| Time |
Nick |
Message |
| 01:09 |
|
GTRsdk joined #minetest-dev |
| 01:58 |
celeron55 |
http://paste.dy.fi/EDT |
| 01:58 |
celeron55 |
i have created a beast |
| 02:01 |
VanessaE |
this is test-loading old worlds? |
| 02:01 |
VanessaE |
looks good to me, I think :-) |
| 02:02 |
VanessaE |
*looks at clock*... why are you still up? |
| 02:02 |
celeron55 |
because. |
| 02:08 |
celeron55 |
https://github.com/celeron55/minetest-worldtest |
| 02:08 |
celeron55 |
it's a fucking WORK OF ART! |
| 02:09 |
celeron55 |
it just needs 0.3 to be added |
| 02:10 |
celeron55 |
somebody could look at the patches in rules.d/$tag/ and make the same thing happen |
| 02:10 |
VanessaE |
this is genius. Nice. |
| 02:13 |
celeron55 |
the patches are supposed to modify the minetest server to do exactly three things: 1) load all the MapBlocks touching (0,0,0), 2) after loading, read nodes and check if they are correctly set; print a line starting with GOOD: and a line starting with BAD: to a new file worldtest_result.txt for each test, 3) set the nodes in the certain formation |
| 02:13 |
celeron55 |
and 4) quit |
| 02:14 |
celeron55 |
s/and a line/or a line/ |
| 02:33 |
* VanessaE |
grumbles at a minecrafter in -delta. |
| 02:51 |
VanessaE |
(one of those "c55 needs to implement feature X" to make the game better, but without being able to say why, other than that he wants it) |
| 02:54 |
celeron55 |
i fully acknowledge minetest looks like shit compared to today's standards |
| 02:54 |
celeron55 |
but today's standards don't run on eg. my laptop |
| 02:55 |
VanessaE |
heh, this guy wants more than "doesn' |
| 02:56 |
VanessaE |
heh, this guy wants more than "doesn't look like shit". But what he wants is stupid like particles by default (why?), some vignette thing, mountains that 'glow' (huh?) |
| 02:56 |
VanessaE |
stuff that even I would agree is mostly useless (and I use the particles mod, go figure) |
| 02:56 |
celeron55 |
anything visual is kind of useless |
| 02:56 |
VanessaE |
exactly. |
| 02:57 |
VanessaE |
eye candy is nice but not if it gets in the way of the game actually working. |
| 03:03 |
VanessaE |
either way, I've asked him repeatedly to post these things on github. he insists it's pointless because he assumes you will react negatively. |
| 03:06 |
VanessaE |
what should I tell him, to that end? |
| 03:08 |
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| 03:09 |
celeron55 |
according to minetest-worldtest, darkrose's node timers and 16-bit content parameters can load data saved by itself and data saved by previous versions |
| 03:09 |
celeron55 |
dunno if this really proves anything though, i don't know if anything that might break anything is used |
| 03:12 |
VanessaE |
well you kinda said it already, it proves it can reload what it saves :-) |
| 03:13 |
VanessaE |
which, really, is as important as any other part of the program |
| 03:15 |
celeron55 |
ehm |
| 03:16 |
celeron55 |
well yes, but it tries to save and load only a small subset of what it should be able to |
| 03:16 |
VanessaE |
true. |
| 03:16 |
celeron55 |
also, that test does not extend to the earliest version that needs to be supported |
| 03:16 |
celeron55 |
that is, 0.3.x |
| 03:16 |
VanessaE |
consider this an "initial smoke test". |
| 03:16 |
VanessaE |
right, I assumed so |
| 03:17 |
celeron55 |
by a quick look at the code it looks like it will explode horribly when stuff made by 0.3 is fed to it 8) |
| 03:18 |
VanessaE |
haha |
| 03:18 |
VanessaE |
wouldn't be the first time that's happened ;-) |
| 03:20 |
VanessaE |
"Yeah, officer. I tried to load an 0.3 map with this newer game and pray to the FSM everything went nuts. Oh the humanity - mapblocks all over the road, nodes hanging from trees... I mean hell, look at my car - it's permanently covered in desert stone now." |
| 03:20 |
VanessaE |
:D |
| 03:33 |
VanessaE |
. o O ( Jeez, what do I have to do to get ol' sourpuss here to laugh? ) |
| 03:59 |
celeron55 |
