeza	/back
17:23	general3214	Thanks
17:23	rubenwardy	Two answers: 2Combo score!
17:23	rubenwardy	Two answers: 3Combo score!
17:23	rubenwardy	meh
17:23	general3214	:O
17:23	rubenwardy	wanted red
17:24	kaeza	-c :O
17:24	rubenwardy	lol
17:24	general3214	Hey, it's rubenwardy, the guy that made one of the foods mod and the awards mod
17:24	rubenwardy	The first food mod
17:24	rubenwardy	:P
17:24	rubenwardy	And the best one for support
17:24	rubenwardy	the worst one for textures
17:24	kaeza	don't forget NBGen! that is awesomeness
17:24	general3214	I think I might be the first one to make a Pokemon mod
17:25	rubenwardy	I was thinking about a FSGen, but I cant be bothered with learning SDL
17:25	rubenwardy	and irrlicht is terrible at 2d stuff
17:29	rubenwardy	122 errors when compiling new version of NBGen
17:29	rubenwardy	I must have forgotten a ; after a class declaration: thats how cpp works
17:31		OWNSyouAll joined #minetest
17:32	general3214	Maybe I should make mulch... :D
17:32	Jordach	general3214, BULLSHIT
17:32	general3214	Probably /give or creative-only mulch
17:33	general3214	XD
17:34	general3214	Trait of Jordach: cusses/swears with humor
17:34	Jordach	general3214, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kHz0bNBSrKs
17:34	Jordach	elderly, but i proved it first
17:35	Jordach	(that also took an age to export from blender, not to mention another age sorting out faces)
17:36	general3214	proved what first?
17:36	general3214	And was that your voice?
17:37	general3214	Must I get the attention of Jordach by the typing of Jordach?
17:38	Jordach	general3214, yup yup and yup
17:38	general3214	<general3214> proved what first?
17:38	general3214	<general3214> And was that your voice?
17:38		arsdragonfly joined #minetest
17:39	general3214	Oh wait
17:39	Jordach	general3214, it was a prototype
17:39	* general3214	is a dummy
17:39	Calinou	general3214: I'm the guy that made more blocks/more ores/map tools! D:
17:39	Calinou	also converted 4 Minecraft packs and translated Minetest to french
17:39	general3214	Calinou, how does that relate to me?
17:40	Calinou	it doesn't
17:40	Calinou	but you said <general3214> Hey, it's rubenwardy, the guy that made one of the foods mod and the awards mod
17:40	general3214	Ah
17:40	general3214	You jealous?
17:40	general3214	:D
17:40	thexyz	fucking jelly
17:41	rubenwardy	Nobody remembers CaptureTheFlag
17:41	general3214	Geez, xyz, lower the amount of swearing
17:41	rubenwardy	My greatest modding achievment
17:41	rubenwardy	My greatest modding achievement
17:41	general3214	Capture. The. Flag?
17:41	* Jordach	made the first wool incarnation
17:41	thexyz	I'm trying
17:41	* general3214	made wool carpets
17:41	thexyz	I didn't even include the pic
17:42	rubenwardy	!title https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=6947
17:42	MinetestBot	rubenwardy: [Game] Capture the Flag and City VS City combat [0.1][capturetheflag] (Page 1) Ã¢Â€Â” Minetest Games Ã¢Â€[...]
17:42	thexyz	but you can google it of course <3
17:42	general3214	rubenwardy: Cool!
17:42	* sfan5	hits google
17:42	Calinou	better hit startpage
17:42	Jordach	general3214, https://github.com/Jordach/Minetest-Mods/commit/408ef31d0b30492be49463d00da14c05df3a4252
17:43	Jordach	wool is nearly 2 years old
17:43	general3214	...?
17:43	Jordach	while it's legacy, it lives on as the reworked wool mod
17:43	general3214	<general3214> ...?
17:43	rubenwardy	You dont have many mods, Jordach!
17:43	Jordach	rubenwardy, that used to be the case
17:44	general3214	So what
17:44		OWNSyouAll joined #minetest
17:44	Jordach	i've got hundreds of prototypes in my local world
17:44	general3214	You're on a modding spree?
17:44	rubenwardy	Make 4more!
17:44	rubenwardy	really?
17:44	Jordach	general3214, two years ago, i just happen to make local world onlies
17:44	general3214	<general3214> <general3214> ...?
17:44	Jordach	stop self quoting the last one
17:44	general3214	Jordach, you confuse me a lot.
17:45	rubenwardy	Jordach is crazy!
17:45	general3214	:DD
17:45	Jordach	btw, i made an animated node before animated textures: https://github.com/Jordach/Minetest-Mods/blob/master/tv/init.lua
17:45	Jordach	it still works today
17:45	rubenwardy	That kept coming up with error messages, it is very annoying
17:45	general3214	Jordach: cool?
17:46	Jordach	rubenwardy, it was basically experimental
17:46	rubenwardy	yeah :P
17:46	Jordach	(basically, that repo contains things that now exist in default)
17:46	thexyz	sfan5: did you enjoy it?
