| Time |
Nick |
Message |
| 00:15 |
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twoelk|2 joined #minetest-hub |
| 00:23 |
Megaf |
Night folks |
| 00:37 |
Mr_Pardison |
gn everyone. |
| 00:38 |
Mr_Pardison |
cya tomorrow (I hope) |
| 00:38 |
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Mr_Pardison left #minetest-hub |
| 02:37 |
* benrob0329 |
uploaded an image: screenshot.png (584KB) <https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/KwbBPHzfzdKGMRJwpbidJPNy> |
| 03:11 |
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CalebDavis joined #minetest-hub |
| 03:59 |
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oOChainLynxOo joined #minetest-hub |
| 05:17 |
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ssieb joined #minetest-hub |
| 07:18 |
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nerzhul joined #minetest-hub |
| 08:33 |
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nerzhul joined #minetest-hub |
| 08:48 |
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CWz joined #minetest-hub |
| 08:51 |
jas_ |
holy cow! https://twitch.tv/jastvn |
| 09:13 |
sofar |
https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?&t=18862 |
| 09:15 |
* sofar |
goes to bed |
| 10:28 |
|
tenplus1 joined #minetest-hub |
| 10:29 |
tenplus1 |
hi folks |
| 10:48 |
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Megaf joined #minetest-hub |
| 10:50 |
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Fixer joined #minetest-hub |
| 10:54 |
tenplus1 |
hi fixer |
| 10:59 |
|
Megaf joined #minetest-hub |
| 10:59 |
tenplus1 |
wb Megaf |
| 11:01 |
VanessaE |
hi |
| 11:01 |
tenplus1 |
hi Vanessa |
| 11:02 |
Megaf |
Thanks tenplus1 |
| 11:02 |
Megaf |
Hi folks |
| 11:02 |
tenplus1 |
due to big demand I've added Hot Dogs to Xanadu... lololol |
| 11:02 |
Megaf |
hah |
| 11:03 |
Megaf |
tenplus1, on Megaf Server I did the opposite. I removed the subgame |
| 11:03 |
Megaf |
now the server has nothing, not even player model |
| 11:03 |
tenplus1 |
wow, minimalistic :P |
| 11:04 |
Megaf |
servers boots up in half secodn now |
| 11:05 |
tenplus1 |
blazin' :) if only you could play a ghost and float around server not doing anything :P |
| 11:06 |
Megaf |
I will be making a new subgame, that will be a nice mix of Xanadu and Minetest Game |
| 11:06 |
Megaf |
but I will try to make it small |
| 11:07 |
tenplus1 |
strangely xanadu is tiny in comparison to most servers |
| 11:55 |
tenplus1 |
hrm, seems I'm having .net issues |
| 12:07 |
Fixer |
oh, more ISP "innovation" is coming to USA, R.I.P. |
| 12:08 |
tenplus1 |
innovation ? is this about removing the internets free status |
| 12:09 |
Fixer |
yeah |
| 12:09 |
tenplus1 |
and before we know it you'll be paying for connection to certain things |
| 12:09 |
tenplus1 |
pah! |
| 12:09 |
Fixer |
yep |
| 12:10 |
Fixer |
but but this is modern and innovation and you are dinosaur |
| 12:10 |
tenplus1 |
lol |
| 12:10 |
tenplus1 |
the internet should remain free to all |
| 12:11 |
tenplus1 |
greedy corporations just want their cut |
| 12:32 |
|
Aerozoic joined #minetest-hub |
| 12:33 |
tenplus1 |
hi Aerozoic |
| 12:34 |
Aerozoic |
wazup tenplus1 |
| 12:34 |
tenplus1 |
enjoying coffee and watching "Justice League" |
| 12:34 |
Aerozoic |
welp, xubuntu 17.10 failed |
| 12:34 |
tenplus1 |
what happened ? |
| 12:34 |
Aerozoic |
everything, glitches and garbage everywhere |
| 12:35 |
Aerozoic |
16.04 works good though. |
| 12:35 |
tenplus1 |
graphical issue ? |
| 12:35 |
Aerozoic |
no graphics issues though, lol |
| 12:35 |
tenplus1 |
glad it works, wonder what happened to 1704 tho... |
| 12:47 |
tenplus1 |
you have intel gfx dont you ? |
| 12:47 |
|
Raven262 joined #minetest-hub |
| 12:48 |
tenplus1 |
hi raven |
| 12:48 |
Raven262 |
Hi tenplus1 |
| 13:06 |
Aerozoic |
Yep |
| 13:10 |
|
atorian37 joined #minetest-hub |
| 13:10 |
tenplus1 |
hi astorian |
| 13:11 |
atorian37 |
hi all |
| 13:11 |
atorian37 |
sorry had to identify first.. |
| 13:12 |
tenplus1 |
:P |
| 13:20 |
benrob0329 |
tenplus1: I dont really want the government in charge of the internet, just saying |
| 13:20 |
benrob0329 |
In other news, I fixed up the texture |
| 13:21 |
* benrob0329 |
uploaded an image: screenshot.png (584KB) <https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/iduJGEcJigOEOsVhjTgHtxjl> |
| 13:21 |
tenplus1 |
yeah, government should stay out of this |
| 13:22 |
tenplus1 |
saw forum page, nice :) |
| 13:23 |
benrob0329 |
NetNeut means the government shoves their hands into private companies' business, but unlike with telephones they arent paying for it |
| 13:23 |
behalebabo |
The government already has control of the internet to some extent, net neutrality ensures that ISPs don't *also* become monopolic governments controlling the internet. That's theoretically safer because the government is supposed to be controlled by the people |
| 13:24 |
tenplus1 |
exactly |
| 13:24 |
benrob0329 |
Supposed to be, but have you seen some political extremism lately? |
| 13:25 |
Raven262 |
benrob0329, I like the new texture better than the old one, though you could add some more detail to it. |
| 13:25 |
tenplus1 |
too many asshats in control |
| 13:25 |
benrob0329 |
I'm more scared for the next election |
| 13:25 |
tenplus1 |
looks good as it raven :D |
| 13:25 |
benrob0329 |
Raven262: problem is I'm trying to keep it at 16px |
| 13:26 |
Raven262 |
You don't need to raise the res |
| 13:27 |
Raven262 |
Just add some more wood-like texture over/under it |
| 13:27 |
Raven262 |
Hmm |
| 13:27 |
Raven262 |
Gotta try that. |
| 13:27 |
benrob0329 |
The trick would be to not crowd it |
| 13:31 |
benrob0329 |
Was I not clear in my lore issue when I said implied by things around the world? |
| 13:32 |
benrob0329 |
Because I would have thought that said "never actually say it, have things that hint at it" |
| 13:32 |
tenplus1 |
little clues all around |
| 13:33 |
benrob0329 |
Exactly |
| 13:33 |
benrob0329 |
Sometimes I wonder if people read or skim.... |
| 13:33 |
* benrob0329 |
sighs |
| 13:39 |
|
lisac joined #minetest-hub |
| 13:44 |
tenplus1 |
hi lisac |
| 13:44 |
lisac |
hey tenplus1 |
| 13:46 |
Raven262 |
benrob0329, I have managed to break the mapping somehow. But here is the result: https://i.imgur.com/0X2vTwj.png |
| 13:47 |
Raven262 |
Added some wood scheme under it. |
| 13:47 |
tenplus1 |
noice |
| 13:47 |
Raven262 |
(But the thing doesn't work) |
| 13:48 |
Raven262 |
I have no idea why, but the text doesn't appear on the model, neither does the light on top of it. |
| 13:50 |
tenplus1 |
hrm |
| 14:01 |
benrob0329 |
Raven262: is it possible that your editor removed the alpha channel? |
| 14:01 |
Raven262 |
I might have had. |
| 14:01 |
tenplus1 |
do you use GIMP ? |
| 14:01 |
Raven262 |
Multiple times actually |
| 14:01 |
Raven262 |
Yes |
| 14:01 |
benrob0329 |
That shouldnt have done it, but it might have |
| 14:04 |
benrob0329 |
Basically delete the white and black pixels |
| 14:15 |
Raven262 |
I don't get it. |
| 14:16 |
benrob0329 |
Wait, the lamp was white and black...oops |
| 14:17 |
tenplus1 |
brb |
| 14:17 |
|
tenplus1 left #minetest-hub |
| 14:22 |
|
sniper570 joined #minetest-hub |
| 14:42 |
|
Megaf joined #minetest-hub |
| 14:43 |
|
tenplus1 joined #minetest-hub |
| 14:43 |
