IRC log for #minetest-dev, 2017-04-21

Time	Nick	Message
00:18		proller joined #minetest-dev
00:34		paramat joined #minetest-dev
01:25	paramat	~tell Zeno` https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/5625
01:25	ShadowBot	paramat: O.K.
01:25	paramat	#5625
01:25	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5625 -- Mgflat, Mgv7: Only create noise objects if needed by paramat
01:47		ssieb joined #minetest-dev
02:01		proller joined #minetest-dev
02:35		kaeza joined #minetest-dev
02:39	octacian	#5626
02:39	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5626 -- Menu: Add install mod button by octacian
02:39	octacian	paramat, sofar: ^
02:39	octacian	also, Calinou ^^
02:43	paramat	ok
03:15	Hijiri	Does the attached entity visual position bug still exist
03:18		tiwake joined #minetest-dev
03:20		DI3HARD139 joined #minetest-dev
03:32		OldCoder joined #minetest-dev
03:32	OldCoder	<OldCoder> minetest.org is being DDoSed right now, Perrtu. I am the target. No other machine in the host's network is presently under attack.
03:32	OldCoder	<OldCoder> Tell the trolls to consider their actions carefully.
03:32	OldCoder	<OldCoder> There are 117,000 sessions. This is the work of somebody in power; one of the core devs or their friends.
03:33	OldCoder	nore, sofar, shivajiva, others; my host has good hardware. And I do prosecute.
03:33	OldCoder	I've been through this before in other contexts.
03:34	sofar	everyone, please do not respond
03:34	sofar	I advise you to not reply to oldcoder in any way on these accusations
03:34	OldCoder	sofar, I'll hire an attorney and subpoena
03:34	OldCoder	RedHat
03:35	OldCoder	based on your involvement. Think it's a bluff?
03:35	OldCoder	They are not "accusations". Wish to speak with my host right now?
03:35	sofar	I always take legal accusations seriously
03:35	OldCoder	You should
03:35	Zeno`	Why would a core dev have that many shells?
03:35	OldCoder	And I am being DDoSed
03:35	sofar	Zeno`: please, do not respond
03:35	OldCoder	hang on, I'm getting more details
03:35	OldCoder	sofar, hush
03:36	OldCoder	sofar, justify your remarks if you are not involved
03:36	OldCoder	But excuse me, host is updating his own scans
03:36	OldCoder	We may be able to trace the network if it is not HMA
03:36	OldCoder	This (a) is childish (b) will not hurt me (c) is attracting my attention
03:37	octacian	#5627
03:37	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5627 -- Menu: Merge singleplayer and server tabs by octacian
03:37	sofar	OldCoder: I have no obligation to justify any remarks
03:38	OldCoder	It was a sensible point. And here is a sensible link for you to review:
03:38	OldCoder	Moment, host is vetting it
03:39	OldCoder	Host offers correction. It is 17,000, not 117,000. That is a lot of simultaneous connections, though.
03:40	OldCoder	Fortunately, I am not hosting from a living room floor. My host is the equal of anybody you know. Anyway, here is the link:
03:40	OldCoder	http://minetest.org/geethanks.txt
03:40		behalebabo joined #minetest-dev
03:40	OldCoder	Are those IPV4s known to anybody present? Perhaps they are RedHat IPV4s, sofar ?
03:41	OldCoder	Note that 1,000s of connections are originating simultaneously from each of them
03:41	sofar	https://www.maxmind.com/en/geoip-demo try it
03:41	Hijiri	does redhat mean something other than the distro
03:41	OldCoder	I had not really noticed, sorry about that, it is like a sneeze. I know how...
03:41	OldCoder	Hijiri, the company
03:41	OldCoder	sofar, I do know how to geolocate
03:41	Hijiri	oh yeah
03:41	sofar	I don't think redhat has AT&T U-Verse blocks
03:41	OldCoder	I have been fighting DDoSers in my family for 4 years... My brother is the VP of Lab126 and uses Amazon for this purpose.
03:42	OldCoder	sofar, I knew it wasn't you. I found your remarks to be out of line.
03:42	sofar	obviously whoever is doing this is using a botnet
03:42	OldCoder	AT&T is a surprise, though...
03:42	OldCoder	Well, yes
03:42	OldCoder	So, I won't be able to track the IPV4s
03:42	OldCoder	But the originators will recognize them, correct?
03:42	OldCoder	U-Verse is residential. I'd expected this to be Russia.
03:43	OldCoder	Talking to host about that, excuse me...
03:43	sofar	maybe someone has backdoored the minebest engine...
03:43	OldCoder	No
03:43	OldCoder	It was a "booter" server
03:43	OldCoder	It was a "booter" service * Observe this:
03:43	OldCoder	http://i.imgur.com/QvLWoJN.png
03:44	OldCoder	A senior Minetester paid for 4 hours
03:44	OldCoder	A 4-hour botnet slot
03:44	OldCoder	My host is very, very good
03:44	OldCoder	But he won't be able to identify the individual
03:44	OldCoder	I'll offer concluding comments shortly, talking to him again
03:44	* OldCoder	didn't know that these things came in specific timeslots
03:46	OldCoder	Host is digging into this a bit. sofar, do you still wish to use the word "accusations" as though it was nonsense?
03:46	OldCoder	Or to contest that somebody here, or who will be here tomorrow, did not purchase this?
03:47	OldCoder	Somebody is PM-g #minetest-project'ers and telling them that the channel is "shutting down"
03:47	OldCoder	And somebody has purchased a 4-hour professional botnet. Just as a gift for the Old Coder.
03:47	OldCoder	How sweet.
03:47	Hijiri	I didn't receive any PM
03:47	OldCoder	I am in fact kind. I have in fact spent 5 years trying to help here - and succeeding.
03:47	OldCoder	Hijiri, sorry
03:48	sofar	OldCoder: I'm seeing you make accusations with legal ramifications
03:48	OldCoder	I'll try not to speak in absolutes. Somebody is PM'g #minetest-project'ers - one at a time
03:48	OldCoder	Not en masse
03:48	OldCoder	And somebody has hired a botnet just for me.
03:48	OldCoder	sofar, yes; and, respectfully, what is your point? Do you deny the accusations on the part of the core devs?
03:48	OldCoder	You are no child
03:49	OldCoder	This is no sandbox game
03:49	sofar	it appears someone is DDossing you, this I can conclude as well, permitted any of the information you provided in here is accurate
03:49	OldCoder	Do you contend, or even believe, that minetest.org is not the specific target?
03:49	sofar	this is largely offtopic for this channel
03:50	OldCoder	...
03:50	OldCoder	It is not unless you contend
03:50	OldCoder	this did not originate right here
03:50	OldCoder	Do you so contend? That will place it in your responsibility
03:50	OldCoder	And will offer legal openings
03:51	OldCoder	Host says DDoS is restarting
03:51	Hijiri	well it's not directly related to development at least
03:51	OldCoder	Excuse me briefly, checking details
03:51	OldCoder	Hijiri, it is directed at me personally
03:51	OldCoder	By this group
03:51	OldCoder	I may need to respond
03:51	sofar	you go and make your accusations if you so desire
03:52	OldCoder	sofar, thank you for your civility
03:52	OldCoder	Excuse me briefly, checking details
03:52	OldCoder	sofar, just out of curiosity, do you offer an alternative explanation?
03:52	OldCoder	Taking into account
03:52	OldCoder	That somebody here has asked people
03:52	OldCoder	To PM people in -project to the effect that -project is "shutting down" (exact quote) ?
03:52	OldCoder	I will have the name of THAT person
03:52	OldCoder	in 24 to 48 hours.
03:53	sofar	you're misrepresenting statements by people, regularly
03:53	OldCoder	Odd, that such PMs would be made even as a DDoS is going on, no?
03:53	OldCoder	Indicate misrepresentation, please
03:53	sofar	I don't have to
03:54	OldCoder	Then withhold your assessment
03:54	OldCoder	It is unreasonable to make it and to decline to discuss it
03:54	OldCoder	My host is assessing router load
03:54	OldCoder	If it is going to cost him anything significant, legal actions will be unavoidable
03:55	OldCoder	Other actions as well
03:55	OldCoder	It is suggested, politely, that those who are proceeding in this matter
03:55	OldCoder	Be advised of the preceding points
03:55	OldCoder	sofar, is anything that was just said unreasonable?
03:55	sofar	yes, you're threatening people with legal action
03:55	sofar	this is immature
03:56	sofar	unethical as well
03:56	OldCoder	Immature? This may cost my host cash and is a felony violation of CFAA
03:56	sofar	I understand you are upset
03:56	OldCoder	Hardly
03:56	OldCoder	I am starting
03:56	OldCoder	to pay attention
03:56	OldCoder	Respectfully, people most likely
03:56	OldCoder	do not wish my full attention
03:56	sofar	but your tone and attitude are unreasonable and outside of the guidelines that have been set out for this channel
03:56	OldCoder	Justify your remarks, including that point
03:56	sofar	take your legal accusations elsewhere
03:56	sofar	please leave this channel
03:56	OldCoder	Kick me and I contact RedHat tomorrow
03:56	OldCoder	Go ahead. I promise.
03:57	sofar	you are mature enough to remove yourself
03:57	OldCoder	I am being attacked right now. And my host is a friend.
03:57	OldCoder	Excuse me while I check the resource load with him.
03:57	OldCoder	sofar, I will phone senior RedHat people at home if you involve yourself.
03:57	OldCoder	And provide
03:57	OldCoder	Information you may not be aware that I possess
03:57	OldCoder	My friend needs me
03:58	OldCoder	Excuse me a moment
03:59	OldCoder	Waiting on his analysis. sofar, DDoS is a felony violation of CFAA. CFAA has teeth if one knows how to call the teeth.
03:59	OldCoder	Do not threaten me
03:59	sofar	I have made no threats of any form.
04:00	OldCoder	You were preparing the framework to state that I was out of line to be present in this channel
04:00	OldCoder	This channel that is involved in one of the more prosecutable felonies
04:00	OldCoder	In the tech arena
04:00	sofar	your current behavior is neither conductive to the project nor friendly
04:01	sofar	it is by all means unwanted
04:01	OldCoder	I am being DDoSed. By these people. Did I happen to mention that?
04:01	OldCoder	That is by all means "unwanted"
04:01	OldCoder	Respond to that, politely, or back off
04:01	sofar	your complaining and threats of legal action are not in any way a benefit to the community nor do they help the project in any way or form
04:01	OldCoder	sofar, does the DDoS do so?
04:01	OldCoder	Hm. That almost rhymes.
04:01	OldCoder	Repond to that simple question.
04:02	OldCoder	Your statement is a non-sequitur, additionally.
04:02	OldCoder	If the project commits a prosecutable felony
04:02	OldCoder	You are hardly in a position to make the statement that you just did
04:02	OldCoder	This is not a kid with a neighborhood botnet
04:02	OldCoder	Somebody is putting effort into it
04:03	OldCoder	Don't talk to me about "threats" when "threats" have escalated to somebody hurting my host
04:04	sofar	again, you are misrepresenting peoples statements left and right, making legal threats, and generally being enormously disruptive to the project and community.
04:05	sofar	please, just leave.
04:05	sofar	nobody could do more harm to the project than you are currently doing.
