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| 00:36 |
perrier |
I think the version of minetest I just built is newer than the one that I have installed from Fedora. |
| 00:37 |
perrier |
Which is cool I like the new sounds. |
| 00:38 |
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| 01:06 |
perrier |
sushi! That's how I spell success. |
| 01:07 |
perrier |
I got the bed crash again. I downloaded the zip files from contendb and compiled them. |
| 01:11 |
perrier |
If anyone's interested http://paste.debian.net/1176442/ |
| 01:14 |
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| 01:18 |
perrier |
With text wrap http://paste.debian.net/1176444/ |
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| 01:38 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
Hi all |
| 01:40 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
Wondering if anyone is familiar with the Villages mod (mg_villages)? |
| 01:40 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
Or just a general question about mods |
| 01:41 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
Is it possible to include the MC2 mods in the regular minetest game? |
| 01:41 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
I'm looking at this site: |
| 01:41 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
https://content.minetest.net/packages/Sokomine/mg_villages/ |
| 01:42 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
and it lists several mineclone mods as optional. Problem is, trying to add them into minetest game piecemeal clearly isn't too feasible |
| 01:43 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> you dont need them if there optional |
| 01:44 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> well, typically |
| 01:44 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
and when I tried to add mg_villages to MC2, they didn't show up. Or if they did, I didn't see any |
| 01:44 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> there is no solution to having one or the other, so people list both as optional, thats the only thing i can think of where a optional mod is required |
| 01:45 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
Ok different angle. Is there a way to get mg_villages to work in MC2? |
| 01:46 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
Or modify the config so they actually spawn with the frequency they do in minetest game? |
| 01:46 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
I really like MC2, just would love to see this mod with tons of villages/buildings in it |
| 01:47 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> > Ok different angle. Is there a way to get mg_villages to work in MC2? should work? as long as you install its dependancy handle_schematics |
| 01:47 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
Any thoughts/advice on how to approach that would be massively appreciated |
| 01:49 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
@Jonathon - do you happen to know if there would a way to increase the spawning frequency |
| 01:50 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
of the villages in MC2? Like a way to force it to activate the mod? |
| 01:50 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> you enable the mod via settings or put them in worldmods of the world you want them on |
| 01:50 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
Let me try again and double check on the handle_schematics thing |
| 01:50 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> have you never added a mod in minetest? |
| 01:50 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
yes |
| 01:51 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
I got the mod added no prob |
| 01:51 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
But no villages |
| 01:51 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> did you enable it? |
| 01:51 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
in MC2 |
| 01:51 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
Yes |
| 01:51 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
enabled |
| 01:51 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> oh wait, i think there are mods what depend on mods_villages to provide the houses |
| 01:51 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
That's what was frustrating - should be working |
| 01:51 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> not sure on that |
| 01:51 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> Shows up in the /mods command? |
| 01:52 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
Let me check on that one. Need a few minutes to span a new game |
| 01:52 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
Super appreciate the help |
| 01:52 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> well, if its cross game, it has to have some sort of list for nodes it can use somewhere |
| 01:53 |
MTDiscord |
<Warr1024> If the mod is loaded it should really just work. If it doesn't then I'd argue it's a bug in the mod, and if it requires something else the mod should give you an error message or something telling you what it's missing... |
| 01:55 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> https://github.com/Sokomine/mg_villages/blob/master/config.lua hmmm, a lot of this stuff is mapped to default |
| 01:56 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> im not really sure |
| 01:57 |
MTDiscord |
<Jonathon> sokomine, the author of the mod should? be in irc, can try shooting them a PM |
| 02:09 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
Ok lol so I did get it loaded |
| 02:10 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
