| Time |
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| 02:59 |
paramat |
updated game#1541 |
| 02:59 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest_game/issues/1541 -- Textures: Darker, richer dirt texture by paramat |
| 03:02 |
VanessaE |
eck |
| 03:02 |
VanessaE |
no way |
| 03:02 |
VanessaE |
that dirt is way too dark |
| 03:02 |
VanessaE |
it looks almost wet |
| 03:09 |
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| 04:27 |
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| 04:28 |
paramat |
yeah dirt is one of those difficult textures, like grass. i'm wasting time maintaining a branch and PR when more experimentation is needed, i'll open an issue instead |
| 04:30 |
paramat |
sofar out of interest what's your opinion of game#1541 ? i'm about to close it |
| 04:30 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest_game/issues/1541 -- Textures: Darker, richer dirt texture by paramat |
| 04:33 |
paramat |
btw i updated game#1587 |
| 04:33 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest_game/issues/1587 -- Biomes: New surface node for rainforest by paramat |
| 05:01 |
paramat |
what do people think about adding krock as an mtgame dev? since he's active, has contributed quite a lot and has been around a long time |
| 05:01 |
paramat |
mtgame is understaffed |
| 05:07 |
sofar |
paramat: I kind of like it |
| 05:08 |
sofar |
it's fairly drastical though, but "weh weh weh" people hate change |
| 05:09 |
sofar |
tbh I think we should give up on doing textures one by one and just have a small team redo every single texture at once |
| 05:09 |
sofar |
2-3 people tops |
| 05:09 |
sofar |
and no external blocking votes |
| 05:17 |
paramat |
i think that would be good for a texture pack, but not for default textures, as contributors will want to submit their own textures for nodes, and if the texture is good and consistent i would disagree with insisting it is redone by someone else |
| 05:19 |
paramat |
people generally like the default textures we have, and they are good, there would be a lot of resistence to trashing the lot |
| 05:20 |
sofar |
no, you'd just ask the team to add new textures |
| 05:20 |
sofar |
and yeah, nothing bad about many textures |
| 05:21 |
sofar |
but, if you redo the style consistently, really, you have to throw it all out |
| 05:21 |
sofar |
no exception |
| 05:22 |
paramat |
my opinion of default textures made by various authors is that it is inevitably less consistent, but needed. texture packs can be (and are already) for small-team / single-artist consistent textures |
| 05:22 |
sofar |
seriously if you'd start to use mcresconvert and use some even half-assed texture pack for MC converted to MT, you just don't want to go back |
| 05:22 |
sofar |
it's so more pleasing and consistent |
| 05:23 |
sofar |
if you want to keep things ugly for old times sake, that's just a really bad proposition |
| 05:23 |
sofar |
I could care less about my code getting replaced with something better |
| 05:24 |
paramat |
i don't think default textures are that bad, i look at MT texture packs and usually i end up deciding that the default pack is the best we have |
| 05:24 |
sofar |
heck a large portion of textures is shamefully ripped from an actual artist |
| 05:24 |
sofar |
did you try pixelperfection? |
| 05:24 |
sofar |
isabella II? |
| 05:24 |
sofar |
hell even the default MC textures look like an eye opener in MT |
| 05:25 |
paramat |
our textures are not ugly |
| 05:25 |
sofar |
oh, yes they are |
| 05:25 |
sofar |
they're absolutely mediocre |
| 05:25 |
sofar |
they're inconsistent |
| 05:25 |
sofar |
they're not color coordinated |
| 05:25 |
sofar |
the contrast level is all over the place |
| 05:25 |
sofar |
and so is the saturation level |
| 05:27 |
sofar |
show it to an art minor student and they run away crying |
| 05:28 |
sofar |
anyway |
| 05:28 |
paramat |
hmm, it could be a new texture pack, once complete we could try it and decide to use it as default if it's generally better. then perhaps have the old textures as a shipped alternative pack |
| 05:29 |
paramat |
i think our textures are better than MCs even if less consistent |
| 05:29 |
sofar |
if only I could get some art students to do a project for school |
| 05:30 |
paramat |
well, it's a good idea, we need a variety of texture packs, this could be an official pack |
| 05:31 |
paramat |
i'm sure some would maintain the classic textures as an alternative official pack |
| 05:32 |
sofar |
find . -name '*.png' -exec cp {} ~/.minetest/textures/minetest-classic/ \; |
| 05:32 |
sofar |
there, maintained |
| 05:36 |
sofar |
