Minetest logo

IRC log for #minetest, 2015-05-17

| Channels | #minetest index | Today | | Google Search | Plaintext

All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:03 dprc joined #minetest
00:05 Putz3000 I would like to setup an in-house minetest server preferably running on my fedora Linux desktop system. Do I have to install a server install or just use the normal client install?
00:06 est31 Putz3000, if you have X installed, a client install is ok
00:06 est31 but if not, then you can go with a server install too
00:06 est31 the only difference are the dependencies
00:08 Pilcrow but if you do have a client, you can run it as a headless server anyway, by using 'minetest --server'
00:09 Putz3000 minetest --server is command line command?
00:09 ShadowNinja Putz3000: `minetest --server` is equivalalent to `minetestserver`.  The seperate executable is just so that you don't have to install the Irrlicht library and all its dependencies to just build a server.
00:11 Pilcrow so yes, it's a command-line option. --server will allow you to run a server in a terminal, without the need to 'log in' on the server computer.
00:11 Putz3000 OK so if I am understanding correctly I can just install the normal client install and using it launch a server instance. That works for me because sometimes I will want to just play as client. Do I place mods in a different location so users connecting to the server can use them?
00:11 LazyJ If setting-up to run Minetest 24/7, go with minetestserver. If setting-up to play at home with your kids after work and school, regular client minetest and starting a local server from the main menu is the way to go.
00:13 LazyJ Mods - the Minetest "server" provides the mods to the "clients", so who ever connects doesn't have to preload anything but the engine.
00:14 Putz3000 LazyJ: but where do I place/install the mods for the server to recognize them?
00:14 Pilcrow same place as if you were using the server computer for a local singleplayer game.
00:15 Putz3000 oh, in the .minetest/mods folder in my home folder then?
00:15 Pilcrow yep
00:15 LazyJ One of two places, either in the "mods" directory or in the ../worlds/yourworldsname/worldmods/ directory.
00:16 LazyJ If using the /mods directory, you'll have to edit the world.mt file to activate each mod.
00:16 MinetestBot [git] kwolekr -> minetest/minetest: Add -Wsign-compare for Clang builds and fix some signed/unsigned compiler warnings 11a96e4 http://git.io/vTUva (2015-05-16T20:15:03-04:00)
00:16 MinetestBot [git] kwolekr -> minetest/minetest: SAPI: Accept either ARGB8 table or ColorString to specify colors fb36c47 http://git.io/vTUvV (2015-05-16T20:15:03-04:00)
00:16 Putz3000 LazyJ: what would make me pick one over the other?
00:16 LazyJ If using the ../worlds/yourworldsname/worldmods/, then just copying the mods into the worldmods directory is enough.
00:17 Pilcrow the worldmods folder is seperate for each world. so you could have unique mods for each world. if you want a mod to be available in all your worlds, putting them in .minetest/mods will take up less space.
00:17 LazyJ Bingo, what Pilcrow said.
00:20 LazyJ For me, I put mods that I use in every world in the .minetest/mods directory. These are "utility" mods that don't add any blocks to the world but are useful tools.
00:21 exio4 Pilcrow: hi
00:21 LazyJ "WorldEdit", "Ambience", and "Unified Inventory" are examples of "utility" mods.
00:21 exio4 Pilcrow: did you look at the paste
00:21 LazyJ Then I use the ../worlds/yourworldsname/worldmods/ directory to put mods that are unique to that world.
00:21 Pilcrow Putz3000: if you have the client installed on your computer already, I find the easiest way to set it up as a 'server' is to run it normally first, create a world (let's call the world 'flump' for this example), then configure it and sign into it once as singleplayer. then exit and run minetest --server --worldname flump
00:22 LazyJ I have one world dedicated to only the Technic mod and its support mods.
00:23 LazyJ So "Technic", "Mesecons", "Pipeworks", "MoreTrees", "PlantLife", "MoreOres", "Carts", and "MoreBlocks" go into the worldmods directory of that world.
