| Time |
Nick |
Message |
| 00:02 |
Hijiri |
paramat: the issues/PRs you removed from the milestone are still in the project, is that intended? |
| 00:02 |
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| 00:03 |
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| 00:04 |
paramat |
erm |
| 00:05 |
paramat |
they will of course still be worked on, but there's only 11 days to freeze |
| 00:05 |
paramat |
i closed 10 that obviously should not be in the milestone |
| 00:07 |
paramat |
.. at this point. it was fine to add them earlier through optimism |
| 00:23 |
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| 00:23 |
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| 00:26 |
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| 00:42 |
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| 00:46 |
Hijiri |
paramat: I meant project as in the project feature of github |
| 00:46 |
Hijiri |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/projects/2 |
| 00:48 |
paramat |
i see |
| 00:49 |
paramat |
i sort of can't be bothered with that kanban board thing, it's a nerzhul thing, seems unnecessary to me :] |
| 01:07 |
paramat |
Zeno` thanks for your message |
| 01:26 |
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| 03:27 |
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| 04:33 |
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| 05:04 |
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| 05:07 |
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| 05:07 |
Zeno` |
I think that maintenance is normally something that doesn't change how something behaves. Therefore removing maintenance tag from #5744 |
| 05:07 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5744 -- Caverns: Remove unnecessary liquid excavation by paramat |
| 05:34 |
nerzhul |
Zeno`, except arrlen #5719 is okay for you ? |
| 05:34 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5719 -- Rework escape/pause menu by red-001 |
| 05:35 |
nerzhul |
(i fixed it myself) |
| 05:39 |
Zeno` |
yeah, but I'd rather the ARRLEN there so if someone changes the length of the array they don't have to remember to change the snprintf() as well |
| 05:40 |
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| 05:42 |
lisac |
#5743 |
| 05:42 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5743 -- Fix instant dig bug #5728 by lisacvuk |
| 05:42 |
lisac |
Hi everyone |
| 05:43 |
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| 05:50 |
Zeno` |
hi |
| 05:50 |
Zeno` |
nerzhul, yep I'm ok with it now |
| 05:50 |
nerzhul |
nice :) |
| 05:50 |
nerzhul |
hi |
| 05:50 |
nerzhul |
merging in ~30mins then |
| 06:05 |
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| 07:12 |
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| 07:30 |
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| 08:00 |
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| 08:02 |
lisac |
Hi kilbith |
| 08:03 |
kilbith |
hey |
| 08:22 |
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| 08:25 |
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| 08:26 |
lisac |
Hi nerzhul |
| 08:26 |
nerzhul |
oh forgot to merge #5719 this morning, i will merge it in ~10 mins |
| 08:26 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5719 -- Rework escape/pause menu by red-001 |
| 08:39 |
nerzhul |
merged |
| 08:39 |
nerzhul |
ty red-002 |
| 09:00 |
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| 09:10 |
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| 09:10 |
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| 10:03 |
nerzhul |
guys, we really need #5554 for release, a second approval is required |
| 10:03 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5554 -- [CSM] Allow enabling and disabling mods. by red-001 |
| 11:00 |
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| 11:01 |
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| 11:39 |
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| 11:39 |
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| 11:57 |
lisac |
nerzhul, What does 'Blocker' tag stand for? |
| 12:03 |
VanessaE |
lisac: in most projects, "blocker" means that the issue in question must be solved before next planned release of the project. |
| 12:03 |
VanessaE |
the issue is literally "blocking" the devs from considering a release (or it would, if it isn't solved by the projected release date) |
| 12:04 |
kilbith |
I have a gross analogy with the toilet in mind but I'll abstain |
| 12:08 |
VanessaE |
heh |
| 12:11 |
lisac |
VanessaE, Thanks :D |
| 12:11 |
VanessaE |
yw |
| 12:18 |
