| Time |
Nick |
Message |
| 00:02 |
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| 00:03 |
Niebieski |
!seen zat |
| 00:03 |
ShadowBot |
Niebieski: I haven't seen zat in #minetest-dev. |
| 00:09 |
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| 03:02 |
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| 03:35 |
est31 |
paramat, don't forget to inform all devs of feature freeze dates. e.g. set the topic: do something like /msg ChanServ TOPIC #minetest bla bla |
| 03:35 |
paramat |
ok |
| 03:36 |
est31 |
sofar i keep my mtgame contributions near-minimal, so you dont have to wait for me to replace ABMs with LBMs :) |
| 03:37 |
paramat |
hm #3605 is mergeable? |
| 03:37 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/3605 -- Play tool breaking sounds. by sofar |
| 03:38 |
est31 |
lots and lots of discussion |
| 03:38 |
paramat |
and just found #3652 which has 2 approvals |
| 03:38 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/3652 -- Update Android depends, -O3 optimization, remove old arm config by MoNTE48 |
| 03:39 |
est31 |
when did it get its second approval |
| 03:39 |
est31 |
aha... |
| 03:39 |
est31 |
I think I'll merge that |
| 03:39 |
est31 |
first I test whether android still works with it... |
| 03:46 |
est31 |
hehe its already outdated |
| 03:46 |
est31 |
there is openssl 1.0.2g lol |
| 03:47 |
paramat |
as you can see i've added 'one approval' 'two approvals' labels. if a PR is authored by a core dev perhaps that can be automatically counted as one approval? |
| 03:48 |
est31 |
there was discussion about it in the past |
| 03:48 |
est31 |
whether dev being author counts as approval |
| 03:48 |
est31 |
I was on the side of people giving the author the approval badge :) |
| 03:49 |
est31 |
man that was shit english |
| 03:49 |
paramat |
yeah many PRs are merged on author plus one approval, so .. |
| 03:49 |
est31 |
I favoured counting the author as approval * |
| 03:50 |
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| 03:53 |
est31 |
I feel this PR is a bit inpolite against sapier |
| 03:53 |
est31 |
because he proposed the same change as well |
| 03:53 |
est31 |
but he didn't voice disapproval with the PR |
| 03:53 |
est31 |
so I guess its okay with him |
| 03:57 |
paramat |
but then, there are cases where a core dev authors a PR but doesn't yet approve of it themselves, so it can't be automatic |
| 03:57 |
paramat |
depends on circumstances |
| 03:57 |
est31 |
yeah |
| 03:58 |
est31 |
I always wait until the author of a PR to merges it themselves if they haven't made it clear |
| 03:59 |
est31 |
unless the PR is trivial in my eyes |
| 04:09 |
ssieb |
I'm seeing a bug where items with a formspec on right-click (e.g. furnaces) don't work right after you place them. If I disconnect the client, then reconnect, they work. Anyone else see this? It's only started recently. |
| 04:14 |
srifqi |
it works for me |
| 04:15 |
ssieb |
how recent is your build? |
| 04:15 |
srifqi |
minetest build on af714c |
| 04:17 |
est31 |
ssieb, that's general server lag |
| 04:17 |
est31 |
not specific to furnaces I think |
| 04:17 |
est31 |
the client predicts that you place something |
| 04:17 |
est31 |
so it appears in the world |
| 04:17 |
srifqi |
that's also happened to me when the connection is slow |
| 04:17 |
est31 |
but it cant predict that the something has a formspec |
| 04:18 |
est31 |
it needs the server to send over the actually updated map |
| 04:18 |
ssieb |
that's pretty massive lag, because it never resolves :-) |
| 04:18 |
srifqi |
Why there are no valleys mapgen in settingtypes.txt ? |
| 04:20 |
ssieb |
also, the server is on the same network as me... |
| 04:21 |
srifqi |
change your server's configuration may helps you reduce lag |
| 04:21 |
ssieb |
the server log shows me placing the furnace |
| 04:23 |
est31 |
well if you can reproduce the issue |
| 04:23 |
est31 |
then its very easy to find out the cause |
| 04:24 |
est31 |
ssieb, do you know how to git bisect? |
| 04:24 |
ssieb |
yes |
| 04:24 |
est31 |
do it, finding out the causing commit helps alot in finding the cause |
| 04:46 |
ssieb |
hmm, it doesn't happen in singleplayer or local server, so it must be a mod or something on my server... |
| 04:47 |
srifqi |
did you test it in vanilla minetest game (no mod)? |
| 04:47 |
ssieb |
srifqi: the valleys mapgen isn't in the docs yet. paramat said he was going to do something about that |
| 04:47 |
ssieb |
yes, that's what I mean. It works there |
| 04:48 |
srifqi |
what are those mod installed? |
| 04:49 |
srifqi |
i'm working for #2561 now, so i asked for valleys mapgen |
| 04:49 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/2561 -- Add mapgen settings to create world dialog by srifqi |
| 04:50 |
srifqi |
*aksed about |
| 05:06 |
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| 05:08 |
paramat |
oh yeah mg_name = valleys is missing from minetest.conf and settingtypes.txt docs, will fix that sometime |
| 05:12 |
sofar |
paramat: #3605 is mergable, yes. |
| 05:12 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/3605 -- Play tool breaking sounds. by sofar |