tenplus1 |
I ish back |
| 14:45 |
tenplus1 |
did you get the texture working ok raven ? |
| 14:47 |
Megaf |
Hi again |
| 14:47 |
tenplus1 |
o/ |
| 14:47 |
Megaf |
welcome back tenplus1 |
| 14:48 |
tenplus1 |
did I miss anything ? :P |
| 14:48 |
Megaf |
I dont know, we joined together |
| 14:48 |
tenplus1 |
ehehe |
| 14:48 |
Megaf |
You joined just a minute after myself |
| 14:48 |
Megaf |
and before the electricity breaker disarmed so I had no internet |
| 14:48 |
Megaf |
I'm in college now |
| 14:49 |
tenplus1 |
ooh, work time :) enjoy |
| 14:49 |
Megaf[College] |
10 minutes to start the class |
| 14:49 |
Megaf[College] |
classroom still pretty empty... |
| 14:49 |
tenplus1 |
they shoudl offer free donuts, am sure class would be packed then |
| 14:49 |
Megaf[College] |
And I just got another bottle of wine by the way |
| 14:50 |
Megaf[College] |
tenplus1, +1 for that |
| 14:50 |
Megaf[College] |
I wonder why Windows 7 installer takes so long to load |
| 14:51 |
tenplus1 |
cause windows sucks |
| 14:51 |
Megaf[College] |
hm, there's no activity in the cdrom, maybe the thing just froze |
| 14:51 |
Megaf[College] |
imagine that, windows freezing |
| 14:51 |
Megaf[College] |
have you ever heard of such thing? |
| 14:51 |
tenplus1 |
it can happen when a driver doesnt load properly |
| 14:52 |
tenplus1 |
you could also disable UEFI in bios which may help |
| 14:52 |
Megaf[College] |
it is disabled |
| 14:53 |
Megaf[College] |
will enabled it to see if it works |
| 14:53 |
tenplus1 |
also unplug any non-essential components like usb card readers etc. |
| 14:54 |
tenplus1 |
IDE mode usually works better than AHCI mode also in bios |
| 15:00 |
Megaf[College] |
tenplus1, eh, virtualbox :) |
| 15:01 |
Megaf[College] |
do you really think I'd install windows on my machine? :P |
| 15:01 |
tenplus1 |
ooh, vbox.. gotcha |
| 15:04 |
Megaf[College] |
And this is Windows 7 Enterprise Edition |
| 15:05 |
|
ThomasMonroe joined #minetest-hub |
| 15:05 |
Megaf[College] |
Lets see if creators edition installer works |
| 15:06 |
Megaf[College] |
Nope, |
| 15:06 |
Wayward_One |
any forum mods, this needs immediate removal: https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?f=42&t=18863 |
| 15:06 |
ThomasMonroe |
hey Megaf[College] |
| 15:06 |
tenplus1 |
hi thomas |
| 15:06 |
Megaf[College] |
ah, I think it is working |
| 15:06 |
tenplus1 |
hi wayward |
| 15:06 |
ThomasMonroe |
hey tenplus1 |
| 15:06 |
Megaf[College] |
CPU use is quite high at least |
| 15:06 |
Wayward_One |
hello :) |
| 15:06 |
Megaf[College] |
Hi ThomasMonroe |
| 15:07 |
tenplus1 |
wth is that... are ppl using mt forums for dating ? |
| 15:07 |
Megaf[College] |
I'm sorry for these people |
| 15:07 |
Megaf[College] |
that's very sad |
| 15:08 |
Megaf[College] |
IRC is so much better for that |
| 15:08 |
Megaf[College] |
xP |
| 15:08 |
ThomasMonroe |
lol |
| 15:10 |
rubenwardy |
Wayward_One, on it |
| 15:10 |
tenplus1 |
hi ruben |
| 15:10 |
Wayward_One |
cool, thanks |
| 15:10 |
rubenwardy |
hey |
| 15:10 |
rubenwardy |
done |
| 15:11 |
Wayward_One |
random ads are one thing, but that.. |
| 15:11 |
rubenwardy |
I'm at work, so didn't click on the image links |
| 15:11 |
rubenwardy |
I don't imagine it was SFW |
| 15:11 |
tenplus1 |
why do ppl do this. in a game forum of all things |
| 15:12 |
rubenwardy |
bot |
| 15:13 |
tenplus1 |
when posting to forums is it possible to add the "not a robot" button or tick? |
| 15:13 |
Megaf[College] |
I'm sure there is a mod for that |
| 15:14 |
tenplus1 |
https://www.newgrounds.com/portal/view/701437 |
| 15:16 |
|
CalebDavis joined #minetest-hub |
| 15:16 |
tenplus1 |
hi caleb |
| 15:17 |
CalebDavis |
hi ten |
| 15:17 |
Megaf[College] |
so, Windows 7 installer still hasnt come up. And there's one core been using to 100% by the installer boot... |
| 15:18 |
|
Jordach joined #minetest-hub |
| 15:18 |
tenplus1 |
hi Jordach |
| 15:18 |
tenplus1 |
how much memory did you assign vm ? |
| 15:19 |
Jordach |
uwot |
| 15:20 |
tenplus1 |
sorry, that was for megaf :P |
| 15:20 |
Shara |
Hello all |
| 15:20 |
tenplus1 |
hey Shara |
| 15:20 |
ThomasMonroe |
hey Shara |
| 15:23 |
CalebDavis |
hi Shara |
| 15:24 |
Megaf[College] |
Hi Jordach |
| 15:24 |
Megaf[College] |
Hi celeron55 |
| 15:24 |
Megaf[College] |
tenplus1, 2G |
| 15:26 |
Megaf[College] |
that's a computer I'd have https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Chassis-plans-mp3x17-fnt-obl-open-1280.jpg |
| 15:26 |
tenplus1 |
2g is enough... hrm, did you set the network adaptor to "bridged" ? |
| 15:26 |
Megaf[College] |
tenplus1, I left the cable unplugged |
| 15:27 |
ThomasMonroe |
that would be really cool Megaf[College] |
| 15:27 |
Calinou |
hi |
| 15:27 |
Megaf[College] |
but I don't think that would prevent the installer from coming up |
| 15:27 |
tenplus1 |
hi Cal |
| 15:27 |
ThomasMonroe |
hey Calinou, I broke 1100 in Classical today |
| 15:27 |
Megaf[College] |
This one is quite cool too https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Chassis-plans-mp1x20a_fnt_obl-1280.jpg |
| 15:27 |
Calinou |
in which way? :P |
| 15:27 |
ThomasMonroe |
lol upwards |
| 15:27 |
tenplus1 |
ooh, nice |
| 15:28 |
ThomasMonroe |
I got 18th in the U1500 classical |
| 15:28 |
Megaf[College] |
(I'm reading this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Portable_computer) (<- Related to our class right now) |
| 15:28 |
Calinou |
Minetest on PDAs when? |
| 15:29 |
ThomasMonroe |
Megaf[College], I'm on a Panasonic CF-29 ToughBook right now :) |
| 15:29 |
Megaf[College] |
oh boy |
| 15:29 |
Megaf[College] |
that's a nice one |
| 15:30 |
ThomasMonroe |
yeah, only 1.5gb of ram, but I make it work |
| 15:31 |
Megaf[College] |
I will just wait it out. This installer |
| 15:31 |
tenplus1 |
is the dvd you are isntalling from ok ? |
| 15:34 |
Megaf[College] |
I hope so |
| 15:34 |
Megaf[College] |
I got it with axel download manager |
| 15:34 |
Megaf[College] |
it ususally works well |
| 15:34 |
Megaf[College] |
This site https://www.microsoft.com/en-ca/software-download/windows7 is not accepting my keys... |
| 15:35 |
Megaf[College] |
(I have original keys) |
| 15:38 |
jas_ |
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8JUSPIKoxO0 <-- mese music |
| 15:42 |
jas_ |
https://gist.github.com/jastevenson303/ab9e1054d1616e6414fe3b5f2d137b6f |
| 15:52 |
|
nerzhul joined #minetest-hub |
| 15:52 |
tenplus1 |
who is in control of CSM part of minetest just now ??? |
| 15:52 |
tenplus1 |
nb nrz |
| 15:52 |
tenplus1 |
*wb |
| 15:53 |
benrob0329 |
jas_: the Orkkis have found you, there is no place to hide :P |
| 15:54 |
* Shara |
suspects it's simply out of control |
| 16:04 |
benrob0329 |
Hi Shara |
| 16:05 |
Shara |
Hi benrob0329 |
| 16:05 |
Raven262 |
Hi Shara |
| 16:05 |
Shara |
Hello Raven |
| 16:07 |
benrob0329 |
That could be a cool mechanic though |
| 16:07 |
benrob0329 |
Orkkis only come after you if you have Mese (or punch it) |
| 16:08 |
benrob0329 |
Otherwise they hide in the shadows |
| 16:08 |
Shara |
Maybe focus should be getting mobs into MTG first? :P |
| 16:09 |
Raven262 |
Nha, we can do this without them. |
| 16:09 |
Raven262 |
*mah |
| 16:09 |
Raven262 |
*nah |
| 16:09 |
Raven262 |
Well |
| 16:09 |
benrob0329 |
Shara: but we need to make those mobs interesting :D |
