| Time |
Nick |
Message |
| 00:03 |
Fixer |
gn |
| 00:04 |
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| 00:08 |
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| 00:18 |
paramat |
#7365 is fairly trivial so will merge later if no objection |
| 00:18 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/7365 -- Schematic decorations: Fix placement bug when centred and rotated by paramat |
| 00:45 |
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| 00:48 |
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| 01:23 |
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| 01:29 |
paramat |
oops wrong channel |
| 01:29 |
tumeninodes |
lol, good thing it's not top secret |
| 02:39 |
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| 02:55 |
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| 05:13 |
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| 06:22 |
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| 09:54 |
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Fixer joined #minetest-hub |
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| 10:59 |
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| 11:59 |
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tenplus1 joined #minetest-hub |
| 11:59 |
tenplus1 |
hi folks |
| 12:01 |
ANAND |
Hey tenplus1! :) |
| 12:01 |
tenplus1 |
hi ANAND |
| 12:04 |
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IhrFussel joined #minetest-hub |
| 12:04 |
tenplus1 |
hi fussel |
| 12:04 |
IhrFussel |
Can I change the collision box of an entity dynamically like the visual size? |
| 12:05 |
tenplus1 |
I would hope so... |
| 12:05 |
IhrFussel |
Hi tenplus1 |
| 12:05 |
IhrFussel |
Cause I want to spawn random "giant" types of monsters |
| 12:06 |
tenplus1 |
use the on_spawn() function to randomly select size etc. |
| 12:12 |
|
longerstaff13 joined #minetest-hub |
| 12:12 |
tenplus1 |
hi longer |
| 12:13 |
longerstaff13 |
Ello eleven :P |
| 12:13 |
tenplus1 |
o/ |
| 12:19 |
IhrFussel |
tenplus1, api.lua already adjusts the collision box so I could've answered this myself |
| 12:19 |
tenplus1 |
ehehe |
| 12:26 |
IhrFussel |
tenplus1, if I increase the visual size I also need to increase reach correct? |
| 12:27 |
IhrFussel |
Looks like bigger mobs cannot damage players otherwise |
| 12:27 |
tenplus1 |
yep |
| 12:28 |
IhrFussel |
So is self.reach calculated from the center of the entity size? |
| 12:28 |
tenplus1 |
calculated from self.object:get_pos() which is generally bottom node of player |
| 12:28 |
tenplus1 |
er... mob even |
| 12:29 |
IhrFussel |
If I make mobs twice as wide should I make reach *2 too? |
| 12:30 |
tenplus1 |
yeah |
| 12:30 |
IhrFussel |
I want to make sure that all giant types can still damage players |
| 12:40 |
|
twoelk joined #minetest-hub |
| 12:40 |
tenplus1 |
hi twoelk |
| 12:40 |
twoelk |
o/ |
| 12:42 |
twoelk |
I added a new table to the wiki page about farming redo - not sure how to proceed though :-D |
| 12:44 |
twoelk |
haven't got a clue how such a table would work when viewed on a mobile device |
| 12:44 |
tenplus1 |
good point, tiny screen... well, maybe depending on model |
| 12:46 |
twoelk |
yeah I was sort of getting excitted about adding lots of columns with sortable info but that would probably only be useable on a pc screen with mouse |
| 12:46 |
tenplus1 |
must be another way to handle info |
| 12:47 |
twoelk |
well the old way is for each plant a chapter of its own on a long scrollable list |
| 12:49 |
tenplus1 |
how abut a basic list and you can click an item for more details, like mc wiki |
| 12:49 |
twoelk |
the only interesting thing you could sort by at this moment would be number of growth stages |
| 12:50 |
twoelk |
I was planning to add the biomes the wild forms could be found at, what they look like and such |
| 12:50 |
twoelk |
so that you could see at a glance what to look for in jungle for example |
| 13:01 |
|
Mr_Pardison joined #minetest-hub |
| 13:04 |
tenplus1 |
hi mister |
| 13:04 |
Mr_Pardison |
ahoy |
| 13:04 |
tenplus1 |
o/ |
| 13:04 |
Mr_Pardison |
online but only for about 20 more minutes. |
| 13:05 |
tenplus1 |
that's ok... rl beckons :P |
| 13:22 |
twoelk |
hmm, aren't onion, cucumber or tomato used for anything in farming redo? |
| 13:23 |
tenplus1 |
