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| 13:45 |
juhdanad |
Hi all! |
| 13:46 |
Krock |
hi |
| 13:46 |
juhdanad |
I think Minecraft will also use palette coloring soon: https://twitter.com/jeb_/status/823564611169484802 |
| 13:48 |
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| 13:49 |
Krock |
uhm.. what's so special about it? I mean, instead of using 1000 different nodes it uses param2 or similar |
| 13:49 |
Krock |
but the memory amount is still the same |
| 13:50 |
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| 13:50 |
juhdanad |
Well... true. |
| 13:52 |
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| 13:57 |
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| 13:57 |
Wuzzy |
i noticed something interesting about minetest.rotate_node and minetest.place_and_rotate |
| 13:58 |
Wuzzy |
the node can have many many different orientations after this. this may be counter-productive for pillar-like nodes |
| 13:58 |
Wuzzy |
i noticed this when making MineClone 2 |
| 13:58 |
Wuzzy |
i kinda solved the problem for myself, but i want to discuss |
| 13:59 |
Wuzzy |
Problem: Rotating a pillar-shaped node (like Tree in Minetest Game) after placing it |
| 13:59 |
Wuzzy |
Naive solution: on_place=minetest.rotate_node |
| 14:00 |
Wuzzy |
It *seems* to work, but the devil lies in the details |
| 14:00 |
Wuzzy |
as long as the texture mirrors perfectly, nobody notices the problem |
| 14:00 |
Wuzzy |
but if it doesnt, strange things happen (screenshot coming soon) |
| 14:04 |
Wuzzy |
Screenshot: https://i.imgur.com/dRqrB0n.png |
| 14:05 |
Wuzzy |
the tree nodes and the pillar were placed first by looking into one direction, then into the other |
| 14:05 |
Wuzzy |
My solution in MineClone 2 was to write my own minetest.place_and_rotate replacement which is basically just a simplified version |
| 14:06 |
Wuzzy |
this function forces the node to only have 3 possible rotations, one for each of the axes (X, Y, Z) |
| 14:06 |
Wuzzy |
because this is really all a pillar actually needs |
| 14:08 |
Wuzzy |
btw the exact same rotation issue happens in Minetest Game as well, it is just very hard to notice because of the textures |
| 14:10 |
Wuzzy |
Proof I'm not making this up: |
| 14:10 |
Wuzzy |
https://i.imgur.com/N73mWLX.png |
| 14:11 |
Wuzzy |
again, the same as in MineClone 2, but harder to notice |
| 14:14 |
paramat |
well, just make sure to place these nodes while facing one direction, this is correct behaviour and rotation would break for many other nodes otherwise |
| 14:14 |
Krock |
Wuzzy, nice 18-liner streak |
| 14:14 |
celeron55 |
all the rotations are obviously needed for things that aren't pillars |
| 14:14 |
Wuzzy |
yes, but pillars/trees are common use cases |
| 14:15 |
celeron55 |
but maybe there could be a minetest.place_and_rotate_pillar or something, if that's a common use case |
| 14:15 |
Wuzzy |
Yes! |
| 14:15 |
Wuzzy |
exactly :) |
| 14:15 |
paramat |
yeah |
| 14:15 |
Wuzzy |
the other function can stay untouched IMO, but a pillar function would be useful |
| 14:16 |
paramat |
but still, those placing pillars may want a particular texture rotation |
| 14:16 |
Wuzzy |
i already made one for MineClone 2 because I didnt want to wait for an engine update (:P) : |
| 14:16 |
Wuzzy |
paramat, not for pillars like these: https://i.imgur.com/dRqrB0n.png |
| 14:16 |
Wuzzy |
here it is a very good idea to force 3 axes |
| 14:17 |
Wuzzy |
of course, at the end the modder decides whther to use full rotation or only pillar rotation |
| 14:17 |
Wuzzy |
my point is that both should be possible without hacks ;-) |
| 14:17 |
paramat |
a player may want the shadowing to be lower-right instead of upper-left |
| 14:17 |
VanessaE |
Wuzzy: https://github.com/minetest-mods/homedecor_modpack/blob/master/homedecor/init.lua#L66-L91 |
| 14:18 |
VanessaE |
maybe one of those functions can be adapted to your needs? |
| 14:18 |
Wuzzy |
meh, this is not worth the trouble, it makes building pillars very annoying imo |