| 05:12 |
sofar |
paramat: note the linked patch to minetest_game as well |
| 05:13 |
paramat |
i was just wondering if the objections are reasonable enough for it to need more consideration |
| 05:16 |
sofar |
so the alternative patch |
| 05:17 |
paramat |
anyway i feel it can probably be merged |
| 05:17 |
sofar |
would require exactly the same changes to minetest_game to actually hook up default sounds |
| 05:17 |
sofar |
and more (the callback code) |
| 05:17 |
sofar |
so this is a smaller subset |
| 05:18 |
sofar |
making a callback for the sole purpose of playing an audio sample ... doesn't have my preference in this case |
| 05:18 |
est31 |
yes but its more general |
| 05:19 |
sofar |
only hardly |
| 05:19 |
est31 |
you can have the default callback be precisely that: play the audio sample |
| 05:19 |
sofar |
it would still require sound.break to be set |
| 05:19 |
paramat |
the objecter is not around anymore. i think we can merge it, i might do that tomorrow |
| 05:20 |
est31 |
sofar, yes but you now have the option to override |
| 05:20 |
sofar |
there still is |
| 05:20 |
sofar |
and it's even further generic |
| 05:20 |
paramat |
(but then i don't understand it) |
| 05:20 |
sofar |
a chain of overridable callbacks isn't good design |
| 05:21 |
sofar |
the most generic callback is already implemented |
| 05:21 |
est31 |
more generic callbacks often have a problem |
| 05:21 |
sofar |
it's not that hard to calculate the wear |
| 05:21 |
est31 |
you have to guess what the engine code does |
| 05:21 |
est31 |
but you still have to do it |
| 05:21 |
est31 |
thats the point |
| 05:21 |
est31 |
you have to keep track of the engine doing things |
| 05:21 |
est31 |
if it changes, you have to change as well |
| 05:21 |
sofar |
that's always a risk |
| 05:22 |
est31 |
thats why a callback as suggested by blockmen is better IMO |
| 05:23 |
est31 |
similar to https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/3133 |
| 05:24 |
sofar |
yes, but that's sensible and multipurpose |
| 05:25 |
sofar |
I'm not saying the argument is incorrect |
| 05:25 |
sofar |
I'm just saying that there's a place for callbacks, and I feel like this isn't one of them |
| 05:25 |
est31 |
well idk, if its not requested, and nobody is coming up with any use cases except the one you implement in 3605, then we should merge 3605 and close the other PR |
| 05:26 |
sofar |
if people do come up with use cases, then we can expand/correct without much issues |
| 05:26 |
srifqi |
paramat: should i add valleys mapgen? |
| 05:27 |
paramat |
srifqi yes add it to your PR, the settings does work, it's just not documented |
| 05:29 |
paramat |
although of course it can't be selected in advanced settings because it's not present 'possible values' |
| 05:30 |
srifqi |
add another PR? |
| 05:37 |
paramat |
yes if you want, start a new PR to add mg_name = valleys to .conf and settingtypes |
| 05:38 |
paramat |
if you do that i'll merge it tomorrow or very soon |
| 05:50 |
sofar |
paramat: grep _script..on src/network/serverpackethandler.cpp |
| 05:51 |
sofar |
wrt callback on_flood() |
| 05:51 |
paramat |
ok thanks |
| 05:52 |
srifqi |
I've just update #2561 , has not rebased. |
| 05:52 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/2561 -- Add mapgen settings to create world dialog by srifqi |
| 05:54 |
sofar |
oh nice I've never seen that PR |
| 05:58 |
paramat |
cool |
| 06:01 |
sofar |
paramat: so you'll end up putting a ScriptApiNode::node_on_flood(v3s16 p, MapNode node) in script/cpp_api/s_node.cpp I guess, doesn't look like too much copy+paste code to make that work |
| 06:02 |
srifqi |
thanks, paramat |
| 06:02 |
paramat |
ok |
| 06:02 |
sofar |
maybe think about return values? |
| 06:03 |
sofar |
although void / no return value seems appropriate |
| 06:03 |
sofar |
well hmmmm |
| 06:03 |
sofar |
no handler: core removes node |
| 06:04 |
sofar |
handler present: lua code can drop item, but node is getting removed anyway, so return value doesn't matter? |
| 06:05 |
sofar |
wait no, I think we want this to be like on_blast |
| 06:06 |
sofar |
no no not on_blast, that returns an itemstack |
| 06:07 |
sofar |
on_burn isn't it either |
| 06:09 |
sofar |
I think it can just be a void. core should remove the node from the map before or after the callback, pass the node/pos to the callback if present |
| 06:12 |
est31 |
note that I'll -1 every PR to the engine that floods plantlike by default |
| 06:12 |
est31 |
I really dont like water messing that much with worlds |
| 06:12 |
est31 |
water is safe, that's good |
| 06:12 |
sofar |
torches, though, right? |
| 06:13 |
sofar |
;^D |
| 06:13 |
est31 |
fire can be easily disabled |
| 06:13 |
est31 |
but well thats mtgame |
| 06:13 |
est31 |
i dont want to start ranting about fire again :) |
| 06:13 |
sofar |
oh, so you'd be ok with farming:* being floodable? |
| 06:14 |
sofar |
easy to mod that in, as well |
| 06:14 |
est31 |
well games can do whatever they want |
| 06:14 |
est31 |
with the engine |
| 06:15 |
est31 |
but default flooding everything away? |