bbq mod uses onion and tomato, cucumber has a salad in xanadu which I could add maybe |
| 13:24 |
tenplus1 |
yep, potato salad uses cucumber & baked potato, will add that :D |
| 13:26 |
twoelk |
cool :) hm although maybe splitting farming and cooking someday might be usefull |
| 13:26 |
tenplus1 |
indeed, farming provides the base ingredients, as does mobs redo |
| 13:26 |
twoelk |
argh now I'm hungry for a potato salad |
| 13:27 |
tenplus1 |
lol |
| 13:28 |
twoelk |
pepper is a little irritating in the mod - I remember pepper plantations looking similar to vine yards |
| 13:31 |
Mr_Pardison |
have to hop now, cya l8r I hope. |
| 13:32 |
twoelk |
the mod seems to be mixing black pepper and capsicum |
| 13:42 |
tenplus1 |
k, added Potato Salad and Blueberry Pie to farming redo :) am gonna shrink salt and pepper shakers |
| 13:43 |
|
Jordach joined #minetest-hub |
| 13:43 |
|
sniper338 joined #minetest-hub |
| 13:44 |
* twoelk |
just decided to leave the wiki be and instead visit xanadu |
| 13:44 |
tenplus1 |
ehehe |
| 13:44 |
|
Mr_Pardison joined #minetest-hub |
| 13:47 |
twoelk |
https://wiki.minetest.net/Mods/Farming_Redo there added to the WIP page |
| 13:48 |
tenplus1 |
thx twoelk :) |
| 13:49 |
twoelk |
wierd, I thought I left at the other house yesterday |
| 13:50 |
twoelk |
hm, my inventory got wiped? |
| 13:51 |
tenplus1 |
joining |
| 13:51 |
tenplus1 |
when was the last time you were on server ? |
| 13:51 |
|
Gael-de-Sailly joined #minetest-hub |
| 13:51 |
tenplus1 |
hi Gael-de-Sailly |
| 13:52 |
Gael-de-Sailly |
hi |
| 13:52 |
tenplus1 |
Farming Redo updated on github with 2x new recipes and salt/pepper shakers resized |
| 14:08 |
Mr_Pardison |
how do I re-enable my public server list? |
| 14:08 |
tenplus1 |
should be a tick box below Host Server called Announce Server |
| 14:11 |
Mr_Pardison |
under the play online tab. |
| 14:11 |
Mr_Pardison |
I can't get it to display other servers other than what I type in and have saved as the favorites. |
| 14:11 |
tenplus1 |
ohhh, thought you wanted to announce your server... oops |
| 14:12 |
Mr_Pardison |
don't have the resources to run a server. |
| 14:13 |
ANAND |
Mr_Pardison, if ur on 0.5.0-dev, there's a refresh button |
| 14:13 |
Mr_Pardison |
on 0.4.16 |
| 14:13 |
ANAND |
ah |
| 14:13 |
tenplus1 |
I usually switch tabs to refresh |
| 14:14 |
Mr_Pardison |
still doesn't show. |
| 14:19 |
Mr_Pardison |
leaving cya |
| 14:25 |
tenplus1 |
Shara: latest creative changes added to git |
| 14:45 |
|
Jordach joined #minetest-hub |
| 14:45 |
tenplus1 |
hi Jordach |
| 14:57 |
twoelk |
ah, just noticed you asked, I was on Xanadu yesterday night, expanding the caverns under my hut near spawn. (white area I think) |
| 15:00 |
|
Krock joined #minetest-hub |
| 15:01 |
Krock |
hio tenplus1 |
| 15:01 |
tenplus1 |
ohio :P |
| 15:06 |
tenplus1 |
it's kewl that players are finding some really amazing caverealms caverns :P the larger one's look great now the lignting is sorted |
| 15:16 |
Krock |
oh, by the way. I found out the reason for the slow falling on top of a node when jumping |
| 15:16 |
tenplus1 |
do tell ? |
| 15:16 |
Krock |
like jumping on the node (1m) |
| 15:17 |
Krock |
well, the collision detection has a certain tolerance to make it easier to get on a surface - but that applies regardless on the speed |
| 15:17 |
Krock |
so this effect also occurs when falling down |
| 15:17 |
tenplus1 |
is it easily fixed ? |
| 15:17 |
Krock |
a trivial four-line change |
| 15:18 |
tenplus1 |
sweet :) you gonna backport it as well ? |
| 15:18 |
Krock |
but I still struggle finding the issue for the weird jumping - the side-movements |
| 15:18 |
tenplus1 |
side movements ? |
| 15:18 |
tenplus1 |
havent noticed that one |
| 15:18 |
Krock |
then try to move in a straight line (45° angle) while permanently jumping |
| 15:19 |
tenplus1 |
checking |
| 15:19 |
Krock |
it will move you up to an entire node (I think) to the side sometimes |
| 15:19 |
Krock |
backporting? surely not for 0.4.17. if there is a release afterwards, then most likely - otherwise you'll have to wait for 0.5.0 |
| 15:20 |
tenplus1 |
nope, working a-ok here |
| 15:20 |
Krock |
moment.. trying to record a video |
| 15:24 |
IhrFussel |
tenplus1, is there a reason that you don't use vector.distance() in get_distance() ? |
| 15:24 |
tenplus1 |