17:46	Jordach	panes evolved into xpanes
17:46	Jordach	(thanks xyz)
17:46	sfan5	thexyz: yep
17:46	thexyz	I see
17:47	rubenwardy	I made a DW mod, but the generation code was terrible because the mapblock the inside of the tardis generated into wasnt loaded, so changes were lost
17:47	rubenwardy	Never published it
17:47	* Jordach	happens to be seeding faster than uploading
17:47	Jordach	downloading*
17:48	general3214	Bye now
17:48	thexyz	while we're offtopic, redshift is awesome, you should totally use it
17:48	thexyz	http://jonls.dk/redshift/
17:48	sfan5	!title
17:48	MinetestBot	sfan5: Redshift \| jonls devblog
17:48	rubenwardy	Just searched forums/ Author: Jordach / Keywords: [Mod] / forum: Modding releases & modding general
17:48	Jordach	rubenwardy, i made mods before the general releases split
17:48	* sfan5	has f.lux installed
17:49	* Jordach	should re install it again
17:49	thexyz	it's shit
17:49	thexyz	windows-only shit
17:49	thexyz	and I guess not open source too
17:49	sfan5	nope it isn't
17:49	thexyz	why on earth would you use it
17:50	Jordach	http://justgetflux.com/linux.html
17:50	thexyz	linux version is so shitty it's better to think it doesn't exist
17:50	thexyz	and just installing it is fucking painful
17:50	thexyz	and no source too
17:50	thexyz	don't use flux
17:50	thexyz	also much copyrights
17:50	thexyz	much research
17:51	thexyz	switch to free and libre alternative right now
17:51	sfan5	I'll remove f.lux now because I don't need it anymore
17:51	thexyz	oh well
17:51	thexyz	if you're using windows i guess you're fucked anyway
17:51	thexyz	so keep on using that proprietary thing
17:51	Jordach	thexyz, ctcp version me
17:52	thexyz	and?
17:52	thexyz	21:52 [Freenode] --- Got VERSION reply from Jordach: Quassel IRC v0.9.0 (dist-3b9dd10) (built on Apr 17 2013 06:24:12) -- http://www.quassel-irc.org
17:53	sfan5	lololol, it didn't include that you are using linux
17:53		NakedFury joined #minetest
17:53	Jordach	thexyz, http://i.imgur.com/BnIkSzf.jpg
17:53	thexyz	what's that quassel thing and why is it suddenly so popular?
17:53	thexyz	oh, I see
17:54	Jordach	thexyz, it's way better than (he)xchat
17:54	thexyz	how does quassel core compare to znc?
17:54	Jordach	it has a logback database
17:54	MinetestBot	7t4e6s9t4 2rain2bo5w pl2e2a9s6e4 4ig2nor5e
17:54	thexyz	what is a logback database?
17:54	rubenwardy	!mlp thexyz
17:54	Jordach	thexyz, quassel uses sqlite to store logs
17:54	Jordach	basically, it doesn't have a limit to scrollback
17:54	thexyz	Jordach: is it a good thing?
17:55	thexyz	oh
17:55	Jordach	you can go back up to the first day you joined that channel
17:55	thexyz	I'm not sure how it's related but I guess it's cool
17:55	thexyz	related to having logs in sql databse
17:55	* Jordach	still needs to move his windows file to Mint
17:55	thexyz	rubenwardy: what was that?
17:55	sfan5	sqlite3 is cool
17:55	Jordach	(mine weighs 35mb!!)
17:56	rubenwardy	http://irc.minetest.ru/minetest/2013-11-09#i_3425342
17:56	thexyz	hm.. I've never watched it
17:57	rubenwardy	Neither have I
17:57	thexyz	but I bring you this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VTlTfL0szTI
17:57	* Jordach	cannot image thexyz as a brony
17:57	sfan5	!title
17:57	MinetestBot	sfan5: My Little Pony: GEDDAN is Magic - YouTube
17:57	sfan5	haha
17:57	thexyz	well at least spam me with stuff you've experienced
17:57	thexyz	Jordach: sure, I'm more into girls
17:58	sfan5	who isn't? :P
17:58	sfan5	s/:P/;)/
17:58	rubenwardy	Gay people?
17:58	rubenwardy	Or hetero women?
17:59	nore	sfan5, is the rainbow thing !rainbow?
17:59	sfan5	nore: psst
17:59	thexyz	also best geddan http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rKmL_eVZZX4
17:59	rubenwardy	15(and the room goes quiet...)
18:00	rubenwardy	(a
18:00	MinetestBot	no2pe9.av3i
18:00	nore	!rainbow !rainbow
18:00	MinetestBot	8!ra4in5bow
18:00	rubenwardy	(and the room goes quiet...)
18:00	rubenwardy	Not quite right
18:00	sfan5	!title
18:00	MinetestBot	sfan5: "ã‚²ãƒƒãƒ€ãƒ³/Geddan" GET DOWN! (swiss version) - YouTube
18:00	kaeza	https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/100008207/Screenshot%20from%202013-11-11%2012%3A37%3A32.jpg
18:00	kaeza	<.<
18:00	sfan5	>.>
18:00	Jordach	^.^
18:01	kaeza	v.v
18:01	sfan5	<.<
18:01	thexyz	kaeza: have you watched it?
18:01	kaeza	thexyz, no comments :3
18:01	* Jordach	attempts to log back into his email using Thunderbird
18:01	thexyz	kaeza: you can /msg me <3
18:02	MinetestBot	5k7a3e4z6a4:9 meo9w
18:02		PilzAdam joined #minetest
18:02	Jordach	hey PilzAdam
18:02	thexyz	I heard it's good
18:02	PilzAdam	Hello everyone!