| 14:18 |
Wuzzy |
for some pillars you are absolutely right but not for the purpur pillar i showed in creenshot |
| 14:18 |
VanessaE |
(of course those are geared toward wallmounted nodes, but it should be trivial to make the code do plain facedir) |
| 14:19 |
Wuzzy |
Fun fact: I already hacked-together my variant of minetest.rotate_node |
| 14:19 |
Wuzzy |
http://repo.or.cz/MineClone/MineClone2.git/blob/HEAD:/mods/mcl_util/init.lua |
| 14:19 |
Wuzzy |
I wonder what your opinions/thoughts on this are |
| 14:19 |
Wuzzy |
maybe not perfect for Minetest inclusion, but it does the job |
| 14:20 |
Wuzzy |
but I would like to see something along the lines of this function in builtin :) |
| 14:21 |
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| 14:21 |
Wuzzy |
Minetest Game should also use this function for trees and cactus because of the ugly cut lines (https://i.imgur.com/N73mWLX.png) |
| 14:23 |
paramat |
that's builder error |
| 14:26 |
Wuzzy |
lol... |
| 14:26 |
paramat |
but good points |
| 14:26 |
Wuzzy |
well, in Minetest Game the player can always change the rotation afterwards |
| 14:26 |
Wuzzy |
rotate_node is about the INITIAL rotation |
| 14:27 |
Wuzzy |
allowing all facedirs on placement may seem like more creative freedom, but it makes building pillars also much more annoying because it gives more possibilities to screw up |
| 14:28 |
Wuzzy |
e.g. if you want to place a pillar and start from the ceiling, then want to “match†it with the a part of the pillar you built at the bottom, you already screwed up |
| 14:28 |
Wuzzy |
now you're forced to either tear down the pillar or to waste a screwdriver |
| 14:28 |
Wuzzy |
by forcing a sane default orientation, you can easily build with less chances to screw up. its about convenience imo |
| 14:29 |
Wuzzy |
Anyways, i actually want to know opinions on this: |
| 14:29 |
Wuzzy |
http://repo.or.cz/MineClone/MineClone2.git/blob/HEAD:/mods/mcl_util/init.lua |
| 14:29 |
paramat |
the screwdriver can also be an argument for not needing pillar-rotate |
| 14:29 |
Wuzzy |
what do you mean? |
| 14:29 |
paramat |
players will learn to build a column in one direction only |
| 14:30 |
Wuzzy |
its still less convenient, even if you know it |
| 14:30 |
paramat |
i prefer to assume the face-direction rotation is intentional instead of assuming rotation should be restricted |
| 14:31 |
Wuzzy |
well this is basically Minetest Game talk, then. would a function like mcl_util.rotate_axis_and_place have any chance to be in builtin? |
| 14:31 |
paramat |
yes it has a chance |
| 14:31 |
Wuzzy |
yay |
| 14:32 |
Wuzzy |
anything bad about it? |
| 14:32 |
Wuzzy |
it sure is redundant as hell xD |
| 14:32 |
Wuzzy |
repeats lots of code |
| 14:32 |
Wuzzy |
but u would be in general OK by adding a completely sepearate “utility†function? cool |
| 14:33 |
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| 14:33 |
paramat |
personally i'm unsure but others may like it |
| 14:35 |
Wuzzy |
ok, back to my rotation argument. I summarize: SANE default rotation (3 axes) after placement with few chances to screw up. For advanced rotation: use screwdriver. Everyone = happy. :-) |
| 14:35 |
VanessaE |
I can see wuzzy's argument for tree and other column placement, actually. I've had the same "problem" from time to time as well. |
| 14:35 |
VanessaE |
it IS a little annoying not being able to line up two ends of a column without the help of the screwdriver. |
| 14:37 |
Wuzzy |
Besides, Personally I would be also happy to put common functionality into Minetest, instead of hiding all interesting hacks away in a subgame. ;-) |
| 14:39 |
paramat |
it would make sense for the cactus texture because that has shadows under the spikes, you would want those shadows always downwards |
| 14:39 |
paramat |
jungletree also has a shadow orientation |
| 14:40 |
paramat |
it's somewhat dependent on texture pack |
| 14:42 |
VanessaE |
and anyway, Wuzzy if it were up to me, your idea should be implemented as another orient_flag on minetest.rotate_and_place |