cause that function works faster :) |
| 15:32 |
tenplus1 |
I have a 'test' mod so I can run 1000's of iterations on a function to see which is better :P |
| 15:33 |
IhrFussel |
tenplus1, but yours should still work diagonally right? |
| 15:34 |
tenplus1 |
yeah |
| 15:34 |
tenplus1 |
it just works a different way from vector.distance() |
| 15:34 |
xerox123 |
hello |
| 15:35 |
tenplus1 |
hi xerox |
| 15:36 |
tenplus1 |
mind you, if a better way to do something appears then I'll try it out and switch to improve :PP |
| 15:44 |
Krock |
tenplus1, http://krock-works.16mb.com/u/minetest_jumping_issues.mp4 |
| 15:44 |
Krock |
took a moment to learn how to use OpenShot lol |
| 15:45 |
tenplus1 |
I see what you mean... but, it doesnt seem to happen here... lemmie double check |
| 15:46 |
tenplus1 |
which build is that ? |
| 15:47 |
Krock |
that? about a six days old 0.5.0-dev version |
| 15:47 |
tenplus1 |
ahh, so it's a new issue... gotcha... 0.4.16-3 here |
| 15:47 |
Krock |
it's not a new issue |
| 15:47 |
nerzhul |
Hello Krock |
| 15:47 |
Krock |
hi nerzhul |
| 15:47 |
tenplus1 |
hi nerzhul |
| 15:47 |
nerzhul |
echo echo |
| 15:47 |
nerzhul |
:D |
| 15:48 |
Krock |
cho cho |
| 15:48 |
tenplus1 |
lol |
| 15:48 |
Krock |
tenplus1, #6886 |
| 15:48 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/6886 -- Unexpected collision when beginning a jump that pushes the player sideways or backwards |
| 15:53 |
tenplus1 |
I did like the coloured beds idea in mt-game but only for base 8 colours and if beds are a single nodebox |
| 15:54 |
nerzhul |
Krock, can you reminind me what are the remaining showstoppers for releasing 0.4.17 ? |
| 15:54 |
nerzhul |
currently only gitlab failed |
| 15:55 |
nerzhul |
but travis is happy :p |
| 15:55 |
nerzhul |
and gitlab CI failed on ubuntu 16.10 & 17.04 due to apt mirroring problems... |
| 15:58 |
tenplus1 |
we got an 18.04 release ? |
| 16:00 |
Krock |
tenplus1, GitLab does not produce 18.04 binaries yet |
| 16:00 |
tenplus1 |
ahh, soon... soon :P |
| 16:04 |
nerzhul |
it can be done if needed but currently apt-get update failed lol |
| 16:06 |
tenplus1 |
finally managed to build 0.4.17 on my ubu 18.04 desky, took forever |
| 16:08 |
Raven262 |
Is the blocky lighting meant to look like this or is there something wrong? https://i.imgur.com/JuWw9TZ.png |
| 16:08 |
Raven262 |
And the smooth lighting at the same place: https://i.imgur.com/9i2KOWF.png |
| 16:08 |
tenplus1 |
hi raven |
| 16:08 |
Raven262 |
Hi ten |
| 16:09 |
tenplus1 |
wow, smooth lighting really addas a lot to the game |
| 16:10 |
Raven262 |
I don't remember the last time i used the ordinary lighting, just tried it now to see if it makes the game darker. (boxes in the insidethebox mostly) |
| 16:11 |
Raven262 |
That shadow patch on the floor looks bit extreme though. |
| 16:13 |
tenplus1 |
wasnt the lighting changed in 0.5x |
| 16:14 |
tenplus1 |
is calculating and displaying smooth lighting intensive ? |
| 16:15 |
Raven262 |
This is 4.17 |
| 16:15 |
Raven262 |
But I can try it in 0.5 too |
| 16:15 |
tenplus1 |
testing 0.4.17 now |
| 16:16 |
Raven262 |
Wait I can't, insidethebox doesn't allow 0.5 clients :P |
| 16:18 |
Krock |
Raven262, *this is 0.4.17 |
| 16:18 |
Raven262 |
Oh yeah, just wanted to shorten it :P |
| 16:18 |
Krock |
also, it's the client that disconnects (AFAIK), not the server |
| 16:19 |
Krock |
depending on which side gets the opportunity first to detect the remote proto version |
| 16:20 |
Raven262 |
Still, I can't connect to this server with a 0.5 client. |
| 16:20 |
Raven262 |
And I can't save the map locally in order to check it offline :P |
| 16:21 |
tenplus1 |
would be nice of 0.5 had a compatibility mode for older servers |
| 16:21 |
* Krock |
headdesks |
| 16:21 |
tenplus1 |
lolol, jk |
| 16:23 |
Krock |
well, one could try to use the map saving as a real-time pipe to explore a map of an incompatible server - but the irony is that you'd need a compatible client to connect to it for the local map save |
| 16:23 |
Krock |
twoelk, lol. indeed we need more doors mods |
| 16:24 |
sofar |
Totally |
| 16:24 |
tenplus1 |
o/ sofar |
| 16:24 |
sofar |
Don't hit me! |
| 16:25 |
tenplus1 |
vanessa could convert her homedecor doors to standard doors |
| 16:25 |
Krock |
hi sofar |
| 16:25 |
sofar |
Lol |
| 16:25 |
