IRC log for #minetest, 2012-08-26

Time	Nick	Message
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00:30	khonkhortisan	Combining worldedit with mesecons with a third mod could create a 3d printer fax machine
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00:54	khonkhortisan	worldedit will soon be microcontroller-friendly (except for saving, transpose, and rotate)
01:45	vicscandl	mepe;
01:45	vicscandl	wow, fingers
01:45	vicscandl	meep
01:47	leo_rockway	bas080: that looks good. It would be better to visualize it with a different texture. Also, like they said, vines.
01:48	bas080	I did make a vines mod. You could use those... i could also add vines to the trees. Maybe climbing plants on the tree stem.
01:49	bas080	would avoid dependency
01:50	bas080	leo_rockway, are you on the forums?
01:50	NekoGloop	Yes he is
01:51	leo_rockway	bas080: I am. I do have the vines mod installed too.
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02:00	khonkhortisan	Crisco: you should update your host address to centurylink, it still shows qwest
02:03	* khonkhortisan	just found a file called ""
02:03	_2cool_	O.O
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02:23	khonkhortisan	I'm making a tictactoe game. There are nine input buttons and eighteen output wires. Somehow I have to make the button turn the square to the correct symbol based on whose turn it is, and change whose turn it is without going back in a loop and changing the symbol.
02:23	_2cool_	interesting
02:25	khonkhortisan	ah. I need a T-flop.
02:32	khonkhortisan	haha. new node idea: lightwire! It gives off light and loses power over distance! (feel free to shoot this idea down)
02:33	_2cool_	I have destroyed all the redstone in this minecraft map
02:33	khonkhortisan	why?
02:33	_2cool_	I WILL DESTROY YOU KHONK FOR SAYING THAT
02:33	_2cool_	anyway, Water got on the water
02:33	khonkhortisan	I have a house on gameboom
02:33	_2cool_	water got on the redstone
02:33	khonkhortisan	mesecons don't short out yet
02:33	_2cool_	I don't have privs in gameboom
02:34	khonkhortisan	I have a health room filled with apples and strawberries and a pie and doorways made of moreores blocks
02:34	khonkhortisan	and a papyrus curtain
02:34	_2cool_	not bad
02:34	khonkhortisan	I'm set up for a greifing
02:34	_2cool_	put lava under your house
02:34	_2cool_	evilface
02:35	khonkhortisan	why? for a moat or to burn the house?
02:35	_2cool_	make it and make it look like a mineshaft
02:35	NekoGloop	No for the griefers
02:36	khonkhortisan	I like trapgrass
02:36	_2cool_	removestone evilfaceagain
02:36	khonkhortisan	haha trapgrass+teleporters = whack-a-mole!
02:36	_2cool_	beautiful idea
02:36	khonkhortisan	there could be a removestone house with a pressure plate inside to frame someone as a greifer because they'll be standing there when the house disappears
02:37	_2cool_	I would lol
02:37	_2cool_	even if it was me
02:37	Crisco	khonkhortisan: what?
02:37	Crisco	I can't control that
02:37	Crisco	plus I liked quest better :P
02:38	khonkhortisan	I just know from the commercials they changed the name
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03:00	_2cool_	The spice must flow!
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03:18	cornernote	i finally made my 4-bit decoder
03:18	cornernote	now all i have to do is hook it to my 7 segment display
03:18	cornernote	and i have a 1 digit number! =)
03:18	khonkhortisan	working on mesecons http://www.flickr.com/photos/79516830@N05/7861326182/in/photostream/lightbox/ reminds me of xkcd http://xkcd.com/505/ I feel like I'm going to end up in a desert of infinite rows of insulated mesecons - like the the bottom left picture
03:19	khonkhortisan	you could have seven digits if you use binary
03:19	cornernote	wow, thats more impressive than mine
03:19	khonkhortisan	almost done with it
03:19	cornernote	what is it ?
03:19	cornernote	and, does it work ?
03:20	khonkhortisan	it's the display and the rules that makes it so big. Tic-tac-toe
03:20	khonkhortisan	I haven't fired it up yet, I have a little bit more to connect
03:20	cornernote	the display has too many pixels for tic-tac-toe ?
03:20	khonkhortisan	most likely I'll have a giant bughunt
03:20	cornernote	oh i see
03:20	cornernote	3x3 = 1
03:20	khonkhortisan	I need to display X or O or blank so it has to be that big
03:20	khonkhortisan	can't do it in single pixels
03:21	cornernote	yea, gotchya
03:21	khonkhortisan	trinary gameboard
03:21	cornernote	walk me through how the game works...
03:21	cornernote	eg..
03:21	cornernote	player 1 presses a button
03:22	cornernote	it knows player 1 is X because player1 is always X
03:22	cornernote	then player 2 pushes... it knows its O's turn ?
03:22	khonkhortisan	you have to decide who's X and who's O - I still have to make the loser go first
03:22	cornernote	can it detect a winner ?
03:22	khonkhortisan	it can detect a win, all 16 ways to win. - aah! I didn't detect a tie!
03:23	cornernote	if we hook up my machine to your machine, it can have a scoreboard
03:23	khonkhortisan	yeah
03:23	cornernote	but yours is way more impressive
03:23	khonkhortisan	my reset button will be hidden if the people tie
03:24	cornernote	over the back...
03:24	cornernote	is that a bank of like 10x10x2 ucs ?
03:24	khonkhortisan	it blinks the three squares that caused a win, that's what the second slice is for
03:24	khonkhortisan	18x2x16 I think
03:25	cornernote	lmao
03:25	cornernote	all the same program on them ?
03:25	cornernote	imagine this in redstone
03:25	NekoGloop	I dont want to
03:25	khonkhortisan	no most of them pass A to C and B to D, there's other programming sprinkled in
03:25	khonkhortisan	does redstone have microcontrollers?
03:26	cornernote	i learned how to make a decoder from wating 10 year olds on minecraft
03:26	khonkhortisan	I guess you'll just have to press the reset button if you get a tie
03:26	cornernote	i wasnt sure how it worked, but after watching that, and looking at some wireing diagrams it all started to come together
03:26	khonkhortisan	there's some way to compress multiple signals on redstone.
03:27	cornernote	ahh, so kindof a uc
03:27	cornernote	and they seem to not connect/interact as much as mesecons do
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03:38	cornernote	sometimes my gates dont switch off when i switch them off
03:38	khonkhortisan	?
03:38	cornernote	i dont have even 1/10 of the amount you have
03:38	cornernote	do all yours work properly ?
03:39	khonkhortisan	if they're too far away from you they won't function
03:39	cornernote	mine are closer than yours
03:39	khonkhortisan	it all works properly, as long as I have it programmed right, which I don't
03:39	cornernote	i'll ss so you can see
03:41	cornernote	http://i49.tinypic.com/2ujjmts.png
03:42	cornernote	its a 4-bit input, and depending on the input, it lights up 1 of the 16 lights
03:42	cornernote	red lights
03:42	cornernote	the blue lights are the indicators for the 2 half-adders
03:43	cornernote	see both blue 0 are on, that means red 0 should be on
03:43	cornernote	but red-3 stayed on
03:43	khonkhortisan	the stuff at the top is what I compressed into my Âµc grid
03:43	khonkhortisan	I could've made it look like that
03:43	cornernote	if i punch the buttons again it will go off
03:44	cornernote	the decoder ?
03:44	cornernote	you mean the wires running to the red lights ?
03:44	khonkhortisan	yes where they connect with the blue wires
03:44	cornernote	so i can make it smaller ?
03:45	khonkhortisan	yes.
03:45	cornernote	using the extra bits in the uc ?
03:45	khonkhortisan	nope just using the ports
03:45	cornernote	there are only 4 ports tho
03:45	cornernote	i need to count to 16 (or at least to 10)
03:45	khonkhortisan	what port is the red on?
03:46	cornernote	A
03:46	cornernote	us is like this.. sbi(A,B&D)
03:47	cornernote	sec, i'll get the diagram
03:47	cornernote	http://www.matthewlynch.net/multittl/images/4-bit-instruction-decoder.png
03:48	cornernote	the buttons are backwards tho, so im going to start it again i think
03:48	khonkhortisan	okay that'll work. flood fill the blue with sbi(C,B)sbi(A,D) then where the yellow wires should connect with the blue wires you put sbi(C,B)sbi(A,D&B) then put an on wire along the opposite side of the red. That way you can have all the reds next to each other.
03:49	khonkhortisan	sbi(C,B)sbi(A,D) is the part in the diagram where the wire hops over itself.
03:49	khonkhortisan	sbi(C,B)sbi(A,D&B) is the and
03:50	khonkhortisan	I might need to build it myself to really show you what I mean.
03:50	cornernote	yeah, i dont really understand what you mean
03:50	khonkhortisan	How many switches should I have in my example?
03:51	cornernote	4
03:51	cornernote	4x 1-bit inputs, 16 outputs (always only one active at any time)
03:51	khonkhortisan	I'll just follow the diagram
03:52	cornernote	but... i think instead of the 16 outputs, i can have a clever chip
03:52	cornernote	using 16 ports EFGHIJKLMNOPQRST
03:53	cornernote	UC has more than 4 bits, it has 255 or 256 i think
03:53	cornernote	right ?
03:53	khonkhortisan	something like that
03:53	cornernote	then the display can read from that chip
03:53	khonkhortisan	if you dump the metadata you get lots of zeros
03:53	khonkhortisan	what would you make the display out of?
03:54	cornernote	pistons or glowstone
03:54	cornernote	i'll do it long 1st, then i'll try to make it into a smarter chip
03:54	khonkhortisan	if you store it in one chip how will you get the data out with only four ports?
03:55	cornernote	lol
03:55	cornernote	ok, good point
03:55	cornernote	chips cant talk to each other
03:55	khonkhortisan	they can, but the ports are one-way communication.
03:56	khonkhortisan	I tried two-way, it doesn't work without some sort of timer.
03:56	cornernote	yeah, chip 2 cant ask chip1 the state of port M
03:56	khonkhortisan	but chip 1 can tell chip 2 the state of port A by using port B
03:56	cornernote	yep
03:57	cornernote	my switches are backwards, so im gunna restart
04:00	khonkhortisan	I really want a Âµc to have a display so it can have a representation of the programming so you can tell where the different ones are in a grid
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04:05	NekoGloop	Crafting: microcontroller + lightstone = that color of a display-microcontroller?
04:09	khonkhortisan	no, a display just like a delayer where the modulus binary representation of the programming string is displayed
04:10	khonkhortisan	with maybe a 3x3 display, automatic registration and deregistration of nodes, and creation and deletion of the display image
04:10	khonkhortisan	this adder is confusing
04:17	cornernote	the one in the diagram ?
04:17	khonkhortisan	I don't like it
04:17	cornernote	yeah, its cos its part of the decoder
04:17	cornernote	u got a better one ?
04:18	khonkhortisan	no, I'm trying to put the switches together but that makes part of the diagram be upside-down
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04:28	cornernote	INS4 = bit1 i think
04:28	cornernote	the way he labled it is strange
04:29	khonkhortisan	I'm going to copy it exactly, no rotates or flips.
04:29	cornernote	i did that
04:29	cornernote	maybe i didnt
04:30	cornernote	i made ins0 on the right, and ins4 on the left
04:30	cornernote	and it turned out ins4 was bit1, and should be on the right
04:30	cornernote	so copy his diagram and it will be right
04:30	cornernote	just his labels are odd
04:34	khonkhortisan	my circuits would be easier to read if I had a passthrough wire like this http://www.flickr.com/photos/79516830@N05/7861675528/in/photostream/lightbox/
04:34	khonkhortisan	where the two wires are insulated from each other
04:43	* khonkhortisan	is so glad he made worldedit capable of copying programmed microcontrollers
04:53	khonkhortisan	I'm done, but I can't make sense of the output.
04:53	khonkhortisan	Maybe I did the nor wrong
04:57	khonkhortisan	yep, I did it wrong !A\|!B
04:57	khonkhortisan	cornernote: how did you make a nor?
04:58	khonkhortisan	oh I know, an and.
04:59	khonkhortisan	huh. It has a zero light. I'm done!
05:01	khonkhortisan	cornernote: http://temp-share.com/show/dPf3mq4pW
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05:23	khonkhortisan	you must've made a cornernote cloner out of mesecons and must be chasing them down right now
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05:33	bas080	http://dl.dropbox.com/u/419967/Screenshot%20-%2008262012%20-%2007%3A25%3A52%20AM.png
05:34	bas080	Jungletrees are as good as done. What do you think?
05:55	cornernote	nor is like
05:56	cornernote	sbi(A,!B&!C)
05:56	khonkhortisan	I fixed it, there's my world
05:57	khonkhortisan	really looks like a forest
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06:21	leo_rockway	is there a noteblock mod?
06:42	VanessaE	leo_rockway: in mesecons, yes.
06:42	VanessaE	also good morning all.
06:42	leo_rockway	VanessaE: neat =]
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08:01	VanessaE	zzz
08:01	jin_xi	sup
08:02	VanessaE	not much. kinda bored :-)
08:02	jin_xi	well. learn c++!
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08:09	rubenwardy	hi guys
08:10	rubenwardy	Good Morning (well, for me anyway)
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08:21	jin_xi	VanessaE: main.cpp, #1296: set mipmaps to true... looks way better here
08:23	VanessaE	oh?
08:23	* VanessaE	tries
08:24	VanessaE	need AF in the other file also?
08:25	jin_xi	i still have trilin and af in
08:25	* jin_xi	checks
08:26	* VanessaE	tries with AF and mipmap turned on
08:26	leo_rockway	where's AF?
08:26	VanessaE	over there ------>
08:26	leo_rockway	>.>
08:26	leo_rockway	I don't see it
08:27	VanessaE	WOW!
08:27	jin_xi	no more moiree
08:27	VanessaE	jin_xi: NOW THAT'S WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT!!!
08:27	VanessaE	and zero effect on the rendering speed
08:27	VanessaE	(actually it seems faster?)
08:27	VanessaE	why isn't this the default?
08:28	leo_rockway	hey, don't spoil! >.<
08:28	leo_rockway	I'm building with mipmaps now
08:29	VanessaE	leo_rockway: at line 469 of src/clientmap.cpp, add this right between the scene:: and const video:: lines: buf->getMaterial().setFlag(video::EMF_ANISOTROPIC_FILTER, true);
08:29	rubenwardy	hi
08:29	VanessaE	and do the mipmap thing jin_xi just posted
08:29	VanessaE	the result is beautiful!
08:29	VanessaE	and 16px textures still look sharp\
08:29	VanessaE	THIS is how it should be!!!
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08:30	leo_rockway	oh, I just finished building with mipmap and no real change. I'll add the AF
08:31	VanessaE	you need both and your card needs to support those features
08:31	VanessaE	(I assume without such support, they do nothing?)
08:32	leo_rockway	I don't even know what mipmaps are
08:33	VanessaE	made a very clear and absolute recommendation to celeron55 and showed him exactly what to change.
08:33	VanessaE	leo_rockway: mipmaps is when the video card or driver or rendering software makes multiple copies of your texture files, scaled to different sizes and aspect ratios, and uses the scaled copies for stuff drawn in the distance
08:33	leo_rockway	oh, that makes a lot of sense, actually
08:34	VanessaE	by doing the scaling before being sent to the rendering pipeline (instead of in realtime), they can be scaled with much nicer algorithms
08:34	leo_rockway	mhm
08:34	VanessaE	e.g. Lanczos or even simple bilinear
08:34	jin_xi	well, theres that comment, we should ask what looked ugly really
08:34	leo_rockway	somewhat relevant: http://kdepepo.wordpress.com/2012/08/15/reverse-antialiasing-for-image-scaling/
08:35	jin_xi	fuck communication D:
08:35	leo_rockway	I'm building irrlicht, I'll build with AF in a moment.