| 16:09 |
Raven262 |
Isn't that sad. |
| 16:09 |
Shara |
Raven262: :D |
| 16:10 |
benrob0329 |
If they do decide to come after you, run, split, leave |
| 16:10 |
benrob0329 |
Do not turn back |
| 16:10 |
Shara |
Let's change it to: The mystery of why there are no more orkkis |
| 16:10 |
Raven262 |
We do need to add some sort of lore. |
| 16:10 |
tenplus1 |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/6662 |
| 16:10 |
Raven262 |
But I don't know if there is any successful open source game that has lore. |
| 16:12 |
Shara |
Lore done poorly is bad |
| 16:12 |
Shara |
And I'm honestly scared this would be done terribly |
| 16:12 |
Shara |
But I dont really expect anyone to agree with me |
| 16:13 |
Raven262 |
Yea, a team needs to be formed for this. Its quite important. |
| 16:13 |
Raven262 |
If we have ~12 people working on it, it could be done pretty nicely in a few meetings. |
| 16:16 |
benrob0329 |
Shara: I would like to avoid overdone, or underdone lore |
| 16:17 |
* shivajiva |
wonders if CSM stands for CheatServersMore |
| 16:17 |
tenplus1 |
brb, foody time :D |
| 16:17 |
tenplus1 |
ehehe, nice one shiva :P |
| 16:17 |
Raven262 |
Cheat System Module. |
| 16:17 |
Shara |
Lol shivajiva, it's been that in my head for a while |
| 16:18 |
benrob0329 |
Right now I'm just trying to get people onboard with the idea on lore guiding MTG's development |
| 16:18 |
Shara |
benrob0329: do you have any experience of implementing lore / worldbuilding into a game? |
| 16:18 |
benrob0329 |
Shara: a better question would be, do I have any experience making a game at all |
| 16:19 |
Raven262 |
We can assemble a team and vote for ideas. |
| 16:19 |
Raven262 |
Takes time, but the result is much better. |
| 16:19 |
benrob0329 |
The answer is no, which is why I'm trying to help with an existing project rather than do everything on my own |
| 16:19 |
Shara |
Well, good luck |
| 16:20 |
Shara |
But until I see actual answers to the things I asked, I'm totally against it |
| 16:20 |
benrob0329 |
I have done a fair amount of research into game design, however. But probably not nearly enough |
| 16:20 |
Shara |
Not against lore being in games that come with MT; but against it in MTG |
| 16:20 |
benrob0329 |
Shara: how can I answer a question to which there is no answer? |
| 16:21 |
Shara |
If there is no answer, what you want cant ever happen anyway |
| 16:21 |
benrob0329 |
"How do we prevent ___" by not doing that |
| 16:21 |
Shara |
No |
| 16:21 |
Shara |
I want to know the mechanics this will add, what it will do to gameplay and so on |
| 16:21 |
Shara |
How will it appear in game |
| 16:21 |
Shara |
What will be used |
| 16:21 |
Shara |
If it cant be planned into a full idea, it cant be done |
| 16:22 |
benrob0329 |
Shara: half the things I have in mind are already in the long-term plan, this isn't a one-pr idea, this is a change in how mechanics are made |
| 16:22 |
Raven262 |
Too many devs might refuse the idea completely. |
| 16:23 |
Raven262 |
Because it needs new mechanics and so on. |
| 16:24 |
benrob0329 |
I'm trying to get past the "this cant be done in MTG" so that we can get to the "how will this look in-game" |
| 16:24 |
|
oOChainLynxOo joined #minetest-hub |
| 16:25 |
tenplus1 |
hi chainlynx |
| 16:25 |
benrob0329 |
I can stab at ideas and concepts, but for what when its still unsure whether or not anything like this will be accepted? |
| 16:25 |
Shara |
You need to get the devs talking really |
| 16:25 |
benrob0329 |
The biggest question is, will MTG stay completely generic? |
| 16:26 |
Shara |
And given how many issues there are (..that thing called CSM to begin with)... I doubt any of them have time for this. |
| 16:26 |
benrob0329 |
If not, how can we cement some depth into it, without getting in the wat of it being a sandbox? |
| 16:26 |
benrob0329 |
*way |
| 16:26 |
Shara |
I'd much rather see mobs get added and see if there is a way to make it so you cant basically skip straight to diamond tools, so progrewssion starts getting built into the mechanics |
| 16:27 |
Shara |
progression* |
| 16:27 |
benrob0329 |
MTG needs a dedicated team imo |
| 16:27 |
Shara |
It has one |
| 16:27 |
tenplus1 |
we need iron tools and a progression from iron, copper, steel etc |
| 16:27 |
Shara |
They are just basically inactive other than paramat |
| 16:27 |
Shara |
And the structure of MT development means only core devs are currently able to be MTG devs |
| 16:28 |
Shara |
But even if that changed, who (other than Ten) has submitted enough content to be considered anyway? |
| 16:28 |
Raven262 |
So there needs to be another team for MTG development? |
| 16:28 |
Raven262 |
That should be considered. |
| 16:28 |
Shara |
FOr the devs to decide, not us |
| 16:28 |
Calinou |
<Raven262> But I don't know if there is any successful open source game that has lore. |
| 16:28 |
benrob0329 |
But how can you plan mobs or progression when nothing has reason. How do you impliment that which has no idea? |
| 16:28 |
Calinou |
Sauerbraten does have "You kill stuff. The end." |
| 16:28 |
Calinou |
:P |
| 16:28 |
|
Krock joined #minetest-hub |
| 16:28 |
Raven262 |
I know, Calinou, I played it xD |
| 16:29 |
Calinou |
also, I knew this lore discussion would turn into a shitstorm :) |
| 16:29 |
tenplus1 |
hey Krock |
| 16:29 |
Shara |
benrob0329: plenty of games dont really have stories inbuilt |
| 16:29 |
Calinou |
I've never seen a discussion about this where people actually get to a consensus |
| 16:29 |
Krock |
hi tenplus1 |
| 16:29 |
Raven262 |
Hi Krock, Calinou |
| 16:29 |
benrob0329 |
("Add mobs" is not an idea) |
| 16:29 |
Krock |
hi Raven262, Calinou |
| 16:29 |
rubenwardy |
Shara, not true |
| 16:29 |
benrob0329 |
Hi Krock, Calinou |
| 16:30 |
Krock |
hi benrob0329 |
| 16:30 |
rubenwardy |
someone can be a MTG dev without being a core dev |
| 16:30 |
rubenwardy |
just no one is |
| 16:30 |
benrob0329 |
Krock: side note, improved tardis texture |
| 16:31 |
benrob0329 |
Big question, will Minetest Game stay generic? |
| 16:31 |
rubenwardy |
I hope not |
| 16:31 |
benrob0329 |
Once we answer that, we can plan depth and mechanics |
| 16:31 |
rubenwardy |
generic means that it satisfies no-one, and scares away new players |
| 16:32 |
tenplus1 |
apart from needing progression in the game itself we need something for the player to STRIVE towards |
| 16:32 |
rubenwardy |
I'd rather have a good default game which leads to people wanting to mod it |
| 16:32 |
rubenwardy |
we need more default games too :D |
| 16:32 |
Aerozoic |
Simulators have no progression :) |
| 16:33 |
benrob0329 |
But until we answer that, I can't get Shara onboard, because I can't plan this out. |
| 16:33 |
Shara |
Itäs true for now |
| 16:33 |
Shara |
It's* |
| 16:34 |
benrob0329 |
And if I can't plan this out, core devs probably wont like it |
| 16:34 |
CalebDavis |
Tre and I were talking a few days ago about my subgame Athermensia Survival and we had a really good idea for a endgame for singleplayer |
| 16:34 |
benrob0329 |
MTG needs to be suitable for multiplayer as well :-) |
| 16:34 |
Aerozoic |
Kill the dragon? lol jk :P |
| 16:34 |
CalebDavis |
after so long an alien from the planet of Mese attacks |
| 16:35 |
CalebDavis |
he is known ad the Meseian |
| 16:35 |
Shara |