00:23 Pilcrow I tend not to use worldmods much at all...
00:23 LazyJ Then for another world that is vanilla, I just use the utility mods in the ./minetest/mods directory.
00:24 LazyJ For my mod testing worlds, I place the mod I'm testing in the worldmods directory.
00:24 LazyJ Each mod has its own dedicated world so that other mods don
00:24 Pilcrow and hello exio4. I did see the paste. looks like I was massively over-thinking it, last night...  :P
00:24 LazyJ don't interfere with the evaluation and testing of the mod.
00:24 twoelk joined #minetest
00:24 Player_2 joined #minetest
00:25 exio4 Pilcrow: yeah :p
00:25 exio4 Pilcrow: was that lua code clear enough? I tried to keep it idiomatic on both sides
00:25 LazyJ If you are setting up a world that has mods for little kids but want a world for the grown-ups to play in, then kiddie mods in the kiddie world and the more complex mods in the grownups world.
00:26 LazyJ The more you use Minetest, the more you'll figure out and evolve your setup to suit your needs.
00:26 Pilcrow exio4: yes, it was clear enough. your 'boilerplate' made me smile though; you know what you're doing, but its obvious that you don't use lua very often...  ;)
00:27 exio4 Pilcrow: I don't really know Lua
00:27 Putz3000 Thank you all. I have copied/pasted this chat so I can study over it more as I try tackling this. On the surface it seems pretty straight forward overall. The real test I think will be if SELinux try's to interfere from a "locked down port" standpoint
00:27 LazyJ Ok, done typing my wall-o-text. :)-
00:27 Pilcrow heh
00:27 Putz3000 :)
00:27 exio4 Pilcrow: what'd the idiomatic way to do that kind of stuff?
00:28 hoodedice .
00:28 hoodedice sorry about that. bbl
00:29 Pilcrow exio4: s/what'd/what's/    ?
00:30 Pilcrow give me a sec. gotta find that paste again.
00:30 exio4 what would be the idiomatic way to do that kind of stuff? *?
00:35 ClaudeRoy joined #minetest
00:39 Viper168 joined #minetest
00:40 Pilcrow exio4: well, for one thing, iterating through the numbers can be done much more simply with a for loop. http://dpaste.com/0CTAXKV
00:40 exio4 lool
00:40 exio4 you're so damn right
00:41 exio4 Pilcrow: wait, does that work?
00:42 rcmaehl joined #minetest
00:42 exio4 and,that gen function now is doing something unrelated
00:42 exio4 for i = min, max do
00:42 Pilcrow oh acually it should be this I think: http://dpaste.com/3X9MH0Q
00:43 exio4 gen becomes completely useless in this specific program
00:43 Pilcrow (this is untested code, lol. step is optional for a for loop)
00:43 exio4 Pilcrow: I think that's wrong
00:43 Pilcrow probably
00:43 exio4 as it'll return the first function that _always_ returns i
00:43 exio4 which will be min
00:44 Pilcrow just a sec, I've gotta think about it a little
00:45 exio4 gen is useless now, you can replace it and just pass it as parameter to the loop
00:45 exio4 unles.. that's just a syntax rule
00:46 Putz3000 Do I need to enable "public" under the server tab when launching a local server instance of the game?
00:48 Pilcrow Putz3000: only if you want it to be listed on the public servers list. if you're just having family/friends connect to your IP, then no.
00:57 Wayward_Tab joined #minetest
01:00 Putz3000 Pilcrow: great, thanks
01:13 MinetestBot [git] ShadowNinja -> minetest/minetest: Fix current mod name change missed during rebase c00b681 http://git.io/vTUtt (2015-05-16T21:12:03-04:00)
01:16 Enke joined #minetest
01:21 Putz3000 sorry, another question. If I create a world can "creative" be toggled on/off for that world?
01:23 LazyJ Not while the game is running.