18:02	MinetestBot	6hey3 5Pi8l6z8A7d8am7 6i9s 3t9h4er7e2!3 3\3o/
18:02	kaeza	I only watched a few episodes actually
18:02	thexyz	oh
18:02	PilzAdam	oh, -c party again?
18:03	nore	sfan5, how do you make the command private without getting a private reply?
18:03	MinetestBot	P7i4lz5A2d6am:6 y3e7p
18:03	kaeza	but /me likes it :3
18:03	rubenwardy	Not quite right
18:03	sfan5	nore: https://github.com/sfan5/minetestbot-modules/commit/db3365c81a1caf41e7e8f845e54bb45e7b2ecefc
18:03	rubenwardy	nice commit
18:04	rubenwardy	"Add ability to send rainbows to other galaxies"
18:04	rubenwardy	!rainbow
18:04	MinetestBot	Rai6n3b5ow What?
18:04	pitriss	Hi, i want to ask.. is there any way how to modify /me command in mod? This function is part of builtin..
18:05	nore	sfan5, how does it work?
18:05	thexyz	kaeza: but since it's a parody I guess the enjoyment depends on your power level
18:05	sfan5	read the file..
18:06	rubenwardy	pitriss, you could use on chat send or something and get in before chat command is called
18:07	nore	sfan5, what is "arg" and what is "input" in the code?
18:07	Jordach	argument
18:07	thexyz	sfan5: I think I can recommend you sadpanda if you enjoy stuff like this ^^
18:08	pitriss	rubenwardy: okay, thanks i will try that
18:08	sfan5	!g sadpanda
18:08	MinetestBot	sfan5: http://sadpanda.us/
18:08	PilzAdam	pitriss, try to register the same chatcommand again
18:08	thexyz	oooh
18:08		arsdragonfly_ joined #minetest
18:08	thexyz	it's hard to google using this keyword, actually
18:08	sfan5	thexyz: please define "like this"
18:08	markveidemanis	!rainbow my ass
18:08		khor joined #minetest
18:09	rubenwardy	lol, markveidemanis is ignored
18:09	pitriss	PilzAdam: Okay, this can be better if this will work
18:09	thexyz	well that jelly thing I guess?
18:09	sfan5	markveidemanis: do not make me ban you again
18:09		AspireMint joined #minetest
18:09	markveidemanis	WTF
18:09	thexyz	meh, I sometimes don't like the fact this channel is logged
18:09	thexyz	can't talk about fun shit
18:09	nore	sfan5: that? !rainbow #minetest test
18:09	sfan5	yep
18:09	markveidemanis	That doesn't stop us
18:09	sfan5	>us
18:10	nore	!rainbow #minetest test
18:10	sfan5	pls
18:10	MinetestBot	#m4i6n6e5tes3t te4s6t
18:10	nore	doesn't work...
18:10	sfan5	nore: """and input.admin:"""
18:10	nore	:(
18:10	rubenwardy	!rainbow 4hi
18:10	MinetestBot	12â€‹4h7i
18:10	rubenwardy	hmmm
18:10	sfan5	eh
18:10	markveidemanis	hahaha
18:10	sfan5	wat
18:10	kaeza	fail :P
18:10	markveidemanis	typo!
18:10	thexyz	why fail?
18:10	nore	what is that "4" doing here?
18:10	sfan5	test
18:10	PilzAdam	pitriss, can you tell me if it works?
18:10	thexyz	that's how colors in IRC work
18:11	rubenwardy	!rainbow ctrl+k 4 hi
18:11	MinetestBot	6c2trl+6k9 â€‹4 5h8i
18:11	rubenwardy	woops
18:11	thexyz	there's a "magic" char and then a number
18:11	nore	4hi
18:11	pitriss	PilzAdam: yes, of course.. I'm trying it just now.:)
18:11	sfan5	oh
18:11	kaeza	I know, but the 4 shouldn't be there
18:11	sfan5	that is how it works
18:12	thexyz	that's because the bot is too stupid to strip out colors
18:12	sfan5	It's a feature ~
18:12	nore	!rainbow !rainbow
18:12	kaeza	\00304hi! -> hi!
18:12	nore	^ no answer... :(
18:14	sfan5	!rainbow !rainbow
18:14	MinetestBot	3!r9ain5b7o3w
18:14	sfan5	..
18:14	sfan5	ah
18:14	nore	yes, but !rainbow !rainbow doesn't work (color...)
18:14		OWNSyouAll joined #minetest
18:14	nore	(I should have removed color...)
18:16	* nore	should write a plugin for xchat to say rainbow things... (evil laugh)
18:16	kaeza	>rainbow things
18:16	Jordach	2/3 emails done
18:16	Calinou	>green text
18:16	Jordach	my bloody viewskew server is down
18:16	Calinou	>green text
18:16	Jordach	(well, the mail.viewskew is anyhow)
18:17	pitriss	PilzAdam: okay so re registering of this same function works..
18:17	Jordach	,03><Calinou01,05> >green text
18:17	Jordach	fuck
18:18	PilzAdam	pitriss, nice
18:18	* Jordach	wants people to join VanessaE's Survival World
18:19	VanessaE	no one likes my servers because most of them need recent git and people are too lazy to build it, or too stubborn..git is "unstable" or "unofficial" or some other bs
18:21	NakedFury	ignore them
18:22	NakedFury	the server is there for playing. if they dont take the time to look for a build in the forums then its their loss
18:22	pitriss	VanessaE: I'm using latest git, but, I don'Å§ like realistic textures in MT.. They don't fit into MT:)
18:22	sfan5	git is more official than 0.4.7
18:22	VanessaE	so don't use HDX?
