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IRC log for #minetest, 2019-09-18

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:02 Sketch2 fyi:  had an unruly spammy  <Trolololololololol> on VE's servers the other day.  same IP as cautiouspotato (~cautiousp@115.99.16.93)
00:11 codic no i already have git master
00:11 codic I'm asking how would i apply one of the new "layouts" you have posted screenshots of
00:13 codic uh oh
00:13 codic i tried to change the config
00:14 codic BUT now i dont have text
00:14 codic and i cant change it back
00:14 codic rubenwardy?
00:16 codic celeron55 is here!
00:20 codic ok i changed it back
00:24 codic and i got the mc like font
00:24 codic rubenwardy how would you aplpy one of your layouts?
00:24 rubenwardy I'm going to sleep now
00:25 rubenwardy it's a pr, you need to pull in the changes using git
00:25 codic oh ok
00:25 codic I'm not experienced with git, would anyone mind telling me how?
00:26 codic :( oh well...
00:29 codic figured it out
00:29 codic downloading the pr
00:30 codic but how do you apply or?
00:30 codic fatal: refusing to merge unrelated histories
00:30 codic i suck at vcs sorry
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00:40 codic aldenp joined and left and joined
00:41 aldenp haha
00:42 codic lol thats what it says
00:43 kurtzmusch he forgot the cloack = )
00:43 aldenp oh interesting, your client must combine join/leave messages
00:43 codic XD
00:43 aldenp what client do you use?
00:43 codic its matrix
00:43 codic riot actually
00:43 aldenp oh I see
00:43 codic riot.im
00:44 codic but you can press expand lol
00:44 kurtzmusch did you rejoin for ip masking?
00:44 aldenp no I was just switching to my VPN, since I needed it to log into my server
00:45 codic lol
00:45 kurtzmusch so no, but yes
00:45 aldenp exactly :P
00:50 BluedelaOof[m] ~~matrix ftw~~
00:51 BluedelaOof[m] it won't do strikethrough, oof
00:51 codic ~~what is ftw~~
00:51 ShadowBot codic: Error: You must be registered to use this command. If you are already registered, you must either identify (using the identify command) or add a hostmask matching your current hostmask (using the "hostmask add" command).
00:51 BluedelaOof[m] for the win
00:51 codic oh ok
00:51 codic are you using matrix now?
00:52 aldenp meh, I like the idea of matrix but I feel like the federation architecture will gradually become more centralized as the userbase increases, not to mention clients like riot that completely defeat the point right off the bat
00:52 BluedelaOof[m] ye
00:52 codic # Markdown
00:52 codic did you see the header?
00:52 codic ~s~
00:52 codic ~~sa~~
00:52 aldenp then again I'm using a centralized IRC server so I shouldn't complain
00:52 codic lol
00:52 BluedelaOof[m] lol
00:52 codic its actually pretty nice
00:52 aldenp markdown isn't formally a part of the matrix spec I think? pretty sure it's up to client implementation
00:52 codic true
00:52 codic but most clients have it
00:53 kurtzmusch my client doesnt do anything with ~~this~~ = (
00:53 codic :( lol
00:53 BluedelaOof[m] minetest matrix client when
00:53 kurtzmusch what does it do ?
00:53 BluedelaOof[m] strikethrough
00:54 codic https://github.com/diggers-mt/matrix_chat
00:55 aldenp I like the idea of federation but federated protocols have been tried before and what seems to end up happening most of the time is people just use whatever provider is easiest and as a result the platform becomes more or less centralized (eg 44% of email users use gmail, with another 26% using yahoo, so although email is a federated protocol it's ruined by the simple fact that people are lazy)
00:58 codic which is why there are so many homeservers
00:58 aldenp true, but I think that's primarily because most matrix users are this point are the nerdy type :P
00:59 aldenp the average person is likely just going to default to matrix.org because they can't be bothered to look up an alternative (which is why imo matrix.org shouldn't be running a homeserver, to force people to use others, but whatever)
01:01 aldenp that said, matrix is certainly promising, or at the very least better than IRC; the main reason I haven't switched yet is because I haven't found any good clients, I've tried 3 or 4 and all of them either wouldn't run or had serious issues (like one client that duplicated every message for some reason)
01:01 aldenp clients are obviously something that can be easily fixed, though
01:02 codic what have you tried?