04:06	sofar	oldcoder, you had a great run. You poored your heart into the project for 5 years
04:06	sofar	more than anyone else I think
04:06	OldCoder	poured *
04:06	OldCoder	sofar, moment, host is assessing
04:06	OldCoder	You can be that reasonable
04:07	sofar	today is the day you have the opportunity to reassess your commitment and change
04:07	sofar	or, you can continue to do what you're attempting to do this very night, and continue the damage
04:07	OldCoder	But the point about "legal threats" is bizarre. Um, a felony is being committed and you don't consider consequences...
04:07	OldCoder	Stop that. Now.
04:07	OldCoder	You will not hold me responsible for the actions of others.
04:07	OldCoder	I'll never go there again.
04:07	OldCoder	Take responsibility for your own choices.
04:08	OldCoder	I've done naught but help, be kind, and stand up to bullies and trolls.
04:08	OldCoder	Speaking of which, do hold the part about how I should not talk about calling the police...
04:08	OldCoder	until I find out the status of what there is to call about
04:08	OldCoder	Minute
04:08	sofar	I can not and will not prevent you from calling any authority
04:08	OldCoder	Yet you continue
04:08	OldCoder	to position the fact
04:08	sofar	I'm asking you to leave this channel
04:08	OldCoder	that that is the right thing to do
04:09	OldCoder	And I am telling you a felony has been committed
04:09	OldCoder	And that if you or any identifiable person
04:09	* VanessaE	peeks in
04:09	OldCoder	Kicks me... I will file a police report
04:09	VanessaE	OC, take it to another channel NOW.
04:09	VanessaE	this is NOT the place for this discussion
04:09	OldCoder	VanessaE, I am being DDoSed. Kick me and I file against sofar at RedHat.
04:09	OldCoder	Wait, the DDoS may be ending
04:09	VanessaE	I don't have the authority to kick you but I DO have the authority to bitch you out
04:09	OldCoder	Will you excuse me long enough to check?
04:09	VanessaE	OFFTOPIC, LEAVE.
04:10	OldCoder	It is not offtopic. Justify the point.
04:10	OldCoder	But let me check the status of my host's hardware first, please
04:10	OldCoder	Or is that too civil a request?
04:10	VanessaE	this is for core discussion of Minetest engine code and game code, not legal threads over a DDoS that isn't even coming from any of us
04:10	VanessaE	no I will NOT wait, take it out of this channel immediately.
04:10	OldCoder	VanessaE, that is two parts. #1 is defensible. Justify #2. You know it is one of the people here.
04:10	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/1 -- GlowStone code by anonymousAwesome
04:10	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/2 -- Burned wood
04:11	rdococ	. o O ( wtf is going on? )
04:11	OldCoder	I have been put through enough
04:11	VanessaE	I justify item 2 because even if it WERE someone here, this is still not the place to discuss it.
04:11	OldCoder	rdococ, I'm being DDoSed by one of the core devs or their friends
04:11	OldCoder	That is point #1 and a point worth considering, VanessaE
04:11	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/1 -- GlowStone code by anonymousAwesome
04:11	OldCoder	Regarding point #2, you know they are right here
04:11	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/2 -- Burned wood
04:11	rdococ	OldCoder, are you sure it was by someone on here?
04:11	sofar	everyone, please do not respond to oldcoder. We've asked him to leave and take it elsewhere
04:11	OldCoder	sofar, go one way or the other
04:12	OldCoder	rdococ, fair point, I'll discuss that with you in PM
04:12	* OldCoder	goes to talk to host friend
04:12	VanessaE	OldCoder: I know nothing at all about who is or is not the source of your DDoS, other than I know I've no connection with it because I've been fecking asleep for the past 2 hours, and afk for a few hours before that.
04:12	OldCoder	I sleep a lot too, Vanessa
04:12	OldCoder	What is your point?
04:13	sofar	OldCoder: please leave the channel
04:13	OldCoder	Do you have any idea what all of this has cost me financially?
04:13	VanessaE	no specific point, just making it clear
04:13	OldCoder	sofar, you have made statements
04:13	sofar	OldCoder: please leave the channel
04:13	OldCoder	which call your right to make that request into question
04:13	sofar	OldCoder: please leave the channel
04:13	OldCoder	If you wish
04:13	sofar	OldCoder: please leave the channel
04:13	OldCoder	actual war
04:13	OldCoder	sofar, you are flooding
04:13	sofar	then leave the channel
04:13	OldCoder	Is it to be actual war?
04:13	VanessaE	and for the record, any good server host will not charge you for a DDoS. they'll mitigate it. I know, from having been a target myself a few times.
04:13	OldCoder	VanessaE, that is not the issue
04:13	VanessaE	and he's just repeating, you are flooding. now TAKE IT SOMEWHERE ELSE.
04:13	OldCoder	This host is a friend. The issue is affecting him.
04:14	sofar	OldCoder: please leave the channel
04:14	OldCoder	These cowards are hurting a friend.
04:14	OldCoder	sofar, you are flooding
04:14	OldCoder	Is it to be war?
04:14	OldCoder	Do you think I won't quit a job
04:14	OldCoder	That is now in jeopardy because of all of this
04:14	OldCoder	And do what I must?
04:14	OldCoder	Leave me alone
04:14	sofar	OldCoder: please leave the channel
04:14	OldCoder	Stop PMg my people
04:14	OldCoder	Stop DDoSing me
04:15	OldCoder	Stop saying that I "weird out" people by being "too detailed"
04:15	OldCoder	Just stop it
04:15	VanessaE	OldCoder: ENOUGH!
04:15	sofar	OldCoder: please leave the channel
04:15	OldCoder	My words exactly
04:15	OldCoder	The decision is the group's. If I wake up tomorrow...
04:15	OldCoder	and I find that anything has been escalated...
04:16	OldCoder	Which would include ex post facto ban from this channel
04:16	OldCoder	It is war
04:16	OldCoder	You people should be ashamed of yourselves
04:16	OldCoder	Enough, yourself, young lady :P
04:16	VanessaE	you need to prove it was someone from here before you make a claim, OldCoder.
04:16	OldCoder	The reaction is good enough. But do you deny it, honestly?
04:16	sofar	this channel is not the place for legal accusations
04:16	OldCoder	Speak the truth
04:17	OldCoder	sofar, oh, really? But this is the channel
04:17	OldCoder	of the Gods
04:17	VanessaE	how can I deny something for which I have no information one way or the other?
04:17	sofar	neither factual or implied
04:17	OldCoder	Isn't it?
04:17	Hijiri	anywhere with third parties isn't the place for legal accusations
04:17	rdococ	-_-
04:17	Hijiri	since that could be defamation
04:17	OldCoder	That is not a legal basis for your assertion
04:17	OldCoder	I fear no defamation
04:17	OldCoder	Ever; since 2012
04:17	sofar	OldCoder: please leave the channel
04:17	OldCoder	sofar, you are tedious. I need to talk to my friend.
04:18	sofar	please leave minetest entirely
04:18	OldCoder	But understand... if I wake up and anything has been escalated
04:18	rdococ	NONE OF US TOUCHED YOUR STUFF. NOW GO.
04:18	OldCoder	The escalation may be regretted
04:18	OldCoder	Is that what is desired?
04:18	OldCoder	Must it be so?
04:18	rdococ	...
04:18	OldCoder	...
04:18	rdococ	well, I don't know if anyone else touched your stuff.
04:18	rdococ	but I know I didn't.
04:18	rdococ	SO GO.
04:19	sofar	OldCoder: please leave the channel
04:19	OldCoder	rdococ, then "BE POLITE"
04:19	OldCoder	Overnight, best decide: peace or war
04:19	OldCoder	And this is the place to announce that
04:19	OldCoder	It is one way or the other
04:19	OldCoder	This has got to end
04:19	OldCoder	If war is necessary, BTW, I am not very nice about it
04:19	OldCoder	IRL
04:20	OldCoder	Ask about a dozen attorneys, if you like
04:20	OldCoder	Who were sicced on me
04:20	OldCoder	I'll send you their home phone numbers
04:20	OldCoder	Say Hi for me
04:20	sofar	OldCoder: please leave the channel
04:20	OldCoder	sofar, I am not escalating. You are.
04:20	OldCoder	Does NOBODY but me understand deescalation?
04:20	sofar	I'm still the person who is kindly asking you to leave
04:21	sofar	so, take it like an adult
04:21	sofar	go walk it off
04:21	VanessaE	I'm being as kind as I can tolerate right now as well. leave the channel.
04:21	OldCoder	sofar, how dare you?
04:21	OldCoder	"Take it like an adult" ?
04:21	OldCoder	My host says it's continuing. They just lost one leg.
04:22	OldCoder	Some system kicked in.
04:22	OldCoder	$2,000. That's how much this has cost me.
04:22	OldCoder	Not for the trademark. Lost work.
04:22	OldCoder	Get off your high horse, sofar. What has this cost you?
04:22	VanessaE	"lost work"
04:22	OldCoder	Same to you, VanessaE.
04:22	OldCoder	Yes, what about it?
04:22	VanessaE	that argument won't fly here and you should know that.
04:23	sofar	I advise you to cut your financial losses to a minimum
04:23	OldCoder	Hm? It's not an argument.
04:23	VanessaE	as for what this has cost me? hmm... well add up three years of server hosting costs, whatever that comes to.
04:23	OldCoder	I'm taking care of a dog tonight. He's hungry. Woof. Shall a dog whimper that you may feel superior?
04:23	OldCoder	He's scratching for food right now
04:23	OldCoder	I mean this rubbish, VanessaE
04:23	OldCoder	The last 4 weeks
04:24	OldCoder	I'm going to feed a dog. Presumably he won't bite me for doing so.
04:24	OldCoder	If only people were animals of this nature.
04:24	sofar	go walk it off, with the dog?
04:24	OldCoder	You go walk it off
04:24	OldCoder	But I must feed him right now
04:24	sofar	please leave the channel as well
04:24	OldCoder	Walk off 17,000 connections?
04:24	OldCoder	sofar, I'll leave when the DDoS stops.
04:24	OldCoder	If I'm kicked, I initiate
04:24	OldCoder	IRL actions, not limited to legal
04:25	OldCoder	Hm, that came out wrong. Or maybe it didn't.
04:25	VanessaE	yeah, that came out VERY wrong on a publically-logged channel......
04:25	OldCoder	I was being facetious, VanessaE
04:25	OldCoder	It came out
04:25	OldCoder	Exactly as I wished
04:25	OldCoder	sofar, Corporate Counsels don't ignore me
04:26	OldCoder	The last one tried
04:26	OldCoder	to
04:26	OldCoder	They brought in somebody who argues before State Supreme Courts
04:26	OldCoder	After a few weeks
04:26	OldCoder	He sort of went away
04:26	OldCoder	I called him Christmas Day just to say Hi
04:26	OldCoder	:D
04:26	sofar	you're argueing in an IRC channel, you should probably get a really good lawyer
04:26	sofar	also, please leave the channel
04:26	OldCoder	sofar, I am not arguing at all
04:26	OldCoder	Dog is waiting
04:27	sofar	he needs you more than this channel does
04:28	sofar	so, think of the dog, leave the channel, and take the dog for a walk
04:29	OldCoder	sofar, you are being... the word is not polite. But those behind the attack are cowardly.
