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Jordach |
experimental regular skybox blending |
| 01:02 |
Jordach |
https://i.imgur.com/MXZPwGC.png |
| 01:04 |
Jordach |
i've also like shaved off 8 tris |
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MinetestBot |
benrob0329: Nov-09 22:04 UTC <paramat> too much offtopic from you on 25/10/18. please don't :) |
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| 13:27 |
Andrey01 |
hi |
| 13:28 |
Krock |
hi |
| 13:28 |
Andrey01 |
can anybody explain me how to offset node programmically? for example, on right click |
| 13:29 |
Krock |
what do you mean by offset? move the node around? |
| 13:29 |
Andrey01 |
yes, just move in minetest world |
| 13:30 |
Andrey01 |
are there any methods that implement it? |
| 13:31 |
Krock |
minetest.set_node(new_pos, minetest.get_node(old_pos)) minetest.remove_node(old_pos) |
| 13:33 |
Andrey01 |
thanks |
| 13:36 |
Krock |
!next |
| 13:36 |
MinetestBot |
Another satisfied customer. Next! |
| 13:37 |
Andrey01 |
what does it mean above? ^ |
| 13:38 |
Andrey01 |
what`s command !next ? |
| 13:41 |
Krock |
it means anyone else may submit their question |
| 13:41 |
Krock |
it's like a queue at the mall |
| 14:08 |
rud0lf |
Krock: how much for VIP access to queue? ;) |
| 14:09 |
Krock |
rud0lf: uhm.. at least.. a lot. |
| 14:50 |
Jordach |
Krock, would you like some smooth vertex blending in the regular skybox? |
| 14:50 |
Jordach |
https://i.imgur.com/zR8PhE6.png |
| 14:51 |
Krock |
I don't see a difference |
| 14:51 |
Jordach |
the bottom of the horizon is more yellow |
| 14:51 |
Jordach |
but the top is considerably darker |
| 14:55 |
Jordach |
here's what the top sky colour looks like against the gradient blend https://i.imgur.com/mpuR6lP.png |
| 14:59 |
Krock |
eeks |
| 15:00 |
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| 15:05 |
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| 15:21 |
Jordach |
Krock, it's there, and it's much smoother than that odd banding we did have |
| 15:23 |
Andrey01 |
when i create inventory list "list[inventory_location;list_name;X, Y;W, H]" can i name a list how i want (assign a value to "list_name") or use only reserved names as "craft", "hand", "main"... ? |
| 15:24 |
Krock |
use set_list to create any new list |
| 15:26 |
Andrey01 |
but can i name a list at will? |
| 15:28 |
Andrey01 |
for example, "list_name" = "my_list"? |
| 15:29 |
Andrey01 |
in list[] |
| 15:31 |
Andrey01 |
can i do so? |
| 15:33 |
Andrey01 |
Krock, are you here? |
| 15:33 |
Krock |
yes |
| 15:33 |
Krock |
and yes |
| 15:34 |
Andrey01 |
answer my question please: can i name "list_name" in list[] at will? |
| 15:34 |
Krock |
I already did that |
| 15:35 |
Krock |
so it will look like this: list[current_player;my_list;0,5;8,4;] |
| 15:38 |
Andrey01 |
but can i just name a list without set_list() method in list[inventory_location;my_list;X, Y; W, H] how i want? what to call set_list if i can do so for? |
| 15:39 |
Krock |
set_list *creates" a list |
| 15:39 |
Krock |
you cannot use lists which don't exist |
| 16:48 |
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| 18:37 |
tumeninodes |
spamathons on the forum lately, such a pathetic way to advertise, and a waste of $ paying for that sort of traffic, as most people today aren't fooled as they were years ago. |
| 18:44 |
T4im |
spammers don't spam to fool most people.. they spam to fool some people; which if they spam enough, are enough to make it worth while |
| 18:48 |
Calinou |
they also try to fool search engines |
| 18:48 |
Calinou |
some of them are copy-pasting real replies and adding links at the end, it's harder to detect |
| 18:48 |
Calinou |
(I noticed this on the Godot Q&A forum) |
| 18:59 |
tumeninodes |
Jordach, that skybox looks so nice... where's the PR? |
| 19:00 |
tumeninodes |
Nvm, I see it |
| 19:12 |
* Shara |
did some clean up |
| 19:50 |
Jordach |
Fixer_, i think i spent like 20 minutes trying to not have the artificial horizon mess up the sunrise |
| 19:54 |
Jordach |
...and sooner or later, i'll expand the controls for set_sky to allow replacing of the regular sky colours |
