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IRC log for #minetest, 2016-07-09

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:00 everamzah ok, i'd put the settings specific to your server in a separate file, and use --config <filename.conf> to load with those settings.  eg minetest --server --config server.conf
00:01 everamzah !server fun caves
00:01 MinetestBot everamzah: [FCS] Fun Caves | lumaria.duckdns.org | Clients: 0/15, 0/0 | Version: 0.4.14-dev / minetest | Ping: 124ms
00:02 jackthegreat hmm
00:02 everamzah i want to change the name but i dunno what
00:02 everamzah I wanted to change it to Fun Cakes and put a cake in there, but decided against it
00:02 jackthegreat so how many .conf files do you have?
00:02 everamzah incidentally, on the host machine, i have just one
00:03 jackthegreat just minetest.conf right?
00:03 everamzah but i still do --config fun_caves.minetest.conf ... you can name it anything you want (just not late_for_dinner.conf)
00:03 everamzah and then use --config <absolute or relative path>
00:06 jackthegreat wait a sec...
00:06 jackthegreat im gonna copy your entire .conf and replace mine
00:07 jackthegreat !up 66.249.65.23
00:07 MinetestBot 66.249.65.23:30000 seems to be down
00:09 everamzah !up lumaria.duckdns.org
00:09 MinetestBot lumaria.duckdns.org:30000 is up (129ms)
00:09 jackthegreat sigh
00:09 jackthegreat i cant figure out what is wrong
00:09 jackthegreat i basically had the same thing as you except i took out and replaced with mine
00:10 everamzah so you're using --config argument now?  with a configuration file specific to the server you're trying to start?
00:11 everamzah let's see it on pastebin again.  there must be some other site.  is that what gists are for?  probably not
00:12 jackthegreat http://pastebin.com/AS8t8rXu
00:12 everamzah what does it say for "listening on" when you start the server?
00:12 everamzah mine says: "listening on 0.0.0.0:30000"
00:12 everamzah (that must be the bind_address = setting)
00:13 everamzah interesting, that looks just like mine!  and mine works so... heh, not a clue
00:13 jackthegreat lol
00:14 jackthegreat but now that i replaced it, the window wont start at all
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00:14 jackthegreat so that file is all you have right
00:14 everamzah replaced?
00:14 everamzah i don't think you were supposed to replace anything
00:14 jackthegreat no i mean after i used yours
00:15 everamzah yes i only have/use one config file
00:15 everamzah but i don't launch the client on that computerr
00:15 everamzah if i hosted and played on the same computer, then i would use two.  one for the server process, and one for the client
00:15 jackthegreat what is a client?
00:16 jackthegreat oh
00:16 everamzah server config would be like, address, port, description
00:16 everamzah client config would be like, key binding, texture pack, etc
00:16 jackthegreat so ill need to test on a different computer?
00:16 everamzah you can mix them all together, it's not problem, i just think it makes it easier to read separate
00:16 everamzah no, not at all
00:16 everamzah when i started running a minetest server, i started up the GUI, checked the Public box, and that was it
00:16 everamzah i even stayed connected overnight because i didn't want the server to shut off haha
00:17 jackthegreat what is a graphical user interface
00:17 jackthegreat actually do i need to create it?
00:17 everamzah the GUI/
00:17 everamzah no
00:17 jackthegreat 17:30: ACTION[Main]: Server for gameid="minetest" listening on 0.0.0.0:30000.
00:18 jackthegreat thats what it says alright
00:18 everamzah my clock must be behind
00:18 everamzah it's 20:20 here
00:18 jackthegreat !up 66.249.65.23
00:18 everamzah anyway, it might help to completely start over
00:18 MinetestBot 66.249.65.23:30000 seems to be down
00:18 everamzah delete everything and just try again from scratch
00:18 jackthegreat sniffle
00:19 everamzah because if you set server_address = 66.249.65.23
00:19 everamzah and you have port 30000 forwarded to the host machine
00:19 everamzah it really very well should work, and without a lot of fuss
00:19 jackthegreat and thats exactly what i did... unless my external ip is wrong somehow lol
00:20 everamzah well i was able to ping it.  i did notice that the ip you gave is different to the one on your IRC
00:20 everamzah jackthegreat (185e0bf2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.24.94.11.242) has joined #minetest
00:20 everamzah i dunno if that makes a difference, tho
00:20 jackthegreat hmmm
00:20 everamzah !up 24.94.11.242
00:20 jackthegreat your right
00:20 MinetestBot 24.94.11.242:30000 seems to be down
00:21 everamzah and you had the port 30000 forwarded to the correct host on your internal LAN?  so if your computer's IP is 192.168.1.100, then any incoming connections on port 30000 in your router would go there?