04:29	OldCoder	And that assessment
04:29	OldCoder	is perfectly on topic
04:29	OldCoder	The core devs have developed hatred and prosecutable crimes
04:30	OldCoder	It is on the new plan
04:30	sofar	<OldCoder> The core devs have developed hatred and prosecutable crimes
04:30	sofar	defamation
04:30	OldCoder	Fact
04:30	OldCoder	I can document
04:30	OldCoder	the first part
04:30	sofar	also, please leave the channel
04:30	OldCoder	In detail over 4 weeks
04:30	OldCoder	Also, please give it a rest
04:31	OldCoder	(1) I leave when the DDoS stops (2) If I am kicked, the results will be satisfactory in the end to me
04:31	OldCoder	None of this was necessary. You just had to leave me be. Without deprecation, attacks, basically rubbing salt in the wound.
04:33	OldCoder	I've got kids, playing, right now; other countries. How nice that their playground is to be smashed up.
04:33	Zeno`	I don't like being accused of things I did not commit
04:33	OldCoder	Zeno`, I am dealing with the group. You are an individual.
04:33	OldCoder	There are many kind people logged in.
04:33	OldCoder	They ought to see this.
04:33	OldCoder	And to understand just how far this has gone.
04:33	OldCoder	And just how wrong it is.
04:34	OldCoder	"Oh, look, somebody is disliked... throw stones, throw feces...
04:34	OldCoder	make the stranger be dead"
04:34	sofar	just, stop
04:34	sofar	please leave the channel
04:34	OldCoder	sofar, I ask the same of you. The first part.
04:34	sofar	you're just looking for someone to acknowledge you
04:34	sofar	for what reason?
04:34	OldCoder	sofar, I am being DDoSed.
04:34	sofar	don't even bother answering that
04:34	sofar	just, go walk your dog
04:34	sofar	please leave this channel
04:34	OldCoder	If you wish to make other statements, discuss them or hush.
04:35	OldCoder	You please leave this channel
04:35	sofar	I've got another one
04:35	sofar	please leave this channel.
04:35	OldCoder	And I have no dog. I was helping somebody.
04:35	OldCoder	please leave this channel.
04:35	sofar	you're being disruptive.
04:35	OldCoder	you're being disruptive.
04:35	OldCoder	Adult, much?
04:35	OldCoder	Grow up, yourself
04:35	OldCoder	I have taken enough from the group that has attacked
04:35	OldCoder	For a solid month now
04:35	OldCoder	It ends
04:35	OldCoder	Or it escalates
04:36	OldCoder	Which is it to be?
04:36	sofar	your decision
04:36	OldCoder	I will never again be the boy
04:36	sofar	so, go make it
04:36	OldCoder	How is it my decision? Shall I stand there
04:36	OldCoder	my blood dripping on the floor again
04:36	OldCoder	And smile sweetly
04:36	OldCoder	So sweetly
04:36	OldCoder	That I shall be told
04:36	OldCoder	I am not being disruptive?
04:36	OldCoder	Never again
04:36	OldCoder	Ever
04:36	OldCoder	The attacks stop. Including from you, sofar.
04:37	OldCoder	Or we go to the next level.
04:37	XtremeHacker	What did I walk into? 0_0
04:37	OldCoder	XtremeHacker, I'm being DDoSed
04:37	VanessaE	XtremeHacker: just back away slowly and close the door....
04:37	OldCoder	It is tedious
04:37	OldCoder	XtremeHacker, best to stay in -project
04:37	OldCoder	But it's up to you
04:37	* XtremeHacker	LEaves -dev
04:38	OldCoder	Host says he can tolerate even 17,000 simultaneous connections... Not sure indefinitely, though
04:38	OldCoder	I might need to ask Bonsai Kitten about this
04:38	OldCoder	Hm
04:38	OldCoder	What sort of hardware is minetest.net hosted on?
04:39	OldCoder	Does anybody know?
04:39	OldCoder	What sort of network?
04:39	sofar	are you threatening to DDos it?
04:39	OldCoder	Is it really, really good? O_O
04:39	OldCoder	Certainly not!
04:39	OldCoder	It's just that
04:39	OldCoder	If
04:39	OldCoder	These people are randomly attacking Minetest
04:39	OldCoder	And it is NOT just an attack on me
04:39	OldCoder	Aren't the odds pretty good
04:40	OldCoder	That they will take down Minetest.Net
04:40	OldCoder	with something that makes 17,000 for a day or two
04:40	OldCoder	Look puny?
04:40	OldCoder	^ Reasonable point
04:40	* OldCoder	is shocked to realize that minetest.net may be at risk
04:40	sofar	discussions about DDos-ing project servers (hypothetically) is certainly not appropriate for this channel
04:41	OldCoder	Hypothetical is probably not on-topic. I contend that ongoing as in right now certainly is on-topic.
04:41	sofar	your presence in this channel is disrupting the very goals of which it was created for
04:42	OldCoder	sofar, do not even try to go there. Blame the victim. Sickening.
04:42	sofar	Instead of discussing code and PRs, look at the channel now
04:42	OldCoder	The victim is not at fault.
04:42	sofar	you are doing more damage to the project than anyone else
04:42	OldCoder	Rape is not justified by the fact that the victim is unable to fight back.
04:43	OldCoder	Oh no O_O By saying I do not wish to be deprecated, dogpiled, lied about, DDoSed
04:43	sofar	then go call your lawyer already, or call the authorities
04:43	OldCoder	I am doing irreparable harm
04:43	OldCoder	Oh no!
04:43	sofar	but please, leave the channel
04:43	OldCoder	sofar, it's martial arts
04:43	OldCoder	The fact is, and I'm being pretty open about this
04:43	OldCoder	My IQ is probably Hawkins level plus 5
04:43	OldCoder	I learned this in 2012
04:43	OldCoder	I could see everything
04:43	OldCoder	laid out in legal actions
04:44	OldCoder	And I realized that I could do nothing
04:44	OldCoder	except when the other side moved
04:44	OldCoder	Then they did
04:44	OldCoder	And it was funny :D
04:44	OldCoder	The trick is you don't let the other side choose the battlefield
04:44	OldCoder	You will not be doing that to me
04:44	OldCoder	The battlefield will not be DDoS
04:45	OldCoder	And nobody in the project, including Perttu
04:45	OldCoder	Hm; never mind the next part
04:45	OldCoder
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05:00	rdococ	why did I have to wake up
05:00	VanessaE	go back to bed :P
05:00	rdococ	I can't
05:00	rdococ	once I wake up I can't go back to sleep
05:04	OldCoder	rdococ, try melatonin
05:04	OldCoder	and I've responded to your question in PM
05:05	OldCoder	rdococ, VanessaE, sleep is off-topic
05:05	OldCoder	:P
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05:36	OldCoder	<VanessaE> so I'm gonna say one last thing: don't ever bring any of this noise into -dev again. the channel has a specific subject... if you are not discussing a patch or a pull request or a bug in the engine or _game or discussing making a change to it, or maybe making a quick one-liner joke, you're offtopic and need to take it somewhere else, regardless of what you think is or is not on-topic.
05:36	OldCoder	VanessaE, deescalate.
05:36	VanessaE	^^^ private message sent to OC that didn't need to be repeated in here.
05:43		nerzhul joined #minetest-dev
05:43	OldCoder	Just as shivajiva's PM dump did not need to appear in #minetest-project
05:43	OldCoder	nerzhul, good morning
05:43	OldCoder	Excuse me, PMg with Vanessa
05:44	nerzhul	hi
05:44	OldCoder	o/
05:53	nerzhul	some noise on -dev unrelated to minetest development this night, hmmm
05:54	nerzhul	can someone approve #5621 ? fairly trivial fix for an external contributor
05:54	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5621 -- Fix #5617 - respect message and reconnect parameters when shutting down immediately by orwell96
05:54	VanessaE	wait, what? something ON-topic?
05:54	* VanessaE	falls over
05:55	nerzhul	guys feature freeze is in 1 month, please finish all milestone 0.4.16 pr :)
05:55	VanessaE	there's another odd shutdown issue that should be looked at - the client likes to hang on the way down. Seems limited to singleplayer situations.
05:55	VanessaE	hang to the point that I have to SIGKILL it.
05:56	nerzhul	only when using shutdown command ? or in another way ?
05:56	nerzhul	celeron55, can you add feature freeze date in topic (21st may), please ?
05:56	VanessaE	well since it's singleplayer, usually ESC -> "exit to OS"
05:57	VanessaE	I haven't noticed any problems with the separate server instance shutting down, other than that one bug that happened and was fixed, a few weeks back
05:57	nerzhul	strange, is this triggered in every case ?
06:00	VanessaE	noper
06:01	VanessaE	it's pretty random
06:01	VanessaE	next time I'll try to get a backtrace
06:01	nerzhul	it's difficult :) maybe it can be related to some mods ?
06:04	VanessaE	it could be, I don't know for sure
06:04	VanessaE	however,
06:04	VanessaE	since it requires a SIGKILL, probably not.
06:04	sofar	#5619 updated, I think it's OK now
06:04	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5619 -- Add on_flood() callback. by sofar
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06:34	nerzhul	i will push the fairly trivial but performance improvement #5628 when travis build will finish
06:34	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5628 -- Fix various performance issues reported by cppcheck by nerzhul
06:57	celeron55	i'll add some core devs as ops here
06:58	VanessaE	thanks.
06:58	celeron55	ask me later if you don't want to have +o, i'll just pick randomly for now
07:00	VanessaE	meanwhile, a user over on #minetest asks for a filtering feature for the in-client server list, i.e. show only servers that have PVP and mod "foo" installed, that sort of thing
07:04		OldCoder was kicked by ChanServ: User is banned from this channel
07:04	celeron55	how about that for now
07:05	celeron55	coming here with DDoS accusations is just stupid
07:06	VanessaE	I still wonder who DDoS'ed him.
07:06	celeron55	he doesn't need to have this much attention
07:06	celeron55	i want people to be able to focus on minetest, not OldCoder
07:08	celeron55	maybe some script kiddie that happened to see some discussions; they tend to show their opinions that way
07:09	VanessaE	perhaps.
07:12	celeron55	anyway, there is a limit for how much of my life i am going to waste with OC
07:13	red-000	wow my chat is spammed with OC
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07:30		Topic for #minetest-dev is now Minetest core development and maintenance. Feature freeze for 0.4.16: 21st May 00:00 UTC. Chit-chat goes to #minetest. Consider this instead of /msg celeron55. http://irc.minetest.net/minetest-dev/ http://dev.minetest.net/.
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07:39	red-000	could someone review #5492?
07:39	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5492 -- [CSM] Add local particles and particlespawners. by red-001
07:52	nerzhul	celeron55: in the topic on the channel, we have since many years a reference to whispers to you, is this always a reality ?
07:59		Lunatrius` joined #minetest-dev
08:00	celeron55	it's been there since i created this channel
08:00	nerzhul	is this always necessary to have this information ? :p maybe it promote you to be whisped :p
08:01		Topic for #minetest-dev is now Minetest core development and maintenance. Feature freeze for 0.4.16: 21st May 00:00 UTC. Chit-chat goes to #minetest. http://irc.minetest.net/minetest-dev/ http://dev.minetest.net/
08:02	celeron55	(this channel was literally created to replace a long /msg with a contributor back then)
08:04	Zeno`	hmm
08:06	nerzhul	yeah, understood heh
08:06	nerzhul	merging #5628
08:06	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5628 -- Fix various performance issues reported by cppcheck by nerzhul
08:06	nerzhul	i didn't fixed all cppcheck issues yet, but ~65% are now done, the most criticals
08:07	VanessaE	nerzhul: how much effect will those changes have
08:07	VanessaE	(performance improvements always pique my interest)
08:07	nerzhul	not very very huge, don't wait for a real difference, current problems needs a better approach than removing memory copis :p
08:07	Zeno`	I guess cppcheck has been updated recently. About 3 months ago it didn't report much interesting at all
08:07	VanessaE	fair enough.