Only when I join the game, it spawns me inside one of the house walls and I'm unable to move and suffocating |
| 02:10 |
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| 02:10 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
I was able to teleport out and it was ok |
| 02:10 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
any way to change the default spawn location in MC2? |
| 02:19 |
specing |
Sokomine sounds like a good mod name |
| 02:19 |
specing |
Sokoban in Minetest |
| 02:32 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
specing Right? |
| 02:33 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
Sokomine love the villages mod. looks like it's working with MC2 now. I'm thinking my randon seed number might be why I spawned inside a tree |
| 02:37 |
perrier |
Did you spawn in the leaves or the wood? |
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| 03:15 |
Sokomine |
Biggvs_Richardvs: you shouldn't spawn inside a tree. mg_villages tries to spawn you directly at the center of a village. unless there's some other mapgen mod involved |
| 03:17 |
Sokomine |
Biggvs_Richardvs: if you want to use the logcabin village type (and perhaps some others), it might be best to change mineclone2 so that it allows for slabs and stairs and the like to be rotated. mineclone2 is sadly deliberately limited in this regard. houses making use of slabs might look odd |
| 03:34 |
iamweasel |
several times i got myself into a bind: |
| 03:35 |
iamweasel |
i stopped in a cart on a break rail at exactly the same place as other player character, and neither of us could get out of the cart |
| 03:35 |
iamweasel |
cuz we were inside each others' heads, and we couldn't click on the cart |
| 03:36 |
iamweasel |
one of us had to log off |
| 03:36 |
iamweasel |
is there like a workaround for this? |
| 03:39 |
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| 03:57 |
Sokomine |
havn't encountered that yet, but i don't use carts often |
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| 06:17 |
hecks |
How does --terminal actually work? |
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| 10:37 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
Sokomine Thanks for the reply! I'll give that a try |
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| 12:33 |
hecks |
Do entities ever get deactivated inside a forceloaded block? |
| 12:39 |
celeron55 |
no, except at shutdown, that's the point right? |
| 12:40 |
hecks |
I guess, it's just not written explicitly in lua_api |
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| 13:24 |
hecks |
I'll repeat my other question, what does --terminal do and how do I use it? |
| 13:31 |
sfan5 |
when running a server, give you an ncurses terminal from where you can execute commands in the name of the user defined by the "name" setting |
| 13:31 |
hecks |
how do I connect to it? |
| 13:34 |
sfan5 |
it uses the terminal the server was run in |
| 13:34 |
sfan5 |
so this wouldn't work with e.g. a systemd service |
| 13:37 |
hecks |
I tried cygwin bash and it's not taking commands, I think I also tried it with ksh on openbsd |
| 13:37 |
hecks |
and I suppose it's not as useful if it requires a term session to the running server. thanks anyway |
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| 14:41 |
tango_ |
g33 |
| 14:41 |
tango_ |
egr sorry |
| 14:49 |
tango_ |
OK, serious question. let's say that I patched up the moreblocks handling of stairs and slabs to allow placing on side walls but right side up and conversely, with information from the “where in then surface of the face did the user click?” |
| 14:49 |
tango_ |
I'm still having doubts about how to differentiate between this and the standard placement rules |
| 14:50 |
tango_ |
currently I'm tying it to aux key so that users can still use the default placement rules otherwise |
| 14:51 |
tango_ |
the alternative would be to override sneak+placement instead |
| 14:51 |
tango_ |
I would go with sneak+placement actually, but this leaves the problem open about how to handle param2 inheritance from same-category items (slab against slab) |
| 14:53 |
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| 14:54 |
tango_ |
to clarify, when I place a slab against another slab, I should have at least two options: parallel placement inheriting param2 vs perpendicular placement |
| 14:55 |
tango_ |
perpendicular _to the surface_ |
| 14:55 |
tango_ |
the problem is that which one is which sort of depends on the face the user is clicking |
| 14:56 |
tango_ |
the standard placement rule would make a parallel-to-the-surface placement, which on the side means perpendicular to the slab, while on the top/bottom face means parallel to the slab |
| 14:57 |
tango_ |
while sneak standard placement would be perpendicular-to-the-surface placement, which o the side means parallel to the slab, while on the top/bottom face means perpendicular to the slab |
| 14:57 |
tango_ |
I want to do param2 inheritance (+ optional tuning) when placing parallel to the slab |
| 14:57 |
tango_ |
oh that's a bother |
| 15:01 |
cheapie |
tango_: If you wanted to get real fancy, sneak+place could cycle through different placement modes without actually placing anything. |
| 15:01 |
tango_ |
cheapie: sure, are you going to pay me to implement it ;-) |
| 15:02 |
cheapie |
Sure, you can have 7 Imaginary Internet Points™ |
| 15:02 |
tango_ |
cheapie: WOOOHOO I'M RICH |
| 15:03 |
cheapie |
FWIW, if you don't have the "replacer" mod installed, install that - it makes working with slabs and such a lot easier :P |
| 15:03 |
tango_ |
meh I hope that with the improved placement it'll be less necessary |
| 15:04 |
cheapie |