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00:22 everamzah i usually google "what's my ip address" to find mine out -- never seems to change anymore tho
00:22 everamzah i tried turning it off and back on again, to no avail
00:22 jackthegreat 2606:6000:c741:b800:d9d4:8997:b8b1:2c18
00:22 everamzah omg what is THAT
00:22 jackthegreat this is my ip address lol
00:22 * everamzah runs away
00:22 jackthegreat when i search it up, 2 comes up
00:23 jackthegreat one is the 22. something
00:23 jackthegreat another is the 66.249.
00:23 jackthegreat and a third says 86.169.
00:23 jackthegreat lol
00:23 everamzah weird, i only have one ip :'(
00:24 everamzah well try putting all of them in server_address =, one at a time, and see which one works
00:24 jackthegreat for port forwarding you did UDP right
00:24 everamzah yep
00:24 jackthegreat hm
00:24 everamzah what's the ip for your computer that you're trying to run the server on?
00:24 jackthegreat did you make both external and internal port 30000
00:24 everamzah i think it's ipconfig or something in windows
00:25 jackthegreat my internal ip is 192.168.0.11
00:25 everamzah oh, mine didn't ask.  it just says port number to be forwarded.
00:25 everamzah so on your router, under port forwarded, you have incoming connections on port 30000 go to 192.168.0.11 ?
00:27 jackthegreat my router doesnt even have the "incoming connections
00:28 jackthegreat "incoming connections" tab
00:28 everamzah well i paraphrased, i dunno what it'll be labeled.  "port forwarding" or something
00:28 everamzah but my point was that any connections from the outside world to your router, on port 30000, go to 192.168.0.11?
00:29 everamzah the host ip of the minetest server?
00:29 jackthegreat nope
00:32 everamzah because the connections to your router from the outside world on port 30000 need to go to the host machine running minetest
00:32 jackthegreat ok how do i check if any connections are going to the host machine?
00:35 everamzah i don't know, but i don't think they are, otherwise i'd have been able to connect and !up would have worked -- you'd have been listed
00:35 twoelk everamzah pinged your computer a while ago, rightß
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00:35 everamzah but i don't know.  i just think that if you have port 30000 forwarded to the correct host IP, and you have server_address to the correct external IP, then it really should Just Work
00:36 jackthegreat thats what i thought to
00:36 twoelk on windows you might have to ad an exception to the firewall
00:36 everamzah 24.94.11.242 is the IP i get from /whois jackthegreat
00:37 everamzah i think that's the one to use for server_address
00:37 twoelk and servers may appear somewhat later on the list after the server started
00:37 everamzah no?
00:37 everamzah well that one i can't ping to.  but 66.249.65.23 i still can
00:38 everamzah !up 66.249.65.23
00:38 MinetestBot ...
00:38 everamzah if you figure it out let us know
00:38 jackthegreat lol
00:39 jackthegreat ok im checking mmy router, it says for ip address is 24.94.11.242
00:39 jackthegreat but 66.249.65.23 is the one i get when i search up online
00:42 everamzah can you ping 24.94.11.242?  i can't
00:43 jackthegreat yep i can
00:44 jackthegreat i am also able to ping 66.249
00:44 everamzah that one i can too, and that's the one in server_address config setting
00:45 jackthegreat yep
00:45 everamzah so maybe it is a router issue hrm :/
00:45 everamzah either that or one of those windows firewall exception dealies
00:45 jomat 66.249.65.23 is a Google address
00:45 jackthegreat grr that would suck
00:45 everamzah haha oh it is?
00:45 everamzah why doesn't google have their minetestserver up?
