| Time |
Nick |
Message |
| 00:00 |
Menchers |
would you remove the infinite water behavior to make pumps more useful? |
| 00:00 |
Menchers |
not much need for a pump now, can carry two buckets to the top of a mountain and have infinite water up there |
| 00:02 |
Gustavo6046 |
oh dear sorry my network's being a bit nuts today, what was the last message that sent? |
| 00:02 |
Gustavo6046 |
I may take this opportunity to neat up a little on the words that I wrote so ADHD-ly prior |
| 00:02 |
Gustavo6046 |
oh, pumps would be more like parts of other machines |
| 00:03 |
Gustavo6046 |
could be used, say, in a water tower |
| 00:03 |
Gustavo6046 |
so this water tower would have a pump as an energy input, and an adjustable flowrate canal with water turbines as an energy output |
| 00:03 |
Gustavo6046 |
it'd essentially be an energy buffer |
| 00:03 |
Gustavo6046 |
and heavier liquids are harder to pump up but produce more energy as they go down |
| 00:03 |
Gustavo6046 |
so this water tower would have (A) a pump component, (B) a water turbine component, (C) possibly components that convert between this mechanical energy and whatever other kinds of energy may be desired by the player |
| 00:04 |
Gustavo6046 |
and of course the water reservoir at the top might be expandable, idk how that'd work |
| 00:04 |
Gustavo6046 |
yeah maybe the hydraulics / fluid machine simulation part would have to be separate |
| 00:04 |
Gustavo6046 |
but, say you have a nuclear reactor producing massive amounts of energy with each run, but it's not producing consistently |
| 00:04 |
Gustavo6046 |
you can plug up this water tower buffer to it, with a big enough water reservoir |
| 00:04 |
Gustavo6046 |
maybe up to a lake of finite fluid, idk |
| 00:04 |
Gustavo6046 |
it'd just spin the pump super fast and fill the reservoir about halfway or 3/4ths of the way with each run of the reactor |
| 00:04 |
Gustavo6046 |
but then you could adjust how fast you want water to flow back down to convert into a steady outflow of energy |
| 00:04 |
Gustavo6046 |
this could be made Technic compatible! |
| 00:04 |
Gustavo6046 |
and if it goes well, it could potentially replace Pipeworks or even Technic itself as you can have an incentive to research new machine components and actually do schematics and stuff |
| 00:19 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> can a minetest server be re-built from source in-place? It is currently a 5.4 server, can I rebuild in place? |
| 00:28 |
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| 00:33 |
Menchers |
rebuild in place? |
| 00:33 |
Menchers |
you mean without a restart? no |
| 00:33 |
Menchers |
Gustavo6046, I do really like the idea of small machines that can be composed together into a larger more useful machine :D |
| 00:35 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> I mean rebuild minetest from source without having to build elsewhere and then copy the files |
| 00:53 |
Gustavo6046 |
:D |
| 00:54 |
Gustavo6046 |
Menchers: if it were to replace technic it'd "provide technic" and the existing nodes would be replaced by "default component trees" |
| 00:54 |
Gustavo6046 |
same goes to Pipeworks |
| 00:54 |
Gustavo6046 |
although the latter could break the finite fluid thing I was thinking about too |
| 00:54 |
Gustavo6046 |
and also being able to only push liquids so far before needing more pumps |
| 00:54 |
Gustavo6046 |
(although that could be another screw pump advantage - they can extend arbitrarily provided enough energy to move their weight) |
| 00:55 |
Menchers |
MisterE, you can definitely do that |
| 00:56 |
Menchers |
you can set RUN_IN_PLACE in cmake's configuration |
| 00:56 |
Menchers |
run the server directly from the source tree |
| 00:56 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> I know... but if it has already been built... |
| 00:56 |
Menchers |
then you can fetch updates, rebuild the server while it's running, then just restart it to deploy it in seconds |
| 00:56 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> ok great! |
| 00:56 |
Menchers |
did you get it from git? |
| 00:56 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> yes |
| 00:57 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> im on openbsd but I have good instructions for building from source taht I know work |
| 01:29 |
Menchers |
openbsd! |
| 01:29 |
Menchers |
yay |
| 01:29 |
* Menchers |
uses the open beastie |
| 01:32 |
Menchers |
huh it turns out my crash problem is a resurgance of the same problem I had before on the same server https://menche.us/files/minetest.txt |
| 01:40 |
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| 02:20 |
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| 02:27 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> do 5.3 clients recieve dynamic media? |
| 02:28 |
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| 02:28 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> Menchers: if you are trying to build minetest on openbsd, here are the instructions: https://wiki.ircnow.org/index.php?n=Openbsd.Minetest |
