| Time |
Nick |
Message |
| 00:04 |
OldCoder |
_Megaf, Hi |
| 00:04 |
OldCoder |
You should focus for the weekend on the IRL matter |
| 00:04 |
OldCoder |
In 2 days things may change a lot |
| 00:04 |
OldCoder |
After that, let's discuss the fork if you like |
| 00:04 |
PR4530 |
Dwarf Fortress |
| 00:05 |
_Megaf |
OldCoder: I must admit that you are correct. But I'm so fed up at the moment |
| 00:06 |
OldCoder |
Well, fed up is not best time to decide things. Relax, focus on what you must focus on |
| 00:06 |
OldCoder |
For 1.5 days, then look at plans |
| 00:07 |
OldCoder |
I think you should consider, if you must, not a "fork", but a similar program, in 'C' (not C++) that borrows some of the code |
| 00:07 |
OldCoder |
Much simpler, something easier to work with |
| 00:07 |
_Megaf |
OldCoder: I can not code, I'm not a developer. I am a server admin and a player |
| 00:07 |
OldCoder |
But not really intended to replace; most forks die |
| 00:07 |
OldCoder |
Quickly |
| 00:07 |
OldCoder |
Hm |
| 00:07 |
OldCoder |
Then what is the fork talk about? |
| 00:07 |
OldCoder |
You were |
| 00:07 |
OldCoder |
Simply voicing |
| 00:08 |
_Megaf |
I have friends that can code :) |
| 00:08 |
OldCoder |
Well, see if they'd like a new project |
| 00:08 |
_Megaf |
and they are familiar with Minetest |
| 00:08 |
OldCoder |
But there is no need to be on negative terms with the current one |
| 00:08 |
_Megaf |
and we are actually implementing Python in the future |
| 00:08 |
OldCoder |
Regardless, you know that you should be asleep now |
| 00:08 |
OldCoder |
As Sunday |
| 00:08 |
OldCoder |
is slotted for something else IRL, correct? |
| 00:08 |
_Megaf |
OldCoder: you are correct, heading to bed |
| 00:08 |
OldCoder |
Relax, then |
| 00:08 |
OldCoder |
If you do shut down |
| 00:09 |
OldCoder |
Transfer your world(s) to me. But perhaps you'll feel differently |
| 00:09 |
OldCoder |
After Monday. Either way, things |
| 00:09 |
OldCoder |
might change |
| 00:09 |
OldCoder |
|
| 00:09 |
OldCoder |
Good night and good luck next week |
| 00:09 |
_Megaf |
OldCoder: Megaf Server will stay property of Megaf forever. If I do fork Minetest, Megaf Server will be migrated to my fork |
| 00:09 |
_Megaf |
s/forever/until I die |
| 00:10 |
OldCoder |
"Property" is an interesting concept for this sort of thing. I'll be here in the U.S. afternoon tomorrow to talk about Monday if you like. |
| 00:10 |
OldCoder |
I can't necessarily help but you can count on me as a sounding board |
| 00:10 |
_Megaf |
[01:09:48] <OldCoder> Good night and good luck next week |
| 00:10 |
OldCoder |
Yep |
| 00:10 |
_Megaf |
Thank you OldCoder |
| 00:10 |
OldCoder |
See me tomorrow |
| 00:10 |
_Megaf |
Good night |
| 00:10 |
OldCoder |
If you'd like |
| 00:10 |
OldCoder |
to discuss scenarios for the meeting |
| 00:10 |
OldCoder |
o/ |
| 00:10 |
_Megaf |
\o |
| 00:10 |
* _Megaf |
closes the window |
| 00:11 |
OldCoder |
There is something else he |
| 00:11 |
OldCoder |
is focused on... the split or fork will not be immediate |
| 00:11 |
OldCoder |
|
| 00:13 |
PR4530 |
OldCoder: can you share that tsundere.fi world, I want to walk on it in singleplay, if it is not big... |
| 00:14 |
OldCoder |
PR4530, yes except we don't know which file it *is*. I had to suspend work on it for the Summer but will resume it. |
| 00:14 |
OldCoder |
Some of the worlds aren't even in modern format; I'd started to work out how to convert them |
| 00:14 |
PR4530 |
it is either tsundere.fi or kray's server |
| 00:14 |
OldCoder |
I know |
| 00:14 |
OldCoder |