01:02 codic officcial riot is nice
01:02 aldenp I forget which ones, actually
01:02 codic or spectral
01:02 codic what os?
01:02 aldenp I tried pretty much everything listed on matrix.org
01:02 aldenp linux
01:03 aldenp riot kinda defeats the entire point imo; you're connecting to a decentralized chat through a centralized client, what's even the point
01:03 codic oh ok
01:03 codic try spectral or fractal
01:03 codic btw which desktop do you use?
01:03 codic im using kde
01:03 aldenp fractal I tried
01:03 aldenp I'm using i3
01:03 codic fractal is ok
01:03 codic i3 is nice
01:03 codic spectral is best tho
01:04 aldenp pretty sure I tried that as well, it's been almost a year though
01:04 aldenp I did hear there's a matrix plugin for weechat which I might try
01:07 nepugia riot is not a centralized client though
01:07 aldenp it runs on a single centralized webserver, riot.im
01:07 aldenp it's technically open source but I don't see anyone running their own instances
01:07 nepugia riot is just a bunch of js that runs clientside
01:08 nepugia you can just download it and run it locally if you want, additionally some homeservers run their own associated instances
01:08 aldenp iirc it also has serverside code noncompliant with the matrix spec
01:08 nepugia and i do agree that matrix.org shouldnt run a matrix server :) (which is why i banned the hs from my room)
01:08 aldenp correct me if I'm wrong but you still have to sign into a riot account on the desktop app, right?
01:08 nepugia there is no "riot account"
01:09 aldenp there was last I used it
01:09 nepugia there wasn't riot.im is not a homeserver
01:09 aldenp I know it's not a homeserver
01:09 nepugia and the desktop app is just a fancy electron wrapper around the aforementioned js
01:10 aldenp this was why I was so confused when I first tried it; there's a riot account which gives you access to their centralized web services, and additionally you have to register on a homeserver like normal
01:10 aldenp maybe I'm just very wrong but that's what their website seems to imply as well
01:10 aldenp https://riot.im/app/#/welcome
01:10 nepugia I think you are confusing something, there still is no riot account and there never was
01:11 aldenp fairly certain I'm not
01:11 aldenp maybe it's only on the web and not the "desktop" version
01:11 nepugia they are literally the same piece of software
01:12 aldenp I mean then why does that link I gave prompt to register an account
01:12 nepugia but the android and ios clients are each different products
01:12 aldenp wait ok I'm wrong
01:12 aldenp :P
01:12 nepugia aldenp: uhm, why wouldn't it? you need a hs account on some homeserver to use the client
01:12 aldenp yeah I didn't realize it was just a shortcut for registering on a homeserver
01:13 aldenp I swore there was some other mechanism going on before though... meh
01:13 aldenp I'm just dumb :P
01:13 nepugia anyway, for clients i personally like (use and test) quaternion
01:13 aldenp that said I also dislike electron (cough cough uses half my cpu for no reason), so I'd rather stick with a proper desktop client :P
01:14 aldenp I think I might've tried quaternion before, can't remember whether it worked for me or not
01:14 nepugia well, it is chromium, dunno what you expect from it
01:14 aldenp yeah lol
01:14 nepugia well, if it doesn't work (as in broken stuff) you can always complain about it
01:15 aldenp I'd love to see a more academic investigation on the tradeoffs betweeen federation and p2p
01:15 nepugia one works when your phone is off the other doesn't
01:15 aldenp p2p can have chat syncing as well
01:16 aldenp the downside with p2p is that it requires much more complex mechanisms for preventing spam and ensuring messages are delivered, although federated protocols share many of the same issues
01:17 aldenp actually, I wonder how matrix deals with spam anyways...
