| Time |
Nick |
Message |
| 00:02 |
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| 00:47 |
VanessaE |
can we PLEASE do something about the constant re-re-re-re-re-[...]-rewriting of player files? |
| 00:48 |
us_0gb |
That would be nice. |
| 00:48 |
VanessaE |
I've got almost 24,000 of the fucking things between five servers now on my machine. |
| 00:48 |
us_0gb |
Ooh, that can't be easy on the drives. |
| 00:48 |
VanessaE |
do they really *ALL* need to be constantly rewritten all the time? |
| 00:49 |
VanessaE |
us_0gb: I've got a constant 3MB/sec write going on my disk now, which is not doing my server's performance any favors. |
| 00:49 |
kahrl |
uh, that shouldn't happen if you are running 6f6f289db4 or later |
| 00:50 |
VanessaE |
I am past that commit, |
| 00:50 |
VanessaE |
but something's eating disk bandwidth for breakfast |
| 00:51 |
VanessaE |
even when the servers are at a fairly low point (read: less than 5 users between them all) |
| 00:51 |
kahrl |
I used inotifywait to verify that the commit fixed it |
| 00:51 |
VanessaE |
ok so maybe player files aren't being rewritten then. something surely is. |
| 00:51 |
kahrl |
then again, I'm not running many mods |
| 00:52 |
us_0gb |
Could it be the map file? |
| 00:52 |
VanessaE |
us_0gb: I would blame the map file if not for this: http://digitalaudioconcepts.com/vanessa/hobbies/minetest/stats.html |
| 00:53 |
VanessaE |
look at say 0200 to 0500 or so. notice how few users there were during that time |
| 00:53 |
VanessaE |
but notice the disk usage? |
| 00:53 |
VanessaE |
it's constant. |
| 00:53 |
VanessaE |
and atop blames minetet. |
| 00:53 |
VanessaE |
minetest* |
| 00:54 |
VanessaE |
can a mod be doing this somehow? |
| 00:54 |
VanessaE |
(and if so, why isn't it causing the server in question to lag?) |
| 00:55 |
kahrl |
I don't think a mod can do it but I'm not sure |
| 00:55 |
us_0gb |
It might be worth shutting down the worlds, backing them up, and running them all as minetest_game to rule out module issues. |
| 00:55 |
kahrl |
but if it did, you wouldn't notice because, well, it used to write all player files anyway up to 6f6f289db4 |
| 00:55 |
VanessaE |
us_0gb: two of the servers DO run minetest_game. |
| 00:56 |
VanessaE |
(one heavily modded, one barely so) |
| 00:56 |
us_0gb |
The heavily-modded one doesn't count for the purposes of the experiment. THe other might. |
| 00:57 |
VanessaE |
the lightly-modded one is my so-called "Almost Vanilla" one, and it uses nothing that could conceivably do this |
| 00:57 |
us_0gb |
It might only take one module in one of the worlds. Then again, I have no idea what is going on here. |
| 00:57 |
VanessaE |
and in fact it's the most popular of the 6. |
| 00:59 |
us_0gb |
I find that very surprising. The one I hear the most talk about is the fully-loaded creative server. |
| 01:01 |
kahrl |
VanessaE: try this to gather some initial data: https://gist.github.com/kahrl/8679721 |
| 01:02 |
VanessaE |
actually I might know what it is. |
| 01:04 |
Sokomine |
i prefer the fully-loaded creative and survival servers as well. guess the reason why there are so many players on vanessas vanilla server is that it has way less media data and players do not time out |
| 01:04 |
VanessaE |
lemme see if what I just did fixed it first. |
| 01:05 |
* VanessaE |
waits for her stats scripts to collect some data... |
| 01:07 |
VanessaE |
yep, I think that did it. |
| 01:07 |
ShadowNinja |
The server keeps all files loaded and iterates over every file in the players directory to save each player file, so even if only changes are saved you are still using a lot of disk, mostly reading though. |
| 01:07 |
VanessaE |
It was PilzAdam's stats mod. |
| 01:08 |
VanessaE |
which he kept hocking me a chinik to install. fucking thing was sitting there rewriting its stats files constantly. For all six servers. generating 3.5 MB/sec of disk traffic. |
| 01:08 |
VanessaE |