benrob0329: the lucky thing is that you dont need me on board |
| 16:35 |
CalebDavis |
and in order to kill him toy have to find his relay post and teleport into his ship |
| 16:35 |
rubenwardy |
I think that lore books is hard to do well, so it's better to have mechanics that match the "history" and not have to spell it out |
| 16:36 |
Shara |
Just regardless of whether I agree with you, please make sure it is done properly or not at all |
| 16:36 |
benrob0329 |
rubenwardy: no lore books, lire books are bad |
| 16:37 |
rubenwardy |
good then :D |
| 16:37 |
Shara |
I'd be completly for unexplained ruins found on hills and dungeons with more content |
| 16:37 |
rubenwardy |
the main person you'd have to persuade is paramat |
| 16:37 |
Shara |
My issue is when you try to explain them |
| 16:37 |
rubenwardy |
as well as getting the community on board |
| 16:37 |
CalebDavis |
ohh and shpiwrecks at the botom of the sea would be cool |
| 16:38 |
Shara |
And rubenwardy: if that is the case about MTG, maybe you should get the other MTG devs together to reassess membership of that team then |
| 16:38 |
tenplus1 |
lol, you seen the new update to mc... ehehe |
| 16:38 |
benrob0329 |
Shara: yes, the explination is to guide what should be in the ruins |
| 16:38 |
CalebDavis |
yep :) |
| 16:43 |
benrob0329 |
Shara: commented, realling waiting for that to be answered first by MTG devs. |
| 16:44 |
benrob0329 |
Then I can put together some concept mechanics. |
| 16:44 |
Fixer |
,_, |
| 16:44 |
Shara |
It's quite a silly question, and rubenwardy already answered I think? |
| 16:44 |
tenplus1 |
.__. |
| 16:45 |
Shara |
also I've known people to disagree about what generic even means |
| 16:45 |
rubenwardy |
all the stuff has been rather vague so far, as to what lore actually means for game content |
| 16:45 |
rubenwardy |
and what can be done now when we don't have mobs yet |
| 16:45 |
Shara |
Yup, that's my issue |
| 16:45 |
tenplus1 |
I did like the oerkki and mese lore |
| 16:45 |
rubenwardy |
It's also worth noting that I've always been very much on the side of MTG being a full game |
| 16:46 |
rubenwardy |
whereas other devs are more conservative |
| 16:46 |
benrob0329 |
rubenwardy: what do we have? The environment |
| 16:46 |
Shara |
tenplus1: that may as well be a fanfic ont he forums unless it does something for the game itself though |
| 16:46 |
tenplus1 |
true, we need a proper game to make lore for... not just a base game |
| 16:46 |
benrob0329 |
What can add? Better ruins, better ore mechanics |
| 16:46 |
Shara |
That's why I am going to make a game |
| 16:46 |
Shara |
benrob0329: they dont need your lore though |
| 16:48 |
benrob0329 |
They dont need anything I make, I'm just trying to help. |
| 16:48 |
Shara |
Just shifting mz meaning now |
| 16:48 |
Shara |
mz* |
| 16:48 |
Shara |
Those mechanics do not need lore in order to be implemented |
| 16:49 |
benrob0329 |
No, but a reason helps |
| 16:49 |
benrob0329 |
Why do they exist? Idk, they just do. |
| 16:51 |
Shara |
Like my first reply in the issue said, lets just have a way to turn it off please |
| 16:51 |
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| 16:51 |
CalebDavis |
i think it would be nice to duplicate the MTG repo as it is and remove the MTG specific things and make that a subgame base so subgame creators dont have to start from scratch and then make MTG into a fully fleshed out game |
| 16:52 |
Shara |
subgame makers should start from scratch though |
| 16:52 |
benrob0329 |
Shara: and like my reply it should be easy to customize MTG |
| 16:52 |
benrob0329 |
Remove this mod, tweak that code, etc |
| 16:52 |
benrob0329 |
But by default there should be something |
| 16:52 |
Shara |
To the point where updating MTG becomes a really chore, I guess |
| 16:53 |
Shara |
So we may as well add proper options for everything to be customised to the wish list |
| 16:53 |
benrob0329 |
That isnt a bad idea |
| 16:53 |
CalebDavis |
true but some things that MTG does need to be in every "normal" subgame so it would be nice to have those features easily accesible |
| 16:53 |
Shara |
Yup, but getting it aded is the issue |
| 16:54 |
benrob0329 |
Anyways, I'll be off and on for the rest of the day |
| 16:57 |
tenplus1 |
I've said it before and I'll say it again... it would be awesome if we had a GAMES tab to browse through available games and download.install them for play |
| 16:58 |
Shara |
Yup |
| 16:59 |
benrob0329 |
Shara: but if all else fails, I'll just go back to making the occasional mod and video |
| 17:02 |
CalebDavis |
same thing would be good with mods ten ik that there is a mod installer for android but it would be nice in-game |
| 17:03 |
tenplus1 |
at one point it WAS in game, but removed |
| 17:04 |
CalebDavis |
ik i think that it was removed due to security issues |
| 17:04 |
Shara |
why was it removed? was it due to no way to quality check mods? |
| 17:05 |
rubenwardy |
nope |
| 17:05 |
rubenwardy |
it wasn't security issues |
| 17:05 |
CalebDavis |
then why? |
| 17:06 |
rubenwardy |
it was because originally the backend was hosted by est31 along with the forum |
| 17:06 |
rubenwardy |
then it broke and est31 couldn't be bothered to fix it |
| 17:06 |
CalebDavis |
ohh ok |
| 17:06 |
rubenwardy |
after a few months celeron55 took over hosting the forums |
| 17:06 |
rubenwardy |
and never set it up again as it was broken for months |
| 17:06 |
rubenwardy |
doesn't help that the original developer has disappeared |
| 17:07 |
rubenwardy |
and the code isn't great |
| 17:07 |
Shara |
Easy access to more content would make the game experience much better |
| 17:07 |
rubenwardy |
yes |
| 17:07 |
Shara |
But I would worry about the quality of what was made available too |
| 17:07 |
CalebDavis |
ok so it really needs a complete rewrite |
| 17:07 |
tenplus1 |
especially for tablet decives or phones where you cant install mods/games that easily |
| 17:07 |
rubenwardy |
it's in my top list of problems Minetest has |
| 17:08 |
Shara |
But a list of hundreds of mods of unknown quality wont help anyone |
| 17:08 |
rubenwardy |
Categories and download counting |
| 17:08 |
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| 17:08 |
tenplus1 |
hi fussel |
| 17:08 |
CalebDavis |
it would be nice to use krocks website as a list since it has ratings |
| 17:09 |
Shara |
But how much do they really tell? |
| 17:10 |
benrob0329 |
If we only list mods in releases, then they will have been checked by a moderator |
| 17:10 |
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| 17:10 |
benrob0329 |
If they dont work and arent fixed, they get put into old mods |
| 17:10 |
tenplus1 |
wb Megaf |
| 17:10 |
Shara |
I think they dont really check much beyond whether all the information required is in the post though? |
| 17:10 |
CalebDavis |
they tell how many likes/dislikes the mod has so it liking/disliking the mod was in the game then it would work nicely as a rating system |
| 17:11 |
rubenwardy |
CalebDavis, mine is better |
| 17:11 |
IhrFussel |
Hi guys^^ Anyone got a clue why the sliding doors from this file don't take away 1 from the stack when you place them? https://pastebin.com/iBr6fLcH |
| 17:11 |
rubenwardy |
as it validates mods |
| 17:11 |
CalebDavis |
ahh ok |
| 17:11 |