tenplus1 |
they do look really nice, but homedecor only |
| 16:25 |
Krock |
it takes a while for mods to adapt APIs |
| 16:25 |
* twoelk |
wonders wether sorcerykid might publish her doors mod |
| 16:26 |
sofar |
Probably not |
| 16:26 |
tenplus1 |
from what I gather sorcerykid doesnt like git |
| 16:31 |
* sofar |
listens to vp chat |
| 16:31 |
tenplus1 |
vp? |
| 16:31 |
sofar |
Corporate |
| 16:38 |
sofar |
Fun chat about how my project will be more and more important in the future |
| 16:38 |
* sofar |
& job security |
| 16:38 |
* tenplus1 |
replaces staff with robots |
| 16:40 |
sofar |
As long as they are running Linux ;) |
| 16:40 |
tenplus1 |
systemd |
| 16:40 |
sofar |
Yay |
| 16:41 |
sofar |
238? |
| 16:41 |
sofar |
Ubuntu used to Snoop search input from their desktop env |
| 16:41 |
tenplus1 |
237-3 |
| 16:41 |
tenplus1 |
might be in proposed repo |
| 16:44 |
tenplus1 |
anything major 238 fixes? |
| 16:44 |
sofar |
Just small things, as usual |
| 16:46 |
|
Jordach joined #minetest-hub |
| 16:47 |
tenplus1 |
hi Jordach |
| 16:47 |
Jordach |
b e e p |
| 16:48 |
tenplus1 |
omg, the've already replaced jordach with a robot |
| 16:52 |
tenplus1 |
lol, love it when players want an invisible sword :P |
| 16:53 |
sofar |
Just show then yours |
| 16:53 |
sofar |
Them* |
| 16:53 |
tenplus1 |
I did, and mines even has sound effects :) cnofuses them |
| 16:55 |
tenplus1 |
pop onto xanadu if u wanna see/hear |
| 16:56 |
sofar |
Tough choice, listen to a Veep about how my job is going to be important, or hear an invisible sword whoosh on Xanadu... |
| 16:56 |
tenplus1 |
no contest :D |
| 16:56 |
* sofar |
conflicted |
| 16:58 |
sofar |
Ook now she's talking about drinking beer |
| 16:58 |
IhrFussel |
tenplus1, you have to define the visual_size and collision box EACH time the mob gets reactivated? |
| 16:59 |
sofar |
I think she's beaten tenplus1 there |
| 17:00 |
tenplus1 |
fussel, if you set self.base_size and self.base_colbox / selbox it'll save the size |
| 17:01 |
tenplus1 |
it uses those as a backup of original size for re-activation and for child mobs growing |
| 17:06 |
|
Mr_Pardison joined #minetest-hub |
| 17:09 |
tenplus1 |
wb mister |
| 17:09 |
Mr_Pardison |
gracias 10+1 |
| 17:30 |
Krock |
hi Mr_Pardison |
| 17:49 |
Mr_Pardison |
'ello Krock |
| 17:50 |
|
entuland joined #minetest-hub |
| 17:50 |
tenplus1 |
hi entuland |
| 17:51 |
Jordach |
sofar: inb4 you end up as a VP yourself |
| 17:51 |
entuland |
hey there |
| 18:04 |
|
Mr_Pardison joined #minetest-hub |
| 18:04 |
Mr_Pardison |
computer restarted on me for some reason. |
| 18:09 |
entuland |
may be a security feature of the MoBo for overheating of the CPU |
| 18:10 |
Mr_Pardison |
no... everything feels cool to the touch. |
| 18:10 |
entuland |
laptop? |
| 18:10 |
Mr_Pardison |
yup. |
| 18:10 |
entuland |
were you using it while it happened? |
| 18:11 |
Mr_Pardison |
well, kinda. |
| 18:11 |
entuland |
running wincrap or something else? |
| 18:11 |
Mr_Pardison |
I had just gotten back from lunch (was afk) and had typed a few things on other channels when it just restarted on me for some reason. |
| 18:12 |
Mr_Pardison |
CPU, mem and swap looked fine. |
| 18:12 |
entuland |
wincrap 10 does that, but it's a regular shutdown... was it all of a sudden as if it had the power cut? |
| 18:13 |
entuland |
the fact that you mention the swap indicates nix of some sort :P |
| 18:13 |
|
xerox123 joined #minetest-hub |
| 18:13 |
tenplus1 |
wb xerox |
| 18:13 |
|
xerox123_ joined #minetest-hub |
| 18:13 |
entuland |
I would keep an eye on the temps in any case |
| 18:14 |
entuland |
I had to dismantle my laptop, clean it from the dust, detach the heatsink from the cpu and replace the paste cause it was all dried out |
| 18:14 |
entuland |
it didn't felt too hot still the CPU was freaking out |
| 18:15 |
entuland |
pretty old laptop |
| 18:15 |
|
Jordach joined #minetest-hub |
| 18:15 |
xerox123 |
my ZNC took 14 seconds to shutdown... |
| 18:15 |
xerox123 |
[24-May 19:10:49] -Notice- {from *status} *** ZNC is being shut down NOW! |
| 18:15 |
xerox123 |
[24-May 19:11:03] [MODE] xerox123 sets mode -I xerox123 |
| 18:15 |
xerox123 |
usually it's instant, if not a second |
| 18:16 |
xerox123 |
probably explains all the latency I was getting |
| 18:18 |
IhrFussel |
