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IRC log for #minetest, 2015-05-02

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
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00:30 AndroidKris Anyone else use Steam?
00:31 sofar sure
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00:32 AndroidKris Any games you like?
00:36 sofar I've got almost 50 games in there, I think
00:36 sofar Lua question: how can I make a tool "wear" bar appear in the inventory for my tool?
00:37 Etzos I also use Steam.
00:43 Etzos sofar: Use `itemstack:add_wear(wearlevel)` where itemstack is an ItemStack and wearlevel is a number between 0 and 65535. This is typically done in the after_use callback of an item def.
00:43 sofar I can't do it in the on_use() ?
00:43 sofar I was calling that, no effect ...
00:44 Etzos It should still work in on_use() I believe.
00:44 VanessaE normally the game will set the wear level for you on use.  you shouldn't need to call it that at all...
00:44 VanessaE -it
00:44 sofar special case, I'm making a watering can
00:44 sofar the wear level equals "filled up"
00:44 sofar kind of like technic's mining laser?
00:45 VanessaE there's a water can in technic you might want to look at
00:45 VanessaE (hold 10 sources)
00:45 VanessaE holds*
00:45 Etzos Are you remembering to return the itemstack?
00:46 Etzos ^ sofar
00:46 VanessaE sofar: so....when are you gonna totally overtake the farming and farming-plus mods? :)
00:47 sofar VanessaE: I'd like to replace the default in-game crops, but I don't want to make a hodge-podge of crops
00:47 sofar I'm more interested in a few well balanced farming items
00:47 sofar and make them work really, really well
00:48 VanessaE ok
00:48 sofar basically, 30 crops is too much
00:48 sofar 2 is not enough
00:48 sofar imo the default game should have 6-8 crops max?
00:48 VanessaE 30 heh
00:48 VanessaE the default game has 2, which I agree isn't enough
00:48 sofar maybe I'll actually modify cotton and wheat as well
00:48 VanessaE farming_plus adds about 8 more.
00:49 sofar but, more importantly, I don't want 8 boring same-game-mechanic crops
00:49 sofar if all crops grow the same, work the same, etc. there's no reason to make more crops
00:49 VanessaE I'd like to be able to replace farming and/or farming_plus in dreambuilder with something better (but without leaving unknown nodes all around)
00:49 sofar the fun is in the little details that make each plant unique
00:50 sofar yes, once I'm done with features I might just take a stab at submitting it to minetest_game
00:50 VanessaE cool
00:50 sofar that would not cause any unknown nodes
00:51 sofar and I could change wheat seed mechanic better
00:51 sofar also, with wheat and tomatoes, I should add a pizza recipe
00:51 sofar :)
00:51 VanessaE heh
00:51 VanessaE but you need a mobs mod too
00:52 VanessaE (for the meat :) )
00:52 sofar yes, mobs, another contentious terrain with lots of mods
00:52 sofar not touching that one just yet ;)
00:53 sofar indeed, returning the itemstack was the missing bit
00:54 sofar Etzos: tyty
00:54 Etzos sofar: No problem. Rewriting the Lua API has hammered some of the things like that into my head even if I haven't made any mods. XD
00:55 sofar I've managed to cover quite a bit of the API at this point
00:55 sofar just did particles yesterday
00:55 sofar now I can show whether crops are withering or soaked
00:58 Etzos Speaking of the API, there doesn't happen to be a way to make blocks like sand or gravel fall after being set, does there?
00:59 sofar you can place() them instead of set_node() ?
00:59 sofar maybe follow that codepath to see where it would cause falling
01:00 Etzos I was hoping to avoid having to do that.
01:04 VanessaE Etzos: add them to the falling_node group I think
01:04 VanessaE or duh
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01:04 VanessaE those already are.
01:04 VanessaE call nodeupdate(pos) after placing them
01:05 Etzos nodeupdate(pos)?
01:06 VanessaE mmhmm
01:07 VanessaE that causes stuff to fall and light to be re-calculated for the given node position
01:07 sofar nice, I need to remember that
01:07 * sofar goes to open the chinese food delivery
01:07 VanessaE gimme!
01:08 sofar already fighting my wife over it
01:08 Etzos Hm. That's not in the lua_api.txt at all. Good to know though.