tenplus1 |
yeah, we do need a mod list with like/dislikes visible and comments |
| 17:11 |
Shara |
CalebDavis: last I checked, nont a single one of my mods has any ratings on Krock's list, despite being used on quite a few servers :D |
| 17:11 |
tenplus1 |
lol, I havent even seen krocks list yet :D |
| 17:11 |
rubenwardy |
but it's still not good |
| 17:12 |
rubenwardy |
as there's not enough validation still |
| 17:12 |
rubenwardy |
really it needs to be a full system with a fixed database |
| 17:12 |
Shara |
I like rubenwardy's system, but yea... I just worry a bit about the client actually providing content that hasnt been reviewed a bit more carefully |
| 17:12 |
CalebDavis |
Irh you need to return the itemstack in the on place function |
| 17:12 |
rubenwardy |
my app uses my backend anyway, and it works reasonably well |
| 17:13 |
rubenwardy |
Web UI is mostly only for debugging minetest-mods.rubenwardy.com |
| 17:13 |
Megaf |
Thanks |
| 17:17 |
IhrFussel |
CalebDavis, thanks I'll try that...do I need to add itemstack:take_item() return itemstack or just return itemstack? |
| 17:17 |
Megaf |
sfan5, I just dont see the point in flooding the terminal/debug with messages that dont have any meaning. |
| 17:18 |
Megaf |
If you dont know the modname it doesnt have any value |
| 17:18 |
Megaf |
Is it that difficult to just make the message say the modname by default? |
| 17:18 |
Megaf |
In the circumstances where the message is showed? |
| 17:19 |
Megaf |
Man, I am really unhappy with Minetest right now |
| 17:19 |
Megaf |
That's the lowest we got in 6 years |
| 17:20 |
tenplus1 |
I had same issue with serialize.h errors and no way to track what mod is causing it or a line number |
| 17:20 |
Megaf |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/6654 |
| 17:22 |
Megaf |
You know that drop of water that makes the bucket overflow? |
| 17:23 |
Shara |
Don't need a drop when we have CSM :) |
| 17:23 |
Megaf |
CSM? |
| 17:23 |
CalebDavis |
Ihr you will need to take an item from the Itemstack in order to not return the same ammount that you started with |
| 17:24 |
rubenwardy |
Megaf, I believe you'd have to manually parse the backstack on that to find the mod name |
| 17:24 |
rubenwardy |
not impossible. Depends on whether there's just one place the deprecation notice is printed |
| 17:24 |
rubenwardy |
the --info will be more useful as it prints a back stack showing the file and line number |
| 17:24 |
Shara |
Megaf: Check the issue tenplus1 opened |
| 17:25 |
Shara |
On a train so would take forever to get a link :D |
| 17:25 |
tenplus1 |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/6662 |
| 17:36 |
Fixer |
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DPNn1RpVQAAahyV.jpg:large |
| 17:36 |
tenplus1 |
master photoshop skillz ;P |
| 17:44 |
Megaf |
home, be back later |
| 17:44 |
sfan5 |
Megaf: it's not difficult |
| 17:44 |
sfan5 |
... |
| 17:53 |
Calinou |
Fixer: I saw the top-left montage on @doom_txt on Twitter :P |
| 18:00 |
sofar |
https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=18862&p=300998#p300998 - has code now as well |
| 18:00 |
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| 18:03 |
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| 18:18 |
benrob0329 |
sofar: did you have cinematic on for that video? |
| 18:18 |
sofar |
yes, to smooth the mouse movement |
| 18:18 |
sofar |
but I used something else too |
| 18:19 |
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| 18:22 |
benrob0329 |
sofar: might need to turn the smoothing up a bit more if your going to turn, it was still a bit jerky :-) |
| 18:25 |
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| 18:29 |
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| 18:31 |
sofar |
benrob0329: that's just me |
| 18:34 |
Jordach |
lmao |
| 19:07 |
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| 19:08 |
Krock |
rubenwardy -who-is-currently-marked-as-away, something like this? https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/6665/commits/77fd67e6 |
| 19:09 |
Krock |
or did you have another sorting in mind? |
| 19:10 |
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| 19:14 |
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| 19:14 |
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bwarden joined #minetest-hub |
| 19:31 |
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| 19:33 |
Shara |
I really hate how f5 info displays in 0.5. Why does it need three lines? |
| 19:34 |
CWz |
yes |
| 19:34 |
Mr_Pardison |
because someone thought that 3 would be a nice number of lines to show? |
| 19:34 |
Shara |
What is the use in param2 displaying and why drop lots of pointless brakcets round things? |
| 19:34 |
Shara |
brackets* |
| 19:34 |
Shara |
and seed no longer shows... huge problem |
| 19:34 |
CWz |
i wouldn't say huge |
| 19:35 |
Shara |
actually, seed displaying once upon a time saved me from losing a whole map, but I rather not go into the details of that |
| 19:35 |
jas_ |
i made a hud elem for coords, that's how much i dislike having to even press F5, let alone the number of lines it takes up. |
| 19:35 |
Shara |
There is no reason at all for it to need three |
| 19:35 |
jas_ |
that's okay, at least it doesn't say minetest-version in upper-left anymore lol |
| 19:36 |
jas_ |
https://i.imgur.com/eaA2jJz.png |
| 19:36 |
Shara |
Seems to show version for me |
| 19:37 |
Shara |
I used to find f5 really helpful.. now it is just annoying |
| 19:38 |
Mr_Pardison |
reminds me of "Just Want You Gone" from Portal |
| 19:38 |
Mr_Pardison |
can't remember if it's 1 or 2. |
| 19:38 |
Shara |
No, that's my themesong for CSM |
| 19:39 |
Mr_Pardison |
very fitting. |
| 19:39 |
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| 19:40 |
Megaf |
back |
| 19:40 |
* benrob0329 |
thinks an actual compas with directions would be useful |
| 19:40 |
benrob0329 |
Or an axis |
| 19:40 |
jas_ |
yes |
| 19:40 |
jas_ |
that's the next phase |
| 19:40 |
Megaf |
I decided to go to college and come back from on foot. Because better for health |
| 19:40 |
Mr_Pardison |
wb Megaf |
| 19:40 |
jas_ |
coords and then a compass image instead of the numbers. first to make the numbers more accurate |
| 19:40 |
Mr_Pardison |
or you can do a whereis on yourself. |
| 19:41 |
Megaf |
whereis in Minetest |
| 19:41 |
Megaf |
? |
| 19:41 |
Mr_Pardison |
if that would be possible. |
| 19:41 |
Megaf |
we have a compass |
| 19:41 |
Mr_Pardison |
asking the server where you or a player is at. |
| 19:41 |
Megaf |
different types of it |
| 19:42 |
jas_ |
i have it so it displays on when wielding the walkie talkie. next i'll make it show a waypoint for last place of death. |
| 19:42 |
Megaf |
on my server we have one that tells your coords and where north, south east and west are |
| 19:42 |
Mr_Pardison |
g2g will brb going to library |
| 19:42 |
Mr_Pardison |
cya in a bit |
| 19:42 |
jas_ |
it's nice to have in-game mechanisms, versus f5 which is better for other stuff |
| 19:42 |
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| 19:42 |
jas_ |
imo |
| 19:43 |
Megaf |
man Im tired, will be back later |
| 19:43 |
Megaf |
cya |
| 19:43 |
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| 19:43 |
Shara |