| 02:29 |
Menchers |
I have it built on openbsd :D |
| 02:29 |
Menchers |
and it usually works |
| 02:29 |
Menchers |
just having a weird crash issue lately |
| 02:30 |
Menchers |
but in only happens on a specific server, very intermittently |
| 02:31 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> no |
| 02:32 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> oh too bad ok thx |
| 02:33 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> that is indeed a weird error |
| 02:33 |
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| 02:34 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> that is indeed a weird error |
| 02:37 |
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| 02:39 |
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| 02:47 |
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| 03:45 |
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| 04:00 |
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| 04:19 |
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| 04:20 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> if anyone is interested: my mod that adds dynamically sent and individual background music, based on environment: https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=27361&p=401190#p401190 |
| 04:20 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> only for servers, and only for 5.5 dev +, clients 5.4+ |
| 04:20 |
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| 05:01 |
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| 05:56 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> i keep having |
| 05:56 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> oops |
| 06:00 |
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| 08:06 |
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| 08:43 |
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| 08:43 |
Kiwi |
yoyo |
| 08:43 |
Kiwi |
GUYS |
| 08:43 |
Guest2368 |
ANYONE KNOWS MEE |
| 08:43 |
Guest2368 |
f |
| 08:43 |
Guest2368 |
f |
| 08:43 |
Guest2368 |
f |
| 08:43 |
|
Guest2368 was kicked by ShadowBot: Message repetition flood detected. |
| 08:43 |
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| 08:44 |
Guest2368 |
whos shadow |
| 08:44 |
Guest2368 |
I LOVE SHADW |
| 08:44 |
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| 08:45 |
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| 08:56 |
Guest2368 |
sad |
| 08:56 |
Guest2368 |
sorry |
| 08:56 |
Guest2368 |
bye |
| 08:56 |
|
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| 09:14 |
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| 11:01 |
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| 13:11 |
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| 13:17 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> hey, I just upgraded my server to 5.5 dev and some of my clients are timing out. Im sure its not the new mod I added, since I disabled it and it keeps happening. Any clue as to how to start debugging this? |
| 13:20 |
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| 13:27 |
macaw |
Hey. I do not have minetest on my machine right now, but the general advice would be to look at the logs, see where something reports Errors and consider whether they are the cause. |
| 13:28 |
macaw |
If the clients are timing out, you may have to connect a client yourself (to the server) and look at the clients' logs. |
| 13:41 |
celeron55 |
the fastest way to get an idea would be to download some different client versions your users use a lot and just try it out |
| 13:41 |
celeron55 |
it's not likely the server logs show much in a timeout case |
| 13:51 |
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| 14:17 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> well they werent timing out when it was 5.4... hmm |
| 14:36 |
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| 15:25 |
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| 15:33 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> ok I tried it with 5.4.1 which people said they were using... but I got no lag. Regardless, they continued to get lag. Notes about it: the lag disappeared when I teleported to them it reappeared when they logged off and then on |
| 15:33 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> also Mineman said he cant join |
| 15:33 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> I am switching back to stable-5.4 for now ? |
| 15:36 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> if you have any concrete ideas about how to work this out then I would switch back |
| 15:37 |
sfan5 |
you can enable verbose output and hope it contains something useful, but that doesn't help directly |
| 15:39 |
sfan5 |
other than that it would be useful if you had a rough idea when the bug was introduced (does it happen on 5.5-dev from one month ago? what about two months ago?) |
| 15:39 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> oh |
| 15:39 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> thats a good idea |
| 15:39 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> the problem is that I cant get lag |