18:22	sfan5	(because it is source code)
18:23	NakedFury	pitriss, use your own textures
18:23	Calinou	the default ones aren't that realistic
18:23	Calinou	walk outside and see :)
18:23	Calinou	I have yet to find Mese IRL
18:24	AspireMint	Hello, VanessaE i have always problem with connecting to your servers :/ whats server version of mt? (im on windows)
18:24	pitriss	NakedFury: heh I'm too lazy to remake all textures used on Vanessaes servers to some normal ones, just to play there.. I prefer to chose any other server where I don't need to spent hours by searching/creating textures:)
18:24	VanessaE	AspireMint: git, no older than October 15.
18:28		ganoo joined #minetest
18:29		thexyz_ joined #minetest
18:29	thexyz	uhh
18:29	Jordach	urr
18:29	Jordach	hurr durr
18:30	sfan5	eh
18:30	Jordach	plol
18:30		thexyz_ joined #minetest
18:32	Jordach	lolol
18:32	Jordach	Guest39274, :P
18:33	MinetestBot	5Someon7e 5th7r7o2w 9a4 2k8it5ten2 9at m5e!
18:33	* sfan5	throws a kitten at MinetestBot
18:33	MinetestBot	7:â€‹3
18:34	* pitriss	is going blind from those colorful lines
18:34	Jordach	you're taking the pitriss
18:35		proller joined #minetest
18:35		troller joined #minetest
18:37	PilzAdam	dafuq? https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=117714#p117714
18:39		arsdragonfly joined #minetest
18:39	rubenwardy	\0030
18:39		LazyJ joined #minetest
18:41	thexyz	PilzAdam: what's wrong here?
18:42	PilzAdam	thexyz, I dont see people write about their "feelings" like this very often
18:43	thexyz	probably because our forums are not the most friendly place
18:43	thexyz	so people are afraid of being honest about how they feel
18:44	thexyz	because they'll be laughed at
18:46	* PilzAdam	sees nobody laughing at him
18:46	PilzAdam	also talking about feelings has not much to do with how "friendly" the forum is
18:47	thexyz	why?
18:49	PilzAdam	you can be friendly while talking about ontopic stuff (the "feelings" topic is offtopic)
18:50		Tux[Qyou] joined #minetest
18:50	thexyz	uh, forget it
19:03	rubenwardy	Bye all!
19:07		dafull97 joined #minetest
19:09		arsdragonfly_ joined #minetest
19:24	MinetestBot	GIT: Sapier at GMX dot net commited to minetest/minetest: Disable localization workaround in server bb54e2cf1d 2013-11-11T10:56:49-08:00 http://git.io/Z3Pdog
19:24	MinetestBot	GIT: Sapier at GMX dot net commited to minetest/minetest: Fix win32/msvc i18n (quite UGLY version, blame Microsoft) 22a59b3912 2013-11-11T10:56:49-08:00 http://git.io/GfOATg
19:28	Jordach	Sokomine, stop making expensive recipes
19:30	Jordach	...same goes for you too ShadowNinja ;)
19:39		arsdragonfly joined #minetest
19:47		Calinou joined #minetest
19:57		Menche joined #minetest
20:06	EvergreenTree	Hey Menche
20:07	Menche	hello
20:08	lutoma	Moh1Phoo6neiphu5pheeguucaig6fi1daphah3oop7gaF9them8deibahpuuC6iebeij0cahm4hiulooja5ci3Sie8cai4eew7et
20:09	Calinou	!vote lutoma
20:10	lutoma	Calinou: :<
20:10	Calinou	!shoot lutoma
20:10	lutoma	:<
20:10	Calinou	Calinou shoots lutoma with a silver bullet!
20:10	Calinou	lutoma is a pony, and is dying from the silver bullet.
20:10	Jordach	lutoma, dafuq
20:10	lutoma	whaat. why would you kill ponies :<
20:10	lutoma	Jordach: a script gone wrong ^^
20:11	PilzAdam	!goat Calinou
20:11	PilzAdam	PilzAdam's goat walks by and kicks Calinou
20:11	Jordach	!mlp Calinou
20:12	EvergreenTree	Wait, you mean you can use colored text?
20:12		werwerwer_ joined #minetest
20:12	Jordach	WHY YES EvergreenTree
20:13	Jordach	,01TROLOLOLOLOLOLOL
20:13	EvergreenTree	How? I was never aware of this feature
20:13	Jordach	enjoy that one :D
20:13	Jordach	+c got removed
20:13	* svuorela	goes looking for the stabbing-over-ip device
20:21	thexyz	svuorela: why?
20:24		arsdragonfly_ joined #minetest
20:25		general3214 joined #minetest
20:26	svuorela	thexyz: because colors
20:28		cisoun joined #minetest
20:28	OldCoder	Colors are OK. Anyway don't fight over them.
20:29	thexyz	some people indeed overuse them but I don't see the reason for hate here
20:29	OldCoder	We can find a common ground
20:29	thexyz	sfan5: you shoul add more colors to the bot, by the way, i.e. git
20:29	sfan5	colors..