| 14:42 |
VanessaE |
e.g. something like "force_simple_facedir = true" or whatever |
| 14:44 |
VanessaE |
or force_three_dir maybe |
| 14:44 |
paramat |
when someone makes a column side-texture they tend to make shadows go downwards, you would want that orientation to be preserved |
| 14:44 |
VanessaE |
yes. |
| 14:44 |
paramat |
.. however you build |
| 14:45 |
VanessaE |
so I could see the flag in question always rotating the placed node to one of three specific facedirs, to match Wuzzy's need |
| 14:45 |
Wuzzy |
orient_flag... thats an excellent idea |
| 14:45 |
Wuzzy |
i wasnt happy with basically copying 90% of the existing function anyway |
| 14:46 |
Wuzzy |
not ust Wuzzy's need. i'm sure many other subgame authors would also want simple pillar rotation |
| 14:46 |
VanessaE |
just speaking in context :) |
| 14:46 |
Wuzzy |
otherwise i wouldnt be here |
| 14:47 |
Wuzzy |
paramat: You finally hit the nail on the head!!! :D |
| 14:47 |
paramat |
currently cactus and tree trunks have 'on_place = minetest.rotate_node' |
| 14:47 |
paramat |
this could then use a new function |
| 14:48 |
VanessaE |
paramat: rotate_node() is just a shortcut to rotate_and_place() with a couple of flags preset |
| 14:48 |
Wuzzy |
yes, once the new function is in MT, the Minetest Game change is easy as pie |
| 14:48 |
VanessaE |
so a whole new function really isn't needed, imho |
| 14:48 |
Wuzzy |
just need another wrapper |
| 14:48 |
Wuzzy |
new function aka new functionality... lol |
| 14:49 |
paramat |
ok |
| 14:52 |
VanessaE |
I suppose so |
| 15:04 |
Fixer |
i have a problem |
| 15:04 |
Fixer |
/giveme cloud, can't mine it back |
| 15:04 |
VanessaE |
you always have a problem :) |
| 15:05 |
VanessaE |
that's a known issue |
| 15:05 |
VanessaE |
a maptools admin pick should be able to remove it. |
| 15:05 |
VanessaE |
(why does that node still even exist?) |
| 15:05 |
Fixer |
compatibility? |
| 15:06 |
VanessaE |
with? |
| 15:06 |
Fixer |
iirc 0.2.2011 also had it, but didnot use it |
| 15:06 |
Fixer |
yes |
| 15:07 |
Fixer |
nobody used it tbh |
| 15:08 |
VanessaE |
you can't get it without /give, can't dig it, and no recipes use it that I've ever heard of. |
| 15:08 |
VanessaE |
imho that's a candidate for deletion |
| 15:08 |
VanessaE |
(or at least, relegate it to 'minimal' and take it out of mt_game) |
| 15:09 |
Thomas-S |
Could someone please review game#1559 ? As soon as this PR is merged, I can work on a few other PRs that make use of the new function. Thanks in advance! |
| 15:09 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest_game/issues/1559 -- Globalize and rename has_locked_chest_privilege by Thomas--S |
| 15:09 |
Fixer |
VanessaE: maybe it is used for current clouds? |
| 15:10 |
VanessaE |
nope |
| 15:10 |
VanessaE |
current clouds are rendered |
| 15:11 |
red-001 |
VanessaE, it seems to be really hard to remove nodes |
| 15:12 |
red-001 |
both cloud and footsteps are unused nodes |
| 15:12 |
VanessaE |
actually footsteps are used in some mods |
| 15:12 |
red-001 |
yes mods |
| 15:13 |
red-001 |
cloud is probably also used by some mod |
| 15:13 |
Thomas-S |
If I remember correctly, there is some meteorite mod that uses the cloud node |
| 15:14 |
VanessaE |
in my entire mods archive (747MB worth), there's only two uses, and in both cases, it's bring redefined anyway |
| 15:14 |
VanessaE |
a couple of things use its texture |
| 15:14 |
red-001 |
what about foot steps? |
| 15:15 |
VanessaE |
quite a number of results for that |
| 15:15 |
red-001 |
skyblock uses cloud |
| 15:15 |
VanessaE |
mostly stuff using the texture or the sound |
| 15:15 |
VanessaE |
oh yes, I forgot about that |
| 15:15 |
VanessaE |
well I guess it stays :) |
| 15:16 |
Fixer |
cloud in 2011: http://pastebin.com/raw/ME6umBDK |
| 15:16 |
red-001 |
/ just something |
| 15:16 |
red-001 |
} |
| 15:32 |
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| 15:33 |
paramat |