for a 170K log file I think it was |
| 01:09 |
ShadowNinja |
He uses timer and timer2, and confuses them. So instead of rewriting every 30 steps (3 seconds) it writes every step after the first 30. |
| 01:10 |
ShadowNinja |
Removeing all timer2 lines except the last one and changing that to timer should fix it. |
| 01:10 |
ShadowNinja |
-e |
| 01:13 |
ShadowNinja |
https://github.com/PilzAdam/stats/pull/1 |
| 01:18 |
VanessaE |
well one thing's for sure; |
| 01:18 |
VanessaE |
my server must be DAMNED fast if it was able to keep up with THAT much disk traffic :D |
| 02:15 |
xyz |
til 3mb/s is considered much disk traffic |
| 03:40 |
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| 09:35 |
proller |
VanessaE, you know, where player files problem already fixed ;) |
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| 12:22 |
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| 12:27 |
VanessaE |
proller: if you'd read the log, you'd notice the problem was actually one of PilzAdam's mods doing wrong things, and that the "player files problem" HAS been fixed. |
| 12:27 |
proller |
no 8) |
| 12:28 |
VanessaE |
no, what? |
| 12:31 |
VanessaE |
xyz: I wouldn't have figured 3 (well, a bit over 3.5 actually) MB/sec was a lot of traffic, but I have to guess the issue stems from seek times in this case - 6 files being rewritten 5x/sec (or 10x/sec, I forget what the server step is) and competing with map loading/saving, player file loads/saves, media loads, and the other stuff my server has to do. |
| 12:31 |
xyz |
yea that was stupid |
| 12:31 |
xyz |
the bug |
| 12:31 |
VanessaE |
spinning rust can get pretty damn slow when you're slamming the heads back and forth a lot :) |
| 12:32 |
proller |
all player files still saved in every save step |
| 12:32 |
proller |
* in mt |
| 12:32 |
VanessaE |
proller: not according to the time stamps in my files. |
| 12:32 |
xyz |
BUILDCRAFT MAKES ITS GLORIOUS RETURN |
| 12:32 |
VanessaE |
xyz: oh? |
| 12:32 |
xyz |
http://www.playstarz.com/ |
| 12:32 |
VanessaE |
ha! |
| 12:33 |
VanessaE |
they're gonna have a hard time being found in a search, I think |
| 12:34 |
VanessaE |
I went looking just yesterday, hoping to find at least an outdated link or something (I don't have a copy of the client, and needed to try something)... kept finding nothing minecraft-related stuff for the mods (?) of those names. |
| 12:35 |
VanessaE |
or something like that, I'm not entirely sure what they were but they weren't the minetest forks anyway |
| 12:37 |
xyz |
could contact their domain or hosting provider |
| 12:38 |
xyz |
or call the guy since there's some phone in whois output |
| 13:16 |
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| 19:31 |
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| 19:35 |
sapier |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/1116 any comments? |
| 19:50 |
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| 19:51 |
ShadowNinja |
sapier: How does it work with old servers/clients? |
| 19:51 |
sapier |
no major issues |
| 19:52 |
sapier |
worst thing to happen is a old client may have to connect twice on media change at server |
| 19:53 |
sapier |
in exchange client disconnect, intitialization, reconnect and join is quite better |
| 20:01 |
ShadowNinja |
The server will only accept packets smaller than or equal to 1500 bytes? |
| 20:02 |
sapier |
right now it will only accept packets < 1000 bytes |
| 20:02 |
sapier |
I increased this to 1500 as this is the minimal required packet size to be compliant to ipv6 standard |
| 20:03 |
ShadowNinja |
It should accept <= -1. That way you can add maximum packet size detection in the future and send with that size. |
| 20:03 |
sapier |
no |
| 20:03 |
sapier |
the size is limited by the receive buffer which has to have a fixed size |
| 20:04 |
sapier |
and I don't think there will be a ipv8 anytime soon ;-) |
| 20:04 |
sapier |