It's been ages, but back when I used to do this stuff a lot, I would just carry around a screwdriver and a replacer when working with slabs/stairs/etc. - place one, rotate to where I want, and use the replacer to copy it to everywhere I want that rotation. |
| 15:05 |
tango_ |
cheapie: I prefer achieving as much as that as possible without having to require extra tools |
| 15:06 |
tango_ |
which means fixing the placement rules |
| 15:06 |
cheapie |
Meh, as long as keeping them the same is either the default or an easily-selectable option, I don't see a problem with that either. |
| 15:07 |
tango_ |
keeping what the same, sorry? |
| 15:07 |
cheapie |
Perhaps s/keeping them the same/using the current placement rules/ would clarify that a bit. |
| 15:08 |
tango_ |
that's actually why I went with aux+placement |
| 15:08 |
cheapie |
Like what you suggested a bit ago where normal placement is unchanged, but sneak+place or aux+place uses some "improved" algorithm - sounds fine to me at least. |
| 15:09 |
tango_ |
but the truth is that the default placement rules for stairs and slabs in moreblocks are horrible |
| 15:09 |
tango_ |
I doubt anyone actually uses them without a screwdriver |
| 15:09 |
cheapie |
For slabs/stairs I've never really needed the screwdriver for basic use. For fancy stuff, sure. |
| 15:09 |
tango_ |
the default placement rules are pretty braindead: nomodifier placement = place parallel to the face, sneak placement = place perpendicular to the face |
| 15:10 |
tango_ |
in moreblocks, mind you. in mtg default they are relatively sane |
| 15:10 |
tango_ |
not perfect, but sane |
| 15:10 |
cheapie |
"place parallel to the face" is what I want for slabs at least 90% of the time. |
| 15:10 |
tango_ |
in moreblocks they SUCK HORRIBLY |
| 15:10 |
cheapie |
Stairs maybe 80% |
| 15:12 |
tango_ |
cheapie: are you talking default or moreblocks? |
| 15:12 |
cheapie |
moreblocks |
| 15:13 |
tango_ |
cheapie: moreblocks for example has no way to place a horizontal slab next to a fullblock on the high position |
| 15:13 |
tango_ |
if you shift+click it goes always on the low position |
| 15:13 |
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| 15:13 |
tango_ |
so if you want to go the high position you need something _above_ it and then placethe slab on the face below |
| 15:13 |
tango_ |
which is ... convoluted to say the least |
| 15:13 |
cheapie |
I'd argue that that's an unusual/"special" request and that requiring a screwdriver is sane enough. |
| 15:14 |
tango_ |
cheapie: my solution as implemented here https://github.com/minetest-mods/moreblocks/pull/160 is to have something more like what default does |
| 15:14 |
tango_ |
which is to go to high or low position depending on where you click on the face of the other block |
| 15:14 |
tango_ |
click in the upper half = go high, click on the lower half of the face = go low |
| 15:15 |
tango_ |
which is actually what I expect it to do |
| 15:15 |
cheapie |
Sure, as long as it uses a modifier key or other method to select that, which it does. |
| 15:15 |
tango_ |
my idea was to just use sneak+place |
| 15:16 |
tango_ |
i.e. override the “perpendicular placement” |
| 15:16 |
tango_ |
so while now sneak+place always goes below, with this it goes where you actually clicked |
| 15:16 |
cheapie |
Sneak+place is fine by me too, I've never used the current sneak+place behavior either and I think you're the only one that even fully understands it. |
| 15:16 |
tango_ |
(currently the PR does it with aux+place) |
| 15:17 |
tango_ |
cheapie: I'm definitely not the only one complaining about it 8-) https://github.com/minetest-mods/moreblocks/issues/138 |
| 15:17 |
tango_ |
now, sneak+place is for “place orthogonally to the surface” |
| 15:17 |
tango_ |
oh this is where you use the replacer |
| 15:18 |
tango_ |
because the issue with the default placement is that if you have a slab, and place another slab onits side, the second slab gets put vertically |
| 15:18 |
tango_ |
(i.e. “parallel to the side”) |
| 15:18 |
cheapie |
If I was trying to put in stairs like that I'd just place them on the ground and be done with it :P |
| 15:18 |
MTDiscord |
<IhrFussel> Coding such a placement code would take 15 minutes max |
| 15:18 |
tango_ |
cheapie: you don't always have ground for placement |
| 15:18 |
cheapie |
Then I pull out the replacer :P |
| 15:18 |
tango_ |
ihrfussel: doing it right actually takes considerably more |
| 15:19 |
tango_ |
there's no trivial map between facedir and the face place |
| 15:19 |
tango_ |
the one in default is pretty good, but not perfect |
| 15:19 |
tango_ |
I believe mine is better |
| 15:20 |
MTDiscord |
<IhrFussel> The only way to 'listen' to keys outside of callbacks is a globalstep AFAIK |
| 15:20 |
tango_ |
there's no need to listen to keys |
| 15:20 |
tango_ |
when you place you know if the player is sneaking or auxing |
| 15:20 |
tango_ |
there's flag in the placer status info |
| 15:20 |
MTDiscord |
<IhrFussel> I was talking about the 'switch between placing modes' method |
| 15:21 |
tango_ |
oh, like cycling until you find the correct one? |
| 15:21 |
tango_ |
I have no plans to implement that honestly |
| 15:21 |
tango_ |
I prefer to have clear, accessible rules |
| 15:22 |
MTDiscord |
<IhrFussel> Could also be done using a formspec menu...MT doesn't expose enough keys to really handle multiple methods of the same thing |
| 15:23 |
MTDiscord |
<IhrFussel> You could just display a one-time formspec as soon as a player places something asking which method they prefer |
| 15:24 |
MTDiscord |
<IhrFussel> That sounds pretty straight-forward to me |
| 15:28 |
tango_ |
you have two modifiers: sneak and aux |
| 15:28 |
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| 15:28 |