| 15:40 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> only me players do |
| 15:40 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> *my |
| 15:40 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> so they have to test it |
| 15:45 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> sfan5: any suggestion for which commit to start at? |
| 15:46 |
sfan5 |
you can specifically test before fd8a8501bc26dfca2a93d51000867b8592210040 |
| 15:50 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> ok building that commit's parent commit now |
| 15:51 |
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| 15:52 |
AristotIe |
in the linux terminal if I do `git clone --depth 1 https://github.com/minetest/minetest.git` I get minetest 5.5.0-dev, what would the url be to get minetest 5.4.0? |
| 15:53 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> you should clone the whole git repository and then checkout the branch or commit you want to use |
| 15:53 |
AristotIe |
so that would be... |
| 15:54 |
AristotIe |
*I'm not very farmiliar with github* |
| 15:55 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> 1) build mt irrlicht 2) $ git clone https://github.com/minetest/minetest.git 3) $ git checkout stable-5 or git checkout master<- for latest dev version |
| 15:55 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> 4) build minetest |
| 15:56 |
AristotIe |
ah, thanks |
| 15:56 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> between 2 and 3, $ cd minetest |
| 15:56 |
AristotIe |
yeah |
| 16:01 |
AristotIe |
huh, when I do step 3, it says `error: pathspec 'stable-5' did not match any file(s) known to git` |
| 16:04 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> please paste the commands you did in order |
| 16:04 |
AristotIe |
well |
| 16:05 |
AristotIe |
`git clone --depth 1 https://github.com/minetest/minetest.git` |
| 16:05 |
AristotIe |
`cd minetest` |
| 16:05 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> sfan5: Mineman says that he was not able to join, when the server was on latest 5.5dev. I just built 5.5dev from commit https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commit/ea250ff5c57301b6ea3e529c811484c743c1fde1 and mineman was able to join |
| 16:06 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> Aristotle, im unsure about that --depth 1 |
| 16:06 |
sfan5 |
AristotIe: re-do the clone command with -b stable-5 (delete the folder first) |
| 16:06 |
sfan5 |
when you have --depth 1 checking out other branches may not work |
| 16:07 |
AristotIe |
MisterE: well, I was just trying that, so I'll continue with that and then if that doesn't work, I'll refer back here |
| 16:08 |
AristotIe |
I assume it worked this time, it gave me these 2 lines: `Branch 'stable-5' set up to track remote branch 'stable-5' from 'origin'.` |
| 16:09 |
AristotIe |
Switched to a new branch 'stable-5' |
| 16:09 |
independent_ |
Where did this all go wrong? my server crashes when i set some routes! I need to compeltely re-interlock this stretch of track |
| 16:11 |
independent_ |
I feel like XKCD #1084 |
| 16:11 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/1084 -- Add InvRef::get/set_lists() by ShadowNinja |
| 16:17 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> sfan5: I can confirm that that commit causes the bugs |
| 16:17 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> no more lag problems |
| 16:18 |
sfan5 |
I know how my commit is related to timeouts but lag problems are new to me |
| 16:18 |
sfan5 |
can you be more specific how those manifest? |
| 16:22 |
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| 16:23 |
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| 16:25 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> so i do not experience lag, but mec404 would join, then after a few minutes, lag would start to build up. Then he would time out |
| 16:26 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> but strangely, when I teleported to him, his lag stopped completely |
| 16:26 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> until he logged out and then on again when I was not on the server anymore |
| 16:26 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> 2 other players were unable to join the game at all |
| 16:27 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> but now that I reverted to the parent of that commit, everyone can join and has no more lag than normal |
| 16:27 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> is there a way to disable the hand completely? |
| 16:29 |
sfan5 |
the visual part or the "the player can interact with things" part? |
| 16:31 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> you can overwrite the hand definition |
| 16:31 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> or make a new tool and set that as the hand |