and still we want to get rid of this protocol in mid to long term |
| 20:05 |
ShadowNinja |
L"Sorry, too many concurrent connects try again in a few minutes." --> L"Sorry, too many people are connecting at the same time. Try again in a few minutes." |
| 20:05 |
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| 20:05 |
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| 20:06 |
sapier |
yes that's very important |
| 20:06 |
ShadowNinja |
You also mix "x<<y" and "x << y". |
| 20:07 |
sapier |
where? |
| 20:07 |
ShadowNinja |
Oh, and if braces on their own lines. The line right above that DenyAccess. |
| 20:07 |
proller |
limiting connecting people - very strange |
| 20:08 |
sapier |
no quick fix for broken texture handling ... you should understand it as you are that scared about code changes ;-) |
| 20:09 |
sapier |
actually server should load textures at max once, but in fact server creates a copy of all textures for each request of client |
| 20:10 |
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| 20:10 |
ShadowNinja |
That should definitely be fixed. Does it free them on disco? |
| 20:12 |
sapier |
it frees them as soon as they're sent but do a simultaneous connect of 20 clients to a server with 200mb textures ... --> 4gb memory at once |
| 20:13 |
ShadowNinja |
That's not so bad then. |
| 20:13 |
ShadowNinja |
http://digitalaudioconcepts.com/vanessa/hobbies/minetest/stats.html Looks like there's a mem leak somewhere... Unless mods could be doing that? |
| 20:14 |
sapier |
could be loaded blocks too |
| 20:15 |
sapier |
I'm not sure about it but I think mapblocks aren't unloaded if not necessary ... but I'm not that used to mapping code maybe someone else can answer this question |
| 20:19 |
sapier |
but it's at least suspicious enough to do further investigations |
| 20:30 |
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| 20:33 |
sapier |
proller I've got a strange issue with nohead clients, I remember them moving around, but they don't do this any more. do you have any idea how the "moving" did work? |
| 20:34 |
proller |
random input? |
| 20:34 |
proller |
where is servers with 200mb textures? |
| 20:35 |
sapier |
where to get random input? |
| 20:36 |
xyz |
--random-input |
| 20:36 |
proller |
sapier, do not fix imagined issues |
| 20:36 |
sapier |
really? *g* funny ... |
| 20:37 |
sapier |
vanessaE's hdx 256 mb texture pack is about 180 mb on her full game, it's about 5 min downloading so this is far from unrealistic to have at a server |
| 20:37 |
proller |
it one server vwith average 0 players |
| 20:38 |
proller |
you want to make problems to clients of all other servers |
| 20:38 |
sapier |
yea ok with 0 players download may take about 7-10 minutes true |
| 20:39 |
sapier |
and noone needs more then 640kb memory as bill gates said years ago ;-P |
| 20:40 |
VanessaE |
bill gates never said that :P |
| 20:40 |
proller |
every servers have 8-64G memory |
| 20:41 |
xyz |
max_concurrent_joins that reta^W stupid IMO |
| 20:41 |
xyz |
s/that/that's/ |
| 20:41 |
xyz |
esp. the default limit set to 3 |
| 20:42 |
proller |
need set it to 1 ! |
| 20:42 |
xyz |
zero |
| 20:43 |
sapier |
ok wait |
| 20:44 |
sapier |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/1116 any >>>USEFULL<<< comments? |
| 20:44 |
sapier |
forgit I need to be very very very precise in here |
| 20:46 |
xyz |
yea what's non-constructive in my comment? |
| 20:46 |
xyz |
it's stupid that you set max_concurrent_joins to 3 |
| 20:46 |
VanessaE |
and for the record, NONE of my servers use big texture packs like that one. They're all at the defaults that come with their respective games/mods. |
| 20:46 |
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| 20:47 |
xyz |
it's stupid because it's only reasonable for servers that have 200 mb texture packs, 20 simultaneous client connecting to it and less than 4 gb of ram |
| 20:47 |
xyz |
but you limit it for everybody |