08:36	VanessaE	"what looked ugly"?
08:36	VanessaE	you mean just before this change?
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08:36	leo_rockway	something looked ugly to him
08:36	VanessaE	horrible glittering and moire patterns in anything more than 5 or so blocks away when you walk around or just pan the camera.
08:36	leo_rockway	so I think he means ask him what looked ugly on his end...
08:37	leo_rockway	(when enabling mipmaps)
08:37	leo_rockway	VanessaE: did you see the comment right before that line of code to disable mipmaps?
08:37	jin_xi	yup, that
08:37	VanessaE	OH
08:37	VanessaE	that comment
08:37	VanessaE	yeah I saw that
08:37	VanessaE	damned if I know what he meant
08:38	VanessaE	but I'll bet that's no longer the case.
08:38	leo_rockway	maybe on certain cards / drivers mipmaps makes things worse
08:40	VanessaE	perhaps
08:40	leo_rockway	the default grass texture looks terrible with AF
08:40	VanessaE	which is why I just told celeron55 that it should be a checkbox.
08:41	leo_rockway	because you can see the squares of the texture instead of an uninterrupted pattern
08:41	leo_rockway	things far away look great
08:41	VanessaE	ah
08:41	leo_rockway	things up close look like a bad case of gaussian blur
08:41	VanessaE	well AF is supposed to do that
08:42	leo_rockway	mhm
08:42	VanessaE	before, the texture would just turn to garbage far away
08:42	VanessaE	wait
08:42	leo_rockway	but I stopped using your texture because of this problem
08:42	VanessaE	no AF is not supposed to blur up close
08:42	VanessaE	that's bilinear filtering that does that
08:42	leo_rockway	VanessaE: well... it's doing that in my case.
08:43	VanessaE	hence why I say it needs a checkbox :-)
08:43	leo_rockway	I'll try your texture
08:43	VanessaE	I just checked by placing a few blocks that still have 16px textures, into my world among the 512px textures. the 16px objects looked normal.
08:44	rubenwardy	you are adding AF?
08:44	Calinou	http://minetest.net/forum/viewtopic.php?pid=39645#p39645
08:44	Calinou	WTF
08:44	Calinou	some new guy revives 14 month old topic and does something
08:44	Calinou	first time this happens on the MT forum (the "does something" part) :P
08:45	VanessaE	rubenwardy: jin_xi found a setting that turns it on - it's already part of irrlicht
08:45	VanessaE	there's nothing to add, just change two settings in the code.
08:45	rubenwardy	i know, i know irrlicht, is it device ok?
08:45	rubenwardy	as in could it be added to the game?
08:46	leo_rockway	Calinou: yes. I tested it and it works great for me, so i had to post a reply for him right away.
08:46	* VanessaE	cranks her video driver up to 16x AF
08:46	VanessaE	let's see if this has any effect.
08:47	Calinou	should be added to official game IMO, true
08:47	leo_rockway	I haven't checked the code of the python one, but it seems to me that if the C++ one is that fast maybe the Python one could've been optimized too.
08:47	Calinou	I bet it would make windows support easier too
08:47	rubenwardy	here comes the /generatemap server command...
08:47	leo_rockway	there's a map mod
08:47	leo_rockway	I already commented there about this
08:48	leo_rockway	although it would be great if the map were more like MC o.o
08:48	leo_rockway	the mod, I mean...
08:51	VanessaE	hm, video card driver settings don't seem to affect the AF/MM feature. But it still looks just orders of magnitude better than without it.
08:51	* rubenwardy	gets the shivers at the thought
08:52	leo_rockway	VanessaE: request for your texture pack to support the snow mod, please o.o
08:52	VanessaE	sure, I'll look into it. remind me later also, ok?
08:52	rubenwardy	the snow mod is good :)
08:52	leo_rockway	okay, will do. Thank you =]
08:53	rubenwardy	does anyone know why celeron55 unsupported jungles?
08:53	leo_rockway	no idea. I liked them.
08:54	VanessaE	now, next is antialiasing.
08:54	VanessaE	rubenwardy: they were "boring"
08:54	VanessaE	:(
08:55	rubenwardy	they are still an enviroment, and they made a difference to the just normal trees...
08:55	rubenwardy	we need loads of different biomes
08:55	leo_rockway	snow works great
08:55	rubenwardy	i know :)
08:56	jin_xi	can't try AA here on crappy 09 intel integrated it seems
08:57	rubenwardy	VanessaE: are you going to release your graphics code modifications as a "super minetest version" or as part of the main game
08:58	VanessaE	there. the AF+MM build is not the default on my machine.
08:58	VanessaE	rubenwardy: jin_xi already said how above :-)
08:59	VanessaE	leo_rockway: how fast is the snow biome?
08:59	VanessaE	(I'm not a big fan of arctic-type biomes, but I'm willing to give it a try)
08:59	VanessaE	there. the AF+MM build is NOW the default on my machine.
08:59	leo_rockway	VanessaE: works just fine for me.
08:59	VanessaE	stupid fingers.
09:00	leo_rockway	you can pick up snow, throw snowballs...
09:00	leo_rockway	fire melts the snow
09:00	leo_rockway	there are snow blocks
09:00	leo_rockway	if you place a snow block in water, the water starts to freeze
09:00	VanessaE	stand by.
09:01	leo_rockway	VanessaE: when I remind you about the snow mod I'll ask for farming mod too, yes? =]
09:01	VanessaE	uploading an ubuntu 12.04, AMD64 build with the tweaks enabled
09:01	VanessaE	leo_rockway: er...no. maybe later on the farming mod :-)
09:01	leo_rockway	okay
09:02	VanessaE	http://digitalaudioconcepts.com/vanessa/hobbies/minetest/minetestc55_0.4.2-0b1ab41-1_amd64.deb
09:02	VanessaE	there.
09:02	VanessaE	standard minetest dependencies.
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09:03	rubenwardy	I really need to get Ubuntu...
09:04	VanessaE	that build will probably work on debian, maybe also others by way of alien
09:04	rubenwardy	Can you build it for windows or give me the code so i can?
09:04	rubenwardy	Thank you
09:05	VanessaE	No I can't, but see above for jin_xi's changes.
09:05	VanessaE	they're simple to apply.
09:05	VanessaE	[08-26 04:30] <VanessaE> at line 469 of src/clientmap.cpp, add this right between the scene:: and const video:: lines: buf->getMaterial().setFlag(video::EMF_ANISOTROPIC_FILTER, true);
09:05	VanessaE	[08-26 04:30] <VanessaE> and in src/main.cpp line 1296: set mipmaps to true
09:05	VanessaE	(as repeated in -dev, but without celeron55's nick prepended)
09:06	VanessaE	it should be incredibly trivial to attach those changes to a checkbox in the GUI.
09:07	rubenwardy	thankds
09:07	rubenwardy	damn
09:10	Calinou	jin_xi, my netbook supports AA yet it has an intel gpu :p
09:10	Calinou	up to 8x iirc
09:10	Calinou	VanessaE, mipmaps are often faster because they might use less video memory
09:10	VanessaE	exactly
09:11	Calinou	rubenwardy, ubuntu sucks.
09:11	jin_xi	hm idk
09:11	VanessaE	and they requrie less data to be rednered to the screen
09:11	Calinou	anyway: I vote for checkbox in menu/setting in minetest.conf :p
09:11	jin_xi	i'm just playing around with this, i have no clue
09:11	Calinou	ideally let us choose texturemode in minetest.conf (default is GL_NEAREST, you can use GL_LINEAR_MIPMAP_LINEAR and any other texture mode)
09:11	jin_xi	usually i play nethack. graphics handled just fine
09:12	rubenwardy	Calinou, what do you use?
09:12	Calinou	debian testing
09:12	Calinou	- not backed by a company
09:12	Calinou	- base install is 100% free software
09:12	Calinou	- rolling release (there's a stable version, too)
09:13	Calinou	- less bloated than noobuntu
09:13	Calinou	:p
09:14	VanessaE	Calinou: please go tell that to c55 in -dev
09:14	VanessaE	EVERYONE who can use this feature PLEASE go bug him
09:14	VanessaE	he needs to understand how useful this is
09:15	leo_rockway	jin_xi: lol
09:15	Calinou	lol, he would kick me :p
09:16	rubenwardy	celeron55 sounds quite stubburn
09:17	VanessaE	do it anyway, Calinou
09:17	rubenwardy	:P
09:17	VanessaE	if he kicks you it'll be in the log
09:19	rubenwardy	lol
09:24	jin_xi	kicked in the log
09:24	Calinou	no, haven't been kicked for now :)
09:24	VanessaE	heh
09:24	Calinou	wtf, I am downloading xonotic git at 289 kb/sec
09:25	jin_xi	here is an idea: someone should make a forum post with changes for users to report back
09:25	jin_xi	once you have a lot of positive feedback, discussion and screenies post a link in -dev
09:25		cornernote joined #minetest
09:27	VanessaE	jin_xi: can you start the topic? you discovered it, and if I start it c55 will just ignore me :-)
09:27	Calinou	and get slapped by c55
09:27	Calinou	sentence completed :p
09:28	Calinou	popularity apparently doesn't help, if it did, there would be 150 ores in the default game :p
09:28	VanessaE	haha
09:28	VanessaE	popularity might not help, but seniority does
09:28	VanessaE	I've seen how c55 reacts to that
09:28	VanessaE	with exceptions ;D
09:30	jin_xi	ok, will do but later today
09:30	jin_xi	gotta run now
09:32	VanessaE	ok
09:35		Calinou joined #minetest
09:37	leo_rockway	I'm disabling AF. This needs to be a GUI or minetest.conf option, though. For HD textures it _really_ needs to be enabled.
09:38	leo_rockway	mipmaps should be enabled by default, IMO.
09:38	VanessaE	why disabling it?
09:38	leo_rockway	VanessaE: in lowres it looks terrible.
09:38	VanessaE	it shouldn't affect low-rez textures?
09:38	leo_rockway	everything's too blurry
09:38	VanessaE	odd
09:38	VanessaE	are you sure you're not also using bilnear filtering?
09:38	VanessaE	(or tei-)
09:39	VanessaE	(or tri-)
09:39	leo_rockway	well, if I am, I was before too.
09:39	leo_rockway	and it didn't look blurry before enabling AF
09:40	VanessaE	weird
09:40	VanessaE	must be a driver bug then
09:40	leo_rockway	there, I just rebuilt without AF and it looks normal again.
09:40	leo_rockway	VanessaE: could be.
09:41	jin_xi	which section should that post go in?
09:41	VanessaE	jin_xi: I think engine development
09:41	VanessaE	or feature discussion
09:41	jin_xi	ok
09:41	jin_xi	oh, what now
09:42	jin_xi	i'll go for feature discussion
09:44	leo_rockway	mipmaps does help for me, though. I haven't checked for far rendering before.
09:45		iqualfragile joined #minetest
09:45	leo_rockway	I can even enable full viewing range
09:48	jin_xi	topic created: http://minetest.net/forum/viewtopic.php?pid=39677#p39677
09:48	jin_xi	ok later all
09:52		TheLastProject joined #minetest
09:53	leo_rockway	yeah, I have to sleep too
09:53	leo_rockway	bye
09:54	iqualfragile	bb
09:54	iqualfragile	(just got up)
09:55		q66 joined #minetest
10:01	VanessaE	mornin iqualfragile
10:01	VanessaE	and q66
10:01	VanessaE	and whoever else I missed.
10:01	q66	hi
10:02	Calinou	<leo_rockway> mipmaps should be enabled by default, IMO.
10:02	Calinou	they were before 0.3
10:02	Calinou	c55 disabled mipmaps "makes textures noisier but better looking"
10:03	VanessaE	now where was that setting for antialiasing against transparency...
10:03	VanessaE	*played with it once before)
10:03	iqualfragile	i have allready asked twice but nobody could help me: im running a server. it seems like the server would have serve problems in sending the chunks to me as a client (conected throught the internet). can somebody help me to either gather an better output or solve the problem
10:04	iqualfragile	the server has two threads of wich one is using 100 % of one cpu
10:05	RealBadAngel	hi all
10:06	RealBadAngel	VanessaE: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JUzMJFrciRo&feature=youtu.be
10:07		rubenwardy joined #minetest
10:07	VanessaE	woohoo!
10:07	RealBadAngel	ive solved problem of puttin somethin inside tubes :)
10:07	iqualfragile	realbadangel: that looks GREAT
10:07	iqualfragile	have you set up an github-repos?
10:08	RealBadAngel	not yet, its in very early stage
10:08	VanessaE	NICE!!!
10:08	VanessaE	can they turn corners okay?
10:08	RealBadAngel	now writin the code for items to find inventories and follow the tubes to them
10:09	rubenwardy	what is it?
10:09	RealBadAngel	btw, changin the collision box and physical didnt helped
10:09	RealBadAngel	ive created my own luaentity
10:10		izua joined #minetest
10:10		izua joined #minetest
10:10	rubenwardy	link?
10:10	RealBadAngel	no dowload yet
10:10	rubenwardy	github page i mean
10:11	rubenwardy	no
10:21	RealBadAngel	rubenwardy: ah you joined after i posted video link, here you go http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JUzMJFrciRo&feature=youtu.be
10:22	rubenwardy	wow
10:24	rubenwardy	when the dropped thingys come out the end, do they form a sand block, or just sit there, or disapear, or add to a chest?
10:25	rubenwardy	RealBadAngel
10:26	RealBadAngel	will be added to a chest or any other node with inventory
10:26	RealBadAngel	when there will be no inv, or the tube just ends
10:26	RealBadAngel	will be dropped on the ground
10:27	rubenwardy	ok, very cool
10:27	iqualfragile	can you later add support for the carts mod?
10:27	rubenwardy	similar to carts transportation, but faster. Is all the sand blocks coming from an inventory in the metal box
10:28	RealBadAngel	this one by now works on_punch
10:28	rubenwardy	adm?
10:28	rubenwardy	inventory on silver box, then call abm
10:28	VanessaE	RealBadAngel: so, patch soon for pumping water? :-)
10:29	RealBadAngel	but will be kinda injector, whatever you put inside will be auto inserted in the tube when connected of course
10:30	RealBadAngel	VanessaE: it may look i am workin on tubes just
10:30	iqualfragile	vanessae: that wouldn't make sense right now
10:30	iqualfragile	as the water is still minecraftlike
10:30	RealBadAngel	but in fact im solvin the very same problems i had with water
10:31	RealBadAngel	tube, wire, pipe whatever
10:31	RealBadAngel	the very same routines
10:31	VanessaE	iqualfragile: eh?
10:31	VanessaE	RealBadAngel: oh ok
10:33	iqualfragile	if you pump away one block of water another one will be created at the same place
10:34	RealBadAngel	but still you can store them
10:34	RealBadAngel	and later fill the sea if you like
10:34	VanessaE	RealBadAngel: see my previous msgs?
10:34	RealBadAngel	yup
10:35	VanessaE	iqualfragile: solution: fill them with an invisible block, remove it later when it has nothing surrounding it
10:35	iqualfragile	wonderfull idea -.-
10:35	VanessaE	the invisible block would be non-selectable, non-walkable
10:36	iqualfragile	i would rather create realistic water wich rly flows
10:36	VanessaE	and buildable-to
10:36	VanessaE	so it would behave like air except where fluids are concerned
10:37	RealBadAngel	try to add gravity to water node
10:37	RealBadAngel	like the sand for example
10:37	iqualfragile	no, but weight
10:37	iqualfragile	â€¦ im gona search a video
10:37	RealBadAngel	so the water could just fall down
10:37	VanessaE	iqualfragile: then youi'll have to figure out how to disable infinite water generation
10:38	VanessaE	or the mod will have to remove water faster than the server can replace it
10:38	iqualfragile	yeah i would have to compleetly rewrite how water works
10:38	RealBadAngel	easy to implement, gonna try that
10:39	VanessaE	what happens if you replace the desired-to-be-taken water_source with water_flowing -- directly I mean?
