| Time |
Nick |
Message |
| 00:03 |
sofar |
4.0 is too old I bet |
| 00:03 |
sofar |
fdroid would be wrong? |
| 00:35 |
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| 03:43 |
kaeza |
I just tested 5.0 on Android 4.4 and seems to work fine FWIW. |
| 03:57 |
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| 04:02 |
argyle77 |
I haven't had a chance to test on android yet. Can't wait to give it a try. |
| 04:14 |
sofar |
yeah, I installed 5.0.0 apk from github and it's playing great |
| 04:17 |
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| 04:38 |
ANAND |
I love the greatly improved controls |
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| 06:19 |
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| 06:19 |
MinetestBot |
paramat: Mar-08 13:19 UTC <IhrFussel> What I say is no nonsense at all... I said IF you acre about every feature request you should SHOW it more... but it's a fact that barely any feature request receives some feedback from core devs... you could at least add a comment stating your opinion or reaction but often all you do is adding the appropriate labels and that's it... that doesn't tell me as user that you actually care about |
| 06:25 |
paramat |
IhrFussel, barely any feature request doesn't receive feedback. i'm highly opinionated so i very often state my opinion (which then often annoys people). sometimes core devs just don't have anything to say or are very neutral, so don't comment. often core devs just don't have time, you can't blame us for that |
| 06:26 |
paramat |
and we do care, people just have to realise how little dev time we have |
| 06:29 |
paramat |
essentially: 'open-source' -> anyone on the internet can open a feature request. 'free' -> a small number of devs with extremely limited time for MT. inevitable result -> most feature requests go nowhere through no fault of our own |
| 06:30 |
paramat |
this is one of the problems with 'free open source' projects |
| 06:35 |
paramat |
around half of core dev work is mundane and not enjoyable, so we don't just work on what we want to, despite working in our free time when we should be enjoying ourselves. but you continue to accuse us of malice and incompetence |
| 06:41 |
paramat |
"I said IF you acre about every feature request you should SHOW it more" you didn't, you wrote: "there are many many open feature requests/bug reports that you somehow didn't care about till this day" |
| 06:41 |
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| 06:42 |
paramat |
as i wrote, if you want more dev, pay us full time wages. you're getting a game for free |
| 06:43 |
paramat |
you're intent on being negative instead of calmly rational |
| 06:44 |
paramat |
that's your problem |
| 06:49 |
paramat |
p_gimeno "there's no 'cave1' or 'cave2' in a world just generated [...] It seems they are generated when you enter the world for the first time" yes, which is why you shouldn't manually edit map_meta.txt but use a mod to set the noise parameters, then it will be in effect right from the start |
| 06:59 |
paramat |
IhrFussel, you write: "either you work on this project with passion and because you want to help to improve the game or not" that's what all core devs do clearly, implying otherwise is offensive. |
| 07:00 |
paramat |
"I didn't even mention 'work more' I said maybe restructure your dev time" what you request requires more time, and 'restructuring your dev time' means other aspects of dev will suffer. you're writing ridiculous and offensive things |
| 07:04 |
paramat |
it's either other server admin or core devs, you're driven to irrationally criticise. the problem is you |
| 07:07 |
paramat |
you're denying the limited dev time fact because you can't argue against it |
| 07:09 |
rubenwardy |
paramat: you know he's not in this channel, right |
| 07:15 |
paramat |
yes =) |
| 07:16 |
paramat |
they'll see it or i'll link them to it |
| 07:25 |
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| 09:42 |
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| 10:08 |