| 20:47 |
sapier1 |
it's a configurable setting |
| 20:47 |
sapier1 |
not a limit |
| 20:47 |
xyz |
its default is 3 |
| 20:47 |
xyz |
that's unreasonable |
| 20:48 |
xyz |
you wanted comments, here they are |
| 20:48 |
sapier1 |
and it's just a limit for simultaneous connect! |
| 20:48 |
xyz |
tbh I think it should be turned off by default |
| 20:48 |
xyz |
well what else could it be? |
| 20:48 |
sapier1 |
in practice you wont realize that limit very often |
| 20:48 |
xyz |
you just said "minetest will never get popular" |
| 20:48 |
sapier1 |
but I dont care about the number anyway |
| 20:49 |
xyz |
if you don't care about the number don't write the number |
| 20:49 |
xyz |
why did you write 3? |
| 20:49 |
xyz |
what was the reason? |
| 20:49 |
sapier1 |
so if you think 2000000 is ok I set it to that value too |
| 20:49 |
VanessaE |
sapier1: I think the point here is that the default limit should either be so insanely high as to be essentially non-existent, or it should at least be relatively high anyway |
| 20:49 |
VanessaE |
and that it can be *lowered* if it turns out to be a problem for a given piece of hardware. |
| 20:50 |
sapier1 |
because I had to set some value and if you don't need to download textures clients don't stay in "connecting" state for very long |
| 20:50 |
VanessaE |
I would guess, based on my own stats, that a limit of around 20 for this particular variable is more reasonable |
| 20:50 |
xyz |
yes as I said I think it should be disabled by default |
| 20:50 |
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| 20:50 |
VanessaE |
(if not effectively disabled) |
| 20:51 |
sapier1 |
VanessaE especially you are very lucky noone did attack your servers by now it'd be quite easy to kill em |
| 20:51 |
VanessaE |
indeed so |
| 20:51 |
VanessaE |
however OVH has some kind of DDoS protection in place, or so they say |
| 20:52 |
xyz |
haha |
| 20:52 |
sapier1 |
your default game server could allocate more then 1.5GB ram at once ... and it's only the most simple one |
| 20:52 |
VanessaE |
nevertheless, your idea is a good one in general |
| 20:52 |
xyz |
hey |
| 20:52 |
xyz |
i like it how you care about memory |
| 20:52 |
xyz |
yet you completely ignored my bug report |
| 20:52 |
sapier1 |
that ddos protection wont have any effect as client doesn't need to send a lot of packets |
| 20:52 |
xyz |
the one where you make server allocate a lot of ram |
| 20:53 |
sapier1 |
I don't make server allocate ram that code is in there for ages |
| 20:53 |
xyz |
yeah well |
| 20:53 |
sapier1 |
you could do this with ANY minetest server out there |
| 20:54 |
xyz |
wow! |
| 20:54 |
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| 20:54 |
sapier1 |
I wont add a "disable" as I don't see a reason to add that complexity, are you fine with 1000 as default? |
| 20:54 |
xyz |
probably |
| 20:55 |
xyz |
the other question is what's the point of this setting if no one is going to use it |
| 20:55 |
xyz |
anyway, didn't reviewed the code, you'll have to find someone else to do that |
| 20:55 |
Calinou |
VanessaE, their DDoS protection is "shut up and shut down your server" |
| 20:55 |
Calinou |
OVH has a track record of doing this :P |
| 20:55 |
VanessaE |
heh |
| 20:55 |
VanessaE |
well I don't plan to rely on it anyway :P |
| 20:56 |
sapier1 |
VannessaE how mad would you be at me if I crash your server ? |
| 20:56 |
VanessaE |
erm |
| 20:56 |
xyz |
that's so childish |
| 20:56 |
VanessaE |
well ask the 27 users who are on right now :P |
| 20:57 |
xyz |
what are you trying to prove? |
| 20:57 |
xyz |
that it's easy to DoS mt server? |
| 20:57 |
sapier1 |
I can remove it too but I don't wanna hear complains about "that bad guy crashed my server" later |
| 20:57 |
xyz |
your patch won't fix it |
| 20:57 |
xyz |
yeah sure |
| 20:57 |
xyz |
well I honestly don't care much |
| 20:57 |
sapier1 |
and right now someone wouldn't even have to do an attack on purpose |