10:39	VanessaE	will the game re-flow it?
10:41		PilzAdam joined #minetest
10:41	theTroy	Would be fun if the game used dwarf-fortress style of water
10:41	PilzAdam	Hello everyone!
10:42	theTroy	Hi PilzAdam :)
10:43	VanessaE	hey PilzAdam
10:43	rubenwardy	Hi ;)
10:44	iqualfragile	Moin
10:47	iqualfragile	vanessae, realbadangel: thats what i meant with real flowing water: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mnbm6u37WtE#t=113s
10:47		iqualfragile joined #minetest
10:48	VanessaE	ha! good luck getting c55 to do anything like THAT
10:48	rubenwardy	german
10:48	rubenwardy	what is he saying?
10:48	VanessaE	no clue, I watch with audio off.
10:49	iqualfragile	vanessae: actualy i programmed that on my own, so i can do it again in minetest
10:49	VanessaE	iqualfragile: cool
10:49	VanessaE	may as well try it
10:49	rubenwardy	is that by you?
10:49	iqualfragile	yeah
10:49	PilzAdam	rubenwardy, hes talking about mountains, lake and snow
10:49	rubenwardy	cool
10:50	rubenwardy	a lot of snow...
10:50	RealBadAngel	http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EX5hGbfDfm4
10:50	RealBadAngel	take a look on finite water mod for mc
10:53	rubenwardy	that is cool
10:53	iqualfragile	realbadangel: that water has rounding-mistakes
10:54		SpeedProg1 joined #minetest
10:55	PilzAdam	RealBadAngel, that should be in default game with a checkbox in the settings
10:55	rubenwardy	very cool
10:55	rubenwardy	i would buy mc just for that
10:55	PilzAdam	dont buy Minecraft!
10:56	rubenwardy	i know
10:56	Calinou	<PilzAdam> dont buy Minecraft!
10:56	Calinou	lol
10:56	RealBadAngel	write it, you wont have to then
10:56	RealBadAngel	tried to register water as falling nodes
10:57	RealBadAngel	doesnt work at all
10:57	PilzAdam	i think this has to be done in c++
10:58	rubenwardy	cant be done in current lua
10:58	rubenwardy	would be slow in lua
10:59	rubenwardy	celeron55 should support dll mods, but require them to be open source
10:59	theTroy	all mods are required to be open source
10:59	theTroy	by the license of minetest
10:59	theTroy	including lua mods
10:59	VanessaE	no they aren't. but it's the standard and people won't look too kindly otherwise
11:00	theTroy	they are
11:00	VanessaE	only if you use code from minetest's mods do yours HAVE to be open.
11:00	theTroy	GPLV2
11:00	VanessaE	no, wrong.
11:00	theTroy	VanessaE: you need to read the GPL then
11:00	PilzAdam	you can use any open source license
11:00	VanessaE	you sir are wrong. period.
11:00	theTroy	denial?
11:00	theTroy	GPL requires you to use GPL
11:00	VanessaE	the GPL does not apply to works added by a third-party to a GPL application
11:00	theTroy	not any other open source licenses
11:00	theTroy	that is LGPL
11:00	VanessaE	it only applies if you want to distribute that applications's oruce.
11:01	VanessaE	sourfce.
11:01	VanessaE	source.
11:01	theTroy	GPL requires ANY code linking to GPL source to be also published under GPL
11:01	VanessaE	mods don't link to minetest.
11:01	VanessaE	they are run by it like a script.
11:01	theTroy	linking means that they interface with a program in a particular special way that the program is written
11:01	theTroy	i.e. a sound file is not linking
11:01	theTroy	but lua mod is, since it uses the minetests API
11:01	VanessaE	if you write entirely your own code and design your own textures, you can use any license you like.
11:02	theTroy	if you link to minetest
11:02	theTroy	your code has to be GPL
11:02	theTroy	you textures can be anything
11:02	theTroy	that is WRITTEN in GPL
11:02	theTroy	if you read the license
11:02	theTroy	you seem to be confusing GPL and LGPL
11:02	VanessaE	the GPl does not govern third-party applications that link to an open-source module or program if that program is distributed separatrely.
11:02	VanessaE	I have read the license, and you are wrong.
11:02	theTroy	you are incorrect
11:02	VanessaE	the GPL is a DISTRIBUTION license, not a EULA.
11:02	theTroy	if you distribute a third party that REQUIRES minetest to work
11:03	theTroy	then you have to release under GPL
11:03	theTroy	btw
11:03	VanessaE	you have to distribute Minetest binaries in order for minetest's source license to matter.
11:03	theTroy	anyone who commited to minetest can sue
11:03	theTroy	that is also incorrect
11:03	VanessaE	bullshit
11:03	theTroy	you seem to be confusing LGPL with GPL here
11:03	theTroy	GPL is extremely viral license
11:03	VanessaE	no, (and for the record, minetest is LGPL)
11:04	rubenwardy	bich fight (inside joke)
11:04	theTroy	minetest is GPL
11:04	VanessaE	minetest is LGPL.
11:04	theTroy	unless celeron has transfered the license
11:04	VanessaE	" Minetest is an infinite-world block sandbox game and a game engine, inspired by InfiniMiner, Minecraft and the like. It has been in development and use since October 2010.
11:04	VanessaE	It is Free and Open Source Software, released under the LGPL, available for Windows and Linux.
11:04	VanessaE	Minetest is developed by Perttu "celeron55" Ahola and a number of contributors. "
11:04	theTroy	and by that I mean he got mutual agreement with all commiters from distro
11:04	VanessaE	and indeed he did.
11:04	PilzAdam	Quote from the minetest.net: "It is Free and Open Source Software, released under the LGPL, available for Windows and Linux."
11:04	theTroy	then ok, he did switch to LGPL
11:05	theTroy	but VanessaE GPL-wise, my statements were correct with regard to mods
11:05	VanessaE	and even if he didn't, mods do not have to be gpl/lgpl because they do not link to minetest.
11:05	rubenwardy	whats the difference? Freer or securer?
11:05	theTroy	LGPL indeed permits you to have mods with different licenses
11:05	VanessaE	mods are loaded and executed by lua, not minetest.
11:05	theTroy	they link to minetest by the very fact that they use minetest API
11:05	VanessaE	no
11:05	theTroy	ehh
11:05	theTroy	springrts.com
11:06	theTroy	that is where it all started
11:06	theTroy	ended up with asking FSF
11:06	VanessaE	the GPl/LGPL is not talking about simple programs/scripts that are being loaded by a program - it's talking about linking in the compiler sense.
11:06	VanessaE	as in linking in like a shared library
11:06	theTroy	VanessaE: well, in any case, minetest is LGPL, so I have no need to argue with you.
11:07	PilzAdam	there is no Minetest article in wikipedia.org
11:07	PilzAdam	we need to fix that
11:07	theTroy	if minetest was GPL, I would assume every mod is GPL by nature of it
11:07	rubenwardy	I think it should still require the mods to be open source, weather WTFPL or completely copyrighted, for player confidence
11:07	theTroy	rubenwardy: lua will be "open source" in any case
11:07	rubenwardy	i will make on
11:07	theTroy	there are binary versions of lua, but you can remove support of that in minetest
11:07	rubenwardy	but if he added .dll's
11:08	theTroy	that would be already changing the LGPL code
11:08	theTroy	unless those dlls would be the ones to run minetest
11:08	theTroy	and not vice versa >.>
11:08	rubenwardy	I make english minetest wikipedia, PilzAdam you can help
11:08	iqualfragile	no fighting please, we are all in the same hurd
11:08	PilzAdam	rubenwardy, i can translate it into german
11:09	rubenwardy	ok
11:09	rubenwardy	i was thinking that :)
11:09	theTroy	iqualfragile: it makes a huge difference to commit to a project of a different license. I would personally not support an LGPL minetest with any code commits
11:09	theTroy	since I know my work can be exploited in ways I do not wish
11:10	theTroy	MIT/BSD projects is like asking for "take my work and make money off it without giving me anything in return"
11:11	theTroy	minetest.net is down?
11:12	PilzAdam	theTroy, nope
11:12	rubenwardy	http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minetest
11:12	theTroy	rubenwardy: also, if you do make a wiki article, don't forget to link the minecraft article to minetest
11:12	theTroy	as open source "alternative"
11:13	rubenwardy	Is that spamming/advertising
11:13	theTroy	not at all...
11:13	theTroy	OpenWRT article refers to DDWrt
11:13	theTroy	and vice versa
11:13	PilzAdam	rubenwardy, you should add information from here: http://minetest.net/
11:14	rubenwardy	i am
11:17	rubenwardy	i need some people to find sources for me (Minetest and blog indepenent - not from the minetest website or a blog)
11:17	iqualfragile	minetest is not a minecraf-version
11:18	rubenwardy	sorry, corrected :)
11:19	PilzAdam	http://kernelex.sourceforge.net/wiki/Minetest
11:19	rubenwardy	no, not a correct soure
11:20	PilzAdam	http://www.foresightlinux.se/wiki-en/index.php?title=Minetest
11:20	PilzAdam	http://www.lgdb.org/game/minetest_c55
11:20	VanessaE	you should not refer to minetest as a "clone" of minecraft.
11:20	VanessaE	call it an alternative, or "a game similar to".
11:21	PilzAdam	http://directory.fsf.org/wiki?title=Minetest&diff=14962&oldid=prev
11:21	PilzAdam	http://4d43.wordpress.com/2011/12/03/minecraft-clones-minetest-in-debian/
11:22	PilzAdam	https://www.ohloh.net/p/minetest-c55
11:22	VanessaE	also, theTroy, you're half right regarding the GPL. interpreted languages are not governed by the interpreter's license unless they use facilities that are added by the interpreter that link to a GPL'd library or to another piece of interpreted code that is itself GPL. but since it's LGPL anyway, the point is moot.
11:22	VanessaE	bbiab,
11:24	PilzAdam	http://linuxgamenews.com/post/21387368393/minetest-free-and-open-source-sandbox-game-inspired-by-m
11:25	rubenwardy	shall i make a section called "Comparing Minetest to Minecraft" or is that not encyclapedia enough
11:25	PilzAdam	dont do it
11:25		Jousway joined #minetest
11:28	PilzAdam	rubenwardy, the first sentence of Aims has no .
11:29	rubenwardy	ok
11:30	rubenwardy	note: anyone can edit the page
11:30	rubenwardy	even w/o an account
11:30	PilzAdam	i know
11:32	PilzAdam	rubenwardy, can you tell me when the article is ready to be translated into german?
11:33	rubenwardy	ok
11:37	rubenwardy	added more
11:38	RealBadAngel	VanessaE: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HpShtUiPZbc&feature=youtu.be
11:39	rubenwardy	Can someone take/find a screen shot of the main 0.4 menu, and of the new creative inventory
11:40	RealBadAngel	items now, when tube just ends, fall on the ground
11:43	PilzAdam	rubenwardy, http://ompldr.org/vZjhyeA/Minetest.jpg
11:45	PilzAdam	rubenwardy, http://ompldr.org/vZjhyeg/Minetest2.jpg
11:45	* PilzAdam	is away: Busy
11:48	rubenwardy	Upload process on Wikipedia is way to complex
11:53		Calinou joined #minetest
11:54	rubenwardy	Calinou: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minetest
11:55	Calinou	lol
11:55	Calinou	amateur-ish
11:55	Calinou	VERY
11:55	Calinou	I'm smelling deletion soon
11:55	Calinou	nice idea though
11:57	rubenwardy	i am cleaning up
11:57	Calinou	I'm improving it right now :p
11:58	rubenwardy	I will stop, you might need to merge
11:58	Calinou	lol edit conflict
11:58	rubenwardy	yeah
11:58	Calinou	merging? ctrl+a, ctrl+c, in case of edit conflict ctrl+a, ctrl+v
11:58	Calinou	:3
11:59	rubenwardy	just use your version
12:00	rubenwardy	Calinou: "Minetest is an open source fast C++ and Irrlicht video game[1] , similar to Minecraft, and is a sandbox-building independent video game created by Perttu "celeron55" Ahola and by other contributors." two video game mentions, doe not make sence
12:01	Calinou	derp, didn't log in to my right account
12:01	Calinou	it's Calinou1 not Calinou :p
12:02	rubenwardy	do "Minetest is an open source, sandbox-building independent video game, similar to Minecraft, created by Perttu "celeron55" Ahola and by other contributors."
12:02	rubenwardy	still not quite right
12:03	Calinou	I suggest viewing this page: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cube_2:_Sauerbraten
12:03	rubenwardy	List of possible resource:
12:03	Calinou	this is how you should make a pag
12:03	Calinou	page*
12:03	rubenwardy	http://directory.fsf.org/wiki?title=Minetest&diff=14962&oldid=prev
12:03		BartoCH joined #minetest
12:03	rubenwardy	http://www.foresightlinux.se/wiki-en/index.php?title=Minetest
12:03	rubenwardy	http://linuxgamenews.com/post/21387368393/minetest-free-and-open-source-sandbox-game-inspired-by-m#.UDoHj6BF8gU
12:04	rubenwardy	minetest.net is not allowed, as well as blogs
12:04	Calinou	gotta hate wikipedia's dumbed down settings; can't mark my edits as minor by default :/
12:04	Calinou	rubenwardy, why?
12:04	Calinou	it is the official website
12:04	rubenwardy	see Wikipedia citation guide lines
12:04	rubenwardy	must be an Independant source
12:05	rubenwardy	and reliable
12:05	* Calinou	facepalms
12:05	Calinou	see sauerbraten page?
12:05	Calinou	it has a link to official website
12:05	Calinou	I suggest not reading wikipedia's guidelines and instead looking at other pages
12:06	rubenwardy	External Link, not a Citation
12:06	rubenwardy	External Links are allowed
12:07	rubenwardy	so i does
12:07	rubenwardy	*it
12:09		_2cool_ joined #minetest
12:09	rubenwardy	_2cool_ for wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minetest
12:10	rubenwardy	brb
12:10	* rubenwardy	is away
12:11	Calinou	hope it won't be removed; let me store a local copy of the wikitext :p
12:31	* PilzAdam	is back (gone 00:45:43)
12:38	iqualfragile	Minetest (sometimes called Minetest-c55) is an open source fast C++ and Irrlicht video game[1] , similar to Minecraft, and is a sandbox-building independent video game created by Perttu "celeron55" Ahola and by other contributors.
12:38	iqualfragile	it feels so wrong
12:40	PilzAdam	Minetest is a open source sandbox-building independent video game, similar to Minecraft, programmed in C++ and Irrlicht created by ...
12:46	iqualfragile	ich Ã¼bersetzte mal auf deutsch
12:46	PilzAdam	das wollte ich machen
12:46	PilzAdam	aber du kannst anfanden :-)
12:46	PilzAdam	*anfangen
12:55	Calinou	added redirect: Minetest-c55 redirects to Minetest
12:55	Calinou	:P
12:56	PilzAdam	good
12:59	PilzAdam	Minecraft should redirect to Minetest ;-)
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13:01	rubenwardy	Calinou
13:02		_2cool_ joined #minetest
13:05	rubenwardy	Calinou
13:05		NekoGloop joined #minetest
13:05	PilzAdam	_2cool_, how is the process of the carts video?
13:05	_2cool_	Haven't started
13:06	PilzAdam	:-(
13:06	_2cool_	Sowwy
13:06	_2cool_	Too bad the forum uses punbb
13:06	PilzAdam	you need any help?
13:07	VanessaE	/me grumbles at whatever user or bot keeps adding the "notability" tag to the top of the Minetest article.