is someone maintaining gambits textures? |
| 05:36 |
sofar |
hmm kilbith was for a while |
| 05:43 |
paramat |
lots of good textures there |
| 05:44 |
sofar |
the whole pack is good |
| 05:44 |
sofar |
I admit a few are odd ones out |
| 05:44 |
sofar |
but as a whole it's coherent, very |
| 05:44 |
paramat |
there are a few i can't stand |
| 05:48 |
sofar |
this is why I'm working on something else atm |
| 05:49 |
sofar |
can't make any radical progress without throwing out a dozen babies with bathwater |
| 05:54 |
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| 05:58 |
paramat |
we do need alternative subgames, and when made by 1 or a few people these can develop many times faster than mtgame does |
| 05:58 |
paramat |
free from the PR/review process |
| 05:59 |
paramat |
fewer authors means more artistic vision |
| 06:02 |
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| 06:11 |
paramat |
i somewhat feel that should be the subgame focus, mtgame work is difficult, being an artistic project with too many authors |
| 06:12 |
sofar |
the project I'm working on now sits at 285 commits and 7500 lines of lua code of which barely 1000 were borrowed I think |
| 06:13 |
sofar |
not to mention completely new sound and textures |
| 06:14 |
paramat |
excellent work |
| 06:14 |
paramat |
a variety of subgames has been requested for a long time |
| 06:14 |
paramat |
ideally i should make one too |
| 06:15 |
sofar |
this is technically not even a subgame project, lol |
| 06:21 |
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| 06:49 |
paramat |
#5316 |
| 06:49 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5316 -- Biomes: Add heat and humidity gradient parameters by paramat |
| 07:56 |
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| 07:57 |
celeron55 |
i agree that textures should be done by a team that actually knows how to do consistent artwork; is there any chance of that actually happening though, outside of just picking an independent texture pack and using it? |
| 08:00 |
celeron55 |
i don't really care though |
| 08:36 |
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kilbith joined #minetest-dev |
| 08:37 |
kilbith |
I'm unable to cross-compile MT with GCC-MinGW (arch) : https://hastebin.com/abekewixiq.txt |
| 08:37 |
kilbith |
using the buildbot script |
| 08:43 |
|
nerzhul joined #minetest-dev |
| 09:02 |
kilbith |
I really don't understand, yet I have set `export CC=i686-w64-mingw32-gcc` (same for g++) |
| 09:03 |
kilbith |
sfan5: any idea ? |
| 09:13 |
sofar |
I'm not seeing my minetest ever touch a remote media server O_o |
| 09:17 |
VanessaE |
curl support? |
| 09:18 |
sofar |
hmm |
| 09:18 |
sofar |
oh look there's 2 http download classes |
| 09:19 |
sofar |
I put a debug print in the http download setup |
| 09:19 |
sofar |
and it only ever downloads the master server list |
| 09:19 |
sofar |
no media at all, ever |
| 09:19 |
VanessaE |
weird. |
| 09:19 |
VanessaE |
clear the cache and try it on my server ? |
| 09:20 |
VanessaE |
I'm 100% certain it works there :) |
| 09:20 |
sofar |
cleared cache, nothing |
| 09:21 |
VanessaE |
huh. |
| 09:21 |
sofar |
wait, no new cache made? |
| 09:21 |
VanessaE |
? |
| 09:22 |
VanessaE |
I know it sounds obvious, but you're looking in the right place for it I assume? |
| 09:22 |
sofar |
I wiped ~/.minetest/cache |
| 09:22 |
VanessaE |
it's not there anymore. |
| 09:22 |
sofar |
it doesn't get recreated |
| 09:22 |
VanessaE |
it's in ~/.cache/minetest/ |
| 09:23 |
sofar |
*wipes* |
| 09:23 |
sofar |
500mb lmao |
| 09:23 |
VanessaE |
you've been getting around : |
| 09:23 |
VanessaE |
:) |
| 09:23 |
sofar |
AHHH there we go |
| 09:23 |
VanessaE |
I don't remember when that dir was moved but at least that worked :) |
| 09:24 |
sofar |
put 60mb of music and wanted to make sure it loads reasonably ok |
| 09:24 |
sofar |
(not) |
| 09:24 |
VanessaE |
hah! |
| 09:24 |
VanessaE |
10 minute download easy |
| 09:24 |
sofar |
2-3 minutes I estimate |
| 09:24 |
VanessaE |
(it takes about 5mins for Dreambuilder's media, which is I think around 30 MB) |
| 09:25 |
sofar |
done |
| 09:25 |
VanessaE |
sweet |
| 09:25 |
sofar |
about 2 |
| 09:25 |
VanessaE |
guess that works better now :) |
| 09:25 |
sofar |
not bad for 60mb of fantastic music |
| 09:25 |
VanessaE |
(shows you how long it's been since I last cleared my cache) |
| 09:25 |
sofar |
this subgame will rock with this music |
| 09:25 |
sofar |
anyway, I so, totally, need to get to bed now |
| 09:25 |
sofar |
:) |
| 09:25 |
* sofar |
vanishes |
| 09:26 |
* VanessaE |
throws flour on sofar |
| 09:26 |
VanessaE |
there, now you're visible again. |