Well, the things I used f5 for are now impossible, other than position, which is less readable than before |
| 19:43 |
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| 19:44 |
jas_ |
what i'm interested in is whether one can hide the hotbar and statbars and show only the wieldhand |
| 19:45 |
Shara |
Don't know, but now I think I need to find a way to make a mod to add the info I actually want... assuming it can all be captured |
| 19:45 |
benrob0329 |
jas_: redefine the HUD? |
| 19:45 |
jas_ |
there's hud flags for minimap, wieldhand, crosshair... i'm not sure, i'll experiment, but i think it's all or nothing |
| 19:47 |
jas_ |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/blob/master/doc/lua_api.txt#L3632 <-- looks like it's possible |
| 19:48 |
Shara |
paramat had agreed with me when I requested seed be left in |
| 19:51 |
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| 19:55 |
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| 19:59 |
garywhite |
I have to agree, the position and node you are looking at are harder to read in the dev build |
| 20:00 |
Mr_Pardison |
same. |
| 20:00 |
Shara |
Hmm, so seed is there now I restarted.. I dont know if it was linked to some priv now or something, (it doesnt seem to be) but that was weird |
| 20:37 |
Fixer |
existentional crysis in chat |
| 20:39 |
Mr_Pardison |
IRL crisis: library closes early and have to walk wearing slippers in the cold to a bagel house nearby. |
| 20:40 |
Mr_Pardison |
I knew I should have taken a few minutes to put on shoes. |
| 20:40 |
Mr_Pardison |
sister offered to drive me over to the library and was kinda rushing me. |
| 20:40 |
benrob0329 |
Mr_Pardison: how cold? |
| 20:41 |
benrob0329 |
Most slippers are pretty warm |
| 20:41 |
Mr_Pardison |
these are Scott's brand slippers. |
| 20:41 |
Mr_Pardison |
not the warm kind. |
| 20:41 |
Mr_Pardison |
64 degrees. |
| 20:41 |
Mr_Pardison |
I haven't checked the wind yet. |
| 20:45 |
IhrFussel |
I implemented the coords as command HUD since many users don't have F5/debug menu cause they play on clone apps that remove the button |
| 20:46 |
Mr_Pardison |
PC master race. |
| 20:47 |
IhrFussel |
I also implemented "server-side fly" because clone apps let users PAY real money to unlock client-side fly |
| 20:48 |
IhrFussel |
Unfortunately there's nothing I can do to help them with ads |
| 20:49 |
Mr_Pardison |
yell at them to get the official game client? |
| 20:49 |
Mr_Pardison |
sad thing is they r 2 lazy to do so. |
| 20:49 |
IhrFussel |
And I'm not talking about those banner ads on top/bottom of the screen... I'm talking about unskippable videos that have a duration of 20-30 secs |
| 20:49 |
benrob0329 |
Mr_Pardison: F or C? |
| 20:49 |
Mr_Pardison |
F |
| 20:50 |
benrob0329 |
LOL |
| 20:51 |
benrob0329 |
64 aint even remotely cold, no offence |
| 20:51 |
Mr_Pardison |
windy outside. |
| 20:51 |
Mr_Pardison |
and where I live I'm used to hot weather. |
| 20:51 |
IhrFussel |
Mr_Pardison, it's not that easy... 1. the official app is a DESASTER like really... the core devs even stated they won't release 0.5.0 before the Android app got improved ... 2. The official app has a very bad rating and is just not as high as the cloen ones for some reason |
| 20:51 |
Mr_Pardison |
cold isn't for me. |
| 20:51 |
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| 20:52 |
Mr_Pardison |
that sucks. |
| 20:52 |
IhrFussel |
I mean the Android app is playable...but the controls and UI design in general are terribad |
| 20:52 |
benrob0329 |
Mr_Pardison: I suppose I'm a Michigander, so chilly is below 50 |
| 20:52 |
Mr_Pardison |
What also sucks about it is that apparently it seems to let you strike from 8 nodes away on a survival server. |
| 20:53 |
IhrFussel |
Even further if the server has no anticheat enabled |
| 20:53 |
Mr_Pardison |
they are horrible but I got used to them when I had to use my phone for a while since my computer was not available to use. |
| 20:53 |
paramat |
~tell Megaf i got your message, and i appreciate that you apologised =) |
| 20:53 |
ShadowBot |
paramat: O.K. |
| 20:54 |
IhrFussel |
You can dig nodes that are 300 away from you in Android 3rd-person |
| 20:54 |
IhrFussel |
If anticheat is disabled |
| 20:54 |
Mr_Pardison |
that really is bad. |
| 20:55 |
IhrFussel |
I'm not sure what caused that...in 0.4.15 it was fine I think |
| 20:56 |
IhrFussel |
Or nobody noticed |
| 20:58 |
paramat |
there's an issue for that |
| 20:58 |
IhrFussel |
By the way I also was forced to use the Android version for a long time cause I had no PC ... and I had to manage my server via phone...that was just terrible...imagine no autocomplete for names, always have to type the full name |
| 20:58 |
Mr_Pardison |
sounds like a nightmare. |
| 20:59 |
IhrFussel |
paramat, I know but it cannot be fixed in 0.4.16 without enabling anticheat (not sure if it will be fixed in 0.4.17 either) |
| 21:00 |
IhrFussel |
Not that anticheat is a bad thing to enable...it got better now and barely has any false positives anymore |
| 21:01 |
IhrFussel |
I had it disabled in 0.4.15 server though cause it was meh |
| 21:03 |
IhrFussel |
Mr_Pardison, since the chat field in Android is just a regular formspec ANY other formspec can overwrite it...imagine typing a long message and then suddenly it's gone cause some other formspec triggered |
| 21:03 |
Mr_Pardison |
the horror. |
| 21:05 |
IhrFussel |
And controlling with arrow keys is just not good on touchscreens...which is why it desparately needs a virtual joystick instead |
| 21:05 |
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| 21:05 |
Mr_Pardison |
keyboard and mouse if tablet supports that. |
| 21:06 |
IhrFussel |
Most devices don't support that AFAIK... and the solution needs to be builtin so a 360 degree touch joystick is the best option... we just need someone who has the ability and time to code it |
| 21:07 |
Fixer |
o_O |
| 21:07 |
Mr_Pardison |
not me. |
| 21:07 |
IhrFussel |
The core devs already "found" someone who said he can work on it in Jan/Feb 2018 ... but what if he suddenly got no time anymore |
| 21:08 |
Mr_Pardison |
I'm barely into coding stuff as is and am working on my own mod. |
| 21:08 |
IhrFussel |
You need more knowledge than Lua modding for that...You need to know c++ and java |
| 21:09 |
Mr_Pardison |
java I'm learning in school. |
| 21:09 |
Mr_Pardison |
c++ I might tackle over a break or over the summer if I have time. |
| 21:09 |
IhrFussel |
Ok not sure about c++... maybe just java would be enough to draw that joystick but you still need the variables from c++ side |
| 21:10 |
Mr_Pardison |
I'm not going for th joystick. |
| 21:10 |
Mr_Pardison |
out of my league for now. |
| 21:10 |
Mr_Pardison |
Just going to freeze and let my feet get real cold now while I wait for my sis to come pick me up. |
| 21:10 |
Mr_Pardison |
I could just walk home but that would take me a while. |
| 21:10 |
Mr_Pardison |
I wish I had brought my skate board with me.... |
| 21:11 |
IhrFussel |
I didn't mean you need to code it^^ I was just escribing what it likely takes for our goal |
| 21:11 |
IhrFussel |
describing* |
| 21:11 |
Mr_Pardison |
it's fine. |
| 21:12 |
Mr_Pardison |
just trying to keep my feet from becoming so cold that thye go numb. |
| 21:12 |
Mr_Pardison |