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| 13:16 |
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| 13:22 |
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| 13:29 |
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| 14:03 |
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| 14:03 |
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| 14:26 |
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| 14:45 |
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| 14:46 |
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| 14:54 |
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| 14:59 |
Fixer |
who come up with this "Minetest Game" was intended to be simple? (maybe i forgot) I thought that was result of lack of development and will so it became so stagnant for years so that "simplicity" was accepted as norm because it is that much fucked up and you can't do much about it |
| 15:18 |
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| 15:18 |
red-002 |
Fixer it's a feature not a bug? |
| 15:24 |
Fixer |
red-002: rails without carts for almost 6 years - bug or feature? |
| 15:25 |
red-002 |
feature since carts are more memory and cpu expensive then just tracks, duh |
| 15:26 |
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| 15:26 |
Fixer |
red-002: remove minetest_game, even less memory/cpu used |
| 15:26 |
red-002 |
huh good point |
| 15:28 |
red-002 |
done http://i.imgur.com/7aA6CBe.png |
| 15:30 |
nore |
Fixer: that was the opinion like 3 years ago, I should edit it out of game#515 probably |
| 15:30 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest_game/issues/515 -- [Discussion] Development direction |
| 15:47 |
twoelk |
red-002: there once was a gameless session on VanessaE's survival server. Connecting was fast and the world full of unknown content |
| 15:53 |
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| 15:56 |
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| 15:59 |
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| 16:12 |
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| 16:25 |
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| 16:36 |
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| 16:43 |
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| 17:00 |
DS-minetest |
why don't have chests an extra file? furnace has |
| 17:01 |
red-003 |
ad hoc? |
| 17:09 |
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| 17:11 |
Fixer |
modularise default |
| 17:11 |
Fixer |
if possible |
| 17:12 |
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| 17:13 |
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| 17:15 |
kaeza |
anybody knows offhand where the default player collision box is? |
| 17:17 |
sofar |
builtin in the code? |
| 17:19 |
kaeza |
nvm, found it |
| 17:19 |
kaeza |
I guess this is it? >m_collisionbox(-BS * 0.30, 0.0, -BS * 0.30, BS * 0.30, BS * 1.75, BS * 0.30), |
| 17:23 |
sofar |
that doesn't make any sense |
| 17:24 |
sofar |
oh, well, collision box ~= selection box |
| 17:24 |
sofar |
so yeah, maybe |
| 17:39 |
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| 17:49 |
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| 17:52 |
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| 17:52 |
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| 17:53 |
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| 17:58 |
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| 18:06 |
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| 18:23 |
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| 18:29 |
kilbith |
it looks like the middle mouse key ain't get-able from `get_player_control()` |
| 18:30 |
kilbith |
while irrlicht supports it: http://irrlicht.sourceforge.net/docu/structirr_1_1_s_event_1_1_s_mouse_input.html#a1a93f70157bfad1c15ae2a7c10745432 |
| 18:32 |
sofar |
there's plenty more valid buttons that are missed, but yes, middle is missing |
| 18:35 |
kilbith |
some of our users want the middle-click to get the pointed node in their inventory, but not destructing it |
| 18:36 |
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| 18:37 |
paramat |
kaeza https://github.com/minetest/minetest/blob/master/src/content_sao.cpp#L801 |
| 18:38 |
rubenwardy |
related: #2730 #4211 |
| 18:38 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/2730 -- Pick node by middle click |
| 18:38 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/4211 -- Being able to use middle Mouse button (button 3 aka scroll wheel) for controls |
| 18:38 |
kaeza |
paramat, thanks |
| 18:39 |
kaeza |
but the line I posted is enough for my purposes |
