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Message |
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| 09:08 |
VanessaE |
'm still looking for people to test the hell out of the latest commits of {biome_lib, plantlife modpack, moretrees} or Dreambuilder if someone could please try them |
| 09:09 |
VanessaE |
or should I say `(biome_lib and plantlife modpack and moretrees) or dreambuilder_game` ;) |
| 09:28 |
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| 11:47 |
BuckarooBanzai |
VanessaE: i saw your commits on the "biome_lib" repo (https://github.com/pandorabox-io/pandorabox-mods/pull/1620) is it safe to test that in "production" :D |
| 11:47 |
BuckarooBanzai |
we don't have the "plantlife" modpack enable though |
| 11:47 |
BuckarooBanzai |
*enabled |
| 11:51 |
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| 11:58 |
VanessaE |
BuckarooBanzai: it is safe, but without either plantlife or moretrees it won't do much :P |
| 12:17 |
BuckarooBanzai |
we _do_ have moretrees ;) |
| 12:19 |
VanessaE |
ok :) |
| 12:24 |
VanessaE |
note that you might want to set biome_lib_debug_log_level to 3 to get some interesting statistics |
| 12:25 |
VanessaE |
(but not 4, unless you want to flood your console with set-node/tree/function call messages ;) ) |
| 12:27 |
BuckarooBanzai |
reading biome_lib's source code reminds me of this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBOqfLVCDv8 |
| 12:33 |
VanessaE |
HEY |
| 12:33 |
VanessaE |
it isn't THAT baade. |
| 12:33 |
VanessaE |
bad* |
| 12:39 |
VanessaE |
if I didn't have to do so many workarounds, it would be a little more straightforward .... now I sound like Warr1024 :) |
| 12:45 |
VanessaE |
that said I'm open to ideas/suggestions to streamline the code a little |
| 12:52 |
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| 13:09 |
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| 13:56 |
MTDiscord |
<ChaosWormz> Why are people going angry about the Richard Stallman guy returning to the FSF? |
| 13:58 |
rubenwardy |
some context: https://rms-open-letter.github.io/ |
| 14:03 |
MTDiscord |
<ChaosWormz> i wonder if FSF will fade away due to this |
| 14:11 |
MTDiscord |
<ChaosWormz> i do have a semi-unrelated question, that confuses me. What the diffrence between Free Software and Open Source Software |
| 14:12 |
MTDiscord |
<ChaosWormz> can one be one of those and not the other |
| 14:14 |
sfan5 |
basically, "open source" just means you can look at the source code while "free software" implies certain freedoms such as being able to redistribute or modify the software |
| 14:14 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> example discord is free but not open source(for the most part) minetest is free and open source |
| 14:14 |
sfan5 |
...and as you can see with "free software" people can get confused about free of charge and freedom |
| 14:14 |
sfan5 |
which is why sometimes "libre software" is used |
| 14:15 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> depends what context its used in |
| 14:16 |
MTDiscord |
<appguru> Free Libre Open Source Software (FLOSS) |
| 14:16 |
MTDiscord |
<appguru> An abomination of a term |
| 14:17 |
rubenwardy |
open source also means you have certain freedoms, under the open source definition |
| 14:17 |
rubenwardy |
really, the difference is political |
| 14:17 |
rubenwardy |
they're both ambiguous terms as well |
| 14:19 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> ^ |
| 14:20 |
rubenwardy |
Programmers aren't very good at naming things |
| 14:20 |
MTDiscord |
<appguru> Hmmm |
| 14:20 |
MTDiscord |
<appguru> At naming large things |
| 14:20 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> looks at the name of this project and the rehash of rename it in the forums |
| 14:20 |
MTDiscord |
<appguru> But naming small things, like variables, properly, is IMO a requirement for a good programmer |
| 14:24 |
rubenwardy |
not really |
| 14:24 |
rubenwardy |
naming things is hard |
| 14:28 |
rubenwardy |
I mean, it's important to name variables in a meanful way. But I don't think many programmers can name things well |
| 14:31 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> naming variables is more naming them practical things while naming a project is more something that sounds good to general users which is complicated....something like that? |
| 14:32 |
rubenwardy |
not practical, but understandable |
| 14:32 |
rubenwardy |
free software and open software aren't understandable terms |
| 14:33 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> yeah, understandable is a better way to put it |
| 14:47 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Why do we have an acronym for FLOSS but not for BRUSH? Aren't we going to end up with CAVITIES, whatever the hell that stands for? |
| 15:36 |
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| 15:49 |
MTDiscord |
<Kimapr> "discord is free but not open source(for the most part)" discord is neither free nor open source (unless you mean "free" as in "free beer", but then there's freebeer.org , which is a beer that's free as in free speech but not free as in free beer...) |
| 15:49 |
MTDiscord |