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01:15 Etzos VanessaE: Works wonderfully, thank you!
01:17 VanessaE yw
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02:15 Undertaker Megaf?
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02:37 kaeza_ Wrong chan...
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04:04 Undertaker alguem ?
04:05 Undertaker someone?
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08:08 xenkey Hi
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08:49 Krock hi
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09:34 xenkey Hi Krock
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11:02 Lemmmy how advanced have the bots become? https://forum.minetest.net/vi​ewtopic.php?p=177598#p177598
11:02 xenkey Not very evidently
11:02 Lemmmy haha
11:02 Lemmmy wait, nevermind i just realised it copied words from the OP
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12:07 _Raiz Where i can find the mintest configuration file in debian-based distros?
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12:16 ElectronLibre _Raiz, from where did you get it?
12:16 _Raiz $ apt-get install minetest minetest-server
12:17 _Raiz # **
12:17 ElectronLibre Ok, it should be around /usr/share/games/minetest/ or ~/.minetest/
12:17 ElectronLibre Anyway, the package is quite old, you should consider compiling it to get the last release.
12:17 _Raiz $ /usr/share/games/minetest$ ls -a
12:17 _Raiz .  ..  builtin  client  fonts  games  minetestmapper-colors.txt  textures
12:17 _Raiz Which i go now?
12:18 ElectronLibre Try ~/.minetest then.
12:18 _Raiz It has only "world"
12:18 ElectronLibre Have you already launched minetest yet?
12:18 ElectronLibre It will only be created after the first execution.
12:19 _Raiz I don't have X11 server, connecting to my VPS through a SSH client.
12:19 ElectronLibre Oh.
12:19 ElectronLibre Then try launching minetestserver, it will do the same.
12:20 _Raiz Nothing new, i did already.
12:22 ElectronLibre Hmm it should be there.
12:22 ElectronLibre Try minetest, it will not start, but maybe copy the minetest.conf
12:22 ElectronLibre (or at least minetest.conf.example
12:22 ElectronLibre )
12:22 _Raiz Where i should copy it to?
12:23 ElectronLibre It should be in ~/.minetest/ I think. I never really used the package, but it must be in there.
12:26 _Raiz Where i can get the git version of minetest?
12:27 ElectronLibre http://github.com/minetest/minetest/
12:27 ElectronLibre ^ Here for the actual HEAD. http://github.com/minetest/minetest/tree/0.4.12/ <= here for last stable.
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12:35 crazyR is there any reason why i would get this error even after fixing the env_meta.text file: ServerEnvironment::loadMeta(): EnvArgsEnd not found
12:36 crazyR *.txt
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12:36 ElectronLibre It means it is still corrupted.
12:37 clever minetest works as a good time sucker, neglecting my other work, lol
12:39 crazyR <ElectronLibre> the file is definatly ok... ive fixed this one a few times. but for some reason no matter what it just keeps throwing that error. think il delete the file and create a new one witht he correct data in see if that helps. :/
12:40 ElectronLibre Was the server shut down when you fixed it?
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12:45 crazyR yes.
12:47 ElectronLibre Ok.. The only thing it means it that the file cannot be loaded, I can't help you more ._.
12:48 crazyR hmmm i feel stupid.... wrong bloody dir. lmao. i need more sleep. i was trying to fix my testing world :/
12:49 crazyR 2 seprate harddrives let alone dir's lol
12:50 * ElectronLibre gives crazyR a failpoint to decorate the testing world's directory.
12:50 ElectronLibre At least you now know why it didn't work.
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12:51 crazyR lol yeah i was starting to think the hard drive was failing or something just as bad :/
12:52 crazyR can anyone think of a way to do this. im not a C++ dev so not sure how to do it: https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/2663
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12:54 ElectronLibre Resetting the file could be bad, for example, if you are able to fix it (like you did).
12:56 crazyR what would be bad about it? just wondering
12:58 crazyR i would think it would do no harm to call ServerEnvironment::saveMeta() and odify it so we can set the variables upon an env error
12:58 ElectronLibre I don't exactly remember what is contained in it, but if you want to keep these data, you may want to try fixing the file instead of resetting it.