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| 10:09 |
Guest31 |
Hey, just wanted to ask if someone could remove 2018-05-21, 2018-10-30 and 2018-10-31 from the online irc logs |
| 10:13 |
Emerald2 |
Why? |
| 10:14 |
Guest31 |
I connected with my real name and don't want it to show up when someone searches for my name |
| 10:20 |
Emerald2 |
Hmm. Not even sure who's in charge of IRC logging. |
| 10:21 |
Emerald2 |
Shara do you know? |
| 10:26 |
Krock |
sfan5, possibly? |
| 11:18 |
Ingar |
time to publish my logs |
| 11:21 |
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| 11:23 |
sfan5 |
Guest31: I can remove the logged join entries if you tell me the nickname, but not entire days |
| 11:24 |
Guest31 |
Join entries are not enough |
| 11:25 |
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| 11:26 |
sfan5 |
the text too, I mean |
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| 13:46 |
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| 13:47 |
JDCodeIt |
Hi All - in a mod with optional dependency is the recommended way to check that a mod is available minetest.global_exists(...) versus get_modpath? |
| 13:49 |
p_gimeno |
global_exist will tell you if everything went well and the mod was loaded. I'm not sure if get_modpath is that reliable. |
| 13:50 |
JDCodeIt |
was thinking to update the wiki on that point - very little there about whether it returns a value if the mod name searched is part of the namespace |
| 13:51 |
p_gimeno |
on the other hand, nothing guarantees that a mod does register a global |
| 13:52 |
JDCodeIt |
true. I think the mod needs to recognize how the other developer prepared the globals, if any |
| 13:53 |
JDCodeIt |
but, get_modpath seems wrong on the surface because you can have a mod directory chock full of mods, but only a few selected for the game/world being played |
| 13:54 |
p_gimeno |
I don't know get_modpath that well. I don't know if it queries the currently loaded mods or the installed mod directory. |
| 13:55 |
JDCodeIt |
time to dig... |
| 13:55 |
p_gimeno |
If the former, then it's reliable. If the latter, then it's almost useless for this purpose. |
| 13:58 |
JDCodeIt |
get_modpath uses the mod manager object which appears to have a list of all mods (world, game, and normal) - so seems it would return a path even if the mod was not selected to be part of the world being played |
| 13:59 |
JDCodeIt |
its purpose seems to be - get me the directory so I can get access to a file over there (in my mod or someone else's) |
| 14:00 |
p_gimeno |
in that case, neither is reliable, therefore since you're depending on a mod, you need to be aware of what does that mod change, and check if that change is effective |
| 14:01 |
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| 14:02 |
JDCodeIt |
you could get the intended loading of a mod by accessing the load_mod_<...>=true from world.mt or whatever structure it goes into |
| 14:02 |
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| 14:03 |
p_gimeno |
I guess the mod author should know what part it depends on exactly, and should be able to check if it's there |
| 14:09 |
JDCodeIt |
nothing in rubewardy's modding book specifically on the topic of mods interacting, but could fit in the Intro to Clean Architecture |
| 14:12 |
p_gimeno |
well, depends.txt can specify that a mod, if it exists, should be loaded before yours; therefore if you know what effect of some other mod you need in yours, you can be sure that if it's installed and working, it will be already loaded, so you can check for that effect |
| 14:13 |
JDCodeIt |
yeah, but nothing tells you an optional mod didn't load, specifically - so then you need some reliable check - "is it present and loaded" |
| 14:15 |
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| 14:15 |
p_gimeno |
my point is, if it failed to load, the effect you need from it won't be there, and checking for it will fail |
| 14:15 |
p_gimeno |
and vice versa |
| 14:16 |
p_gimeno |