01:24 LazyJ If you use Unified Inventory, that mod adds the "creative" priv which you can grant and revoke on-the-fly but the creative priv isn't quite the same as creative-mode.
01:24 Putz3000 LazyJ: but I could turn it on for a little bit and then when we were done using it I could shutdown, turn it off, and then relaunch the world correct?
01:25 LazyJ In creative-mod you can break the hardest objects with your hand. With the creative priv you don't have to craft items.
01:26 LazyJ Correct. "Creative" and "Enable Damage" can be toggled on/off and relaunch the game any number of times and combinations.
01:26 Pilcrow well, exio4, I thought I understood it, but I still don't. apparently, minetest doesn't understand the code in your original paste either though; running your code as a mod's init.lua just returns 4 instances of 2500...  O_o
01:27 LazyJ Setup your Spawnbuilding (and other primary structures, roads, wayfindings, etc) in creative-mode then switch creative-mode off for gathering and crafting challenges.
01:29 Putz3000 LazyJ: Spawnbuilding? - you are not referring to each players house/building but instead a central spawn point?
01:29 LazyJ "Spawnbuilding" if you use a static spawn point.
01:30 Pilcrow exio4: http://dpaste.com/2WDYTGM
01:30 LazyJ It doesn't have to be a building but usually it is some sort of easily identifiable structure or spot.
01:30 Putz3000 the Static spawn point would apply to all players correct?
01:30 Taoki joined #minetest
01:30 exio4 Pilcrow: yes, it is a standalone lua script
01:31 LazyJ Correct. A static spawn point would apply to all players unless overridden by a mod such as the new, default 'Beds' mod.
01:32 Putz3000 LazyJ: I am using the beds mod. so the bed would override the static spawn point and not the other way around?
01:32 LazyJ Correct.
01:32 LazyJ Players have to "sleep" at least once for their individual spawnpoints to be set to the bed.
01:33 LazyJ Just clicking on the bed isn't enough; night has to be changed to day (sleep).
01:33 Putz3000 LazyJ: Have you every played with the teleporter mod? It sounded somewhat interesting
01:33 LazyJ There are several teleporter mods.
01:33 Putz3000 LazyJ: what config file do I need to edit for a static spawn point?
01:33 LazyJ We use a combination of chat-command and push-button teleporter mods.
01:33 Pilcrow exio4: lol I know. actually didn't realize until now that there's an actual 'lua' cli executable.
01:34 LazyJ The static spawn point is set in the minetest.conf file. "minetest.conf.example" is the list of all the possible settings.
01:34 Putz3000 LazyJ: the one I read about allowed you to create teleporter pads and program them with coordinates. then you just walk onto the pad & it teleports you to the pre programmed destination
01:35 LazyJ If you use a static spawn point, go there first to make sure it is a safe landing spot. I recommend placing the actual spawn point one block higher so players don't materialize in the floor and make sure the spawn point is protected so no players can block it.
01:36 LazyJ You can use multiple teleporting mods without affecting each other.
01:36 LazyJ "Travelnet" is the most intuitive to use once set.
01:37 LazyJ For more 'mystical' or sci-fi, the telepads (the mod you describe) fit the theme better.
01:37 Pilcrow exio4: I just put your original paste into a test.lua file. this is my result: http://dpaste.com/2DE4PBF ... still not sure what it's supposed to do. I'm assuming not that.
01:37 LazyJ TPR and Bookmarks are chat-based teleport mods.
01:37 exio4 Pilcrow: do you understand what `count' does, now?
01:38 LazyJ Chat-based teleporters can be used anywhere where teleport mods that require pads or booths have to be found by the players.
01:38 Pilcrow nope. I assumed it would output different numbers. this just confused me more.
01:38 LazyJ TPR allows players to teleport to each other.
01:38 exio4 Pilcrow: do you have the link to the paste? :p
01:38 Pilcrow http://dpaste.com/2YXM2KW
01:38 LazyJ Bookmarks allows admins to set teleport locations that can be used by players.