tango_ |
this gives you effectively 4 possible placement rules: nomod, sneak, aux, sneak+aux |
| 15:28 |
tango_ |
I think that's plenty |
| 15:30 |
tango_ |
the standard placement rules only use nomod and sneak: nomod means place parallel to the face, sneak means place orthogonal to the face |
| 15:30 |
tango_ |
and the issue is that “orthogonal” has several possibilities (at least 4) |
| 15:31 |
tango_ |
(parallel has several too, but in that case the frequently accessible choices are just 2: same orientation, and opposite) |
| 15:33 |
tango_ |
the rules I wrote (currently used with aux) are all for “face-perpendicular” placement, so they could easily replace the standard sneak placement rule |
| 15:33 |
tango_ |
except for the special handling of same-category elements |
| 15:57 |
Helenah |
Are the beds bugged? On my server, when the bed is used, the server crashes. I'll look at the logs if they shouldn't be bugged, infact I'll look at the logs now. |
| 15:58 |
sfan5 |
see https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/10711 |
| 16:00 |
Helenah |
sfan5: I'd only just seen you message after I uploaded the log entry so I'll post it anyway and will read that. |
| 16:00 |
Helenah |
https://termbin.com/pz30q |
| 16:03 |
Helenah |
sfan5: Thank you very much |
| 16:03 |
Helenah |
For raising that with me, I mean. |
| 16:03 |
Helenah |
I will now look into replacing minetest_game with a different version. |
| 16:03 |
sfan5 |
it'd be interesting to know where you installed MTG from |
| 16:05 |
perrier |
The version of MTG for download onthe main website isn't stable it's mislabled I believe. |
| 16:08 |
perrier |
This one https://github.com/minetest/minetest_game/archive/master.zip |
| 16:08 |
perrier |
I have bed bugs too from it. |
| 16:09 |
perrier |
And it has new sounds so I know it's not the same as my system version of MTG. |
| 16:13 |
sfan5 |
yeah that's the wrong one |
| 16:13 |
sfan5 |
but I don't think there's a direct download link for MTG on the website |
| 16:14 |
perrier |
right it sends you to github |
| 16:16 |
perrier |
This one https://github.com/minetest/minetest_game |
| 16:18 |
sfan5 |
the better question here is: how come you installed minetest 5.3.0 and don't have minetest_game? |
| 16:21 |
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| 17:01 |
perrier |
I'm building the devel version of the game engine see if bed bugs go away. |
| 17:01 |
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| 17:17 |
tango_ |
daaaaamn, placement is hard |
| 17:17 |
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| 17:34 |
perrier |
What on tablet? |
| 17:57 |
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| 17:58 |
Gustavo6046 |
Hello o/ |
| 18:01 |
perrier |
hi |
| 18:03 |
Gustavo6046 |
Thanks! |
| 18:03 |
Gustavo6046 |
Good afternoon, folks. |
| 18:04 |
Gustavo6046 |
Is the Y coordinate in the debug UI foot level? It doesn't seem to be, as it includes a .5 at the end. But it also can't be the center, as a character is 2 units tall, which would mean it would be foot level plus one. |
| 18:05 |
Gustavo6046 |
Also, just out of curiosity, is there a mod that employs neural networks in some way? Like, maybe some mobs or something, dunno? Feel free to ignore this question lol, it's not important, tis mere curiosity. |
| 18:08 |
Gustavo6046 |
I usually expect mobs to be a simple state machine. Which works fine! Again, I'm just curious! |
| 18:10 |
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| 18:12 |
Gustavo6046 |
Also, is it possible to make an ore cluster jitter a Gaussian distribution (to make it clump up a little more toward the center while still having bits in the edges)? I feel like this would make prospecting more interesting, among other things, at least for larger clusters, as you'd gravitate toward more ores to try and find the clumped up center. I'd make copper clusters a bit larger (because |
| 18:12 |
Gustavo6046 |
they're a bit disproportinately small compared to tin, and even iron is a lot more numerous... max 22 for some reason lol) |
| 18:16 |
perrier |
No bed bugs in development. |
| 18:16 |
Gustavo6046 |
Lol |
| 18:16 |
Gustavo6046 |
thanks Helenah :P |
| 18:17 |
Gustavo6046 |
Anyway, In general I do feel like minetest_game balancing is fine and good enough overall, although it could use some tweaks, eg. the copper I mentioned, or also the fact that more valuable ores spawn so deep down in the crust of the earth. |
| 18:17 |
Gustavo6046 |
Er, underground. Idk why I said that |
| 18:17 |
Gustavo6046 |
I mean, it takes several steel pickaxes just to reach the small Mese ore cluster layer. Which I guess is fine, and maybe even intended, as it means you can't just grab 3 iron thingies and be good to go. |
| 18:17 |
Gustavo6046 |
But it's a bit tedious to dig that far down. |
| 18:18 |
Gustavo6046 |
And on that, tool durabilities are also a little bit low, maybe could be buffed a tiny bit? |
| 18:19 |
perrier |
In mapgen v6 ore is shallow. |
| 18:19 |
perrier |
Makes for a shorter game. |
| 18:20 |
Gustavo6046 |
Ah |
| 18:20 |
Gustavo6046 |
Yeah |
| 18:20 |
Gustavo6046 |
tr8e |
| 18:20 |
Gustavo6046 |
true* |
| 18:20 |
perrier |
Not everyone has time for deep mining. |
| 18:20 |
Gustavo6046 |
Yeah |
| 18:20 |
Gustavo6046 |
I think what could help is A) have a better method of vertical transport than ladders (minecarts are mostly horizontal, it feels like), and/or B) make small clusters even smaller but extend them further up. |
| 18:21 |
Gustavo6046 |
I feel like the difference between small and larger clusters isn't striking enough. |
| 18:23 |
Gustavo6046 |
Also, is there some keypress I can use to clear a text field instantly if I want to rewrite, say, my password? |