https://github.com/celeron55/minetest-worldtest |
| 03:59 |
celeron55 |
pushed working rule for 0.3.1 |
| 03:59 |
VanessaE |
cool |
| 03:59 |
celeron55 |
http://paste.dy.fi/EMy |
| 04:00 |
celeron55 |
and it catched what i saw in the code 8) |
| 04:03 |
celeron55 |
hmm... some pre-sqlite 0.2 would be interesting |
| 04:03 |
celeron55 |
8D |
| 04:03 |
celeron55 |
i bet that wouldn't work |
| 04:03 |
celeron55 |
the code is there, but it's likely broken |
| 04:57 |
celeron55 |
== master returns all good for world generated by 0.3.1 |
| 04:59 |
VanessaE |
yay \o/ :-) |
| 05:11 |
celeron55 |
http://c55.me/random/2012-07/minetest-worldtest-testcase.png |
| 05:11 |
celeron55 |
that is the test case |
| 05:13 |
celeron55 |
3x5x3 box made of nyan cats, having a torch at the top, a glass block at the middle and air at the bottom, in such a way that the air is at 0,0,0; and there is a sign at the black node at 0,0,2 |
| 05:13 |
celeron55 |
the text of the sign is "Foo Bar" |
| 05:14 |
VanessaE |
looks good |
| 05:29 |
celeron55 |
i... guess i can push this upstream |
| 05:30 |
VanessaE |
careful, |
| 05:30 |
celeron55 |
it's network incompatible with 0.4.1 and 0.4.1 cannot open it's save files |
| 05:30 |
VanessaE |
this is darkrose's 16-bitr node ID part......right, you already got that in mind then |
| 05:31 |
celeron55 |
anyone who wants to just play the game can just use the stable branch |
| 05:31 |
VanessaE |
right |
| 05:31 |
VanessaE |
is there any way at all to work in network compat at least? |
| 05:32 |
celeron55 |
no |
| 05:33 |
VanessaE |
too bad. well if that' |
| 05:33 |
celeron55 |
there is always a way but this time it consists of too much duct tape |
| 05:33 |
VanessaE |
that's how it has to be, so be it. |
| 05:49 |
celeron55 |
-> |
| 05:49 |
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| 08:23 |
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| 08:30 |
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| 09:32 |
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| 10:12 |
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| 10:13 |
Nemo08 |
hi! |
| 10:13 |
VanessaE |
hi |
| 10:14 |
darkrose |
stfu |
| 10:14 |
VanessaE |
this channel is strictly for the purpose of discussing the minetest engine core, general chit-chat is frowned upon strongly here. |
| 10:19 |
Nemo08 |
hm |
| 11:56 |
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| 12:10 |
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| 12:22 |
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| 12:58 |
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| 15:22 |
sfan5 |
i fixed my pull request: https://github.com/celeron55/minetest/pull/163#issuecomment-7176669 |
| 15:46 |
celeron55 |
i made this http://paste.dy.fi/67m |
| 15:46 |
celeron55 |
but i am not sure if it is good |
| 15:46 |
celeron55 |
i was thinking of the way the snow mod needs to rework the place where nodes actually go when placed on snow |
| 15:48 |
celeron55 |
an another solution would be a group or a field that just says "place inside of me"; that the client could also predict |
| 15:49 |
jordach |
well, thinking about what you just said: buildable_to = true does this i think? |
| 15:49 |
celeron55 |
...NO. |
| 15:50 |
celeron55 |
as if i would be doing anything like this if the functionality existed |
| 15:51 |
celeron55 |
i feel 90% desire to kick you becaue of that; anyone who knows anything about minetest can directly say it's not what this is about |
| 15:51 |
celeron55 |
+s |
| 16:02 |
celeron55 |
...it kind of _maybe_ could be made to work that way, but i don't know how large a bunch of things it would affect |
| 16:06 |
celeron55 |
that is, if a node has buildable_to = true and a node is placed on it, the node will go in place of the node rather than on the side that was clicked (buildable_to is set basically for air, water and stuff like that; the problem here is that snow is buildable_to *but also* pointable) |
| 16:06 |
celeron55 |