01:39 LazyJ Or you could grant players the "teleport" priv and they could teleport themselves anywhere.
01:39 LazyJ That's not recommended if you are running a server with players you don't know and trust.
01:40 Pilcrow exio4: oh, btw... one thing I actually _do_ understand is what idiv is supposed to do. idiv(x,2) can be replaced with math.floor(x/2)
01:42 Putz3000 LazyJ: server is family based. how would I grant teleport for all players? I want to be able to go to their computer and quickly punch in their home base coordinates if they get lost
01:42 LazyJ Add the teleport priv to the list of privs in the minetest.conf file.
01:43 Putz3000 LazyJ: same type of thing if I want to allow flying?
01:43 LazyJ Putz3000:    default_privs = shout,interact,fast,fly,teleport
01:44 LazyJ "no-clip" allows players to fly through solid objects.
01:44 Pilcrow Putz3000: or, if you want to change privs for each player individually, you can do /grant playername teleport
01:44 Pilcrow Putz3000: and /grant playername fly
01:45 LazyJ As for "home base" coordinates, use the default "sethome" mod.
01:45 Putz3000 LazyJ: so to default enable go to the config file and where it has default_privs just add the elements I want to allow?
01:45 LazyJ Once a player has setup a home base, they type   "/sethome"    at their home base.
01:45 Pilcrow Putz3000: that's right :)
01:45 LazyJ To return to their home base they type:  "/home".
01:47 Putz3000 LazyJ: how does the engine know "/home" = what ever coordinate they started at or is that based on a static spawn point?
01:47 LazyJ Unified Inventory uses two buttons, a red-arrow house for "sethome" and a green-arrow house to "gohome". It's sethome/gohome are independent and separate from the default sethome.
01:47 LazyJ For each player, a player file is created that contains their inventory and last known location (coords).
01:48 LazyJ Depending on the mod used, their "home" coords may be recorded there or in a single file that tracks the "sethomes" of every player.
01:48 Putz3000 LazyJ: so really /home = either static spawn point or last place they slept (bed mod)?
01:48 LazyJ Nope.
01:49 LazyJ The static spawn point is a different location, the bed's spawn point different from that, and the sethome is yet another location.
01:49 Putz3000 LazyJ: so will i find info on the wiki for the sethome command?
01:50 LazyJ I don't know. I haven't looked at Minetest's wiki for a long time.
01:51 LazyJ While in-game, type     /help all     to see a list of commands and a very brief description of them (usually just the syntax).
01:51 exio4 grr
01:51 Putz3000 OK - so how would I make sure each player is able to pick a "sethome" spot so they can easily teleport to it?
01:51 exio4 Pilcrow: math.floor! I didn't know about it
01:51 LazyJ Type:   /help <command>   for that specific command's info.
01:51 Putz3000 LazyJ: OK. I can do that. thank you
01:51 LazyJ Each player would have to "sethome" for themselves.
01:52 exio4 Pilcrow: well, basically count, takes a function, and some data structure that can be iteratored over (like a range..) and counts how many elements match the condition,
01:52 Putz3000 LazyJ: that I figured. Just wasn't sure if it was as easy and standing someplace and typing /sethome
01:52 LazyJ If you are dealing with youngin's you might want to setup a teleporter at their homes for them.
01:52 exio4 Pilcrow: I don't really know how to put this in a different way (things being the same is just because the functions happen to math nicely
01:52 LazyJ Yup. Its just as easy as that.
01:53 LazyJ Stand still, type   /sethome    and it's set for that player.
01:53 Pilcrow exio4: what I'm really struggling to understand is what gen_ actually outputs..
01:54 exio4 oh
01:54 exio4 it's an iterator
01:54 Pilcrow is that a type of function?