Regarding 0.4.17: EVERY code change that gives server owners more control over client-side stuff minus brand new features (such as flavors) should be backported ... don't force server owners to upgrade their version and risk losing MOST of their playerbase *just* to have a healthy environment that prevents all the cheats |
| 18:20 |
IhrFussel |
That's a pretty shady move to basically tell server owners "upgrade now or let your servers get destroyed" |
| 18:23 |
Shara |
Fussel, if something is being missed that is a fix of some kind, just point it out. No need to accuse peopel of anything shady. |
| 18:23 |
IhrFussel |
Every server owner with a somewhat established userbase would agree here... it's not easy to get good active players onto your server |
| 18:23 |
sfan5 |
IhrFussel: that makes no sense |
| 18:23 |
sfan5 |
"giving more control to server owners" requires client coorperation |
| 18:23 |
sfan5 |
but 0.4.17 is compatible to 0.4.16 |
| 18:23 |
tenplus1 |
o/ sfan |
| 18:23 |
sfan5 |
so if you add those features, people can just use older clients to bypass that |
| 18:24 |
sfan5 |
hi ten |
| 18:24 |
IhrFussel |
sfan5, that's not what I meant... the server side should do its very best (as long as it's possible with current code without breaking changes) to fix secrity issues |
| 18:24 |
sfan5 |
security fixes were of course backported |
| 18:24 |
IhrFussel |
Security also includes cheating in my eyes |
| 18:24 |
Shara |
Fussel, point out what is being missed |
| 18:25 |
|
Mr_Pardison joined #minetest-hub |
| 18:25 |
Mr_Pardison |
keyboard quit responding. |
| 18:25 |
IhrFussel |
I didn't check the whole list of missing commits from backport, I just wanted to point out that if he release 0.4.17 next week or in 2 weeks as final version then all those commits should be included by then |
| 18:26 |
IhrFussel |
if they* |
| 18:26 |
IhrFussel |
There is also the problem of devs not caring enough to write fixes for 0.4.17 which are obsolete in 0.5.0 ...that's another problem |
| 18:27 |
Shara |
"all those commits"...? if there is something you feel needs to be there, you have to say which are missing |
| 18:28 |
IhrFussel |
Shara, I am no c++ dev so I cannot possibly know which commits would even be possible to simply be backported (c++ 11 changes, breakages) |
| 18:29 |
Shara |
Yet instead of being polite and asking if maybe there are more to add, you just accuse of devs of not caring? |
| 18:30 |
Mr_Pardison |
g2g now cya |
| 18:30 |
Mr_Pardison |
byeeee |
| 18:30 |
Shara |
See you :) |
| 18:30 |
IhrFussel |
Some commits also are related to yet other commits which could make the picked commit incompatible with 0.4.17 code |
| 18:30 |
* Mr_Pardison |
hugs Shara and promises to finish the mod |
| 18:30 |
* rdococ |
hugs |
| 18:31 |
Shara |
Fussel - for the last time - then point out the actual problems you see instead of hurling insults. |
| 18:31 |
tenplus1 |
hi rdococ |
| 18:31 |
IhrFussel |
I didn't say that devs are doing shady stuff...I said *if* they do it the way I explained (forcing server owners to upgrade for security) then they it's shady business |
| 18:32 |
rdococ |
who mentioned shady stuff? |
| 18:32 |
Shara |
"There is also the problem of devs not caring enough" |
| 18:33 |
Shara |
"That's a pretty shady move" |
| 18:33 |
Shara |
Read what you write Fussel. |
| 18:33 |
IhrFussel |
But what I really meant was that core devs don't seem to care about 0.4.X much anymore and basically abandon us |
| 18:34 |
rdococ |
abandon us... what... |
| 18:34 |
Krock |
first: yes, latter: no. |
| 18:34 |
Shara |
There you go. Devs are shady, don't care and abandon people. |
| 18:34 |
IhrFussel |
I'm not upgrading for a looooong time...not even all my mods will be compatible with 0.5.0 ... they say *most* mods should still work...but out of 180 on a server I bet that there are quite a few that break |
| 18:34 |
Krock |
tbh the crashes in 0.5.0 and the missing network improvements there increase the will to take care of 0.4.x |
| 18:35 |
Krock |
there's a reason for "most". because 180/180 working would be "all" |
| 18:35 |
Shara |
I have someone in a PM right now (not in this channel) telling me he's just switched back to stable because dev version crashes endlessly |
| 18:35 |
Krock |
whereas 176/180 is "almost all" or "most" |