He didn't store the files with recognizable names |
| 00:14 |
OldCoder |
There are many files and bits and pieces |
| 00:15 |
OldCoder |
If I knew which one it was I'd boot it now |
| 00:15 |
OldCoder |
How about a deal |
| 00:15 |
PR4530 |
there was converter somewhere, and minetest can read old format iirc, but ok, good night! |
| 00:15 |
OldCoder |
He is too busy to... |
| 00:15 |
OldCoder |
Wait |
| 00:15 |
OldCoder |
Proposed deal: |
| 00:15 |
OldCoder |
One part of the delay is that I have nobody to help me interpret what I find |
| 00:15 |
PR4530 |
that world is in older format |
| 00:15 |
OldCoder |
If I return to this this month or next month will you tour what I set up |
| 00:15 |
OldCoder |
Yes, I can run it |
| 00:15 |
OldCoder |
Observe: |
| 00:16 |
OldCoder |
http://minetest.org/happyfort.jpg |
| 00:16 |
OldCoder |
http://minetest.org/maybecat.jpg |
| 00:16 |
OldCoder |
The oldest surviving structures in Minetest. Fall 2010. |
| 00:16 |
OldCoder |
If I return to this this month or next month will you tour what I set up and tell me what I'm looking at? |
| 00:17 |
OldCoder |
The preceding structures were in "sectors" format |
| 00:17 |
OldCoder |
Obscure indeed |
| 00:17 |
PR4530 |
right |
| 00:17 |
OldCoder |
O.K., deal |
| 00:17 |
OldCoder |
I will try to get back to it |
| 00:17 |
OldCoder |
Must focus on IRL now and it is 3am there right? |
| 00:18 |
PR4530 |
right, good night, have fun |
| 00:18 |
OldCoder |
o/ |
| 00:19 |
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| 08:28 |
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| 08:30 |
Cyborg42 |
Hi all! How do I set English language on non-English system? |
| 08:30 |
Krock |
language = en |
| 08:31 |
Krock |
or delete the locale directory |
| 08:31 |
Cyborg42 |
Where do I put this? |
| 08:31 |
|
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| 08:32 |
Krock |
into your minetest.conf file |
| 08:32 |
Krock |
or the locale directory into your trash bin |
| 08:32 |
Krock |
depends what you want to do |
| 08:32 |
Krock |
(rename would be possible too) |
| 08:36 |
MinetestBot |
[git] Rui-Minetest -> minetest/minetest: Remove unused parameter of GUIVolumeChange b3fc133 https://git.io/vPB3h (2016-10-09T10:35:51+02:00) |
| 08:38 |
Cyborg42 |
Krock: Thank you! Conf file works fine. |
| 08:38 |
Krock |
!next |
| 08:38 |
MinetestBot |
Another satisfied customer. Next! |
| 08:38 |
|
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| 08:39 |
Cyborg42 |
Wonder why nobody thought of creating empty "en" dir and having it in the UI too. |
| 08:46 |
Krock |
that's another one-liner to fix :/ |
| 08:54 |
agaran |
Hello |
| 08:54 |
Krock |
hi agaran |
| 08:54 |
Krock |
Cyborg42, https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/4606/files |
| 08:54 |
agaran |
anyone knows if there is more recent protector than https://github.com/Zeg9/minetest-protect/ ? |
| 08:55 |
Krock |
protector redo, perhaps? |
| 08:55 |
Krock |
https://github.com/tenplus1/protector |
| 08:55 |
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| 08:55 |
agaran |
thx :) |
| 08:55 |
Krock |
!next |
| 08:55 |
MinetestBot |
Another satisfied customer. Next! |
| 08:56 |
Cyborg42 |
Krock: nice |
| 08:58 |
agaran |
that was the one I was looking for |
| 08:58 |
Krock |
^^ |
| 09:03 |
agaran |
bridges mod for mg_valley.. yay |
| 09:20 |
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| 13:17 |
MinetestBot |
[git] nerzhul -> minetest/minetest: Environment cleanup 70f104b https://git.io/vPBBj (2016-10-09T15:17:10+02:00) |
| 13:19 |
MinetestBot |