| 18:41 |
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| 18:45 |
paramat |
Fixer "... lack of development and will so it became so stagnant for years ..." see rate of commits in the last 2 years https://github.com/minetest/minetest_game/graphs/contributors half my time has been spent on it |
| 18:46 |
Fixer |
paramat: yeah, but still 2012-2014 was pretty stagnant |
| 18:47 |
Fixer |
2016-2017 looks much more active |
| 18:48 |
paramat |
yes it was neglected earlier |
| 18:52 |
Fixer |
MTG question, I can rotate default:wood but not default:cobble, what is the reason to not rotate cobble with screwdriver? |
| 18:52 |
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| 18:52 |
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| 18:53 |
Raven262 |
Cause it has same texture from all sides? |
| 18:53 |
Raven262 |
No one thought that rotating it would actually make it look different, thought it would |
| 18:53 |
Raven262 |
Is this a bug then? |
| 18:53 |
Fixer |
hard to say |
| 18:53 |
paramat |
intentional |
| 18:53 |
Raven262 |
really? |
| 18:54 |
paramat |
because it has been considered as looking the same in every rotation, although that's not exactly true |
| 18:55 |
Raven262 |
Why couldn't all "ordinary" nodes be rotated then? |
| 18:55 |
paramat |
but generally considering all texture packs, it's usually a random mess of stones |
| 18:56 |
Raven262 |
I'm not sure if it would have any purpose in rotating it anyway |
| 18:56 |
paramat |
param2 can be useful for other purposes so it's only reserved for rotation if needed |
| 18:56 |
Raven262 |
Ah, yes, didn't think of that |
| 18:57 |
Raven262 |
btw, will minetest get any coloured lightning at all? |
| 18:57 |
paramat |
wood planks only became rotatable a year ago or so |
| 18:58 |
paramat |
coloured light is a huge job, with changes to map format |
| 18:59 |
Raven262 |
Well, is it in plan, if there is some plan anyway |
| 19:00 |
Raven262 |
Since i have seen coloured text being added |
| 19:00 |
Raven262 |
Was that less of a job? |
| 19:00 |
paramat |
not really planned. coloured text is vastly easier there's no comparison |
| 19:00 |
Raven262 |
Ah. |
| 19:01 |
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| 19:02 |
Raven262 |
Well, there is one thing i would like to ask core devs. |
| 19:02 |
twoelk |
never knowing what a texture pack may be up to I would consider all blocks, slabs, stairs and walls of mtg should be rotatable |
| 19:02 |
Raven262 |
I noticed suspiciously large number of clients with the name consisting of a name starting with a capital letter + random 2 or 3 digit number. |
| 19:03 |
Raven262 |
On a single server i have been following in irc last few months (and earlier possibly) |
| 19:03 |
twoelk |
some new multicraft clone? |
| 19:03 |
Raven262 |
The minetest's copies are getting out of hand, a bit |
| 19:04 |
Raven262 |
People are joining from copies much more than from original minetest. |
| 19:04 |
Raven262 |
It is an insane amount of clients |
| 19:04 |
Raven262 |
one in every 10 minutes or so here |
| 19:05 |
Raven262 |
just joins, waits for a few moments, then leaves |
| 19:07 |
Raven262 |
Though one can ask a player what game is he playing, and he will respond with the name of the copy. |
| 19:07 |
Raven262 |
And copies are a bit outdated too, some minetest features crash them |
| 19:08 |
Raven262 |
which is nice, just tell a player to open a craft guide and see if it crashes him xD |
| 19:09 |
twoelk |
http://i.imgur.com/3ZXqqq7.png rotated cobble :-D |
| 19:09 |
Raven262 |
:O |
| 19:10 |
Fixer |
https://i.imgur.com/4AGRLxx.png monitoring particle use on server |
| 19:11 |
Fixer |
most of the time it is below 20 |
| 19:13 |
paramat |
would be good to be able to filter clients to only official MT clients |
| 19:14 |
Raven262 |
But, then copies could steal that part of the code too :P |
| 19:15 |
twoelk |
there had been discussions like that before |
| 19:16 |
Raven262 |
How would server know if the client is minetest, not a copy? |
| 19:16 |
Raven262 |
Maybe ask for version? |
| 19:17 |
nerzhul |
paramat, it's very very difficult to filter because we don't have any idea about this |
| 19:17 |
paramat |
ok |
| 19:19 |
twoelk |
also such a feature could be missused and clones usually have enough interest to quickly hack around any signiture or whatever |
| 19:19 |
paramat |
#5744 |
| 19:19 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5744 -- Caverns: Remove unnecessary liquid excavation by paramat |
| 19:21 |
nerzhul |
it's easy to spoof data :) |
| 19:21 |
nerzhul |