01:17 nepugia It all depends, but in the core core defirence it is really just the difference between my phone talking to yours, or my phone talking to my bouncer talking to your bouncer talking to your phone
01:17 nepugia both can work
01:17 aldenp yea
01:17 nepugia eh, kinda... you can redact messages in matrix, but there is no immunity against spam there either
01:18 aldenp my concern is with someone spamming new accounts and sending messages en masse into a channel as a sort of denial of service attack
01:18 nepugia anyway.. before i drag of this channel into more offtopic, feel free to pm me on @nep:pink.packageloss.eu
01:19 aldenp haha
01:19 nepugia matrix has had other attacks already that werent nice, but automated ddos spam i havent seen yet, although the api does rate limit some stuff
01:20 aldenp yeah the matrix.org hack was pretty insane, although that had nothing to do with matrix itself
01:21 nepugia yeah, it didnt have anything to do with the protocol itself, mean more like state resets and such bs (reset the state of who is admin and whatnot to a previous point in time)
01:21 aldenp huh, didn't know that was a thing
01:21 nepugia gonna go to sleep now... late for me, do feel free to pm me if you would like to talk more about this
01:21 aldenp ok cya
02:01 blaise hey, so.. what do we do if we install a texture pack from the online content browser, and the texture pack tab never show sup in the main menu?
02:02 codic which texture pack?
02:02 blaise HDX-128 by VanessaE
02:04 codic hmm.. works for me
02:04 codic try restarting minetest
02:05 blaise ahh, it's not a tab, but a button on the bottom right that says enable texture pack
02:05 blaise lmao
02:05 blaise was totally hiding from me
02:05 codic lol
02:05 codic XD
02:05 codic thats a nice joke :)
02:06 codic i thought it was soome glitch
02:06 codic what os are you on?
02:06 blaise GNU/Linux
02:06 codic yay
02:06 codic which distro and desktop?
02:06 codic and its Linux not GNU/Linux imho
02:07 blaise i toss back and forth between gentoo and funtoo... and I use fluxbox for gaming and plasma for normal ery day driver
02:07 codic oh ok
02:07 codic plasma is the bes
02:07 codic but i use xfce for gaming
02:07 codic really try manjaro
02:08 blaise I can't..
02:09 blaise there's a long standing fraternal fewd between people I hang with and live around, and the guys behind redhat...
02:09 blaise feud..
02:09 codic what?
02:09 blaise that, and I have a loathsome passionate hate for RPM
02:10 blaise I'll go back to slackware first.. XD
02:10 codic manjaro dosent use rpm lol
02:10 blaise o.O
02:10 codic but what feud?
02:10 blaise honestly, I don't even remember how it started..
02:11 blaise it was at some party....
02:11 blaise almost 30 years ago
02:11 blaise fsck I'm old.. =[
02:11 codic XD
02:11 codic what is it about?
02:12 blaise I believe it may have had something to do with package management and archive types..
02:12 blaise something about how tarballs already had all the stuff implemented that RPM was supposed to accomplish
02:14 blaise never the less.. it successfully ended the party..
02:14 blaise so no redhat, manjaro, or any of those rh based distro's
02:15 blaise or, wait.. manjaro is based on arch?
02:15 blaise well, I guess that can't be too bad then... XD
02:16 codic XD
02:16 blaise codic: does it support ABS ?
02:16 blaise I think I was thinking of mandrake linux or something
02:16 blaise no....
02:17 blaise gah, what was I thinking
02:17 codic idk what that is lol
02:18 blaise https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a3/Redhat_family_tree_11-06.png
02:19 blaise it is mandrake
02:19 blaise evil nastyness
02:19 codic oh ok
02:19 blaise buyer beware
02:28 blaise awe man
02:29 blaise itemdrop mod doesn't work with minetest-5.0.1
02:29 * blaise produces sad face
02:30 codic then 5.1.0?
02:30 BluedelaOof[m] Lol my phone did parkour
02:30 BluedelaOof[m] I'm back
02:30 codic blaise: ya know how to merge git prs with local repo?
02:32 blaise I haven't tried 5.1.0
02:32 blaise what is a prs?
02:33 BluedelaOof[m] > https://github.com/diggers-mt/matrix_chat
02:33 BluedelaOof[m] I think that's more of a bridge
02:34 BluedelaOof[m] > what is a prs?