| 20:21 |
Shara |
For the record: I hate connected nodes |
| 20:22 |
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| 20:22 |
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| 20:22 |
Shara |
disconnected_sides should be a lovely thing, but since anything used there is apparently not rotatable on facedir, instead it kind of fails the moment I want anything other than rotational symmetry |
| 20:24 |
Shara |
So my fancy shelving solution only works if we only ever want non-connecting-to-walls shelves that face one single direction :( |
| 20:26 |
Shara |
If anyone is curious, these are all a single connected node. But done to any other orientation, it will fail: https://user-images.githubusercontent.com/7035183/48305618-fc0c1100-e525-11e8-9681-a1216e4c0a21.png |
| 20:27 |
Shara |
Anyonoe have any suggestions/solutions I can try? (And there are reasons I don't make it a separate node) |
| 20:29 |
tumeninodes |
you have to show the code too otherwise no one knows what they're looking at |
| 20:29 |
Shara |
Sadly I doubt many people have even experimented with disconnected_sides much, but I think that description should be enough if they have, and they can ask if they need the code |
| 20:31 |
Shara |
I am fairly sure it's unsolvable with the way things currently work |
| 20:32 |
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| 20:33 |
Fixer |
rubenwardy: still don't have pic previews in contentdb tab in minetest |
| 20:49 |
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| 20:50 |
Krock |
Shara: the textures & shaders look nice tho. Is it a custom texture pack? |
| 20:51 |
Krock |
I have the cobble texture different in mind. Maybe it changed recently.. |
| 20:52 |
Shara |
Krock: these screenshots are from HW, not MTG, so it's a whole different game |
| 20:53 |
Krock |
HardWare |
| 20:53 |
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| 20:53 |
Shara |
Hidden Worlds |
| 20:53 |
Krock |
HometoWn |
| 20:53 |
Shara |
Hopefully Wondering (if you can give a solution) |
| 20:55 |
Krock |
a solution for what? |
| 20:55 |
Shara |
The shevles are a connected node. The ones with a wooden backing are created using disconnected_sides, where there is no suitable back for them |
| 20:56 |
Shara |
But because connected nodes apparently don't know what paramtype2 = "facedir" means, those ones are locked into one orientation |
| 20:57 |
Shara |
Being able to rotate a connected connected node is silly of course, but when you start using disconnected options, it can be quite needed... |
| 20:57 |
Shara |
Want the code? |
| 20:57 |
Krock |
so disconnected_* and connected_* aren't rotated by param2 |
| 20:58 |
Krock |
or rather, they're not assigned differently depending on the param2 value |
| 20:58 |
Shara |
Seems like. The textures rotate and I see param2 change, but the nodebox stays exactly the same |
| 20:58 |
Krock |
simply not implemented yet, I guess. |
| 20:59 |
Shara |
Worth an issue then? I haven't been sure if there's a reason against it working, other than that it wouldn't have made any sense before the disconnected options existed |
| 21:00 |
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| 21:01 |
Krock |
mapnode.cpp L425 and after would probably have to be adjusted to treat the "neighbors" bits differently depending on params2 |
| 21:01 |
IhrFussel |
I hope no matter how low players set the "repetive rightclick interval" it can never cause more actions per second than server steps...for example if interval is set to 0.05 but server step is 0.15 will it always just cause 1 action per 0.15 seconds? |
| 21:01 |
Krock |
check whether it has been reported already - if not, file a feature request |
| 21:02 |
Krock |
hello to you too, IhrFussel :D |
| 21:02 |
Shara |
Sure Krock, thank you |
| 21:02 |
IhrFussel |
Hello^^ |
| 21:02 |
Krock |
IhrFussel: no. They can place as many nodes they want (I think) |
| 21:03 |
Krock |
it's surely not restricted to the server step because the client can predict the placement and do another one in the same server step |
| 21:03 |