08:08	nerzhul	Zeno`: don't just do cppcheck, but cppcheck --enable=performance --std=c++03 src/ :)
08:08	Zeno`	I'm meant to type all that?! :-o ;)
08:08	nerzhul	for the network part it remove 4 packet copies in the connection threads, which is systematic and can a little bit improve latency
08:09	nerzhul	Zeno`: heh, you can --enable=all if you want but some things are not very interesting (style issues for example)
08:09	Zeno`	that sounds easier :D
08:09	nerzhul	after this PR merging, in performance issue if i remember are 4-5 memory copies and ~40 constructor optimizations
08:10	nerzhul	please note when switching to C++11 we will have many more errors to fix which are shown by cppcheck to improve a little bit more performance due to new compilers/standards
08:11	nerzhul	oh nice !
08:11	nerzhul	https://gitlab.com/nerzhul/minetest/pipelines/7774250
08:11	nerzhul	a full pipeline for Debian and ubuntu (and just a build for fedora i should add package & deploy steps :D
08:17	nerzhul	celeron55: is this okay if i push #5629 for the gitlab daily build in the mirror repository ?
08:17	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5629 -- Gitlab-CI enhancements by nerzhul
08:17	nerzhul	it doesn't affect github but i really want to continue and finish daily builds, and this is the second step :)
08:17	nerzhul	maybe at the end make gitlab push some artifacts to github or somewhere else for end users
08:18	celeron55	if there's no other way to control gitlab, i guess it's okay
08:19	celeron55	it's kind of silly though
08:19	nerzhul	.gitlab-ci.yml is equivalent to .travis.yml :)
08:19	celeron55	travis is silly also
08:19	nerzhul	i prefer gitlab-ci it's a little bit simple to handle and docker usage permit to test on many systems, unlike travis which only uses ubuntu
08:19	celeron55	it's like they use our project for marketing by forcing their file to be there
08:20	nerzhul	celeron55: heh
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09:03	nerzhul	what are those [off] everywhere
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09:07	red-000	can someone kickban HiBitches
09:07	HiBitches	I'll be back in 3 minutes
09:07	HiBitches	Red, if they do
09:07	HiBitches	alternative is to go +m on channel
09:07	red-000	go to your own channel
09:07	HiBitches	There is a fallback plan for that
09:07	kaeza	so mature
09:07	HiBitches	red-000, PM, please, no sneeze, you are offtopic
09:07	HiBitches	kaeza, I agree
09:07	kilbith	how about to go fuck yourself
09:07	HiBitches	PM, please
09:08	HiBitches	This is offtime and I am lawabiding
09:08	HiBitches	offtopic, sorry
09:08	red-000	-> #minetest-project
09:08	HiBitches	PM, please
09:08	HiBitches	Be good citizens
09:08		HiBitches was kicked by nerzhul: HiBitches
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09:08	nerzhul	VanessaE, oh i didn't knows that
09:08	HiBitches	Ban or nothing. And ban means HMA.
09:08	red-000	Isn't ban evading agaist freenode rules?
09:08	HiBitches	It surely is.
09:08	HiBitches	Shocking.
09:09	HiBitches	So is DDoS ofc
09:09	nerzhul	i didn't ban just kick
09:09	HiBitches	Sigh
09:09	HiBitches	Let me sleep
09:09	VanessaE	nerzhul: it also works to keep chat in an IRC channel from propagating to minetest server instances that are in that channel via kaeza's IRC mod.
09:09	nerzhul	oh, it's because it's handled like this in the reading components then
09:10	red-000	nerzhul, oldcoder already got banned
09:10	HiBitches	That was probably foolish
09:10	HiBitches	as he is insane and not age 14
09:10	HiBitches	and has sufficient funds
09:10	HiBitches	to be rather inconvenient
09:10	HiBitches	Oh no
09:10	HiBitches	He hires detectives
09:10	HiBitches	IRL
09:10	kaeza	potato
09:11	HiBitches	Did you know that? He's really quite a B*tch
09:11	HiBitches	He likes to spread U.S. SSNs around
09:11	HiBitches	for US people
09:11	red-000	?
09:11	HiBitches	vanessa, PM, truly; RBA did care for you
09:11	red-000	potato?
09:11	HiBitches	I think
09:12	HiBitches	It's a potat-Oh po-tah-to reference
09:12	VanessaE	potato.
09:12	red-000	I'm confused
09:12	HiBitches	It is a criticism of obsession
09:12	kilbith	stop answering him already
09:12	red-000	why is everyone saying potato?
09:12	HiBitches	A US meme of decades ago
09:12	kaeza	potato!
09:12	HiBitches	red-000: it's a meme
09:12	red-000	!??
09:12	VanessaE	hash browns. :)
09:12	HiBitches	kilbith don't be a, um, bith
09:13	VanessaE	because we're just being silly since the channel is slow right now :)
09:13	kilbith	celeron55: please, shoot him down
09:13	kaeza	nerzhul, ^
09:13	HiBitches	kilbith I'd be back in 2 minutes
09:13	red-000	I'm really confused
09:13	HiBitches	Tomorrow I'll have 700 IPs
09:13	HiBitches	Just as LM had
09:13	celeron55	what on earth is this now
09:13	HiBitches	That is kid stuff
09:13	HiBitches	It is potato meme
09:13	kilbith	should we request a k-line to the Freenode admins ?
09:13	HiBitches	kilbith this is a random IPV4
09:14	HiBitches	Tomorrow I sign up for HMA
09:14	HiBitches	After that I hire detectives
09:14	HiBitches	Are you in the US BTW? But you are German
09:14	HiBitches	sad
09:14	red-000	pretty sure ban evading is a k-linable offence
09:14	HiBitches	It is, yes\
09:14	HiBitches	Indeed
09:14	HiBitches	So is DDoS
09:14	nerzhul	it's a very offtopic from an unpretty nick
09:14	celeron55	let's play this game
09:14		HiBitches was kicked by celeron55: HiBitches
09:15	nerzhul	i never see a such thing on IRC since 3 years...
09:15	celeron55	just whoever, i need to work
09:15	red-000	wow
09:15	kaeza	op party?
09:15	shivajiva	kk
09:15	red-000	thats a lot of ops
09:15	VanessaE	have a better day, ce1
09:16	VanessaE	er celeron55
09:17	kilbith	wait, there's a better approach, give voice only to users with +v mode
09:17	nerzhul	kilbith, it's not a good idea on this channel
09:17	nerzhul	it's a more open channel than hub
09:17	nerzhul	everybody should have a chance to discuss to developers, respecting rules
09:17	kilbith	we don't need an "open bar" currently
09:18		red-000-kick-tes joined #minetest-dev
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09:18		red-000-kick-tes was kicked by red-000: ok then I will kick you
09:22		IamSleepyFriend joined #minetest-dev
09:22	IamSleepyFriend	Hey
09:22	IamSleepyFriend	Love abounds, hounds
09:23	IamSleepyFriend	I do have a Visa, you know
09:23	IamSleepyFriend	HMA when I wake up
09:23		IamSleepyFriend was kicked by celeron55: IamSleepyFriend
09:23	nerzhul	celeron you ban root@* ? :p
09:23	celeron55	mistake
09:23	nerzhul	nobody can connect as root, security
09:23	nerzhul	:p
09:24	celeron55	+m might be a good idea but we'll see
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09:25	red-000	it's a bad idea to connect as root anyway
09:26	VanessaE	don't most IRC clients and servers warn you if you do?
09:26	celeron55	well, root is probably just a temporary hacked IoT device anyway
09:27	kaeza	or PuppyLinux
09:27	kaeza	you are always root there, unless you specifically go through hoops to set up the damn thig properly
09:27	kaeza	+n
09:36	red-000	or windows in a lot of common setups
09:37	celeron55	windows IRC clients don't tell it to the server
09:40	red-000	that was my ip
09:41	red-000	I was testing something
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12:17	juhdanad	#5186 is rebased, but I need help with pahole.
12:17	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5186 -- Soft node overlay by juhdanad
12:19	juhdanad	My problem is that I use Ubuntu, and the provided pahole has a bug and does not work with the built object files.
12:20	juhdanad	I also tried to build the patched version from source, but a required library is not available anymore.
12:20	juhdanad	So I can not test if the memory layout of TileLayer and TileSpec is correct.
12:25	VanessaE	pahole?
12:25	juhdanad	An utility program to find holes in the memory.
12:25	VanessaE	ok
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12:41	nerzhul	juhdanad, it's sofar who ask you to do that ?
12:43	juhdanad	He did not ask me. I wanted to do this because of this line comment: https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commit/93c1d511e3880acf15a656f1653ce5853dd1d362#diff-f44f50a96d13d2421bd5301b7511ee26R288
12:52	sfan5	can't your use a chroot or vm to use pahole
12:53	juhdanad	No. I can't compile it.
12:54	sfan5	yes that is why you should use a chroot with a different distro
13:04	Zeno`	If you have to try a different distro then the optimisation is bogus
13:05	Zeno`	actually that whole comment is bogus
13:05	juhdanad	Well, I guess the best would be to use tile spec references instead of memory copy...
13:05	Zeno`	that may be the case but it doesn't make the comment any more valid
13:05	Zeno`	wait
13:05	Zeno`	it's a pointer anyway :/
13:06	Zeno`	where is the memory copy?
13:08	juhdanad	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/blob/master/src/mapblock_mesh.cpp#L678
13:08	juhdanad	is an example
13:09	Zeno`	I don't like it. Optimising that way is bad
13:10	Zeno`	even worse, who knows what architecture this is being built on?
13:10	Zeno`	it's a bit crazy
13:11	kilbith	it's 50000% faster, Craig
13:12	Zeno`	if it's only 50000% it's not worth it
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13:12	juhdanad	But it won't be easy to use pointers everywhere, as some parts of the tile specs are modified (rotation, color)
13:12	Zeno`	juhdanad, huh?
13:13	juhdanad	What do you not understand?
13:13	Zeno`	Why you cannot modify an object that is pointed to
13:14	Zeno`	that's kind of the point of pointers :/
13:15	juhdanad	So currently a mapblock mesh contains lots of tile specs. These contain redundant information - texture, animation. So it would be better if these meshes only had pointers instead of tile spec copies.
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13:17	juhdanad	If you have a flat block with grass, it creates 16 copies of the grass node's tile spec: 16 times the texture pointer and animation data.
13:23	Zeno`	so remove the comment?
13:24	juhdanad	I don't think it should be removed, as now TileSpec is better optimized.
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13:24	Zeno`	It is?
13:25	agrecascino	uh
13:25	juhdanad	Yes, some holes were removed by sofar.
13:25	agrecascino	is anyone working on a client side lua implementation
13:26	Zeno`	I don't get it juhdanad
13:26	juhdanad	agrecasino: it is already implemented.