| 18:35 |
Krock |
only 0.5.x suffers from crashes #7272 |
| 18:35 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/7272 -- Occasional crash on shutdown / other reported crashes |
| 18:36 |
Shara |
Yup. I've had issues with it too. |
| 18:37 |
Shara |
And I'm in no hurry to jump my servers to 0.5, but we don't know when 0.5 will be released. A lot might change by then. |
| 18:37 |
Krock |
however, the backtrace is there but it seems like further research is needed to find the real cause of this issue |
| 18:37 |
Shara |
Personally I think rushing to update a server for a compat breaking release is risky, but you'll also loose people if you delay too long |
| 18:37 |
IhrFussel |
0.5.0 will likely not crash a lot anymore when it releases, but that also idn't my point... I mean most server owners with an already established userbase will likely stay on 0.4.X for a while simply because 70-80% of MT users are on mobile devices and ~ 90% of those users don't use the official MT client and must rely on a 3rd-party-app which might not upgrade to 0.5.0 ever |
| 18:37 |
Krock |
s/idn/isn/ |
| 18:39 |
Krock |
it's only our issue when our app is outdated |
| 18:40 |
Krock |
just to have it mentioned: there were quite a few improvements regarding the android app, so 0.5.0 won't be an issue because they can still use their 3rd party app and the official in parallel |
| 18:40 |
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| 18:40 |
Krock |
hello paramat |
| 18:40 |
tenplus1 |
o/ paramat |
| 18:42 |
IhrFussel |
The fact that there is no official iOS app will haunt us forever |
| 18:43 |
IhrFussel |
Sadly many people only buy iDevices |
| 18:43 |
rdococ |
why would it? |
| 18:43 |
Krock |
the fact that iOS' store guidelines are like that will hurt them forever |
| 18:45 |
IhrFussel |
What should server owners tell their userbase though? "Buy Android" isn't gonna help |
| 18:48 |
Krock |
they can instead request official apps which must then be installed manually |
| 18:48 |
Krock |
or rather unusual: root their phone and use the good hardware for another OS |
| 18:48 |
IhrFussel |
Always the same "how do I fly?" "press the airplane button on your screen" "it says i need to be v.i.p." "what app are you using" "[random app name]" |
| 18:49 |
* tenplus1 |
doesn't like the iOS device mentality |
| 18:49 |
rdococ |
does the iOS app store have any minetest client, official or not? |
| 18:50 |
sfan5 |
official, no; unofficial ones yes but none are called "Minetest" |
| 18:50 |
IhrFussel |
If the stupid iOS app devs wouldn't modify the client so much and put fly and other stuff behind a paywall then it wouldn't be *that* much of a problem to manage players with other apps |
| 18:51 |
sfan5 |
that not stupid |
| 18:51 |
sfan5 |
it's clever, it makes money |
| 18:51 |
IhrFussel |
MT is not meant to make you money |
| 18:51 |
Krock |
and none seems to control these apps so their calculations work |
| 18:51 |
IhrFussel |
So they are stupid in my eyes |
| 18:51 |
rdococ |
sfan5 is correct, it's malicious but not stupid |
| 18:51 |
Krock |
LGPL allows selling |
| 18:52 |
IhrFussel |
I know that it's allowed, still not what the MT community expects |
| 18:52 |
Krock |
but the apps are doing it in almost all cases in the license-violating way by not sharing the code |
| 18:53 |
IhrFussel |
Try to set up a server where you pay afee every month... no one will play there for sure |
| 18:54 |
IhrFussel |
The app devs exploit the "helpless" state of the people |
| 18:54 |
Krock |
I can't imagine paying McAfee |
| 18:55 |
IhrFussel |
People who just want to play on MT servers with iOS get an inferior experience |
| 18:55 |
rdococ |
iOS is all about inferior experiences |
| 18:56 |
Shara |
I've been offered money toward server costs each month by players before. (I've refused it though.) Some people are okay with paying... (but yes, I doubt it would be enough people for a busy server, or even that they'd have been willing to offer money if they had not experienced the server qand got to know the people involved first) |
| 18:56 |
IhrFussel |
I dislike iOS myself and would never buy an Apple product cause each one of them is pretty much overpriced...but it's sad that I cannot offer every player the same gameplay |
| 18:56 |
Shara |
and* |
| 18:57 |
