| Time |
Nick |
Message |
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| 02:02 |
ShadowNinja |
kahrl: Hehe. :-P That's pretty ridiculous. |
| 02:03 |
ShadowNinja |
If you can't read past the first sentence you shouldn't be let near ANY code. |
| 02:34 |
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ShadowNinja |
celeron55: Can you rebase set_sky/override_day_night_ratio? |
| 03:02 |
VanessaE |
I can't really read that code, was my concern ever addressed about there being one "default, no mod needed" skybox? |
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RealBadAngel |
if merging that code, there shall be added textureable sun/moon to make it complete |
| 04:28 |
VanessaE |
YES |
| 04:29 |
VanessaE |
bbl |
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sfan5 |
ShadowNinja: good use? I couldn't think of any good use for getting the version of the server. |
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| 14:41 |
ShadowNinja |
sfan5: For display. You might be able to move the status string generation to Lua for example. Or the CTCP VERSION thing, or a menu... |
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| 19:02 |
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| 19:05 |
xyz |
sapier: apparently serialization of functions doesn't work in luajit 2.0.0_beta7 |
| 19:05 |
xyz |
sapier: is it supposed to work with luajit at all? |
| 19:11 |
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| 19:11 |
elliot_ |
Evening all :) |
| 19:15 |
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| 19:16 |
ShadowNinja |
Hello elliot_! This channel is strictly on-topic, #minetest is our social channel. |
| 19:16 |
* specing |
changes topic to random chatter |
| 19:18 |
elliot_ |
ShadowNinja: Okay :) |
| 19:18 |
elliot_ |
I was just going to ask what made you guys choose Irrlicht over writing your own opengl rendering code? |
| 19:19 |
sapier |
good question xyz I thought everyone except me uses luajit on regular base. I use 2.0.1 |
| 19:19 |
ShadowNinja |
You'd have to ask c55, although he regrets that decision now. Irrlight does include some batteries to make things easier though. |
| 19:21 |
elliot_ |
To me, voxel rendering ought to be it's own thing |
| 19:22 |
elliot_ |
I haven't yet looked at the code, but I'm imagining a horrible for loop creating many cube objects... |
| 19:23 |
sapier |
I suggest looking at code and make suggestions how to improve we know this code is suboptimal but by now noone really tried to improve it |
| 19:23 |
ShadowNinja |
The rendering code isn't known for it's speed... But you're welcome to improve it. |
| 19:24 |
xyz |
sapier: so what will we do? |
| 19:24 |
xyz |
I don't think serializing luajit function is a defined behavior |
| 19:24 |
ShadowNinja |
However Minetest currently works with DirectX, you'd have to break that if you use OpenGL. |
| 19:24 |
ShadowNinja |
(Or add a compat layer) |
| 19:25 |
elliot_ |
I thought irrlicht is graphics API independent anyway? |
| 19:25 |
sapier |
I don't se a reason why it shoudln't work, serialization doesn't use anything non standard compliant |
| 19:25 |
ShadowNinja |
And OGL ES is needed for Android support. |
| 19:25 |
sapier |
what exactly happens? |
| 19:25 |
ShadowNinja |
elliot_: Yep. |
| 19:25 |
xyz |
elliot_: irrlicht is good enough and there aren't many devs anyway |
| 19:26 |
xyz |
sapier: the deserialized function returns nil |
| 19:27 |
xyz |
http://lua-users.org/lists/lua-l/2011-01/msg00255.html could be related |
| 19:27 |
sapier |
what did you try to serialize? |
| 19:27 |
sapier |
serializing will fail for anything containing minetest.* |
| 19:28 |
xyz |
it happens in server list |
| 19:28 |
xyz |
because you serialize functions here |
| 19:28 |
xyz |
I don't know why you do that though |
| 19:28 |
sapier |
ok so it's something quite simple |
| 19:28 |
sapier |
because the server list needs to be fetched async in order to not stall the menu |
| 19:29 |
sapier |
as everything doing network operation |
| 19:29 |
|
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| 19:29 |
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| 19:30 |
xyz |
yes, so what are we going to do about it? |
| 19:30 |
sapier |
try to find out whats really wrong and fix it ... what else? |
| 19:31 |
sapier |
shouldn't be that hard to find out why marshal returns nil on luajit |
| 19:31 |
xyz |
what really wrong is — function serialization doesn't work |
| 19:31 |
xyz |
