| Time |
Nick |
Message |
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| 00:18 |
MTDiscord |
<Bastrabun> Not long ago, the backport-5 branch of MT engine was updated. Does that mean this branch is what people who want a stable version should follow? |
| 00:19 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/12773 |
| 00:19 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> ^read the above |
| 00:20 |
MTDiscord |
<Bastrabun> I did, but not sure what to make of it. Is it a new 5.6.1 release now? |
| 00:21 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> also read https://discord.com/channels/369122544273588224/747163566800633906/1020256247674572860 |
| 00:22 |
MTDiscord |
<Bastrabun> Ok, so I barged in right when release was still ongoing? ? Then I'll shut up until done and happily test for 5.6.1 instead of 5.6.0 |
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| 11:14 |
jwmhjwmh |
rubenwardy Why was the Zero modpack removed from ContentDB? |
| 11:17 |
MTDiscord |
<ROllerozxa> technical modname conflicts |
| 11:19 |
MTDiscord |
<ROllerozxa> since it was a modpack that provided mods such as player_api, it would be installed whenever you tried to install some MTG-dependant mods and break dependency resolution |
| 11:19 |
MTDiscord |
<ROllerozxa> "install some MTG-dependant mods"... for a non-MTG game ofc |
| 11:23 |
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| 11:31 |
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| 11:33 |
jwmhjwmh |
That isn't Zero's fault. When installing dependencies, ContentDB should keep a blacklist for mods like player_api. |
| 11:37 |
rubenwardy |
I meant to write a thread but never got around to it. It broke another game when a user installed zero indirectly to get player API. Zero should be a game forked from void, making it a modpack doesn't make much sense |
| 11:39 |
jwmhjwmh |
The advantage of making it a modpack is that individual mods can be enabled and disabled by the user. |
| 11:39 |
MTDiscord |
<kimapr> why does it need to be forked from void |
| 11:39 |
MTDiscord |
<kimapr> just make it a standalone game |
| 11:45 |
jwmhjwmh |
I was actually the one who suggested to the maintainer of Zero to rename zr_player_api to player_api. It seems the issue is my fault '=( |
| 11:45 |
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| 11:48 |
jwmhjwmh |
How about during dependency installation ContentDB just blacklist modpacks that provide mods which are also provided by MTG. |
| 11:49 |
rubenwardy |
Easier to implement that blacklist by removing the modpack from CDB |
| 11:50 |
rubenwardy |
I'm currently working on adding supported games to Minetest and ContentDB |
| 11:50 |
rubenwardy |
One way to do it is have Zero only have Void in supported_games, and so not be installed for other games |
| 11:53 |
jwmhjwmh |
That sounds good. About when will that be done? |
| 12:04 |
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| 12:11 |
definitelya |
I had a tornado forecasted in my area today, so my connection is acting up, it seems. :) |
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| 12:31 |
definitelya |
jwmhjwmh: I still don't really get why the removal from CDB is that big of a deal, anyone looking to contribute or to play with Zero will want to use the git version, IMO. |
| 12:37 |
jwmhjwmh |
I expect a lot of players only find mods through ContentDB. |
| 12:38 |
definitelya |
Yes, that's probably why. |
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| 15:12 |
MTDiscord |
<GoodClover> What's the difference in input handling between the main menu and in-game? I'm trying to run MT inside of Xephyr (X nesting), mouse & kbd work fine in the menu but nothing works in-game. |
| 15:14 |
MTDiscord |
<GoodClover> Mouse makes some sense, as in the menu it's being used as "normal", in-game its being captured and used for rotation. But why would the keyboard system be different? |