01:54 exio4 for x in gen_(max,min) do
01:54 exio4 end
01:54 exio4 is equivalent to
01:54 exio4 uhh, wrong parameter order
01:54 exio4 gen_(min,max)
01:54 exio4 for x in min,max do
01:54 exio4 end
01:55 exio4 if I understand correctly
01:55 exio4 Pilcrow: yeah, it's a bit weird, now that I look at it!
01:57 Pilcrow 'for x in min,max do' is different than 'for x = min,max do' ... I think the former will only perform the code twice (once for min and once for max), while the latter will iterate through all the in-between numbers.
01:58 exio4 er, I don't know lua
01:59 exio4 gen_ basically returns an iterator, from min to max, using a step = 1
02:01 Pilcrow I tried to plug in some different things, to understand it, but failed. print(count(f, {1,2,3,4,5})) is totally wrong (it expects a function), but print(count(f, function() return 1,2,3,4,5 end)) just freezes the interpreter.
02:07 exio4 http://www.lua.org/pil/7.1.html Pilcrow
02:13 exio4 Pilcrow: if count there had a type, it'd be something like
02:13 exio4 count :: (a -> Bool) -> Iter a -> Int
02:13 exio4 with `Iter a` being a function non-pure function like (() -> a)
02:14 est31 -> is associative isnt it?
02:15 exio4 I assumed (A -> B -> C) is (A -> (B -> C))
02:15 exio4 (note, thatg ((A -> B) -> C) is different)
02:15 est31 ok
02:15 exio4 it's right associativity
02:16 exio4 I am also too used to currying, so nevermind
02:16 exio4 A -> B -> C would be a function that takes an A, and returns a new function that'll take a new parameter B and and return a C
02:16 exio4 in some kind of vague terms
02:16 est31 yes
02:16 exio4 A -> (B -> C) makes that clear
02:17 est31 yes
02:17 exio4 (A -> B) -> C takes a function from A to B and returns a C
02:17 est31 yes
02:17 est31 was kicked by ShadowBot: Message repetition flood detected.
02:17 exio4 lol
02:17 est31 joined #minetest
02:17 est31 lol
02:17 exio4 poor est31 :P
02:18 est31 exio4, you are too right for ShadowBot. Make mistakes!
02:18 exio4 wat
02:18 exio4 which kind of mistakes
02:18 est31 where I cant answer with "yes"
02:19 exio4 lol
02:19 est31 :)
02:19 est31 restarting my KDE
02:19 est31 (that ugly bug again ...)
02:19 Pilcrow exio4: well. this is more advanced than I thought. even that explanation link doesn't make much sense to me. I feel stupid. I guess this is another of the many reasons I failed university...  -_-
02:20 exio4 don't worry, I am gonna fail too :D
02:21 thefamilygrog66 joined #minetest
02:21 exio4 Pilcrow: this is not that advanced, it's more like you have never wrote code that way, so it doesn't feel natural :p
02:22 thefamilygrog66 has anyone else been successful getting kaeza's firearms mod to work with 0.4.12?
02:25 Pilcrow thefamilygrog66: I've never tried it, sorry. I've got a custom spin of the old 'throwing' mod, and that's all I've ever needed for projectiles...  :P
02:25 exio4 Dan Grossman's course is prety good https://www.coursera.org/course/proglang
02:25 exio4 http://courses.cs.washington.ed​u/courses/cse341/13wi/#lectures
02:27 Putz3000 LazyJ: another Q (sorry): do I edit the mintest.conf file that is inside the worlds/<world name>/ folder that is inside the .minetest folder in my user folder?
02:28 LazyJ Putz3000, no worries. ;)  ./minetest/minetest.conf.
02:29 LazyJ Only if you are getting really specific about a world do you get into stuff in the /worlds/yourworld/ directory.
02:29 rcmaehl joined #minetest
02:29 thefamilygrog66 Pilcrow: thanks, it's odd - everything seems to work in it, though when I shoot mobs or other players, they don't take any damage at all. hopefully, it's just some minor tweaking...
02:29 Putz3000 LazyJ: thats the folder inside my user home folder correct (linux user)?