for example, test.lua from marshal distribution fails |
| 19:32 |
|
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| 19:32 |
xyz |
the message I linked to says "The attempts to marshal and unmarshal functions of course fail on LuaJIT 2" so I thought this behavior is not defined |
| 19:32 |
sapier |
your bug report is almost as bad as "it doesn't work" ... I can't say what's wrong right now too but I we need a way better error report than this |
| 19:33 |
sapier |
that's be a real problem as it would stop any attempts to do client side lua prior even starting |
| 19:33 |
xyz |
ugh |
| 19:33 |
xyz |
what else can I say? |
| 19:33 |
xyz |
function serialization doesn't work |
| 19:33 |
sapier |
I hope you're wrong |
| 19:34 |
xyz |
and what you expect me to say? |
| 19:34 |
ShadowNinja |
Why not just use a string and then loadstring() it? You can use [[ ]] multi line quotes. |
| 19:34 |
xyz |
bug report: there's a bug on line XXX in file ololo.cpp |
| 19:34 |
xyz |
that's not how bug reports usually work |
| 19:35 |
ShadowNinja |
That will mess up syntax highlighters, but it seems fine otherwise. |
| 19:35 |
sapier |
might be an option ShadowNinja but very very ugly ... I'd prefere to find a solution to make serialization work |
| 19:35 |
xyz |
well we can just say we don't support luajit versions lower than 2.0.2 and hope that this behavior is supposed to work |
| 19:35 |
ShadowNinja |
And the Async API isn't usable by mods yet, so there's no need to work about compatability. |
| 19:35 |
xyz |
since it works now |
| 19:36 |
xyz |
with some versions of luajit |
| 19:36 |
sapier |
xyz you're not a plain user ;-) |
| 19:36 |
ShadowNinja |
Seems a lot simpler than marshal too. |
| 19:36 |
sapier |
it works with 2.0.2? |
| 19:36 |
xyz |
guess what! |
| 19:37 |
xyz |
it does! |
| 19:37 |
xyz |
also it's very strange that you don't use LuaJIT since you're the author of the most cpu-hungry mod |
| 19:37 |
sapier |
oh, ok I didn't realize this before. Is there a way to check the luajit verison on startup? |
| 19:37 |
ShadowNinja |
sapier: Not all that ugly. Creating the function and serializing and deserializing it is a lot slower, depends on a external lib, and doesn't always work. |
| 19:38 |
sapier |
well ShadowNinja if it's as simple as requireing 2.0.x (x yet to find out) I don't want to use any ugly hack |
| 19:39 |
xyz |
we don't know, maybe we should ask people who do |
| 19:39 |
xyz |
is that even supposed to work |
| 19:39 |
sapier |
no shadow as we do only serialize/deserialize once on client connect ... network transmission is way slower |
| 19:39 |
ShadowNinja |
sapier: But it's not a ugly hack. |
| 19:39 |
sapier |
it is as you always have to escape your code which is quite a pain in the ass |
| 19:40 |
ShadowNinja |
Only if you use [[ and ]] in your code. |
| 19:40 |
sapier |
you can't use any ide support to find syntax errors ... just the first issue |
| 19:40 |
ShadowNinja |
And you can easily add them after writing the function. |
| 19:40 |
sapier |
WHY? |
| 19:41 |
sapier |
if irrlicht is broken and can't display polygons do we switch to asciart for everyone? |
| 19:42 |
ShadowNinja |
What? |
| 19:42 |
xyz |
haha, that's so typical for this channel |
| 19:42 |
sapier |
by now we only know luajit beta4 is broken ;-) |
| 19:42 |
sapier |
is it really an issue if a beta version of an optional lib is broken? |
| 19:42 |
ShadowNinja |
That's a rather obvious fallacy. |
| 19:43 |
xyz |
sapier: well it's not really optional |
| 19:43 |
ShadowNinja |
^ |
| 19:43 |
sapier |
I'm sorry but imho we can't fix any bad thing in world |
| 19:43 |
xyz |
it's automatically enabled when found and you can't disable it if it's found |
| 19:43 |
xyz |
and yet |
| 19:43 |
xyz |
you're missing the point, read my messages once again please |
| 19:43 |
sapier |
ok then we could check if a working version is found too |
| 19:44 |
xyz |
understanding is not very strong, I see |
| 19:44 |
xyz |
well whatever |
| 19:44 |
sapier |
I don't use luajit because it's useless to debug anything with luajit enabled |
| 19:45 |
sapier |
maybe I don't understand because of two different converstions at same time ;-) ok back what's the point I missed? |
| 19:46 |
sapier |
you can't disable it? who the hell changed this? |
| 19:47 |
sapier |
how is debugging supposed to work? ... wait I forgot minetest programmers don't use debuggers :-) |
| 19:47 |
xyz |
no, you didn't get it |
| 19:47 |
xyz |
how about this |
| 19:47 |
xyz |