13:26	agrecascino	oh snap
13:26	Zeno`	anyway, will merge #5186 within 30 minutes
13:26	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5186 -- Soft node overlay by juhdanad
13:27	agrecascino	heh
13:29	agrecascino	so when did it like get implemented?
13:30	juhdanad	To sum up: sofar reorganized TileSpec so it requires less memory. Meanwhile my PR also changes TileSpec. The only problem is that I can not check for holes in my PR, so it might not be as optimal as possible.
13:31	juhdanad	agrecasino: #5088
13:31	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5088 -- Client side scripting/modding by nerzhul
13:32	agrecascino	cool!
13:32	juhdanad	also #5394
13:32	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5394 -- [CSM] Second Roadmap
13:32	agrecascino	uh
13:33	agrecascino	are like nametags modfiable via csm?
13:33	juhdanad	Not yet. There are no client side object references yet.
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13:34	agrecascino	rip
13:35	agrecascino	also
13:35	agrecascino	can the client communicate to the server
13:37	juhdanad	Not yet, but it is planned too.
13:37	agrecascino	uh
13:37	agrecascino	are there any plans yet
13:38	juhdanad	You can read the second roadmap for the plans.
13:38	juhdanad	Also you can help in coding if you want to.
13:39	agrecascino	i would but my c++ code always ends up as object spaghetti
13:39	agrecascino	but i was thinking, since my religion is wamp, what about wamp for messaging
13:41	juhdanad	something like #5390?
13:41	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5390 -- CSM: messaging channels
13:42	agrecascino	yes
13:42	agrecascino	with wamp as the implementation on the protocol level
13:42	agrecascino	because wamp
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13:58	Taoki	Thought I'd do my periodic asking for this question: Has any progress been made on shaders and graphics, including RBA's latest in-the-works codes?
13:59	Taoki	Or more specifically: Is there any hope of seeing any of the following features make it into master soon: Extruded (3D-fied) plantlike, bloom shader, depth-of-field shader?
13:59	Taoki	(those were the ones I was most interested in, and obviously still am)
14:02	juhdanad	There's only one enhancement I know of: undersampling.
14:02	Taoki	Interesting. Any screenshots?
14:02	juhdanad	#5057
14:02	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5057 -- Undersampling by numberZero
14:03	Taoki	Thanks
14:03	Taoki	Cool. Can help with offering a pixelated, Doom-like art style :)
14:05	Taoki	Woah... client-side Lua scripting is a thing now? Noticed it in one of the pull requests. Been away for quite some time it seems.
14:08	agrecascino	Taoki, yeah, i stopped paying attention around 8 months ago, for various reasons
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14:10	Calinou	Taoki: current undersampling kind of sucks because you can't set it to be filtered linearly
14:10		halt_ joined #minetest-dev
14:10	Taoki	Fair enough
14:10	Calinou	I'd like that for my 4K laptop, while I want Minetest to render at 1080p (else it's unplayable), I don't want it to be blocky
14:10	Calinou	the way it's implemented makes it non-trivial to implement that
14:14	agrecascino	uh, i have to ask
14:15	agrecascino	who thought it was a good idea to have 4k displays on laptops that can barely into 3d graphics at 1440p
14:15	Taoki	Heh. Also, I assume that to this day, a working implementation for VBO was still not achieved :P
14:15	Taoki	I think it's like, half a decade now since we're trying to get working VBO in master, for that essential performance improvement.
14:18	agrecascino	wait
14:18	Calinou	I think VBOs were merged? maybe enabled by default
14:18	agrecascino	i have to ask, if we aren't using vbos, what are we using?
14:18	Calinou	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/blob/master/minetest.conf.example#L329
14:18	Taoki	Calinou: That would be wonderful
14:18	Calinou	enabled by default, it seems
14:19	agrecascino	i'm pretty sure minetest doesn't use opengl 1.1
14:19	Taoki	agrecascino: Drawing by the CPU each frame, which was very slow
14:19	Calinou	it's been here for at least a year, according to Git blame
14:19	Taoki	Oh... amazing!
14:19	agrecascino	i mean
14:19	Calinou	agrecascino: Minetest uses whatever OpenGL is supported by the system
14:19	Taoki	Ok... might have forgotten then
14:19	Calinou	currently, I don't think any OpenGL 4.x features are used, although OpenGL 3.x may help in places, I don't remember
14:19	agrecascino	my current attempt at a game engine uses gl 1.1 interwhatever mode calls
14:20	agrecascino	but that's because opengl 3 is hard and a waste of time for me
14:20	Calinou	immediate mode (and thus, OpenGL 1.x) has been obsolete since like 10 years
14:21	agrecascino	just because it's obsolete doesn't mean it's not easy
14:21	Calinou	well, it's like using mysql_* functions in PHP, it shouldn't be done in 2017 :)
14:22	Calinou	and it's not like you can make anything good-looking with OpenGL 1.x anyway
14:22	Calinou	(barring pixel art games, which are their own thing)
14:22	agrecascino	obviously, but it's still super easy to use
14:24	agrecascino	my laziness succeeds my reason in decision making
14:28	Taoki	https://cloud.githubusercontent.com/assets/825418/25281686/c1c3319c-26b6-11e7-89ed-ccaafcc2b0c3.png Weird bug that just started happening on my machine.
14:28	Taoki	Reported it here for now: https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5631
14:33	agrecascino	Taoki, surprisingly pretty
14:34	Taoki	Still a bug, but true :P
14:34	agrecascino	uh
14:35	agrecascino	can client-side lua scripts play audio
14:36	Fixer	agrecascino: 4k on laptops is a myth, 99% own 1366*768 garbage
14:36	agrecascino	Fixer, it definitely exists
14:37	agrecascino	or at least, too high-res-for-the-laptop-hardware laptops exist
14:37	Fixer	i see even 1000 usd laptops has this 1366*768 garbage included...
14:37	Fixer	what a joke
14:38	agrecascino	ie: friend's laptop has like 2880xsomething screen
14:38	agrecascino	Fixer, it's even worse that most are TN panels
14:38	Fixer	yep
14:38	agrecascino	also
14:38	Fixer	TN 1366*768 garbage even on 1000+ usd laptop
14:38	agrecascino	minetest has endian issues
14:39	agrecascino	Fixer, i have a sager laptop with a 1080p screen
14:39	agrecascino	worst tn panel evr
14:39	agrecascino	ever*
14:39	agrecascino	it's 18 bit with dithering
14:39	agrecascino	the worst dithering i've ever seen
14:39	Zeno`	mine is true 1920x1080
14:39	agrecascino	to the point where dark grays produce weird line artifacts on the screen
14:40	agrecascino	in linux i can disable the dithering, and the artifacting goes away, but it's still pretty bad
14:40	Taoki	Perhaps client-side Lua also means a decent weather system. People tried doing particle weather in the past, but it sucked because you had to move a particle spawner on the server based on the player's position: The server lagged, rain would start dropping from another location.
14:40	Fixer	Taoki: that coloring bug could be related to that recent coloring changes
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14:41	Taoki	Fixer: If no one else is getting it, it could be because I use Mesa / RadeonSI
14:41	agrecascino	i want to see protracker in minetest
14:41	Taoki	Hopefully it won't be hard to debug and fix
14:41	agrecascino	or something that could read/write MOD files in minetest
14:41	Fixer	Taoki: what is your version? 1ffb180? What is server you connecting?
14:42	Taoki	Fixer: Latest Git master, local server (singleplayer game)
14:42	Fixer	Taoki: try yesterdays build
14:42	Taoki	Can I download it from somewhere else?
14:42	Fixer	Taoki: win/lin?
14:42	Taoki	Linux
14:43	agrecascino	maybe i can finally implement nametag fading and stuff in a sensible way
14:44	Taoki	That would be great
14:44	Zeno`	protracker is not as easy as you'd first think
14:44	Fixer	Taoki: you said you recompiled it, why can't you recompile one commit back, it is pretty easy?
14:44	Taoki	Also, have any thoughts been given on a pixelated large font, similar to Minecraft? Not to copy MC per say... just always wondered if that would look and feel better.
14:44	juhdanad	Taoki: maybe what you are seeing is #4986. Now it is possible to re-colorize nodes.
14:45	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/4986 -- Hardware node coloring by juhdanad
14:45	Taoki	Fixer: I guess I can try it, just don't wanna mess GIT up. What was the command to switch your local master back to a previous commit in it, but have that safely reverted once I do 'git pull' again?
14:45	Taoki	Fixer: Also, which commit in particular do you recommend I try?
14:45	Fixer	Taoki: i do it like this, go into /minetest and run: git checkout 2ad74a9
14:45	Fixer	Taoki: then compile it
14:46	Fixer	Taoki: after that you can go back by typing: git checkout master (if i remember correctly, if master does not work try head or origin)..
14:46	Fixer	go back to newest i mean
14:46	Fixer	i'm compiling engine right now
14:47	Taoki	Done... recompiling now against that commit
14:52	Taoki	Darn... it's recompiling everything. Might take a while
14:58	nore	might be related to #5555
14:58	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5555 -- Some kinds of nodes are now colorized when they should not be.
14:58	Taoki	Fixer: The problem no longer exists with that commit! So it is introduced after 2ad74a9e8b9da48aef62346de6cd55f304c6440d
14:58	Fixer	kek
14:59	Fixer	juhdanad: ^^^^
14:59	nore	Taoki: does your version have this commit? https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commit/6f641df8a52ccb84452a289416527e3d1a36621a
15:00	Taoki	nore: Possibly. Hard to tell and I need to run soon
15:00	Taoki	It seems the very latest commit has in fact introduced it
15:00	nore	ah, the node overlay?
15:03	Fixer	compiled, will check to
15:03	Fixer	o
15:03	juhdanad	I suppose you are playing on VanessaE's server.
15:05	juhdanad	Then the reason of the colored nodes is https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5555#issuecomment-293421136.
15:05	Fixer	juhdanad: i have the same problem, checking if in vanilla too
15:05	juhdanad	Testing...
15:05	Fixer	got crasjh
15:07	Fixer	juhdanad: confirmed on vanilla world https://i.imgur.com/qkzyGI2.png
15:07	Fixer	and crash on exit
15:08	juhdanad	I'm currently compiling, and will push a fix ASAP.
15:08	Taoki	Need to go now. Glad I could help to idenfity this... good luck on finding the cause, and thanks for the help!
15:08	Fixer	juhdanad: my config https://pastebin.com/raw/hUq3gZss
15:08	Fixer	juhdanad: do you need a backtrace for crash on exit?
15:08	Fixer	juhdanad: do you have crash when exiting from the world via menu?
15:09	juhdanad	No, for me the game works as it should.
15:10	Fixer	will get a backtrace then
15:17	juhdanad	Okay, with your config I see the miscolorization, but not the crash.
15:18	Fixer	juhdanad: join the world, type esc - click on quit the game
15:19	juhdanad	I get back to the menu.
15:19	Fixer	crap, i will post a backtrace anyway
15:40	juhdanad	I found the cause of miscolorization, fixing...
15:40	Fixer	backtrace of my crash https://pastebin.com/raw/84XS9fhP
15:40	Fixer	will post an issue
15:41	Fixer	0x00000000007470ab in CItemDefManager::~CItemDefManager (this=0xa862b90, __in_chrg=<optimized out>)
15:41	Fixer	at /media/sf_Exchange/minetest/build/minetest/src/itemdef.cpp:264
15:45	juhdanad	Fixer: could you change wieldmesh.cpp:441 to 'scene::SMesh *mesh = NULL;', please?