13:07	VanessaE	also hi
13:07	_2cool_	Punn
13:07	_2cool_	Oops
13:08	rubenwardy	Yes, i know
13:08	_2cool_	PunBB doesn't work with my tapatalk reader
13:08	rubenwardy	#r
13:09	rubenwardy	You could use the RSS fead]
13:09	* NekoGloop	pokes vanessae :3
13:09	rubenwardy	I can access the mod forum again!
13:09	VanessaE	there. minetestc55 redirects to minetest.
13:10	RealBadAngel	VanessaE: seen that 2nd movie?
13:10	VanessaE	yes I saw, nice
13:10	VanessaE	I wanna see the objects turn corners now :-)
13:10	NekoGloop	I wanna see... :(
13:10	RealBadAngel	codin it now
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13:10	RealBadAngel	http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HpShtUiPZbc&feature=plcp
13:11	VanessaE	bas080: add vines, make the leaves a little more common.
13:11	VanessaE	re: jungle trees
13:11	VanessaE	also, let me know what perlin seed you use so I can adjust Junglegrass mod to match
13:12	bas080	VanessaE, what do you mean with common.
13:12	VanessaE	more of them
13:12	VanessaE	:-)
13:12	rubenwardy	VanessaE, we need citations :) there is only one :(
13:12	bas080	I'm not using perlin. It uses the plants spawning function
13:12	VanessaE	bas080: oh ok. use perlin instead. it's better
13:12	VanessaE	it lets you create biomes
13:13	NekoGloop	I want pilz's farming mod to use jungle trees instead of rubber ones (have the rubber be obtained from the jungle tree.)
13:13	PilzAdam	hmmm
13:13	* PilzAdam	thinks about it
13:13	bas080	I wouldn't how to use it. Where is a simple example?
13:13	VanessaE	bas080: look at junglegrass :-)
13:14	VanessaE	https://github.com/VanessaE/junglegrass/blob/master/init.lua
13:14	VanessaE	local SEED = 52453235636
13:14	bas080	VanessaE, ok. thnx
13:14	VanessaE	inside the ABM, local noise = perlin:get2d({x=p_top.x, y=p_top.z})
13:14	VanessaE	if ( noise > ABUNDANCE )
13:14	VanessaE	(where p_top is the variable I'm using for my spawn function's coordinates)
13:14	VanessaE	oops
13:14	VanessaE	left out a line
13:14	VanessaE	local perlin = minetest.env:get_perlin(SEED, 3, 0.5, 150 ) -- using numbers suggested by Splizard
13:14	VanessaE	local noise = perlin:get2d({x=p_top.x, y=p_top.z})
13:15	PilzAdam	NekoGloop, nope i leave it as it is
13:15	VanessaE	then compare "noise" with some value e.g. "ABUNDANCE" above to decide how "thick" each region is from the "center" of the region
13:15	VanessaE	(the larger the "ABUNDANCE" variable in this code, the smaller the regions are.
13:17	VanessaE	the SEED and the numbers next to it above is the one I need to match with you if you go with perlin
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13:18	rubenwardy	Guys: #minetest-wiki
13:20		rubenwardy joined #minetest
13:31		loggingbot joined #minetest
13:31		Topic for #minetest is now [Please be patient when asking questions; someone may not be around. \| Main website: http://minetest.net \| Development channel: #minetest-delta] [WikipediaChanel: #minetest-wiki]
13:31	VanessaE	while get2d() actually gets the value
13:31	VanessaE	I'm not sure, I just did what someone else told me to do :D
13:31	VanessaE	jeez my typing is atrocious
13:33	rubenwardy	At least you can spell atrocious
13:35	VanessaE	heh
13:35		Topic for #minetest is now Please be patient when asking questions; someone may not be around. \| Main website: http://minetest.net \| Development channel: #minetest-delta] [WikipediaChanel: #minetest-wiki
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13:48	* Calinou	facepalms
13:48	Calinou	another stupid channel
13:48	Calinou	we have three already (not counting -mods)
13:48	Calinou	we are not ubuntu
13:49	PilzAdam	Calinou, you can translate the article into french?
13:50	iqualfragile	calinou: the chanel is just temp
13:50	Calinou	PilzAdam, not right now
13:50	PilzAdam	but later?
13:50	rubenwardy	#minetest-wiki
13:50	Calinou	k
13:50	rubenwardy	i will delete after finish
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14:02	bas080	VanessaE, jungletrees require some descent spacing. Just perlin noise isn't giving me that effect. Or am i wrong? Will have to combine it with something else. Also the ABM works well for junglegrass but it makes wide trees spawn to close to eachother. Now i'm planning to use my spacing function from plants + perlin noise for smooth biome effect. It should be simpler...
14:04	VanessaE	use the radius function also
14:04	VanessaE	if (minetest.env:find_node_near(p_top, RADIUS, JUNGLETREE_NODE) == nil) then spawn one
14:04	VanessaE	radius is measured in nodes.
14:05	VanessaE	if ~= nil, don't spawn a tree at all
14:05	VanessaE	that way you can use both perlin noise and keep the spawn density under control
14:05	bas080	and how should i get the surface node value without using abm?
14:05	VanessaE	this is inside the abm
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14:06	VanessaE	when the abm fires, do that check. if it comes back nil, then go ahead and spawn a tree the way you're doing now.
14:06	VanessaE	https://github.com/VanessaE/junglegrass/blob/master/init.lua#L40
14:06	bas080	But i don't want abm's firing or do I? It does make chopped trees grow back.
14:07	VanessaE	well you can probably do this inside the map generator too
14:07	VanessaE	I just use an ABM since grass should grow and die over time
14:08	VanessaE	all you have to do is make sure that you do the perlin noise check and the radius check before you actually generate a tree.
14:08	bas080	that's what i would like. As jungletrees take a long time to regenerate. Maybe a really big interval should do the trick.
14:11	bas080	Now i remember why i didn't want to use abm's the trees aren't spawned when map generates. You slowly see them popping out the ground.
14:11	bas080	I find that not cool
14:12	bas080	Could use your code to spawn new saplings but i do want an initial jungle on map gen
14:13	rubenwardy	^^ Jungles +1 ^^
14:13	rubenwardy	VanessaE, does this apply to generating, say, and Orange Tree
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14:15	VanessaE	it'll work for anything.
14:16	VanessaE	it's all a matter of what you want to use the noise to do
14:16	VanessaE	mostly it's just useful for limiting stuff to grow in certain areas instead of just all over.
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15:24	bas080	Chess mod now has all pieces thnx to tonyka
15:25	bas080	still looking for a better texture so the pieces look more refined. Anyways, you can now play a game of chess.
15:28	rubenwardy	ok
15:28	rubenwardy	does the /move rook a43 v8 work?
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15:30	rubenwardy	bas080
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15:34	rubenwardy	VanessaE, do the anti-alaising / AF thing as a issue on Github
15:40	VanessaE	after we gain some support and commentary
15:40	rubenwardy	okaydookay
15:41		Topic for #minetest is now Please be patient when asking questions; someone may not be around. \| Main website: http://minetest.net \| Development channel: #minetest-delta \| WikipediaChanel: #minetest-wiki
15:42	jinxi	look, idk if that forum post and stuff is necessary or not, just trying to get some discussion going
15:42	jinxi	just adding issues or posting requests is no long term solution
15:42	PilzAdam	jinxi, wheres your _ ?
15:42	jinxi	__________________________
15:43	PilzAdam	in your name?
15:43	jin_xi	oh well
15:49	jin_xi	hmm, thinking about stuff moving player around
15:50	jin_xi	don't the methods of entities all work for players too?
15:51	rubenwardy	jin_xi: http://minetest.net/forum/viewtopic.php?id=2868
16:00	Calinou	http://wiki.minetest.com/wiki/More_Blocks
16:00	Calinou	started documenting :D
16:01	thexyz	shouldn't it be here http://wiki.minetest.com/wiki/Mods/More_Blocks ?
16:02	Calinou	nope, shorter links
16:02	Calinou	minetest is about modding; thus the "Mods/" thingie is uneeded
16:02	thexyz	damn
16:02	thexyz	that means i can't create page for mod named "crafting"
16:03	Calinou	in case a mod name conflicts with some item in the default game, it will be named "Itemname Mod" (eg. Signs Mod)
16:03	Calinou	> Crafting Mod
16:03	thexyz	that's even worse
16:03	Calinou	why?
16:03		Crisco joined #minetest
16:03	thexyz	no naming conventions
16:03		roboman2444 joined #minetest
16:03	thexyz	some mods are named like $modname, some like $modname Mod
16:03	thexyz	but, anyway
16:04	thexyz	i'm too lazy to document my mods
16:04	Calinou	:p
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16:05	jin_xi	hi TForsman
16:05	TForsman	howdy
16:05	jin_xi	whats up?
16:06	TForsman	not much
16:07	Basstard`	What's down?
16:08	jin_xi	a guess: you are
16:09	Basstard`	Gettin' jiggy wid it.
16:09	jin_xi	na na na na na na na na!
16:11	Basstard`	So how we gonna kick it?
16:12	Basstard`	Gonna kick it root down.
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16:39	rubenwardy	hi bas080
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16:43	khonkhortisan	my tictactoe machine keeps having on mesecons with no source for the power
16:45	khonkhortisan	I press the reset button, the lights go off, I let go of the reset button, one light goes on again as if I pressed its button
16:46		mrtux joined #minetest
16:47	khonkhortisan	I need to add in some error checking
16:50	rubenwardy	Thats an idea bas080, we could make the chess block require mesecon power....
16:50	rubenwardy	to do /move /reset
16:51	khonkhortisan	Are you using a single node for the chessboard and entities for the pieces?
16:57	rubenwardy	http://minetest.net/forum/viewtopic.php?id=2784
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17:04	khonkhortisan	<constructive criticism> If it was a mesecon display for a chess game it would make sense to have rules, but I don't see how it would make sense for a physical board to enforce rules. <missing end tag>
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17:20	khonkhortisan	How to I make a recipe where it takes a stack of two items to make one item?
17:20	khonkhortisan	*do I
17:20	PilzAdam	i think its "modname:itemname 2"
17:21	rubenwardy	"<constructive criticism> If it was a mesecon display for a chess game it would make sense to have rules, but I don't see how it would make sense for a physical board to enforce rules. <missing end tag>" I know it is a problem :(
17:22	rubenwardy	"'modname:itemname' 2"
17:22	rubenwardy	i think
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17:27	khonkhortisan	output = '"mesecons_insulated:plus_off" 1', works fine but recipe = {'"mesecons_insulated:insulated_off" 2'}, doesn't
17:27	VanessaE	lose the excess quotes
17:27	VanessaE	{"mesecons_insulated:insulated_off 2"}
17:27	VanessaE	do it that way
17:27	VanessaE	the double-quoted method is deprecated.
17:27	VanessaE	(or at least, obsolete)
17:28	VanessaE	of course you probably don't need the braces either
17:32	khonkhortisan	the recipe works but only takes one of the input item to make the output with minetest.register_craft({output = "mesecons_insulated:plus_off 1", recipe = {{"mesecons_insulated:insulated_off 2"},},})
17:33	khonkhortisan	if I take out either set of braces in the recipe it won't run
17:33		NakedFury joined #minetest
17:33	PilzAdam	i had the same problem with my farming mod, so i used a shapless recipe with two stacks of the same item
17:33	khonkhortisan	You couldn't get one stack to craft to half a stack?
17:34	khonkhortisan	I guess I'll just do the same thing.
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17:44	Calinou	minetest' page on wikipedia is WAY too biased
17:44	Calinou	it lacks neutrality and expects you already played the game for a while
17:44	Calinou	it doesn't have wikipedia's writing style at al
17:44	Calinou	all*
17:44	VanessaE	Calinou: we're still working on it
17:44	saschaheylik	wikipedia has a writing style?
17:44	Calinou	i know, but be careful
17:45	Calinou	saschaheylik, neutrality, and beginner-availability
17:45	PilzAdam	Calinou, you can make it better
17:45	Calinou	i know. just telling ;)
17:45	VanessaE	yes, if you can push it more neutral, please do
17:45	VanessaE	we want this to persist
17:45	Calinou	see the "texturepacks" section
17:45	Calinou	it shouldn't contain the username of anyone; that's not neutrality
17:45	VanessaE	and not be removed by some stupid deletionist
17:46	PilzAdam	Calinou, this are examples
17:46	Calinou	VanessaE, this is why articles should always be neutral :p lots of deletionits on wikipedia
17:46	Keegann	hello
17:47	VanessaE	there, cleaned out the names from the texture packs
17:47	VanessaE	hi Keegann
17:47	Calinou	hi
17:47	VanessaE	I need a good name for my texture pack
17:47	Keegann	so glad im back
17:48	khonkhortisan	VanessaE: an insulated plus wire where the two directions don't connect would serve my purposes better than a Âµc display.
17:48	VanessaE	maybe "HDX" ? ("High Definition Expansion")
17:49	VanessaE	khonkhortisan: not possible unfortunately, says jeija anyway
17:49	khonkhortisan	really?
17:49	VanessaE	yeah
17:49	khonkhortisan	so someone's already tried it.
17:49	VanessaE	I don't see why it's impossible if a ÂµC can do it
17:49	khonkhortisan	a ÂµC can't do it. It only goes one-way on both wires.
17:49	VanessaE	think oyu can code it?
17:50	khonkhortisan	A goes to C but if C goes to A it'll never turn off
17:50	VanessaE	I think jeija released a codepaste that does go both ways
17:50	Calinou	improving the wikipedia page :)
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17:51	VanessaE	sfan5: you need to make this ycpaste database into an actual database so pastes don't just get lost
17:51	sfan5	the won't get lost
17:51	PilzAdam	Calinou, can you come to #minetest-wiki ?
17:51	VanessaE	khonkhortisan: if(A&!C&#1)off(A)sbi(1,0); if(C&!A&#1)off(C)sbi(1,0); if(D&!B&#2)off(D)sbi(2,0); if(B&!D&#2)off(B)sbi(2,0); if(A&!C&!#1)on(C)sbi(1,1)sbi(2,0); if(C&!A&!#1)on(A)sbi(1,1)sbi(2,0); if(B&!D&!#2)on(D)sbi(1,0)sbi(2,1); if(D&!B&!#2)on(B)sbi(1,0)sbi(2,1);
17:51	VanessaE	bidirectional crossing
17:51	VanessaE	sfan5: oh ok.
17:52	VanessaE	http://sfan.sf.funpic.de/ycpaste/index.php?8fy
17:55	Calinou	lol minecraft auth servers are down
17:55	Calinou	huge spam in #minecrafthelp
17:55	Calinou	(not related, but makes me laugh.)
17:55	Calinou	^ this can't happen in minetest :) no auth servers
17:56	jin_xi	/join #minetest-wiki
17:57	jin_xi	oh fuck it
17:58	khonkhortisan	does it really repeat like that or is that a double-paste?
17:59	khonkhortisan	oh. the second half is different.
18:00	VanessaE	I have to wonder if that code couldn't be shrunk down a bit
18:00	NakedFury	that is extremely exagerated
18:00	VanessaE	seems like a lot of code just to do a bidirectional crossing
18:00	khonkhortisan	so now just to make a Âµc that can't be programmed and looks like wire
18:01	VanessaE	khonkhortisan: I wouldn't start with a ÂµC as such. it's better to create a new node
18:01	VanessaE	and btw it should look like a wire that rises up and over the other
18:01	VanessaE	otherwise they look like they're connected anyway
18:01	khonkhortisan	yeah I was going to do that after I got the on/off part working
18:02	VanessaE	you code it, I'll draw up the textures and nodeboxes.