| 09:51 |
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| 10:37 |
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| 10:53 |
nerzhul |
read<int>(L, -2) ? :) |
| 10:53 |
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| 11:13 |
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| 11:24 |
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| 11:27 |
glut32 |
Hi, I would like to compile minetest on MacOSX. I installed Xcode and CMake. And I would like to know wich compiler do you use for the MacOSX compilation with CMake? is it "Xcode" or "Unix Makefile"? |
| 11:28 |
sfan5 |
if you want to compile it using GNU "make" from the command like choose makefile |
| 11:28 |
sfan5 |
if you'd like xcode then choose that |
| 11:41 |
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| 12:08 |
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| 12:21 |
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| 12:22 |
nerzhul |
merging #5132 |
| 12:22 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5132 -- Bug in nodeboxes and collision check. And ghost slabs again, in version 0.4.15 |
| 12:22 |
nerzhul |
err #5312 |
| 12:22 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5312 -- Fixed spelling mistakes by Bond-009 |
| 12:28 |
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| 13:02 |
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| 13:31 |
glut32 |
thank you sfan5 ! |
| 13:33 |
glut32 |
I want to compile minetest on mac os x. I used "brew install ..." and I launch cmake (compiler = Xcode). And I have this error : "Could not find X11" when I click on configure on CMake. Does someone has a solution to fix this it? |
| 13:38 |
sfan5 |
it shouldn't be looking for x11 on mac |
| 13:44 |
glut32 |
could you send me your "CMakeCache.txt" file ? |
| 13:45 |
glut32 |
I think that a lot path will be the same cuz we use "brew install"? |
| 13:45 |
glut32 |
this is my email adress : mr.glut32 gmail.com |
| 13:45 |
sfan5 |
i don't have a mac |
| 14:03 |
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| 14:04 |
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| 14:09 |
glut32 |
ok. no problem |
| 14:10 |
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| 14:23 |
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| 14:25 |
glut32 |
I read the CMakeLists.txt file. You can read this : |
| 14:25 |
glut32 |
if(WIN32) |
| 14:25 |
glut32 |
... |
| 14:25 |
glut32 |
else() |
| 14:26 |
glut32 |
# Unix probably |
| 14:26 |
glut32 |
if(BUILD_CLIENT) |
| 14:26 |
glut32 |
find_package(X11 REQUIRED) |
| 14:26 |
glut32 |
... |
| 14:27 |
glut32 |
endif() |
| 14:27 |
glut32 |
It's strange |
| 14:41 |
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| 14:42 |
celeron55 |
none of the core developers have macs, you're pretty much on your own |
| 14:42 |
celeron55 |
remember to make a PR if something needs to be fixed |
| 14:46 |
sfan5 |
this searching for all the deps sucks anyway |
| 14:46 |
sfan5 |
it is only needed for static linking |
| 14:46 |
sfan5 |
the whole section from if(BUILD_CLIENT) to endif(BUILD_CLIENT) can just be omitted |
| 14:47 |
sfan5 |
if responsibility of specifying deps in case of static linking is moved to whoever is compiling mt |
| 14:48 |
sfan5 |
glut32: you can comment out the find_package for X11, Xxf86vm, jpeg, bzip2 & png |
| 15:02 |
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| 15:18 |
glut32 |
thank you again sfan! the project compiles on xcode but doesnt work. porting::share_path is not valid on mac os x. I'm investigating this now |
| 15:18 |
sofar |
glut32: congratulations, you are now the mac port maintainer |
| 15:20 |
glut32 |
ha ha |
| 15:21 |
glut32 |
* porting::path_share |
| 15:21 |
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| 15:22 |
octacian |
Seeing as I'm implementing both a workbench and a nametag to rename items, I'm wondering if I should keep the ability to name nametags with their own formspecs show on_use. What do you guys thing? |
| 15:27 |
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| 15:38 |
sofar |
octacian: what's the use of the nametag item if the workbench does all the complex work? |
| 15:38 |
octacian |
Yeah, that's what I decided. |
| 15:39 |
octacian |
Right now I'm just fighting with getting the workbench to show the name of the item when I move it from the output slot back to the input slot. |
| 15:39 |
sofar |
you'd still want a consumable though |
| 15:39 |
octacian |
I'm not sure how I can get the description of an item with on_metadata_inventory_move |
| 15:40 |
octacian |
Apparently local stack = inv:get_stack(from_list, from_index) doesn't work |