20:29	thexyz	but that's okay, I'm used to people fighting over pointless things in this channel
20:29	OldCoder	Heh
20:30	sfan5	I've already added all possible irc colors
20:30		Miner_48er joined #minetest
20:30	thexyz	um?
20:31	thexyz	out of ink?
20:32	sfan5	there are only 15 colors
20:32	thexyz	eh eh
20:32	thexyz	you better go get some sleep
20:33	general3214	My Pokemon mod is now up for download: https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=7705
20:33	thexyz	do you want to use different colors or what?
20:33	general3214	Pokemon berries*
20:33	thexyz	because that makes no sense
20:34	Menche	why does hybrid dog use weird gimp filters on all his screenshots?!?!? https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=117799#p117799
20:34		AspireMint joined #minetest
20:35	Menche	see the portal screenshot in one of the spoilers there
20:35	general3214	Menche reminds me of mulch
20:36		Wuzzy2 joined #minetest
20:36	sfan5	thexyz: ?
20:38		werwerwer joined #minetest
20:41		NakedFury joined #minetest
20:48	kaeza	Menche, he also seems to randomly delete his own posts
20:48	kaeza	if you look at older topics, there are people talking with themselves all over the place ._.
20:49		dafull97 joined #minetest
20:49	thexyz	lol ubuntuone down
20:52	Calinou	you use it? :P
20:52		bas080 joined #minetest
20:54	Jordach	that's a first
20:54		arsdragonfly joined #minetest
20:54	PilzAdam	bye
21:02		Peacock joined #minetest
21:07	Peacock	should texture_alpha nodes be halving FPS or am i missing something in my node reg.?
21:17		paramat joined #minetest
21:18	paramat	Peacock, translucent nodes can sometimes hugely increase number of faces rendered, i found this with adding fog nodes to paragenv7
21:19	Peacock	hm, i made a sortof "dirty" glass node, and noticed the drop when we started using those for windows
21:19	paramat	i had to remove the fog nodes due to the FPS drop
21:20	Peacock	tried glasslike, backface[..], not many differences
21:20		theTroy joined #minetest
21:28	sfan5	ahahaha, this is just too silly
21:28	sfan5	...
21:28	Peacock	?
21:28	Peacock	musta missed something lol
21:33	sfan5	no you haven't
21:33	Sokomine	that strange glass? without shaders, it does look strange. especially in connection with clouds
21:34	Peacock	then sfan's humour escapes me lol
21:34	Peacock	i did notice less of a fps drop on the computer with shaders on
21:36	sfan5	Peacock: no, I am reading something different
21:36	Peacock	lol ok no wonder i dont get it
21:37	Peacock	speaking of humour: http://satwcomic.com/art/germany-on-vacation.jpg :P
21:37	sfan5	I don't get it
21:37	* sfan5	continues reading the silly thing
21:39	Peacock	according to the guy/gal that made the comic, apprently german tourists like to dig holes on beaches and steal moose signs lol don't know if it's true, id have to ask the dutch/danes/swedes/norwegians lol
21:39	sfan5	I haven't stolen a moose sign yet.. :P
21:40		anunakki joined #minetest
21:40	Peacock	we have a shitton of moose signs lol
21:40	Peacock	and deer
21:42	paramat	another way to do translucency is 'alpha = 127,' in definition, not sure it would help though :)
21:42	Peacock	ive tried the alpha trick, it didn't make the node transparent though
21:42	Peacock	i dont know in such a case if the texture must be opaque or have alpha/transparency
21:45		john_minetest joined #minetest
21:45	Peacock	oh jesus, they want to redesign formspecs? wish i knew that before starting my new game lol
21:46	kaeza	redesign formspecs? O.o
21:46	kaeza	hi john_minetest
21:47	kaeza	also hi Peacock :P
21:47	Peacock	howdy K
21:47	paramat	i use opaque texture with no alpha channel, drawtype glasslike, alpha = xxx, seems to work
21:48	Peacock	noted, its a good thing i save the dirty glass xcf
21:51	paramat	in GIMP 'flatten image' removes alpha channel (um i think)
21:52	Peacock	well i think you can remove the alpha channel from the layer menu too
21:52		AspireMint joined #minetest
21:53	kaeza	http://1389blog.com/pix/thats-a-feature-not-a-bug.jpg
21:53	Peacock	lol
21:54	Peacock	finally got my bloody craft guide working (inc. all crafts and stuff you can make with diff. machines) :D
21:55	kaeza	screens? :3
21:55	Peacock	though for every 'thing' i finish, 3 more get added to the list XD
21:55	Peacock	lemme start up
21:57	Peacock	http://s22.postimg.org/b5p163by9/Screenshot_111113_04_56_45_PM.png
21:57		SegFault22 joined #minetest
21:57	Peacock	sorry for titlebar, hard to take screens with open formspec
21:57	SegFault22	So why don't we add Tin, to be combined with copper, instead of steel - and create a blast furnace for making steel, from Iron ingots?
21:58	SegFault22	(Or the old crucible steel method)
21:59	Peacock	SF22: would be better for an industrial-craft type game, minetest_game should be pretty basic and easy for newbies to get
21:59	Peacock	(and easy to base new games off of)
22:00	SegFault22	Yeah, but that is no excuse for being incorrect... They should alteast name it Copper-Steel alloy or something, because Bronze is something else.