| 18:23 |
Gustavo6046 |
Also, is there a way to know the foot height, and/or the coordinates of the looked at node (rather than just the type), in the debug overlay? |
| 18:24 |
perrier |
Can you select the text and use backspace to clear it? |
| 18:24 |
Gustavo6046 |
Ah |
| 18:24 |
Gustavo6046 |
Well, of course |
| 18:24 |
Gustavo6046 |
But I mean all at once |
| 18:24 |
perrier |
yea |
| 18:24 |
Gustavo6046 |
The little things can make a big difference in UI design :D |
| 18:25 |
Gustavo6046 |
Backspace is a bit tedious, but that's fine |
| 18:25 |
Gustavo6046 |
Anyway |
| 18:25 |
perrier |
I wonder how much tnt it would take to destroy the whole world? |
| 18:26 |
specing |
I wonder how long that blast would take to complete |
| 18:26 |
specing |
emerging the whole world and then digging it away, spraying entities all over the place |
| 18:27 |
Gustavo6046 |
specing: "I wonder how long that blast would take to fry my computer." FTFY! :P |
| 18:27 |
specing |
yes, that's what I meant |
| 18:28 |
specing |
How many computers would it destroy :D |
| 18:28 |
cheapie |
Knowing how these things tend to go, it's probably more likely to be a question of how long until MT just crashes :P |
| 18:28 |
Gustavo6046 |
:D |
| 18:28 |
Gustavo6046 |
lol |
| 18:28 |
cheapie |
(and whether it's the engine or a mod that does it, and in the latter case which one) |
| 18:28 |
Gustavo6046 |
cheapie: oh hi! You here too! :v |
| 18:28 |
cheapie |
Yes, I'm here... barely, I don't play MT much any more. |
| 18:31 |
Gustavo6046 |
Ah |
| 18:31 |
Gustavo6046 |
What do you play nowadays? |
| 18:32 |
cheapie |
Not much :P |
| 18:32 |
Gustavo6046 |
and I mean |
| 18:32 |
Gustavo6046 |
you're basically everywhere in freenode lol |
| 18:32 |
Gustavo6046 |
Ah, fair enough |
| 18:32 |
Gustavo6046 |
You've ever played, say, Unreal Tournament? And Doom? (I'll just leave it to there, because knowing myself I'll just go on a massive endless tangent otherwise lol) |
| 18:34 |
perrier |
I used to UT2K3 and UT2K4 |
| 18:34 |
Helenah |
Hi Gustavo6046 :3 |
| 18:34 |
Helenah |
Fancy seeing you here? o: |
| 18:34 |
Helenah |
Or was you already here? |
| 18:34 |
Gustavo6046 |
Hai :o |
| 18:34 |
Gustavo6046 |
No I joined a little ago |
| 18:34 |
Gustavo6046 |
perrier: ah, I only do 99 |
| 18:36 |
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| 18:36 |
Gustavo6046 |
TIL you can put ladders on the floor |
| 18:37 |
Helenah |
Yeah, you can put ladders on the floor. :3 |
| 18:37 |
Helenah |
What Gustavo6046 said |
| 18:38 |
Gustavo6046 |
:P |
| 18:38 |
Gustavo6046 |
I mean it's probably possible to do *something* with it |
| 18:38 |
Helenah |
Now, unless the world was to for some mysterious reason turn sideways, I'm not sure what the function of that would be. |
| 18:38 |
Gustavo6046 |
Well |
| 18:38 |
Gustavo6046 |
To climb into air! |
| 18:38 |
Gustavo6046 |
1 block |
| 18:38 |
Helenah |
o: |
| 18:38 |
cheapie |
Gustavo6046: "basically everywhere"? I'm only in 17 channels. |
| 18:38 |
Gustavo6046 |
You can make it look like you're levitating :P |
| 18:39 |
Gustavo6046 |
cheapie: yeah but I've seen you many a place |
| 18:39 |
Gustavo6046 |
Iirc you're even in the AC net? |
| 18:39 |
cheapie |
I'm on 6 networks. |
| 18:39 |
Gustavo6046 |
Helenah: you can stack them on top of each other xD |
| 18:39 |
Gustavo6046 |
:op |
| 18:39 |
Gustavo6046 |
:o |
| 18:39 |
Gustavo6046 |
they can even stay in midair |
| 18:39 |
cheapie |
And what, you've never WE-d in a whole stack of ladders and never bothered to orient them correctly? :P |
| 18:40 |
cheapie |
(IIRC a param2 of 0 puts them on the floor) |
| 18:43 |
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| 18:44 |
Gustavo6046 |
o you use 3D chunks? |
| 18:44 |
cheapie |
? |
| 18:44 |
Gustavo6046 |
cheapie: lol |
| 18:44 |
Gustavo6046 |
not really |
| 18:45 |
Gustavo6046 |
I have never used World Edit... so far anyway |
| 18:45 |
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| 18:46 |
Gustavo6046 |
Hey, at least terminal velocity can't be stifled by a single block of water source! |
| 18:47 |
* cheapie |
pulls out a tube of those DGL555 chips and starts stacking them on Gustavo6046 |
| 18:47 |
Gustavo6046 |
o.o |
| 18:47 |
Gustavo6046 |
what is that thing |
| 18:47 |
Gustavo6046 |
I feel chipped on |
| 18:47 |
Gustavo6046 |
*badumtss* |
| 18:47 |
cheapie |
The timer chip from digistuff. |
| 18:48 |
Gustavo6046 |
ah |
| 18:48 |
cheapie |
All three ICs in digistuff (I/O expander, NIC, and timer) have "part numbers" visible on top, and all three start with "DGL" followed by numbers. |
| 18:49 |
Gustavo6046 |
Mm |
| 18:49 |
Gustavo6046 |
:O |
| 18:50 |
* Gustavo6046 |
creates dah DGL 6502 |
| 18:50 |
Gustavo6046 |
lol |
| 18:50 |
Gustavo6046 |
It does sound like a damn lot of fun! |
| 18:50 |
cheapie |
All three of these are named after real-life chips doing the same or similar functions - the I/O expander (DGL9536) is named after the TI PCA9536, the NIC (DGL8139) is named after the Realtek RTL8139, and I shouldn't really have to explain the timer (DGL555) :P |
| 18:50 |
Gustavo6046 |
Ah |
| 18:50 |
Gustavo6046 |
:O |
| 18:50 |
Gustavo6046 |
NIC? |
| 18:50 |
Gustavo6046 |
lol TCP |
| 18:50 |
Gustavo6046 |
I don't know many real integrated circuits |
| 18:51 |
Gustavo6046 |
I wish I knew more |
| 18:51 |
Gustavo6046 |
electronics fascinate me |
| 18:51 |
Gustavo6046 |
semiconductors |
| 18:51 |
cheapie |
And yes, this is also why the digistuff NIC has a somewhat poorly-drawn crab thing vaguely reminiscent of the Realtek logo on it. |
| 18:52 |
Gustavo6046 |
h |
| 18:52 |
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| 18:52 |
Gustavo6046 |