02:34 BluedelaOof[m] Pull Requests I think
02:35 codic i meant pr as in git pr sry
02:35 codic pull request
02:35 codic it is a bridge
02:36 * codic uploaded an image: image.png (573KB) < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/rxDJHNVgxdrhpTXqeoPQEMZh >
02:36 BluedelaOof[m] *I have it installed, actually, just haven't used it successfully*
02:36 codic can irc users see that image?
02:37 codic https://i.imgur.com/dBlF14H.png
02:37 codic ok now you should be able ot
02:37 codic like it?
02:37 codic *to
02:38 BluedelaOof[m] ye, though it seems a bit crowded
02:38 BluedelaOof[m] I feel like a vertical splitscreen might be better
02:39 codic oh no i just did that for the screenshot lol
02:39 codic i meant the font
02:39 BluedelaOof[m] oh lol
02:39 codic its a minecraft font
02:39 codic works pretty good
02:39 codic wanna know how?
02:39 BluedelaOof[m] Nice
02:40 BluedelaOof[m] settings I think
02:40 BluedelaOof[m] you provide a path to a font file
02:41 codic yup
02:41 codic http://dl1.fontspace.com/download.ashx?guid=a146cdd53e6b4cb7b05e7cf0c2c89afc&amp;name=jdgraphics_minecraft.zip
02:41 codic thats the font
02:45 BluedelaOof[m] ~~I see discord on your taskbar~~
02:45 codic dock
02:45 codic so,
02:45 blaise lol
02:45 codic why cant i use discord?
02:46 BluedelaOof[m] I'm not saying you can't, I use it too
02:46 codic you have been typing for so long
02:46 codic oh ok lol
02:46 codic whats your username?
02:46 BluedelaOof[m] Lol
02:46 codic ok
02:46 codic i sent a friend request to lol lol
02:46 BluedelaOof[m] lol
02:47 codic what is it? lol
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06:19 BuckarooBanzai5 !tell GreenDimond Recommended specs page: https://github.com/minetest-tools/mapserver/blob/master/doc/recommended_specs.md
06:19 MinetestBot BuckarooBanzai5: yeah, yeah
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08:20 jas_ !title https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0mEujyNWc9Q
08:20 MinetestBot jas_: 4u [df.] - YouTube
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10:01 jas_ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OY1PO2l7xFc <-- 30 minute lavaland longplay lol
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13:43 Andrey01 BluedelaOof, I know name of the inv, but I can not find lines in inventory.lua where that inventory list is defined (formspec string)
13:44 Andrey01 Can you please say a line number?
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13:47 Andrey01 It's not in third argument of sfinv.make_formspec() that is on 111 line
13:47 Andrey01 https://github.com/minetest/minetest_game/blob/master/mods/creative/inventory.lua#L111
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15:15 nvz Wuzzy: 5.0.1+repack-2 is in testing and unstable idk why buster just released with such an old version :P
15:16 Wuzzy thats debian for you. i hate debian with a passion
15:16 Wuzzy because of their outdated package policy
15:16 nvz the same version is in buster-backports
15:16 nvz the latest
15:16 Wuzzy but thats the thing. why make users jump through hoops? just remove the hoops
15:16 nvz those issues have improved a lot over the years.. we now actually change versions of things like browsers and such
15:17 nvz its about the priorities.. which is stability and freedom foremost..
15:17 Wuzzy anyway i think minetest has huuuuuuge potential, much of which is still untapped. Inside The Box gives already a glimpe of what things you can do with it
15:18 Wuzzy but minetest still has sooo many issues. mostly the main menu, controls are a little bit insane (but just a little bit), entities are a complete clusterfuck, and as a result, all mobs suck
15:19 Wuzzy I think UI is currently Minetest's biggest problem. not just the main menu actually
15:19 Wuzzy its also such basic things like the font
15:19 Wuzzy there's one font for the entire game, and its tiny, and you cant change it as a game.
15:20 Wuzzy you can change it as an user, but chances are high you probably screw up a lot of game/mod UIs
15:20 Wuzzy I'm sure all of the issues will be fixed eventually. its just a matter of time.