nerzhul |
hey, is there any moderator ? spam there: https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?f=18&p=319464#p319464 |
| 18:57 |
nerzhul |
and we need a stick here https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?f=18&t=20170 |
| 18:57 |
IhrFussel |
That is why I implemented a "server side fly" mode... cause I don't give up on the iOS users |
| 18:57 |
Shara |
I can kill spam :) |
| 18:58 |
IhrFussel |
The app devs have no control over the server code and server owners can use that to their advantage |
| 18:58 |
Shara |
Or I guess someone beat me to it |
| 18:58 |
sfan5 |
:) |
| 18:58 |
Shara |
Hehe :) |
| 18:59 |
IhrFussel |
Of course the server side fly is not nearly as good as the real thing, but "better than nothing" |
| 19:01 |
rdococ |
I see no point in trying to cater to iOS users |
| 19:02 |
Shara |
well, there is a point, but it's basically impossible |
| 19:04 |
IhrFussel |
I won't give up on the many iOS users...it feels like every 3rd mobile user uses an iPhone or iPad |
| 19:05 |
IhrFussel |
I cannot stop supporting 1/3 of my playerbase |
| 19:05 |
BillyS |
I must be one of the thirds, then/ |
| 19:05 |
BillyS |
Personally, I didn't know that minetest on iOs was a thing |
| 19:06 |
IhrFussel |
BillyS, cause the app names are different and don't even indicate that the app could be about MT in the first place "Exploration" |
| 19:07 |
IhrFussel |
Some don't even believe that the original game is Minetest and not their shitty 3rd-party-app's name |
| 19:08 |
BillyS |
Ah |
| 19:08 |
IhrFussel |
Even "Multicraft" doesn't sound like MT in the slightest |
| 19:08 |
IhrFussel |
That can confuse people easily |
| 19:09 |
BillyS |
*sigh* |
| 19:09 |
BillyS |
Stupid apple developers |
| 19:10 |
IhrFussel |
Multicraft is by the way the most used app on both Android and iOS |
| 19:10 |
BillyS |
I at least prefer to try and stay original |
| 19:10 |
BillyS |
Really? |
| 19:10 |
BillyS |
More so then YKW? |
| 19:10 |
IhrFussel |
No not that...the most used MT app |
| 19:10 |
BillyS |
Oh. |
| 19:11 |
IhrFussel |
The real Minetest only got a fraction of its downloads/ratings |
| 19:11 |
Jordach |
IhrFussel: i'd rather deal with apple |
| 19:11 |
BillyS |
Yeah, welcome to the world of open-source, I suppose |
| 19:11 |
Jordach |
that privacy policy is top notch |
| 19:12 |
Jordach |
you're paying more for that fact that they aren't datamining yo |
| 19:12 |
paramat |
multicraft is sloppy coding too, a messy bunch of mods |
| 19:12 |
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| 19:13 |
BillyS |
My coding is sparsely commented, but I try to keep it organized |
| 19:13 |
IhrFussel |
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=mobi.MultiCraft << look at the download number |
| 19:14 |
IhrFussel |
It's more popular than the real thing even though it contains ADS and INAPPS |
| 19:14 |
IhrFussel |
Unbelievable |
| 19:15 |
BillyS |
Kids are usually glued to phones or xboxes, not computers I suppose |
| 19:15 |
tenplus1 |
mobile is a big thing |
| 19:17 |
IhrFussel |
BillyS, the real thing is available for Android, but people still download the ads client https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=net.minetest.minetest |
| 19:18 |
xerox123 |
ads! |
| 19:19 |
IhrFussel |
The average joe likely just enters "minecraft" in google play and the first free app that matches is probably multicraft |
| 19:19 |
BillyS |
yep |
| 19:20 |
IhrFussel |
And then they even think that it's Minecraft (I see users trying to send /gamemode 0 all the time in my chat log) |
| 19:21 |
* BillyS |
facepalms |
| 19:21 |
BillyS |
This explains the n00b infestations on certain servers |
| 19:22 |
paramat |
it's essentially a game that is MTG plus a mess of mods to make it 'look' slightly like MC (has mobs), that makes it popular |
| 19:23 |
* BillyS |
hopes MC will sue the devs |
| 19:23 |
IhrFussel |
Many different MT apps have different controls...in some apps players can only eat for example when pointing at a node and not air, other apps removed the DROP button so players have to use chests or the trash can in their inventory |
| 19:23 |
paramat |
the engine is not changed much, the owner has no c++ ability |
| 19:23 |
BillyS |
Hm |
| 19:24 |
BillyS |
Well, it was smart of them. Despicible, but smart. |
