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| 09:12 |
ANAND |
#8834 is ready for review |
| 09:12 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/8834 -- [no squash] Send ActiveObjects along with definitions once connection is established by ClobberXD |
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| 17:36 |
paramat |
there are some game PRs that need attention, the new tnt sounds seem good |
| 19:30 |
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| 19:39 |
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| 19:45 |
rubenwardy |
paramat: I'd like to suggest making a "mobs" branch on Minetest Game were we can add mobs redo, and then strip and polish it |
| 19:46 |
rubenwardy |
I don't want to be the sole person to do that polishing, as it's a big mod |
| 19:46 |
rubenwardy |
I suggest reducing the number of mobs to a core set, and then polishing their animations and behaviour |
| 19:46 |
rubenwardy |
if we can get someone to do that |
| 19:49 |
sfan5 |
are you sure we don't want to write stuff from scratch? |
| 19:50 |
rubenwardy |
after 7 years, I'd rather have something done than something done perfectly |
| 19:50 |
rubenwardy |
sofar gave up on his clean implementation |
| 19:51 |
sofar |
gheghe |
| 19:51 |
sofar |
"deprioritized" |
| 19:51 |
rubenwardy |
it would be good to see what problems mobs redo has first, I guess |
| 19:54 |
rubenwardy |
I don't think that we need engine support for mobs |
| 19:54 |
sofar |
I still think my approach would be ideal |
| 19:54 |
rubenwardy |
I do think that we need better related APIs, such as pathfinding |
| 19:54 |
sofar |
you can throw in models and sounds and textures and it would be better |
| 19:54 |
sofar |
you can plug in different pathfinders easily |
| 19:54 |
sofar |
since it's abstracted |
| 19:55 |
rubenwardy |
it's important to have an implementation actually perform well |
| 19:56 |
sofar |
for sure |
| 19:57 |
rubenwardy |
Are there any Minetest mobs mods which use steering behaviours? |
| 19:58 |
sofar |
that's what the sheep in my mod does in a very basic way |
| 19:58 |
sofar |
when you punch it, it runs away from you |
| 19:58 |
sofar |
it changes course if you flank it, too |
| 19:59 |
sofar |
it'll run for a while until it's far enough away, and then calm down again |
| 19:59 |
sofar |
but if you chase it, it'll go much further :) |
| 19:59 |
rubenwardy |
> last updated: 2017 |
| 20:01 |
sofar |
yeah I was working on the stone monster and never finished that |
| 20:01 |
rubenwardy |
the restrictive license and CLA is troubling, and is probably dissuading contributors |
| 20:01 |
sofar |
he was going to mimic a stone block and sit in caves |
| 20:01 |
sofar |
I just need to LGPL-2.1 it all |
| 20:02 |
sofar |
surprised I haven't done that yet |
| 20:02 |
sofar |
that was the plan anyway, dumb of me I haven't done it yet really |
| 20:37 |
paramat |
hmm, perhaps mobs redo is too complex? there may be simpler, well coded mobs mods. personally i think MTG only needs very simple mobs, just enough to make the MT app more appealing to help it get downloaded more |
| 20:40 |
rubenwardy |
I think that MTG should have the following mobs: Some farm animals (sheep for wool, cows for milk, pigs for meat), predators (wolves), and rare monsters (dungeon master, oerkii) |
| 20:41 |
rubenwardy |
I think that the overworld should only have realistic enemies, and the monsters should spawn underground |
| 20:41 |
paramat |
if we insist on something complex, the more chance we won't have time to work on it and maintain it, so then nothing happens. simple is better than nothing |
| 20:41 |
rubenwardy |
and it's good to have uses for each thing, to expand the craft tree |
| 20:44 |
rubenwardy |
paramat, please may you take a look at the prioritising in this board? https://github.com/minetest/minetest_game/projects/1 |
| 20:44 |
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| 20:45 |
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| 20:49 |
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| 20:51 |
paramat |
wool is made from cotton, in fact it is cotton. i think it's best to not make this wool/cotton mess worse by changing it back to animal wool. cotton would lose it's primary use. anyway, minor point :) |
| 20:52 |
paramat |
yes looking |
| 20:52 |
rubenwardy |
wool isn't cotton |
| 20:52 |
rubenwardy |
cotton is cotton |
| 20:52 |
paramat |
ugh nerzhul spam, can we do something about this? |
| 20:52 |
rubenwardy |
oh wait, there's a wool mod |