15:20 Calinou I also find the default font to be too small
15:22 Wuzzy oh that reminds me
15:23 Wuzzy the main menu redesign totally must take a new font into account. even if its not actually used immediately
15:24 Wuzzy otherwise the design will assume the tiny font, and probably use tiny widgets everywhere … and this will just bite us in the ass later
15:24 sfan5 is there an issue open that proposes bigger fonts?
15:25 Wuzzy i want to bet there is
15:25 kurtzmusch "entities are a complete clusterfuck" im really hoping CSM will remedy this
15:26 Wuzzy https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/4898
15:26 Wuzzy ohh noooo! not csms again!
15:26 Wuzzy csms cant fix a rotten core
15:26 Wuzzy its not just efficiency. its the entity API as well
15:26 kurtzmusch = (
15:27 Wuzzy entities are not well designed imo
15:27 kurtzmusch it seems to me that even on singleplayer entities lag half a second or more, maybe the protocol for internet isnt good either.. ?
15:27 Wuzzy it seems entities and players are very similar but they're not
15:28 Wuzzy i mean, a lot of player functionality is not present for entities (like falling to the ground). so basic features must be 100% replicated in lua. really ugly
15:29 Wuzzy theres also no entity aliases, or entity groups (except damage groups, but they're different)
15:29 Wuzzy lack of aliases makes "renaming an entity" especially annoying
15:30 Wuzzy and the whole function set is just weird. the whole player <-> entity relationship is a little crazy
15:30 nepugia kurtzmusch: i dont think that csm will do anything for entities :)
15:30 Wuzzy you can set velocity for entites. you cant for players
15:30 nepugia and minetest doesnt even have csm mods in the sense that gmod has them, only the equivalent of user scripts
15:30 Wuzzy players have gravity. for entities you must code it by hand
15:31 Wuzzy sfan5: https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/4898 https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5105
15:31 sfan5 well that's not about the default font size
15:32 Wuzzy wow
15:32 Wuzzy lol apparently theres indeed no issue about default font size
15:33 Wuzzy i thought this is such an obvious missing feature that someone MUST have posted it before. haha
15:33 kurtzmusch will csm allow to control position/rotation animation of entities: if yes then we might have decent mobs
15:33 Wuzzy btw a much overlooked recent feature addition for entities was rotation in all 3 axes
15:34 Wuzzy that was one major lacking feature. glad its available now. i already used it in MCL2 for flying arrows :)
15:35 Wuzzy previously, only rotation around 1 axis (yaw) was possible
15:35 kurtzmusch nice
15:35 nepugia Wuzzy: huh, the default font size has always been adequate for me :)
15:35 nepugia i guess that heavily depends on the device you play on though
15:35 Wuzzy another issue about font is that its not monospace
15:36 Wuzzy i believe this has been brought up 1 million times before
15:36 nepugia kurtzmusch: no, because servers cant provide clientside mods with the current architecture
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15:37 kurtzmusch i thought that server provided csm was the current focus for development...
15:37 nepugia well, the current csm that is there isnt that at all
15:37 kurtzmusch iirc 5.0 had breaking changis to allow for this
15:38 nepugia the current clientside mods don't even have set camer angle calls, (but the serverside variant does) which is kinda stupid
15:41 kurtzmusch Wuzzy: you mentioned ITB... the reason its a good game its because its gameplay doesnt rely on any entity = )
15:42 Wuzzy hehehe
15:42 Wuzzy well not 100% true.
15:42 kurtzmusch games that rely on entitys are bound to look/feel bad/unpolished imo
15:42 Wuzzy you forgot falling nodes
15:43 kurtzmusch huum, true
15:43 Wuzzy kurtzmusch: yeah i have that impression too
15:43 Wuzzy falling nodes are pretty much a solved problem thankfully
15:43 Wuzzy I think entities also have a lot of problems with collision
15:44 Wuzzy there's so many issues in MCL2 that surround mobs ...