00:45 jackthegreat lol
00:46 everamzah yes looks like square one here jack
00:47 jackthegreat unfortunately
00:47 twoelk you could dissable the firewall, call the server from here and put the firewall back up, just to check if that is blocking you
00:47 jackthegreat cant be
00:48 jackthegreat i allowed minetest to pass through
00:48 jackthegreat but when i try port forwarding to 24.94.11.2424, it says it isnt a valid ip
00:48 everamzah 2424?
00:49 everamzah 24.94.11.242
00:49 jackthegreat yep
00:49 jackthegreat meant that
00:49 everamzah that's what i got from your /whois, but wasn't able to ping it.  is that normal?
00:49 everamzah if that's your publicly accessible ip, then put _that_ in server_address field
00:50 everamzah worth a try anyway
00:50 everamzah !up 24.94.11.242
00:50 MinetestBot 24.94.11.242:30000 seems to be down
00:52 jackthegreat alright im going to stop for today, might giv eup : (
00:53 everamzah yes, rest, take a break for sure
00:53 everamzah next time with fresh eyes, maybe it will be easier
00:53 jackthegreat thanks for spending so much time everamzah trying to help me
00:53 everamzah it's my pleasure.  good luck, and have a nice evening
00:53 jackthegreat you too
00:53 jackthegreat and thanks
00:53 everamzah thx
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08:22 agaran Hello, perhaps it is know but if register_craft you pass recipe = {'node:name'}, game will crash on load instead of reporting error that it is incorrect structure passed..
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08:24 agaran also it seems that you can't have two shaped recipes with 1 item only differing with placement and having different result object..
08:26 Krock hi. Could you please post a pastebin link for that crash code?
08:28 agaran ok
08:29 agaran minetest.register_craft({ output = "dye:red", recipe = { 'dye:blue' } })
08:29 agaran lua eats it happily, then game crashes on load
08:30 agaran I understand it is -wrong- recipe, but still..
08:30 agaran sorry for QA morning ;)
08:34 Krock did you add "dye" to your depends.txt file?
08:38 agaran yes, original code was making result that is from my module and was using only my module provided node types.
08:39 agaran I am just playing with minetest for maybe month, discovered technic, mesecons, now messing with own things to get cables more to my liking etc..
08:39 agaran and above was result of one liner to convert back spare cables.. got crash so dug around..
08:44 Krock agaran, I see the problem. Check this out: minetest.register_craft({ output = "dye:red", recipe = { {'dye:blue'} } })
08:46 Krock the additional bracket on the inner side is used to seperate the craft table lines (horizontal)
08:47 agaran yes, I know
08:47 agaran I mean, game should not crash if lua accepted syntax...
08:47 agaran I perfectly understand that my recipe was lua-side correct but game-side incorrect
08:48 agaran sorry if I did not phrased it well enough
08:49 Krock there are many issues that go into that direction. Usually when the game expects another argument type of the function
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08:50 agaran I guess, I just thought it is good to report such as static structure is easier to examine than function signature..
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09:02 MinetestBot [git] numberZero -> Jeija/minetest-mod-mesecons: Command block server crash fixed f9f7600 https://git.io/vKsVI (2016-07-09T11:01:27+02:00)
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09:21 MinetestBot [git] cheapie -> Jeija/minetest-mod-mesecons: Don't bother checking if a node can overheat before cooling it acd41b5 https://git.io/vKsVH (2016-07-09T11:17:08+02:00)
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12:17 XeonSquared Is there a good way to keep mods up-to-date from the command line?
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12:26 Calinou XeonSquared: clone them using Git, then call "git pull" inside the mod folder :P
12:26 Calinou this works on all platforms
12:26 XeonSquared Sane enough.
12:26 Calinou https://gist.github.com/Ca​linou/93938dc92484bc5e89f0
12:26 XeonSquared Scriptable too.
12:27 XeonSquared I'll do that, thanks
12:27 Calinou use this for updating all Git repositories contained in a folder
12:28 XeonSquared My issue with that
12:28 XeonSquared is that I don't know if stuff will always be in that dir and loadable as a mod
12:28 XeonSquared if that makes sense
12:29 Calinou don't worry, it skips non-Git repositories automagically
12:30 XeonSquared no but like
12:30 XeonSquared if there's a mod that has say
12:30 XeonSquared the mod in a subfolder of the main git repo
12:30 XeonSquared is that an issue?