02:29 Putz3000 LazyJ: not inside of .bin or .var, etc
02:29 thefamilygrog66 howdy lazy
02:30 LazyJ Putz3000, afaik. I compile my Minetest clients as non-system wide.
02:30 LazyJ Howdy, grog!  Long time, no see ;)
02:30 thefamilygrog66 Putz3000, do a Ctrl+H to show all the hidden folders within your home folder, and look in .minetest
02:30 Pilcrow thefamilygrog66: do you have a link to it? If not, I can go find it myself; I'd like to poke around with it.  :P
02:31 thefamilygrog66 Pilcrow: Sure! https://forum.minetest.net/v​iewtopic.php?f=11&amp;t=4562
02:31 LazyJ Putz3000, thefamilygrog66 has setup Minetest for "home" use with his family. He may have more insights to add. :)
02:32 Pilcrow exio4: are those links just videos to watch and stuff to read, or would I have to somehow 'enroll' or something
02:32 Pilcrow ?
02:32 thefamilygrog66 Howdy LazyJ, stopped into linuxgaming the other day
02:32 Putz3000 LazyJ, thefamilygrog66: It sounds like its the folder I think it is. I edited it and I think it is working fine but I saw the user name I used listed inside the config file so that had me wondering if maybe there was another more system wide config file that I was missing.
02:33 exio4 Pilcrow: e coursera link means you have to enroll, etc, but it's not needed, the second link gives you the lectures, all the content
02:33 LazyJ I saw that. Sorry I could be around. I finally found a full-time job and it's kicking my butt; dead tired when I get home these days.
02:33 exio4 Pilcrow: it's nice to take the course in the normal offerings because of the forums, though
02:33 thefamilygrog66 Looks like Vanessa made my furniture all curvy!
02:33 Putz3000 thefamilygrog66: basically LazyJ has been answering a ton of questions in an effort to help me setup a home server for the kids and I so we can play in the same world.
02:34 thefamilygrog66 Oh, okay - you're all behind the same router?
02:34 Pilcrow exio4: ah. I'll check it out, thanks.
02:34 thefamilygrog66 Putz3000 ^^^
02:35 thefamilygrog66 brb
02:35 exio4 Pilcrow: remember to do the homework! :p
02:35 Pilcrow sometimes I wonder how much a certain medical condition actually affected my brain before I got it under control. I've passed out from lack of oxygen to the brain tens of times... that can't be good. I feel like I used to be smarter 5-6 years ago...  :\
02:35 Putz3000 thefamilygrog66: yes. I want to run it on my fedora desktop and just fire it up in server mode for the kids and I from time to time. all in house, no public facing.
02:36 LazyJ Putz3000, if you are starting the Minetest server from inside the client, then your name is added to the config file as the "admin" or "server-op"... the one Minetest is supposed to (cough, cough) obey.
02:38 LazyJ So when you type   /grant <playername> <privs>, those privs are given to that player.
02:38 LazyJ Sort of like being the "root" in-game.
02:39 LazyJ But if any other player, who doesn't have any special privs, tries to grant privs to themselves or others, it won't work.
02:40 Putz3000 LazyJ: but once I launch it via command line the same config file should still be used correct?
02:40 LazyJ Correct.
02:41 LazyJ Once the Minetest server is running, log in and grant privs accordingly to yourself, the other "admins" (I recommend giving Mom high status) and then whatever privs you think the kids are ready for.
02:41 Pilcrow LazyJ: just making sure, if you /grant someone the 'privs' priv, then they can use /grant to give it to others, correct?
02:41 LazyJ Yup.
02:42 exio4 good night
02:42 LazyJ There is also "basic_privs" which only allows the player to grant or revoke interact, fast, and shout.