it could work, but then does there exist a callback for eg. custom drops or effects in that situation |
| 16:10 |
celeron55 |
if the minetest.register_on_placenode callback had the old node as the fourth parameter, that would suit the need... kind of |
| 16:13 |
celeron55 |
i think that actually is the way to go |
| 17:00 |
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| 17:01 |
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| 17:02 |
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| 17:46 |
celeron55 |
done |
| 18:10 |
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| 19:41 |
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| 19:43 |
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| 20:23 |
celeron55 |
oh god |
| 20:23 |
celeron55 |
i am making a list of useful mods |
| 20:23 |
VanessaE |
uh oh |
| 20:23 |
VanessaE |
define "useful" :-) |
| 20:23 |
celeron55 |
there are things from like half a year ago that still work perfectly 8) |
| 20:27 |
VanessaE |
using with you likely define as "useful", and given what features you've recently added, I would suggest animatedtorches, nature_pack, doorsplus, drippingwater, junglegrass (unless you re-implement jungle biomes), locked_sign, and stairsplus |
| 20:27 |
VanessaE |
all are lightweight, and don't seem to affect performace. |
| 20:27 |
VanessaE |
+n |
| 20:28 |
VanessaE |
unifieddyes would be in that list too but we've already covered that for now. |
| 20:35 |
celeron55 |
the main thing that comes to mind is that what kind of a beast this'd make if all of these were put together |
| 20:35 |
VanessaE |
well, |
| 20:36 |
VanessaE |
I run all of those plus a bunch more, and the only time I see a performance drop is one of them runs some big CPU-hog of an ABM |
| 20:37 |
VanessaE |
but I'm not exactly running low-end hardware, so you'd obviously have to evaluate it on your laptop also |
| 20:39 |
VanessaE |
particles is nice also, but I have no idea what kind of performance impact that one will have on low-end hardware. on my machine, no impact that I can see. |
| 20:39 |
VanessaE |
(yes, that one's less than 'useful') |
| 20:40 |
celeron55 |
my laptop is basically a 15" sized netbook with a 1600x1200 pixel screen |
| 20:40 |
celeron55 |
the GPU seriously struggles to run minetest 8) |
| 20:40 |
VanessaE |
16x12? damn. beats the pathetic little thing I have :-) |
| 20:40 |
VanessaE |
(I want to say 1320x768?) |
| 20:41 |
celeron55 |
i had 1024x768, but upgraded a few weeks ago |
| 20:41 |
celeron55 |
i actually bought a version of this same laptop with an ATI GPU, but it made too much heat and fan noise |
| 20:41 |
celeron55 |
so i just threw the screen to this old one |
| 20:41 |
VanessaE |
that said, I run a pair of 1280x1024 displays off an ATI HD6870 video card on my desktop machine, so it's no slouch ;-) |
| 20:43 |
VanessaE |
re: the mods you're looking into... what's your immediate goal with them? |
| 20:43 |
VanessaE |
(versus the long-term goal of minetest in general) |
| 20:44 |
celeron55 |
is there an up-to-date trapdoor anywhere |
| 20:44 |
celeron55 |
or hatch |
| 20:44 |
celeron55 |
whatever |
| 20:45 |
celeron55 |
there is this, but it's... a fairly bit old http://minetest.net/forum/viewtopic.php?id=609 |
| 20:45 |
celeron55 |
-ly |
| 20:46 |
VanessaE |
hm, a hatch...good question |
| 20:46 |
celeron55 |
http://minetest.net/play.php |
| 20:46 |
celeron55 |
i probably need to rework the layout a bit 8) |
| 20:46 |
VanessaE |
my tex pack supports that mod but I haven't actually tried to use it |
| 20:47 |
VanessaE |
let's see what happens.... |
| 20:48 |
VanessaE |
well 0.4.1 doesn't crash with it anyway... |
| 20:49 |
VanessaE |
eh, it sorta works |
| 20:50 |
VanessaE |
I can craft a hatch, and place it, but on punch it just rises or lowers, but doesn't actually flip open/closed like it's supposed to. |
| 20:50 |
VanessaE |
and I can't dig it up because it moves out of the way |
| 20:51 |
VanessaE |