<Kimapr> "FREE BEER is a beer which is free in the sense of freedom, not in the sense of free beer." |
| 16:01 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> https://discord.com/licenses |
| 16:02 |
rubenwardy |
Libraries, not Discord itself |
| 16:03 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> >not open source |
| 16:03 |
rubenwardy |
A proprietary program can use open source libraries |
| 16:04 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> "discord is free but not open source(for the most part)" can be restated as discord is not open source(but some of the library's it uses are) |
| 16:06 |
MTDiscord |
<Kimapr> discord is absolutely proprietary, no matter what open source libraries it uses |
| 16:06 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> i never said it was |
| 16:06 |
MTDiscord |
<Kimapr> what did you mean by "free" then? |
| 16:07 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> "not open source" <literally said it right there |
| 16:07 |
MTDiscord |
<Kimapr> stuff can be free (libre) but not open source, and vice versa |
| 16:07 |
MTDiscord |
<Kimapr> that's very rare though |
| 16:08 |
MTDiscord |
<Kimapr> and discord is not an example of that |
| 16:08 |
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| 16:16 |
MTDiscord |
<Kimapr> https://softwareengineering.stackexchange.com/questions/21907/open-source-but-not-free-software-or-vice-versa#21949 |
| 16:20 |
celeron55 |
what would be an example of a libre-but-not-open-source thing? |
| 16:21 |
celeron55 |
i guess you could call a CC-licensed photo that |
| 16:22 |
celeron55 |
or really anything that intrinsically doesn't have a source |
| 16:24 |
celeron55 |
i guess even a program can be libre but not have source code available, but that's weird and inconvenient and barely makes sense |
| 16:25 |
celeron55 |
after all programs can be modified using a disassembler so it just requires a skillset... |
| 16:25 |
celeron55 |
who said libre has to be easy |
| 16:37 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> I'm pretty sure libre and open source mean basically the same things in spirit, but they approach the same goals from different cultural underpinnings. |
| 16:38 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> If you get something in binary-only form, it can still have open source, i.e. it can be licensed under an open-source license that grants you the rights to modify the source code ... it just isn't required to actually provide you with the source code, so you might be on your own with that one. |
| 16:38 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> But e.g. an MIT license still grants you the right to reverse engineer and patch binaries even if you don't have source code. |
| 16:39 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> The "open source" thing is basically a hack to make "free software" more palatable to for-profit businesses by pushing it as a "code excellence through crowdsourcing" thing rather than a moral thing. |
| 16:41 |
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| 17:20 |
celeron55 |
i think open source means more "transparency" than "crowdsourcing" |
| 17:21 |
celeron55 |
or code excellence" |
| 17:21 |
celeron55 |
+" |
| 17:21 |
celeron55 |
i guess it depends on the company and project |
| 17:22 |
MTDiscord |
<Jordach> At least discord contributes back to the community |
| 17:23 |
MTDiscord |
<Jordach> Meanwhile at Oracle and SCO |
| 17:40 |
VanessaE |
shh, never say the name of The Beast :P |
| 17:52 |
MTDiscord |
<appguru> They be killing Java |
| 17:52 |
MTDiscord |
<appguru> Isn't that enough of a contribution? |
| 18:14 |
MTDiscord |
<Jordach> well yes but actually no |
| 18:15 |
MTDiscord |
<Jordach> some devices can only be programmed with java |
| 18:19 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Let them eat Kotlin |
| 18:20 |
MTDiscord |
<Jordach> you mean a dumbed down java for people with farenheit IQ |
| 18:21 |
MTDiscord |
<oneplustwo> "farenheit" |
| 18:21 |
MTDiscord |
<Jordach> spelling schmelling |
| 18:21 |
rubenwardy |
easier to use is better |
| 18:21 |
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| 18:22 |
MTDiscord |
<Jordach> they said that about iPhones |
| 18:22 |
rubenwardy |
kotlin isn't even simpler. Java is mostly quite simple, the problem is it lacks any syntactic sugar |
| 18:22 |
rubenwardy |
so everything is boilerplate |
| 18:23 |
MTDiscord |
<Jordach> that sounds like a lack of develop imagination |
| 18:23 |
MTDiscord |
<Jordach> developer |
| 18:24 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> "Easier to use" is kind of an absurd thing to mock a language for. |
| 18:25 |
rubenwardy |
it stems from elitism |
| 18:25 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> I was gonna say "that's some brogrammer-ass thinking" but sure, same diff :-) |
| 18:26 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> I mean, I always assumed I was a bit elitist, but not to the extent where I'd handicap myself just to flex. |
| 18:32 |
MTDiscord |
<Jordach> so COBOL is now "ist" and an "ism" these days |
| 19:07 |
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