12:58 crazyR *modify
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14:01 luizrpgluiz hi
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14:23 Krock What kind of bot is that? https://forum.minetest.net/search​.php?author_id=13942&amp;sr=posts
14:25 sfan5 a music bot
14:25 sfan5 obviously
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14:44 luizrpgluiz the better the version of opengl better the game performance?
14:45 Calinou not always
14:45 Calinou some OpenGL 3.3 cards deliver 60 FPS, some 4.5 cards deliver 30 FPS
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17:02 CWz Guys i found another android knockoff https://play.google.com/store/apps/deta​ils?id=com.pipsqueake.squeakecraftfree
17:03 CWz now i know why I saw lots of players named SqueakeCrafter
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17:14 CWz wow andriod store is full of minetest knockoff and minecraft ones as well
17:14 Calinou yeah, Mojang should probably get out and sue for trademark violation
17:14 Calinou it'd actually help us
17:15 Calinou but they don't to not get flak from community
17:18 CWz Squeakcraft also has a payed version it seems
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17:19 Calinou it's legal but only if they release source code under LGPL
17:19 Calinou they do not, so it's not legal
17:20 CWz it seems also that SqueakeCraft has this Guest like feature too so that will be annoying for servers
17:20 * CWz is looking at the client tab an i see SqueakeCrafter8443
17:21 Calinou time to ban *SqueakeCraft*
17:23 CWz and the worst part is the ads
17:24 Calinou Google should never have allowed apps in Play Store, they really do hurt experience
17:24 sfan5 Calinou: they need to provide the source if you ask
17:24 Etzos They're not in violation of the GPL.
17:24 Calinou “if you ask”
17:25 Calinou this is wrong
17:25 Etzos *LGPL
17:25 sfan5 they even state in the desc that you should ask for more information
17:25 Calinou they must provide it whenever they distribute a binary
17:25 Calinou to the recipients
17:25 sfan5 wrong
17:25 Calinou okay, ask licensing@fsf.org
17:25 Hijiri GPL you only need to say you can provide it
17:25 Calinou and see what happens
17:25 Hijiri and then provide it when asked
17:25 Hijiri actually I'm not sure, maybe the requirement is that it's somewhere accessible
17:27 Hijiri it says you need to include an offer, valid for 3 years, to give the source code
17:27 Calinou that's a written offer
17:28 Calinou not valid for electronic distribution
17:28 Hijiri oh
17:28 Hijiri I see
17:36 CWz wow it's passward fieild and username field are one
17:36 CWz *field
17:36 Etzos Under GPLv3+ the "written offer" also applies to non-physical forms.
17:37 Calinou Minetest is LGPLv2.1+
17:37 Etzos Correct.
17:37 Etzos That means it can be distributed under the terms of the LGPLv3.
17:37 Etzos Which follows the same "written offer" rules as the GPLv3.
17:38 CWz The worst part about SqueakeCraft that username = password
17:38 Calinou lol
17:39 CWz My guess is that this is to bypass the no-emptypasswords setting
17:40 Calinou we should have some password checks, like forbid username = password
17:43 Hijiri they could make it password = username ++ "pass"
17:47 ElectronLibre <Calinou> time to ban *SqueakeCraft* <= It would be nice to be able to ban using regexes, like in IRC.
17:48 Calinou name_restrictions does that
17:50 Hijiri has anyone approached squeakecraft about the violation?
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17:50 Calinou as if they were going to do anything…
17:50 Hijiri might be worth a nominal try
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19:08 Undertaker alguém?!
19:08 Undertaker estou tentando falar com o Megaf desde ontem mas ele parece não dar muita atenção para novos jogadores do servidor Megaf... :(
19:21 * CWz is gonna extract the squeakcraft_game
19:21 CWz intrestingly enough all the stuff seems to be in the minetest folder
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19:32 kaeza Greetings
19:35 jin_xi o hai
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19:43 CWz feels sorry for all those SqueakeCraft user joining mtz-basic now
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21:26 TheWild Hello, great devs
21:26 sfan5 hi
21:26 TheWild could someone help me understand the communication protocol, because I feel I missed something
21:27 sfan5 what did you try so far?