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12:38 everamzah !up 172.101.13.131
12:38 MinetestBot 172.101.13.131:30000 is up (123ms)
12:38 everamzah oops
12:38 everamzah !up 172.101.13.131 30001
12:38 MinetestBot 172.101.13.131:30001 is up (128ms)
12:39 agaran is there oposite function to string.split ?
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12:52 agaran found, table.concat
12:57 agaran is there something that gets called during loading of game to pass data from nodes in-world to module to which they belong or I am missing point?
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12:59 EvPix Hello, here speak on russian?
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13:08 EvPix I only have one question. Why not make a 3d model of the torch, why 2d texture? She did not look the part.
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13:12 everamzah i don't know, but there is https://github.com/minetest-mods/torches anyway
13:14 EvPix And somehow Performance on AMD A6-4400M in minetest not good.
13:15 EvPix Occur periodically hang for 5 seconds.
13:17 EvPix Video card: AMD Raderon HD 7520G + HD 7400M Dual Graphics
13:17 EvPix Radeon not Raderon
13:18 EvPix Answer please
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13:22 EvPix Answer please, guys.
13:29 EvPix Why Intel Pentium 64bit better AMD A6-4400M performance?
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13:31 EvPix My PC Intel Pentium better better than my laptop processor AMD A6-4400M?
13:32 EvPix why everyone is silent?
13:33 EvPix everyone is asleep, or you do not want me to answer?
13:33 shangul im asleep
13:34 EvPix how can you sleep if you answer me?
13:34 everamzah EvPix: performance in minetest is not good
13:34 everamzah that is a known issue
13:35 everamzah in fact, when i played it for the first time, i was rather appalled
13:36 EvPix read my question about CPUs
13:36 XeonSquared Well I mean
13:36 XeonSquared It's not particuarly good on high-end systems
13:36 XeonSquared but it copes really well on low-end systems
13:37 everamzah maybe.  if there's more than one core
13:38 everamzah the biggest factor, i find, is whether you're running the server with the mapgen
13:38 everamzah or just the client.  old PC with minetest singleplayer world = too slow
13:38 EvPix So it turns out that my computer processor is better than the more productive laptop?
13:39 everamzah i don't know, but if your machine is running just the client than it will be much faster
13:39 everamzah then*
13:40 EvPix I play on the server, 200 players on it.
13:40 everamzah 200 players eh?  impressive!
13:41 EvPix although the Russian community has 2,000 players on the server
13:42 everamzah quake
13:43 EvPix what? it's too much?
13:43 everamzah i wouldn't know
13:44 tpe I would say a more efficient engine would be beneficial (the whole high end not scaling is weird) but I understand that a switch to something else wouldn't be trivial.
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13:45 EvPix Russian community server is running on a machine with intel core i7.
13:46 EvPix 2000 players
13:46 EvPix on it
13:46 everamzah so that's #1 -- when you say performance is poor, we must specify: do we mean the performance of the client? (graphics)
13:47 everamzah or do we mean the performance of server (many players, mapgen, etc)
13:47 everamzah and of course, both server+client on one machine doesn't cater well to >2 players
13:47 everamzah (on my hardware, anyway)
13:47 EvPix Yes graphics and bottlenecks world generation.
13:47 everamzah well server doesn't do graphics
13:48 everamzah just client, and if only client performance is bad, lower graphics settings
13:48 everamzah change max_fps to 30 or so
13:48 everamzah that 2x performance boost, no?
13:49 EvPix now, and so more and 60 fps
13:50 EvPix I think the world is optimized generators.
13:50 everamzah lost me on that one
13:50 * Krock gets constant 25 fps in a singleplayer world. Athlong 64 4000+ (singlecore) @0.8 MHz (when idle in Minetest)
13:50 Krock * 0.8 GHz
13:50 Krock *Athlon
13:51 Krock Aagh.. there's again a typo monster around
13:51 everamzah rawr
13:52 EvPix now it working intel pentium 64bit on my PC.
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13:53 EvPix Oh, and wondering when in minetest will add a lot of different items and monsters?