02:42 Pilcrow bye exio4. sorry for being annoying, lol
02:42 exio4 you aren't annoying
02:42 exio4 duh :p
02:42 Pilcrow eh. I just feel like it then. :P
02:44 Pilcrow heh. don't set default_privs = privs   :P
02:44 Pilcrow of course, if you just did that, you'd have to /grant yourself interact... which would be really weird...  :D
02:50 LazyJ Putz3000, so when you are in-game, grant *yourself* all of the privs:   /grant Putz3000 all
02:51 LazyJ And then every time you add a mod, repeat the command to grant yourself any new privs that the mods may have added.
02:51 LazyJ Also do this when updating the engine and game as good measure.
02:52 Pilcrow thefamilygrog66: well, I poked into the firearms code, but can't figure out what the firearms.event.trigger function is supposed to do, so I don't know why it doesn't damage players/mobs. I tried but failed. sorry.  :\
02:53 thefamilygrog66 Pilcrow, no prob - thanks for looking at it. I'll try to run into kaeza sometime soon and pick his brain.
02:54 * thefamilygrog66 really needs to learn meshnodes...
02:55 * Pilcrow needs to as well...
02:55 thefamilygrog66 my own mods are using them now, or at least forks of them are, haha
02:56 thefamilygrog66 I have to admit that the sofas look pretty slick with their curves and all now.
02:56 Pilcrow ^ it would help if I could get Blender working, but it's nearly impossible in this old, outdated distro. every package I install needs to be manually compiled, and there are a LOT I need for blender; it's just kind of a dependancy nightmare...  -_-
02:57 thefamilygrog66 yikes, which distro are you using Pilcrow?
02:57 LazyJ Any forum posts on creating meshnodes in Blender yet?
02:57 thefamilygrog66 LazyJ, I haven't checked, to be honest
02:58 LazyJ Also, is there a setting to prevent Irrlicht from listing, in the logs' startup, every single meshnode loaded?
02:58 thefamilygrog66 the first time I actually saw them being used on my lrfurn mod was when I was on your server recently
02:58 thefamilygrog66 no idea
02:59 LazyJ That list of meshnodes does me no good. I need the log info before and after.
02:59 thefamilygrog66 Is minetest itself generating the list?
03:00 thefamilygrog66 or irllicht
03:00 thefamilygrog66 *irrlicht
03:00 LazyJ idk.
03:00 Pilcrow thefamilygrog66: I'm using an old 32-bit version of Chakra Linux (originally forked from arch)... the repository doesn't exist any more. It would be completely useless, if Arch and its derivatives weren't so good at building packages. I really need to just re-do this computer entirely, but I have no available backup medium right now, and no money to get one, so I'd lose a lot of stuff...
03:02 thefamilygrog66 ah, I haven't heard of chakra.
03:05 Xenoth joined #minetest
03:09 thefamilygrog66 LazyJ: Vanessa made a script to import nodeboxes into blender: https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?p=159252
03:11 LazyJ Thanks, thefamilygrog66  ;)
03:12 LazyJ I'm going to have to spend a lot of time on YouTube learning how to use Blender.
03:12 LazyJ Too many irons in the fire, as always... as always.
03:13 Pilcrow thefamilygrog66: do you know the difference between a fixed-release model and rolling-release? as an example, Ubuntu is fixed-released and Arch proper is rolling-release. Chakra is one of the few existant 'semi-rolling' distros; it takes the rolling principle of Arch, but freezes and bugfixes the core libraries such as the kernel, sound server etc. while updating the higer-level packages (what most people would refer to as 'applic
03:14 Pilcrow ^ this allows it to be more up-to-date than, say, ubuntu, while being more stable than Arch. I think it's the best of both worlds.
03:15 Pilcrow the reason _my_ install is so outdated, is because I haven't used this computer in years, but recently switched back to it after my other one started getting some major heat problems...  :P
03:16 Pilcrow s/core libraries/core packages/   .... the kernel isn't a library, lol
03:18 chchjesus joined #minetest
03:18 Putz3000 LazyJ: OK, on the surface it looks like it will work or at least I appear to have a decent working start on this. I was able to connect from my laptop to the box running as a server and I spawned in the exact spot I had logged out of when I first created the world via gui application.