21:27 sfan5 or rather look at
21:27 TheWild there is no good protocol documentation like this http://wiki.vg/Protocol (it's unofficial btw) and I was looking at the code
21:27 TheWild http://pastebin.com/Dy3EyU8z
21:27 sfan5 we don't have a good protocol documentation, right
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21:28 sfan5 if you want to understand the protocol look into clientserver.h and the files that use the protocol (client.cpp, server.cpp)
21:29 sfan5 TheWild: I'd guess the 01 is TYPE_ORIGINAL (the packet just has no content)
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21:30 Undertaker Megaf_?
21:38 Undertaker porra!
21:38 Undertaker não posso jogar no seu servidor por causa desse sistema falho que você colocou
21:38 Undertaker não posso interagir com o servidor
21:45 sofar Undertaker: this is mostly an english channel... if you're looking for help you may be better off asking in english
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21:46 paxcoder Can a client be uniquely identified?
21:46 sofar paxcoder: with what information?
21:46 sofar paxcoder: by whom?
21:46 paxcoder sofar, by the server
21:47 paxcoder !up 87.110.8.195
21:47 MinetestBot 87.110.8.195:30000 seems to be down
21:47 paxcoder !up 87.110.8.195:30001
21:47 MinetestBot paxcoder: use 'example.org 1337' instead of 'example.org:1337'
21:47 paxcoder !up 87.110.8.195 30001
21:47 MinetestBot 87.110.8.195:30001 seems to be down
21:47 sofar paxcoder: not sure yet what you're asking for. You can have multiple clients on an IP address, so yeah, the server can identify each client separately
21:48 paxcoder sofar, i meant each build
21:48 sofar paxcoder: ahhhh, that makes more sense
21:49 paxcoder so that the server can perhaps give useful things to players, and yet prevent spamming new accounts to get them.
21:50 sofar wait, you just want the first login of a user to give him some one-time items?
21:50 paxcoder yep
21:52 paxcoder sofar, are you thinking, searching, or am i waiting in vain?
21:52 sofar all of those
21:52 paxcoder :D
21:52 sofar just kidding, only the first two ;)
21:53 xenkey All of the above [x]
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21:53 sofar so there's no event that I know of that you can use
21:53 sofar but there's an easy solution that isn't too bad
21:53 sofar first, you create a new permission called "present" or something like that
21:53 sofar and you make sure that it's given to new players by default
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21:54 xenkey Etzos: Ping.
21:54 sofar then, you allow those users to get something when they have that permission, and revoke it as they get their items
21:54 sfan5 sofar: ...or you just use on_newplayer
21:54 sofar lel
21:54 xenkey That ^
21:55 sofar sfan5: google failed us, all
21:55 xenkey Use ddg
21:55 xenkey Or bing
21:55 sfan5 look into lua_api.txt
21:55 sofar minetest.register_on_newplayer(function(player)
21:55 xenkey No
21:55 sofar https://github.com/minetest/minetest_game/b​lob/master/mods/give_initial_stuff/init.lua
21:55 xenkey )
21:55 sofar ?
21:56 sofar already a mod for that
21:56 xenkey You never closed the first
21:56 paxcoder sofar, how does any of that ensure only the first account gets the stuff?
21:56 xenkey Nupe
21:56 xenkey Set a limit on accounts
21:56 sofar paxcoder: I assume that event fires only when a new user account is added
21:56 xenkey !mod names_per_ip
21:56 MinetestBot xenkey: Names per IP [names_per_ip] by Calinou - https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?t=9768
21:59 paxcoder sofar, s/only when/every time/
21:59 sofar yeah, yuck, that's not helpful
21:59 sofar so then my method will work
22:00 sofar otherwise, you'd have to keep a table in memory and store it to make it persistent
22:00 paxcoder MinetestBot, that's different
22:00 paxcoder sofar, what's your method again?
22:00 sofar grant default priv, use that to give out stuff and revoke priv
22:01 paxcoder sofar, um...
22:01 paxcoder sofar, please explain how that addresses the issue
22:02 sofar privs are not granted every login, only on account creation or admin action
22:02 sofar so once the user loses the priv, he can't regain it
22:03 sofar so then you can use minetest.register_on_newplayer() to detect a user has that priv and revoke it
22:03 xenkey MinetestBot: what was that link again?
