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IRC log for #minetest-dev, 2022-07-30

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
01:58 erle i have realized dealing with minetest development may be bad for my mental health. the reason is not because my recent contribution <https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/12592> is not welcome – but rather because i have reflected upon earlier behaviour of a-certain-coredev-that-does-not-want-to-be-highlighted towards me and others: denying that bugs even exist, suggesting workarounds that make things work or do not work
01:58 erle , not even trying to understand some things yet having some strong opinions, trying to block others from contributing useful things. i suspect that this behaviour is either intended to drive away casual contributors (see: “management by perkele”) or that it is as side effect of toxic brogrammer culture (e.g. “if you can deliver results, you are allowed to be a dick”). i do not think that it is worth to try changin
01:58 erle g this: projects like systemd and suckless (“make unix great again” with all of the implications) have proven that it is possible to deliver software even if the developers tolerate arrogant jerk behaviour. but if any of my friends acted like the-coredev-who-must-not-be-over to literally anyone and kept doing that after being called out, i would end the friendship on short notice.
02:04 erle i am not the only one having such an opinion. as far as i am aware, others have done so, some months or even several years back. i have seen these kind of complaints being dismissed multiple times. this is not good. if anyone has a list of viable forks (not multicraft) that do not tolerate insults or devs having opnions without even interested in learning about a topic, please contact me in a query.
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02:48 MTDiscord <MisterE> pretty sure there are no viable forks
02:48 MTDiscord <MisterE> there are similar projects tho
02:48 MTDiscord <MisterE> veloren for onw
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03:05 MTDiscord <Warr1024> You are very unlikely to find a project where only non-devs having opinions is the accepted norm.
03:06 MTDiscord <Warr1024> If you do, though, I might be among those interested to hear about it, even if potentially just for curiosity's sake :-)
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06:58 rubenwardy would be nice to fix all the particle warnings
06:59 rubenwardy "doesn't add warnings" should be part of the PR merge criteria
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09:28 sfan5 I agree but I always forget to look at the CI output
09:28 sfan5 rubenwardy: here's another one http://codepad.org/kcJZ2P9j
09:28 sfan5 the fix is kinda stupid but what are you gonna do
09:29 MTDiscord <!~ 𝞿 Λtlantλs~!> hmm
09:29 sfan5 for completeness sake: kilbith suggested it a few days ago
09:33 Goobax[m]1 MTDiscord: quoi
09:33 MTDiscord <!~ 𝞿 Λtlantλs~!> feur
09:33 Goobax[m]1 stp
09:42 rubenwardy warnings should probably be disabled in minetest/lib and irrlicht includes
09:43 rubenwardy set_source_files_properties(src/libs/jsoncpp.cpp PROPERTIES COMPILE_FLAGS -w)
09:43 sfan5 we can fix warnings in irrlicht ourselves
09:44 sfan5 and jsoncpp having deprecating warnings in their own code is their fault and also fixable
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11:38 rubenwardy merging #12615 and #12604 in 10
11:38 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/12615 -- Fix some warnings by rubenwardy
11:38 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/12604 -- Fix Android blank screen by rollerozxa
11:38 rubenwardy oh I should probably test that latter one
11:38 rubenwardy would be a good idea :/
11:42 sfan5 while you're at it check that #12613 doesn't happen by default
11:42 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/12613 -- Shader failed to generate
11:43 ROllerozxa probably does not, android uses OGLES1 by default which does not even have the option for shaders
11:43 ROllerozxa ...I guess this is also why OGLES2 hasn't become the default yet
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13:07 rubenwardy KDE have an initiative called "15 minute bugs" where they prioritise the bugs you might stumble across in the first 15 minutes, thought that was interesting
13:38 sfan5 bug: the entire main menu
13:40 rubenwardy :D
13:40 rubenwardy I believe GreenXenith is nearly done fixing that
13:52 rubenwardy https://pointieststick.com/2022/01/18/the-15-minute-bug-initiative/
14:26 schwarzwald[m] sfan5: If you set -Werror on one of the CI builds you would know when a warning was introduced on that build.
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15:29 rubenwardy At freenode live 2018, I had the opportunity to try out an early version of KDE Plasma. I crashed it in about 20 seconds, a bit less than 15 minutes
15:29 rubenwardy or maybe it was an indev version
15:30 rubenwardy yeah, plasma was released in 2014. So it would have been ages ago
15:31 Krock does Minetest crash for you in the first 15 minutes?