| 20:57 |
xyz |
proller: make sure to revert this when merging btw |
| 21:21 |
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| 21:24 |
ShadowNinja |
max_concurrent_joins is the people downloading media at the same time, not the number of people on the server. I think about 8 is reasonable. |
| 21:32 |
ShadowNinja |
Is there a way for mods to get the server's version? |
| 21:33 |
sapier1 |
I think this wasn't added in favor of feature support flags |
| 21:34 |
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| 21:40 |
xyz |
ShadowNinja: i know right? we already have max_players |
| 21:40 |
xyz |
this doesn't make the limit less stupid |
| 21:41 |
xyz |
anyway now it feels like i'm only arguing without doing anything so let's let someone else decide if we need it |
| 21:43 |
sapier1 |
right now I don't see anyone who likes it. Imho it would harden servers to a quite simple sort of attack but guess hardening is as popular as security in minetest community ;-P |
| 21:44 |
proller |
xyz one big 1000 lines conflict expected ;( |
| 21:45 |
sapier1 |
I don't care about freeminer conflicts proller you did fork it's your issue ;-P |
| 21:46 |
proller |
no problem if conflicts good useful code |
| 21:46 |
proller |
but if it remix and fighting with imagined problems.. |
| 21:47 |
sapier1 |
It's your problem if you wanna wait till a bug really causes a problem instead of fixing it before |
| 21:48 |
proller |
01:48:27: ERROR[main]: Fatal error n=6600 : not enough memory |
| 21:49 |
proller |
hellp from mobf |
| 21:49 |
proller |
hello |
| 21:49 |
sapier1 |
did you allow a client to fly along whole map within 20 seconds again? |
| 21:49 |
proller |
no |
| 21:50 |
sapier1 |
why do you think this is a mobf issue? |
| 21:50 |
proller |
we have 6000+ road with fast allowed |
| 21:50 |
proller |
01:50:39: VERBOSE[main]: MOBF: spawning animal_vombie:vombie_spawner_at_night entity by at_night_spawner at position (7376.000000,3311.000000,91.000000) |
| 21:50 |
proller |
1000++++ |
| 21:50 |
proller |
in log |
| 21:51 |
sapier1 |
then add as much memory as required to support it |
| 21:51 |
sapier1 |
or disable vombies if your server can't handle them in combination with fast clients |
| 21:51 |
proller |
i have 32g |
| 21:51 |
proller |
1818M 1030M uwait 6 168:13 100.39% freeminerserver |
| 21:51 |
sapier1 |
I thought memory will never bee an issue? |
| 21:51 |
VanessaE |
O_O |
| 21:51 |
proller |
its lua error |
| 21:52 |
sapier1 |
no it isn't if you trigger 10000 blocks to be loaded you'll trigger 10000*mob density spawners |
| 21:52 |
proller |
3 minutes of shutdown again.. |
| 21:53 |
VanessaE |
... -> #minetest ? |
| 21:53 |
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| 21:53 |
proller |
but lua cant use more than 1-1.5G memory |
| 21:53 |
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| 21:54 |
sapier1 |
obviously it can |
| 21:54 |
sapier1 |
wait lua itself can't? |
| 21:55 |
proller |
maybe limit |
| 21:55 |
sapier1 |
-->minetest |
| 22:01 |
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| 22:17 |
paramat |
hi celeron55, sapier1, please merge the per player custom skybox https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/960 this is essential for my space realms and moonrealm mod :) |
| 22:22 |
sapier1 |
I don't see a final decision of that discussion in there. does this collide with recent time based coloring? |
| 22:22 |
ShadowNinja |
sapier1: Right, I want it to have the server reply to CTCP VERSION with it's version. |
| 22:23 |
ShadowNinja |
sfan5: You've got a good use for that pull now. :-) |
| 22:24 |
sapier1 |
I wasn't involved in that dscussion but if I remember correct version wasn't made available to mods to avoid silly modders write code like if version == X.X.X then enable feature y |
| 22:24 |
ShadowNinja |