Does it actually transmit data layer signals through a digiline? |
| 18:53 |
cheapie |
The "NIC" (which requires digistuff to be added to the HTTP mods list) allows LuaCs to perform HTTP(S) requests to arbitrary URLs. |
| 18:54 |
cheapie |
It's quite useful, but of course has the potential to be abused and so is fairly limited and is also an optional component. |
| 18:54 |
Gustavo6046 |
Ah |
| 18:54 |
Gustavo6046 |
aw |
| 18:54 |
Gustavo6046 |
I thought I could make machines talk with each other in TCP in digilines ;-; |
| 18:55 |
cheapie |
I don't think there's anything stopping you from encapsulating TCP in digilines messages :P |
| 18:56 |
Gustavo6046 |
Oh? |
| 18:57 |
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| 18:58 |
cheapie |
Unless they've been screwing with it for no reason when I wasn't looking (they do that a lot), you can send arbitrary strings over digilines and they don't have to be text. |
| 18:59 |
Hawk777 |
Hm, I was wondering, I haven’t used digistuff yet but from the README it looks pretty useful and I think I will. But is there any benefit to using the timer node compared to just using the interrupt function in a Luacontroller? |
| 19:00 |
Hawk777 |
The rest looks pretty useful. |
| 19:00 |
cheapie |
Hawk777: Unless things have changed (they may have), interrupts don't pause when the LuaC is unloaded. |
| 19:00 |
cheapie |
The timer IC does. |
| 19:01 |
Gustavo6046 |
Ah |
| 19:01 |
Gustavo6046 |
What is a good method of exploratory mining? Just strip mining? |
| 19:02 |
Hawk777 |
Ah. If I understand correctly events to a LuaC cause the containing block to be loaded so the event can be delivered—so that means the 555 will extend the time period if it’s unloaded, while the LuaC interrupt will always keep perfect time, so one is suitable for real time and the other for timing e.g. plant growth or other stuff that only works when the block is loaded? |
| 19:02 |
cheapie |
Pretty much. |
| 19:02 |
Gustavo6046 |
It seems a little inefficient, as that way a Mese pickaxe couldn't really dig enough to replenish its own cost in Mese, at least in my case at hgiht -610 |
| 19:02 |
Gustavo6046 |
Hence me wonderinfg |
| 19:03 |
cheapie |
The main reason I made it is for performance reasons - so you don't have tons of mapblocks kept loaded with LuaCs running non-stop. |
| 19:04 |
Gustavo6046 |
Ah |
| 19:04 |
Hawk777 |
Ah, I see, thanks. |
| 19:05 |
cheapie |
At least one server actually prohibits setting up LuaCs to run interrupt loops continuously without some method to stop them when the mapblock tries to unload - there are a few methods to do it, or just using a timer instead works. |
| 19:06 |
cheapie |
The method I used to use before that involved a blinky plant connected to any pin, and then a bit of boilerplate to manage two interrupts - one "clock" and one "sleep". The "sleep" one was reset each time the blinky plant changed states, but if it timed out then the code would stop resetting the "clock" one each time the "clock" interrupt fired. |
| 19:07 |
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| 19:07 |
cheapie |
If the blinky plant changed state again after it had timed out (meaning the mapblock re-loaded), then both interrupts were set again. |
| 19:07 |
specing |
Gustavo6046: use an anvil to repair it |
| 19:07 |
specing |
Gustavo6046: or terumet equipment reformer, or technic workshop |
| 19:08 |
cheapie |
or creative mode |
| 19:08 |
* cheapie |
hides :P |
| 19:08 |
Hawk777 |
Wow, that costs a whole pin, and those are in short supply on LuaControllers! I can definitely see the benefit of the timer in that situation. |
| 19:08 |
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| 19:09 |
cheapie |
Heh, I usually end up using no pins at all :P |
| 19:09 |
specing |
Hawk777: cheapie's digistuff has io expanders |
| 19:09 |
specing |
I think |
| 19:09 |
Hawk777 |
Fair. I don’t have Digistuff yet, so to me, pins are really really precious. |
| 19:09 |
Hawk777 |
With an IOX I guess they’re… ahem… *cheap*. |
| 19:09 |
* Hawk777 |
hides |
| 19:09 |
specing |
you can program a luaC to act as an io expander |
| 19:09 |
Hawk777 |
Well yeah, that’s what I do if I need more of them. |
| 19:09 |
cheapie |
Another mod if you're wanting to save pins: https://cheapiesystems.com/git/rgblightstone/ |
| 19:10 |
Hawk777 |
Oh nice! Now to convince the guy running my server to install some more mods :D |
| 19:11 |
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| 19:12 |
cheapie |
You can pull off a few neat tricks with the I/O expanders too - if you connect two or more of them together over digilines and put them on the same channel, they'll "mirror" signals coming in even without a LuaC. |
| 19:13 |
Hawk777 |
Hm, yeah, I guess that would work. Long-distance transmission of many signals at much lower material cost than a zillion mesecons wires. |
| 19:13 |
* cheapie |
nods, nothing to stop you from running a bunch over one digiline either |
| 19:14 |
Hawk777 |
Right, I was about to compare the recipe costs when I realized you could just put 20 IOXs at each end with different channel names. |
| 19:14 |
cheapie |
That and some digilines devices have... strange conduction rules and can be (ab)used to send signals through shapes that mesecons can't do. |
| 19:15 |
Hawk777 |
Yeah, like LuaCs being able to send and receive messages in a wire floating in mid-air above themselves. |
| 19:15 |
cheapie |
The junction box from digistuff is one of these, it'll send to another junction box (and a few other devices) across a 1m gap. |
| 19:16 |
cheapie |
The dimmable lights do this too - it's intended so that you can do things like <JBox><ceiling><dimmable light> and they'll connect even though the ceiling is in the way. |