| 15:40 |
octacian |
But, up in allow_metadata_inventory_move, inv:get_stack(from_list, from_index) does work |
| 15:40 |
octacian |
..which is a bit confusing. |
| 15:42 |
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| 15:45 |
octacian |
All I have left though, is to fix that issue and clean up some code. |
| 15:47 |
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| 15:52 |
octacian |
sofar: the nametag is the consumable. One is used with each renaming. |
| 15:52 |
halt_ |
Hey anyone know what a PC would need to run a minetest server? |
| 15:53 |
octacian |
halt_: it'd be better to ask in #minetest |
| 15:53 |
halt_ |
K |
| 16:10 |
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| 16:11 |
nerzhul |
halt_: i suggest to have a bi xeon x6 + 64GB ram |
| 16:11 |
nerzhul |
MT have memleak and we don't want to fix it, also please use systemd to respawn your service after a OOM kill :p |
| 16:11 |
nerzhul |
*joke* |
| 16:17 |
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| 20:11 |
nerzhul |
we will need to switch from sha1 to sha256 guys |
| 20:14 |
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| 20:14 |
est31 |
why |
| 20:14 |
est31 |
we dont use it for any cryptographic purpose |
| 20:15 |
est31 |
and in SRP its meaningless which hash is used |
| 20:15 |
est31 |
we could use MD5 too |
| 20:15 |
sfan5 |
huh srp uses a hash? |
| 20:15 |
est31 |
yes |
| 20:15 |
est31 |
I mean, weak collision resistance is not what you want from a password hash |
| 20:15 |
est31 |
as long as preimage attacks are not feasible, its perfectly usable to use sha1 |
| 20:16 |
est31 |
(of course, you can say you should use scrypt/bcrypt instead but this will just mean a constant factor) |
| 20:17 |
est31 |
we also use sha1 for media files |
| 20:17 |
est31 |
I dont see any problems in its use either |
| 20:17 |
est31 |
again, we could have used md5 as well and nothing would have went wrong |
| 20:18 |
nerzhul |
est31, collision between client files |
| 20:18 |
nerzhul |
we use a sha1 to know the unique file |
| 20:18 |
est31 |
yes, and? |
| 20:19 |
nerzhul |
if two files have the same sha1 your client will just be crazy |
| 20:19 |
est31 |
nerzhul: do you know the difference between collision attacks, and second preimage attacks |
| 20:19 |
sfan5 |
google's thingy allows everyone to create two colliding pdf files |
| 20:19 |
sfan5 |
but i don't see how that is a problem |
| 20:19 |
sfan5 |
we don't deal with pdfs |
| 20:19 |
est31 |
yeah |
| 20:20 |
nerzhul |
it could be extended to other format like images no ? |
| 20:20 |
est31 |
yes |
| 20:20 |
nerzhul |
and minetest have images, no ? |
| 20:20 |
est31 |
yes, so you will see a wrong image, is that any bad? |
| 20:20 |
sfan5 |
it's a theoretical attack until someone actually does it |
| 20:20 |
sfan5 |
which is estimated to cost like $600k |
| 20:20 |
nerzhul |
est31, yes it's bad as it's the wrong image and also could be a rogue image |
| 20:21 |
est31 |
nerzhul: but you'd have to download that image first |
| 20:21 |
est31 |
I mean minetest already now bases on the concept that the network between client and server is to be trusted |
| 20:21 |
est31 |
unless we do encryption ofc |
| 20:22 |
nerzhul |
it's wrong to trust client <=> server without encryption |
| 20:22 |
sfan5 |
obviously it is |
| 20:23 |
est31 |
nerzhul: if the server wants you to send a malicious image, it can send you one already now |
| 20:23 |
nerzhul |
base on that concept is wrong and you can send colliding rogue files to clients |
| 20:23 |
est31 |
there is nothing preventing it from that |
| 20:23 |
nerzhul |
because we use UDP |
| 20:23 |
nerzhul |
:) |
| 20:23 |
est31 |
server can send all kinds of shit |
| 20:23 |
sfan5 |
you don't need a sha1 collision for that |
| 20:23 |
est31 |
^ |
| 20:23 |
nerzhul |
sfan5, ofc yes, but why not protect against that ? :) |
| 20:23 |
sfan5 |
this is a game not a banking app |
| 20:24 |
nerzhul |
sfan5, i think you didn't see banking app code |
| 20:24 |
sfan5 |
:D |
| 20:24 |
est31 |
:P |
| 20:24 |
nerzhul |
the only reason why bank are secure is nobody understand all the infrastructure and code :p |
| 20:25 |
nerzhul |
i change the topic but #5088 needs to be merged at a point |
| 20:25 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5088 -- Client side scripting/modding by nerzhul |
| 20:25 |
nerzhul |
i will not lost many time to rebase just for rebase as the API is now stable and secure, only requires a CSM store out of this PR and more callbacks |
| 20:56 |
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Calinou joined #minetest-dev |