like the current random player names to bypass guest ban |
| 19:21 |
red-003 |
well I guess it's a bit better then guest names? |
| 19:22 |
Raven262 |
Better? Now we don't enev know which name is randomly generated and which is not? xD |
| 19:22 |
Raven262 |
*even |
| 19:23 |
red-003 |
could you post an example of some of the names? |
| 19:24 |
Raven262 |
Krutsch380 Delrosario398 Kenady973 Babula777 Diesel234 Milledge562 Largent249 Hugghins283 Sandahl227 Gloeckner506 Brightharp319 Terhark486 |
| 19:25 |
Raven262 |
brought to you from craig's server |
| 19:25 |
Raven262 |
I have no idea on how could one generate such different names. |
| 19:26 |
nerzhul |
just have a list, add random number, finished |
| 19:26 |
Raven262 |
list? |
| 19:26 |
Raven262 |
that is one great job to get this many names |
| 19:26 |
Raven262 |
There are hundreds of them, about 15 new every day |
| 19:26 |
red-003 |
considering the quality of these clients there is probalay an giant array of names somewhere in the code |
| 19:26 |
Raven262 |
lol |
| 19:27 |
Raven262 |
somebody is actually doing it |
| 19:28 |
Raven262 |
Well, you could ban clients from using a name that fits these parameters, Capital letter at the begining, 3 digits at the end |
| 19:29 |
Raven262 |
this would stop them for some time xD |
| 19:29 |
* Raven262 |
is afk. |
| 19:30 |
nerzhul |
Raven262, then i can ban you now ? |
| 19:30 |
Fixer |
why would you ban those names? |
| 19:30 |
Fixer |
it is certainly better than Saddie666 |
| 19:31 |
Fixer |
... and guest |
| 19:31 |
Raven262 |
Yeah, right |
| 19:31 |
Raven262 |
Bad idea |
| 19:32 |
Raven262 |
And, we knew sadies and guests were nameless |
| 19:32 |
Raven262 |
we don't know if someone is using an illegal client or not according to these new names |
| 19:33 |
red-003 |
someone should reverse engineer one of these clients and check how long the name list is |
| 19:33 |
Raven262 |
Sadies and Guests were better imo then |
| 19:34 |
Raven262 |
Lets see if i can get to know some client names |
| 19:36 |
Hijiri |
may or may not be actually illegal |
| 19:36 |
Hijiri |
even if it's not an official client |
| 19:37 |
Fixer |
i'm fine with those, why whould you ban them? just because of name? it is better than 666cutedogcapcake666 |
| 19:37 |
Raven262 |
Hmmm |
| 19:37 |
Raven262 |
Yes, you are right |
| 19:38 |
Hijiri |
Maybe if the name matches a particular pattern show the player a notice that they may be using an unofficial client |
| 19:38 |
Hijiri |
and only on the first time they log on, otherwise it's annoying |
| 19:39 |
Raven262 |
Yes, we need those names |
| 19:39 |
red-003 |
some many of these apps don't link to their real source code |
| 19:39 |
red-003 |
so* |
| 19:39 |
red-003 |
not some |
| 19:40 |
Hijiri |
nobody has made a DMCA against them? |
| 19:40 |
Hijiri |
DMCA takedown request I mean |
| 19:40 |
red-003 |
too much effort to dmca all of them |
| 19:40 |
kilbith |
nerzhul once a time ago |
| 19:40 |
Hijiri |
(though congress made the DMCA against them) |
| 19:41 |
Calinou |
yeah, we need to ban all usernames ending with 3 numbers I gues :( |
| 19:41 |
Calinou |
guess* |
| 19:42 |
Calinou |
there probably is a list somewhere in the APK |
| 19:42 |
Calinou |
if someone can get it in plain text, jackpot |
| 19:42 |
Raven262 |
If someone could get to know which app are we looking for |
| 19:42 |
Hijiri |
they'll just create some other random name scheme |
| 19:42 |
red-003 |
Calinou, I remeber once opening one of these in a deassmbler and I'm pretty sure the list was embedded in the binary |
| 19:42 |
red-003 |
disassmbler* |
| 19:42 |
Hijiri |
showing a notice is less likely to cause enough complaints for them to switch it up |
| 19:43 |
Calinou |
this is whack-a-mole anyway |
| 19:43 |
Calinou |
we have to do it, this is getting out of hand |
| 19:43 |
red-003 |
that was a while ago through |
| 19:43 |
Raven262 |
Maybe they are overhearing this as we speak. |
| 19:43 |
Calinou |
heh |
| 19:43 |
red-003 |
and I don't remeber which app this was |
| 19:43 |
Raven262 |
How does one get this minetest clone? |
| 19:44 |
Calinou |
Google Play I guess |
| 19:44 |
Hijiri |
there are multiple |
| 19:44 |
Calinou |
aka. Hell on Earth |
| 19:44 |
red-003 |
^ |
| 19:44 |
Raven262 |
so google play then? |
| 19:45 |
nerzhul |
for the DCMA, only unlegit fork can be nuked (no source providen an no reference to MT) |
| 19:45 |
twoelk |
what is the most recent data on OS usage with minetest? how high is the android share on servers now? |
| 19:45 |
red-003 |
apple app store encrypts the binary so you are out of luck if it's not in plain text somewhere |