my typing is also suffering from the cold. |
| 21:13 |
IhrFussel |
paramat, do you got any plan B in case the guy doesn't manage to work on MT Android early next year? |
| 21:13 |
Mr_Pardison |
plan c d and e are also nice to have. |
| 21:13 |
Fixer |
shops via signs (used with economy), mc beta 1.7.3 (colourised): https://i.imgur.com/zKYhtwl.png |
| 21:13 |
Mr_Pardison |
"it is better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it." -Mr_Pardison |
| 21:14 |
IhrFussel |
I think it's wrong to just think "oh i found someone for the work now and he'll take care of it" |
| 21:14 |
paramat |
well obviously it can't be fixed in past MT versions =) we intend it to be fixed for 0.5 |
| 21:15 |
IhrFussel |
But the 0.5.0 breakage won't stop the illegal forks... it will just delay them but they will reappear |
| 21:16 |
IhrFussel |
We can just hope that our 0.5.0 app became the most popular one by then |
| 21:16 |
Mr_Pardison |
so, a stop-gap instead of a solution. |
| 21:17 |
benrob0329 |
\>freeze |
| 21:17 |
benrob0329 |
\>64 degree weather |
| 21:17 |
paramat |
plan B ... we are always looking for other people to work on android, we won't rely on 1 person |
| 21:17 |
IhrFussel |
Of course, since the source code will be public... app devs just need to wait for 0.5.0 Android to be finished and then they can start with their illegal forks again |
| 21:17 |
Mr_Pardison |
benrob0329: windy here! |
| 21:17 |
Fixer |
:) |
| 21:17 |
Mr_Pardison |
and I'm not used to cold. |
| 21:17 |
Mr_Pardison |
grrrrrrr |
| 21:17 |
paramat |
this is why servers should switch to 0.5 asap |
| 21:18 |
Mr_Pardison |
sister FINALLY said that she was on her way. |
| 21:18 |
paramat |
so we can move players to the official app |
| 21:18 |
paramat |
assuming it's fixed by then |
| 21:19 |
IhrFussel |
But the illegal forks will connect to 0.5.0 servers then just like they connect to 0.4.X servers now ... app devs will likely offer a 0.5.0 fork of their app if they realize it's the *hot* new thing |
| 21:20 |
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| 21:21 |
IhrFussel |
The positive thing is they will likely have to start over with that new 0.5.0 app which means 0 downloads, 0 reviews, 0 rating |
| 21:22 |
Mr_Pardison |
give it a 5 star rating when it comes out so it is farther up the list |
| 21:22 |
Mr_Pardison |
g2g |
| 21:22 |
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| 21:24 |
IhrFussel |
I don't believe you can trick the play store like that...but either way our official app would still have the same downloads, reviews, rating + improved controls + UI ... so it could turn out to be the most popular modern MT app |
| 21:26 |
paramat |
yes the bad apps will catch up, but slowly. also, multicraft (>1 million downloads) may not be upgrading to 0.5 ever |
| 21:27 |
Roger9 |
Minetest atm is really laggy for me, is there any way to change that? |
| 21:28 |
Raven262 |
Calinou, Wanna play TF2? |
| 21:29 |
IhrFussel |
Roger9, what's your view range? |
| 21:29 |
Fixer |
paramat: depends on greed :) |
| 21:31 |
IhrFussel |
Roger9, also what's your FPS (press F5 in game) and does it improve when you press the - key a few times? |
| 21:35 |
Calinou |
Raven262: alright :) on matchmaking? |
| 21:35 |
Calinou |
(some common gametype) |
| 21:35 |
Calinou |
casual matchmaking, that is |
| 21:38 |
Calinou |
Raven262: there, you can invite me to a game/lobby |
| 21:38 |
Roger9 |
IhrFussel: View range is the minimum, and I'll check my FPS now. |
| 21:39 |
Roger9 |
FPS in singleplayer is ~13. |
| 21:39 |
Roger9 |
Other than that, I believe the settings are default (haven't changed them besides view range). |
| 21:42 |
IhrFussel |
Roger9, 0.4.16? |
| 21:43 |
Roger9 |
IhrFussel: Yes. |
| 21:43 |
Roger9 |
IhrFussel: I'm using the AppImage, but running the Windows version in Wine is just as slow. |
| 21:43 |
Roger9 |
(if not slower) |
| 21:45 |
IhrFussel |
First disable ALL shaders if not done yet ... second set leave styles as opaque, disable 3d clouds... next go to advanced settings enable "show technical names" and search for "mapblock" then look for mapblock_limit and set it to 100 or so |
| 21:46 |
IhrFussel |
The setting is called client_mapblock_limit |
| 21:53 |
IhrFussel |
Roger9, Also list the mods you use if there are any outside of Minetest Game |
| 21:54 |
Roger9 |
M'kay. |
| 21:55 |
Roger9 |
client_mapblock_limit is 100, all settings set to their minimum (opaque leaves, 2d clouds, all shaders are disabled). Gonna try singleplayer now. |
| 21:55 |
Roger9 |
IhrFussel: FPS has risen, but only up to 15~20. |
| 21:57 |
IhrFussel |
Roger9, any external mods? Or just MTG? |
| 21:59 |
Roger9 |
IhrFussel: Just MTG. |
| 21:59 |
Raven262 |
Calinou, Well, that wasn't really a fun round. |
| 21:59 |
Calinou |
Raven262: you leaving, or going somewhere e lse? |
| 21:59 |
Calinou |
else* |
| 21:59 |
Calinou |
yeah |
| 21:59 |
Calinou |
I don't like KOTH on Harvest very much |
| 21:59 |
Calinou |
I prefer more open maps |
| 21:59 |
Raven262 |
Idk, lisac left us |
| 21:59 |
Raven262 |
Me too |
| 21:59 |
Raven262 |
But we seem to have been stuck on those |
| 21:59 |
Roger9 |
With the minimal development test, I can reach a semi-consistent FPS of 18~20. |
| 21:59 |
Calinou |
wanna play payload or CTF? |
| 21:59 |
Calinou |
I played CTF yesterday, was nice |
| 22:00 |
Raven262 |
I do, If lisac does too. |
| 22:00 |
lisac |
Sorry Calinou, it was either that or hanging myself. |
| 22:00 |
IhrFussel |
Roger9, set active_block_range to 1 |
| 22:00 |
lisac |
I'm pretty close to hanging raven, though |
| 22:00 |
lisac |
Skial/Panda 2fort? |
| 22:00 |
Calinou |
Skial/Panda? |
| 22:00 |
Raven262 |
YOu need to get a balloonicorn, lisac. |
| 22:00 |
lisac |
servers. |
| 22:01 |
Roger9 |
IhrFussel: Did that, no increase in FPS. |
| 22:01 |
paramat |
client_mapblock_limit 100 is too small and will cause issues, it doesn't affect FPS |
| 22:01 |
paramat |
are you in singleplayer? |
| 22:01 |
Roger9 |
Yes. |
| 22:02 |
Roger9 |
I'm resetting client_mapblock_limit to 5000. |
| 22:02 |
Roger9 |
(at least I think that's what it was originally) |
| 22:02 |
paramat |
also disable smooth lighting |
| 22:02 |
Roger9 |
That's already disabled. |
| 22:03 |
IhrFussel |
Roger9, try to enable undersampling |
| 22:03 |
paramat |
ok, must be low power computer? |
| 22:03 |
Roger9 |
paramat: My FPS was significantly higher until I wiped Windows and installed Linux. |
| 22:04 |
paramat |
weird |
| 22:04 |
IhrFussel |
Undersampling should help on every computer even if you set it to 2 the FPS should increase |
| 22:05 |
IhrFussel |
The game will just look a tiny bit more pixelated |
| 22:05 |
Calinou |
"a tiny bit" |
| 22:05 |
Calinou |
that's only true on hiDPI displays :) |
| 22:05 |
Roger9 |
Setting undersampling to 2. |
| 22:05 |
Calinou |
also, non-native fullscreen will be faster than undersampling on such displays |
| 22:05 |
Calinou |
(I have tested this, the difference is huge) |
| 22:05 |
Calinou |
(30 FPS vs almost 60 FPS) |
| 22:05 |
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| 22:05 |
Roger9 |
My FPS actually increased quite a bit - in fact, it's actually playable now. |
| 22:06 |
Calinou |
Raven262: hmm, I don't like community servers, really |
| 22:06 |
Calinou |