18:02	khonkhortisan	I just ^ the side and end textures
18:03	VanessaE	you should make the crossing automatically appear if there are insulated wires on either side of an insulated line
18:03	VanessaE	e.g. if I do this:
18:03	VanessaE	\|
18:03	VanessaE	--\|
18:03	VanessaE	\|
18:03	VanessaE	and then put another wire on the right
18:03	VanessaE	\|
18:03	VanessaE	-- \| --
18:03	VanessaE	\|
18:03	VanessaE	it should replace the middle with a crossing wire automatically
18:04	VanessaE	(and of course automatically replace it with a straight wire if the crossing wire is removed)
18:04	Calinou	http://c55.me/blog/?p=1274#comments
18:04	Calinou	rofl @ latest comment
18:04	Calinou	nyancat is non-free? O_o
18:05	Calinou	the FOSS d00ds can censor it if they want
18:08	* Calinou	rates the page
18:08	Calinou	erm wrong chan
18:09	Calinou	http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minetest
18:09	Calinou	everyone vote 5-5-5-5 stars at the end of the page :P
18:09	Calinou	thanks in advance
18:17	saschaheylik	how is minetest irrlicht based?
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18:18	saschaheylik	it's C++ based and irrlicht does only one thing: render
18:18	VanessaE	there. better?
18:19	saschaheylik	what is the difference between "based on" and "based around"
18:19	VanessaE	based around means it uses something
18:19	VanessaE	based on means it actually IS that something or tries to me
18:19	VanessaE	be
18:19	saschaheylik	then how about "using"
18:20	khonkhortisan	A uses B, A sends signals to B, A loses functionality without B or B's replacement
18:20	VanessaE	threre. how about that?
18:21	saschaheylik	yes
18:22	saschaheylik	VanessaE: add a link to the official facebook page: http://www.facebook.com/pages/MineTest/345371275551444
18:23	VanessaE	done.
18:24	Calinou	should be Minetest not MineTest
18:24	Calinou	saschaheylik has been SLAPPED
18:24	saschaheylik	i didnt make the page
18:24	* Calinou	hates facebook and will never use facebook, too
18:24	saschaheylik	i hate it too
18:25	saschaheylik	but do you want to reach an audience or not?
18:25	Calinou	I wouldn't add a link to the facebook page; is it really official?
18:25	Calinou	(endorsed by c55; probably not)
18:25	saschaheylik	does c55 own minetest?
18:25	saschaheylik	last time i checked its open source
18:25	Calinou	trademark? no. but he made the game
18:26	Calinou	there's a "community trademark" though
18:26	saschaheylik	so anything by the community is pretty official
18:26	Calinou	it's not legally enforced but still
18:26	Calinou	it isn't
18:26	Calinou	go ask him in -dev and see
18:26	saschaheylik	if a company makes a game, what the company does is considered official
18:26	saschaheylik	in open source its random coders instead of a company
18:27	saschaheylik	so what would be considered official if not them
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18:31	VanessaE	https://www.facebook.com/pages/Minetest/335345033194147
18:32	VanessaE	most popular minetest facebook page ^^^^^^
18:33	Calinou	we have 8 5-5-5-5 ratings on wikipedia now :D
18:33	Calinou	(someone voted 4 for "complete" though)
18:34	VanessaE	"Hello there!
18:34	VanessaE	The Nyan Cat image is not creative commons, and is in fact both copyrighted and trademarked by me. Did you have any licensing inquiries for it's use?"
18:34	VanessaE	response from the nyancat guy
18:35	rubenwardy	not me :) (to Calinou)
18:39	saschaheylik	VanessaE: im fairly sure i wouldn't have much trouble beating 840 likes
18:39	Calinou	didn't knew mikeeusa made the nyancat
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18:40	Calinou	seriously
18:40	Calinou	16x16 texture copyrighted
18:40	VanessaE	I wrote back:
18:40	Calinou	HEY! I CREATED BLACK 1x1 TEXTURE. ITS UNDER COPYRIGHT
18:40	VanessaE	"We (that is, the community involved with the game) would like some kind of official permission to use Nyancat (or rather, its likeness) in a free, open source video game as an object which can be found and collected under very rare circumstances. The game is LGPL for the code and CC 3.0 for the imagery therein, hence my suggestion of that license.
18:40	VanessaE	Very small portions of the Nyancat image (small enough to qualify under US fair use guidelines) are already being used, but as I said it's quite rare to find it (rare enough that it almost may as well not exist).
18:40	VanessaE	I don't want to give the name of the game as I don't want to get its authors in trouble."
18:40	Calinou	default texture pack is under WTFPL iirc.
18:40	Calinou	not sure though
18:40	VanessaE	no
18:40	VanessaE	CC 3.0
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18:41	Calinou	what kind of CC?
18:41	Calinou	CC BY?
18:41	VanessaE	cc-by-sa 3.0
18:41	Calinou	k
18:41	VanessaE	https://github.com/celeron55/minetest/blob/master/README.txt#L247
18:41	saschaheylik	go copyright the most common jpg artifact patterns
18:41	Calinou	haha true
18:41	VanessaE	haha
18:42	Calinou	I'd be rich if I did that
18:42	VanessaE	copyright the patterns, overlay them to make the nyancat image :-)
18:42	saschaheylik	yeah
18:42	VanessaE	the game does support simple image compositing .... ;-)
18:42	Calinou	then the nyancat needs to be renamed and changed so that it isn't nyancat anymore, to avoid legal issues
18:42	VanessaE	it's just "nc" in the filenames
18:43	Calinou	the node definition is called nyancat
18:43	saschaheylik	make a nyandog
18:43	VanessaE	however, legal issues aren't an issue, nyancat is probably not copyrighted in .fi and besides, the image is so small that it no sane country would consider it anything but fair use/fair dealing/etc.
18:43	GTRsdk	make a block for the fake nyancat! (found at nyan.cat)
18:43	khonkhortisan	and a nyandog song that plays when you get near it
18:43	VanessaE	(as applicable to a given country)
18:44	saschaheylik	VanessaE: show me a sane government
18:44	VanessaE	good point
18:44	GTRsdk	wait... it looks like nyan.cat has the real one now
18:46	GTRsdk	https://encrypted.google.com/search?q=toast+nyan+cat
18:46	Calinou	encrypted + google
18:46	Calinou	does not compute
18:47	Calinou	saschaheylik, mars maybe
18:47	Calinou	this is why curiosity was launched
18:47	Calinou	to find a decent government
18:49		roboman2444 joined #minetest
18:50	khonkhortisan	http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minetest#Creative_Mode how do I get the gui on the right?
18:50	Calinou	play 0.4.2-rc1 or git
18:50	Calinou	and enable creative mode
18:51	khonkhortisan	oh. I didn't know I already had that.
18:53	saschaheylik	Calinou: the mars rover?
18:53	Calinou	yeah
18:53	saschaheylik	and there are decent governments on mars?
18:54	Calinou	maybe
18:54	rubenwardy	is that even possible?
18:54	Calinou	given how they spend so much money on curiosity
18:54	Calinou	real governments don't need air
18:56		rubenwardy left #minetest
18:56		rubenwardy joined #minetest
18:58	khonkhortisan	what do I do when I have wires that don't turn off?
18:59	rubenwardy	remake them, find bug?
18:59	rubenwardy	sell it, unlimited energy source
19:00	khonkhortisan	the bug isn't in my circuit, I have a wire with Âµcs on each end with the ports off.
19:00		vicscand1 joined #minetest
19:01	rubenwardy	bug in code
19:08	saschaheylik	jin_xi: thanks for this http://minetest.net/forum/viewtopic.php?pid=39678
19:08	saschaheylik	been trying hard to figure out how to make irrlicht obey
19:09	khonkhortisan	? the button got stuck pushed
19:10	jin_xi	saschaheylik: pls report back in the thread
19:10	saschaheylik	guess i didnt look in clientmap.cpp
19:11	saschaheylik	jin_xi: dont think im signed up on the forum
19:11		FreeFull joined #minetest
19:11	jin_xi	oh ok
19:12	jin_xi	i grep the source a lot
19:12	jin_xi	but i use ack not grep ;)
19:12	saschaheylik	did you try trilinear filter too?
19:13	VanessaE	saschaheylik: I use it
19:13	VanessaE	the result is beautiful on high def textures
19:13	saschaheylik	in the post it says bilinear
19:13	saschaheylik	nice
19:13	VanessaE	you may want to reload the page in case you miss my latest post at the bottom
19:13	VanessaE	(re: texture filter threshold)
19:15	saschaheylik	do the default textures have to be that low-res?
19:15	VanessaE	saschaheylik: yes, "old machines etc"
19:15	saschaheylik	did anyone actually compare the performance to justify that?
19:15	VanessaE	on my machine, the 16px textures are only a little faster (maybe 20%) than my 512px ones
19:16	saschaheylik	faster to load or your fps count in game?
19:17	jin_xi	saschaheylik: i like your idea of bypassing network layer entirely when playing locally
19:17	VanessaE	FPS count
19:17	saschaheylik	either way with that little difference i'd at least use 64px or something
19:17	VanessaE	the big textures take WAY longer to load but that's understandable to a point
19:17	jin_xi	local playing and waiting for stuff to download... yuk
19:18	jin_xi	pissed me off when i installed ambient sound
19:18	saschaheylik	are you confusing me with celeron55?
19:18	jin_xi	maybe ;)
19:18	jin_xi	i thougt it was you who mentioned it in -dev
19:18	saschaheylik	im a C++ coder too but im relatively new to mt and obviously didnt start it
19:19	saschaheylik	i dont remember talking about bypassing the network layer
19:20	saschaheylik	or are you referring to my "localhost-problem-fix"
19:20	saschaheylik	its on my repo https://github.com/saschaheylik/minetest
19:21	jin_xi	yes, in the following discussion i believe
19:22	saschaheylik	VanessaE: can you link me to that HD texture pack please?
19:22	VanessaE	http://minetest.net/forum/viewtopic.php?pid=19702
19:22	saschaheylik	thank you
19:23	thexyz	that not a fix =(
19:23	VanessaE	what?
19:23	saschaheylik	technically the removal of a problem is a fix
19:23	VanessaE	oh that
19:23	VanessaE	saschaheylik: it's a kludge.
19:23	saschaheylik	everything else is your opinion
19:23	VanessaE	the correct fix is to find out why it doesn't resolve to begin with and fix it there.
19:24	jin_xi	sorry saschaheylik, it was hmmmm's idea
19:25	saschaheylik	it's done and it works. which is what the player wants. i am not going to discuss this again. if you want a "better" solution (even though problem.solved? is a boolean variable and there is nothing more true than true).
19:25	jin_xi	http://irc.minetest.ru/minetest-dev/2012-08-23 here. sorry for the noise
19:25	iqualfragile	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HpShtUiPZbc
19:26	saschaheylik	jin_xi: the point of this channel is to talk in it. you did just fine.
19:27	saschaheylik	oh that.
19:27		iqualfragile joined #minetest
19:28	* rubenwardy	is away
19:28	thexyz	that's not fix because it works only in one particular case
19:29	thexyz	so the problem is not that player can't sometimes connect to localhost
19:29	thexyz	the problem is that minetest doesn't work with ipv6
19:29	saschaheylik	n problems - n problems = n fixes
19:29	saschaheylik	no it's not
19:29	saschaheylik	im not using ipv6
19:30	saschaheylik	yet this problem made the game impossible to play
19:30	thexyz	how can this problem make game impossible to play?
19:30	saschaheylik	well, if you can't join the server, how are you going to play
19:30	thexyz	i can't understand you now
19:30	thexyz	are we talking about "localhost" issue?
19:31	saschaheylik	yes.
19:31	thexyz	so
19:31	thexyz	type 127.0.0.1 instead of localhost
19:31	saschaheylik	and who is going to tell you that?
19:31	saschaheylik	noone
19:31	thexyz	damn
19:31	saschaheylik	you could put in a pop up that says that
19:32	saschaheylik	but isnt my solution better than that?
19:32	VanessaE	to be fair, if you know to know "localhost" means your PC, you probably already know that 127.0.0.1 is the same thing
19:32	thexyz	no, your "solution" is not solution
19:32	saschaheylik	you dont understand
19:32	saschaheylik	the player who enters "localhost" doesnt know that the game doesn't work because he typed "localhost" instead of "127.0.0.1"
19:32	thexyz	then explain it
19:33	thexyz	why player need to enter "localhost"?
19:33	saschaheylik	which will make him quit it without playin
19:33	thexyz	instead of starting singleplayer game
19:33	saschaheylik	bugs dont have to be encountered
19:33	saschaheylik	yet they can be
19:33	thexyz	well, then, what will happen if i enter my hostname (xyz-pc) instead of ip
19:33	thexyz	and then it may work
19:33	thexyz	or may not work
19:34	saschaheylik	who does that
19:34	thexyz	will you make another if to handle this?
19:34	thexyz	yes, I have the same question for you
19:34	saschaheylik	dude localhost is the same on all machines
19:34	saschaheylik	while your hostname is unique to you
19:34	saschaheylik	think, please.
19:34	thexyz	what do you mean by "same"?
19:34	thexyz	it can resolve to 127.0.0.1 or ::1
19:35	thexyz	is that "same"?
19:35	khonkhortisan	I've seen that resolving file somewhere
19:35	saschaheylik	again, i am done leading this useless conversation.
19:35	saschaheylik	ya its /etc/hosts
19:36	saschaheylik	thexyz: localhost always points to the local machine
19:36	saschaheylik	"xyz-pc" only on yours
19:36	saschaheylik	or your moms
19:36	saschaheylik	or your dog
19:36	saschaheylik	s
19:36	saschaheylik	but not mine
19:37	saschaheylik	and all other people who entered "localhost" as expected and had no idea whatsoever why they can't play
19:37	thexyz	ok, then explain one last thing
19:37		rubenwardy joined #minetest
19:37	saschaheylik	well?
19:37	thexyz	tell me one reason to enter "localhost" in server ip instead of starting singleplayer game
19:38	rubenwardy	server testing
19:38	saschaheylik	would you leave a gamebreaking bug in a game just because you know how to avoid it?
19:39	thexyz	well, that's not "reason"
19:39	rubenwardy	some people are too stupid and can not be bothered with: 127.0.0.1
19:39	saschaheylik	would you rather tell people not to run into bugs instead of fixing them?
19:39	saschaheylik	rubenwardy: you are the stupid one
19:39	saschaheylik	why would someone enter 127.0.0.1 rather than localhost
19:39	rubenwardy	it is very easy to remember though
19:39	khonkhortisan	if the server is started separately and you want to connect to the one you are hosting you would type localhost
19:39	saschaheylik	or vice versa
19:39	saschaheylik	no reason
19:39	saschaheylik	its random
19:39	rubenwardy	sascha, i have been c++ coding longer than you
19:39	saschaheylik	yet if they enter localhost they wont be able to play
19:40	saschaheylik	lol
19:40		krayon joined #minetest
19:40	saschaheylik	and how long have i been coding c++?
19:41	saschaheylik	also, so?
19:41	saschaheylik	and, why are you still failing to understand user behaviour?
19:42	rubenwardy	you said earlier that you were not around long enough to make minetest, minetest was started in oct 2010
19:42	rubenwardy	i start c++ in 2009
19:43	saschaheylik	lol bs i said
19:43	rubenwardy	anyway, i do understand user behaviour
19:43	saschaheylik	i said i was not working _on minetest_
19:43	rubenwardy	i will check the log...
19:43	saschaheylik	ive been using c++ since something like 6 years ago
19:44	saschaheylik	and not only c++
19:44	rubenwardy	oh wait
19:44	saschaheylik	if you want an (incomplete) list, its on saschaheylik.com/about-me
19:45	rubenwardy	anyway...
19:45	rubenwardy	"im a C++ coder too but im relatively new to mt and obviously didnt start it" i read it instead of mt
19:46	rubenwardy	nice website
19:47	rubenwardy	i read "it" instead of "mt"
19:47	rubenwardy	how old are you?
