| Time |
Nick |
Message |
| 02:05 |
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| 03:11 |
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| 04:00 |
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| 06:00 |
[MTMatrix] |
<grorp> Krock: another feature that depends on USE_SDL=1 is toggling fullscreen mode at runtime via keyboard shortcut. probably not the most important thing though. |
| 06:35 |
Mantar |
I can do that already with my window manager |
| 08:07 |
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| 08:37 |
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| 08:45 |
[MTMatrix] |
<grorp> celeron55: re https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?p=438143#p438143 "this is because it binds keys based on their position on the keyboard, instead of the symbol on the key": You know that we haven't switched keybindings to scancodes (key positions), right? They're still based on keycodes. SDL just doesn't give us keycodes that take modifiers into account. |
| 08:51 |
[MTMatrix] |
<grorp> It looks like your post caused follow-up confusion: https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?p=438191#p438191 |
| 08:52 |
[MTMatrix] |
<grorp> > The key still works across layouts, it's just that the correct character is not displayed in the controls menu. |
| 08:52 |
[MTMatrix] |
<grorp> This is false. This would be the case if we had changed keybindings to use SDL scancodes, but had forgotten to show the actual layout-dependent key name in the controls menu. However, we haven't changed keybindings to use SDL scancodes. |
| 08:57 |
sfan5 |
@luatic I think 14932 is simply a product of setRelativeMode not being available on !SDL |
| 08:58 |
[MTMatrix] |
<grorp> (replying here because I couldn't find my forum password) |
| 08:58 |
sfan5 |
remember that we enabled it specifically for wayland #12636 |
| 08:58 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/12636 -- Set and unset relative mouse mode where necessary by ndren |
| 09:03 |
[MTMatrix] |
<grorp> the issue only happens with SDL according to https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/14932#issuecomment-2276231213, so you're saying that relative mouse mode causes the problem? (?) |
| 09:08 |
sfan5 |
yes |
| 09:09 |
sfan5 |
of course could also be something that's broken with our use of relativ mouse mouse specifically |
| 09:09 |
sfan5 |
but what I have observed if you have part of your display stack not handle relative mouse mode (e.g. vnc connection) that exact behavior OP is seeing happens |
| 09:12 |
sfan5 |
merging #14937, #14929 in 5m |
| 09:12 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/14937 -- Revert macOS workflow to run on x86 by sfan5 |
| 09:12 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/14929 -- Update credits for 5.9.0 by sfan5 |
| 09:14 |
sfan5 |
we're also not error-checking the result of SDL_SetRelativeMouseMode |
| 09:14 |
sfan5 |
>If relative mode is not supported, this returns -1. |
| 09:16 |
sfan5 |
however in principle nothing should happen if it doesn't work (except that we try to constantly re-enable it?) |
| 12:46 |
[MTMatrix] |
<grorp> this could possibly be the bug, considering the "Only change it when necessary, as it flushes mouse motion when enabled" comment |
| 13:20 |
celeron55 |
@grorp well... assuming the release will be done now with the irrlicht backend, i'll not bother fixing the messages |
| 13:22 |
celeron55 |
(at least i managed to make a number of users post their thoughts which is good enough) |
| 13:22 |
MTDiscord |
<prolller> Maybe its time to discuss how to merge https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/11843 - for example only type change without any actual big worlds support? - or full version vith compatible net BUT disabled 32bit by default ? or will wait few years more ? |
| 13:27 |
MTDiscord |
<athozus> I know OpenTTD uses a system of choosing the size at the beginning of a new game. Maybe that would be helpful for Minetest : most tests worlds could be on 8 bits, while gaming worls would be sized depending on the gamestyle |
| 13:50 |
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| 14:07 |
sfan5 |
does someone plan to prepare a PR to disble sdl by default? |
| 14:25 |
[MTMatrix] |
<Zughy> uhm, the survey is going in the other direction |
| 14:28 |
rubenwardy |
I think the survey is fundamentally flawed due to the sample |
| 14:54 |
rubenwardy |
the disadvantages don't effect those on QWERTY english keyboards. Technical users will find the disadvantages easy to work around and the advantages more appealing |
| 14:59 |
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| 15:22 |
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| 15:31 |
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| 15:31 |
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| 15:37 |
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| 16:00 |
MTDiscord |