too much cruft |
| 22:06 |
Calinou |
I used to be a fan of a few, but meh |
| 22:06 |
Roger9 |
I don't mind the decreased resolution, either. I mean, Minetest is a voxel-based game (engine), so you don't really need that much detail. |
| 22:07 |
Roger9 |
FPS is still 15 on CTF, though |
| 22:08 |
IhrFussel |
Try undersampling 3 or 4 then |
| 22:09 |
IhrFussel |
IMO you can still normally see the elements in the world even with 4 |
| 22:09 |
Roger9 |
Using undersampling 3, singleplayer gives me an FPS of 25~30. |
| 22:10 |
Roger9 |
My FPS on CTF is still around 12. |
| 22:11 |
Roger9 |
Undersampling 4 makes singleplayer completely smooth, which is cool. |
| 22:11 |
Fixer |
Roger9: news flash, gpu performance is often worse on linux (depends on gpu) |
| 22:11 |
Roger9 |
My FPS on CTF is still low, though. |
| 22:12 |
Roger9 |
Fixer: I'm using the same laptop from when I had Debian 8 - the only difference is a new hard drive. And on Debian 8, MT runs completely fine. |
| 22:12 |
Fixer |
Roger9: it is linux, regressions are fact of life |
| 22:12 |
Roger9 |
Fixer: What would even be causing these regressions, though? |
| 22:12 |
sfan5 |
my guess is that something about your video driver broke |
| 22:15 |
IhrFussel |
If singleplayer is smooth but server isn't then it's the server's content which seems to be too heavy for your machine |
| 22:15 |
Fixer |
Roger9: THIS IS SPARTA, i mean linux, everything possible, I had to mail a bugreport to linux dev team to fix kernel panic on screen brightness off (it was fixed pretty fast), thats just an example |
| 22:15 |
lisac |
Calinou, join now |
| 22:15 |
Fixer |
Roger9: check vsync, disable shaders |
| 22:15 |
IhrFussel |
Does CTF use a custom TP? |
| 22:15 |
lisac |
I'm on Skial 2fort server |
| 22:15 |
Roger9 |
Fixer: Shaders are completely disabled. I'll check vsync. |
| 22:15 |
Calinou |
ok |
| 22:16 |
Calinou |
Roger9: check CPU and GPU usage |
| 22:16 |
Fixer |
Roger9: vsync should be off |
| 22:16 |
Calinou |
(what OS are you on?) |
| 22:16 |
Roger9 |
V-Sync is disabled. Calinou: I'm on Debian 9. |
| 22:16 |
Fixer |
and check if direct rendering is enabled |
| 22:16 |
Fixer |
what gpu? |
| 22:16 |
Calinou |
checking GPU usage is pretty difficult if you're using anything other than the NVIDIA driver on Linux :( |
| 22:17 |
Fixer |
check your privilage with glxgears |
| 22:17 |
Fixer |
and glxinfo (iirc) |
| 22:18 |
Calinou |
these don't report GPU usage |
| 22:18 |
Calinou |
(GPU usage ≠VRAM usage, by the way) |
| 22:18 |
Calinou |
(by "GPU usage", I mean "GPU core usage") |
| 22:18 |
Fixer |
why do you need gpu usage, just check if driver is installed and direct rendering |
| 22:19 |
Fixer |
so what is the gpu? cpu? resolution? |
| 22:19 |
Roger9 |
Uh... |
| 22:21 |
IhrFussel |
glxgears constantly reports 59 FPS here on an integrated intel chip from 2009 so I highly doubt his is older/worse |
| 22:21 |
Calinou |
Roger9: what's your graphics card? |
| 22:21 |
Calinou |
I didn't ask this, but it's the question to ask :) |
| 22:21 |
Fixer |
IhrFussel: disable vsync ;) |
| 22:21 |
Roger9 |
Calinou: I think it's integrated with my CPU... |
| 22:21 |
Fixer |
IhrFussel: i had like 3000 fps in glx 13 years ago |
| 22:21 |
Roger9 |
AMD A4-6210 APU with AMD Radeon R3 Graphics (1000MHz) |
| 22:21 |
Calinou |
disabling compositing on Linux will greatly improve performance and reduce input lag |
| 22:22 |
Calinou |
however, it makes for a less convenient desktop experience |
| 22:22 |
Calinou |
and you will likely get tearing when playing videos/etc |
| 22:22 |
IhrFussel |
Fixer, how do I disabel vsync though? |
| 22:22 |
Calinou |
(so you should probably disable it only when playing a game) |
| 22:22 |
Roger9 |
Compositing...? |
| 22:22 |
IhrFussel |
disable* |
| 22:22 |
Calinou |
IhrFussel: most compositors enforce V-Sync by default |
| 22:22 |
Calinou |
Roger9: "desktop effects" |
| 22:22 |
Fixer |
IhrFussel: there was some variable, hold on |
| 22:22 |
Roger9 |
Calinou: What do you mean? |
| 22:22 |
Calinou |
if you are on GNOME 3, too bad, you have to move away from it :) |
| 22:22 |
Roger9 |
I use MATE. |
| 22:22 |
Calinou |
since GNOME 3 doesn't allow disabling compositing at all |
| 22:22 |
Calinou |
not sure if MATE allows disabling it, check for a "desktop effects" setting |
| 22:22 |
Roger9 |
Calinou: I don't know what you mean by compositing, though. |
| 22:23 |
Calinou |
compositing is a fancy term for "render windows on many layers, attempt to prevent tearing and optionally add some effects in the process" |
| 22:23 |
Calinou |
as you can guess, it is the enemy of gaming, especially on Linux thanks to X11 |
| 22:23 |
Roger9 |
Ah. |
| 22:23 |
Calinou |
(on Windows, it's completely fine) |
| 22:23 |
Calinou |
(as of Windows 8, that is) |
| 22:23 |
Calinou |
(you can't disable it there anymore, anyway) |
| 22:23 |
Fixer |
IhrFussel: try this: vblank_mode=0 glxgears |
| 22:24 |
IhrFussel |
6572 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1312.754 FPS |
| 22:25 |
Fixer |
Roger9: do "glxinfo | grep direct" and check if it says yes |
| 22:26 |
Roger9 |
Fixer: I don't have glxinfo as of now, but I've found a package (mesa-utils) which includes it. |
| 22:26 |
Fixer |
o_0 |
| 22:26 |
Roger9 |
? |
| 22:28 |
IhrFussel |
Off for now see ya |
| 22:29 |
Calinou |
1312 FPS is very low by today's standards |
| 22:29 |
Calinou |
last time I tried on my desktop, I had 50,000-60,000 FPS |
| 22:29 |
Calinou |
and on my previous desktop, 29,000 FPS with compositing disabled |
| 22:29 |
Calinou |
(~20,000 with compositing enabled, IIRC) |
| 22:29 |
Calinou |
Roger9: yeah, install the "mesa-utils" package |
| 22:31 |
Roger9 |
Direct rendering is on. |
| 22:32 |
Calinou |
I would be surprised if it was disabled |
| 22:32 |
Calinou |
(the game probably wouldn't even start) |
| 22:33 |
jas_ |
no way to get_player_control().zoom? |
| 22:33 |
jas_ |
(i wanted to player:hud_set_flags({wielditem=false}) |
| 22:34 |
jas_ |
) |
| 22:37 |
Calinou |
the zoom control isn't sent to the server |
| 22:37 |
Calinou |
also, that would disable it server-side, without prediction |
| 22:37 |
Calinou |
so there'd be visible lag when you zoom in and out |
| 22:39 |
Roger9 |
For something like that, a CSM would probably be better. |
| 22:40 |
Calinou |
indeed |
| 22:43 |
paramat |
er no not CSM, we plan to remove wield when zooming |
| 22:43 |
paramat |
it's obviously needed |
| 22:47 |
jas_ |
also perhaps "minimap disable by server" message changed to "minimap requires mapping kit" |
| 22:48 |
jas_ |
ha |
| 22:48 |
Fixer |
meanwhile https://i.imgur.com/QqeC5AJ.png |
| 22:59 |
Fixer |
pipes <3 https://i.imgur.com/jnpc0qc.png |
| 23:00 |
Calinou |
that FOV looks tiny, especially since you're on 5:4 |
| 23:00 |
Calinou |
not good for combat :P |
| 23:31 |
Fixer |
fine for me |
| 23:39 |
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| 23:41 |
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| 23:41 |
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| 23:50 |
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| 23:53 |
paramat |
""minimap disable by server" message changed to "minimap requires mapping kit"" can't do that because the message is from the engine, the mapping kit is game-specific |