[git] sfan5 -> minetest/minetestmapper: Fix small typo (std:cerr -> std::cerr) 09945ca https://git.io/vPBRf (2016-10-09T15:19:35+02:00) |
| 13:40 |
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| 13:51 |
agaran |
!seen paramat |
| 13:51 |
MinetestBot |
agaran: paramat was last seen at 2016-10-07 20:42:31 UTC on #minetest |
| 13:52 |
Krock |
you have more chances in -project |
| 13:52 |
agaran |
ah |
| 13:52 |
Krock |
or in -dev ;) |
| 13:52 |
agaran |
I am too noobish for -dev |
| 13:57 |
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| 14:34 |
MinetestBot |
[git] nerzhul -> minetest/minetest: A little cleanup since previous commit 1b45086 https://git.io/vPBu6 (2016-10-09T16:31:43+02:00) |
| 14:37 |
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| 15:54 |
MrJones |
silly question: if I just install the game and launch singleplayer, is there anything else I'm supposed to do for enemies and animals? |
| 15:54 |
MrJones |
like, would I need mods for that? or is that in the game and I just didn't enable it |
| 15:56 |
sfan5 |
you need mods for that |
| 15:57 |
MrJones |
is there like some sort of standard mod pack? like for someone new to the game who just wants some reasonable base functionality |
| 15:59 |
sfan5 |
i don't know of any |
| 15:59 |
sfan5 |
ufortunately you need to find the mods you want for yourself |
| 16:00 |
sfan5 |
*unfortunately |
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| 16:54 |
agaran |
MrJones: easiest way may be to wander thru several servers and looking what mods they have, then trying them on local machine via singleplayer |
| 16:57 |
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| 16:59 |
Out`Of`Control |
25 GB map turn into 2.4 GB map |
| 17:00 |
Krock |
Out`Of`Control, how? |
| 17:00 |
Out`Of`Control |
Krock: delete all below -200 |
| 17:00 |
Out`Of`Control |
but i need more tests |
| 17:01 |
sfan5 |
but people can also build bases below -200 you know |
| 17:01 |
Out`Of`Control |
sfan5: i know |
| 17:01 |
Krock |
add a rule that they should not build anything there :P |
| 17:01 |
* agaran |
routinelly builds below -1k if possible... |
| 17:01 |
Out`Of`Control |
i am only testing |
| 17:02 |
Out`Of`Control |
sfan5: you can't protect land under 200, i can save some with WE |
| 17:02 |
sfan5 |
you can't? why not |
| 17:03 |
agaran |
landrush I think does not go below -200 |
| 17:03 |
Out`Of`Control |
maybe i change it to -500 will see |
| 17:03 |
Out`Of`Control |
but its 10x smaller wow |
| 17:04 |
Out`Of`Control |
"Name-ID mapping version not supported!" corupted map chunk? |
| 17:05 |
sfan5 |
yes |
| 17:05 |
Out`Of`Control |
ok thanks |
| 17:06 |
Out`Of`Control |
i try many tools on this map. something whent wrong, but its a copy |
| 17:06 |
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| 17:07 |
agaran |
Hi IhrFussel |
| 17:08 |
sfan5 |
what kind of tools try to modify the serialized map data? |
| 17:08 |
IhrFussel |
Hey there...I decided to do the following: Create a new map with the exact same seed, save the most important buildings via WE and paste them into the new map at the same location |
| 17:10 |
Out`Of`Control |
anyone know an easy way to tweak mod_travelnet.data file? |
| 17:10 |
agaran |
sfan5: silly idea, what if I load some mapblock with voxelmanip, save which each node is, replace those nodes with clean-meta-if-should-be-empty node, then apply VM, then revert, would it clean metadata in map? |
| 17:10 |
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| 17:11 |
IhrFussel |