19:49	leo_rockway	greetings
19:50	rubenwardy	hi
19:51	leo_rockway	this world that got generated has a lot of snow! o.o
19:52		NekoGloop joined #minetest
19:53	rubenwardy	sascha: your "offical" page does not even show up in drop down when searched
19:55	leo_rockway	I just tried MT with the MC textures... MT default textures are prettier =]
19:55	rubenwardy	what do they mean: "Check the wiki for enough info to make your eyes bleed."
19:55	MiJyn	yeah
19:55	VanessaE	bbl
19:55	saschaheylik	rubenwardy: surprised?
19:55	rubenwardy	what do they mean?
19:56	saschaheylik	idk ask them
19:56	saschaheylik	or spend your time on something useful
19:56	saschaheylik	your call
19:57	rubenwardy	they answered me
19:57	saschaheylik	great
19:58	rubenwardy	on the "add website link"
19:58	rubenwardy	why are you so sour on this?
19:59	saschaheylik	add what link to what
20:01	rubenwardy	add website link "www.minetest.net" to their page
20:01	saschaheylik	again something i didn't say
20:02	saschaheylik	i said they don't even link to minetest.net
20:02	saschaheylik	so people google "minetest"
20:02	saschaheylik	then go to wikipedia
20:02	saschaheylik	then to that page
20:02	rubenwardy	no, i said www.minetest.net
20:02	rubenwardy	bit
20:02	saschaheylik	and then they dont go anywhere
20:02	saschaheylik	its 2012
20:03	saschaheylik	you dont have to type the www.
20:03		sdzen joined #minetest
20:03	rubenwardy	minetest.net is the first listing in google :)
20:03	saschaheylik	right now it is
20:03	saschaheylik	but wikipedia is a huge authority site
20:04	saschaheylik	they could easily outrank minetest.net
20:05	saschaheylik	wikipedia quite often outranks the actual product
20:05	rubenwardy	then celeron should do better ceo
20:05	rubenwardy	*seo
20:05	saschaheylik	no he shouldn't
20:06	saschaheylik	i am the one who is studying seo and internet marketing
20:06	rubenwardy	and there is no link to face book page in wikipedia
20:06	saschaheylik	i dont think he is too
20:06	saschaheylik	ok im really tired of wasting time now
20:06	saschaheylik	bye
20:06	rubenwardy	bye
20:06	rubenwardy	no hard feelings
20:08	rubenwardy	such an illogical person
20:08	saschaheylik	me?
20:08	rubenwardy	huhu
20:09	saschaheylik	i am a programmer. i live logic.
20:09	NekoGloop	oh look, winRAR has expired. boo-hoo
20:09	rubenwardy	i see your reasoning
20:09	rubenwardy	lol
20:09	rubenwardy	but it does not apply
20:09	rubenwardy	any way, topic other
20:09	rubenwardy	*over
20:09	thexyz	oh look somebody uses winrar
20:10	NekoGloop	yes I use winrar
20:10	rubenwardy	i do too
20:10	NekoGloop	that expires but doesnt make you buy it
20:10	leo_rockway	no, it just gets annoying.
20:11	rubenwardy	i does
20:11	rubenwardy	*it does
20:14	saschaheylik	look at http://minetest.com/
20:14	saschaheylik	they are doing it right
20:16	rubenwardy	that site also hosts the wiki
20:16	saschaheylik	"Welcome to the Minetest Wiki
20:16	saschaheylik	The official source for information about Minetest."
20:16	saschaheylik	_official_
20:16		SpeedProg joined #minetest
20:17	rubenwardy	that is just the wiki, not the site
20:17	rubenwardy	the offical site is minetest.net
20:17	rubenwardy	the offical wiki it wiki.minetest.com/wiki
20:17	saschaheylik	not wiki.
20:17	saschaheylik	"source for information about minetest"
20:19	rubenwardy	whatever
20:19	NekoGloop	children, no fighting.
20:19	thexyz	> We currently have 93 articles and 1 active contributors
20:20	rubenwardy	wtf? who is it?
20:21	Keegann	when i try to connect with 0.4.2 r1 it loads mods slow and it dissconnects
20:22	saschaheylik	more detail pls
20:22	NekoGloop	hm... should I re-create the jungle biome in a mod? (using snow biome code)
20:23	Keegann	i got it to work
20:23	saschaheylik	what?
20:23	jin_xi	earlier today someone posted some nice jungle trees
20:23	saschaheylik	i need to know exactly what happened in order to fix it
20:23	khonkhortisan	huh. My second commit automatically got added to my pull request on github.
20:24	Keegann	0.4.2 r1 i just keep on joining and it dissconnects to the server and after like 6 times it work
20:24	saschaheylik	i think pull requests are requesting the whole branch to be pulled
20:24	saschaheylik	or maybe even the whole repo
20:25	saschaheylik	Keegann: what server
20:25	Keegann	my server
20:25	saschaheylik	your local machine?
20:25	Keegann	yes
20:25	saschaheylik	what did you type in the address field
20:25	Keegann	its working now
20:25	saschaheylik	what did you type in the address field
20:25	saschaheylik	was it "localhost"
20:25	saschaheylik	or was it "127.0.0.1"
20:25	Keegann	it doesnt load media that good
20:25	rubenwardy	lol :)
20:25	Keegann	no my public server
20:26	saschaheylik	not your local one?
20:26	saschaheylik	you just said yes when i asked you
20:26	saschaheylik	<saschaheylik> your local machine?
20:26	saschaheylik	<Keegann> yes
20:26	saschaheylik	rubenwardy: i swear i am not the illogical person here
20:26	Keegann	who has a 0.4.2 r1 server here?
20:27	khonkhortisan	locally run public server with a public address?
20:27	rubenwardy	i think we should put our differences aside
20:27	saschaheylik	Keegann: me
20:27	saschaheylik	well, i could run it
20:27	saschaheylik	on the saschaheylik.com server
20:27	saschaheylik	if theres need
20:27	NekoGloop	is there an option to turn sound off? I think that might make it run a little faster...
20:28	saschaheylik	i highly doubt it
20:28	NekoGloop	aw oh well
20:28	saschaheylik	or do you mean to load?
20:28	NekoGloop	hm?
20:28	Keegann	wow what happend to all of my friends that was on my server
20:28	NekoGloop	I mean i need to somehow make minetest go about 5 fps faster
20:29	saschaheylik	oh yeah i will do that in a bit
20:29	saschaheylik	got a hint from someone i forgot who
20:29	NekoGloop	from minetest.conf
20:29	Keegann	anyone know a 0.4.2 r1 server?
20:30	saschaheylik	Keegann: do you want me to start one?
20:30	rubenwardy	Hunger Games
20:30	saschaheylik	do you need one?
20:30	saschaheylik	then i will
20:30	saschaheylik	takes just a second
20:30	Keegann	i just want to test it
20:30	saschaheylik	ok, give me a moment to start it up
20:31	NekoGloop	saschaheylik: any ideas on how to make minetest run faster using minetest.conf?
20:31	saschaheylik	i highly doubt that is possible
20:31	saschaheylik	since it doesnt seem to make sense to make the game speed variable in a config file..
20:31	rubenwardy	disable 3d clouds and enable opaque water?
20:32	saschaheylik	nor do we have gfx levels
20:32	saschaheylik	i highly doubt that will have a whole 5 fps impact
20:32	saschaheylik	but you can try if you want
20:32	NekoGloop	well I'm running at 15
20:32	NekoGloop	(generating new biomes leads to 10 or even 5 fps)
20:32	rubenwardy	is enable_full_rendering on?
20:32	saschaheylik	are you using default textures?
20:32	rubenwardy	check with "r"
20:33	NekoGloop	yes I'm using default textures, no I dont have full render distance
20:33	NekoGloop	opaque water was enough
20:33	NekoGloop	I'm at about 50 now lol
20:33	saschaheylik	rubenwardy: no its off per default
20:33	rubenwardy	i know]
20:34	NekoGloop	he means I might have accidentally hit r
20:34	rubenwardy	i often accidently press that button
20:34	leo_rockway	cornernote_: hatches look good!
20:34	rubenwardy	well, not often
20:35	leo_rockway	NekoGloop: lower the rendering distance...
20:35	NekoGloop	ok
20:35	NekoGloop	lets see... shift + "-"?
20:36	leo_rockway	I have them remapped, so I don't know
20:36	rubenwardy	just -
20:36	NekoGloop	ok
20:36	NekoGloop	lowering to whatever is lowest but reasonable
20:36	Keegann	when i join a server it loads to a number and stays there and then it dissconnects after awhile
20:37	thexyz	NekoGloop: try choosing different driver
20:37	thexyz	if you're on windows
20:37	NekoGloop	how do i do that
20:37	thexyz	video_driver = direct3d9
20:37	thexyz	in minetest.conf
20:37	Keegann	thexyz iis the hunger games server up?
20:37	rubenwardy	yes
20:37	saschaheylik	leo_rockway: default is smallest iirc
20:38	NekoGloop	i dont think i have direct3d...
20:38	NekoGloop	but attempting anyway
20:38	rubenwardy	thexyz, can you add my traps mod to the hunger games server?
20:38	thexyz	NekoGloop: here http://wiki.minetest.com/wiki/Minetest.conf
20:38	thexyz	direct3d8 directdd9 opengl
20:38	thexyz	try those all
20:39	thexyz	rubenwardy: ask infinity for that
20:39	rubenwardy	i have
20:39	rubenwardy	http://minetest.net/forum/viewtopic.php?pid=39623#p39623
20:39	rubenwardy	he has yet to ask you
20:39	thexyz	ok, i'm waiting for it
20:40	Keegann	almost 85% loaded
20:40	saschaheylik	compiling the server on my server
20:40	saschaheylik	40%
20:41	thexyz	saschaheylik: what's your server specs?
20:41	saschaheylik	its a linode vps
20:41	thexyz	oh
20:41	saschaheylik	the 512 plan
20:41	NekoGloop	there is an enable_sound in the config
20:42	saschaheylik	does it make it faster?
20:42	thexyz	just fyi, minetest is very cpu-intensive
20:42	NekoGloop	the what?
20:42	saschaheylik	thexyz: its small ram but VERY fast
20:42	thexyz	i mean, minetestserver
20:42	saschaheylik	it will do fine
20:42	saschaheylik	i think
20:42	NekoGloop	I'm not running a server just a singleplayer
20:43	thexyz	huh
20:43	khonkhortisan	singleplayer sort of counts as a server
20:43	NekoGloop	yeh
20:43	NekoGloop	but it doesnt have to look for other players
20:44	khonkhortisan	aw, in other games I can sneak into someone's singleyplayer game and make the bots win
20:44	Keegann	ii couldnt connect to the hunger games server
20:44	thexyz	http://minetest.ru/plot_final.png
20:44	NekoGloop	lol I can completely disable clouds altogether
20:44	leo_rockway	saschaheylik: default is 50~ I think. Lowest is 5.
20:44	* VanessaE	is back
20:45	saschaheylik	sorry, default what?
20:45	* NekoGloop	is not here. this is the sould of NekoGloop.
20:45	NekoGloop	soul*
20:45	leo_rockway	saschaheylik: rendering distance.
20:45	NekoGloop	augh
20:45	saschaheylik	oh
20:45	saschaheylik	ok
20:46	NekoGloop	i changed something that made minetest not load
20:46	saschaheylik	yeah thats a good idea
20:46	saschaheylik	NekoGloop: gj.
20:46	NekoGloop	i must not have direct3d :P
20:48	NekoGloop	hrmm... cannot find a snow biome :P
20:48	NekoGloop	(using this mod: http://minetest.net/forum/viewtopic.php?id=2290&p=3 )
20:48	leo_rockway	NekoGloop: it works on latest.
20:49	leo_rockway	it works very well, IMO.
20:49	NekoGloop	what does?
20:49		rubenwardy joined #minetest
20:49	NekoGloop	the snow mod?
20:49	leo_rockway	mhm
20:49	leo_rockway	yes
20:49	NekoGloop	i cant find one though
20:49		rubenwardy left #minetest
20:49		rubenwardy joined #minetest
20:49	leo_rockway	in my last map the one generated was huge
20:49	VanessaE	anyone know who Paul.pbm is?
20:49	rubenwardy	no
20:50	leo_rockway	NekoGloop: depending on the map generation there might be small ones or bigger ones
20:50	VanessaE	(someone who wants to 'friend' me on fb)
20:50	NekoGloop	omg I have like no viewing distance
20:50	NekoGloop	max view distance should not be 50 :P
20:51	VanessaE	turn it up :-)
20:51	NekoGloop	max is 75 min is 5
20:51	VanessaE	hit + a few times
20:52	rubenwardy	on numpad
20:52	NekoGloop	not applicable
20:52	NekoGloop	I'm changing -max- view distance not -min- view distance
20:52	VanessaE	oh
20:52	VanessaE	um
20:52	leo_rockway	there's no max and min...
20:53	NekoGloop	minetest.conf ;)
20:53	leo_rockway	there's only max
20:53	NekoGloop	yes there is
20:53	leo_rockway	min view distance makes no sense...
20:53	NekoGloop	http://wiki.minetest.com/wiki/Minetest.conf
20:53	leo_rockway	min view distance is your nose o.o
20:53	NekoGloop	idk what min changes but it works
20:53	NekoGloop	min is where fogging starts, max is what's actually loaded
20:54	saschaheylik	server is live on saschaheylik.com:30000
20:54	leo_rockway	NekoGloop: oh, alright.
20:54	saschaheylik	Keegann: copy that?
20:55	NekoGloop	ok this is being retarded
20:55	NekoGloop	gonna go eat dinner, be back in about 2 hours
20:57	Keegann	its loading
20:58	Keegann	it work
20:59	leo_rockway	view_bobbing_amount neat!
20:59	leo_rockway	I didn't know about this.
20:59	Keegann	saschaheylik t work
21:02	saschaheylik	Keegann: https://github.com/saschaheylik/minetest_game
21:02	saschaheylik	without the _game
21:02	saschaheylik	https://github.com/saschaheylik/minetest
21:02	leo_rockway	I just lot the game =[
21:02	saschaheylik	there is no game, you are pretending.
21:03		Taoki[mobile] joined #minetest
21:10	leo_rockway	I know what c55 was talking about when he disabled mipmap...
21:10	leo_rockway	I'll take screenshots
21:11	jin_xi	cool, pls post in thread too
21:12	leo_rockway	mhm
21:12	leo_rockway	I know what's better and what's worse... I can't take screenshots of what's better, though.
21:13	leo_rockway	because it's evident on movement
21:13	leo_rockway	mmhh... maybe it will still be noticeable in the screenshot, we'll see
21:15	VanessaE	well take the screenshot already :-)
21:16	leo_rockway	I have, I'm uploading.
21:19	leo_rockway	VanessaE: http://minetest.net/forum/viewtopic.php?pid=39764#p39764
21:19	leo_rockway	jin_xi: ^
21:20		servvs joined #minetest
21:20	VanessaE	what's ugly?
21:21	VanessaE	I must be missing something here :-)
21:21	leo_rockway	the papyrus kind of disappears
21:21	leo_rockway	look at the papyrus in the background on the left and in the middle
21:21	VanessaE	oh yeah I see that
21:21	jin_xi	are those taken at the same in-game time? second one looks darker
21:21	VanessaE	did you turn on trilinear filter also?
21:21	VanessaE	actually no you didn't
21:21	VanessaE	(or I'd be able to see it :-) )
21:21	leo_rockway	jin_xi: no, I should retake the second one
21:22	jin_xi	would give better comparison
21:22	leo_rockway	VanessaE: no, it looks terrible with default.
21:22	VanessaE	leo_rockway: you didn't turn AF on though
21:22	leo_rockway	AF, bi, tri... all look bad
21:22	VanessaE	you need mipmapping for AF to look right
21:22	leo_rockway	it destroys lowres textures...
21:22	VanessaE	doesn't affect my box?
