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Nick |
Message |
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| 00:16 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> MisterE, do note that doesnt show up as well on irc as it does here. https://irc.minetest.net/minetest/2021-05-04#i_5817585 |
| 00:20 |
Emerald2 |
Wow that shows up weird on IRC. |
| 00:20 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> depends on your irc client |
| 00:21 |
Emerald2 |
The text is kinda between the lines of where it normally is. |
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MTDiscord |
<MisterE, Modder of Sorts> yes, well, I think IRC users are used to things showing up kinda wierd ? I kinda expect it when I use IRC But yeah, IG I should have posted the text-only version |
| 02:41 |
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Swift110-mobile |
Oh |
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| 10:30 |
deatline |
Hey all |
| 10:31 |
deatline |
i need help with cocoa |
| 10:34 |
Emerald2 |
What's the problem? |
| 10:36 |
deatline |
the cocoa its only green |
| 10:36 |
deatline |
i have put on the jungletree |
| 10:37 |
Emerald2 |
Remind me which mod that's in? |
| 10:37 |
deatline |
what need cocoa |
| 10:38 |
Emerald2 |
If I remember right, farming redo. |
| 10:39 |
Emerald2 |
I'm having a quick look at the code to see if it needs light or whatever. |
| 10:42 |
deatline |
ok |
| 10:43 |
Emerald2 |
Is it the default game jungletree you placed it on? I used to just place some trunks by my farm and plant cocoa on it and it was fine. |
| 10:45 |
MTDiscord |
<Danil_2461> hello people |
| 10:46 |
deatline |
yes, too, but no change, only green |
| 10:46 |
Emerald2 |
It looks to me like it just needs the jungle tree logs to grow. Hopefully somebody else can be more helpful. |
| 10:46 |
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| 10:47 |
deatline |
ok, thank you, i will wait |
| 10:51 |
hisforeverkid |
hi I'd like to know where is the Mod folder in Ubuntu, my /home/.minetest dose not have a Mod folder |
| 10:54 |
calcul0n |
you can create it there or it might be in /usr/share/games/minetest |
| 10:54 |
calcul0n |
(if you installed it from a package) |
| 10:55 |
hisforeverkid |
ok thanks calcu10n |
| 10:55 |
MTDiscord |
<Danil_2461> install a mod, then itll create one |
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MinetestBot |
[git] sfan5 -> minetest/minetest: Add basic client-server test to CI ba40b39 https://git.io/J36v2 (2021-05-05T20:49:44Z) |
| 20:50 |
MinetestBot |
[git] sfan5 -> minetest/minetest: Use Irrlicht functions to query npot texture support 08f1a7f https://git.io/J36vV (2021-05-05T20:49:44Z) |
| 20:52 |
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| 21:04 |
MTDiscord |
<Danil_2461> https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/749727888659447960/839608484516331530/Screenshot_20210506-000348.png |
| 21:04 |
MTDiscord |
<Danil_2461> when I try to launch any game, it gives this and freezes |
| 21:06 |
MTDiscord |
<Danil_2461> ------------- Separator ------------- 2021-05-06 00:05:15: ERROR[Main]: Main menu error: Runtime error from mod '' in callback handleMainMenuButtons(): /storage/emulated/0/Minetest/builtin/mainmenu/tab_local.lua:232: attempt to index local 'game' (a nil value) 2021-05-06 00:05:15: ERROR[Main]: stack traceback: 2021-05-06 00:05:15: ERROR[Main]: /storage/emulated/0/Minetest/builtin/mainmenu/tab_local.lua:232: in function |
| 21:06 |
MTDiscord |
'handle_buttons' 2021-05-06 00:05:15: ERROR[Main]: /storage/emulated/0/Minetest/builtin/fstk/ui.lua:142: in function 'handle_buttons' 2021-05-06 00:05:15: ERROR[Main]: /storage/emulated/0/Minetest/builtin/fstk/ui.lua:186: in function </storage/emulated/0/Minetest/builtin/fstk/ui.lua:172> |
| 21:15 |
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MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> make sure your engine build and builtin versions match |
| 21:30 |
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| 22:43 |
MTDiscord |
<Danil_2461> wh? |
| 22:48 |
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| 23:33 |
erlehmann |
<Aris> is there a way to make the night lighter so that it's slightly easier to see? |
| 23:34 |
erlehmann |
Aris you can edit src/nodedef.cpp and replace "light_source = 0" with "light_source = 7" |
| 23:34 |
erlehmann |