IhrFussel |
Then that setting is completely broken... some servers (CTF for example) can be cheated on with a very low interval |
| 21:04 |
IhrFussel |
Just hold right mouse button and build yourself up 50 blocks in a few seconds |
| 21:04 |
Krock |
is that cheating? |
| 21:04 |
Krock |
there are no node placement restrictions |
| 21:04 |
IhrFussel |
I would say it is at least an unfair advantage over other players |
| 21:05 |
IhrFussel |
I'm not even sure if rubenwardy sees it as fine |
| 21:05 |
IhrFussel |
He also banned someone for changing their FOV on CTF I think |
| 21:06 |
IhrFussel |
Which also gives you an unfair advantage on PvP focused servers..cause you can see more stuff around you |
| 21:06 |
Krock |
also did that for precision shooting, but the server lag and player movement resulted in being a too major negative factor for this |
| 21:07 |
Krock |
there are also ultrawide screens, so that might be justified |
| 21:07 |
IhrFussel |
Gamma is another setting that can be considered cheating on PvP servers...cause if one player can see everything while the others see darkness, it's unfair too |
| 21:08 |
Krock |
everybody can adjust their shaders to see through stuff or brighten it |
| 21:09 |
IhrFussel |
Yes but the question is what is allowed on CTF and what isn't ... it should be clear before you get banned for a BUILTIN setting you changed |
| 21:10 |
Shara |
Fussel, are you criticising CTF for banning someone? |
| 21:10 |
IhrFussel |
We're not talking about modified clients here |
| 21:10 |
Shara |
They were spam crashing the server and filling chat with swearing when I checked there. |
| 21:10 |
IhrFussel |
No? I say make clear which settings are safe to change without breaking ToS or whatever |
| 21:11 |
IhrFussel |
Cause I'm pretty sure that at least some of the so called "pros" adjusted their client settings in a way that makes gameplay easier for them |
| 21:12 |
rubenwardy |
I didn't ban anyone for that reason |
| 21:13 |
IhrFussel |
Are you sure? I only know I saw someone posting a screenshot in the thread showing off their custom FOV in a match and the next post was a "thank you for banning me" ... that's just what I saw |
| 21:14 |
IhrFussel |
I think Enrico was the username |
| 21:16 |
rubenwardy |
Only bans I sent for that user are for spawn killing |
| 21:24 |
IhrFussel |
So players are free to change their client settings the way they want as long as they don't set something the default client doesn't support? |
| 22:25 |
sofar |
how about you make a forum thread about it |
| 22:31 |
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| 22:34 |
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| 22:42 |
Jordach |
>banning over FoV |
| 22:43 |
Jordach |
holy shit that is the biggest piece of retardation i've ever seen in my entire 22 years of existance, barring me |
| 22:43 |
Jordach |
FoV is literally there so you don't get motion sick depending on camera view |
| 22:44 |
Jordach |
next thing you know he'll start banning displays that aren't 16:9 or 4:3 |
| 22:45 |
Jordach |
or even banning for the extremely rare and unusal 31:9 or triple monitor setups |
| 22:46 |
Gael-de-Sailly |
No one has ever been banned on CTF for FOV adjustments or like |
| 22:46 |
Gael-de-Sailly |
it's not cheating, it's just a way to find the setting that fits the best with your material and your vision, depending on your screen |
| 22:47 |
Jordach |
Gael-de-Sailly: i mean, people could even do this and be entirely scott free https://lolcoaster.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/EkOeabP.jpg |
| 22:47 |
Gael-de-Sailly |
IhrFussel: Enrico was banned for other reasons, we did absolutely not care about his FOV tweak |
| 22:48 |
rubenwardy |
also, his longest ban was 2 weeks in June |
| 22:48 |
Gael-de-Sailly |
for spawn-killing iirc |
| 22:49 |
rubenwardy |
yeah |
| 22:49 |
IhrFussel |
Changing the FOV setting DOES give you a wider view and you can see more than a player with the default (70?) |
| 22:50 |
IhrFussel |
If you set it high enough you can probably see what's directly next to you |