I've added a return parameter to chatcommand functions. Normally it is simply sent with chat_send_player, but it can be captused and sent to, eg, the server's terminal or a box in a formspec(for a commandblock). I'd also like to add a scuuess return value. |
| 22:25 |
sapier1 |
I suggest looking up that discussion prior adding that version command |
| 22:25 |
ShadowNinja |
Yes, it was added because version comparison is more complicated than "if minetest.feature_i_need then ... end |
| 22:25 |
ShadowNinja |
" |
| 22:26 |
sapier1 |
and less error prone |
| 22:26 |
sapier1 |
but as I said I wasn't involved by that time and neither do I really care now |
| 22:30 |
sapier1 |
I'm gonna merge #1116 after removing the max concurrent fix this weekend so everyone is welcome to review and look for REAL problems. |
| 22:30 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/1116 -- Add proper client initialization by sapier |
| 22:41 |
* proller |
facepalm |
| 22:44 |
sapier1 |
nonsense comments to minetest please |
| 22:45 |
proller |
nonsense pulls to trash please |
| 22:46 |
sapier1 |
I'm really sorry irc doesn't have a ignore feature |
| 22:46 |
sapier1 |
did you have any VALID comment about minetest development the last two months? |
| 22:47 |
sapier1 |
maybe I missed it in between all of your "I'm pissed" comments |
| 22:48 |
ShadowNinja |
sapier1: Actually it does, /mode +q server-side, and /ignore cllient-side. |
| 22:48 |
sapier1 |
sadly my client doesn't support /ignore .. already tried |
| 22:49 |
sapier1 |
and as far as I know +q is muting I don't thing it's fair to be that rude :-) |
| 22:50 |
VanessaE |
proller G*d damn it stop trolling. ENOUGH already. |
| 22:51 |
sapier1 |
but back to 1116 I tested it with loop join/leave looped texture downloading both with no other clients and with 5 10 30 clients logged in ... just standing there. |
| 22:52 |
celeron55 |
i'm very busy with non-minetest stuff as people have probably very easily noticed, but i'll comment about two things: |
| 22:53 |
paramat |
sapier1, pull 960: there are good suggestions for future improvements, but nothing that need delay the original pull which is extremely useful to modders as it is, AFAIK it does not conflict with anything. |
| 22:53 |
sapier1 |
#960 |
| 22:53 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/960 -- set_sky()/override_day_night_ratio() by celeron55 |
| 22:54 |
celeron55 |
1) the only "issue" in #960 is the slightly non-perfect network protocol, but it's probably good enough |
| 22:54 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/960 -- set_sky()/override_day_night_ratio() by celeron55 |
| 22:54 |
celeron55 |
and nobody is going to improve on it so that's a reason to merge it as is |
| 22:55 |
sapier1 |
good enough for me, ShadowNinja it's scriptapi to any veto from your side? |
| 22:55 |
celeron55 |
2) NEVER add a function in the API to read the version of the server; it is missing completely intentionally in order to allow forks of minetest (and this was decided way before freeminer became to exists; do not let it affect your standing on the feature in any way) |
| 22:56 |
celeron55 |
exist* |
| 22:57 |
celeron55 |
(it could be that whoever here has to fork minetest some day for any purpose, and a version-based feature check immediately becomes a pain in the ass at such point) |
| 22:58 |
celeron55 |
(to both ways) |
| 23:02 |
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| 23:03 |
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| 23:09 |
ShadowNinja |
sapier1: Nope. |
| 23:09 |
ShadowNinja |
celeron55: I don't want to check the version, only use it as a response in a CTCP VERSION reply in the IRC mod. |
| 23:10 |
sapier1 |
does anyone volonter to rebase it to current master? |
| 23:10 |
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| 23:10 |
celeron55 |
but if you make it possible, then almost any modder will use it for the wrong purpose |
| 23:11 |
celeron55 |