Aris then rebuild – that will give you a client that has halfbright blocks |
| 23:35 |
erlehmann |
i think there is no way to detect it server side so you don't have to worry about ppl banning you for cheating bc you have eyesight issues |
| 23:35 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Or you could just hack up node defs in lua so you don't have to recompile the engine. |
| 23:35 |
erlehmann |
yes, you can install dragonfire client or waspsaliva if you want to |
| 23:36 |
erlehmann |
but they do a lot of other stuff |
| 23:36 |
erlehmann |
that will get you banned |
| 23:36 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> If you are trying to correct for eyesight issues, gamma can be raised all the way to 3, which basically makes everything fullbright if it's not pure black anyway. |
| 23:37 |
erlehmann |
uh, i did not think of that, it sounds gnarly |
| 23:37 |
erlehmann |
funniest thing i found in waspsalive is the idle miner |
| 23:37 |
erlehmann |
like you walk and it just mines everything it can reach directly below you |
| 23:37 |
erlehmann |
it basically means you *have* to walk |
| 23:37 |
erlehmann |
funny minigame |
| 23:37 |
erlehmann |
i bet i am misusing that feature |
| 23:37 |
erlehmann |
i mean i don't regularly use waspsaliva |
| 23:38 |
erlehmann |
Warr1024 would gamma correction affect the interface? |
| 23:38 |
erlehmann |
i have problems with low contrast |
| 23:38 |
erlehmann |
like grey on gray |
| 23:38 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> I don't recall it doing so |
| 23:39 |
erlehmann |
other people can for example see the outlines of a room where the walls are lined with black concrete. |
| 23:39 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> You should also invest in a texture pack, could help. |
| 23:39 |
erlehmann |
i can not, easily |
| 23:39 |
erlehmann |
unless i make a screenshot and up the contrast |
| 23:39 |
erlehmann |
or sometimes the screenshot gamma is slightly off on another machine |
| 23:39 |
erlehmann |
then i can see it |
| 23:40 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Do you just have trouble with low brightness stuff, or is it like an inability to distinguish nearby shades or something? |
| 23:40 |
erlehmann |
i think the latter |
| 23:40 |
erlehmann |
i need higher contrast than other people my age |
| 23:41 |
erlehmann |
also i *can* see some stuff that other people have no problem with, but it is very straining |
| 23:41 |
erlehmann |
it is only light |
| 23:41 |
erlehmann |
but i notice it whenever some hipster makes a website with gray on grey text |
| 23:41 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Interesting. I'll have to keep that in mind when I evaluate my stuff for accessibility. I already watch out for color blindness and blurry vision accessibility... |
| 23:41 |
erlehmann |
or in the case of looking at a corner of black concrete in minetest |
| 23:42 |
erlehmann |
like i can't really see where the corner is |
| 23:42 |
erlehmann |
i mean ofc that depends on the lighting |
| 23:42 |
erlehmann |
which brings us to why i had a halfbright suggestion |
| 23:42 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> How does that even work? Is there a name for the condition that I could look up? |
| 23:42 |
erlehmann |
Warr1024 WCAG 2.0 has a formula for contrast, do you know that? |
| 23:43 |
erlehmann |
i think everyone gets it when they get older actually |
| 23:43 |
erlehmann |
i have so far only seen people under 40 make designs that are hard to read honestly |
| 23:43 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> MT's "gamma" formulas, be warned, have never really been right... |
| 23:43 |
erlehmann |
but i am, actually, under 40 |
| 23:43 |
erlehmann |
Warr1024 i look up the WCAG stuff, pls wait |
| 23:44 |
erlehmann |
Warr1024 https://www.w3.org/TR/UNDERSTANDING-WCAG20/visual-audio-contrast-contrast.html |
| 23:44 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> We need an MTCAG |
| 23:45 |
erlehmann |
Warr1024 what kind of accessability things do you do? for websites, there is a WCAG 2.0 contrast checker |
| 23:45 |
erlehmann |
it can figure out if your website has text that does not conform to the 4,5:1 or 3:1 contrast things |
| 23:45 |
erlehmann |
and mark it with a red outline |