But before I start with this extremely difficult task I have some questions: 1. Will the same seed GUARANTEE the exact same map generation? 2. Can I specify a seed WITHOUT UI? |
| 17:11 |
agaran |
yes I know it will stress minetest core but I want to avoid chopping there directly.. |
| 17:11 |
agaran |
IhrFussel: seed = in config |
| 17:11 |
sfan5 |
IhrFussel: 1 not exactly the same i think 2 yes there's a setting, what did you think the main menu sets? |
| 17:11 |
agaran |
IhrFussel: in map_meta.txt you have seed = ... |
| 17:12 |
sfan5 |
you can also modify the seed *number* in map_meta.txt |
| 17:12 |
IhrFussel |
sfan5, how much can it differ from the original? |
| 17:12 |
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| 17:13 |
sfan5 |
agaran: are you talking about https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commit/3a57e525009ade2aa039b0bab33e4b10eda36bf4 ? |
| 17:13 |
agaran |
wow, great, gonna git pull then |
| 17:13 |
sfan5 |
IhrFussel: if it does then it will probably be small details that differ |
| 17:13 |
agaran |
sfan5: thanks ALOT :) |
| 17:14 |
sfan5 |
yeah no |
| 17:14 |
sfan5 |
agaran: 1) you probably can't fix this with vmanip anyway 2) just applying this commit won't fix your map |
| 17:14 |
IhrFussel |
sfan5, okay so it SHOULD be possible to have overall the same map and players will not notice differences? |
| 17:14 |
sfan5 |
tl;dr make sure to read the extended commit description |
| 17:14 |
sfan5 |
IhrFussel: dunno try it :) |
| 17:14 |
sfan5 |
i can't predict which differences your players would notice |
| 17:15 |
agaran |
sfan5: I know it wont fix, but should reduce -some- junk in there, VM to replace nodes with ones I want (that clean metadata) |
| 17:15 |
agaran |
just to do like default:stone -> my cleaner node => default stone replacement.. |
| 17:15 |
agaran |
stone, air shall have no meta |
| 17:15 |
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| 17:15 |
sfan5 |
they can have meta too |
| 17:16 |
agaran |
then I amnot aware about reason they might.. |
| 17:16 |
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| 17:24 |
MinetestBot |
[git] Nestorfish -> minetest/minetestmapper: Improvements to Node name/ID mapping code c45965e https://git.io/vPBoZ (2016-10-09T19:22:28+02:00) |
| 17:29 |
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| 18:08 |
ShadowNinja |
BTW, we just got featured on the front page of hacker news, we've gotten over 2000 today uniques so far. |
| 18:08 |
ShadowNinja |
s/today uniques/uniques today/ |
| 18:08 |
red-001 |
link? |
| 18:09 |
sfan5 |
huh |
| 18:09 |
ShadowNinja |
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12670310 |
| 18:12 |
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| 18:13 |
ShadowNinja |
Analytics: http://i.imgur.com/2j14Pt4.png |
| 18:14 |
Krock |
wow nice |
| 18:14 |
sfan5 |
oh right we have analytics |
| 18:15 |
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| 18:15 |
Fixer_ |
ycombinator effect |
| 18:17 |
sfan5 |
>One of the best 'downloads' page I've seen |
| 18:17 |
sfan5 |
i wonder what makes it so good |
| 18:17 |
swift110 |
hey all |
| 18:19 |
Krock |
Perhaps the direct and large written links :) |
| 18:20 |
sfan5 |
or maybe the fact that we say GNU/Linux instead of Linux |
| 18:22 |
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| 18:23 |
red-001 |
when will mod security be enabled by default? |
| 18:24 |
sfan5 |
i'm sure it already is |
| 18:24 |
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| 18:24 |
ShadowNinja |
Surely soon (tm). |
| 18:25 |
red-001 |
so never? |
| 18:25 |