15:45 nepugia Wuzzy: that you can't dig falling nodes seams like a problem to me though, i don't think they are solved as such really
15:45 nepugia (also lighting)
15:55 codic rubenwardy; how would i pull in your pr?
15:56 codic for the new layouts
15:56 codic and the how would i change the layout?
15:56 codic to the vertical one where all menu items are on the left
15:56 codic * and  how would i change the layout?
15:58 Wuzzy dig falling nodes? it never bothered me
15:58 Wuzzy they fall so fast its been never a problem for me
15:59 Wuzzy sfan5: here you go: https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/8948
15:59 codic why would you dig falling nodes?
15:59 codic they fall way too fast
16:00 codic a good font is: https://www.urbanfonts.com/fonts/Minecraft.font
16:00 codic i use it
16:00 codic pretty good
16:00 codic works on linux
16:01 Wuzzy but it surely breaks many game uis, doesnt it?
16:01 Wuzzy or do you only use the smallest font size?
16:02 codic no it dosent
16:02 codic i use the standard font size
16:02 codic and mineclone 2 and minetest game w/ dreabuilder
16:02 codic work
16:02 codic post screenshots work
16:02 codic i will post screenshots later i mean
16:02 codic Sorry I was typing WAY too fast lol
16:04 Wuzzy hmmm not too bad actually
16:04 Wuzzy i'm trying it
16:04 codic ok
16:04 Wuzzy sadly, its missing umlauts
16:04 codic pretty cool
16:04 nepugia Wuzzy: acumalitive it is annoying me, for example when a lot of sand is falling down
16:04 codic umlauts?
16:05 codic oh ok
16:05 Wuzzy äöüÄÖÜ
16:05 codic but minetest dosent need them
16:05 codic unless we type in another lang
16:05 nepugia although it also annoys me that dig progress doesnt stay on a block for some time, though that is especially annoying with faster tools
16:05 nepugia codic: why /wouldnt/ you dig them?
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16:06 Wuzzy hmmm speaking of fonts
16:06 Wuzzy i should probably start using larger fonts regularily
16:06 Wuzzy so i immediately see where my UI breaks :)
16:06 nepugia I mean, if you want a lot of sand digging in a straight line makes sense, but each time the falling sand entity falls into your view your dig progress just gets reset, and you have to wait for it to settle to continue making dig progrees
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16:14 Wuzzy codic: i like Minecraftia better: https://www.urbanfonts.com/fonts/Minecraftia_2_0.font
16:14 Wuzzy its even under libre license CC BY-SA 3.0 (yay!)
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16:47 MinetestBot [git] SmallJoker -> minetest/minetest: Inventory: Properly revert client predictions (#8945) 94a5df7 https://git.io/Je3vx (2019-09-18T16:47:09Z)
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17:19 MinetestBot [git] SmallJoker -> minetest/minetest: Settings: Prevent mutex deadlock in remove() (#7803) 4271889 https://git.io/Je3fQ (2019-09-18T16:48:41Z)
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17:38 BuckarooBanzai Spammer in the forum: https://forum.minetest.net/search.php?author_id=25417&amp;sr=posts
17:48 clavi there should be a report function in the forum
17:49 clavi I mean directly on someone's profile
17:49 BuckarooBanzai clavi: or more moderators....
17:51 DS-minetest just reporting one post should be enough, the moderators can then look at the users posts
18:02 clavi okay
18:07 clavi why does minetest.net not redirect to www.minetest.net but instead serve an invalid TLS cert?
18:14 Astrobe Technically you need a valid cert to have a brwoser accept anything including a redirection, but I guess this does not really answers the question.
18:15 nepugia maybe it is the same cert for both but only www. is in the cert?
18:15 nepugia my browser doesnt let me inspect it, gonna look up the openssl syntax...
18:17 Astrobe Is it not the site managed by someone a bit hostile to the MT community? Or was it minetest.com?
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18:32 Astrobe nope, it seems to be minetest.org. I have no cert issue with minetest.net, with or without www btw.