| 16:31 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> well, to explain, im trying to make a player only be able use a items on_place, setting the hand inventory to the item works (and main to 0), but in the hand inventory, on_place is not called. if hand inventory is set to nothing, and main is set to 1, and the item added to main, the player can still rotate over to the hand even though it doesnt exist |
| 16:34 |
sfan5 |
sounds like you're not setting the hotbar size |
| 16:36 |
independent_ |
Mostly fixed now. |
| 16:36 |
independent_ |
I hate it when my infastructure breaks down |
| 16:37 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> thanks sfan5 |
| 16:39 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> any hope for fixing this bug soon? |
| 16:39 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/749727888659447960/896436763550183454/unknown.png |
| 16:40 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> where attached players' models are blown up |
| 16:41 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> attached is set to the same scale as the root |
| 16:41 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> you can just set it to the proper one after attaching to work around it |
| 16:42 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> yes and draconis does that but anotehr mod is doing something to conflich with it |
| 16:43 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> it would be better if the bug was just fixed in the engine |
| 16:43 |
sfan5 |
"fixing" it would break all mods that apply the workaround currently |
| 16:44 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> heh ok |
| 16:44 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> maybe in 6.0 |
| 16:44 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> tho even then maybe not |
| 16:44 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> if your going to fix that, should fix models of ents being 10 units to small |
| 16:45 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> yeah so scaling the model in blender would fix it |
| 16:45 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> but as sfan5 said, break sompat |
| 16:45 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> ? |
| 16:45 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> *breaks compat |
| 16:45 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> yeah so scaling the model in blender would fix it? |
| 16:45 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> or using visual_sacle |
| 16:45 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> *visual_scale |
| 16:45 |
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| 16:46 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> its easier to fix in blender if your using attachments so that the attachements dont need to be resized |
| 16:46 |
rubenwardy |
for this, you typically have a transform per entity (position / rotation / scale) that applies to all children, and a per-entity adjustment that only applies to itself |
| 16:47 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> so its not a bug |
| 16:47 |
rubenwardy |
it's misleading and badly implemented |
| 16:47 |
rubenwardy |
the feature should be implemented as a transformation matrix on the entity, rather than an object property. And then a separate way to scale without scaling children |
| 16:48 |
rubenwardy |
it's possible to fix this without breaking compat by making a new property for just scaling the entity and not its children |
| 16:48 |
rubenwardy |
network compat may be tricky. I guess you could calculate the old visual_size from the new transform and scale bet eh |
| 16:48 |
rubenwardy |
*but |
| 16:54 |
sfan5 |
@MisterE if you have time please recompile the latest dev with this patch http://sprunge.us/z6WDeh?diff and report back if the problems appear again |
| 16:55 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> I dont know how to do that... could you give me a branch of minetest that I can check out? |
| 16:56 |
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| 16:57 |
sfan5 |
https://github.com/sfan5/minetest/tree/temporary |
| 16:57 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> ok, ill bookmark it, probably will be able to get back to you in within 24 hrs |
| 16:58 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> players are on the server rn and having fun and I dont want to stop that right now, but later tonight maybe |
| 17:02 |
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| 17:02 |
sfan5 |
sure, thanks |
| 17:19 |
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| 19:46 |
* Menchers |
grumbles discontentedly about all the stupid carriage returns in the irrlichtmt source code |
| 19:50 |
* Menchers |
randomly wonders why the [REDACTED] irrlicht implements its own string type |
| 19:51 |
sfan5 |
that makes it portable to platforms with no (complete) C++ stdlib |
| 19:52 |
sfan5 |
I think the real reason might have been that in early times the C++ standard library (esp. containers and related stuff) was considered bad so people wrote their own |
| 20:09 |
* Menchers |
adds a debug printf, wonders why it segfaults immediately now |
| 20:10 |
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| 20:28 |