22:00	SegFault22	And we should not just make everything ultra-simple-mode just to cater to the newbies who should go read the Wiki
22:01	kaeza	Peacock, that looks sexy :3
22:01	Peacock	well when you consider the dwindling userbase/modding community, newb-friendliness is kinda important yeah :P
22:01	NakedFury	well when I go play a new game I do not want to read a wiki at first
22:01	Peacock	sexy? lol
22:02	SegFault22	It's not even friendly to noobs. It is relatively Easy for someone to find out about Bronze on the wiki
22:02	SegFault22	There could even be made a tutorial for "getting started"
22:03	Peacock	i was aiming for simplicity but sexy works i guess lol
22:03	Peacock	SF22 i agree mtgame has gotten more complicated in the last year :P
22:04	Peacock	though i dont get why anyone would want mtgame to be a complete experience of it's own, it doesn't encourage mod development
22:05	Peacock	formspec labels are a pain the ass when placed near buttons
22:05	Peacock	eventhough the text is short and doesn't overlap, makes some buttons unclickable :/
22:06	SegFault22	But they already made the mistake of adding bronze, so now it either has to be removed or made correct.
22:06	SegFault22	It's not like the inclusion of a whole new Metallurgy tech tree or something
22:06	Peacock	good luck with that :P changes to mtgame seem to solicit more powerful debates than changes to the engine itself lol
22:07	SegFault22	Why did they even make Bronze a combination of Copper and Steel then?
22:07	SegFault22	Why did they even add coper without bronze to compliment it? Can they, like, not use Google or something?
22:07	Peacock	can't say, didn't dev mtgame and haven't played it in years
22:07	SegFault22	tin*
22:08	Peacock	my space game uses paramat's asteroid mod as a base rather than default
22:09	SegFault22	How is it so that the underdeveloped changes always get added to stuff with relative ease, but whenever someone wants to fix it, everyone has to say "durp too difficult"
22:09	Peacock	coming up with a new resources/tech tree is more fun than coming up with ever more complicated things to complement an already complicated base lol
22:09	SegFault22	Or some other Lame excuse
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22:09	Peacock	i can't say :P i gave up trying to understand development a long time ago :P
22:11	SegFault22	The question is, "why didn't they do it right in the FIRST place?!?", and my goal is to get it fixed or removed. It will just make the game be laughed at by the internet if it continues without any change made to bronze creation.
22:11	Peacock	well i think that's the motivation behind c55's idea to rewrite MT
22:12	SegFault22	Rewrite?
22:12	SegFault22	Tell me more.
22:12	Peacock	so i gather
22:12	Peacock	i can't really, read the dev logs :P
22:13	SegFault22	You can't, or don't want to?
22:13	Peacock	i can only say what i read :P
22:13	SegFault22	I*
22:13	Peacock	he threw the idea out there, and people starting debating the kinda of features that made the current branch a jenga-tower lol
22:14	Peacock	so i cant tell you where, if anywhere, it will lead :P
22:14	SegFault22	I do not understand. Which idea did he throw out there, bronze or a total rewrite?
22:14	SegFault22	And where are these fabled dev logs?
22:14	Peacock	total rewrite, i doubt he's that concerned with mtgame specifically
22:14	Peacock	see topic
22:15	SegFault22	I have seen many topics. Even made a few.
22:15	Peacock	i mean channel topic, should be a link to logs
22:15	SegFault22	Where are the dev logs?
22:15	SegFault22	Oh
22:15	SegFault22	Nope
22:15	Peacock	http://irc.minetest.ru/minetest-dev
22:16	SegFault22	Those are IRC logs, not dev logs
22:16	kaeza	:I
22:16	kaeza	http://irc.minetest.ru/minetest-dev/2013-11-11#i_3430607
22:16	Peacock	i like to keep abreast (or two) of dev, saves me quite a bit of trouble with coding knowing what's in and what's out lol
22:20	Peacock	though it would be cool if say, minetest 1.x and minetest 2.x were developed concurrently (if the resources are there)
22:20	SegFault22	Concurrently?
22:20	SegFault22	Concurrently...
22:21	Peacock	!g concurrently
22:21	MinetestBot	Peacock: http://www.thefreedictionary.com/concurrently
22:23	Peacock	irony ËˆÊŒÉªrÉ™ni/noun 1. A french canadian teaching an anglo english :P
22:24	SegFault22	I see.
22:24	Peacock	unless you're not a native anglo, in which case i retract :P
22:25	MinetestBot	GIT: Sapier at GMX dot net commited to minetest/minetest: Fix invalid usage of temporary object in mainmenu json conversion a935d81053 2013-11-11T14:23:58-08:00 http://git.io/8F0Nlg
22:26	SegFault22	anglo?
22:27	Peacock	MPAA Backs Anti-Piracy Curriculum For Elementary School Students - in other news, a school around here though a trip to the apple store might be educational
22:28	Peacock	education being a joke nowadays lol
22:29	SegFault22	Okay I just got an idea - chunk backups, for when something really bad happens, and rollback is not available, work done by others during the incident won't be rolled back.
22:29	kaeza	it's sad how kids know what Facebook is, how to internet, etc, but can't count to three ;(
22:30	SegFault22	Like, if a chunk gets corrupted and the world has to revert to a backup, it would be better to only set back certain chunks, keeping the rest intact.