15:45	juhdanad	I hope it will fix the crash.
15:45	Fixer	yep
15:45	Fixer	will do
15:47	Fixer	compiling
15:51	Fixer	juhdanad: fixed the crash for me
15:52	juhdanad	Great!
15:52	juhdanad	There was an item which did not have an inventory image and was not a node. In this case the mesh pointer was not initialized.
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16:04	VanessaE	paramat: saw in the commit log, "Tools: Fix tool digging speed limit" ... reminded me, can someone please fix the digging speed on unknown nodes (so that it respects whatever tool is being used)?
16:09	juhdanad	#5633
16:09	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5633 -- Fix after soft node overlays by juhdanad
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16:40	red-000	are we banning all ip's oldcoder has control over?
16:41	VanessaE	ordinarily I would suggest doing so
16:41	red-000	it's one of his sites
16:42	Krock	am I not looking correct? where do all the ops come from?
16:42	Krock	opens logs
16:42	red-000	He used it to contact me before
16:42		longerstaff13 joined #minetest-dev
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16:43	VanessaE	Krock: celeron55 spread the ops around.
16:43	red-000	another one of his sites
16:44	* Krock	looks at sofar and wonders why he's so strongly opposed to OC
16:44	benrob0329	Did you read the logs?
16:46	sofar	no worries, it's hightly confusing what happened
16:48	juhdanad	I don't think that it is wise to ban him. I'm sure that he has done a lot for this community.
16:48	Krock	right, needs some time to filter out what's the actual problem. I wonder why he even came here
16:49	Krock	juhdanad, yes he did but it must not be a perma-ban. Also: I think it would only be applied on #-dev
16:57	red-000	yes
16:58	VanessaE	palemoon, the web browser?
16:58	red-000	yes
16:58	VanessaE	huh.
16:59	VanessaE	http://www.palemoon.org/
17:02	sofar	juhdanad: did you rebase your PR? I'll see if I can get the pahole output for you
17:03	juhdanad	sofer: yes, and it was merged too.
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17:03	juhdanad	*sofar
17:07		Hunterz joined #minetest-dev
17:11	sofar	juhdanad: I'll still look
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17:16	juhdanad	sofar: thank you!
17:17		Grandolf joined #minetest-dev
17:17	sfan5	merging #5633 since it's a trivial bugfix
17:17	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5633 -- Fix after soft node overlays by juhdanad
17:20	nerzhul	nice sfan5
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17:22	red-NaN	linked to another OC site
17:22	red-NaN	http://haggishell.com/
17:23	Grandolf	why are you banning everrything OldCoder?
17:23	garywhite	Who is 88.198.98.192?
17:23	red-NaN	Grandolf, he uses his servers to ban evade
17:24	Grandolf	why ban him?
17:24	VanessaE	Grandolf: he was banned for being extremely disruptive, then proceeded to evade the ban 2 or 3 times.
17:25	VanessaE	that's a re-bannable offense in most channels, and is probably against this network's usage rules as well.
17:25	red-NaN	^
17:25	Grandolf	when was this?
17:25	red-NaN	pretty sure you can get k-lined for that if you annoy the wrong people
17:25	VanessaE	earlier today.
17:25	VanessaE	http://irc.minetest.net/minetest-dev/2017-04-21
17:25	nerzhul	181 pr :(
17:25	VanessaE	nerzhul: they'll get whittled down soon enough
17:25	VanessaE	we are approaching feature-freeze after all
17:26	nerzhul	sfan5, can you look at #5621 it's fairly trivial too
17:26	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5621 -- Fix #5617 - respect message and reconnect parameters when shutting down immediately by orwell96
17:29	sfan5	nerzhul: lgtm
17:32	nerzhul	merged
17:32	nerzhul	ty
17:38	juhdanad	I was planning to create a 'save for older Minetest version' feature. What do you think? How should users access it?
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17:40	VanessaE	nerzhul: remember the thing I mentioned about minetest crashing on exit?
17:40		XtremeHacker joined #minetest-dev
17:40	VanessaE	(not related to the soft overlay issue)
17:41	VanessaE	it's not limited to singleplayer. I've got a client hung right now, just exited from doing a bunch of running around on my survival server. sorry I didn't think to run it in gdb
17:41	DS-minetest	(#5604 is also very trivial)
17:41	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5604 -- lua_api: Correct craft recipe param `type` to `method` by DS-Minetest
17:41	VanessaE	BAM, got gdb to attach to it
17:42	sfan5	it it a debug build?
17:42	VanessaE	and...it's a release build :-/
17:42	nerzhul	VanessaE, is this not related to the PR merged by sfan5 ?
17:42	VanessaE	http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/24428119/
17:42	sfan5	no that's something else i think
17:42	VanessaE	nerzhul: it is not. this is that crash bug I mentioned before the soft overlays went in
17:42	sfan5	looks like a deadlock to me
17:43	nerzhul	sfan5, yes
17:43	VanessaE	is that bt at all useful without debug symbols?
17:43	sfan5	yes
17:43	VanessaE	oh good.
17:43	sfan5	debug symbols "only" tell us which file & line
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17:43	sfan5	normal symbols are already better than nothing
17:44	sfan5	CurlFetchThread and the main thread (httpfetch stuff) seem to be waiting for eachother
17:44	VanessaE	er, why?
17:45	sfan5	that's the question
17:45	VanessaE	why is curl even getting involved in shutdown?
17:45	sfan5	curl threads need to exit
17:45	VanessaE	oh right
17:45	sfan5	cf. curl_parallel_limit = n in .conf
17:56	VanessaE	want anything else from this hung client before I kill it?
17:57	sfan5	nah
17:57	VanessaE	ok.
17:57	VanessaE	killed.
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17:59	VanessaE	bbl
18:04	ThomasMonroe	VanessaE, sfan5, sofar, rubenwardy, nore, red-NaN, i need to talk to you guys for a bit
18:04	ThomasMonroe	in private
18:05	sfan5	...to all of us?
18:05	red-NaN	diffrent channel?
18:05	ThomasMonroe	im making a channel right now, just wait a mom
18:05	red-NaN	just join one
18:05	red-NaN	and send everyone the name in a pm
18:16	Krock	ThomasMonroe, you're summoning quite many people there..
18:16	ThomasMonroe	ik Krock
18:16	nerzhul	you are privileged guys :p
18:17	nerzhul	maybe he will tell you that sofar insult me like the tell me this morning
18:17	nerzhul	he*
18:17	Krock	nerzhul, huh? could you please re-phrase that sentence?
18:18	nerzhul	this morning OC whisper me on IRC and told me sofar insult me in PM when he talked with him
18:18	nerzhul	(sorry for talking like a spaghetti :p)
18:18	Krock	ah okay. now I get it :)
18:18	sfan5	nerzhul: don't you mean baguette ;)
18:18	Krock	no, you're not italiano. only these guys can talk spaghetti
18:18	nerzhul	:p
18:18	nerzhul	lol
18:19	* Krock	imagines sfan5 talking like beer..
18:19	nerzhul	beer is belgium not german haha :D
18:19	sfan5	:/
18:20	Krock	oh really? but.. oktoberfest!
18:20	nerzhul	german is deustch kalidad :D
18:21	Krock	#5604 looks good but it's PITA to have both params used in our functions
18:21	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5604 -- lua_api: Correct craft recipe param `type` to `method` by DS-Minetest
18:21	Krock	would rather like to see a fix for the functions themselves first before starting with the documentation
18:21	benrob0329	#5586 is light stored in a signed int?
18:21	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5586 -- Add negative value for node light_source.
18:22	Krock	unsigned byte
18:22	benrob0329	Oh, nvm
18:23	benrob0329	How hard would it be to change to a signed byte?
18:24	sfan5	hard
18:24	benrob0329	is light source seperate from light level?
18:25	paramat	'stored' in what way, in the world database or as a light source parameter?
18:25	sfan5	doing this kind of change requires deep knowledge of the light system, which you don't seem to have; sorry
18:27	Krock	signed byte is nonsense, regarding how we store the light values right now: 4 bits for daylight, 4 bits for at night, thus light max = 15
18:27	Krock	alone in the backwards compability would be a challenge (to not forget anything)
18:28	DS-minetest	(also negative light is unrealistic)
18:28	Krock	> unrealistic > running with 20 n/s
18:29	paramat	mapnode light levels are positive, so using signed ints would mean we are using twice as much memory as we need to
18:29	Krock	btw, int16 or int32?
18:31	benrob0329	sfan5 true, I was thinking a negative source would simply subtract said light rather than add it, but from reading light.cpp/h this probably wouldn't be easy.
18:32	paramat	nope the lighting method is built around positive values, negative ones would not automatically work
18:33	paramat	so i'm closing the issue :]
18:33	benrob0329	The light value would remain the same, but light_source would change and extra clauses added
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18:34	Krock	that's not as simple as you may think
18:35	paramat	closed
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18:54	celeron55	the only change to the datatypes of the light system might be extending it to 16 bits total, but it might be completely hazardous to performance as light propagation is recursive and probably gets really expensive after something like 15 nodes
18:54	celeron55	the only remotely reasonable*
18:55	celeron55	well except for modifying of the meaning of the light banks a bit (which is already a PR?)
18:57	celeron55	(also, making mapnode larger from its current 4-byte size is probably also hazardous to performance)
18:58	celeron55	it would be nice if subgames or something could decide such performance tradeoffs but it's not really possible to implement anything like that
18:58	sfan5	should've used java
19:06	sofar	juhdanad: TileLayer holes are OK, it's not so bad
19:06	sofar	2 holes of 6 bytes, no big deal
19:06	sofar	it's 2 bytes larger than a cacheline though without the holes
19:06	sofar	so maybe we can save 2 bytes and get it in one cacheline?
19:07	sfan5	is it the same for AMD cpus or are we optimizing for intel only?
19:07	Hijiri	I don't think I've reviewbegged today yet: #5612
19:07	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5612 -- Allow overriding tool capabilities through itemstack metadata by raymoo
19:07	sofar	it's all 64bytes afaik
19:07	paramat	will merge #5623 in 2-3 hrs if no objections
19:07	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5623 -- Sneak glitch: Set default to false by paramat
19:08	sofar	sfan5: even if it would be e.g. 32 bytes, then you'd still be 3 instead of 2 cachelines
19:08	sfan5	hm, and ARM-based cpus?
19:08	sfan5	indeed
19:08	sofar	66 bytes for a struct is just a big overhead for those last 2 bytes
19:08	sfan5	i guess no chip designer is weird enough to have odd-sized cache line
19:08	sfan5	s
19:08	sofar	afaics arm is 64bytes cacheline as well
19:09	sofar	cat /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cache/index0/coherency_line_size
19:10	sofar	if we go to 16bit shader id's we can do it
19:11	sofar	or 16 bit texture ids
19:12	paramat	#5625 is trival mapgen stuff requested by zeno so will merge later once cleaned up and tested
19:12	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5625 -- Mgflat, Mgv7: Only create noise objects if needed by paramat
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19:47	* Fixer	.oO(please fix mod packs and mod loading in general)
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20:22	Fixer	I've noticed torches are no longer instamined, is that intentional?
