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| 15:23 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> Hey Josiah, if I wanted to get us webp support (smaller texture compression than png, better lossy than jpeg), I need to know how we would handle the dependency. It's a apache licensed source base, google provides the repo. Linux supports the libwebp and libwebp-dev packages, so we could depend on it that way. Just wondering how we would add such a dependency normally? I'm thinking we need webp for textures, and add support for |
| 15:23 |
MTDiscord |
.gtlf/.collada and .midi via fluidsynth to get our file support and options better. So webp is the lowest hanging fruit |
| 15:25 |
MTDiscord |
<josiah_wi> Best case, they have documentation for using their project with CMake, and you load their config file and link to a target. |
| 15:26 |
MTDiscord |
<josiah_wi> Second best case is the same except you need to link to a library and add their header directory. |
| 15:26 |
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| 15:27 |
MTDiscord |
<josiah_wi> If they don't use CMake you have to manually implement a search for it in CMake that sets appropriate variables, which sucks. |
| 15:29 |
MTDiscord |
<josiah_wi> If it's all done in Irrlicht Minetest doesn't need to link to it. If Minetest needs headers they'll be forwarded from the Irrlicht setup courtesy of CMake. |
| 15:30 |
MTDiscord |
<josiah_wi> Not sure exactly how you're planning to manage that. PNG and JPEG image support are in Irrlicht... |
| 15:38 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> Gotcha, I'll put it in irrlicht-mt then |
| 15:38 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> Not a big deal sense we forked |
| 15:38 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> Since** |
| 15:38 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> hopes for cmake.lists |
| 15:39 |
Pexin |
I don't understand, whether it's in mt or irrmt, you have to do the same lib shenanigans |
| 15:44 |
MTDiscord |
<josiah_wi> Right, but if it's in IrrlichtMt you don't have to even touch Minetest build code. |
| 15:45 |
Pexin |
ah, which is probably more complex and easy to break huh |
| 15:47 |
MTDiscord |
<josiah_wi> IDK, it means less duplicate stuff, and it should make the build code smaller. |
| 15:48 |
MTDiscord |
<josiah_wi> And less ineffecient. |
| 15:48 |
MTDiscord |
<josiah_wi> @Exe, Virus webp has full CMake support. |
| 15:49 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> nice |
| 15:49 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> now to make sure I understand how to do cmake's find and if webp-dev does that and whatnot |
| 15:49 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> sadly, I have only like 12 hours of cmake experience under my belt |
| 15:49 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> so 0.1% of the way to "mastery" |
| 15:50 |
MTDiscord |
<Sublayer plank> please no midi support, use tracker music formats with embedded samples |
| 15:50 |
Pexin |
midi is awesome |
| 15:50 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> sorry, midi is easier to support and has open source libraries |
| 15:50 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> tracker music formats are mostly closed |
| 15:50 |
MTDiscord |
<Sublayer plank> so is minetest gonna ship with a soundfont or is it gonna sound different on every platform? |
| 15:50 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> we can always add that support in later |
| 15:50 |
Pexin |
midi also lets people use hardware midi or custom client samples |
| 15:51 |
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| 15:51 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> probably ship with the musescore 12MB one, that's a later decision |
| 15:51 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> ideally, you could also provide one when running a server |
| 15:51 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> and it would be sent as a media file |
| 15:52 |
Pexin |
hm. going to need a per-game setting for endusers to override the server's suggested soundfont then... |
| 15:52 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> But yeah, we'd have to choose a default, and allow you to ship any soundfont you want |
| 15:52 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> something like in lua: playMidi(file.midi, file.soundfont) |
| 15:52 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> the midi could be text or a file |
| 15:52 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> and the soundfont if nil, defaults to our shipping one |
| 15:53 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> just my personal thoughts on the subject. Either way, being able to send midi in realtime is super duper helpful and allwos a lot more player-server-music interactions |
| 15:53 |
MTDiscord |
<Sublayer plank> libmodplug is a thing |
| 15:54 |
Pexin |
scenario: if I'm a user with a custom default client midi config, but I want to specify that a specific server still uses its suggested, server-provided soundfont |
| 15:54 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> It is, but it's got very similar issues |
| 15:54 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> users can always override, honestly |
| 15:54 |
Pexin |
but per whitelist or blacklist |