| 22:50 |
Jordach |
spawnkilling in my experience is either imbalanced teams or your team is oblivious to even consider dealing with the shithead |
| 22:51 |
rubenwardy |
I would certainly prefer removing the impact of spawnkilling using gameplay mechanics rather than rules |
| 22:51 |
rubenwardy |
I think that abuse should be remove through mechanics, not moderation |
| 22:52 |
rubenwardy |
but this isn't always possible |
| 22:52 |
rubenwardy |
especially as I don't have time for CTF currently |
| 22:54 |
IhrFussel |
Also it's a combination of several client settings that gives you possibly an advantage (gamma, repetive right clicks, fov, (certain shaders?)...maybe more) |
| 22:54 |
Jordach |
my mouse and keyboard can literally be scripted |
| 22:54 |
Jordach |
on their internal processors, and my mouse has a full OLED + ARM core |
| 22:56 |
IhrFussel |
IMO servers should be able to enforce certain client settings that affect gameplay... if someone doesn't want to play on that server they can just choose another that gives them the "freedom" they need |
| 22:57 |
IhrFussel |
It's already bad enough that modified clients can do such things...but providing a builtin settings menu that applies to every server is just terrible... |
| 22:58 |
Gael-de-Sailly |
The advantage is still relatively low compared to what an actual hacked client can provide |
| 22:58 |
Shara |
There's generally perfectly legitimate reasons where someone might need those settings. |
| 22:59 |
Shara |
So denying them just because one player might utilise them to their advantage and another won't is kind of... not so great |
| 22:59 |
Gael-de-Sailly |
yea, as I see it it's more for adapting your settings to your screen, to the way you play, ... |
| 22:59 |
Gael-de-Sailly |
like if your screen is not bright enough, it's normal that you can increase the gamma |
| 23:00 |
* luk3yx |
still likes the idea of forced (sandboxed of course) CSMs. |
| 23:00 |
IhrFussel |
Shara, if the server requires fair PvP (like CTF) then the server settings should be able to overwrite client settings...I personally didn't meet any player yet who *needs* such settings cause of their eyes/ears or whatever |
| 23:00 |
Gael-de-Sailly |
On CTF that happened |
| 23:00 |
Shara |
Fussel, pretty sure you're personal experience of what players do or don't need isn't going to be a deciding factor here |
| 23:00 |
Gael-de-Sailly |
players that weren't able to play at night |
| 23:01 |
Shara |
your* |
| 23:01 |
Shara |
I have needed to adjust gamma settings in some games before. |
| 23:02 |
T4im |
minetest is not a fps for competitive play; and it won't get better by reducing configuration that even actual fps built with competitive play in mind let you configure |
| 23:02 |
IhrFussel |
I'm a server owner of a server with 150,000+ accounts ... I'm argaubly the most active server owner in the entire server list (10+ hrs online DAILY) ... if there is ANY server owner who knows what MT player do or don't do it's probably me cause I dedicate almost all my freetime to my server |
| 23:03 |
Shara |
.... |
| 23:03 |
longerstaff13 |
...bad time to stumble over a branch and fall in? |
| 23:04 |
IhrFussel |
Don't compare me to the majority of other server owners who just check their server once or twice per day maybe and read chat logs... I experience my players LIVE |
| 23:04 |
Shara |
Fussel: Said in a channel of very many long term server owners, some of which have been running many servers for very many years. |
| 23:04 |
* VanessaE |
wanders in, too |
| 23:04 |
* luk3yx |
wonders how to make node timers or minetest.after()s run if the game is paused in singleplayer. |
| 23:04 |
Shara |
luk3yx: surely paused is paused, and should be... well, paused? |
| 23:05 |
luk3yx |
My rickrolling mod has sounds that play while the game is paused. |
| 23:05 |
luk3yx |
But the timers don't stay up-to-date. |
| 23:05 |
Shara |
I wouldn't have expected them to, but never looked into exactly what pausing stops |
| 23:05 |
VanessaE |
sounds like the event that keeps making the sounds play should also be paused. |