20:23	sfan5	i don't think so
20:24	sfan5	caused by https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commit/858c72297409ca54092c3c908279d2a05fef58cd
20:25	Fixer	added issue in mtg https://github.com/minetest/minetest_game/issues/1706
20:25	sfan5	it looks like instant dig is no longer possible after that commit is that correct?
20:26	Fixer	i suspect that
20:28	Fixer	since just few builds ago it was ok
20:28	sfan5	i think i even approved that pr
20:28	sfan5	hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
20:30	Fixer	node is removed without tool wear after 0.15 seconds (torch)
20:30	Fixer	0.15 seconds? o_O
20:30	Fixer	it is quite visible
20:30	sofar	it's 10 frames
20:30	sofar	at 60fps
20:30	sfan5	what did the removed code do
20:31	sfan5	then
20:31	Fixer	it is quite annoying, since you need to hold the button a bit more than you really want %)
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20:43	Taoki	Wow... latest Git master has some very pretty mgv7 biomes. I assume the abstinence toward considering v7 incomplete is over by now :)
20:44		proller joined #minetest-dev
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20:46	sfan5	mgv7 is default since last release
20:46	paramat	happy you like it
20:46	red-NaN	could someone review #5492?
20:47	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5492 -- [CSM] Add local particles and particlespawners. by red-001
20:47		kilbith joined #minetest-dev
20:47	paramat	just need a new surface node and ferns for coniferous forest
20:48	nerzhul	particlespawner constructor is just crazy xD
20:49	juhdanad	paramat: for the /fixlight command, is "Resets lighting in the area between pos1 and pos2" a good description?
20:50	sfan5	red-NaN: can you please not fix the code style of entire files in your pr
20:50	sfan5	thanks
20:50	Taoki	Indeed I do
20:50	Taoki	Apparently however, Minetest constantly crashes
20:51	juhdanad	Taoki: when does it crash? When you exit the game?
20:52	Taoki	No... sometime randomly during the game
20:52	Taoki	And it's not a Lua crash to the main menu... engine crash
20:52	nerzhul	sfan5, as we don't change the particle code source very often, why not no ? :)
20:53	nerzhul	a memleak was introduced today juhdanad
20:53	nerzhul	in your PR
20:53	juhdanad	I know, but I already fixed it, sorry.
20:53	nerzhul	cppcheck showed me an error when i fetched before preparing my 5th PR on cppcheck performance fixes
20:53	nerzhul	temp_buf->append(v, mesh_buffer->getVertexCount(), indices,
20:53	nerzhul	mesh_buffer->getIndexCount()); ?
20:54	nerzhul	is this fixed ?
20:54	juhdanad	This is not, I will check.
20:54		goldenboy joined #minetest-dev
20:54	nerzhul	cppcheck reports
20:54	nerzhul	[src/mesh.cpp:409]: (error) Memory leak: temp_buf
20:54	nerzhul	[src/mesh.cpp:418]: (error) Memory leak: temp_buf
20:55	nerzhul	in EVT_STANDARD you returned temp_buf, it's fine
20:55	nerzhul	for others you return clone which is NULL because we never set it in the function
20:55	nerzhul	i think it's not normal i think no ?
20:55	nerzhul	also in this function the u16* case is unneeded
20:55	nerzhul	mesh_buffer->getIndices() is already u16*
20:56	nerzhul	please send us very fast a fixing PR
20:57		ThomasMonroe left #minetest-dev
20:58	juhdanad	I'll try.
21:02	Taoki	nerzhul: Is that related to my crash too?
21:02	juhdanad	If you use tangent vertices, probably yes.
21:02	nerzhul	i'm pretty sure
21:02	nerzhul	juhdanad, you hsould never return null i think ?
21:03	juhdanad	Yes, I intended to return at the end of each case.
21:03	Taoki	tangent vertices? Is that an option?
21:03	Taoki	But in any case, gladly awaiting a fix
21:05	juhdanad	nerzhul: how can I enforce Minetest to use tangent vertices?
21:06	nerzhul	no idea, use taoki world ?
21:07	nerzhul	if i look at the code
21:07	nerzhul	before temp_buf->drop(); was called
21:07	nerzhul	and dst_mesh added temp_buffer
21:08	nerzhul	in every case
21:08	nerzhul	and we returned clone
21:08	nerzhul	with your pr
21:08	nerzhul	dst_mesh was renamed clone
21:08	nerzhul	we never drop
21:08	nerzhul	and in the working case we return temp_buf
21:08	nerzhul	i think we should return temp_buf everytime and remove clone
21:08	nerzhul	or re_use dst_mesh with addMeshBuffer
21:09	nerzhul	juhdanad, https://lut.im/3LkJxDGyx4/we6bLDzXdltoTizg.png
21:10	nerzhul	Taoki, you can modify code right ?
21:10	nerzhul	and you crash is systematic, right ?
21:10	Taoki	Depends on what code. And it's random but consistend, happens unpredictably
21:11	nerzhul	it should be triggered on specific event using those vertices, how many time (mean) before it happens ?
21:12	Taoki	Not sure what you mean by times. It happens sometimes.
21:12	Taoki	Although I think it happened twice in the same point once
21:13	juhdanad	Okay, I enforced tangent vertices and I see the crash. Now I'll attempt to fix...
21:13	juhdanad	Taoki: probably an item's mesh causes the crash. Or a special node on the map.
21:14	Taoki	Makes sense. Glad you found a way to test
21:14	nerzhul	juhdanad, first remove clone and return the temp_buf (and rename it to another name if it's not temporary, or restore prvious behavour)
21:14	Taoki	I've been away from Minetest for a bit like I said... would have been harder, as I might have forgotten a few things
21:15	nerzhul	nore, be careful you merged this , i know the PR was very huge :(
21:15	nerzhul	when i will finished with CPPcheck fixes i think i will provide a PR to add a cppcheck verification to show the static errors found, without this a random crash + memleak could happen
21:16	nore	nerzhul: the soft node overlay? it was not me who merged it...
21:16	Taoki	777 MB of RAM. I don't think Minetest should be using that much...
21:16	Taoki	So might confirm the memleak as well
21:17	nerzhul	oh sorry nore, i misread github log you have same colors as juhanad :p
21:18	nore	lol :D (although not exactly, mine is more pink :p)
21:18	nore	no problem anyway :)
21:19	nerzhul	i will push #5635 after travis build pass, it will fix the master LINT problems (i think a merged PR branch was before lint) + some code style errors i introduced in previous cppcheck pr + some memory copy fix + constructor fix etc
21:19	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5635 -- Fix various performance issues reported by cppcheck + code style (CI) by nerzhul
21:20	nerzhul	and some ugly spaces added by juhdanad :p
21:20	nerzhul	"return dst_mesh;"
21:25	benrob0329	shouldn't clearobjects only remove item entities, and a clearentities command be added?
21:25	juhdanad	nerzhul: #5636
21:25	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5636 -- Fix a memory leak by juhdanad
21:26	nerzhul	assert before return if it should not happen
21:26	juhdanad	You mean 'assert(false)'?
21:26	nerzhul	also remove break after return, it's unreached
21:26	nerzhul	yes
21:26	juhdanad	Or rather with sanity_check?
21:26	nerzhul	sfan5, ?
21:27	nerzhul	what do you think ?
21:27	nerzhul	i think it's a pure devel error, it should not be reported to user in release mode ? i don't see how can that happen
21:28	nerzhul	you can use sanity_check yes, why not
21:32	sfan5	return null sounds fine to me
21:32	nerzhul	sfan5, you prefer a crash when using the object than an assertion for a unhandled switch case ?
21:33	nerzhul	i don't really know where this pointer will finish but it can be difficult to track
21:33	sfan5	then throw in a sanity_check(false);
21:33	juhdanad	cloning should be always successful.
21:34	nerzhul	yeah
21:34		sofar joined #minetest-dev
21:34	nerzhul	guys i found a very interesting Lua call !
21:34	nerzhul	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/blob/master/src/script/lua_api/l_server.cpp#L488
21:34	sofar	I've lost internet at home
21:34	nerzhul	maybe we can remove it no ?
21:34	nerzhul	i don't see any interest to have a lua call to trigger segfaults, zerodivision and exception
21:35	nerzhul	sapier told: "Catch some error situations when mod used without thinking about it"
21:35	nerzhul	wtf
21:35	nore	nerzhul: it's only these in debug builds and I guess it's there to check if error handling works well, probably?
21:35	juhdanad	nerzhul: updated.
21:36	nerzhul	nore i don't see how you want to handle a segfault :p
21:36	nore	ehm
21:36	sfan5	nerzhul: that function looks useless
21:36	nore	yeah, maybe remove it
21:36	nerzhul	sfan5, i will push a commit to remove it
21:36	sfan5	and clang does actually not allow you to cause a segfault by deref'ing a NULL pointer
21:37	nerzhul	exact
21:37	nerzhul	nore
21:37	nerzhul	note*
21:37	nerzhul	it's called in games/minimal/mods/errorhandler_test
21:37	nerzhul	i remove it ?
21:37	nerzhul	it's related to /exceptiontest in minimal
21:37	sfan5	yes
21:38	nerzhul	okay i will provide a trivial pr for this
21:39	Taoki	Found another bug BTW...
21:39	Taoki	Hit a mob once: Their model becomes white, but doesn't go back. Every time you hit an entity and damage it, it becomes whiter until you reconnect.
21:41	Hijiri	are you sure it's not a bug with the mod?
21:42	Taoki	Don't see how it could be, so yeah. I don't colorize entities or anything
21:42	Taoki	Although I used colorized mixed textures
21:43	Taoki	Appended with ^ in the texture string. But that's all
21:43	Hijiri	what does the code look like?
21:43	Hijiri	oh
21:43	Hijiri	no punch code?
21:43	Hijiri	that does sound like an engine bug then
21:44	juhdanad	I see it too, will investigate...
21:45	Taoki	Other than that, the glass_framed drawtype does some z-fighting, when you see the backface against a wall. That's really unimportant though, but just thought to mention
21:45	nerzhul	sfan5, sofar #5637 for this change
21:45	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5637 -- Remove lua crash triggering by nerzhul
21:47		sofar_ joined #minetest-dev
21:48		sofar joined #minetest-dev
21:49	paramat	juhdanad that seems ok to me
21:49	nerzhul	juhdanad, you should rebase :)
21:49	* sofar	kicks 45 min internet outage
21:50	nerzhul	and i will merge it after CI pass after rebase
21:51	juhdanad	nerzhul: you only removed (u16*) casts, right?
21:52	sofar	juhdanad: #5638
21:52	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5638 -- Reorder TileLayer. by sofar
21:52	nerzhul	yes
21:53	sofar	juhdanad: ideally, we shrink TileLayer 2 bytes, though!
21:54	juhdanad	sofar: sorry for not responding so long, there are a lot of bugfixes to do now...
21:54	paramat	Taoki tangent vertices is enabled when you use bumpmapping/normalmapping/parallax occlusion shaders
21:54	Taoki	paramat: Oh... I use those in that case
21:55	nore	sofar: I'll try to modify it not to copy things that are not needed
21:55	sofar	juhdanad: don't worry
21:55	nore	(i.e. you don't need to copy the whole vector, and copying a vector is probably expensive even if there is nothing in it)
21:56	sofar	nore: it's gonna be hard, maybe shrink shader_id to u16? but that comes from the protocol I think
21:56	nerzhul	copy an empty vector is not expensive as memory area is less than 8 bytes :)
21:56	nore	nerzhul: vector is already 24 bytes long, and I think it allocates another area for the new vector
21:56	nore	I mean the vector struct is 24 bytes long
21:57	juhdanad	nerzhul: rebased.