21:22	leo_rockway	VanessaE: I tried both together, lowres textures look very very bad.
21:22	leo_rockway	it does with mine...
21:23	VanessaE	leo: with AF, with MM, but without bi/trilinear?
21:23	leo_rockway	VanessaE: correct
21:23	saschaheylik	VanessaE: your texture pack takes ages to load
21:23	VanessaE	saschaheylik: blame c55 - my pack triggers as bug in the game.
21:23	VanessaE	-s
21:24	saschaheylik	which is?
21:24	khonkhortisan	want to move full chests? worldedit will be able to next release.
21:24	VanessaE	dunno, vicscandl was looking into it.
21:24	jin_xi	khonkhortisan: cool
21:24	VanessaE	it gets hung up when processing the textures for jungle grass and dry shrubs
21:24	VanessaE	each hang adds like 15 seconds to the total load time
21:24	leo_rockway	rebuilding. I'll take the second screenshot at the same time.
21:24	VanessaE	but the files I supply are no different than anything else, so it's a game bug
21:25	saschaheylik	you mixed jpg and png files
21:25	VanessaE	saschaheylik: this was before I did that.
21:25	leo_rockway	saschaheylik: doesn't matter
21:25	VanessaE	but yeah it doesn't matter
21:25	leo_rockway	irrlicht takes them anyway
21:25	saschaheylik	are the image sizes correct?
21:25	VanessaE	the game ignores the file extension and uses irrlicht to load them, so you can get away with JPG if your images look okay in it
21:26	VanessaE	yes, they are all correct
21:26	VanessaE	verified in multiple ways
21:26	rubenwardy	Why is the "Unsupported Image Format" message displayed on game load, nothing appears wrong in it.
21:27	VanessaE	rubenwardy: dunno, happens to me even with default textures.
21:27	saschaheylik	rubenwardy: not happening if you put it in textures/all/here
21:27	rubenwardy	ok, i will keep it as it is a sign that the game has completed loading properly
21:28	leo_rockway	updated the screenshots
21:28	leo_rockway	check again, jin_xi
21:28	khonkhortisan	on what axis should the wire go over itself?
21:28	rubenwardy	if load fails, it is not printed
21:28	VanessaE	khonkhortisan: I'd use the X axis for the lower wire, Z axis for the one that jumps over
21:28	saschaheylik	i'll let it load and see if it fails
21:29	saschaheylik	its loading at maybe 2% per minute
21:29	saschaheylik	and my pc is not slow
21:29	VanessaE	saschaheylik: that's one SLOW box
21:29	VanessaE	on my fast PC it takes roughly 65 seconds to load, with lots of mods installed.
21:29	saschaheylik	i can play crysis on high without problems
21:29	VanessaE	(faster when less mods; redcrab's server typically starts in 20 seconds or so)
21:30	saschaheylik	do you have a ssd?
21:30	VanessaE	yes I do
21:30	saschaheylik	duh
21:30	VanessaE	OCZ Vertex2 60GB
21:30	saschaheylik	well most people still have hdds
21:30	saschaheylik	including me
21:30	VanessaE	but big files shouldn't incur much delay on a spinning rust disk.
21:30	leo_rockway	I have a laptop HD... slow.
21:30	VanessaE	their failing point is small files/seeking
21:30	saschaheylik	actually i could afford a ssd now.. thanks for reminding me
21:30	VanessaE	besides,
21:30	VanessaE	the texture pack is only 93MB.
21:31	saschaheylik	10% now
21:31	saschaheylik	no 113
21:31	VanessaE	even the slowest rotating disks can copy that much in 3-4 seconds
21:31	Basstard`	I want Minetest on C64. Get to it VanessaE.
21:31	VanessaE	113? your copy is out of date.
21:31	saschaheylik	im using the github one
21:31	VanessaE	vanessarainbird:~/Minetest-Textures-and-mods/texture-packs$ du -h 512px/Vanessa_512HD/
21:31	VanessaE	93M512px/Vanessa_512HD/
21:31	saschaheylik	oh right
21:31	saschaheylik	it is 93
21:32	saschaheylik	somewhere it said 113
21:32	VanessaE	well there was a 260-some MB version before (all PNG).
21:32	saschaheylik	15%
21:32	VanessaE	I shrunk that to 240-odd by shaving off all alpha channels where they weren't needed and reducing inventory/craft items to 64px
21:33	VanessaE	then it dropped to 93MB when I went with JPG where I could.
21:33	VanessaE	(is there an image format that uses JPEG-like lossy compression but which supports transparency?)
21:33	saschaheylik	i just calculated an ETA of 22 minutes -.-
21:33	VanessaE	(and which irrlicht can load?)
21:33	VanessaE	saschaheylik: how much RAM?
21:34	leo_rockway	VanessaE: gif? o.o
21:34	saschaheylik	4GB DDR2-800
21:34	VanessaE	leo_rockway: GIF doesn't use JFIF compression or anything even remotely similar. straight L-Z I think
21:34	saschaheylik	i guess that could be faster too
21:34	VanessaE	saschaheylik: processor? video card?
21:34	saschaheylik	but still, this is minetest
21:34	saschaheylik	ati HD4850
21:35	saschaheylik	intel at 3.4ghz i forgot which model this one is since i changed it
21:35	saschaheylik	dual core
21:35	khonkhortisan	should crossed wires have facedir?
21:35	VanessaE	that should be more than enough grunt to load this texture pack
21:35	VanessaE	khonkhortisan: no
21:35	khonkhortisan	if it did it would show you how ocd the builder is
21:35	VanessaE	khonkhortisan: as long as your rules for crossing the signals are compatible either way
21:36	leo_rockway	VanessaE: jpeg2000, although I don't know if it's compatible with irrlicht (and it's not jfif, but still lossy, and with transparency).
21:36	jin_xi	argh, i hate my laptop. screen connector flicker so bad i'm installing a screenreader soon
21:36	saschaheylik	intel E5400 i think
21:36	VanessaE	leo_rockway: I thought about jpeg2k. hm
21:36	saschaheylik	from 2.7ghz oced to 3.4
21:37	VanessaE	saschaheylik: you sure you aren't thrashing around in swap right now?
21:37	leo_rockway	I was thrashing around in swap with the 512 texture
21:37	saschaheylik	hm..
21:37	saschaheylik	memory 70% swap 1.4%
21:38	VanessaE	my machine is an AMD Phenom II X6 1055T (2.8 GHz I think), 4GB RAM, ATI HD6870 video w/1GB, and the aforementioned SSD.
21:38	saschaheylik	memory 2.2gb/3.1gb swap 109.6mb/7.8gb
21:39	VanessaE	MT's memory usage usually floats at around 3 to 3.5 GB with this texture pack
21:39	saschaheylik	what type of ram?
21:39	VanessaE	DDR..um...shit I'm not sure
21:39	VanessaE	lemme check
21:39	saschaheylik	whut?!
21:39	saschaheylik	how the fuck?
21:40	saschaheylik	it shouldnt be more than 93mb if its 93mb big
21:40	saschaheylik	else the textures are being loaded multiple times
21:40	saschaheylik	or am i missing something
21:40	VanessaE	well I could see it blowing up to 512MB at the most (the images do have to be converted to raw uncompressed data)
21:40	VanessaE	but 3.5GB is definitely ridiculous
21:41	VanessaE	no idea what the RAM is, except it's clocked at 667 MHz
21:41	Basstard`	I've never liked flashy texture packs, for whatever game. I like 'em small and gritty and bitty and fast.
21:41	saschaheylik	thats each texture 90 times
21:41	VanessaE	looks like it takes DDR3 1600 or so
21:41	saschaheylik	but you also like them loaded exactly one time
21:42	VanessaE	saschaheylik: I can even try to blame some of it on the extrude process c55 uses to create the objects you wield
21:42	VanessaE	but still
21:42	saschaheylik	what does that have to do with the terrain textures?
21:42	saschaheylik	or is this both?
21:43	VanessaE	this is everything
21:43	VanessaE	terrain, tools, mods, it supports a metric assload of stuff
21:43	VanessaE	all in a tiny 93MB package.
21:43	saschaheylik	ok
21:43	jin_xi	that snugly fits into 4 gigas...
21:43	NakedFury	well flat wielded items would not look as attractive as they are now
21:44	NakedFury	any other ways it can be done?
21:45	VanessaE	nope
21:45	VanessaE	either display flat or extrude the hard way
21:45	VanessaE	or come up with a tool model standard
21:45	saschaheylik	well
21:45	NakedFury	3- code a more clean way that doesnt use too much power
21:45	jin_xi	license gdl from archisoft?
21:45	saschaheylik	you could cache the extruded data on disk
21:46	VanessaE	saschaheylik: I've been bugging c55 for months now to improve it. he has no interest at all.
21:46	VanessaE	but that's a good idea.
21:46	VanessaE	wait.
21:46	VanessaE	better
21:46	saschaheylik	use proper 3d models
21:46	VanessaE	extrude the image, then flatten it. store the flattened one to disk.
21:46	saschaheylik	whats the point of that
21:46	VanessaE	it'll still look like it's extruded, and the user will never know the difference, but it'll only take up as much space and bandwidth as a plain old image
21:47	khonkhortisan	teaser image: http://www.flickr.com/photos/79516830@N05/7867482388/in/photostream
21:47	saschaheylik	hm..
21:47	VanessaE	--> no need to add a special loader
21:47	khonkhortisan	whoops meant for that link to be lightbox
21:47	VanessaE	khonkhortisan: put some space between the two wires
21:47	VanessaE	a little gap between the bottom wire and the one jumping over it
21:47	jin_xi	idk, i think color coded insulation would be cool and look great
21:47	khonkhortisan	horizontal gap or vertical gap?
21:48	VanessaE	vertical gap
21:48	saschaheylik	added anisotropic, trilinear and mipmap to this repo https://github.com/saschaheylik/minetest
21:48	VanessaE	make it look like the wire jumps up higher to get over the other one
21:48	Keegann	anyone knows how to crash a server?
21:48	khonkhortisan	wire height? half height?
21:48	VanessaE	khonkhortisan: about the height of the wire's thickness
21:48	rubenwardy	sascha, is that with a check box?
21:48	VanessaE	so a gap of say 2/16
21:49	VanessaE	khonkhortisan: you'll need to use the top/sides texture on all six faces since the ends of this crossover won't ever be visible.
21:49	khonkhortisan	so five or six boxes
21:49	jin_xi	here is something else i tried, in case anyone wants to try some more:
21:49	VanessaE	5 boxes
21:49	VanessaE	er
21:49	jin_xi	//buf->getMaterial().AntiAliasing = video::EAAM_QUALITY;
21:49	jin_xi	//buf->getMaterial().setFlag(video::EMF_ANTI_ALIASING, true);
21:49	VanessaE	6 boxes :-)
21:50	VanessaE	jin_xi: I tried that, had no effect on my box oddly
21:50	jin_xi	also in clientmap, right next to the bi/trilin stuff
21:50	jin_xi	VanessaE: same here...
21:50	khonkhortisan	my tiles are two "jeija_insulated_wire_sides.png" and four "jeija_insulated_wire_sides.png^jeija_insulated_wire_ends_off.png"
21:50	VanessaE	khonkhortisan: one nodebox for the under wire, one each for the ends of the over wire, one each for the little vertical bits, one for the crossover itself
21:51	saschaheylik	jin_xi: is there a way to set the AA level 1-16=
21:51	VanessaE	khonkhortisan: naw, just wrap it in "jeija_insulated_wire_sides.png"
21:51	saschaheylik	?
21:52	saschaheylik	oh i think video::EAAM_QUALITY; is an enum
21:53	jin_xi	yes
21:54	VanessaE	what about my idea of a threshold for texture size?
21:54		cisoun joined #minetest
21:54	VanessaE	let the user configure "don't apply bilinear if < 128px" for example
21:54	jin_xi	http://irrlicht.sourceforge.net/docu/namespaceirr_1_1video.html#aa8647c2a52bdd3bc15ee773e8f2b149d
21:55	leo_rockway	VanessaE: +1
21:55	saschaheylik	VanessaE: yes, noted
21:55	NakedFury	add that the source with options ingame to turn on or off
21:55	saschaheylik	later
21:55	NakedFury	and use the OPTIONS tab in the game too or just remove it entirely
21:55	NakedFury	wasted space
21:56	jin_xi	i like the TAPE AND GLUE label
21:56	VanessaE	ok
21:58		_2cool_ joined #minetest
21:58	Basstard`	_2cool_
21:59	_2cool_	yesh
22:00	VanessaE	leo_rockway: I just realized, what the problem could be for you with mipmapping is the mode. your drivers might be defaulting to nearest neighbor scaling instead of something like cubic or lanczos
22:00	VanessaE	jin_xi: how does one change the setting irrlicht uses for the mipmap type?
22:01	leo_rockway	VanessaE: the Intel drivers used to be really really bad, but they are slowly improving. I wouldn't be surprised if the drivers are at fault here.
22:01	leo_rockway	s/slowly/quickly
22:01	leo_rockway	in fact, a lot of work is being put on mesa / intel drivers.
22:01	leo_rockway	they were slowly improving, now they have picked up momentum.
22:01	jin_xi	lol i really dont know jack about irrlicht and 3d.
22:02	saschaheylik	finally antialiasing
22:02	khonkhortisan	really? in minetest?
22:03	saschaheylik	yes.
22:03	saschaheylik	what level should i use as default for now?
22:03	khonkhortisan	I thought a blocky game just wasn't supposed to have antialiasing
22:03	saschaheylik	between 1 and 16
22:03	saschaheylik	khonkhortisan: thats bs
22:03	khonkhortisan	:)
22:03	saschaheylik	since blocks have edges too
22:03	jin_xi	aa makes blocks more edgy, less jaggy
22:03	Basstard`	I want grit.
22:04	saschaheylik	should i put it on 8? 4?
22:04	_2cool_	This is going to be like me and neko last night with Mesecons-Git
22:04	jin_xi	all i know for sure is that irrlicht docs suck
22:04	_2cool_	people discovering new features :P
22:04	VanessaE	saschaheylik: let the user select it, but for now pick a middle-of-the-road setting
22:04	VanessaE	I guess 8x is good enough
22:04	saschaheylik	yes but what is a middle of the road settign
22:04	saschaheylik	ok
22:04	VanessaE	what is the change you're making?
22:05	VanessaE	(the code change so I can add it to the forum post)
22:05	khonkhortisan	the lowest that actually does something if you want to go non-graphics-intensive
22:06	khonkhortisan	this better? http://www.flickr.com/photos/79516830@N05/7867618750/in/photostream/lightbox/
22:06	leo_rockway	the problem with picking a sensible default is that you don't know how drivers take that sensible default: intel, nouveau, nvidia, fglrx, radeon...
22:06	VanessaE	khonkhortisan: looking better, now can you lengthen the crossover bit a little?
22:06	saschaheylik	you can get minetest with 8x AA now at https://github.com/saschaheylik/minetest
22:06	leo_rockway	it would need testing on all those, different cards, different mesa builds, windows...
22:06	jin_xi	khonkhortisan: now it needs a gap on the sides too...
22:06	VanessaE	that is, instead of this:
22:06	khonkhortisan	If I add a side gap I get exposed wire
22:07	VanessaE	_
22:07	VanessaE	__\|.\|__
22:07	VanessaE	do this:
22:07	VanessaE	___
22:07	VanessaE	_\| . \|_
22:07	VanessaE	that's why I said to wrap it entirely in the jeija_insulated_wire_sides.pngtexture
22:08	jin_xi	saschaheylik: minor nitpick (and my fault really) but i think you can OR some of those together in one call?