so that's a no-go for now |
| 20:51 |
celeron55 |
you probably can't dig it anyway, because it uses the pre-group digging properties |
| 20:51 |
VanessaE |
ah, that figures |
| 20:52 |
celeron55 |
otherwise i'd think it would work |
| 20:52 |
celeron55 |
well, whatever |
| 20:52 |
VanessaE |
wait, I didn't try this patch. |
| 20:52 |
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| 20:54 |
VanessaE |
er, that probably won't help. |
| 20:54 |
VanessaE |
but I'll try anyway, I have nothing better to do ;-) |
| 20:55 |
VanessaE |
haha. definitely not |
| 20:56 |
VanessaE |
screw it. :-) |
| 20:56 |
jordach |
celeron55, can you remove my Wool and Panes please? |
| 20:57 |
celeron55 |
is there any particular reason? (it doesn't matter, but i am interested) |
| 20:58 |
jordach |
yes, i have stopped supporting them, since the dyes i used were common blocks, and not a de facto mod standard |
| 20:58 |
celeron55 |
we don't have a de facto mod standard for dyes |
| 20:58 |
celeron55 |
well, maybe de facto |
| 20:58 |
jordach |
replace with this http://minetest.net/forum/viewtopic.php?id=2373 |
| 20:59 |
jordach |
thank you |
| 20:59 |
* VanessaE |
gives celeron55 oxygen |
| 21:02 |
celeron55 |
i don't like the looks of those at all |
| 21:04 |
celeron55 |
also, i don't think i will support the full unified dyes mod |
| 21:04 |
VanessaE |
:( |
| 21:04 |
jordach |
my mod supports all of the colours con-currently |
| 21:04 |
celeron55 |
yes and that is why it sucks |
| 21:05 |
celeron55 |
better have few good looking ones than 100 bad looking |
| 21:05 |
jordach |
ah |
| 21:05 |
jordach |
blame gentextures.sh |
| 21:05 |
celeron55 |
it just feels so mechanically made, and there is nothing to help it |
| 21:06 |
VanessaE |
he used an older version of the gentextures script that lacked the tinted overlay method |
| 21:08 |
VanessaE |
http://i.imgur.com/0U8YA.png |
| 21:08 |
VanessaE |
c55, is that any better? ^^ |
| 21:08 |
celeron55 |
horrible. |
| 21:08 |
VanessaE |
:( |
| 21:09 |
celeron55 |
i see i need to make the dye mod next |
| 21:09 |
VanessaE |
noooooooooo |
| 21:09 |
jordach |
good. |
| 21:09 |
jordach |
im for this |
| 21:09 |
jordach |
16 colours at best |
| 21:09 |
celeron55 |
jordach better keep keep his wool and panes around, i will use the exact same colors, with NO extra shades of any kind |
| 21:10 |
jordach |
ok ok |
| 21:10 |
jordach |
you win |
| 21:10 |
jordach |
however, i might make it so unified dyes and your dyes work in sync |
| 21:11 |
VanessaE |
c55: well at least do everyone a favor? use the same modname, so I can just rework mine to act as an 'extension' pack or something |
| 21:11 |
VanessaE |
that way existing mods don't break |
| 21:12 |
celeron55 |
no, it will be just "dyes", because if i will have an included dye mod for all of the known future, nothing else suffices |
| 21:14 |
jordach |
are we going to use the colours from my old wool mod? |
| 21:14 |
celeron55 |
i don't see any reason to not do that |
| 21:15 |
jordach |
because i noticed most servers use the old wool mod (16) |
| 21:16 |
VanessaE |
celeron55: I think implementing your own is a bad idea to be honest |
| 21:16 |
celeron55 |
jordach: ? |
| 21:17 |
jordach |
most servers today run a very old version of my wool, most notably, the 16 colour version. |
| 21:17 |
celeron55 |
can you link to it? |
| 21:17 |
jordach |
yes sure |
| 21:18 |
jordach |
http://www.mediafire.com/?d9nzvn12xmf2i2r |
| 21:18 |
jordach |
and complimentary image http://i.imgur.com/OmlIN.png |
| 21:21 |
celeron55 |
hmm, those colors seem a bit random |
| 21:23 |
celeron55 |
jordach: in how wide use you think that is? |
| 21:24 |
jordach |
mainstream servers |
| 21:24 |
jordach |
menche |
| 21:24 |
jordach |
redcrab 0.4.1 |
| 21:24 |
jordach |
pixel art |
| 21:25 |
jordach |
http://minetest.net/forum/viewtopic.php?pid=29195#p29195 |
| 21:25 |
jordach |
(modified version) |
| 21:25 |
jordach |
sdzens server |
| 21:26 |
celeron55 |