21:57	nore	including a pointer to data
21:57	nerzhul	nore, can you show me the code line ?
21:57	nerzhul	juhdanad, nice, i will merge it after CI
21:57	nerzhul	but CI seems very busy
21:58	nore	nerzhul: hmm, it's the animation vector is TileInfo that is now TileLayer I think
21:58	nore	*in
21:58	juhdanad	sofar: the alpha bits of the layer's color is not used currently.
21:58	juhdanad	That's 1 byte.
21:58	sofar	we need 2 bytes, and alignment :)
21:59		troller joined #minetest-dev
21:59	nore	alignment is more difficult
21:59	nerzhul	sofar, does that change really something at this moment as we have many other areas to improve ? :p
21:59	sofar	yes, this is a really hot struct in the client
22:00	nore	but anyway I'll try to modify the code to make it copy only what is needed, I think it would get the hot part to 20 bytes only
22:00	nore	so 2 of them would even fit in a single cache line
22:00	nerzhul	is the vector size dynamic or static ?
22:01	nore	(well, 3 if we didn't have these alignment restrictions)
22:01	nore	nerzhul: doesn't change for a fixed TileLayer, but size depends on the TileLayer
22:02	nore	(i.e static as does not change within each instance)
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22:08	juhdanad	nerzhul: I've found the reason why entities become continuously brighter when you punch them: it's a const reference.
22:08	Fixer	sfan5: funnily enough i have impression that tool dig speed was increased, for example diamond shovel or pickaxe
22:09	nerzhul	juhdanad, can you be more precise
22:10	nerzhul	i don't see why a const ref can trigger that
22:10	juhdanad	When some time has elapsed, the entity wants to return to its original texture.
22:10	juhdanad	Therefore, 'updateTextures(m_previous_texture_modifier)' is called.
22:10	nerzhul	okay, and ?
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22:11	juhdanad	Then it does: m_previous_texture_modifier = m_current_texture_modifier;
22:11	nerzhul	const ref just prevent copying the texture modified but it in updateTexture it's copyied, it's done
22:11	juhdanad	And m_current_texture_modifier = mod;
22:11	nerzhul	sorry but not relevant
22:12	nerzhul	mod is a reference to m_previous
22:12	juhdanad	Where mod is a reference to m_previous_texture_modifier.
22:12	nerzhul	and m_current_texture_mod = mod; copy the reference content
22:12	juhdanad	Bot mod was overwritten in the previous command.
22:12	nerzhul	m_previous_texture_modifier = m_current_texture_modifier;
22:12	nerzhul	m_current_texture_modifier = mod;
22:12	nerzhul	i think the problem is that
22:13	nerzhul	no ?
22:13	nerzhul	oh okay
22:13	nerzhul	i see
22:13	nerzhul	exact
22:13	nerzhul	we don't copy it, and we use it without swapping
22:13	nerzhul	anoying side effect
22:14	juhdanad	So the parameter there is not const, because you have a non-const pointer to it too.
22:14	nerzhul	i'm thinking about it, wait a minute :)
22:14	juhdanad	(at content_cao.cpp:1325)
22:14	nerzhul	if (mod != m_previous_texture_modifier)
22:14	nerzhul	m_previous_texture_modifier = m_current_texture_modifier;
22:15	nerzhul	that should do the trick
22:15	nerzhul	can you try it ?
22:16	juhdanad	Well, it works, but I don't understand yet why.
22:17	nerzhul	with my fix ?
22:17	juhdanad	Yes.
22:17	nerzhul	it's simple, if you set previous with current, when you set current to mod, current = previous = current => no change
22:18	nerzhul	but it's not the right fix i think
22:18	nerzhul	copy the string solve the problem, but it's not very elegant to cut the previous override, because previous is not current then
22:19	juhdanad	No. There are three different values there: the previous, the current and the next (mod) texture modifiers.
22:19	juhdanad	*No, it is not the right fix.
22:20	nerzhul	i'm searching if it's possible to keep the const ref benefit
22:20	nerzhul	i see how it's possible, jsut copy the variable before usage
22:21	juhdanad	But if you copy it, there is no point in sparing a copy.
22:21	nerzhul	in 2 usecase on, in 3 usecases yes
22:21	nerzhul	3 vs 3
22:21	nerzhul	then, rollback this sounds the only correct solution
22:22	nerzhul	very tricky bug
22:23	nerzhul	or we can do better
22:23	juhdanad	Maybe keep the const ref, but copy the string when you call the function with the member!
22:24	nerzhul	yeah i think about that
22:24	nerzhul	but no real benefit, another copy
22:25	juhdanad	No, there is a call 'updateTextures(m_current_texture_modifier + "^[brighten")'
22:25	nerzhul	yes u know, there is 3 calls like this, and three cases to member variables
22:26	nerzhul	https://pastebin.com/KckCCDr0 ?
22:26	nerzhul	swap if we are working on members, else do the regular way
22:26	sofar	https://gist.github.com/sofar/21b8d3b70a83103c9c0cb9bf59bbaf21 <== all Pahole output of minetest
22:27	nerzhul	sofar, i you want to pahole all minetest i think i will pass clang-format on all files, as it will do same thing on PR :p
22:27	nerzhul	(joke)
22:28	nerzhul	sofar, don't the compiler reorder things for CPU ?
22:28	juhdanad	nerzhul: looks good to me.
22:28	nerzhul	juhdanad, you tested it ?
22:28	juhdanad	Not yet, wait...
22:28	nerzhul	i'm waiting for travis on #5637 no problem :p i will merge it in 5 mins, travis will finish
22:28	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5637 -- Remove lua crash triggering by nerzhul
22:28	sofar	nerzhul: this is from the binary, and no, reordering doesn't happen except for initializers
22:29	nerzhul	sofar, it's strange that compiler doesn't try to make binary more efficient for their architecture
22:32	juhdanad	nerzhul: the first line should be: 'if (mod == m_current_texture_modifier) {', shouldn't it?
22:32	juhdanad	Unfortunately the patch doesn't work.
22:33	nerzhul	okay, i will just revert to a copy, we will see later
22:34	sofar	ItemDefinition is 6 cachelines of which 2.5 cachelines is just c_strings[32]
22:35	sofar	ContentFeatures is huge, lol
22:35	nerzhul	ContentFeature is a huge thing yes
22:35	nerzhul	i'm pushing a const ref revert on updateTextures
22:36	sofar	/* size: 4272, cachelines: 67, members: 57 */
22:36	sofar	67 ... 67 cachelines
22:36	sofar	it wastes half a cacheline on paddings and stuff
22:37	juhdanad	sofar: when I write f.light_source, then all 67 cachelines are loaded?
22:37	sofar	no, it doesn't work like that
22:38	sofar	it'll load the part of the struct that isn't in cache, in 64byte segments
22:38	sofar	for what is needed
22:38	nerzhul	sofar, ContentFeature is not very often updated it's write once in majority cases
22:38	juhdanad	Okay then! Fortunately ContentFeatures are passed as references.
22:38	nerzhul	juhdanad, i pushed the revert on master for this const ref
22:39	nerzhul	juhdanad, it was not the case everywhere 2 years ago :p hopeful Zeno` and me worked on removing that :p
22:39	nerzhul	this struct is very dangerous i think the copy constructor should be removed if possible when using C++11 to prevent bad usages :)
22:39	juhdanad	I'm sure Minetest became significantly faster when you did that.
22:39	sofar	nerzhul: is ContentFeatures read a lot in hot (render/mesh update) paths?
22:40	juhdanad	I only know it is read a lot at light updates.
22:40	sofar	the trick isn't to make it smaller per se
22:41	juhdanad	Oh, yes, mesh update also reads content features!
22:41	sofar	the trick is to put the hot items in it all together in a single cacheline
22:41	sofar	suppose that mesh and light update only need 10-15 items
22:41	sfan5	nerzhul: i think some of your fixed introduced this warning http://sprunge.us/YFQM
22:41	sofar	and now they're in 13 of the 67 cachelines
22:41	sofar	maybe we can make that 2 cachelines
22:42	sofar	and reduce memory pressure by a factor 5+
22:42	nerzhul	sfan5, why my compiler doesn't report it...
22:42	sfan5	clang 4.0 on arc
22:42	sfan5	h
22:42	sofar	which change?
22:42	nerzhul	i think my clion uses gcc atm instead of clang
22:43	juhdanad	Good night to everybody! I hope I successfully cleaned up everything after myself.
22:43	nerzhul	it was reseted when testing jsoncpp defaults heh, i switched, it's better now
22:43	nerzhul	okay i see, a cleanup to remove
22:43	nerzhul	oh no, just a const ref to re-link :)
22:44	nerzhul	it also permits to show gui::IGUIElement* m_parent; in guiFileSelectMenu warning, nice
22:44	nerzhul	lol
22:45	nerzhul	compilers are crazy
22:45	nerzhul	if you set m_parent(parent) in constructor it reports m_parent as unused
22:45	nerzhul	and if you do m_parent = parent in constructor it doesn't
22:46	nerzhul	i'm testing it and i will push the double warn fix
22:46	sofar	nerzhul: `class Client`
22:46	sofar	watch this
22:46	sofar	you won't believe this:
22:47	sofar	/* size: 134088, cachelines: 2096, members: 69 */
22:47	sofar	/* sum members: 2045, holes: 16, sum holes: 940 */
22:47	sofar	lmao
22:47	sofar	none of it is hot, though, I think
22:47	nerzhul	rah cmake reseting RUN_IN_PLACE when changing compiler
22:48	nerzhul	client is central but env is more used than client in terms of attributes
22:48	nerzhul	also client has a ClientEnvironment object inside it
22:49	sofar	that one actually sounds like a pahole bug
22:52	nerzhul	okay pushing a trivial fix for warning + guiFileSelectMenu header clean on unused attributes (never called anywhere)
22:53	nerzhul	pahole is not simple i think :)
22:54	sofar	using it right is hard
22:54	sofar	we stumbled on TileSpec being bad due to profiling
22:55	nerzhul	i also merge #5636 (travis is yellow, but C++11 build will finish soon and is not concerned by this change).
22:55	sofar	if the problem doesn't show in profiling it's probably not so bad
22:55	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5636 -- Fix a memory leak by juhdanad
22:56	nerzhul	i'm off, see you tomorrow guys, thanks for your help, and good luck sofar but don't forget we have 180 PR now (argh)
22:56	nerzhul	i don't know which project have the most PR/issues but: https://github.com/ansible/ansible >1000 pr :p
23:01	Fixer	!tell nerzhul I wonder if your building system can be used for making flatpaks... https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?f=42&t=15336
23:01	ShadowBot	Fixer: O.K.
23:22		paramat joined #minetest-dev
23:56	paramat	+1 for #5630 will merge later
23:56	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5630 -- Add /fixlight chat command by juhdanad
23:58	VanessaE	so it does something similar to worldedit's `//replace air air` trick?
23:59	nore	VanessaE: much more efficiently

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