22:30	Peacock	and old timers think talking about money is bad form so they don't know how to budget, save or do their taxes either
22:30	SegFault22	Money is a negative influence on society, by the way
22:31	kaeza	{{cn}}
22:31	Peacock	money is a simple exchange medium and a store of value
22:34	SegFault22	1.) When a company makes money, the population as a whole becomes slightly poorer to account for that. 2.) People spend their time making money at the expense of someone else, fighting for jobs and money. 3.) corruption, where people do illegal activities to get even more money. 4.) Hordes of people working in factories/etc., instead of contributing to society, are simply filling the pocketbook of a fat CEO and/or buying their yacht f
22:34	SegFault22	leets. 5.) Without money, there wouldn't be any class division, and people would not, say, starve to death - there would be required, however, an automation system to do the boring work like factories/farms, but people would naturally have incentive to contribute to society through the arts, science, etc.
22:36	Peacock	well that's a nice fantasy SF22 lol
22:36	SegFault22	Explain how starving kids in Africa is positive for society.
22:37	SegFault22	Explain a different way to stop corruption, greed, and make people want to be better people rather than make money
22:37	Peacock	which reminds me of an old communist joke, "So long as the bosses pretend to pay us, we will pretend to work."
22:38	SegFault22	I'm not saying communism, I'm saying StarTrek (they have automationsystems for foodstuffs, are generally better people, have no class division or currency, etc.)
22:38	Peacock	money doesn't cause Africa's problems, Africa is actually very resource-rich, crooked governments and high birth rates are the problem in Africa
22:39	Peacock	*problems
22:39	Peacock	and
22:39	Peacock	automation != infinite resources
22:39	SegFault22	Peacock: Exactly, Corruption, which is caused by a greed for money
22:39	SegFault22	(there would be limits on stuff though, to prevent problems)
22:40	Peacock	so, not paying people, and allocating resources, sounds like communism to me lol
22:40	Peacock	the star trek economy works because they can convert energy to resources, and energy is cheap
22:40	SegFault22	Well, people won't be forced to work, they would be priviledged to get to contribute to society through arts/science/etc
22:41	SegFault22	But when you get rich, it makes the rest of the people poorer
22:41	SegFault22	And that is bad
22:42	SegFault22	Wrong. The 100% would contribute to society while the robots do the dirty work.
22:42	SegFault22	Repetitive, constant, difficult work like farming
22:43	SegFault22	or factorization
22:43	Peacock	i would actually prefer to be a farmer than work in customer service
22:43	SegFault22	Contributing to society is not customer service -.-
22:43	Peacock	in fact service will probably one of the first jobs to be robotized
22:44	SegFault22	Customer Service exists because companies don't make instructions good enough, due to making them cheap so that they can be efficient and pocket more... MONEY!@
22:44	SegFault22	Without money, there could be Forums and Wikis accessible through widely-available computers
22:45	SegFault22	Where people would documment stuff for others
22:45	Peacock	so what do you do with people who don't want to idle? who want more and are willing to work for it, do you tell them to make clay seagulls? lol
22:45	SegFault22	The thing is, there would be no restrictions on what people can contribute to.
22:46	SegFault22	Robots don't do all of the work, they do the work that can be automated
22:46	Peacock	yeah if anything you'll see a rise in crime, drug and alcohol abuse
22:46	SegFault22	That's only in our dying society, dude
22:47	SegFault22	Contribution to Arts, Media, Science, and the furthering of the human knowledge
22:47	Peacock	any society, look at all the places with high unemployment, the devil finds work for idle hands
22:48	SegFault22	The only reason there would be violence, drugs, etc. is because people currently are mostly stupid.
22:48	Peacock	for an AI to do a psychologists' job you'd need a really good random() function
22:48	Peacock	and if they didn't have to work they'd be even dumber
22:49	Peacock	i mean, why get an education otherwise?
22:49	SegFault22	The only solution I see is to either "reprogram" everyone in camps (BAD hitler-ism) or take smart people to mars and ait for Society here to kill itself (BAD too for some lame moral reason blah blah blah)
22:49	Peacock	and you say you're not a communist lol
22:49	SegFault22	Because only intelligent people can handle such a society
22:49	Peacock	camps or gulags?
22:49	SegFault22	The communists were idiots. And they profited from the people's forced work, which was bad.
22:50	SegFault22	The idea is to get people, to raise their kids to want to contribute to arts/media/science/etc., and to raise them to be good people
22:50	Peacock	yeah, because in any system (even your little utopia) there will always be smarter people willing to take advantage of it and others less fortunate
22:50	SegFault22	Instead of the slum of sh*t we call our society now.
22:51	Peacock	so i should take that to mean you volunteer at local charities and soup kitchens?
22:51	Peacock	or are you just an idea man :P
22:51	SegFault22	Ah, not in this utopian system, as there would be no way for someone to profit, except for being a good person to the others and (slow down, I can;t reply to all of this spam)
22:53	SegFault22	We wouldn't need to volunteer because everyone would be the same class. Everyone, including the government, which would be overseen by the people.
22:53	Peacock	without money you have barter, so unless you ban the owning of things, there will always be a way to profit, and take advantage of people
22:53	SegFault22	You don't understand. Let me explain.
22:53	Peacock	re: volunteering, what i mean is if you think the present society is shit, what do you do to help?