| 15:54 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> perhaps? again they can just ignored |
| 15:55 |
MTDiscord |
<josiah_wi> @Exe, Virus They didn't export a target. You cann do find_package(WebP) and it'll create variables WEBP_INCLUDE_DIRS and WEBP_LIBRARIES. |
| 15:55 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> Either way, I'm not against shipping BOTH libmodplug and fluidsynth |
| 15:55 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> It's very minimally different and we ARE an engine..... |
| 15:56 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> we're supposed to support lots of varied formats and whatnot |
| 15:56 |
MTDiscord |
<josiah_wi> It should be pretty easy to add. It'll be just like the other examples in the build file. |
| 15:56 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> Okay, that's helpful Josiah, are you sure you don't want to start the branch with support haha? I'll work it into the codebase, but if you do the cmake support, that could be helpful |
| 15:57 |
MTDiscord |
<Sublayer plank> as long as minetest isn't being bundled with fluidr3 or something equally ridiculous I'm happy |
| 15:57 |
MTDiscord |
<josiah_wi> I could do that. |
| 15:57 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> sure, just share back when you are finished, still got a newborn so my time is sporadic |
| 15:57 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> fluidr3? |
| 15:58 |
Pexin |
those things will kill you |
| 15:58 |
MTDiscord |
<josiah_wi> I remember when my little brother was a newborn, no worries. xD |
| 15:58 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> Oh. a big soundfont. No, definitely something under 15 MB |
| 15:58 |
MTDiscord |
<Sublayer plank> I actually did not know there existed such small soundfonts |
| 15:58 |
MTDiscord |
<josiah_wi> Will let you know once I've got a branch ready, may be a day or two. |
| 15:59 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> Yeah take a look at https://musescore.org/en/handbook/3/soundfonts-and-sfz-files |
| 16:00 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> With .sf3 they added compression, so for example, the default with musescore is 35.9 MB |
| 16:00 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> I figure sadly, that FluidR3Mono_GM.sf3 is a better fit at 13.8 MB, though it's exactly what you said not to use haha |
| 16:01 |
MTDiscord |
<Sublayer plank> oh no I meant the fluidr3 soundfont that's 150mb, 13mb is perfectly alright haha |
| 16:02 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> well, I think uncompressed, it is 150Mb, so it's the same thing, just with ogg compression |
| 16:02 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> that's all they did with .sf3, store the samples as .oggs |
| 16:02 |
MTDiscord |
<Sublayer plank> oh |
| 16:03 |
MTDiscord |
<Sublayer plank> yeah the soundfont I have installed here is an sf2 one, FluidR3_GM.sf2 |
| 16:03 |
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| 16:08 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> Yeah browse that link, you'll see a compressed one of that there. Anyways, did I convince you that maybe fluidsynth and midi could work at those sizes? |
| 16:10 |
MTDiscord |
<Sublayer plank> definitively |
| 16:13 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> awesome, that's never happened in my life haha |
| 16:13 |
Pexin |
it's because midi is awesome |
| 16:14 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> ic ic, the power of software |
| 16:14 |
Pexin |
here hoping vgmusic.com is never shut down |
| 16:17 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> archiving is fine, plus wayback machine..... |
| 16:17 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> also, don't put infringing stuff on minetest cdb haha |
| 16:20 |
Pexin |
out of curiosity, is there a problem if I hypothetically had infringing stuff in my game, and my game is listed in the official serverlist? |
| 16:21 |
Pexin |
I mean there's a tmnt avatar in the userskin set for one thing |
| 16:22 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> yes, there's issues with it, but nothing too crazy |
| 16:22 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> I don't think we'll shut you down |
| 16:22 |
Pexin |
pretty sure that userskin set is in many servers |
| 16:22 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> but we may in the future deprioritize servers that infringe at some point |
| 16:23 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> I personally wont be enforcing it hardcore |
| 16:23 |
Pexin |
"your server has a user-made structure that looks like the captain america shield when viewed from <angle>, GET OFF OUR SERVERLIST |
| 16:23 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> you could always contact the originl copyright holder |
| 16:24 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> haha, yeah at some point it's just "okay" or "fair use" |
| 16:24 |
Pexin |
now that I think of it, I wouldn't completely put it past Modern Disney to send lawyers in such a case |
| 16:24 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> exactly |
| 16:24 |
Pexin |
they craycray |
| 16:24 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> but let them complain |
| 16:25 |
MTDiscord |
<exe_virus> and deal with it then i guess |
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