| 23:06 |
T4im |
it's perfectly normal that people that go into a "competitive" mode start turning up gamma, and reducing special effects that would distract; expected to the point that xonotic and warsaw even have a rendering mode as a preset for competitive players |
| 23:06 |
VanessaE |
pausing is supposed to stop everything except GPU shaders. |
| 23:06 |
* luk3yx |
should see if they can get the whole song on without breaching copyright |
| 23:06 |
VanessaE |
luk3yx: nope. you can't. |
| 23:06 |
luk3yx |
I have to turn up gamma and reduce particles on my 2005 laptop or it just won't run nicely. |
| 23:06 |
luk3yx |
Aww. |
| 23:06 |
Shara |
And IhrFussel, no, I don't compare you to the majority of server owners, but compared to the group of more serious server owners here, please don't act like you are something exceptional with more insight than anyone else. |
| 23:07 |
IhrFussel |
Shara, I said I'm arguably the most active server owner... of course that also means I have no job and not much else to do BUT it still means I have all day for my server to spend on |
| 23:07 |
longerstaff13 |
how do you pay for your server? |
| 23:07 |
longerstaff13 |
or pay you rbills if you don;t have a job? |
| 23:08 |
T4im |
well; i agree that players would fiddle with settings for advantage; i'm just saying that is normal and ok |
| 23:08 |
Shara |
Fussel, you said a bit more than that. |
| 23:08 |
* luk3yx |
backs out |
| 23:08 |
Shara |
And you also isolate yourself to only your server, so it's also arguable you know very little about players on servers more generally |
| 23:09 |
longerstaff13 |
Shara has a point; I've never seen Ihr on any other server |
| 23:09 |
* luk3yx |
/part |
| 23:09 |
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| 23:09 |
IhrFussel |
I meant it as "I watch my players and talk to them in realtime cause of my huge online time I spend on there" ... so I got a pretty good idea of how most MT players behave |
| 23:09 |
xerox123 |
what is that we're discussing if you don't mine, too much read back and figure out... |
| 23:09 |
xerox123 |
mind* |
| 23:10 |
VanessaE |
apparently IhrFussel is a minetest player psychologist ;)( |
| 23:10 |
VanessaE |
;) |
| 23:10 |
longerstaff13 |
lol |
| 23:10 |
Shara |
I guess we know where to send all our misbehaving players now |
| 23:11 |
IhrFussel |
I suggested to add a way to enforce certain gameplay settings server side because I have yet to meet a player who desperately needed fov, gamme etc to be able to enjoy the game ... and then others told me "what you personally experienced doesn't matter at all" |
| 23:11 |
longerstaff13 |
I can send some from LS-Wonderland ;) |
| 23:11 |
xerox123 |
I changed my FOV to 120, from when I used to play on CTF |
| 23:12 |
xerox123 |
got so used to I can't use anything else |
| 23:12 |
Shara |
IhrFussel: Don't misquote me |
| 23:12 |
Jordach |
>dictating player experience |
| 23:12 |
Jordach |
we've found the steve jobs of MT |
| 23:12 |
T4im |
again, even games build with competitive gameplay in mind that have much more experience in that than minetest, do not take away the option to change things like gamma, rarely fov, or other graphics settings that could be used for an advantage |
| 23:12 |
Gael-de-Sailly |
IhrFussel: I've personally seen several player who "deserately" needed gamma |
| 23:12 |
Shara |
T4im is totally right in this. |
| 23:13 |
Gael-de-Sailly |
*"desperately" |
| 23:13 |
IhrFussel |
If you allow such settings per-player then the gameplay will NEVER be 100% fair and also not 100% skill-based |
| 23:14 |
Shara |
Well no, when you have players using desktop computers and others playing from phones, it won't be |
| 23:14 |
Jordach |
tell that to the Quake 3 and UT98/04 players |
| 23:14 |
Jordach |
they want to tweak every last function |
| 23:14 |
T4im |
IhrFussel: nothings tops a player from turning up gamma on the monitor or via the operating system |
| 23:14 |
T4im |
it will just look worse |
| 23:15 |
IhrFussel |
T4im, you can still see better in the dark with it which is the point (I mean with gamma, increasing screen brightness will probably do nothing) |