how much do you think the lesser coloured version is used? |
| 21:27 |
jordach |
11 none from what ive seen |
| 21:27 |
jordach |
and sdzen pushes 16 hard http://img696.imageshack.us/img696/1540/screenshot113753755.png |
| 21:28 |
celeron55 |
i don't see why i wouldn't be going with that then |
| 21:29 |
celeron55 |
the colors are a bit oddly chosen but i guess it just adds character to the game 8) |
| 21:29 |
VanessaE |
... |
| 21:29 |
jordach |
i attempted to bring (some) sort of balance |
| 21:30 |
jordach |
and the before wool http://minetest.net/forum/viewtopic.php?id=1012 |
| 21:31 |
celeron55 |
there is no widely used dye mod, right? |
| 21:31 |
jordach |
id say 50/50 |
| 21:31 |
VanessaE |
I'd say half the mods that need dyes use mine, the others implement their own system |
| 21:32 |
celeron55 |
hmm |
| 21:32 |
VanessaE |
but mine's fairly new so it hasn't had time to gain a lot of traction yet |
| 21:32 |
celeron55 |
i recall there is a flowers mod somewhere |
| 21:32 |
jordach |
flowers mod is around, broken and slow (spawning) |
| 21:32 |
VanessaE |
yes, http://minetest.net/forum/viewtopic.php?id=518 |
| 21:33 |
VanessaE |
nature_pack supplies a purportedly upgraded version of it |
| 21:33 |
jordach |
yes it does |
| 21:58 |
VanessaE |
celeron55: I feel the need to point out two things. 1, and I've said this before: you should not limit others' creativity. 2, if you provide only a few colors, you are limiting other modders' choices to just those, even if other colors are needed. |
| 21:59 |
VanessaE |
whereas if you provide a lot of colors, modders can choose exactly the ones they need, even if they only end up using half a dozen unique colored objects in their mod. |
| 21:59 |
VanessaE |
(the existence of a wide palette does not imply the need to utilse every color provided by it) |
| 21:59 |
VanessaE |
+i |
| 22:00 |
celeron55 |
having a million colors makes it impossible for players to just randomly mix them together and then expect to be able to color stuff with them |
| 22:00 |
VanessaE |
eh? |
| 22:00 |
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| 22:00 |
VanessaE |
that makes no sense |
| 22:00 |
jordach |
i agree |
| 22:01 |
jordach |
a million colours can give choice, but mixing any two out of that million might now have a result |
| 22:01 |
jordach |
s/now/not |
| 22:01 |
VanessaE |
that might be true if the mod didn't already cover that issue |
| 22:02 |
jordach |
and theres the problem with yours |
| 22:02 |
jordach |
MC has these limits |
| 22:02 |
VanessaE |
unifieddyes already accounts for mixing colors |
| 22:02 |
celeron55 |
you can make an extended dyes mod for those who need it |
| 22:02 |
celeron55 |
the core game has core stuff. |
| 22:02 |
VanessaE |
that's how everything beyond the full ones works. |
| 22:02 |
jordach |
celeron55, i compiled my own texture, with gimp then with gentextures.sh, which returned these two images (light colours have no half saturation) http://imgur.com/a/ZNjgl |
| 22:02 |
VanessaE |
<celeron55> horrible. |
| 22:02 |
jordach |
go on check them |
| 22:02 |
VanessaE |
;) |
| 22:03 |
sfan5 |
celeron55: what about merging my pulk now? |
| 22:03 |
sfan5 |
*pull |
| 22:04 |
VanessaE |
celeron55: You do realize all my mod does is provide a bunch of craft items, right? |
| 22:05 |
celeron55 |
i want to have dyes that players can memorize and that can have interesting ways of collecting them |
| 22:05 |
celeron55 |
remember, SURVIVAL. |
| 22:06 |
VanessaE |
right |
| 22:06 |
VanessaE |
and what's so hard about remembering mind? |
| 22:06 |
VanessaE |
red, orange, yellow....? |
| 22:06 |
VanessaE |
mine* |
| 22:06 |
jordach |
for a start |
| 22:06 |
VanessaE |
collecting them is another matter of course |
| 22:06 |
jordach |
remove, lime, redviolet and skyblue |
| 22:06 |
VanessaE |
jordach: no - that breaks the color wheel |
| 22:07 |
jordach |
three colours that are almost the same as the others |
| 22:07 |
jordach |
VanessaE, this is the point |
| 22:07 |