you spend 5 minutes reading my messages and if you still can't understand it then I'll explain |
| 19:48 |
ShadowNinja |
sapier: I fixed the C++ exception issue. |
| 19:48 |
sapier |
I already said it doesn't work, you haven't been interested |
| 19:49 |
sapier |
or did you do additional fixes recently? |
| 19:49 |
ShadowNinja |
sapier: My patch? |
| 19:49 |
sapier |
the one prior I told you assert() doesn't work and causes follow up exceptions hiding real issues? |
| 19:50 |
ShadowNinja |
Because C++ exceptions in Lua -> C++ calls show up for me now. |
| 19:50 |
sapier |
I'll try again later, but I don't have much hope It's going to work |
| 19:51 |
ShadowNinja |
I don't know what you mean by that assert() sentence. |
| 19:51 |
sapier |
just do assert(flase) in lua |
| 19:51 |
sapier |
false |
| 19:51 |
ShadowNinja |
My patch didn't add or remove assert()s, Lua or C++ side. |
| 19:52 |
sapier |
ok xyz you thin serializing functions isn't defined ? it's as less defined as serializing in general. |
| 19:52 |
sapier |
I didn't say you added it, assert(false) is a lua function call |
| 19:52 |
ShadowNinja |
Yes, and? |
| 19:52 |
xyz |
sapier: yes, I think it's possible that it's not defined for luajit for whatever reason, it's better to ask someone familiar with stuff |
| 19:52 |
sapier |
if you use it in lua you actually expect to stop lua code immediately and see that state |
| 19:53 |
sapier |
but that doesn't work |
| 19:54 |
ShadowNinja |
Sounds like a Lua bug that I haven't experienced. :-) |
| 19:54 |
sapier |
if it doesn work for luajit 2.0.1 2.0.2 and all other "stable" versions why do you assume it's not "supported" at all instead of the way more likely explanation "bug in 2.0.0 >>beta4<<". Do you have any other information that cause you thinking this? |
| 19:56 |
sapier |
if it wasn't supported at all I'd expect it to fail in luajit beyond any fixability |
| 19:56 |
ShadowNinja |
> assert(false) print("test") -> stdin:1: assertion failed! stack traceback: ... |
| 19:57 |
ShadowNinja |
Same with non-JIT Lua. |
| 19:57 |
sapier |
it failed for me in on step callback I'll check later. I'd be glad to be able to use luajit |
| 19:57 |
ShadowNinja |
No "test" printed. |
| 19:58 |
xyz |
sapier: read my messages once again and you'll find the truth |
| 19:58 |
sapier |
and obviously I don't check every day if it works now |
| 19:58 |
xyz |
sapier: why is this always happening when I chat to you? it seems to me as you're ignoring at least half of what I'm saying |
| 19:58 |
sapier |
I'm sorry xyz, I don't know why I always missread your messages |
| 19:59 |
sapier |
do you know anyone we could ask about it? maybe the one who wrote the marshalling code? |
| 19:59 |
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| 19:59 |
xyz |
nope |
| 19:59 |
xyz |
maybe we should open an issue as a question or something |
| 20:00 |
sapier |
yes we could document which versions work in there too |
| 20:01 |
sapier |
if it's really beta versions only I'd suggest fixing cmake to not support those versions. It's way more easy then any other solution. At least on debian that's not an issue as there ain't even a luajit package in repos. Does anyone know about other distributions? |
| 20:02 |
Calinou |
no luajit package in debian? I have one on Ubuntu, so I would be surprised |
| 20:02 |
Calinou |
do you mean in debian stable? |
| 20:03 |
sapier |
yes |
| 20:03 |
sapier |
another reason why I don't have luajit installed |
| 20:03 |
sapier |
hmm ok so ubuntu has? |
| 20:04 |
sapier |
what version is ubuntu luajit calinou? |
| 20:08 |
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| 20:09 |
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| 20:11 |
Calinou |
Version: 2.0.2+dfsg-1 |
| 20:11 |
Calinou |
in saucy |
| 20:11 |
Calinou |
(libluajit-5.1-dev) |
| 20:12 |
Calinou |
raring is dead, quantal will be dead soon |
| 20:12 |
Calinou |
also look at http://packages.debian.org/search?keywords=libluajit |
| 20:12 |
sapier |
ok so I guess ubuntu based distributions wont be an issue |
| 20:12 |
Calinou |
and http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?keywords=libluajit |
| 20:12 |
Calinou |
Debian testing looks fine too |
| 20:12 |
Calinou |
and unstable |
| 20:12 |
sapier |
jessie ... next version |
| 20:13 |
sapier |
ok debian based is not an issue to as first you don't have to compile has a valid version and if you compile yourself you can choose a valid version |
| 20:13 |
sapier |
what about redhat suse fedora and bsd? |