| 23:15 |
Shara |
I've played with some of these settings, and though, for example, you can make it easier to see in the dark, it doesn't look great and I was quick to switch back |
| 23:15 |
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| 23:15 |
Shara |
But that was my choice. There's nothing stopping me using the setting if I decide I have a disadvantage by not doing so. |
| 23:17 |
Jordach |
if you tried doing shit like that, i'd immediately start disassembling MT and removing those server sided locks |
| 23:17 |
Jordach |
or just building a full Cheat Engine library trainer |
| 23:18 |
luk3yx |
Oh, it hasn't finished. |
| 23:18 |
luk3yx |
Less settings customisations = Less users = "Told you so"... |
| 23:19 |
Jordach |
why'd you think DOOM and Quake 3's multiplayer hasn't died yet? no single authority telling them how to play their game |
| 23:19 |
Jordach |
micromanaging players = eventual decline and dead server |
| 23:19 |
Jordach |
if i wanted that, i'd play hometown |
| 23:19 |
IhrFussel |
More options is not always better...it can destroy server gameplay but that is less important right? |
| 23:20 |
Shara |
These are really basic options you get in all kinds of games though... |
| 23:20 |
Shara |
There's a whole bunch of things I feel servers should be able to control, but not this |
| 23:20 |
IhrFussel |
paramat said is well recently... "your computer = your decision" only applies in SP and on servers you cannot do whatever you like |
| 23:21 |
luk3yx |
IhrFussel: Settings can be abused, but a lot of players (including me on my low-end devices) need them to play. |
| 23:21 |
T4im |
it's not a "all or nothing" thing, gameplay relevant features can already be deactivated serverside like minimaps; but gameplay irrelevant things like graphics is just too extreme |
| 23:22 |
T4im |
maybe you can find some things that are actually in need to be server side managed, but graphics isn't one of them |
| 23:22 |
IhrFussel |
I would argue that a view range of 50 vs 100 doesn't make a difference as much as fov 70 vs 100 for example |
| 23:22 |
luk3yx |
There's no real way to restrict client-side settings, even if you could run system-level commands a nicely written program could create a convincing honeypot. |
| 23:22 |
Jordach |
i basically leave my servers to one or two rules; don't bollock up the server, and definitely no personal inter-relations |
| 23:23 |
Jordach |
tl;dr you sort your own shit out, not my job to dig you out of that 1x2x1 pit you made yourself |
| 23:23 |
T4im |
you forbid friendship? :o |
| 23:23 |
IhrFussel |
I also didn't say that MY server needs those restrictions ... it's a very small portion of servers... creative servers and standard survival servers probably don't mind it |
| 23:24 |
Jordach |
T4im: i mean the bugger off with the dating RP crap |
| 23:24 |
T4im |
oh |
| 23:24 |
T4im |
right |
| 23:24 |
T4im |
i forgot that's a thing in minetest |
| 23:25 |
Jordach |
i don't mind regular friendships and trading mechanics |
| 23:25 |
Jordach |
those can be as organic as you want |
| 23:25 |
IhrFussel |
"no dating" rules are too vague...some servers even disallow couples playing there because they are dating in RL |
| 23:25 |
VanessaE |
I have that same rule on my servers. no dating, no roleplay. because it irritates people |
| 23:25 |
luk3yx |
"No dating" means "no dating on the server". |
| 23:25 |
Jordach |
1) don't break my server / get it stuck in a reboot loop, 2) RP over discord or roblox |
| 23:25 |
VanessaE |
right. |
| 23:26 |
luk3yx |
I don't think server owners really care what you do outside the server, and if they do, .disconnect. |
| 23:26 |
VanessaE |
if they're dating IRL, it's okay to bring it to the server, just keep it subtle. |
| 23:26 |
IhrFussel |
No dating on the server can include "2 people dating and playing on the server" |
| 23:26 |
luk3yx |
No, that's micromanaging player's real lives. |
| 23:26 |
Shara |
I don't mind a couple playing who tell me they are actually together in their actual lives. But if they started typing inappropriate things on my server, that would be a no. |