22:03 sfan5 sofar: thats does exactly the same as using on_newplayer
22:03 kaeza well, that's basically the same as on_newplayer
22:03 * kaeza purrs at sfan5
22:03 paxcoder sofar is so confused
22:03 * sfan5 meows at kaeza
22:04 * xenkey eats kaeza
22:04 kaeza D:
22:04 sofar I'm not confused
22:04 kaeza there's no reliable way to "identify" a client
22:04 kaeza in the sense that you mean
22:04 sofar oh, now I get it
22:05 sofar you want to prevent multiple accounts from one IP to get free stuff
22:05 paxcoder sofar, as sfan5 says, that does what on_newplayer does, only in a complicated way
22:05 paxcoder i want to prevent multiple accounts from one build to get initial things
22:05 xenkey Use names per ip
22:06 paxcoder no
22:06 TheWild sfan: nice, I was looking at everything in /network but not in the main directory. Now still confused, but I'll keep reading the code and maybe even understand what's going on, then craft some pretty doc
22:06 TheWild Thanks for help
22:06 kaeza paxcoder, it's possible to keep a register of name<->ip pairs, but that is not 100% reliable
22:07 xenkey Why not?
22:07 sfan5 TheWild: saying just "sfan" does not highlight me
22:07 xenkey A few mistakes can't hurt
22:07 xenkey Saying 'illegal' highlights me =D
22:08 paxcoder xenkey, because it's unreliable and prevents multiple players on the same ip
22:08 xenkey Or 'key'
22:08 kaeza paxcoder, you can be sure that (unless you reset your players DB), user "foo" will be the "same" user every time (again, not 100% reliable)
22:08 TheWild sfan5: I noticed that right after I wrote
22:08 sofar plus it'll false positive for players on a ipv6 tunnel, for instance
22:09 paxcoder kaeza, i'm interested to know whether user foo is user bar or not
22:09 xenkey He is not
22:09 xenkey Foo != bar
22:10 paxcoder -_-
22:10 xenkey Foo's IP might be the same as bar's
22:10 * paxcoder is getting frustrated
22:10 kaeza paxcoder, the MT protocol only has limited information on the client; currently only IP, name, and version info
22:10 xenkey That's all you can find out though
22:10 xenkey ^
22:11 kaeza it's basically like having a webserver and only having access to "User-Agent" and IP
22:13 kaeza unless you can code a mod that can detect user's behavioral patterns or something :P
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22:16 paxcoder Maybe a combo of creation timestamps for binaries
22:17 TheWild could Minetest discover another itself already running?
22:18 paxcoder TheWild, it could as well as other things do (like browsers which open tabs instead of new windows for example)
22:19 paxcoder TheWild, but that doesn't solve the problem because I'm not after banning multiple accounts, but identifying a single build
22:19 paxcoder So that only one of those gets initial stuff.
22:26 Undertaker I speak english, the problem is with the server Megaf... this server has a policy with new players, they can't interact with the server, like me, so to play I need a permission of a admin, just the user Megaf_, but I'm trying to say him yesterday and nothing
22:26 Undertaker today again and nothing
22:27 TheWild paxcoder: maybe: give the stuff if no account was registered on this IP within 24 hours
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22:38 xenkey Good idea
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23:13 paxcoder Poor TheWild. Never got confirmation for his idea.
23:13 paxcoder *found out that
23:13 paxcoder *he
23:13 paxcoder darnit
23:17 kaeza hmm
23:18 kaeza how about making special tools as "gifts", store the name of the owner in the metadata of the tool, and regularly (e.g. every minute or so) purge items that don't belong to the player?
23:18 paxcoder reminds me of VanessaE's server where you get money every (new) day you join
23:19 paxcoder kaeza, elegance is not one of your strong sides, is it?
23:20 kaeza is it that obvious? :(
23:20 kaeza if a hack doesn't work, apply more hack
23:21 Hijiri and then there was light
23:28 Undertaker joined #minetest
23:29 Undertaker left #minetest
23:47 Hijiri joined #minetest
23:56 ecutruin joined #minetest

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