we know from experience that modders are evil and will abuse anything that they possibly can 8) |
| 23:12 |
kahrl |
see the second latest post of "The Old New Thing" for the sadness caused by getVersion type APIs |
| 23:12 |
kahrl |
and there aren't even (officially supported) forks of Windows |
| 23:12 |
ShadowNinja |
We can add "DO NOT DEPEND ON THE VERSION FOR CHECKING FEATURES, USE IT ONLY FOR DISPLAY. USE MINETEST.FEATURES OR 'if minetest.thing_i_need' INSTEAD." TO THE DOC. |
| 23:12 |
ShadowNinja |
-Caps at the end. |
| 23:12 |
celeron55 |
ShadowNinja: doesn't matter; they'll say "works for me" |
| 23:12 |
sapier1 |
which will be ignoread |
| 23:13 |
sapier1 |
-a |
| 23:13 |
kahrl |
http://blogs.msdn.com/b/oldnewthing/archive/2014/01/28/10493174.aspx |
| 23:13 |
ShadowNinja |
We can't do anything about moders that refuse to read. |
| 23:13 |
celeron55 |
yes we can |
| 23:13 |
celeron55 |
and it's simple |
| 23:13 |
ShadowNinja |
And they'll break things in worse ways even without this feature. |
| 23:13 |
celeron55 |
i already said it 8) |
| 23:15 |
ShadowNinja |
So, the official way to get the version is "os.execute('git describe --tags --always > hash.txt ...')"? |
| 23:15 |
celeron55 |
from the standpoint of mod code, there are no versions |
| 23:15 |
ShadowNinja |
I'll add that after the patch I'm working on now. |
| 23:16 |
ShadowNinja |
Or is there something else I can read? |
| 23:16 |
sapier1 |
git describe won't work for a installed server |
| 23:16 |
celeron55 |
what kind of benefit do you expect to get from giving out a minetest version number for CTCP VERSION? |
| 23:16 |
sapier1 |
imho it should contain the version of the irc client not the server version |
| 23:17 |
celeron55 |
i guess it should say "minetest irc mod version <whatever the mod version is>" |
| 23:21 |
ShadowNinja |
celeron55: That's what it does now, but I CTCPd a server it check it's Minetest version. |
| 23:21 |
ShadowNinja |
* Received CTCP-VERSION answer from Merlin: Minetest IRC mod 0.2.0 |
| 23:22 |
kahrl |
why not simply check the serverlist? |
| 23:22 |
ShadowNinja |
I want to add " running on Minetest 0.4.x-13579ace-dirty" or some such to that. |
| 23:23 |
ShadowNinja |
The server list isn't that precise, and although in this case it will work, announcement is not madatory. |
| 23:24 |
ShadowNinja |
Actually, it isn't on the list, so that won't work. |
| 23:24 |
kahrl |
why do you need the version anyway? |
| 23:24 |
ShadowNinja |
Comments on http://ix.io/abZ ? |
| 23:24 |
ShadowNinja |
(I plan to open a PR...) |
| 23:24 |
kahrl |
I guess you could connect to the server to see its version |
| 23:25 |
ShadowNinja |
To figure out if it's running 0.4.8 or 0.4.9. |
| 23:26 |
ShadowNinja |
But why do we need these workarounds? if minetest.thing_i_need is far easier to implement than a version parser, so lazy moders won't write one. |
| 23:27 |
kahrl |
it's easier if you know about it |
| 23:27 |
kahrl |
but lazy modders don't read, so they don't know about it |
| 23:28 |
kahrl |
but they know they need a feature from version >=X, so they look for a function that checks for version X |
| 23:28 |
ShadowNinja |
They'll have to read quite a bit to get a working version parser. |
| 23:28 |
Exio4 |
modders will abuse the function anyway |
| 23:29 |
Exio4 |
even if needs to be run in an integrated brainfuck interpreter |
| 23:29 |
ShadowNinja |
Modders have abused just about every function in the MT API. |
| 23:29 |
Exio4 |
most modders aren't "pro coders" |
| 23:29 |
ShadowNinja |
But if they're looking for a version checking function they'll see the notice and use the recommended and simpler method. |
| 23:30 |
kahrl |
no, the notice is in a separate line so it won't be read |
| 23:31 |
Exio4 |
or because they'll be using more than a single feature from 0.4.9 |
| 23:32 |
Exio4 |
ShadowNinja: modders are like long time users, http://xkcd.com/1172/ |
| 23:55 |
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