| 23:26 |
xerox123 |
^ |
| 23:27 |
xerox123 |
that too ^ |
| 23:27 |
Shara |
Rules on a server are rules on the server. |
| 23:27 |
Jordach |
that's my train of thought |
| 23:27 |
IhrFussel |
I hope in PMs they are free to do whatever |
| 23:27 |
Shara |
It's like if I have a "no swearing" rule, you wouldn't assume I mean you can't play if you swear off the server |
| 23:27 |
IhrFussel |
Cause PMs should not restrict love |
| 23:27 |
Shara |
I don't want it in PMs either. That is still on my server |
| 23:28 |
luk3yx |
You still shouldn't be allowed to harass users in PMs (/me glares at [someone]). |
| 23:28 |
Shara |
There's always potential for some nasty and inappropriate things via PM |
| 23:28 |
VanessaE |
https://pastebin.ubuntu.com/p/FqvZhKNGwp/ |
| 23:28 |
Jordach |
just disable the command server side |
| 23:28 |
VanessaE |
that's my servers' rules. |
| 23:28 |
IhrFussel |
If 2 people AGREE to have a sex chat...you would read the PM history of them and punish them accordingly? |
| 23:28 |
Shara |
Intentionally, no. |
| 23:29 |
Shara |
I don't go through all Pms on the server. |
| 23:29 |
VanessaE |
(there's more shown to players, but it's just info like how to get interact, reboot info, admins, and so on |
| 23:29 |
VanessaE |
) |
| 23:29 |
Jordach |
at this point i'm lassiez faire when it comes to rules, if you have beef with someone, that's your job to resolve it |
| 23:29 |
Jordach |
Kray's server was the best server |
| 23:30 |
Shara |
My concern basically comes down to people pretending to be younger than they are and messing very young players with things they really shouldn't |
| 23:30 |
Shara |
messaging* |
| 23:30 |
Shara |
I'd rather remove the risk of that completely. |
| 23:30 |
Shara |
And an MT server isn't a dating app. |
| 23:31 |
Shara |
It's not the purpose of the server. |
| 23:31 |
IhrFussel |
On my server only the public chat is moderated unless I receive a report about something happening in PM or when I have a suspect (potential pedo, bully etc) |
| 23:32 |
Shara |
Your server Fussel, so up to you what risks you want to take, but personally I don't want them. |
| 23:32 |
IhrFussel |
If something bad happens in PM my players are expected to be able to file a report...if they don't then they probably don't care enough |
| 23:33 |
Jordach |
Rule 29, 30: There are no girls on the internet, and if they claim they are, they're FBI |
| 23:33 |
Shara |
If someone is being abused, they likely won't. |
| 23:33 |
Jordach |
also, pools closed |
| 23:34 |
Jordach |
i think the original 50 rules of the internets was a *great* idea for setting your expectations |
| 23:34 |
Jordach |
i.e, https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/030/662/rules.jpg.jpg |
| 23:35 |
IhrFussel |
I already mentioned it multiple times but German law even likely forbids server admins to read PMs without very good reason... PMs are treated as "electronical letters between 2 persons" ... but that law also only makes me responsible for stuff in PMs when I get to know about it |
| 23:35 |
Jordach |
VanessaE: Rule 9... never question the Banhammer. |
| 23:36 |
VanessaE |
https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2061106 |
| 23:36 |
VanessaE |
that's MY banhammer ;) |
| 23:36 |
Jordach |
VanessaE: pass me one of these would ye |
| 23:37 |
VanessaE |
print your own, you cheapskate ;) |
| 23:37 |
Jordach |
i'd even feed you money |
| 23:37 |
BillyS |
IhrFussel: So did I report the Plebs harassment issue to you well enough to allow you to read PMs? |
| 23:38 |
BillyS |
Also, most server just have a disclaimer that says "Your PMs aren't private. Don't like it, don't play here." |
| 23:38 |
BillyS |
*servers |
| 23:38 |
Jordach |
BillyS: i've gone as far as to symlink /dev/null as debug.txt, so it's *never* logged anywhere on this earth |
| 23:38 |
BillyS |
Huh |
| 23:38 |
BillyS |
I wouldn't do that |
| 23:38 |
rubenwardy |
I don't think PMs are even called PMs anywhere |
| 23:38 |
luk3yx |
PMs - Public Messages. |
| 23:39 |
BillyS |