VanessaE |
all 12 base colors are on a 30 degree rotation from red |
| 22:07 |
VanessaE |
it's mathematically exact |
| 22:07 |
jordach |
i give up with the dyes |
| 22:07 |
jordach |
celeron want this simple |
| 22:07 |
jordach |
not everything |
| 22:08 |
jordach |
ask yourself this: would you craft every single colour in there? no, you'd probably use /giveme |
| 22:08 |
VanessaE |
why would I want to craft every last color? |
| 22:08 |
VanessaE |
that's not the point at all |
| 22:09 |
jordach |
im looking from the player here |
| 22:09 |
jordach |
because. |
| 22:09 |
VanessaE |
the formula is dead simple even for the biggest idiot players :-) |
| 22:09 |
jordach |
they might want ONE hard to reach colour |
| 22:09 |
jordach |
for their block |
| 22:09 |
jordach |
and getting 7-8 dyes for that one block is madness |
| 22:09 |
VanessaE |
name it. |
| 22:09 |
VanessaE |
WRONG!!!! |
| 22:09 |
VanessaE |
try three dyes, tops. |
| 22:10 |
VanessaE |
a base color, black, and white. |
| 22:10 |
VanessaE |
that's all you need to construct any other color in the palette. |
| 22:10 |
jordach |
you missed your half sats |
| 22:10 |
celeron55 |
VanessaE: don't you undestand? like "oh awesome, you've got dark green, you can only get that by killing X and being through Y with item Z" |
| 22:10 |
VanessaE |
celeron55: I understand NOW, you never said that part before. |
| 22:11 |
jordach |
im with celeron, too many items = too much time wasted |
| 22:12 |
VanessaE |
but in the case of unifieddyes, it's easy. stone, junglegrass, one or two flowers, coal, and if you want desaturated colors, you'll need iron too. |
| 22:12 |
jordach |
see |
| 22:12 |
VanessaE |
(iron to make a bucket, for water) |
| 22:12 |
jordach |
problem |
| 22:12 |
jordach |
that bucket which equates to 3 iron ingots, which are rare, require 8 cobble, and one coal lump |
| 22:13 |
celeron55 |
i am not making a paint program, i am making a game |
| 22:13 |
jordach |
and the water source, which there might not be any |
| 22:13 |
VanessaE |
celeron55: you're limiting creativity. |
| 22:13 |
celeron55 |
if somebody wants to make a paint program of it, they can always make independent mods |
| 22:13 |
sfan5 |
i never get an answer to my qeustion |
| 22:13 |
jordach |
im going to sit in the corner now, this has gone too far |
| 22:13 |
VanessaE |
but I get your point. |
| 22:13 |
sfan5 |
>.< |
| 22:13 |
celeron55 |
limiting creativity? so what? |
| 22:13 |
jordach |
the engine must |
| 22:14 |
jordach |
have a simple yet good balance* |
| 22:14 |
VanessaE |
because you yourself said one should "leave all creative decisions to me" |
| 22:14 |
VanessaE |
or words to that effect |
| 22:14 |
VanessaE |
that's a major FAIL |
| 22:14 |
celeron55 |
i am BALANCING A GAME FOR THE FUTURE |
| 22:14 |
VanessaE |
you've made a wonderful game. |
| 22:15 |
jordach |
i give up on this dye thing |
| 22:15 |
VanessaE |
ok, you know what? I give up. you're not going to listen. |
| 22:15 |
celeron55 |
i know your point, and you know my point |
| 22:16 |
VanessaE |
fair enough. |
| 22:16 |
jordach |
i think our problem here is the two opposing sides, one wants EVERYTHING in a nutshell, and the other wants something that WORKS |
| 22:16 |
celeron55 |
no |
| 22:17 |
celeron55 |
in a nutshell: VanessaE wants a creative sandbox; i want a balanced game |
| 22:17 |
VanessaE |
celeron55: wrong. |
| 22:17 |
VanessaE |
that's not what I want |
| 22:17 |
jordach |
bias is in everything |
| 22:18 |
jordach |
thats our problem |
| 22:18 |
VanessaE |
what I want is for the player - or rather the *modder* - to have enough options that they don't *have* to go looking for another, and another, and yet another addon, at least in this case |
| 22:18 |
celeron55 |
i can tell you a secret: if a dye has color #aa7700, the color your item gets from it doesn't need to be #aa7700 |
| 22:19 |
VanessaE |
of course not - but it needs to be *logical* |
| 22:19 |
celeron55 |