| 06:15 |
est31 |
thats griefers wet dream |
| 06:20 |
paramat |
heh literally |
| 06:21 |
sofar |
right, but might be nice for singleplayer focussed games |
| 06:26 |
paramat |
it will be calls to on-flood functions. i will oppose making plants floodable. torches and fire perhaps ok |
| 06:26 |
sofar |
paramat: btw you wouldn't have to do any registration of on_flood() callbacks, since you know the nodedef when you flood it and just check if that nodedef has a callback |
| 06:27 |
paramat |
yeah |
| 06:27 |
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| 06:28 |
sofar |
so relatively cheap and not very complex |
| 06:28 |
sofar |
I'd have a half-assed implementation already but I don't know the water code, at all ;) |
| 06:31 |
srifqi |
Just opened a PR #3815 |
| 06:31 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/3815 -- Add forgotten valleys mapgen in mapgen name by srifqi |
| 06:40 |
paramat |
thanks |
| 06:41 |
paramat |
i'll merge it tomorrow (later today, whatever) |
| 06:41 |
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| 06:42 |
est31 |
forgotten valleys |
| 06:42 |
est31 |
sounds like an idea for a mapgen :) |
| 06:44 |
srifqi |
:D |
| 06:44 |
srifqi |
maybe something like "old" map? |
| 07:55 |
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| 11:42 |
celeron55 |
i don't know about this menu redesign anymore |
| 11:43 |
celeron55 |
i don't like the current menu, but on the other hand i'm not sure about any other design either |
| 11:51 |
celeron55 |
meh, i guess i'll continue enough to have something to show |
| 11:53 |
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| 12:23 |
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| 12:23 |
srifqi |
what menu did you mean, celeron55? |
| 12:24 |
yang2003 |
Hmm... does new minetest coming in a week? |
| 12:31 |
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| 12:32 |
kaeza |
>[One approval] |
| 12:32 |
kaeza |
is it really necessary to have tags for everything? |
| 12:33 |
sfan5 |
no |
| 12:33 |
sfan5 |
but this tag is useful |
| 12:35 |
kaeza |
is it? |
| 12:36 |
celeron55 |
yang2003: it looks like maybe at the end of this month |
| 12:37 |
yang2003 |
nice |
| 12:44 |
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| 13:03 |
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| 13:26 |
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| 13:46 |
celeron55 |
lol... i just did this: https://github.com/celeron55/minetest/commit/48304d1ada77f0c25e4e58ac5a00bacaaf94563b |
| 13:48 |
celeron55 |
this is an example menu that just strips out everything and automatically creates a world when you press "play": https://gist.github.com/celeron55/5f6e5d28caf358684d5c |
| 13:50 |
celeron55 |
wuzzy will like this, but i wonder what others do |
| 13:51 |
yang2003 |
nice work |
| 13:51 |
yang2003 |
I like it |
| 13:51 |
VanessaE |
celeron55: screenshot? |
| 13:51 |
celeron55 |
(it's hacky as hell; i haven't bothered cleaning stuff up) |
| 13:51 |
VanessaE |
(too lazy to compile it :P ) |
| 13:52 |
celeron55 |
that whole branch is actually all lua and a few textures but, eh, http://i.imgur.com/Be2tPed.png |
| 13:52 |
celeron55 |
did you really need to see this? :P |
| 13:52 |
VanessaE |
heh |
| 13:52 |
VanessaE |
I suppose not :) |
| 13:53 |
celeron55 |
the other parts of the menu you're going to have to try yourself |
| 13:53 |
celeron55 |
in fact i would like it if you did |
| 13:54 |
celeron55 |
because i'm not going to push this forward unless at least some people like it |
| 13:55 |
VanessaE |
I'll pass. |
| 13:55 |
VanessaE |
but that screenshot/mockup you shared a few days ago looked good. |
| 13:57 |
celeron55 |
well, take this then http://imgur.com/a/gFWAy |
| 13:58 |
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| 13:59 |
Fixer |
i think current one is better and more readable |
| 13:59 |
VanessaE |
not bad, but the subgame icons being shown on the opening screen at all doesn't work. |
| 14:00 |
VanessaE |
they should be placed behind a menu similar to the others. |
| 14:00 |
celeron55 |
too many clicks |
| 14:00 |
VanessaE |
four icons to open - Play Single-player, Host Game, Join Game, Settings. |
| 14:00 |
VanessaE |
behind the Single-player option would be those subgames. |
| 14:00 |
celeron55 |
it's a click more |
| 14:01 |
VanessaE |
that's okay. it's about the path the player follows to get started isn't it? |
| 14:01 |
VanessaE |
putting those games on the opening screen will confuse some people. |
| 14:02 |
celeron55 |
aat least you are not suggesting to have the ridiculous subgame bar always visible on the single-player screen? |
| 14:02 |
celeron55 |
at* |
| 14:02 |
VanessaE |
nah |
| 14:02 |
Fixer |
white text on near white background is not good |
| 14:02 |
VanessaE |
he just has the menu dialog background turned off, Fixer |
| 14:03 |
celeron55 |
it's trivial to darken it like this http://i.imgur.com/eHcD8Wn.png |
| 14:03 |
celeron55 |
but a menu background that doesn't fill the window doesn't look good in that style |
| 14:03 |
Fixer |
it still feels somewhat crappy |