e.g. if you depend on a mod that registers a node, you can check if that node already exists |
| 14:17 |
JDCodeIt |
OK, perhaps a concrete example then. TenPlus1/protector wants a optional dependency on TenPlus1/lucky_block - but the game I'm playing doesn't have lucky_block selected, but it is in the list of mods in my mod folder |
| 14:17 |
p_gimeno |
or if you depend on a mod that adds an API, you can check if the API is there |
| 14:18 |
JDCodeIt |
in this case, the optional code is going to call a global function that is exposed by luck_block - maybe that is the global_exists that should be checked? |
| 14:18 |
MinetestBot |
[git] sfan5 -> minetest/minetestmapper: Update colors.txt cd0d1ad https://git.io/fhhzA (2019-03-09T14:16:28Z) |
| 14:20 |
p_gimeno |
ok, lucky_block registers a global, therefore in that particular case you can check for that global |
| 14:20 |
p_gimeno |
what I'm trying to say is that in the case that a mod does not register a global, you can check for some other effect of the mod that your mod relies on |
| 14:21 |
JDCodeIt |
...so if minetest.global_exists("lucky_block:add_blocks") then ... <-- notice the meta_data accessor - would that work? |
| 14:22 |
p_gimeno |
if minetest.global_exists("lucky_block") then ... |
| 14:23 |
p_gimeno |
https://notabug.org/TenPlus1/lucky_block/src/master/init.lua#L2 |
| 14:24 |
JDCodeIt |
yes, I see the global - so if any mod is going to expose an API - it is merely convention to use a global of the same name, but does not ensure that the specific function I want has been implemented in that version. |
| 14:24 |
p_gimeno |
right, but you can check for that function specifically |
| 14:25 |
p_gimeno |
e.g. if minetest.global_exists("lucky_block") and lucky_block.add_blocks then ... |
| 14:25 |
p_gimeno |
(which I believe is what you were after) |
| 14:25 |
JDCodeIt |
back to the lua question - with the ":" accessor will that exists in the global names? |
| 14:26 |
p_gimeno |
global_exists requires the name of a global variable, and "lucky_block:add_blocks" is not |
| 14:26 |
p_gimeno |
"lucky_block" is |
| 14:27 |
p_gimeno |
lucky_block is a global whose value is a table; add_blocks is a table field of a table which happens to be in a global, but it's not a global itself |
| 14:27 |
JDCodeIt |
right... _G("lucky_block:add_blocks") == nil is an invalid request or might always return true? |
| 14:27 |
p_gimeno |
I think it will always return false |
| 14:28 |
p_gimeno |
ah wait |
| 14:28 |
p_gimeno |
the comparison will return always true |
| 14:28 |
p_gimeno |
note the syntax is with [] instead of () |
| 14:29 |
JDCodeIt |
sorry about that yes, [] not () |
| 14:31 |
p_gimeno |
any table can have any string as key, including the globals - but only strings that correspond to an identifier can be accessed by the identifier. For example, _G["lucky_block"] is the same as _G.lucky_block |
| 14:32 |
p_gimeno |
however, _G["lucky_block:add_blocks"] has a string as index which doesn't correspond to an identifier, therefore it's not accessible with an identifier |
| 14:33 |
JDCodeIt |
so I think I should add a note the dev wiki that using get_modpath is not a good way to tell if a mod is loaded - I see so many examples of this in mods out there |
| 14:33 |
p_gimeno |
yes, definitely |
| 14:34 |
p_gimeno |
you also seem confused about the meaning of : |
| 14:34 |
JDCodeIt |
perhaps also something can be written in rubenwardy's book as lots of modders start there |
| 14:34 |
JDCodeIt |
please do tell - I'm not a lua expert |
| 14:35 |
p_gimeno |
: is a shortcut when calling (and ONLY calling - not accessing) functions which are fields of a table |
| 14:35 |
MinetestBot |
[git] sfan5 -> minetest/minetestmapper: Improve color averaging and update colors.txt again 0fd3dc1 https://git.io/fhhgO (2019-03-09T14:33:38Z) |
| 14:35 |
p_gimeno |
mytable:myfunction(3) is a shortcut to: mytable.myfunction(mytable, 3) |
| 14:35 |
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| 14:36 |
p_gimeno |
but you can't write e.g. x = mytable:myfunction; or if mytable:myfunction then ... |