15:32 rubenwardy depends what I'm doing, not normally. But there are non-crash bugs and sticking points
15:58 MTDiscord <Jonathon> Depending on the mod, or game yes
15:58 MTDiscord <Jonathon> Depending on how fast you restart a world on windows, yes
15:59 MTDiscord <Jonathon> https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/12605#issuecomment-1198722445
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16:16 rubenwardy I have made a branch that uses SDL GameController instead of Irrlicht Joysticks for better controller support. However, when I start Minetest it disconnects my controller. Other games using SDL work fine, although I have had disconnects before. I use a chinese adapter and an xbox 360 controller. Any idea on steps to debug? Ie: log files to look at
16:16 rubenwardy I think it's probably a hardware issue being aggrevated in some way
16:17 rubenwardy when I open Minetest, the controller shows as disconnected and I need to unplug and plug the adapter for it to work again
16:23 sfan5 I say there's a bug in your code ;-)
16:23 Krock if other SDL games work, then it's probably some initialization order issue
16:24 rubenwardy Processes shouldn't be able to disconnect the controller like that
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21:30 sfan5 rubenwardy: fyi if you wanted rc windows builds last week you could have pulled them from gitlab
21:30 rubenwardy ah
21:31 rubenwardy I got a bit distracted with the broken Android build
21:32 sfan5 gitlab mirroring seems to have broken exactly on the day of the translation update
21:32 sfan5 wtf?
21:34 rubenwardy force push?
21:34 rubenwardy that sometimes breaks it
21:34 rubenwardy it doesn't like resetting, so if you force push after if has synced then it can break
21:36 sfan5 i'll manually push the latest ref, let's see what happens
21:38 sfan5 https://0x0.st/oe-U.png no pipelines for me
21:39 sfan5 this is a joke honestly, credit cards are rare in my country and I would probably have to pay extra to get one from my bank
21:39 sfan5 people tout gitlab as a github alternative but between the sluggish javascript ui and shit like this I can't say I'm very interested
21:41 MTDiscord <Jonathon> not sure about ci, but would recommend gitea over gitlab
21:42 sfan5 that's for self-hosting
21:42 sfan5 anyway don't let my short rant distract you
21:43 MTDiscord <Jonathon> codeburg, or git.minetest.land, can be used
21:43 MTDiscord <Jonathon> *codeberg
21:44 rubenwardy Literally never needed to do that - it's probably because it's a mirror without any actual user activity, so maybe it thinks it's a bot
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21:45 rubenwardy oh, I think it might just be your account. I can trigger a gitlab build
21:45 rubenwardy I also use gitlab for my own projects so less likely to be classified as a bot
21:46 rubenwardy yeah "Pipeline failed because the user is not verified"
21:47 rubenwardy (also, when US companies ask for a credit card they often allow a debit card)
21:48 rubenwardy (not that it excuses this)
21:49 sfan5 they probably added this for all new accounts around the time the "lets cryptomine in free CI" craze happened
21:50 rubenwardy yeah makes sense
22:11 rubenwardy gitlab:   XInput not found
22:12 sfan5 I might have forgotten to add it
22:13 sfan5 swap out xxf86vm for xi in package lines you find
22:26 kilbith would est31 be rehabilitated as a core-dev if he comes back?
22:26 kilbith he said "maybe"
22:27 rubenwardy probably. Would need to contact c55
22:32 rubenwardy would be nice to have them back
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22:37 kilbith I'm trying to convince est31 that MT can be a strong job's vector
22:37 kilbith it's important to understand that not everyone is interested to dedicate time just for the praises
22:40 MTDiscord <MisterE> How?
22:41 kilbith the scientific community is already aware of Minetest thanks (partly) to the CERN contribution
22:42 kilbith they are interested to use Minetest for neurosciences, like what I'm doing right now
22:42 MTDiscord <MisterE> Yes?
22:43 MTDiscord <MisterE> Oh, to study behavior?
22:43 kilbith yes
22:43 MTDiscord <MisterE> They would need lots of willing participants, tho, right?
22:44 kilbith I am currently working on a project where the french jobseekers will be analysed through Minetest for a public institute
22:44 kilbith that means thousands of users
22:49 MTDiscord <MisterE> Wait, what? 'If you want a job with us, play minetest and we will evaluate your behavior' kind of thing?
22:49 MTDiscord <MisterE> Thats a new one
22:52 kilbith not it's not new, I also made neuroscientific tools for use in schools in the past
22:58 MTDiscord <MisterE> Interesting
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