| 15:30 |
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| 22:34 |
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| 22:46 |
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| 22:46 |
galex-713_ |
hello, i am experiencing fps drop after some time playing minetest and don’t understand why |
| 22:47 |
galex-713_ |
also i don’t understand why it takes 20% of my memory |
| 22:47 |
galex-713 |
i am currently at 3-7fps but usually it’s more like 15-20fps (which is totally fine |
| 22:49 |
schwarzwald[m] |
I sometimes have an FPS drop when my view range is set too high and I move into an un-generated part of the world. |
| 22:49 |
galex-713 |
for me it’s like, independent of the world i am playing |
| 22:49 |
galex-713 |
it’s usually after a little while playing, it comes |
| 22:49 |
galex-713 |
and then i can stop, start, restart, it’s shit, idk why |
| 22:49 |
galex-713 |
i think reboot changes it, but idk why |
| 22:50 |
schwarzwald[m] |
Could it be a mod? |
| 22:50 |
schwarzwald[m] |
Having mesecons running etc. can really cause an FPS drop. |
| 22:51 |
galex-713 |
but it’s even in multiplayer |
| 22:51 |
galex-713 |
and no mesecons in default game |
| 22:51 |
galex-713 |
so no |
| 22:51 |
schwarzwald[m] |
galex-713_: I'm curious whether this memory pretty much stays at 20% or whether it looks like it gradually gets more and more. |
| 22:52 |
galex-713 |
no it stands still |
| 22:52 |
galex-713 |
were you thinking about memory leaks? |
| 22:52 |
schwarzwald[m] |
Ok, probably not a memory leak, then. |
| 22:52 |
galex-713 |
because the issue is preserved if i kill and start again minetest |
| 22:52 |
schwarzwald[m] |
But not if you restart the computer? |
| 22:52 |
galex-713 |
i’m not sure |
| 22:53 |
galex-713 |
i had this issue, so i stopped playing minetest for a while |
| 22:53 |
galex-713 |
and today i tried again, and everything was fine |
| 22:53 |
galex-713 |
i was starting to believe it was debian’s version which was bad, and arch’s one was good |
| 22:53 |
galex-713 |
but no |
| 22:53 |
galex-713 |
now it’s back to as bad as before |
| 22:53 |
schwarzwald[m] |
Sounds like a bug. |
| 22:54 |
schwarzwald[m] |
Might be a tricky one to get confirmed, though. ? |
| 22:55 |
galex-713 |
the most weird is |
| 22:55 |
galex-713 |
ok maybe idk how graphics work etc. |
| 22:55 |
galex-713 |
but minetest only takes 13% of cpu |
| 22:55 |
galex-713 |
but is at 10fps |
| 22:55 |
galex-713 |
why? |
| 22:56 |
Desour |
if you have 8 virual cores, 12.5% is one core |
| 22:56 |
Desour |
does it really stay over process restarts? |
| 22:56 |
Desour |
sounds very weird |
| 22:56 |
schwarzwald[m] |
One possible explanation is that there's something that persists in one of the databases that correlates with a decrease in FPS. |
| 22:57 |
galex-713 |
Desour, dual core |
| 22:57 |
schwarzwald[m] |
Entities get despawned IIRC so entities doesn't explain it. |
| 22:58 |
schwarzwald[m] |
Oh, but do boats despawn? |
| 22:58 |
galex-713 |
schwarzwald[m], anyway it’s even in new worlds |
| 22:59 |
galex-713 |
maybe i’m getting crazy |
| 22:59 |
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| 22:59 |
galex-713 |
maybe it’s not minetest but something else… |
| 22:59 |
galex-713 |
but what? |
| 22:59 |
schwarzwald[m] |
galex-713: Ouch, that is even more confusing. |
| 22:59 |
galex-713 |
why is minetest slow |
| 22:59 |
schwarzwald[m] |
No settings changed? |
| 22:59 |
Desour |
does it also happen in other games? |
| 22:59 |
galex-713 |
no |
| 22:59 |
galex-713 |
i tried to delete .minetest and .cache |
| 22:59 |
galex-713 |
Desour, i don’t know other fps that i can play on my computer ^^' |
| 22:59 |
galex-713 |
i just noticed sometimes minetest was fluid |
| 22:59 |
galex-713 |
but apparently it can’t stay fluid too long |
| 23:00 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> what is your view range set to |
| 23:00 |
galex-713 |