18:35 nepugia minetest.net:443 ->  Verify return code: 18 (self signed certificate)
18:35 nepugia maybe your cert store has more stuff than mine ;)
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18:39 MinetestBot [git] sfan5 -> minetest/minetest_game: Fix more translation strings (#2487) b4c7522 https://git.io/Je3UG (2019-09-18T18:38:27Z)
18:43 Astrobe Might be the case. I have two suspicious certificates; also one for dev.minetest.net for some reason.
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18:44 Krock Both Let's Encrypt. Safe to me
18:46 nepugia Krock: issuer=/C=FI/CN=everything.8dromeda.net
18:46 nepugia openssl s_client -showcerts -connect minetest.net:443
18:49 Krock nepugia: it's about dev.minetest.net. there are different certs
18:50 nepugia Krock: eh, minetest.net:443 sais self signed for me regardless
18:51 Astrobe But I thought dev.minetest.net was evil? ;-)
18:51 * DS-minetest tries to make it a bit less evil
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19:58 Wuzzy how can move threads to Mod Releases? https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?f=11&amp;t=10418
19:58 Wuzzy who*
19:59 DS-minetest a person that is too lazy to do so
19:59 DS-minetest multiple persons*
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20:23 kurtzmusch can i name variables starting with _ in lua ?
20:24 DS-minetest sure
20:24 kurtzmusch ok thangs
20:24 DS-minetest you can also name your variable __ or _
20:24 DS-minetest afaik
20:25 kurtzmusch so mods dont acces my globals
20:25 kurtzmusch like modname={} is for public acces and _modname={} for mod access only
20:26 sfan5 you can also just use a file-scoped local
20:26 kurtzmusch but i like to have many files
20:27 kurtzmusch and variables accessible between them
20:27 kurtzmusch but no truly global, like mod-scoped
20:28 kurtzmusch i think its a C thing to put an _ in front of vars that are internal for libraries...
20:28 sfan5 not impossible https://github.com/minetest/minetest/blob/master/builtin/game/init.lua#L8
20:28 sfan5 see also line 31 and the referenced file
20:29 calcul0n i'd rather use modname = { global_var=..., _private_var=... } but that's a matter of style
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20:39 codic Wuzzy: i never knew, thx!
20:41 codic but i found a better one unifont
20:41 codic gnu unifont
20:42 Astrobe In C, _ prefix is reserved by convention; there's no compiler protection behind it.
20:43 kurtzmusch yeah, i know but i figured, since theres already a pattern for this, id use the same well estabilished pattern
20:44 Astrobe At some point, what you like to do is less important that what is idiomatic to the language; those who try to force rather than adapt often only obtain a Pyrrhic victory.
20:46 Astrobe The fact that you have this problem is a bit suspicious per se; it seems that some module spreads in multiple files, which is bad practice.
20:47 kurtzmusch https://pastebin.com/yc2WC8Px why am i getting nil from get_perlin_map?
20:47 sfan5 the "modules" of your mod may want to share state but not expose it, it's not bad practice per se
20:48 kurtzmusch Astrobe: i usually end up overthinking these kind of things
20:49 kurtzmusch sfan5: yeah, thats what i will want to do in the future
20:51 Astrobe OOP say you should send messages in this case, not share state directly. Golang says something like that too: "Do not comminicate by sharing memory; instead, share memory by communicating"
20:52 sfan5 lua has no proper OOP so make of that what you want
20:52 Astrobe kurtzmusch: maybe you call it before MT init is finished? I think there's a restriction like that.
20:53 kurtzmusch huuuum, interesting is there a func to see if said init has finished?
20:57 kurtzmusch ok so i did get return by moving the call inside another function...
20:57 sfan5 init has finished as soon as your mod code has run once
20:57 Astrobe In this case, use after().
21:00 Astrobe Lua is actually prototype-based OOP.
21:02 Astrobe gn
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21:16 codic this font is also nice: https://www.fontspace.com/carl-osterwald/profontwindows
21:17 codic or https://www.fontspace.com/jdgraphics/minecraft
21:27 codic Wuzzy: is MC2 compatible with 5.1.0?
21:27 codic im restricted to a certain amount of terrain
21:27 Wuzzy what is 5.1.0?