13:54 everamzah minetest is an engine
13:54 everamzah minetest game has a bunch of stuff, but is kept minimal (heh) on purpose
13:54 everamzah see discussions at https://github.com/minetest/minetest_game
13:55 everamzah additional subgames offer a wealth of feature/items -- singular mods add just what you need
13:55 everamzah if you haven't already, puruse the mods subforums at forum.minetest.net
13:55 EvPix I thought that minetest game.
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13:57 EvPix The only thing that did not suit me so it is the speed of the mods on lua.
13:57 everamzah well it really depends on the mod.  if it adds just 1 item, that wouldn't affect much
13:58 everamzah but if it's a complex mod that does a lot of different functions constantly, yes it could be poor
13:58 everamzah but remember, you multiply these things by number of connected players
13:58 everamzah so if it's slow normally, then it'll be slow x 2000 for your server
13:59 EvPix This mod is working very slowly https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?t=629
13:59 everamzah (i don't actually math)
13:59 everamzah oooh
13:59 everamzah yes did u install luasocket?!?!
13:59 EvPix yes
14:00 everamzah oh i think it's only spawning that affects speed of... i dk that mod well, but it's a nice one
14:00 everamzah it is slow tho.  mobs_redo is generally considered fast enough
14:00 everamzah i am fond of CME also
14:01 everamzah mobs are probably going to add a lot of bottleneck to server in general.  i've seen mobs_redo mobs get kinda outta control too
14:01 EvPix Why not do fashion game in a dll libraries?
14:01 everamzah are you using LuaJIT?
14:02 everamzah also, i am not on windows and don't generally use wine
14:02 * XeonSquared gets a solid 20FPS on this https://a.pomf.cat/ucibaf.png box
14:02 EvPix everamzah: no
14:02 EvPix not luajit
14:03 everamzah did u download a precompiled windows binaries?
14:03 everamzah i kinda assumed they came with luajit
14:03 Krock they all come with LuajIT
14:03 MinetestBot [git] Snipie -> minetest/minetest: Fix typos (#4298) 4c530de https://git.io/vKs1w (2016-07-10T00:00:14+10:00)
14:03 everamzah so if you downloaded precompiled windows binaries, you are using luajit then ok
14:04 EvPix XeonSquared: upload please on imgur.com.
14:04 XeonSquared mmk
14:04 everamzah but if you're using animals modpack i think you need luasocket to make it faster, that's from recollect tho
14:04 XeonSquared man people don't trust pomf clones outside of imageboards
14:05 XeonSquared https://i.imgur.com/0HrwvVK.png
14:05 EvPix but what is it?
14:06 EvPix pyramid?
14:08 EvPix In minetest certainly has a future but only in a few areas of games, space procedurally generated worlds, minecraft-like and all!
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14:11 EvPix I personally minetest kospicheskuyu remade in the game with a completely redesigned the infinite universe and the core with high capacity generation.
14:11 EvPix space game
14:13 EvPix But unfortunately a greater realization minetest not do.
14:14 EvPix Has anyone tried to remake minetest another game?
14:15 EvPix If not, I'll probably go and will not disturb the silence chatting minetest.
14:16 everamzah :) good chatting
14:17 EvPix Ok, well I'm leaving.
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15:36 Calinou in soviet Russia...
15:36 everamzah quake plays you
15:37 everamzah i have it in my mind every russian gamer has to play quake as like some requisite.  i refuse to believe anything to the contrary
15:37 est31 joke makes fun of you
15:38 everamzah harosh
15:41 MinetestBot [git] t4im -> minetest/minetest_game: Doors: Remove unnecessary node lookups 5943653 https://git.io/vKsSz (2016-07-09T16:34:28+01:00)
15:41 MinetestBot [git] t4im -> minetest/minetest_game: Always return the leftover ItemStack for on_place and on_rightclick 71c7e21 https://git.io/vKsS2 (2016-07-09T16:32:41+01:00)
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16:08 heyX3 hey
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17:09 Obito hi
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17:15 Obito mech are you here ?
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19:02 everamzah !server joeychloe
19:02 MinetestBot everamzah: No results
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19:58 shangul miner is cool. he mined about 5kn for me!
19:59 shangul now i have a big long tunnel!
20:00 shangul i mean a network of these tunnels
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20:02 agaran miner ?
20:03 shangul yea
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22:02 shangul why people play mc instead of mt?