it’s only a factor 2 so idk maybe i’m just crazy or picky or idk |
| 23:00 |
galex-713 |
how can i know the view range? |
| 23:00 |
Desour |
+ and - |
| 23:00 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> +/- keys increase/decrease it |
| 23:00 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> also R will toggle far view (it should be off) |
| 23:01 |
galex-713 |
190 |
| 23:01 |
Desour |
that's pretty high |
| 23:01 |
schwarzwald[m] |
That's a lot more than I've found necessary. |
| 23:01 |
galex-713 |
it’s not the default |
| 23:01 |
galex-713 |
this is really weird, i just gained 1fps but it looks a lot more fluid |
| 23:02 |
galex-713 |
not so much as before tho |
| 23:02 |
MTDiscord |
<GreenXenith> Well, I play at 200 view range. Necessary is subjective. |
| 23:02 |
Desour |
what gpu do you have btw, galex-713 ? |
| 23:02 |
galex-713 |
Desour, i915 |
| 23:03 |
galex-713 |
Intel Corporation Mobile 4 Series Chipset Integrated Graphics Controller |
| 23:06 |
galex-713 |
why does minetest needs 2G of resident memory? i don’t understand |
| 23:08 |
Desour |
the vertex data can be very much, i.e. ca. 4*6*(3+2+4)*4=864 bytes per leave node. and it's never freed |
| 23:09 |
Desour |
(4 vertices per side, 6 sides, world pos + uv pos + color, 4 bytes per float) |
| 23:09 |
galex-713 |
why it’s never freed? |
| 23:10 |
Desour |
because we don't do it. |
| 23:10 |
galex-713 |
but why? |
| 23:10 |
Desour |
(as least I don't think we do it, as you can always see all previous mapblocks via full view range) |
| 23:10 |
galex-713 |
mm |
| 23:11 |
galex-713 |
why loading all vertices while only a fraction is displayed? |
| 23:11 |
Desour |
minetest does many things sub-optimal |
| 23:12 |
galex-713 |
ok… |
| 23:12 |
galex-713 |
ig it’s not what makes it slow… |
| 23:13 |
galex-713 |
why only 15fps while 15% of cpu? what’s bottleneck? gpu? |
| 23:15 |
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| 23:16 |
Desour |
I guess so. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ |
| 23:17 |
Desour |
but if it slows down over time and doesn't get better when you restart minetest, it's most likely not minetest's fault. maybe your graphics driver has some issues |
| 23:18 |
galex-713 |
:/ |
| 23:18 |
galex-713 |
maybe i should give up |
| 23:19 |
Desour |
there's someone in the minetest community who'd tell you to buy a new pc |
| 23:21 |
schwarzwald[m] |
<Desour> "(as least I don't think we do it..." <- Seriously? |
| 23:21 |
schwarzwald[m] |
How hard can this be to do? ? |
| 23:21 |
schwarzwald[m] |
Maybe I'll give it a shot after university. |
| 23:23 |
schwarzwald[m] |
C++ Core Guidelines says, "P.9: Don’t waste time or space", because, "This is C++" |
| 23:23 |
schwarzwald[m] |
With the following note: |
| 23:23 |
schwarzwald[m] |
'Note Time and space that you spend well to achieve a goal (e.g., speed of development, resource safety, or simplification of testing) is not wasted. “Another benefit of striving for efficiency is that the process forces you to understand the problem in more depth.” - Alex Stepanov' |
| 23:32 |
fluxionary |
galex-713, is that 15% of one core, or 15% of all cores? |
| 23:33 |
fluxionary |
galex-713, i think the client is mostly single-threaded |
| 23:34 |
fluxionary |
schwarzwald[m], that sounds like larry wall's "programmer's virtue" of laziness |
| 23:35 |
fluxionary |
galex-713, oh i see you already provided that info earlier |
| 23:49 |
fluxionary |
> Desour: (as least I don't think we do it, as you can always see all previous mapblocks via full view range) |
| 23:49 |
fluxionary |
Desour, isn't that controlled by `client_unload_unused_data_timeout`? |
| 23:50 |
fluxionary |
(and also `client_mapblock_limit`) |
| 23:56 |
Desour |
fluxionary: ah seems so. I didn't know about that. |
| 23:56 |
Desour |
600 seconds by default is pretty long though |
| 23:58 |
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