| 19:16 |
cheapie |
That and you can also place the lights at every other node and have them connect across those gaps too. |
| 19:17 |
Hawk777 |
Haha now you’re getting me excited to use this stuff, even though I should be working instead :) |
| 19:18 |
cheapie |
Most of these other devices just conduct normally, but in all directions - like rgblightstone does that, so you can build a big rgblightstone screen and just connect it at one point. |
| 19:19 |
cheapie |
More digilines stuff \o/ https://cheapiesystems.com/git/printer/ |
| 19:22 |
Gustavo6046 |
yey |
| 19:23 |
cheapie |
There's, uh, also this, but don't install this on a public-facing server, or better yet just don't install it at all: https://cheapiesystems.com/git/das/ |
| 19:24 |
cheapie |
Not really documented (partly due to laziness, partly to discourage use) but it lets you talk to SCSI devices from inside MT. |
| 19:26 |
cheapie |
But that mod is how this thing works. The phone I had at the time had an awful microphone so you'll probably have to turn the volume up a lot to hear anything: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jf_ZC346lEM |
| 19:26 |
Hawk777 |
Hahaha I was about to say WTF why would anyone make such a mod, and then you showed why! |
| 19:27 |
cheapie |
Can also talk to hard drives, of course: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GeiJxJPCn2U |
| 19:27 |
Hawk777 |
Reminds me a bit of, I think it was a Minecraft mod, someone made that would talk to some kind of real-world electronics, maybe an Arduino or something. |
| 19:28 |
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| 19:29 |
cheapie |
This thing also used it to play the "video" from a real hard drive: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XG48Y_GbMXk |
| 19:29 |
cheapie |
IIRC I used a custom on-disk format for that one and each frame took up a few sectors on disk. |
| 19:32 |
cheapie |
Some more stuff that's possible with digilines these days: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jFcRWuGVj8w |
| 19:32 |
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| 19:44 |
cheapie |
...you know, I was just thinking that the building blocks (mesecons_carts, and the NIC from digistuff) are there for someone to make some sort of rail transportation setup where you get in a cart, pick your destination on a map on a website somewhere, and get automatically directed through the rail network to the station you chose. |
| 19:45 |
cheapie |
Complete with handling of multiple users at once (the digilines rails in mesecons_carts can detect who is in the cart). |
| 19:45 |
tango_ |
ok I'm definitely overengineering this thing |
| 19:50 |
Hawk777 |
Well, technically the building blocks are there to do that even without half the things you just mentioned. You can detect the passage of a cart with a track (not its identity, but its presence), and just keep them separated into signalling blocks and pass their destination info from signal box to signal box via Digilines wires as they pass by the locations. I was already planning to do that, when I got a whole pile of free time. |
| 19:51 |
Hawk777 |
A map on a website is a nice idea for usability though! |
| 19:51 |
Hawk777 |
Probably much easier than scrolling through a list of names or trying to somehow jam a map into the in-game world. |
| 19:52 |
Hawk777 |
Detector Rail, that’s the name I was looking for. |
| 19:54 |
Hawk777 |
Though I suppose card scanners could be used as a form of ticketing system if you wanted to add that, or perhaps stored-value transit passes. |
| 19:55 |
SX |
very nice elevator you got there, just that kind of stuff I love to see in game :) |
| 19:59 |
cheapie |
I'm still kinda waiting for someone to end up doing PID speed control on the carts... I've done PI before, but never actually put in the D term. |
| 20:00 |
cheapie |
This includes a few "stations" I've built that do controlled acceleration/deceleration. |
| 20:01 |
cheapie |
SX: You might like this too, older video but it shows more of the special modes and stuff: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=72BR07IVDdY |
| 20:04 |
TLuna |
..amazing /minecraft defector online/ |
| 20:10 |
cheapie |
And yes, I have made machines capable of assembling other machines: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w4cP_VujDWA |
| 20:10 |
cheapie |
The real-life equivalent is "just a bit" faster, FWIW: https://cheapiesystems.com/media/my9e-2.webm |
| 20:13 |
TLuna |
holysh |
| 20:13 |
TLuna |
(ehm, am i muted) |
| 20:14 |
cheapie |
TLuna: We can see what you're saying, if that's what you're asking. |
| 20:14 |
TLuna |
sorry, odd client interface |
| 20:39 |
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| 21:10 |
MTDiscord |
<IhrFussel> Gustavo6046, ctrl + a then backspace clears all at once usually |
| 21:10 |
Gustavo6046 |
Ah, thanks |
| 21:11 |
Gustavo6046 |
Oh I was about to come ask a thing lol |
| 21:11 |
Gustavo6046 |
geez crystal balls |
| 21:11 |
Gustavo6046 |
How do I breed the rats from... er, let me try to recall the mod name |
| 21:11 |
Gustavo6046 |
mobs_animal |
| 21:12 |
Helenah |
Hi |
| 21:12 |
Gustavo6046 |
Hai |
| 21:12 |
Helenah |
Gustavo6046: yes, that's it, mobs_animal :3 |
| 21:13 |
MTDiscord |
<IhrFussel> Breeding works by feeding them their desired food enough times till hearts appear and if at least 2 are close to each other chances are high that they mate...this is how it works in the older versions at least |
| 21:14 |
rubenwardy |
bringing literal meaning to "food is the way to the heart" |
| 21:20 |
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| 21:24 |
Gustavo6046 |
Oop |
| 21:24 |
Gustavo6046 |
internet connection weird |