21:28 codic the beta
21:28 codic git version
21:29 Wuzzy 5.1.0 does not exist.
21:29 sfan5 if it is compatible with 5.0 it will be compatible with any other version in the 5.x series
21:29 sfan5 (exceptions are possible but very unlikely)
21:29 Wuzzy even -dev? 😀
21:29 codic it does
21:29 codic 5.10-dev
21:29 codic anyways survival works but not creative
21:29 Wuzzy no, MCL2 is not compatible with 5.1.0-dev
21:30 Wuzzy i never aim compat with -dev
21:30 Wuzzy i only look at latest stable
21:30 codic :(
21:30 Wuzzy its to keep my sanity
21:30 codic can you try to make it compatible?
21:30 codic lol
21:30 codic it seems the same wait
21:30 Wuzzy no
21:30 Wuzzy i would get insane
21:30 Wuzzy running after a daily changing codebase is not good for my mental health
21:30 codic ok my old worlds didnt work
21:30 codic but a new world did
21:30 codic lol
21:30 codic thats good
21:30 codic you dont need to
21:31 Wuzzy the meshhand seems broken
21:31 sfan5 if you're reasonably sure that changes will stay, being compatible with -dev just means you do changes once at a time instead of all at once when 5.1 comes out
21:31 codic whats the meshand
21:31 Wuzzy sfan5: did you know? meshhand mods are currently borked in -dev
21:31 codic wht is it
21:32 sfan5 I did not know since I probably don't use this feature myself
21:32 Wuzzy meshhand is the hand based on a mesh
21:32 Wuzzy its pretty hacky, admittedly
21:32 codic i dont use it lol
21:32 codic how would you change fly from k to space space
21:33 codic wait it dosent work wuzzy
21:33 codic https://i.imgur.com/XUIq3Hk.png
21:33 Wuzzy go into all settings and search for "jump"
21:34 codic for?
21:34 Wuzzy ...
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21:34 codic for what
21:37 codic Wuzzy for what?
21:37 Wuzzy ...
21:37 Risk64 I have the 'craftguide' mod installed and can invoke it with '/craft' in the console. That's somewhat uncomfortable. How is it supposed to be used? Can i bind it to a key or something?
21:37 Wuzzy 😒
21:37 Wuzzy Risk64: you must craft a craft sign or a craft book
21:38 Wuzzy sign → craft sign. or book → craft book
21:38 Risk64 ok, thx. I'm still at the very beginning. So i guess it comes later..
21:39 codic what is ...?
21:39 codic and mt eeds menu music
21:39 sfan5 codic: you will find a setting that changes the keybind exactly the way you want
21:39 codic ok i see what you mean
21:40 codic anyone know why mcl2 dosent work with 5.1.0 in creative?
21:40 codic anyone mind testing it?
21:40 codic i found it
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21:40 BluedelaOof[m] Let me see if I have MCL2 installed
21:42 codic ok
21:42 DS-minetest !wiki Main_menu_music
21:42 MinetestBot "Minetest currently (as of 5.0.1) does not play any music in the main menu by default." - http://wiki.minetest.net/Main_menu_music
21:42 Wuzzy sfan5: the meshhand also fails in The End, a game for -dev
21:42 DS-minetest codic: ^
21:43 sfan5 good to know but reporting a bug is going to be more effective than telling me
21:43 Wuzzy no idea if its a bug in The End or not
21:44 BluedelaOof[m] I don't have mcl2 installed oof
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21:51 codic :(
21:51 codic get it from the content store
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22:37 MinetestBot [git] pangeneral -> minetest/minetest: Fix misuse of AsyncTask (#8799) 6a7f5c0 https://git.io/Je3Lz (2019-09-18T22:37:06Z)
22:37 MinetestBot [git] An0n3m0us -> minetest/minetest_game: Set fuel percentage to decrease (#2481) cbb0529 https://git.io/Je3Lg (2019-09-18T22:36:50Z)
22:39 MinetestBot [git] TranslucentSabre -> minetest/minetest: Also print help commands to chat for server terminal (#8869) c413eeb https://git.io/Je3LK (2019-09-18T22:37:56Z)
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