| 19:24 |
IhrFussel |
Some apps don't let players eat at all and all they do is punch with foos in their hands |
| 19:24 |
paramat |
the mods used are mostly other people's mods too |
| 19:24 |
IhrFussel |
food* |
| 19:25 |
IhrFussel |
Imagine "Wanna eat food on the server? Become V.I.P." haha |
| 19:25 |
BillyS |
LOL |
| 19:25 |
tenplus1 |
gawd |
| 19:25 |
BillyS |
I really hate the hacked versions that allow people to pay for things like fly and noclip |
| 19:26 |
IhrFussel |
You know maybe the drop button also appears when paying for V.I.P hmm |
| 19:28 |
IhrFussel |
The app devs have so much control over their users...they could just decide to block them out of certain features or "feature" certain servers who paid them |
| 19:29 |
IhrFussel |
And of course...the 30 secs VIDEO ads... you try to explain something to a new player *30 secs later* "oh sorry i had an ad can you tell me again?" |
| 19:33 |
tenplus1 |
nite folks |
| 19:33 |
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| 19:35 |
xerox123 |
... |
| 19:35 |
Krock |
The Great Rename Flood |
| 19:35 |
Shara |
Seems nickserv has gone insane |
| 19:36 |
Krock |
They announced a service downtime of ~30 mins |
| 19:36 |
Shara |
It started spamming me with nonsense :) |
| 19:39 |
IcyDiamond |
Haha |
| 19:39 |
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| 19:40 |
entuland |
seems like we're immune from the renaming disease |
| 19:55 |
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| 19:59 |
paramat |
seems we are in 0.4.17 freeze now, please test backports branches |
| 20:06 |
Shara |
:) |
| 20:06 |
Shara |
FInally! |
| 20:08 |
VanessaE |
yay? |
| 20:09 |
xerox123 |
:O so 0.4.17 will be stable? |
| 20:09 |
rdococ |
Yay! |
| 20:09 |
BillyS |
I thought the 0.4.* branch WAS stable? |
| 20:12 |
Krock |
yes, pretty much stable. it's now just the addition of the "Stable" label (formal stuff) |
| 20:13 |
BillyS |
ah |
| 20:16 |
paramat |
it means we stop backporting bugfixes and test it to officially release '0.4.17'. there will be a 0.4.18 in future as more bugfixes will happen |
| 20:18 |
xerox123 |
and then 0.4.20, 0.4.21, and when we get bored of 0.4.x we'll have 0.5.0! |
| 20:18 |
xerox123 |
yes, accidently skipping 0.4.19 as our love for 4 is so avid! |
| 20:21 |
nerzhul |
xerox for me the 0.4.18 is useless |
| 20:21 |
nerzhul |
we need to release 0.5.0 in 1 month or 2 as a maximum and fixed should be there |
| 20:21 |
nerzhul |
fixes* |
| 20:26 |
Shara |
I'd say we can't decide on whether a 0.4.18 is needed until 0.5 is ready... then if there were some major bugfixes to port back at that point, just do 0.4.18 almost as an aside with only those |
| 20:27 |
Shara |
But release it same time as 0.5. Not as some seperate big release |
| 20:29 |
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| 20:39 |
paramat |
IhrFussel i can assure you all possible server-control/CSM-security commits are included in 0.4.17, i make a big fuss about that stuff :) |
| 20:40 |
paramat |
we're actually putting a lot of effort into 0.4.17 and adding as much as we can, if we wanted to force people to 0.5 we wouldn't do that |
| 20:41 |
lisac |
rubenwardy, Shara: https://www.reddit.com/r/Minetest/comments/8luzj8/would_members_of_the_minetest_community_be/ |
| 20:41 |
lisac |
and everyone else too, I guess |
| 20:42 |
lisac |
unfortunately the linked site is all in some incomprehensible dead language |
| 20:43 |
Shara |
lisac: probably can't fit in much more travel than I already have planned for the next few months. Plus it's Brussels., and to me Brussels is... lawyers and work related things. |
| 20:44 |
paramat |
"the problem of devs not caring enough to write fixes for 0.4.17 which are obsolete in 0.5.0" none that i know of, do point them out |
| 20:44 |
Shara |
Would be awesome if anyone went though |
| 20:46 |
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| 20:46 |
paramat |
i expect most forked apps will update to 0.5 quite quickly, it's in their monetary interest to do so. the multicraft owner corrected me to say that app will update to 0.5 |
| 20:48 |
paramat |
that's cool. but educational stuff bores me =) |
| 20:49 |
Shara |
It's a mix for me. Depends on what kind of teaching |
| 20:49 |
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