any amount of colors give room to be logical |
| 22:19 |
VanessaE |
ok, |
| 22:19 |
VanessaE |
from jordach's 32-color set, |
| 22:19 |
jordach |
bleh |
| 22:20 |
VanessaE |
how would you get a nice, pale blue bundle of wool? Nevermind what it'll be used for. |
| 22:20 |
jordach |
huh, sorry VanessaE, but what you just said gave me an excellent idea |
| 22:21 |
jordach |
i never thought about it like that |
| 22:21 |
VanessaE |
you'd either have to: |
| 22:21 |
VanessaE |
1, craft a white block and some straight blue dye to make blue block, then craft that with a couple of white blocks |
| 22:21 |
VanessaE |
+a |
| 22:21 |
VanessaE |
or 2, craft blue and white dyes and add the result to a white block. |
| 22:22 |
celeron55 |
i DO NOT want to have more core dye colors than that which anything colorable can support, because it's fucking lame if you tweak a perfect color, then color something with it and instead of your exact pale blue it gets colored blue |
| 22:22 |
jordach |
how i mixed the wool (white + blue) would create 2 light blues, because, you strained half of the blue colour, into the other block, so that gives logic its balance, plus difficulty, because they cannot be returned to their previous colour |
| 22:23 |
celeron55 |
maybe there should be a color enhancer dye, a darkener dye and a lightener dye that can be supported by items as an extra thing after the core dyeing if they wish to have a million colors |
| 22:23 |
jordach |
so lets say we have 6 central colours |
| 22:23 |
jordach |
bobblocks does this |
| 22:23 |
jordach |
and we want a VARIANT |
| 22:24 |
* VanessaE |
grumbles |
| 22:24 |
jordach |
so we, (player/modder) must make that themselves |
| 22:24 |
VanessaE |
did either of you read the standard I published on this? it's all there in the parent post |
| 22:24 |
VanessaE |
if a modder gets stupid and strays from the standard, it'll be no different whether you have 12 base colors or 2. |
| 22:25 |
VanessaE |
but, do whatever you want I guess |
| 22:26 |
jordach |
i think roygbiv should be the standard |
| 22:26 |
jordach |
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roy_G._Biv |
| 22:26 |
celeron55 |
i hate it how you constantly approach this like an image manipulation program |
| 22:27 |
* VanessaE |
shrugs |
| 22:27 |
jordach |
i guess we are over thinking this |
| 22:29 |
jordach |
lets go to the start of this |
| 22:29 |
jordach |
<celeron55> jordach better keep keep his wool and panes around, i will use the exact same colors, with NO extra shades of any kind |
| 22:29 |
jordach |
and that should have stayed there |
| 22:30 |
celeron55 |
no, i'm going with the one being used on servers |
| 22:30 |
jordach |
my 16 engine? |
| 22:30 |
celeron55 |
. |
| 22:32 |
jordach |
sorry about that, spaced for a second. so the mod i coded (on a broken laptop,) is actually the most balanced? |
| 22:33 |
celeron55 |
it isn't, but that is the catch of it |
| 22:33 |
celeron55 |
it's always interesting to base things on stuff that occurred by chance |
| 22:33 |
jordach |
so, its hit the target target, but in the wrong place for a kill? |
| 22:34 |
jordach |
50/50 in other words |
| 22:35 |
|
jordach left #minetest-dev |
| 22:44 |
celeron55 |
hmm, this night started with a nice feeling, and stopped with crap |
| 22:50 |
VanessaE |
sorry to bring you down like that |
| 22:51 |
celeron55 |
there is one color in this set that just can't be a dye |
| 22:52 |
celeron55 |
gold. |
| 22:52 |
* celeron55 |
deletes line |
| 23:13 |
VanessaE |
I'll say one last thing re: dyes and then I'll shut up about it forever: you say I treat minetest like a paint program. I say, you have apparently not been playing the game on public servers: EVERYONE treats it that way. |
| 23:13 |
VanessaE |
(and that's in "survival" mode, btw) |
| 23:31 |
celeron55 |
minetest has no survival or creative mode currently |
| 23:32 |
celeron55 |
regarding to what the words mean in my mind |
| 23:55 |
|
VanessaE left #minetest-dev |