| 20:52 |
rubenwardy |
nevermind |
| 20:53 |
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| 20:56 |
paramat |
cotton is a better source for 'wool' because it only requires farming, not mobs. i think it's best to continue to consider 'wool' to be synthetic wool made from cotton. but anyway, it's a mess, weird how wool was merged, trying to imitate MC, without an animal source =) |
| 20:56 |
paramat |
but nevermind, mobs is the topic |
| 20:59 |
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| 20:59 |
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| 21:05 |
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| 21:06 |
paramat |
i disagree with about half of the things in that project/roadmap (sorry) |
| 21:06 |
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| 21:09 |
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| 21:12 |
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| 21:12 |
rubenwardy |
paramat: which things? |
| 21:13 |
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| 21:13 |
rubenwardy |
paramat: please feel free to remove the things you don't agree with |
| 21:13 |
rubenwardy |
so that it accurately represents consensus |
| 21:15 |
paramat |
i can't face or justify working on mobs-redo, sorry, because it's big and complex (overly complex for MTG in my opinion) and the author is not a good coder |
| 21:17 |
rubenwardy |
well, I guess we need to kidnap sofar then |
| 21:18 |
sofar |
fine |
| 21:18 |
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| 21:19 |
* sofar |
holds up wrists |
| 21:19 |
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| 21:25 |
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| 21:26 |
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| 21:30 |
paramat |
well, i only 'object' to a very few things in the roadmap, which i have removed. there are some other things that i like, but where i feel our limited time is better spent on new games, i won't remove those from the roadmap |
| 21:30 |
rubenwardy |
bahmm |
| 21:30 |
rubenwardy |
it's troubling how there's no other games that are any good |
| 21:31 |
* rubenwardy |
looks at Shara awkwardly |
| 21:31 |
* rubenwardy |
hasn't contributed to her game in a while |
| 21:32 |
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| 21:32 |
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| 21:38 |
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| 21:39 |
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| 21:41 |
p_gimeno |
how would a mob API look like? |
| 21:42 |
rubenwardy |
finite state machine |
| 21:44 |
paramat |
recently i have been feeling that the only things worth doing in MTG are bugfixing and maintenance, that we shouldn't try to make it into 'MT's impressive game' because it can't be that, because it is an unfixable structural mess and so constrained by everything that depends on it being the way it is |
| 21:45 |
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| 21:45 |
rubenwardy |
How do we get people to make actual good games? |
| 21:45 |
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| 21:47 |
paramat |
MT's 'impressive game' has to be something else, and will be so much better because it isn't MTG so is freer and more modern, and does things in a better way |
| 21:47 |
pmp-p |
rubenwardy: by giving them libs to reduce coding efforts, so they can focus more on game itself |
| 21:48 |
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| 21:48 |
paramat |
i think core devs need to work on new games, can't leave it to modders only, because core devs have so much talent and experience. so i feel we need to divert time from MTG to new games |
| 21:49 |
* sofar |
relicenses |
| 21:51 |
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| 21:56 |
paramat |
it's a tough situation, because it will be a while before a good new game is ready, so that makes us feel we have to work on MTG. however, if we keep focussing on MTG it will delay the new games ... |
| 21:58 |
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| 21:58 |
paramat |
... considering this, i feel the best thing to do, even though it is painful, is to minimise work on MTG and prioritise working on new games |
| 22:01 |
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| 22:07 |
paramat |
hopefully after november (CERN) we'll all have more time for HW |
| 22:08 |
rubenwardy |
not much has been done for the cern project recently |
| 22:11 |
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