| 20:17 |
sapier |
proller you have bsd what's bsd's luajit version? |
| 20:17 |
xyz |
you're fun |
| 20:18 |
sapier |
for what reason? what did I miss this time? |
| 20:20 |
sapier |
xyz did you have time to look for other issues then the concurrent connect limit? |
| 20:21 |
xyz |
nope, not interested |
| 20:21 |
sapier |
anyone else? |
| 20:22 |
Exio4 |
why is a concurrent connect limit an issue? |
| 20:22 |
Exio4 |
some high value for avoiding random DoS seems a nice thing |
| 20:23 |
ShadowNinja |
8 should be plenty high. |
| 20:23 |
sapier |
xyz and proller don't like it and vanessae doesn't care about it ... without anyone who want's it I will not spend time on persuading people to add it |
| 20:24 |
ShadowNinja |
And maybe the default max_users should be bumped to 32 now. |
| 20:24 |
ShadowNinja |
(Or something around there) |
| 20:24 |
Exio4 |
you like base2 numbers, don't you? ; |
| 20:24 |
Exio4 |
;P* |
| 20:24 |
sapier |
like any programmer ;-) |
| 20:25 |
Exio4 |
true true |
| 20:25 |
sapier |
maybe not lua and java programmers :) |
| 20:25 |
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| 20:25 |
ShadowNinja |
Yep. :-) |
| 20:25 |
Exio4 |
probably |
| 20:25 |
sapier |
or perl ... guess the vm programmers don't care about 2 |
| 20:26 |
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| 20:32 |
sapier |
xyz I may have missed it but for what reason did you choose 2.0.0beta4? |
| 20:32 |
sapier |
pure chance or is there something wrong with later versions? |
| 20:32 |
xyz |
sapier: I didn't, also it's beta7, not 4 |
| 20:32 |
sapier |
ok why beta7? |
| 20:33 |
xyz |
one FM user reported this issue |
| 20:33 |
sapier |
I see |
| 20:35 |
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| 20:43 |
ShadowNinja |
Wouldn't max_lag be a better value to announce as lag than the step time? |
| 20:44 |
sapier |
Can someone explain to me what max lag is supposed to be? |
| 20:45 |
PilzAdam |
sapier, AFAIK its the time spend in Lua code |
| 20:46 |
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| 20:47 |
ShadowNinja |
sapier: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/6845876/ |
| 20:48 |
ShadowNinja |
Basically dtime that decreases only slowly. |
| 20:49 |
sapier1 |
hmm ok guess we need to think about this way of determine lag later as it doesn't honor network lag |
| 20:51 |
Calinou |
sapier, a lot of desktop users use Jessie already, not necessarily a bad choice. |
| 20:51 |
Calinou |
some server users do too. |
| 20:51 |
Calinou |
but not much |
| 20:52 |
Calinou |
https://admin.fedoraproject.org/pkgdb/acls/name/luajit?_csrf_token=be21ce0f2450c29ae4d69bf0fd47d352f701f382 ? |
| 20:52 |
Calinou |
for fedora |
| 21:01 |
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| 22:11 |
Sokomine |
hmmmm: are you there? |
| 22:12 |
Sokomine |
or, more general map-related question: blocks consisting solely of air. do they take up storage space? |
| 22:17 |
xyz |
yes |
| 22:24 |
ShadowNinja |
^ But they're zlib compressed, so they should be pretty small. |
| 22:26 |
xyz |
that too |
| 22:39 |
ShadowNinja |
This happens an awfull lot, usually in pairs: collisionMoveSimple: WARNING: maximum step interval exceeded, lost movement details! |
| 22:43 |
hmmmm |
perhaps that has something to do with lagging |
| 22:56 |
Sokomine |
ShadowNinja: i just got afraid because a player sounded as if he intended to map out the entire map :-) |
| 22:57 |
Sokomine |
fortionately, he later explained that his mapping-bot sticks to ground level; that seems far less threatening |
| 22:57 |
Sokomine |
ShadowNinja: with mobs running around? |
| 22:59 |
NakedFury |
https://www.humblebundle.com/weekly?utm_source=Humble+Weekly+Sale+Newsletter&utm_campaign=82107c4317-newsletter_codemasters&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_a406d06e11-82107c4317-108957521 |
| 23:08 |
sapier |
ShadowNinja for some reason your server step is laging way to bad |
| 23:08 |
sapier |
that warning is in collision handling to avoid collision handling killing your server by adding even more lag based uppon huge steps |
| 23:13 |
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| 23:22 |
sapier |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/1116 final call for review and comments, I squashed and cleaned this one in order to merge it this weekend |
| 23:49 |
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| 23:51 |
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| 23:52 |
proller |
NOOOOOOOOOO |