'dirt with grass footsteps' is very probably present in some maps, 'cloud' too |
| 15:34 |
paramat |
i use the footsteps texture overlay in my 'trail' mod |
| 15:34 |
Fixer |
i think you use cloud in that spherical planet mod |
| 15:34 |
Fixer |
flexsmth |
| 15:34 |
paramat |
no i always use mod nodes for clouds |
| 15:35 |
paramat |
flexrealm |
| 15:35 |
Fixer |
default:cloud |
| 15:35 |
Fixer |
yes |
| 15:35 |
Fixer |
paramat: could you please add cone like planet? to emulate climbing a huge mountain? (offtopic) |
| 15:36 |
paramat |
hm you asked but i'm not interested |
| 15:36 |
Fixer |
ok |
| 15:37 |
paramat |
(or not interested enough) |
| 15:38 |
Fixer |
i've opened an issue anyway long ago (so i'm fine) |
| 15:38 |
paramat |
Wuzzy so 3 rotations with the node top either facing Y+ X+ Z+ |
| 15:41 |
paramat |
sorry it took me a while to realise it's a good idea |
| 15:44 |
VanessaE |
paramat: precisely that, yes |
| 15:45 |
VanessaE |
(with the screwdriver being able to override that after the fact, if needed) |
| 16:10 |
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| 17:18 |
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| 18:06 |
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| 18:23 |
paramat |
please can anyone review #4682 ? looks good to me. this is high priority as it's the 1st half of fixing all lighting bugs |
| 18:23 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/4682 -- Fix water flooding onto lava by juhdanad |
| 18:44 |
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| 20:02 |
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| 20:27 |
paramat |
#5215 just seen that firelike drawtype also has 'visual scale' applied twice, here's the fix, very similar PR to the one for plantlike |
| 20:27 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5215 -- Firelike drawtype: Fix visual_scale being applied squared by paramat |
| 20:38 |
paramat |
also, amusingly, i forgot to update visual scale values in mtgame *=/ |
| 20:42 |
paramat |
i have that done tonight |
| 20:43 |
paramat |
since 5215 is near-identical to the PR for plantlike, and since it's less controversial, i'll merge later (2hrs) if no objections |
| 20:46 |
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| 21:06 |
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| 21:11 |
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| 21:22 |
paramat |
i'll also merge #4052 later |
| 21:22 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/4052 -- add minetest.get_last_run_mod to lua_api.txt by HybridDog |
| 21:23 |
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| 21:39 |
rubenwardy |
what's the use of that? |
| 21:40 |
paramat |
no idea |
| 21:41 |
paramat |
what do you think about merging this? |
| 21:41 |
paramat |
i'm neutral |
| 21:45 |
paramat |
i won't merge it then for now |
| 21:46 |
celeron55 |
some functions can be internal to core; is this one of those? |
| 21:46 |
celeron55 |
better not put it in lua_api.txt if it's not intended for use by mods |
| 21:51 |
paramat |
not sure but comments suggest internal, |
| 21:51 |
paramat |
i won't merge it |
| 21:55 |
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| 22:15 |
paramat |
#5215 updated and simplified |
| 22:15 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5215 -- Firelike drawtype: Fix visual_scale being applied squared by paramat |
| 22:37 |
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| 22:47 |
paramat |
#5199 will merge this later |
| 22:47 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5199 -- Footsteps: Fix offset footstep and shallow water sound bugs by paramat |
| 22:55 |
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| 23:11 |
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| 23:13 |
paramat |
game#1562 |
| 23:13 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest_game/issues/1562 -- Visual scale: Update plantlike nodes to post-bugfix values by paramat |
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