22:08	VanessaE	khonkhortisan: remember, when the crossover is in use, the ends are, by definition, covered up by neighboring wires, so there's no point in trying to use the ends texture at all
22:09	saschaheylik	jin_xi: im not sure what you mean
22:09	khonkhortisan	if insulated turns into crossed insulated, yes. Now what causes the insulated to intersect? Obviously more insulated, but what about microcontrollers or exposed wires?
22:10	VanessaE	saschaheylik: eek, don't use point smoothing, irrlicht docs say that's software-only usually
22:10	saschaheylik	no thats level 8 of anti aliasing
22:10	VanessaE	OH
22:10	VanessaE	you were asking for the mode
22:10	saschaheylik	enum E_ANTI_ALIASING_MODE {
22:10	saschaheylik	EAAM_OFF = 0, EAAM_SIMPLE = 1, EAAM_QUALITY = 3, EAAM_LINE_SMOOTH = 4,
22:10	saschaheylik	EAAM_POINT_SMOOTH = 8, EAAM_FULL_BASIC = 15, EAAM_ALPHA_TO_COVERAGE = 16
22:10	saschaheylik	}
22:10	VanessaE	I thought that was the 4x/8x/16x oversampling setting od so
22:10	VanessaE	or so
22:11	VanessaE	in that case, use mode 16
22:11	jin_xi	saschaheylik: nevermind
22:11	saschaheylik	as a default?
22:11	saschaheylik	sure everyone can handle that?
22:11	saschaheylik	well, most
22:11	VanessaE	no :-)
22:11	saschaheylik	exactly
22:11	saschaheylik	thats why i asked
22:11	VanessaE	ok try simple or quality mode then
22:11	* VanessaE	gives 16 a try
22:11	saschaheylik	no i commited 8x
22:12	jin_xi	i tried quality, did not work for me
22:12	VanessaE	I checked your changes and patched against my normal vanilla copy
22:12	VanessaE	er, my normal-already-patched-for-mipmap-and-AF copy ;-)
22:14	_2cool_	does anyone think taht the homepage is a bit bland?
22:14	_2cool_	that*
22:14	VanessaE	hm, mode 16 doesn't do anything for me
22:15	saschaheylik	you wont see much difference in the higher modes
22:15	saschaheylik	its just cubes, remember?
22:15	VanessaE	true true
22:15	VanessaE	now how do we smooth out the edges..
22:15	VanessaE	(the edges of the whole cubes that is)
22:16	saschaheylik	marching cubes
22:17	khonkhortisan	I tried smoothing everything, it slowed stuff down
22:17	khonkhortisan	the problem is the diagonal faces on a node
22:17	saschaheylik	well yeah marching cubes will add polygons
22:18	VanessaE	wouldn't this just be a matter of telling the driver to supersample the edges?
22:18	saschaheylik	marchingcubes demonstration: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d6_ZaoCfK0o
22:18	NakedFury	1,0You0,4Tube1,15 Mine Mars ( Marching Cubes ) Teaser 4 Infinite World Loading [2,15User1,15: johndavidfive] [2,15Views1,15: 1796] [3,1571,15] [4,1501,15] [2,15Time1,15: 00:02:361,15]
22:18	NakedFury	1,0You0,4Tube1,15 Mine Mars ( Marching Cubes ) Teaser 4 Infinite World Loading [2,15User1,15: johndavidfive] [2,15Views1,15: 1796] [3,1571,15] [4,1501,15] [2,15Time1,15: 00:02:361,15]
22:18	VanessaE	wtf?
22:18	saschaheylik	o.O
22:19	VanessaE	oh no I don't mean that
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22:19	VanessaE	I mean the jaggies along the edge of a cube face
22:19	VanessaE	look at the sun or clouds, notice the edges
22:19	VanessaE	that's the next thing to fix
22:20	saschaheylik	ls
22:20	saschaheylik	oops
22:20	VanessaE	bamboo MAME-ROMS
22:20	VanessaE	burning-flame-video microcontroller
22:20	VanessaE	celeron55-0.4.1-minetest-e3ddbe8 Minetest-Textures-and-mods
22:20	VanessaE	...
22:20	VanessaE	;-)
22:22	saschaheylik	that may have something to do with the speed or the way the sun/moon/clouds are drawn
22:23	VanessaE	saschaheylik: it happens on all objects in the game
22:23	saschaheylik	whatÃŸ
22:23	saschaheylik	?
22:23	VanessaE	most of the time you don't notice it, but when you di, suddenly you can't take your eyes off it :-)
22:23	VanessaE	here, look at one of leo's images
22:23	VanessaE	http://leorockway.com.ar/no_mipmap.png
22:23	VanessaE	look at the way the papyrus is stairstepped, or the wield hand in the lower right
22:24	VanessaE	also look at the grass "hole" to the right of the pointer and crodsshairs
22:24	VanessaE	-d
22:24	khonkhortisan	http://www.flickr.com/photos/79516830@N05/7867740072/in/photostream/lightbox/ if this would actually work my giant Âµc grid would be reduced to crossed wires and just a few microcontrollers
22:24	VanessaE	khonkhortisan: perfect!
22:24	saschaheylik	VanessaE: even with AA on 16?
22:24	VanessaE	saschaheylik: yup. no effect.
22:25		PilzAdam joined #minetest
22:25	saschaheylik	how can i spawn papyrus?
22:25		cisoun joined #minetest
22:25	VanessaE	(and I know my card supports those features, so there's probably something else we're missing)
22:25	VanessaE	khonkhortisan: oh, you use my animated torches, I just noticed :-)
22:25	PilzAdam	Hello everyone!
22:25	VanessaE	hey PilzAdam
22:25	khonkhortisan	I think you already noticed that?
22:25	saschaheylik	PilzAdam: hi
22:25	_2cool_	Bahello
22:25	VanessaE	saschaheylik: /giveme default:papyrus 999 ? :-)
22:26	VanessaE	khonkhortisan: I forgot :D
22:26	khonkhortisan	on my keyboard picture
22:26	jin_xi	a propos antialiasing:
22:26	saschaheylik	VanessaE: are the cubes antialiased?
22:26	VanessaE	saschaheylik: in the screenshot I linked? no.
22:26	saschaheylik	jin_xi's changes that i pushed only apply to the cubes i think
22:27	VanessaE	(nor in my setup, no setting seems to affect the cube edges)
22:27	jin_xi	look at main.cpp: 1278 fsaa is used to set drivers AntiAlias
22:27	khonkhortisan	where can I get this antialiasing?
22:27	VanessaE	khonkhortisan: here, https://github.com/saschaheylik/minetest
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22:27	jin_xi	when i set that value in source, and enable aa in clientmap i get "No FSAA available"
22:27	VanessaE	khonkhortisan: or here, http://minetest.net/forum/viewtopic.php?pid=39686#p39686
22:28	jin_xi	i think thats my crappy integrated intel?
22:28	VanessaE	jin_xi: probably
22:28	VanessaE	not everything supports antialiasing
22:28	khonkhortisan	fake it with software rendering
22:28	VanessaE	khonkhortisan: ew.
22:29	jin_xi	so someone with better card try and report back?
22:29	VanessaE	wait,
22:29	jin_xi	thats why i mentioned that fsaa option earlier...
22:30	saschaheylik	jin_xi: i set the fsaa setting to 16 and nothing happens
22:30	jin_xi	and do you get any messages?
22:31	saschaheylik	nothing happens
22:31	saschaheylik	no AA no messages
22:31	VanessaE	saschaheylik: by the way, you don't have to include the "false" setting on bilinear mode - the irrlicht docs say trilinear overrides it
22:31	saschaheylik	i know
22:33	VanessaE	there's mine btw: http://digitalaudioconcepts.com/vanessa/hobbies/minetest/screenshots/screenshot_1695583769.png
22:33	VanessaE	(2550 x 1985 pixels)
22:33	khonkhortisan	that's the center picture on the wiki
22:34	VanessaE	no
22:34	VanessaE	but it's the same world.
22:34	khonkhortisan	well it looks like it
22:34	rubenwardy	cool marchingcubes demonstration: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d6_ZaoCfK0o
22:34	NakedFury	1,0You0,4Tube1,15 Mine Mars ( Marching Cubes ) Teaser 4 Infinite World Loading [2,15User1,15: johndavidfive] [2,15Views1,15: 1796] [3,1571,15] [4,1501,15] [2,15Time1,15: 00:02:361,15]
22:34	NakedFury	1,0You0,4Tube1,15 Mine Mars ( Marching Cubes ) Teaser 4 Infinite World Loading [2,15User1,15: johndavidfive] [2,15Views1,15: 1796] [3,1571,15] [4,1501,15] [2,15Time1,15: 00:02:361,15]
22:34	VanessaE	this one's taken with AF/MM/trilinear turned on, the other one is old
22:36	_2cool_	please stop naked
22:36	saschaheylik	its obviously automatic
22:37	_2cool_	Maybe he'll get banned
22:37	VanessaE	the interesting thing is that with these filtering settings turned on, the glass blocks lose their "streaks" as they get far enough away
22:37	saschaheylik	no
22:37	VanessaE	not sure how to prevent that.
22:37	saschaheylik	hm
22:38	rubenwardy	http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ojo2dFiLtao&feature=related
22:38	rubenwardy	that is cool
22:39	NakedFury	it is cool
22:39	rubenwardy	and i know unity, the game engine
22:41	saschaheylik	yeah that's pretty much what i'd like to achieve
22:42	rubenwardy	terriable texture though
22:42	saschaheylik	yes
22:43	leo_rockway	is there anything like on_hurtplayer ?
22:43	rubenwardy	http://forum.unity3d.com/threads/94224-Introducing-Voxelform-voxel-terrain-%28Marching-Cubes%29-with-real-time-deformation.
22:43	leo_rockway	I can't find anything like it in the Lua API.
22:44	leo_rockway	I looked for hurt, damage, harm, hit...
22:44	rubenwardy	it is just a generator though
22:44	rubenwardy	you could do an on_step that checks the last hp with the current one
22:45	khonkhortisan	event catching is better than check cycling
22:46	rubenwardy	is ther an on hurt even catch then?
22:46	khonkhortisan	dunno, but if there is, I don't think nodes would have it
22:47	rubenwardy	no, for player
22:49	khonkhortisan	doesn't look like it
22:50	leo_rockway	I wanted to add sounds for when the player gets hurt
22:50	leo_rockway	:S
22:50	khonkhortisan	If someone wants to make one it could be called on_hp_set(new_hp, old_hp)
22:50	VanessaE	leo_rockway: periodically check the player's hp (say 5x a second) and then play a sound if it drops by more than some value?
22:51	leo_rockway	eh... I guess
22:51	leo_rockway	I don't like having to constantly check...
22:51	leo_rockway	thank you, though
22:52	VanessaE	I know but if you're doing it at a low rate, it won't affect the game speed any
22:52	khonkhortisan	newhp = get_hp() if newhp ~= oldhp then if newhp < oldhp then play_hit_sound() else play_health_sound() end end oldhp = newhp
22:53	khonkhortisan	so don't do too much in your on_step or you'll have a delay
22:54	VanessaE	you might want to consider 3 or 4 different "hurt" sound effects, for varying levels of damage taken
22:54	VanessaE	e.g. a grunt, a louder groan, a yelp, a painful scream
22:54	VanessaE	sorta like in Quake/OpenArena
22:54	khonkhortisan	so get hurt twice really fast and break the mod
22:54	leo_rockway	VanessaE: I have 15
22:54	VanessaE	jeez
22:54	VanessaE	ok :-)
22:54	leo_rockway	I was just checking which one to keep
22:55	leo_rockway	http://opengameart.org/content/15-vocal-male-strainhurtpainjump-sounds <--- here
22:55	VanessaE	need female sounds also :-)
22:55	khonkhortisan	and you can customize your character to be a tough guy or to go ow. owowow! wAAAA! AIEEE!
22:55	leo_rockway	VanessaE: I was thinking that. The game should ask for gender maybe.
22:55	khonkhortisan	or to say oops or it's just a flesh wound
22:55	leo_rockway	and which hand the player uses >.<
22:55	_2cool_	http://minetest.net/forum/viewtopic.php?pid=39792#p39792
22:56	leo_rockway	it feels weird using my right hand to mine stuff o.o
22:56	khonkhortisan	it looks like the 31000 blocks is diameter
22:57	_2cool_	The minetest world is circular?
22:57	_2cool_	makes sense
22:57	khonkhortisan	>=31000 blocks every direction
22:57	khonkhortisan	it should render a curved horizon
22:58	_2cool_	so how about my forum topic?
22:58	_2cool_	be back sometime
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23:07		theTroy joined #minetest
23:10	Keegann	anyone know how to crash a server?
23:11	sdzen	why do you wanna know?
23:11	Keegann	cause o want to know
23:11	sdzen	request denied then
23:11	khonkhortisan	yes, with mesecons. Don't know if it works anymore.
23:13	Keegann	how do i get a hack client
23:13	rubenwardy	you make it your self
23:14	rubenwardy	wait, you are too stupid too
23:14	rubenwardy	*2nd too should be to
23:14	khonkhortisan	god mode/noclip are usually easy to do
23:22	rubenwardy	noclip?
23:23	khonkhortisan	when you fly through walls instead of flying into them, the term is usually used for when you are on the observer team
23:25	rubenwardy	ok
23:27	VanessaE	Keegann: I believe you've already been told "no" on this subject multiple times.
23:28		servvs joined #minetest
23:28	VanessaE	khonkhortisan: as far as I know, those server crashing issues with mesecons have already been worked out :-)
23:29	rubenwardy	I think there should be a feature in MT that tells the server weather your build is prebuilt or built by self. This would more easly identify hacked clients]
23:29	VanessaE	naw
23:29	VanessaE	I always build mine from source.
23:30	VanessaE	in fact, technically, I use a hacked client as well, since my copy contains a few changes to add anisotropic filtering and related stuff, as discussed before.
23:30	rubenwardy	it would at least identify the possibilties
23:32	khonkhortisan	bzflag has /clientquery which shows build date, os, and version. I always play with a self-compliled client, modified or not. In minetest, I haven't gotten into the game itself yet, but when I do, I'll probably also play modified.
23:40		NekoGloop joined #minetest
23:41	NekoGloop	Hello peeps
23:41	rubenwardy	hi
23:42	Keegann	hi
23:50	VanessaE	guys,
23:50	VanessaE	http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minetest
23:50	VanessaE	we need citations.
23:50	VanessaE	LOTS of them
23:50	VanessaE	valid ones that don't rely on anything from minetest.net, forums, etc.
23:50	VanessaE	SPAM the article with good citations please
23:51	VanessaE	also hit the page ratings at the bottom. set them all to 5 stars
23:52	VanessaE	let's show this guy who keeps claiming "might not be notable" what "notable" means
23:55	NekoGloop	I have a question though
23:55	rubenwardy	ok?
23:55	VanessaE	hm?
23:55	NekoGloop	Isnt minecraft's world truly infinite horizontally, unlike minetest?
23:56	NekoGloop	(actually my friends question i wanna prove him wrong)
23:56	rubenwardy	no
23:56	VanessaE	no
23:56	VanessaE	but it mayas well
23:56	NekoGloop	Oh?
23:56	VanessaE	it may as well be
23:56	rubenwardy	infinite worlds are impossible
23:56	VanessaE	it goes to like +/- 4 billion or so
23:56	NekoGloop	Ah i see
23:57	VanessaE	rubenwardy: I think he means as in a turing machine - infinite until you run out of memory/storage to keep it
23:57	rubenwardy	minetest is still 64 kilometres in each direction
23:57	NekoGloop	rubenwardy: Minetest could be adapted to allow that, although filesizes would be horrendous.
23:57	rubenwardy	yes
23:58	rubenwardy	smaller than minecrafts? because it uses minisql?
23:58	NekoGloop	I want that in next update :3
23:58	rubenwardy	see jordachs fork
23:58	NekoGloop	I have no ability to compile code
23:59	NekoGloop	His fork has infinite generation?

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