| 14:04 |
celeron55 |
http://i.imgur.com/ynvB0j0.png |
| 14:04 |
celeron55 |
so is this what we want? |
| 14:04 |
Fixer |
https://i.imgur.com/FirHhjD.png wth is this? |
| 14:04 |
Fixer |
no! |
| 14:04 |
VanessaE |
celeron55: not really, no. |
| 14:05 |
VanessaE |
Fixer: that's a subgame + map that's meant to help the player learn to play |
| 14:05 |
VanessaE |
I forget who made it |
| 14:05 |
yang2003 |
Hmm... |
| 14:05 |
celeron55 |
Fixer: it's this because this is the only subgame that i so far know to want a custom menu: https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=10312 |
| 14:05 |
Fixer |
VanessaE, big black Tutorial and two grey buttons? %) |
| 14:05 |
VanessaE |
Fixer: well talk to Wuzzy about the style of it then :P |
| 14:06 |
Fixer |
please don't do it like that |
| 14:06 |
celeron55 |
none of this discussion should be about style |
| 14:06 |
celeron55 |
we need to talk about UI logic and functionality |
| 14:06 |
VanessaE |
celeron55: agreed. |
| 14:06 |
Fixer |
ah |
| 14:06 |
Fixer |
i was talking about style, nevermind |
| 14:07 |
celeron55 |
given that the icons were on their own screen, what's the next issue then? |
| 14:07 |
Fixer |
Singleplayer | Network | Settings |
| 14:08 |
yang2003 |
Hmm.. |
| 14:09 |
VanessaE |
not sure what's next, actually. |
| 14:09 |
Fixer |
icons below can be somewhat confusing, need some kind of Subgame ------------- |
| 14:09 |
celeron55 |
having the client (join game) and the server (host game) functionality on the same screen as tabs is confusing in my opinion |
| 14:09 |
VanessaE |
Fixer: I already said that. |
| 14:09 |
celeron55 |
that's why i separated them |
| 14:09 |
Fixer |
also, what to do with tabs? |
| 14:09 |
Fixer |
tabs should be separated? |
| 14:09 |
celeron55 |
? |
| 14:09 |
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| 14:10 |
Fixer |
pic 1 has icons, but in other places it shows tabs again |
| 14:10 |
Fixer |
just thinking |
| 14:10 |
yang2003 |
I thinks... |
| 14:10 |
yang2003 |
The texture can be square texture |
| 14:10 |
celeron55 |
i think the tabs work fine on the sub-screens but don't suit a launcher screen like that |
| 14:10 |
yang2003 |
Just suggest |
| 14:12 |
celeron55 |
i wonder if we even have a single person who actually knows jack shit about UI design |
| 14:12 |
yang2003 |
XD |
| 14:12 |
Fixer |
maybe open an issue on github and start discussion there, maybe we need some kinds of examples from other games |
| 14:12 |
Fixer |
this mocap feels overcomplicated |
| 14:13 |
celeron55 |
other games don't really do this thing where there actually are multiple games inside the game but not if you connect to a server, and not necessarily if you select a world first, and then all settings are still global and then there are mods that kind of apply to everything and nothing at the same time and... |
| 14:14 |
celeron55 |
it gets complicated because minetest operates in a quite non-traditional way |
| 14:15 |
est31 |
Well on one hand the main menu gradually converged to its current state and hasn't much changed in the past. On the other hand, if we don't experiment with new stuff we are a dead project lol |
| 14:15 |
celeron55 |
one thing that could be done would be to make the menu focused on worlds |
| 14:16 |
celeron55 |
i.e. the home screen options would be something like "select/create world", "join server" and "settings" |
| 14:16 |
celeron55 |
then when you select a world, you would choose whether to play singleplayer or host a game |
| 14:16 |
yang2003 |
Hmm... |
| 14:16 |
yang2003 |
Yes |
| 14:16 |
yang2003 |
I like this |
| 14:17 |
celeron55 |
but then you don't get to have game-specific singleplayer screen, if that's what's wanted |
| 14:17 |
yang2003 |
I agree |
| 14:18 |
celeron55 |
and the world list will be very long if you have many subgames |
| 14:18 |
celeron55 |
but of course there would be an option in the world selection screen to filter by subgame |
| 14:18 |
yang2003 |
yup |
| 14:18 |
celeron55 |
so it's not really an issue |
| 14:19 |
yang2003 |
Hmm... |
| 14:19 |
celeron55 |
est31: i don't think the menu has converged anywhere; it's the same menu as it was in the 0.2 days; just new stuff tacked to it in whatever way it happened to fit |
| 14:19 |
celeron55 |
and with massive implementation changes |
| 14:23 |
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| 14:23 |
huang2003 |
hi all |
| 14:25 |
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| 14:25 |
huang2003 |
wb |
| 14:27 |
Fixer |
i do like current menu, what I don't like is too much tabs, instead make singleplayer | network | settings | credits, mods and texture packs move into settings or in current world config |
| 14:27 |
Fixer |
current minetest one, not mocup |
| 14:27 |
huang2003 |
oh i think it was a good idea |
| 14:28 |
Fixer |
also, make public server list on by default |
| 14:28 |
huang2003 |
oh,it sounds good |
| 14:28 |
celeron55 |
huang2003: please can you just leave, we need to discuss this among more experienced developers |
| 14:28 |
huang2003 |
ok,i will |
| 14:28 |