Menchers |
oh, this object is null |
| 20:28 |
Menchers |
why's it calling crap with it? why doesn't this crash on other platforms? |
| 20:28 |
Menchers |
dafook |
| 20:34 |
Menchers |
huh, the clouds are now textured with the font map texture |
| 20:34 |
Menchers |
wat |
| 20:38 |
sfan5 |
?! |
| 20:43 |
Menchers |
I am very stressed right now |
| 20:43 |
Menchers |
this code is not good for my mental health |
| 20:44 |
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| 20:44 |
Menchers |
I will have more to ask about once I finish this debugging session… |
| 20:46 |
Menchers |
*sigh* |
| 20:46 |
Menchers |
the crash is always at irr::video::ITexture::getDriverType |
| 20:46 |
Menchers |
line 256 |
| 20:46 |
Krock |
re-compile Irrlicht and Minetest. ensure that Minetest uses the correct library |
| 20:47 |
Menchers |
E_DRIVER_TYPE getDriverType() const { return DriverType; }; |
| 20:47 |
Krock |
i.e. correct ldd output paths |
| 20:47 |
Menchers |
(irr::video::E_DRIVER_TYPE) DriverType = <read memory from 0x13120000004b failed (0 of 4 bytes read)> |
| 20:47 |
Menchers |
dunno what's wrong with DriverType but trying to return it is apparently a segfault |
| 20:48 |
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| 20:50 |
Menchers |
running out of ideas |
| 20:51 |
sfan5 |
recompile both like Krock said |
| 20:51 |
Menchers |
I have |
| 20:51 |
Menchers |
many times |
| 20:53 |
Menchers |
what could cause returning DriverType from ITexture to segfault |
| 20:53 |
Menchers |
it's not NULL |
| 20:53 |
Menchers |
I checked |
| 20:55 |
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| 20:56 |
sfan5 |
did you check that Minetest is loading the exact library file you compiled? |
| 20:57 |
Menchers |
yes |
| 20:58 |
sfan5 |
how? |
| 20:59 |
Menchers |
the changes I'm making to irrlicht are showing up when I run minetest in the debugger |
| 20:59 |
Menchers |
and I can look at ldd |
| 20:59 |
Menchers |
it confirms |
| 20:59 |
sfan5 |
okay good enough |
| 21:01 |
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| 21:03 |
Krock |
"it's not NULL". means that it's accessing garbage values. uninitialized pointers. -Wextra or valgrind could help there |
| 21:03 |
sfan5 |
there's one thing you might want to know: if you build Irrlicht as debug it's possibly broken |
| 21:03 |
sfan5 |
by default |
| 21:03 |
Menchers |
what |
| 21:04 |
Menchers |
do I need to change something in the flags CMake sets for debug builds? |
| 21:04 |
sfan5 |
yes |
| 21:04 |
sfan5 |
if you didn't set anything you should have a release build |
| 21:04 |
sfan5 |
(so not affected by this) |
| 21:04 |
Menchers |
I set debug build |
| 21:05 |
Menchers |
changed it to -O0 -g3 -ggdb |
| 21:05 |
sfan5 |
try -DCMAKE_BUILD_TYPE=RelWithDebInfo |
| 21:05 |
Menchers |
lldb's information is very unuseful otherwise |
| 21:05 |
sfan5 |
the crash might just go away magically |
| 21:05 |
Menchers |
ok |
| 21:15 |
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| 21:15 |
Menchers |
if it goes away magically I won't figure out what caused it though >:/ |
| 21:16 |
Menchers |
anyways it still crashes, but the debugger shows assembly instead of C++ now |
| 21:19 |
sfan5 |
huh okay so that wasn't it |
| 21:25 |
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| 22:00 |
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| 22:17 |
Swift110-mobile |
hey akk |
| 22:18 |
Swift110-mobile |
hey all i mean |
| 22:18 |
Swift110-mobile |
whos playing right now? |
| 22:27 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> I can... |
| 22:27 |
MTDiscord |
<MisterE> what server? |
| 22:31 |
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| 22:42 |
erlehmann |
Menchers have you tried using asan or msan or ubsan? |
| 22:43 |
Menchers |
last I checked, those didn't work on openbsd |
| 22:43 |
Menchers |
can check again |
| 22:43 |
Menchers |
right now I'm rebuilding irrlichtmt with g++ instead of clang++ |
| 22:53 |
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| 22:56 |
Menchers |
doesn't fix it |
| 22:59 |
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| 23:06 |
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| 23:07 |
luizsab |
hello. Someone already use the alchemy mod? I can't find documentation |
| 23:07 |
luizsab |
Or how potion mod do you can recommend? Is there some better? |
| 23:08 |
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| 23:15 |
Menchers |
trying the build with -fsanitize=undefined |
| 23:17 |
erlehmann |
Menchers good luck |
| 23:18 |
Menchers |
:D |
| 23:19 |
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| 23:20 |
* Menchers |
should probably also do memory sanitizer… but later |
| 23:26 |
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| 23:30 |
Menchers |
hm, right, openbsd doesn't seem to ship with the sanitizer runtime built |
| 23:30 |
Menchers |
unsure why |
| 23:31 |
Menchers |
:( |
| 23:35 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> there are at least two alchemy mods |
| 23:56 |
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