22:54	SegFault22	The problem is, society is too broken to survive, so why even try to help it? Why don't we just rebuild eslewhere?
22:54	Peacock	well if you dont even try, why bother thinking about it either?
22:55	SegFault22	Because this isn't helping THIS society, it is helping the existence of the human race as intelligent life-forms!
22:55	SegFault22	-.-
22:55	Peacock	thats what i like about liberals (sarcasm), they have all these great policies, the dirty-work of which they never do, and the confines of which they don't live in lol
22:56	SegFault22	I am not a Liberal dude...
22:56	SegFault22	I just want what's best for the Human Race
22:56	SegFault22	Because robots aren't people, they don't have feelings and couldn't care less if they spend their lifetime doing nothing but factory work 24/7
22:56	SegFault22	it's what they are programmed to do
22:57	Peacock	well i still think if you really cared about the human race you'd give your time or money to some charity
22:57	Peacock	if you won't lift a finger to help your fellow man, why should everyone labour to conform to your ideas..
22:58	SegFault22	To some charity, that does what? Gives it for free to a few people. That's not a big enough difference, unless you funnel ALL of the money into said charities
22:58	Peacock	emphasis being on the funnelling of everyone else's money
22:58	SegFault22	And I didn't say that I won't/am not helping...
22:58	Peacock	what have YOU done to help people?
22:59	SegFault22	I have created the theoretical basis of a society where nobody will have to worry about being able to put a meal on their table...
22:59	SegFault22	That has been looked at from several dozen angles, and so far, no serious issues have been found
23:00	NakedFury	so your society has Star TRek Replicators?
23:00	SegFault22	This will inspire change, on such a large scale, that it is helpful
23:00	SegFault22	We don't currently have repplicators... but we DO have Factories and 3D printers!
23:00	SegFault22	We don't need ANY new technology to pull this off, just the application of our current technology
23:01	Peacock	contributing fantasies while not putting in an ounce of energy or money to make the world better isn't really contributing
23:01	SegFault22	I didn't say that I won't try to help such change, did I
23:02	Peacock	though if you really wanna help, you might want to raise funds for the Philippines, they could use the relief
23:02	SegFault22	Till when? The next typhoon?
23:02	Peacock	interesting way of thinking
23:03	SegFault22	It would be much more efficient over time to fix the enviromnent, make it less hostile, and build better, safer structures that can survive said typhoons for AGES
23:03	Peacock	so why give a shit about Africa like you did early, after all, the next warlord/epidemic is right around the corner
23:03	SegFault22	Not if we CHANGE the WORLD! >:D
23:03	Peacock	you should get a job as a shrink, they get paid good money for their BS lol
23:04	SegFault22	-.-
23:05	SegFault22	I must be going elsewhere. For several reasons: 1. My fingers hurt from this speed-typing, 2. you all seem to not be on a high enough level to understand these ideas and contribute, and 3. I am tired.
23:05	SegFault22	Bye
23:05		SegFault22 left #minetest
23:13	kaeza	lol
23:14	AspireMint	Hello, can i use transparent textures in MT (for mobs) ?
23:15	kaeza	try! :)
23:16	AspireMint	x) okay
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23:19		AspireMint left #minetest
23:19	Peacock	bach
23:19	Menche	beethoven
23:20	Peacock	jesus, i sneezed more in the shower than i did since waking up lol
23:20	kaeza	mozart
23:21		AspireMint joined #minetest
23:22	Peacock	Venezuelan army occupies chain of electronics stores accused of overcharging customers by 1,200% - jesus did they really need the army for that?
23:23	* Menche	wonders if the 1,200% or the army occupation is more overkill
23:23	Peacock	i cant picture heavily armed clerks fighting back lol
23:24	kaeza	they were selling forkbombs
23:24	kaeza	</badpun>
23:25		Mallot1 joined #minetest
23:25	Peacock	reading more into the article, seems the economy's in the gutters thre
23:25	Peacock	*there
23:26	Mallot1	hey, they took the version of minetest out of the description
23:26	Mallot1	:(
23:27	kaeza	?
23:27	Mallot1	the descriptiion used to say the minetest version kaeza
23:27	Mallot1	but now its gone oh well
23:28	kaeza	Â¿?
23:28	khonkhortisan	My compose key does not do inverted interrobang.
23:28	kaeza	what description?
23:29	khonkhortisan	?Â¿!Â¡â€½
23:29	Mallot1	oh, i meant the chat topic
23:29	kaeza	ah :P
23:29	Mallot1	you know, /topic
23:29	Mallot1	:D
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23:34	Peacock	helluva riot in Poland
23:40	Peacock	"Scientist Seeks Investment For "Alcohol Substitute"" ... http://youtu.be/WWaLxFIVX1s
23:46		zat1 joined #minetest
23:55	VanessaE	Synthahol soon? :)
23:55	Peacock	lol the article even referred to synthahol lol
23:56	Peacock	though theyre looking to create an ingredient that has all the effects of alcohol, minus the hangover
23:56	Peacock	so if anything, i think people would go more nuts
23:58	VanessaE	that ingredient is hydrogen hydroxide
23:58	Peacock	hh2?
23:58	VanessaE	also known as dihydrogen monoxide, DHMO, H2O, or WATER.
23:59	VanessaE	you wanna prevent a hangover when you're drinking? include water in your menu.

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