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| 14:31 |
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| 14:33 |
celeron55 |
Fixer: so... more tab layers? |
| 14:34 |
celeron55 |
i don't know about this |
| 14:35 |
celeron55 |
well, i did what i set out to make a few hours ago; now it's up to feedback what might happen to the menu |
| 14:36 |
celeron55 |
i don't want to make a PR because this is just an experiment |
| 14:36 |
celeron55 |
well i guess i could |
| 14:36 |
twoelk |
uhm - from where do you open the tutorial screnn and will all games have such a screen? |
| 14:37 |
twoelk |
*screen |
| 14:38 |
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| 14:42 |
celeron55 |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/3818 |
| 14:46 |
twoelk |
actually I really like the idea that subgames can start with a simple info page |
| 14:48 |
twoelk |
or rather information can be served before a game is started |
| 14:49 |
est31 |
I like the fact that its written out "Host Game" |
| 14:49 |
est31 |
and not just "Server" |
| 14:49 |
est31 |
if you are new to minetest you dont know what it means: host server? join server? |
| 14:50 |
VanessaE |
out of curiosity, |
| 14:50 |
VanessaE |
why even separate "singleplayer" from "host game" in the first place? |
| 14:50 |
est31 |
same for join game |
| 14:51 |
VanessaE |
have the engine just set a default port, require the user to enter their name, and not allow anyone to log in remotely with that name (hence no password would be needed) |
| 14:52 |
VanessaE |
if the user wants to just play singleplayer, they should be able to just "start" without so much as typing in their name (in which case "singleplayer" becomes the username) |
| 14:53 |
est31 |
there are some conditions here |
| 14:53 |
est31 |
if the default port is taken, it should not end the server or crash |
| 14:53 |
VanessaE |
agreed. just pick a new port automatically. |
| 14:54 |
est31 |
and if you do something like that you still need to provide info for how to join |
| 14:54 |
est31 |
thats perhaps what the LAN tab is about... |
| 14:54 |
twoelk |
having to do with little kids, their parents and teachers now and then I think to have a clear boundary between closed-local-game and open-to-others-game is important to many people (parents-teachers) |
| 14:54 |
VanessaE |
well sure, but you can just pop up a dialog box on join |
| 14:54 |
VanessaE |
my point is to avoid presenting a separate LAN tab or similar, at all |
| 14:54 |
est31 |
idk there sure is some way to do network auto discovery |
| 14:55 |
VanessaE |
and as we all know, running server+client as two separate processes usually results in a more fluid game |
| 14:55 |
est31 |
as long as anti virus doesnt think we try to add the distinctiveness of other computers in the lan to our own :p |
| 14:55 |
VanessaE |
heh |
| 14:56 |
est31 |
they already run as separate threads btw |
| 14:56 |
VanessaE |
perhaps but for some reason, having them as actual separate processes seems to work better for some people. |
| 14:56 |
twoelk |
can confirm |
| 14:57 |
Fixer |
how about that mocup? https://i.imgur.com/BPYP1dQ.png mods and texture pack will be in Configure (for each world) |
| 14:58 |
Fixer |
first tab can be either Network or Singleplayer |
| 14:58 |
Obani |
Fixer : yes |
| 14:58 |
Fixer |
maybe rename Network to Join server |
| 14:59 |
Obani |
Also Network is clearer than Client but still not a good word IMO |
| 14:59 |
Obani |
Multiplayer ? |
| 14:59 |
Obani |
Online ? |
| 14:59 |
Fixer |
Online |
| 14:59 |
Fixer |
or Internet |
| 14:59 |
Obani |
Internet is false :p |
| 14:59 |
Obani |
Online imo |
| 15:01 |
twoelk |
start-own-game and join-running-game would be more exact but much too long labels |
| 15:02 |
Fixer |
Start | Join | Settings | Credits |
| 15:02 |
Fixer |
._. |
| 15:03 |
srifqi |
Are you sure about this? |
| 15:03 |
srifqi |
0.4.14 ? |
| 15:03 |
Obani |
Fixer, Solo | Online | Settings | Credits |
| 15:03 |
twoelk |
Online is not always correct |
| 15:04 |
twoelk |
you can connect to a game on the same machine |
| 15:06 |
sfan5 |
merging https://patch-diff.githubusercontent.com/raw/minetest/minetest/pull/3815.patch in 5 minutes (trivial) |
| 15:06 |
est31 |
sfan5, +1 |
| 15:07 |
twoelk |
from my experience many parents or teachers would love to be able to hide the internet but allow lan |
| 15:07 |
Fixer |
hmm |
| 15:07 |
Fixer |
we forgot about LAN |
| 15:08 |
Fixer |
can MT auto discover servers on lan? |
| 15:08 |
Fixer |
probably not |
| 15:08 |
celeron55 |
that feature should be added |
| 15:09 |
celeron55 |
i guess it's just a matter of making the server send some broadcast UDP packets |
| 15:10 |
est31 |
that should do it probably |
| 15:10 |
srifqi |
maybe check for each IP 192.168.x.y ? |
| 15:10 |
sfan5 |
flooding the network is always a good idea |
| 15:10 |
est31 |
nah thats a bad idea |
| 15:10 |
sfan5 |
also do you want to check each port? |
| 15:11 |
est31 |
we could ping on a certain port hardcoded into minetest |
| 15:11 |
twoelk |
maybe a set of 5 or 10 hardcoded ports |
| 15:12 |
twoelk |