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22:11 Hijiri more features, more extensive mods and mod community
22:13 shangul ah
22:13 Hijiri mobs maybe, but I don't remember caring about them particularly
22:13 Hijiri There aren't a lot of MT mods with deep tech trees, for example
22:13 Hijiri those can be engaging if combined with the tech actually mattering
22:14 Hijiri actually, maybe the gameplay is what makes a mod engaging, but the tech trees stretch it out so it feels like you have some sense of progression along with it
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22:14 Volkj always asked if the reason MC has more extensive mods is technical (e.g. MT can't do what MC mods can) or just the modder ability
22:14 shangul is there any real sandbox computer mod?
22:15 Hijiri shangul: I am working on a lisp computers mod
22:15 Hijiri the vm will be written completely in lua so I can control computation  time and memory use
22:15 shangul where to download it?
22:15 Hijiri it's not ready yet
22:15 Hijiri I only have the lexer and parser ready
22:16 Hijiri I have a good idea of how the VM will work though, and have been writing the design down so I know how to do it
22:16 shangul ok where i can getnot ready mod?
22:16 Hijiri It's on my github, but it's not a mod yet
22:16 Volkj a reason may be that MT has a modding api and you can't go over it while MC, not having official mods, can work deeper in the code, in a situation similar to Chrome vs Firefox extensions
22:17 Hijiri also with Java jar files you can just insert junk into it
22:18 Hijiri with a program compiled like MT you would need to use a modified shared library that inserted hooks into minetest or something, to get an "unofficial mod system" where you modify the game directly, like mc does
22:18 Hijiri with MC the jar file has compiled class files in it and you can just replace those
22:19 Volkj so MT has "extensions" more than "mods"?
22:19 Hijiri more like "mods" in MT means "modules" rather than "modifications"
22:19 Volkj i see
22:20 shangul !server
22:20 MinetestBot shangul: *** BuildersWorld *** by Telesight | buildersworld.telesight.nl:30003 | Clients: 0/20, 0/3 | Version: 0.4.13 / minetest | Ping: 6ms
22:20 shangul yay
22:20 shangul 0.4.13
22:20 shangul but 0 clients?
22:21 Hijiri But a lot of the extensive mods that MC has could be implemented with most of their gameplay intact as MT mods
22:21 Hijiri except some things having to do with mobs
22:21 Volkj are mobs a "low-level" stuff compared to other things?
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22:22 Hijiri mob AI is computationally expensive, and if you have to make a lot of API calls interleaved with your AI then it gets more expensive since API calls are expensive
22:22 shangul what can i do with sword while there's no enemy?
22:22 Volkj shangul: cutting leaves
22:22 Hijiri hit people
22:23 shangul lol
22:24 shangul i found a skyblock, what can i do with it?
22:24 Hijiri skyblock the mod?
22:24 shangul no
22:24 Hijiri cloud node?
22:24 shangul yea
22:24 Hijiri I don't know
22:24 Hijiri decoration maybe
22:24 shangul why u say node?
22:25 Hijiri "blocks" in minetest are called nodes
22:25 shangul ik
22:25 shangul why u say node?
22:25 Hijiri Why do I personally call them nodes, or why are they officially called nodes?
22:26 Volkj imho using a common word helps in modding
22:26 shangul officaly
22:26 shangul *ll
22:27 Hijiri I don't know, I guess because they are an element of the map, and node is a generic name for components of things
22:27 Hijiri I've never read about why they decided to call them nodes
22:27 shangul aw
22:27 shangul k
22:28 Hijiri maybe because "block" is already associated with a map blocks, which are 16x16x16 pieces of the map
22:31 hmmmm joined #minetest
22:31 hmmmm http://www.golem.de/news/kommissionsberi​cht-merkel-und-laenderchefs-unterstuetze​n-kampf-gegen-adblocker-1606-121599.html
22:32 Hijiri off topic?
22:32 Hijiri not that I can read it
22:32 hmmmm it's #minetest
22:32 hmmmm not #minetest-dev
22:32 Hijiri oh yeah
22:32 hmmmm did you assume this was mtdev because i was chatting?  lol
22:34 Volkj happened to read something similar, seemed more oriented on the business model of adblock plus than on the adblocking itself
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