rubenwardy: Yes, in Discord they are "DM"s now |
| 23:39 |
IhrFussel |
BillyS, it#s not that simple there...because the PMs were not between him and you but between him and someone else... pretty sure I would have to ask the other mentioned person first before I can read THEIR PMs |
| 23:39 |
Jordach |
if it's restart looping - it'll be on the console |
| 23:39 |
BillyS |
"Direct Message" |
| 23:39 |
rubenwardy |
Ah, it does say private message in the help |
| 23:39 |
BillyS |
IhrFussel: Ah, I figured that you could read all PMs from Plebs if you though he was harassing |
| 23:39 |
rubenwardy |
Should be changed to direct really |
| 23:39 |
Shara |
My server isn't a place for personal info. I don't want it and I ask player's not to give it out in game. |
| 23:39 |
Jordach |
^ |
| 23:39 |
BillyS |
^ |
| 23:39 |
Shara |
rubenwardy: yes, agreed |
| 23:40 |
Jordach |
ah, i think i know why i'm getting anxiety pains again |
| 23:40 |
IhrFussel |
DMs on discord as private messages...they just chose to rename them for coolness maybe |
| 23:40 |
IhrFussel |
are* |
| 23:41 |
xerox123 |
Instagram calls them DMs |
| 23:41 |
IhrFussel |
I never heard "Direct Message" referring to personal messages before...maybe I live under a rock but no social network or app I ever used, used that term |
| 23:41 |
xerox123 |
and I don't think they're looking for much of a cool factor |
| 23:41 |
xerox123 |
Twitter too AFAIK |
| 23:43 |
BillyS |
I think it's because they aren't actually private |
| 23:43 |
BillyS |
Seeing that Discord sells user information / messages |
| 23:44 |
IhrFussel |
BillyS, if you know what exactly they talked about in PM then I could look for that specific sentence to just see the relevant info |
| 23:44 |
BillyS |
IhrFussel: I know they called me a childlover in a PM between Plebs and Pirate |
| 23:44 |
BillyS |
That's about all I know |
| 23:45 |
BillyS |
You'd probably have to ask Pirate for more if that isn't enough. |
| 23:48 |
Shara |
BillyS: what's the plan? To ban people who express opinions (however false they may be) in private? |
| 23:50 |
BillyS |
Shara: No, not really. I just don't appreciate Plebs getting little digs in on me all the time, and I want people to realize that he has a reputation of this and that his statments are lies |
| 23:51 |
Jordach |
BillyS: wrong |
| 23:51 |
BillyS |
Jordach: ? |
| 23:51 |
Jordach |
ToS explicitly mentions they refuse to do that |
| 23:51 |
BillyS |
Oh, about Discord? |
| 23:51 |
Jordach |
yes |
| 23:52 |
BillyS |
Hmm ... time to talk to luk3yx about that. :P |
| 23:52 |
BillyS |
He told me they did ... huh. |
| 23:52 |
luk3yx |
BillyS: I didn't. |
| 23:52 |
BillyS |
You didn't? |
| 23:52 |
luk3yx |
I dislike Discord, I said nothing about PM reading. |
| 23:52 |
BillyS |
Now I'm confused |
| 23:52 |
BillyS |
I though that's why you didn't use it |
| 23:52 |
luk3yx |
No, it's proprietary. |
| 23:52 |
luk3yx |
They /could/ PM read and get away with it, no evidence. |
| 23:53 |
luk3yx |
I didn't say they /do/, however. |
| 23:54 |
IhrFussel |
Just like WhatsApp (if anyone here knows what it is...seems to be rather unknown in USA) |
| 23:54 |
luk3yx |
Isn't that a social media thing? |
| 23:55 |
IhrFussel |
It's the most popular messaging app in Europe...by far ... mostly because texting is still not free in many tariffs here |
| 23:56 |
IhrFussel |
They promise to only keep a message as long as it didn't reach the target user and nobody would read it/access it |
| 23:56 |
rubenwardy |
Whatsapp is also end to end encryptes |
| 23:56 |
rubenwardy |
Also, WhatsApp can't read your messages |
| 23:57 |
rubenwardy |
Assuming you trust they don't share the keys to themselves |
| 23:57 |
rubenwardy |
Or have any other back doors |
| 23:57 |
Jordach |
i can't find anything in big D's ToS or Privacy related to DMs |
| 23:58 |
IhrFussel |
rubenwardy, but I wonder how they are allowed to delete all messages when they reach their targets...like what if FBI (or other governmental properties) ask for certain contents between people? |
| 23:59 |
IhrFussel |
To solve a crime for example |