<josiah_wi> The +/- keys affect people with QWERTY english keyboards, I thought. |
| 16:00 |
MTDiscord |
<josiah_wi> They don't affect me because I use Dvorak. 🙂 |
| 16:14 |
pgimeno |
I think it's vitally important that the keypad "/" works in all situations - I hope that's common to all proposed solutions |
| 16:15 |
[MTMatrix] |
<Zughy> Yeah, it doesn't require shift |
| 16:16 |
pgimeno |
yeah, my concern is that something like supporting shift + 7 makes the implementor forget about ensuring that support for keypad "/" still works |
| 16:16 |
[MTMatrix] |
<Zughy> Another question should be: why players are expected to tweak fog, but that's gonna result in another long conversation |
| 16:16 |
[MTMatrix] |
<Zughy> *fog distance |
| 16:18 |
[MTMatrix] |
<Zughy> Not a core dev but I think that the regression is justified. It's not like we're top quality UX right now |
| 16:19 |
[MTMatrix] |
<Zughy> PRs have reached almost the same levels we had a couple of years ago, so whatever the solution I think we should act fast |
| 16:20 |
[MTMatrix] |
<Zughy> Also: are sfence and cx384 core devs now? I didn't get it, sorry |
| 16:21 |
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| 16:25 |
pgimeno |
@Zughy https://irc.minetest.net/minetest-dev/2024-07-29#i_6188880 https://irc.minetest.net/minetest-dev/2024-08-04#i_6189618 https://irc.minetest.net/minetest-dev/2024-08-04#i_6189607 https://irc.minetest.net/minetest-dev/2024-08-07#i_6190732 |
| 16:25 |
pgimeno |
may have been during Matrix bridge downtime |
| 16:27 |
Desour |
welcome to both! |
| 16:28 |
rubenwardy |
Adjusting draw distance is super important for managing performance |
| 16:29 |
rubenwardy |
(Minetest used to support doing this automatically but it reducded performance and caused jitter) |
| 17:22 |
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| 17:30 |
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| 17:41 |
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| 17:42 |
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| 17:59 |
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| 18:18 |
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| 18:43 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> We expect users to control view distance, but I agree fog* distance doesn't make much sense. It should just be latched to view distance in some standard way, and then fog can be toggle-able still. |
| 18:45 |
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| 18:46 |
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| 18:48 |
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| 18:49 |
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| 19:05 |
sfan5 |
considering fog obscures the view what's the logical difference between view and fog distance? |
| 19:06 |
MTDiscord |
<herowl> Tbh, fog can be used for effects by the game |
| 19:06 |
MTDiscord |
<herowl> To intentionally obscure the view |
| 19:07 |
MTDiscord |
<herowl> What's the fog gradient along the view frustum is more important than where's the end of it exactly |
| 19:07 |
celeron55 |
well, obviously it's dual purpose. ideally the game should be able to let the engine know what the artistic fog distance should be, and then from somewhere (currently from the user) should come a render distance value which depends on the performance of the hardware (or how much CPU and GPU the user wants to use for rendering) |
| 19:07 |
MTDiscord |
<herowl> Although both matter |
| 19:09 |
MTDiscord |
<herowl> Tbh it should be that of what's game-chosen and what's user-chosen, the smaller value is picked |
| 19:09 |
celeron55 |
yeah the fog has many parameters, for artistic fog you can do many things, but for obscuring the rendering limit you want relatively "short" fog |
| 19:09 |
celeron55 |
i suppose all these concepts and the smartness to decide what to do in the end should be added to the engine |
| 19:11 |
Desour |
we already have a fog api |
| 19:11 |
celeron55 |
there's at least this issue https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/14176 |
| 19:16 |
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| 20:06 |
rubenwardy |
there's also volumetric fog |
| 20:53 |
rubenwardy |
do the VM images no longer come with gl headers? |
| 20:53 |
rubenwardy |
#14944 |
| 20:53 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/14944 -- Disable SDL2 for 5.9.0 by rubenwardy |
| 21:03 |
sfan5 |
which vm? |
| 21:04 |
rubenwardy |
nevermind, fixed it - updated the windows.yml workflow vcpkg list |
| 22:32 |
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| 22:40 |
rubenwardy |
if decided, I suggest merging #14944 soonish and doing rc2 |
| 22:40 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/14944 -- Disable SDL2 for 5.9.0 by rubenwardy |
| 22:40 |
rubenwardy |
then release in a week |
| 22:40 |
rubenwardy |
well depends how confident people are that non-sdl still work |
| 22:40 |
rubenwardy |
+s |
| 23:05 |
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