schools do use differing internal ip sets sometimes though |
| 15:13 |
sfan5 |
that wouldn't be a problem |
| 15:13 |
celeron55 |
the server can just broadcast a packet every 10 seconds telling its ip and port |
| 15:13 |
celeron55 |
it's pretty much the de-facto way of doing this i think |
| 15:13 |
srifqi |
where to broadcast? |
| 15:13 |
celeron55 |
everywhere |
| 15:13 |
sfan5 |
192.168.x.255 |
| 15:14 |
celeron55 |
255.255.255.255 |
| 15:14 |
sfan5 |
that works too |
| 15:14 |
celeron55 |
it won't get to the internet, ISPs block them |
| 15:14 |
est31 |
or the client could broadcast |
| 15:14 |
est31 |
hello i am client i want servers |
| 15:14 |
est31 |
server then answers |
| 15:14 |
est31 |
then there is no waste |
| 15:14 |
Fixer |
10.x.x.x or so |
| 15:14 |
est31 |
and its super fast |
| 15:14 |
sfan5 |
are you afraid of wasting local network bandwidth? |
| 15:14 |
est31 |
yeah broadcasts wont get to the internet |
| 15:15 |
nore |
there should however be a setting to disable this |
| 15:15 |
nore |
for those on big local networks (students for example) |
| 15:15 |
sfan5 |
might be useful to automatically disable it when server_dedicated is set to true |
| 15:16 |
celeron55 |
eh |
| 15:16 |
celeron55 |
it's a separate option just like publishing to internet |
| 15:16 |
est31 |
sfan5, no i mostly care about speed celeron55 suggested having it broadcast every ten seconds, thats slow in my eyes |
| 15:16 |
est31 |
but i dont want it to spam the local network with broadcasts |
| 15:16 |
est31 |
and there is no need to |
| 15:16 |
sfan5 |
every other program does it like that too |
| 15:17 |
twoelk |
maybe only on request - like a button -searchnow- |
| 15:17 |
est31 |
twoelk, that's what I am suggesting, the client searching for the server, not the server searching for clients |
| 15:17 |
nore |
twoelk: +1 |
| 15:18 |
srifqi |
^ +1 |
| 15:18 |
est31 |
and not even a button needed, just send a ping every second or so if the client has the tab open |
| 15:20 |
nore |
est31: a button would be better though |
| 15:20 |
nore |
to avoid spamming the local network |
| 15:20 |
sfan5 |
why? |
| 15:21 |
sfan5 |
if you have the tab open it makes sense to search for servers |
| 15:21 |
Fixer |
checkbox Lan |
| 15:21 |
est31 |
yeah |
| 15:21 |
VanessaE |
how does CUPS do it? |
| 15:21 |
Fixer |
turned off by default %) |
| 15:21 |
VanessaE |
(it has local auto-discovery of printers) |
| 15:22 |
est31 |
RFC 6763 |
| 15:22 |
est31 |
thats used for the auto discovery part |
| 15:23 |
VanessaE |
oof.. overkill |
| 15:25 |
est31 |
it seems to work using standard DNS queries |
| 15:26 |
est31 |
so client asks, server responds model or something like that |
| 15:31 |
kahrl |
what about good old multicast/IGMP? |
| 15:32 |
kahrl |
server does a setsockopt(fd, IPPROTO_IP, IP_ADD_MEMBERSHIP, <multicast ip>) |
| 15:32 |
kahrl |
client then sends the discovery packet to the multicast ip |
| 15:34 |
est31 |
it requires ipv4, no? |
| 15:34 |
kahrl |
I'm pretty sure ipv6 supports it too, but I might be wrong |
| 15:35 |
est31 |
idk though, I guess its not that big of a network compat issue here, we can surely change LAN auto discovery protocols if we want to support ipv6 |
| 15:35 |
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| 15:38 |
kahrl |
actually I guess that does the same thing like the broadcast in almost all situations |
| 15:38 |
kahrl |
since multicast makes use of the ethernet broadcast address FF:FF:FF:FF:FF:FF |
| 15:38 |
kahrl |
so in a LAN it would still go to all hosts |
| 15:38 |
kahrl |
the difference would be that it could be routed if someone cared to configure a router for that |
| 15:40 |
kahrl |
ah, no |
| 15:40 |
kahrl |
there are special MAC addresses in ethernet that correspond to ipv4/ipv6 multicast addresses |
| 15:41 |
kahrl |
so decent ethernet switches would deliver these packets only to hosts that want them |
| 15:44 |
est31 |
IGMP has leave messages |
| 15:44 |
est31 |
thats good |
| 15:48 |
twoelk |
like: your server has left, deal with it? |
| 15:48 |
est31 |
yes |
| 15:48 |
est31 |
dont click at it thinking it still runs and then get a timeout |
| 15:51 |
twoelk |
the client not telling me that you are disconnected did happen to me quite often on my crappy internet-line - many blocks placed in vain |
| 15:53 |
est31 |
it should work like we have it in the minetest protocol: |
| 15:53 |
est31 |
there are ping requests, and for a normal leave there is an extra request |
| 15:54 |
est31 |
so for the normal leave you get a fast response that the server is shutting down |
| 15:54 |
est31 |
no timeout |
| 15:54 |
est31 |
and if the internet dies its handled by the ping |
| 16:07 |
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| 17:09 |
est31 |
kahrl, btw if you want to review a PR, my LBM PR is ready |
| 17:09 |
est31 |
#3677 |
| 17:09 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/3677 -- Add minetest.register_lbm() to run code on block load only by est31 |
| 17:33 |
kahrl |
est31: ah nice, I will soon |
| 17:39 |
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| 18:11 |
kahrl |