| 23:45 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Contrast ratios tend to be disolay-dependent, and even moreso for MT, where we have to work with things like android phones where people want the brightness way low to preserve battery... |
| 23:46 |
erlehmann |
https://www.w3.org/TR/UNDERSTANDING-WCAG20/visual-audio-contrast7.html |
| 23:46 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Tbh mostly what I've done is (1) keep the HUD uncluttered so it can be scaled larger, and (2) test the game with all color desaturated (pure grayscale) to make sure it's usable for colorblind. |
| 23:47 |
erlehmann |
well the thing is because they are so display dependent you have to err on the side of caution |
| 23:47 |
erlehmann |
some peole do not even know they are colorblind |
| 23:47 |
erlehmann |
years ago i showed a guy an ishihara plate |
| 23:47 |
erlehmann |
and well |
| 23:47 |
erlehmann |
i think he was over 30 |
| 23:47 |
erlehmann |
and only on that day noticed that he may have a color vision issue apparently |
| 23:48 |
erlehmann |
like you know the things where you see different numbers |
| 23:48 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> That's kinda surprising, but then, I have a hard time remembering what it was like not expressing colors as hex values, so... |
| 23:48 |
erlehmann |
yeah i also was like "how can you get through life for so long" |
| 23:48 |
erlehmann |
but i mean 5% of men and 0,5% of women have some color vision issues i read |
| 23:48 |
erlehmann |
so it must be pretty common |
| 23:49 |
erlehmann |
like mostly minor probably |
| 23:49 |
erlehmann |
> test the game with all color desaturated (pure grayscale) to make sure it's usable for colorblind |
| 23:49 |
erlehmann |
that sounds nice, but what kind of desaturation function do you use? |
| 23:49 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Pure grayscale is the overkill approach, should cover every kind of color blindness. I just use imagemagick I think. |
| 23:50 |
erlehmann |
i mean you have to approximate the kind of desaturation that the different kinds of colorblindness give, not just set everything to gray as far as i get it |
| 23:50 |
erlehmann |
when i tried this to finde the minimal ANSI palette that is reasonably colorblind safe i came up with yellow, cyan, purple, white, black |
| 23:50 |
erlehmann |
like terminal 16 colors ANSI i mean |
| 23:51 |
erlehmann |
i now tend to use cyan instead of green and yellow instead of red |
| 23:51 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> It doesn't matter much which function because you also can't rely on contextual cues. Someone could be buried in a pit of nothing but sand or nothing but gravel, and there needs to be some way to distinguish them just from the shapes or patterns or contrast. |
| 23:51 |
erlehmann |
in terminal output |
| 23:51 |
erlehmann |
right |
| 23:51 |
erlehmann |
i have not looked at the ores |
| 23:51 |
erlehmann |
i guess they can be distinguished by shape then? |
| 23:51 |
erlehmann |
texture-wise |
| 23:51 |
erlehmann |
i mean they have different colors |
| 23:51 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> In MTG I dunno, maybe some? |
| 23:52 |
erlehmann |
well if not, there exists an issue |
| 23:52 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Probably. |
| 23:52 |
erlehmann |
i think minecraft changed something about their textures at some point to account for that |
| 23:52 |
erlehmann |
i will look it up |
| 23:52 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> But then, content creators may not necessarily want to bake all accessibility features right into a package, and with texturepacks there is an alternative so they don't have to |
| 23:53 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Switching texture packs also has the advantage that they could specialize for specific accessibility needs |
| 23:57 |
erlehmann |
Warr1024 the most widespread accessibility needs should be addressed by default |
| 23:57 |
erlehmann |
for example some ppl require low contrast due to cognitive disabilities |
| 23:57 |
erlehmann |
but that is much rarer than having difficulties with low contrast |
| 23:57 |
erlehmann |
so i would do a texture pack for the former |
| 23:58 |
erlehmann |
but insist the latter is taken into account for default textures |
| 23:58 |
erlehmann |
Warr1024 i think a good example is the dye color textures in mineclone2, they are all differently shaped |