ShadowNinja |
sfan5: Nope, still disabled: https://github.com/minetest/minetest/blob/master/src/defaultsettings.cpp#L304 |
| 18:26 |
ShadowNinja |
red-001: Probably soon, we just haven't got to it. Maybe I'll make a pull now. |
| 18:26 |
sfan5 |
what really |
| 18:26 |
sfan5 |
well why is it not enabled |
| 18:28 |
ShadowNinja |
sfan5: It was left off for testing and we never got to enabling it I guess. I was running it on my mini-world server without problems. I think player_textures is just about the only mod still incompatible with it, but there's a PR to fix it. |
| 18:29 |
Fixer_ |
sfan5: o.O |
| 18:29 |
sfan5 |
i see |
| 18:29 |
Fixer_ |
sfan5: download pages THAT MUCH FUCKED UP so minetest one is actually good? |
| 18:29 |
sfan5 |
idk |
| 18:31 |
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| 18:32 |
ShadowNinja |
I think one of the things that makes our DL page good is that it provides some information for beginers and gives you simple install links for a bunch of platforms. |
| 18:32 |
agaran |
paramat: Hello, can I have question(s) about intersecting mod? |
| 18:33 |
paramat |
yes |
| 18:33 |
agaran |
paramat: is there some setting to prevent lightore to be generated just under surface shallow enough that it shines thru dirt? |
| 18:35 |
paramat |
you want it deeper so it doesn't shine through corners? |
| 18:37 |
agaran |
yep, especially looking funny on deserts |
| 18:37 |
agaran |
I looked at code but I didn't found how to adjust that.. |
| 18:37 |
paramat |
ah, you want it to start at a deeper y value |
| 18:37 |
agaran |
and this mod + valleys mg is cpu-killer |
| 18:37 |
agaran |
(it alone on v6 mapgen was reporting 500-900ms per mapblock) |
| 18:38 |
agaran |
ok, I'll try tweaking :) |
| 18:38 |
paramat |
hang on .. |
| 18:38 |
paramat |
https://github.com/paramat/intersecting/blob/master/init.lua#L254 |
| 18:39 |
paramat |
if y < LUXDEPTH and math.random() < LUXCHA then |
| 18:40 |
paramat |
easy really |
| 18:40 |
agaran |
and set LUXDEPTH to desired value? |
| 18:40 |
paramat |
yes or add it as a parameter to top of file |
| 18:41 |
paramat |
the mod is a heavy user of noise, all that 3D noise |
| 18:41 |
agaran |
yes I felt that :) |
| 18:41 |
agaran |
but tunnels are awesome |
| 18:41 |
paramat |
it still needs one more noise memory use optimisation |
| 18:42 |
paramat |
you might get OOM crash with LuaJIT |
| 18:43 |
agaran |
I was testing it only a little bit, but caverns that get easilly several hundreds nodes down.. neat |
| 18:45 |
ShadowNinja |
sfan5: https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/4614 |
| 18:45 |
_Megaf |
wait, you mean Minetest uses less memory without Luajit? |
| 18:45 |
paramat |
LuaJIT has a very low mwmory use limit ~2GB |
| 18:48 |
ShadowNinja |
LuaJIT is basically 32-bit limited, so you may be able to get up to 4GiB of memory, but it will realistically be much less. Non-JIT Lua is also *MUCH* faster at allocating a lot of memory (possibly because LuaJIT uses an old and slow GC). |
| 18:50 |
_Megaf |
so on a server with lots of mods and mesecons and technic and pipeworks. What is best, JIT or non JIT? |
| 18:50 |
_Megaf |
maybe LuaJIT could speed things up on CPU side and slow on memory side? |
| 18:52 |
Out`Of`Control |
how compile with Non-JIT? |
| 18:52 |
ShadowNinja |
_Megaf: LuaJIT probably still faster than Lua in most cases, it just has a few parts that are starting to fall behind Lua. |
| 18:52 |
Out`Of`Control |
so minetest eat more ram |
| 18:53 |
paramat |
because i dev lua mapgens i always use non-JIT |