| 14:36 |
JDCodeIt |
OK, so the lucky_block.add_blocks exists as a member in that table, but just happens to be a function, which you can call with the syntax lucky_block:add_blocks(...) |
| 14:37 |
p_gimeno |
when you call it with : then it's adding an implicit first parameter which is lucky_block itself |
| 14:37 |
p_gimeno |
you can still call it with . |
| 14:37 |
p_gimeno |
lucky_block:add_blocks(...) is equivalent to lucky_block.add_blocks(lucky_block, ...) |
| 14:38 |
p_gimeno |
the : is just a convenience for method calls |
| 14:38 |
JDCodeIt |
so inside the function when calling with : you can access the entire lucky_block, but in the other calling method you cannot? |
| 14:39 |
p_gimeno |
you can in both IF you pass the table as a parameter |
| 14:39 |
JDCodeIt |
right, but it's there implicitly with the ":" call |
| 14:39 |
p_gimeno |
exactly |
| 14:40 |
p_gimeno |
it is part of the language as a way to support method calls with implicit self |
| 14:41 |
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| 14:41 |
p_gimeno |
similarly, in function definitions, function mytable:myfunc(x) is exactly the same as function mytable.myfunc(self, x) |
| 14:42 |
JDCodeIt |
back to the example to wrap it up... if minetest.global_exists("lucky_block.add_blocks") might be good practice to check before calling your mod's optional code in that case |
| 14:42 |
p_gimeno |
well, again, add_blocks is a field of a table, not a global in itself. The global is just lucky_block. |
| 14:43 |
p_gimeno |
So the right check is first, check if the global exists, and then if the field exist within the table: if minetest.global_exists("lucky_block") and lucky_block.add_blocks then ... |
| 14:43 |
JDCodeIt |
OK, got it - not specifically checking the field - though after confirming lucky_block global exists one could also then check if lucky_block.add_blocks ~= nil |
| 14:44 |
p_gimeno |
exactly |
| 14:44 |
JDCodeIt |
Thanks for the helpful discussion! |
| 14:44 |
p_gimeno |
my pleasure :) |
| 14:46 |
p_gimeno |
remember also that nil and false are the only values considered as false in Lua, therefore, since lucky_block.add_blocks isn't expected to ever be set to false, the above check works too |
| 14:51 |
p_gimeno |
I have a question myself. I've created a mod like this: https://paste.scratchbook.ch/view/9e4853b3 - why is the minimap still disabled? |
| 14:57 |
JDCodeIt |
The get_modpath page is updated with a reference to global_exists - https://dev.minetest.net/minetest.get_modpath |
| 15:05 |
p_gimeno |
never mind my question, it's working now o.O |
| 15:20 |
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| 17:45 |
DoyleChris |
I have a problem with 5.0 |
| 17:45 |
DoyleChris |
my character is in the ground |
| 17:46 |
DoyleChris |
character is to be 2 blocks high |
| 17:46 |
DoyleChris |
but it is only seeing it as 1 block high. |
| 17:48 |
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| 17:53 |
Krock |
DoyleChris: update minetest_game |
| 17:54 |
DoyleChris |
update minetest_game how |
| 17:56 |
Krock |
nvm, you're on windows, so you probably installed all over from scratch |
| 17:56 |
DoyleChris |
it is i just downloaded it today |
| 17:56 |
Krock |
in that case, download the newest 3d_armor verison |
| 17:56 |
Krock |
in case you have that mod |
| 17:56 |
DoyleChris |
i do have 3darmor |
| 17:57 |
Krock |
https://github.com/stujones11/minetest-3d_armor/commits/master |
| 17:57 |
Krock |
most recent change was 4 days ago. grab the newest version there |
| 17:58 |
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| 18:20 |
DoyleChris |
that fixed it |
| 18:21 |
DoyleChris |
now i just need to bring all my buildings from 4.17 to 5 map |
| 18:24 |
Krock |
take the old map. copypaste |
| 18:26 |
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CESTRayCRYSTAL |
##JOIN minetest-ctf |
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botch |
hello minetest irc :) |
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