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| 22:06 |
Gustavo6046 |
Do chicken eggs hatch? |
| 22:06 |
Gustavo6046 |
Also I didn't catch any messages after my oop / nvm |
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| 22:21 |
calcul0n |
i don't think you can breed rats, you can just catch them with a right click and an empty hand |
| 22:21 |
calcul0n |
then use them to breed cats |
| 22:41 |
iamweasel |
i made large underground flats, dimly lit, and they spawn like 10 rats, so one can "breed" rats via environment |
| 22:41 |
iamweasel |
just went there periodically and collected them :) |
| 22:48 |
Gustavo6046 |
A |
| 22:48 |
iamweasel |
you know what i am looking for? a working dino mod |
| 22:48 |
Gustavo6046 |
true |
| 22:48 |
Gustavo6046 |
like JurassicCraft? |
| 22:48 |
iamweasel |
i tried 2 different versions of paleotest, i rly like the models, but both versions were not working quite right |
| 22:48 |
iamweasel |
oh i gotta check that out |
| 22:49 |
iamweasel |
i would be happy with like mobs_paleo, i was already seriously thinking writing it, take the paleotest models and just use the api for random dino spawns |
| 23:03 |
perrier |
Does anyone know of another mod that supplies the thirst function? |
| 23:04 |
perrier |
Like hunger_ng or something? |
| 23:05 |
perrier |
Thirsty still works with but with warnings for deprecation. |
| 23:11 |
Gustavo6046 |
Do mods that affect world generation (eg. ores and trees) add some to an existing world if they detect a world that previously didn't have them? |
| 23:12 |
Helenah |
If what Gustavo6046 said doesn't happen, is there a way I can... inject the new ores into the ground of the world? |
| 23:12 |
Helenah |
Like... some sort of stone detection and ore injecting into that? |
| 23:14 |
Gustavo6046 |
Yeah, naybe a worldedit function of some sort |
| 23:14 |
Gustavo6046 |
maybe( |
| 23:14 |
Gustavo6046 |
maybe* |
| 23:14 |
Helenah |
hmm |
| 23:15 |
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| 23:35 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
Howdy all |
| 23:43 |
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| 23:44 |
Gustavo6046 |
Waiting for the day Minetest servers/clients become compatible with Minecraft clients/servers :P |
| 23:44 |
Gustavo6046 |
lol |
| 23:45 |
iamweasel |
hi Biggvs_Richardvs |
| 23:47 |
specing |
Gustavo6046: why |
| 23:47 |
Gustavo6046 |
specing: because! |
| 23:47 |
iamweasel |
Gustavo6046: if, solely due to quantum randomness, the boards of mojang, micro$soft, and $ony go crazy all at the same time, and opensource minecraft forever, why, there's a chance |
| 23:47 |
Gustavo6046 |
lol, true |
| 23:47 |
specing |
I'd prefer Minetest to be better in every way imaginable |
| 23:47 |
Gustavo6046 |
iamweasel: but I mean |
| 23:47 |
Gustavo6046 |
the protocol is not secret |
| 23:47 |
Gustavo6046 |
there is Cuberite |
| 23:47 |
Gustavo6046 |
which is a Minecraft server reimplementation in C++ |
| 23:48 |
Gustavo6046 |
It's reverse engineering |
| 23:48 |
Gustavo6046 |
But yeah |
| 23:48 |
Gustavo6046 |
M$ is kind of going crazy lately. They open-sourced a bunch of crap lately, but seemed not to go all the way lol, odd |
| 23:48 |
Gustavo6046 |
Also, what is ony? |
| 23:48 |
iamweasel |
protocol shmotocol, it's about the intent, they can always make sure their clients and servers use secret extensions, this is micro$oft's speciality |
| 23:50 |
Gustavo6046 |
iamweasel: M$ has given Mojang quite a bit of free roaming space |
| 23:50 |
Gustavo6046 |
The game is a very large IP and they seem to be just aware enough of how their touch would insta-ruin it to just let Mojang continue dealing with it instead |
| 23:51 |
Gustavo6046 |
Which I'm kinda glad about, to be honest. More budget, without restricting creative liberties much! |
| 23:51 |
Gustavo6046 |
Although it's not like they didn't try anything with it. Say, Bedrock Edition... which kind of flopped, apart from of course mobile devices. |
| 23:52 |
Gustavo6046 |
Kind of a shame they're so bad at C++ nowadays. Didn't Windows 95 pioneer the usage of C++ in the operating system? Like, something something templates? |
| 23:52 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
Hi iamweasel! |
| 23:52 |
Gustavo6046 |
Didn't OLE use templates? I don't remember. |
| 23:52 |
Gustavo6046 |
Eh, M$ |
| 23:53 |
iamweasel |
^^ yup |
| 23:55 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
Guys I'm having trouble getting any Mobs to show up. I'm running Sokomine 's excellent mg_village mod, and df_caverns, and the only time I can get mobs to show up now that I can tell, is by enabline mobf_trader, but when they show up, they are lying dead and floating lifelessly above the structure they are supposed to be "living" in. |
| 23:56 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
Is it ok to dump my mod list? Maybe someone will spot a conflict |
| 23:56 |
iamweasel |
sorry, i have no experience with any of these mods, but.... |
| 23:56 |
iamweasel |
use a paste service if possible, like pastebit or the debian one |
| 23:57 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
Paste service? Sorry don't know what that is - could you elaborate? |
| 23:57 |
iamweasel |
...but perhaps other entities in this channel can help you. i have a lot of experience with mobs_redo and its dependents |
| 23:58 |
iamweasel |
paste large code samples @ https://paste.debian.net/ and then give us url |
| 23:58 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
nm I got it |
| 23:58 |
Biggvs_Richardvs |
https://justpaste.it/2n0uh |
| 23:59 |
iamweasel |
it may be a while, hours, before most of the channel users will see this, so it would really help if you hung in here for a while |