| 18:53 |
ShadowNinja |
We're still stuck on Lua 5.1 though, so the optimizations added in 5.2 and 5.3 don't really apply either unlesss you modify the build files. |
| 18:55 |
Out`Of`Control |
DENABLE_LUAJIT=0 would eat more ram? |
| 18:55 |
sfan5 |
it would make it possible to use more |
| 18:55 |
Out`Of`Control |
cool, as i have too much free ram |
| 18:56 |
sfan5 |
ok you misunderstood me |
| 18:56 |
sfan5 |
it opens the possibility of using more |
| 18:56 |
sfan5 |
it won't use more |
| 18:56 |
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| 18:56 |
Out`Of`Control |
ok thanks, will compile and compare |
| 18:57 |
Out`Of`Control |
sfan5: will it stop crashes like lua out of ram? |
| 18:57 |
Out`Of`Control |
i just wonder |
| 18:57 |
sfan5 |
yes it would help in those cases |
| 18:57 |
Out`Of`Control |
cool |
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| 19:13 |
ShadowNinja |
I wonder if we could catch those cases and print something about how you should try without LuaJIT. Otherwise the massage is quite confusing since you probably have plenty of memory left. |
| 19:15 |
ShadowNinja |
Ravi is a promising modern alternative to LuaJIT, although I don't think it's particularly fast yet: https://ravilang.github.io/ |
| 19:16 |
ShadowNinja |
It uses LLVM or libgccjit and has support for optional static typing for additional speedups. |
| 19:17 |
sfan5 |
including the whole of llvm is pretty heavy though |
| 19:19 |
Hawk777 |
Isn’t LLVM already used by some Linux video drivers to compile shaders? |
| 19:20 |
Hawk777 |
So, not absurd to embed it. |
| 19:37 |
ShadowNinja |
sfan5: There's also the libgccjit backend. And we definitely shouldn't just copy the whole thing into our source tree like we did with Lua 5.1. |
| 19:42 |
Hawk777 |
Although http://the-ravi-programming-language.readthedocs.io/en/latest/ravi-jit-status.html seems to suggest it’s not quite ready for primetime yet (no coroutines, no infinite tail recursion, and not recommended to use C API). |
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| 21:01 |
red-001 |
is Jeija on irc? |
| 21:01 |
Krock |
sometimes |
| 21:01 |
Krock |
currently offline |
| 21:02 |
red-001 |
~seen jeija |
| 21:02 |
ShadowBot |
red-001: I haven't seen jeija in #minetest. |
| 21:02 |
red-001 |
~seen Jeija |
| 21:02 |
ShadowBot |
red-001: I saw Jeija in #minetest 2 days, 23 hours, 22 minutes, and 38 seconds ago saying "The curvature is implemented in shaders, yes. But the mechanics of the planet can only be implemented in the cpp code." |
| 21:02 |
red-001 |
~tell |
| 21:02 |
ShadowBot |
red-001: tell <nick> <text> |
| 21:02 |
Krock |
!tell |
| 21:02 |
MinetestBot |
Krock: Need a nickname... |
| 21:03 |
red-001 |
nvm I will just write new documentation |
| 21:08 |
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| 21:10 |
red-001 |
what version of cc by sa does the dev wiki use? |
| 21:14 |
Krock |
click on the link on the footer |
| 21:14 |
Krock |
3.0 |
| 21:15 |
red-001 |
why does it use a diffrent license then lua_api.txt? |
| 21:17 |
Krock |
because creative commons is common for wikis |
| 21:17 |
Krock |
thus, default |
| 21:17 |
red-001 |
still it makes it harder to reuse documentation from lua_api.txt |
| 21:19 |
red-001 |
~tell Jeija I reformated documention written by you about HTTPFetchRequest that was in lua_api.txt (licensed under lgpl v2.1) and added it to the dev wiki (licensed under cc by sa). I hope this isn't a problem. |
| 21:19 |
ShadowBot |
red-001: O.K. |
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