| 19:45 |
red-003 |
~90% |
| 19:45 |
nerzhul |
the only real way to fight against them is to change the license, but i don't think we will ever do it, to use GPLv3 + CC by NC SA for textures etc |
| 19:45 |
Raven262 |
Guys, there are just so many copies |
| 19:46 |
red-003 |
we know |
| 19:46 |
Raven262 |
What is needed for a license change? |
| 19:47 |
nerzhul |
signature of all contributor since MT birth :p |
| 19:48 |
twoelk |
Raven262: https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=16020 <-- add any new info here |
| 19:50 |
Raven262 |
signature? |
| 19:50 |
Raven262 |
Are you all just hiding your identities? |
| 19:51 |
Raven262 |
twoelk, well this is quite a list already. |
| 19:51 |
twoelk |
probably not complete |
| 19:52 |
Raven262 |
But, why people play clones rather than the original game anyway? |
| 19:52 |
Fixer |
wait a second... are particles on dig are rendered for _everybody_ ? |
| 19:54 |
Calinou |
please no CC BY-NC-SA |
| 19:54 |
Calinou |
it's the root of all evil |
| 19:54 |
Calinou |
(someone could replace all textures if they wanted, too…) |
| 19:54 |
Calinou |
so this won't even solve your problem |
| 19:54 |
Calinou |
there are plenty of freely-licensed texture packs out there |
| 19:54 |
Calinou |
Fixer: nope, only yourself |
| 19:54 |
sofar |
perhaps move this discussion to -hub? |
| 19:55 |
twoelk |
most clones are availiable at places players look for new games and some are maybe easier to install |
| 19:56 |
nerzhul |
a good way to have players can be to distribute on steam, there is more control than play store, but it's not easy to distribute on steam and have some costs |
| 19:57 |
Raven262 |
So, is minetest going to be added to steam? |
| 19:57 |
Raven262 |
Are there any against it? |
| 19:57 |
twoelk |
do you volanteer? ;-P |
| 19:58 |
Raven262 |
lol |
| 20:04 |
Raven262 |
adding a game on steam requires money, right? |
| 20:04 |
Raven262 |
Now, how do we get money? |
| 20:04 |
Raven262 |
Donations should do |
| 20:04 |
Raven262 |
I mean it is not that expensive, right? |
| 20:05 |
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kilbith joined #minetest-dev |
| 20:09 |
* Raven262 |
is away |
| 20:12 |
nerzhul |
Raven262, no time for this, we have a release to manage, please talk about this on minetest-hub |
| 20:13 |
twoelk |
http://i.imgur.com/bnlnN3s.png 3digit names at spawn on JT2 right now |
| 20:16 |
sofar |
move it to -hub please |
| 21:07 |
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| 21:17 |
nerzhul |
guys, just a question, why we use u32, u8 etc, instead of cstdint types ? uint8_t, int64_t etc ? (which is standard) ? It's only due to irrlicht stupidity ? |
| 21:17 |
nerzhul |
celeron55, ^? |
| 21:17 |
rubenwardy |
nicer |
| 21:17 |
rubenwardy |
do you really want to type uint32_t everytime? |
| 21:18 |
celeron55 |
if i started minetest now, i'd even alias std::string as ss_ or something |
| 21:18 |
rubenwardy |
lol |
| 21:18 |
sfan5 |
s::s |
| 21:18 |
celeron55 |
that's what i do in new C++ projects |
| 21:18 |
sfan5 |
does c++ even allow tht |
| 21:18 |
sfan5 |
i wonder |
| 21:18 |
nerzhul |
except the character typing speedup (which is a non sense, just use an IDE on a such project) it's standard :p |
| 21:19 |
rubenwardy |
it's ugly and less readable |
| 21:19 |
nerzhul |
celeron55, on private C++ projects maybe but for opensource it's not good to have such unreadable variable (ss_ :p) |
| 21:20 |
celeron55 |
well, i just don't agree with common C++ practices generally either |
| 21:20 |
celeron55 |
so don't ask me if you want common practices |
| 21:20 |
nerzhul |
especially for external contribution, for the u8/u32 it's understandable, i just mean, why this choice |
| 21:20 |
nerzhul |
just to keep some disk space to run on window 3.1 and OS hard disk drives ? :p |
| 21:20 |
nerzhul |
or zx spectrum ^^ |
| 21:21 |
celeron55 |
i don't see why it's so bad to shorten common things |
| 21:21 |
celeron55 |
i think humans generally like to do that |
| 21:21 |
nerzhul |
for std::unordered_map<std::string, std::string> yeah :D StringMap is quite good ^^ |
| 21:22 |
nerzhul |
but uint8_t vs u8 :) |
| 21:23 |
celeron55 |
if you can't call it C++, then call it Minetest C++ |
| 21:23 |
nerzhul |
:o |
| 21:23 |
Fixer |
https://i.imgur.com/U0TI360.png |
| 21:29 |
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Fixer |
https://i.imgur.com/OC7Fc0A.png |
| 21:32 |
Calinou |
the latter might just be an altitude graph of the French Alps |
| 21:32 |
Calinou |
who knows |
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