est31: question, what is the motivation behind nameHash? |
| 18:13 |
est31 |
kahrl, its so that I dont have to handle that many strings inside the code |
| 18:14 |
est31 |
but you are the second reviewer critical of it perhaps I remove it entirely |
| 18:14 |
kahrl |
for performance reasons? |
| 18:14 |
est31 |
yes |
| 18:15 |
kahrl |
ah, is it still relevant since m_lbm_lookup is no longer referenced by nameHash but by time? |
| 18:16 |
kahrl |
everything else that uses nameHash seems to be only done on initialization |
| 18:18 |
est31 |
yes m_lbm_lookup is referenced by time |
| 18:18 |
est31 |
why is it a u64 map |
| 18:18 |
est31 |
thats wrog |
| 18:18 |
est31 |
wrong* |
| 18:20 |
kahrl |
yeah, I was going to mention that too |
| 18:32 |
est31 |
what do you think, keep the hash or remove it? |
| 18:32 |
kahrl |
I'd remove it (unless I missed a spot where it's used in performance critical code) |
| 18:33 |
kahrl |
the extra code complexity and (small) risk of collisions imho isn't worth slightly faster initialization |
| 18:33 |
hmmmm |
i don't think minetest should reinvent its own hash table data structures when we already have the c++ standard library |
| 18:34 |
kahrl |
well, we don't really |
| 18:34 |
kahrl |
we can't use unordered_map |
| 18:34 |
est31 |
the pr uses the already existing std::map |
| 18:34 |
est31 |
just with different key type |
| 18:35 |
hmmmm |
C++11 support is coming soon |
| 18:35 |
est31 |
when was precise end date? |
| 18:35 |
est31 |
somewhen in 2017 |
| 18:35 |
hmmmm |
if you want something to really be a hash table, then why not use a typedef for the container type and add a //TODO(namehere): change this to unordered_map |
| 18:37 |
est31 |
C++11 has auto for iterators right? |
| 18:37 |
hmmmm |
yup |
| 18:37 |
est31 |
because std::map<std::string, u32>::const_iterator is long already |
| 18:37 |
est31 |
no need for "unordered_" |
| 18:38 |
hmmmm |
doesn't really matter, if you typedefed the container you wouldn't need to retype any of that |
| 18:38 |
hmmmm |
ThingMap::const_iterator |
| 18:39 |
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| 18:39 |
kahrl |
I think I see a use-after-free |
| 18:40 |
kahrl |
use-after-delete, whatever |
| 18:40 |
kahrl |
you have LBMContentMapping as the value type in lbm_lookup_map which is a map |
| 18:40 |
kahrl |
so the map might copy those things around |
| 18:41 |
kahrl |
but when *any* of the copies of the LBMContentMapping is destructed, the contained LBMs are deleted |
| 18:41 |
kahrl |
even when there are still other copies of the LBMContentMapping |
| 18:42 |
est31 |
aha |
| 18:43 |
est31 |
you say that the map doesnt keep the stuff at one place, but copies it around? |
| 18:43 |
est31 |
this made the set-up just a bit harder |
| 18:43 |
kahrl |
yeah, I'm pretty sure it does |
| 18:43 |
kahrl |
well, or uses move constructors, dunno; it doesn't matter here |
| 18:44 |
est31 |
once the stuff lands in LBMContentMapping it isnt supposed to be moved around much |
| 18:44 |
nrzkt |
est31: undordered map can't take a std::string as key |
| 18:45 |
est31 |
why |
| 18:45 |
nrzkt |
only integers are allowed by this type |
| 18:45 |
nrzkt |
try yourself :) |
| 18:45 |
kahrl |
I think you just have to delete the LBMs from the LBMManager destructor |
| 18:45 |
kahrl |
and remove the LBMContentMapping destructor |
| 18:45 |
est31 |
that was the original goal that should happen |
| 18:46 |
est31 |
the LBMManager destructor automatically destructs lbm_lookup_map |
| 18:46 |
est31 |
which then deletes all the LBMContentMapping and the pointers |
| 18:47 |
celeron55 |
unordered_map can take std::string as key |
| 18:47 |
kahrl |
I mean explicitly loop over the mappings and the LBMs in them and delete the LBMs |
| 18:47 |
est31 |
yeah |
| 18:47 |
celeron55 |
(it's just hash table in that case) |
| 18:47 |
est31 |
seems I have to do some loops i wanted to avoid |
| 18:48 |
est31 |
idk doesnt become an iterator become invalid |
| 18:48 |
est31 |
ah yeah |
| 18:48 |
est31 |
will do end != begin check or something |
| 18:48 |
est31 |
thats most safe |
| 18:48 |
est31 |
then delete them one by one |
| 18:48 |
kahrl |
the other option would be to make the lbmdef refcounted, and maybe add proper copy constructors / operator= to LBMContentMapping |
| 18:48 |
kahrl |
which seems more complicated |
| 18:49 |
est31 |
agreed |
| 18:53 |
nrzkt |
celeron55, yes you are right, it's not std::string the problem :) sorry. It's irrlicht types. We will need to overload them with the hashing functions to permit using std::unorered_map on them |
| 18:54 |
est31 |
or we convert them to std strings as soon as possible |
| 18:54 |
celeron55 |
yes, you can define the hash functions for anything of course |
| 18:55 |
celeron55 |
i guess minetest doesn't do it anywhere for any type yet |
| 19:05 |
nrzkt |
VBO was a good patch. On my Radeon HD 7970 with Mesa 11.1 i now have 60 with 215 node limit. Before 85 |
| 19:07 |
est31 |
60 drawtime? |
| 19:07 |
nrzkt |
fps :) |
| 19:08 |
nrzkt |
and 85 nodes |
| 19:17 |
est31 |
ok PR is updated |
| 19:24 |
est31 |
kahrl ? |
| 19:29 |
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| 19:29 |
kahrl |
looking |
| 19:31 |
est31 |
I haven't tested the latest version, but if I get a +1 I'll do another test to be certain nothing broke |
| 19:31 |
est31 |
(i cant imagine that sth broke) |
| 19:31 |
kahrl |
I notice several places where you do a find() on a map, then if that fails you insert an item at the same key |
| 19:31 |
kahrl |
that can be shortened by just doing map[key] |
| 19:31 |
est31 |
yeah c++14 or something has a method for that |
| 19:32 |
est31 |
or... |
| 19:32 |
est31 |
perhaps we are talking about different usecases |
| 19:33 |
kahrl |
C++03 also guarantees that map::operator[] inserts a key/value pair if the key doesn't exist yet |
| 19:33 |
kahrl |
no need for C++14 |
| 19:33 |
est31 |
ah |
| 19:34 |
kahrl |
(just checked the standard to be sure: 23.3.1.2) |
| 19:35 |
est31 |
so its like lua tables in that case |
| 19:35 |
est31 |
thats good |
| 19:37 |
est31 |
in fact the code is really a bit stupid |
| 19:38 |
est31 |
at some places its required though |
| 19:38 |
est31 |
in LBMManager::loadIntroductionTimes |
| 19:38 |
est31 |
to declare lbms_we_introduce_now |
| 19:39 |
est31 |
and lbms_running_always |
| 19:39 |
est31 |
aww |
| 19:39 |
est31 |
not even required there |
| 19:39 |
est31 |
and just found a bug lol |
| 19:39 |
est31 |
lbm_lookup_map::iterator jtt = m_lbm_lookup.find(U32_MAX); |
| 19:40 |
est31 |
if (jtt == m_lbm_lookup.end()) { LBMContentMapping m; m_lbm_lookup[now] = m; jtt = m_lbm_lookup.find(now); } |
| 19:40 |
est31 |
copy paste mistake |
| 19:41 |
kahrl |
oh, right :) |
| 19:43 |
sofar |
est31: ping me if you want me to retest |
| 19:43 |
est31 |
oh thats cool, thanks, will do, if the PR seems ready. |
| 19:47 |
est31 |
ok PR updated kahrl |
| 19:49 |
kahrl |
commented 2 lines in s_env.cpp for style |
| 19:49 |
kahrl |
otherwise code style looks good |
| 19:50 |
est31 |
fixed |
| 19:50 |
est31 |
there is one issue perhaps remaining |
| 19:50 |
est31 |
dunno if its an issue |
| 19:50 |
est31 |
just noticed it |
| 19:51 |
est31 |
when I compile the engine, and then checkout another version of minetest e.g. to edit code, and then start the engine |
| 19:51 |
est31 |
then I get a pretty unfriendly error message |
| 19:51 |
kahrl |
hmm |
| 19:51 |
est31 |
my guess the luaL_checktype in s_env.cpp is failing |
| 19:51 |
kahrl |
what does it say? |
| 19:52 |
est31 |
PANIC: unprotected error in call to Lua API (bad argument #4 to '?' (table expected, got nil)) |
| 19:52 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/4 -- cppcheck warnings |
| 19:52 |
est31 |
hah |
| 19:52 |
kahrl |
oh, yeah, that makes sense |
| 19:53 |
kahrl |
the C++ side is still looking for core.registered_lbms but the lua builtin side is a different version that doesn't provide that |
| 19:53 |
kahrl |
until you rebuild the C++ side |
| 19:53 |
est31 |
its copied from ABMs so similar behaviour existed already |
| 19:54 |
kahrl |
I don't think that is really a problem, builtin is tightly coupled to the engine |
| 19:54 |
est31 |
dunno if its worth fixing, i have no idea how to do "protected" error propagation |
| 19:54 |
est31 |
yeah |
| 19:54 |
kahrl |
and you are expected to recompile the C++ code if you change builtin version |
| 19:56 |
kahrl |
though you can make it more robust by getting rid of the luaL_checktype |
| 19:56 |
kahrl |
the type is checked below anyway by lua_istable |
| 19:57 |
est31 |
its sort of an internal engine error |
| 19:57 |
est31 |
perhaps FATAL_ERROR_IF? |
| 19:57 |
est31 |
or FATAL_ERROR |
| 19:58 |
kahrl |
yeah, I guess it's best to alert the user if builtin and core versions don't match |
| 19:58 |
kahrl |
other things might be out of sync too |
| 19:59 |
est31 |
my main concern is that the error message is very confusing |
| 19:59 |
est31 |
I'll fix that I think |
| 20:09 |
est31 |
hmmm I dont know whether FATAL_ERROR calls lua stuff or not |
| 20:11 |
est31 |
I'll keep an empty stack behind just to make sure |
| 20:13 |
est31 |
okay kahrl uploaded the new code |
| 20:20 |
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| 20:25 |
est31 |
kahrl, do you want some time to review the PR? |
| 20:25 |
est31 |
it would be great if it went in during the weekend |
| 20:31 |
est31 |
I'll go i think |
| 20:31 |
est31 |
sofar, if you want you can test the current state of the PR |
| 20:31 |
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| 20:32 |
est31 |
not guaranteed to be the last one though |
| 21:00 |
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| 21:26 |
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| 21:46 |
paramat |
i'll merge games 891 799 892 880 later |
| 22:09 |
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| 23:00 |
sofar |
ShadowNinja: the problem I have with "front" (e.g.) is that usually front is the south side of the node with facedir=0 ;) |
| 23:01 |
sofar |
but yes, both will do |
| 23:10 |
sofar |
yuck, I messed up top/bottom with up/down |
| 23:10 |
* sofar |
fixes |
| 23:52 |
sofar |
I'm making a mess of things |