03:19 chchjesus joined #minetest
03:19 LazyJ Putz3000, that's a good start. \o/
03:20 LazyJ Keep an eye on the minetest.conf file after a few starts and shutdowns.
03:20 Putz3000 LazyJ: next question, is there any way to make my home world or server show up or be able to join simply by entering the world name on the remote client? currently you have to know the physical IP address of the server
03:20 Pilcrow honestly, Ubuntu is a bit of a bad example anyway, as fixed-releases go. it's based on an unstable branch of debian, so when it freezes the development, it freezes with bugs intact. that's one of the biggest reasons I hate ubuntu; it tries to be a figurehead to non-linux users, but it provides them with a system that's sometimes even buggier than windows. thus, linux is seen as a 'toy', incapable of 'real' work, by the majority of
03:20 Putz3000 LazyJ: why, something undesirable might happen in the config file? what should I look for?
03:20 LazyJ Minetest adds things to the minetest.conf file if you toggle something in the menu or change a setting in-game.
03:21 LazyJ Also it's a good idea to leave notes for yourself when and what settings you manually change in minetest.conf.
03:22 LazyJ Minetest's documentation is scattered and to sparten to make heads or tales of. Shear trial-and-error is often what it takes.
03:23 LazyJ Setup a domain name for your intra-net and use that instead of the IP (I haven't done that myself yet so I don't know how).
03:23 Pilcrow heh. guess I got a little ranty. just proves I love Linux though...  :P
03:23 Putz3000 Pilcrow: that would explain why one release of Ubuntu seems good and stable and the next release things are broken that was previously just fine. very frustrating. I also feel they have ditched the desktop but can't publicly say or do so...at least not at this time. Their quality control sucks and they seem to not be putting any effort into applying known fixes for some things that are well known and documented issues.
03:24 LazyJ If you in-house server is the only one the family computers connect to to play Minetest, just logging in once is all you'll need.
03:24 LazyJ Minetest will keep that connection info in the client's minetest.conf files.
03:24 Putz3000 LazyJ: thats right (domain). Crap, I should have realized that - I work around networking. Personally I think it would be easier to give my box a static IP and then save it in the clients list :)
03:25 LazyJ If they start hopping around to Minetest servers online, those will be kept in another file and show-up in the server list.
03:25 Pilcrow Putz3000: yeah, I feel ubuntu has its reputation because it _used_ to be good. imho, though, it started going downhill way back in 8.10...
03:25 Putz3000 LazyJ: does the minetest.conf file respect # as a REM statement so I can place notes in the file without triggering an error message?
03:26 LazyJ Static IP, save in clients list... workable solution.
03:26 LazyJ Yup. "#" to comment out stuff in minetest.conf.
03:27 LazyJ Works in the world.mt and client list too.
03:27 Pilcrow Putz3000: 8.4 was great. 8.10 had some annoying bugs but mostly worked. then 9.4, 9.10, 10.4, and 10.10 were all complete trash. I stopped checking after that.
03:27 Putz3000 Pilcrow: I started noticing issues that really bugged me (could be old age too though) around the 9.10/10.10 range and of course Unity just tipped it for me. the very locked down nature of unity seems to defy free as in freedom.
03:28 Pilcrow Putz3000: if you don't mind my asking, what distro do you prefer?
03:29 Putz3000 Pilcrow: I have largely been a ubuntu or ubuntu based user with eOS being the most recent. Sadly mostly because I hated RPMs with a passion and loved command line apt-get. but I am honestly thinking fedora may have finally won me over. And RPMs have come a long way from where they used to be.
03:31 Putz3000 Pilcrow: lol, didn't see Q until I had already posted. I am currently using fedora 21 Workstation and am thinking I am largely enjoying it. not a fan of how comlicated it is for nvidea driver but otherwise seem pretty good. I recently looked at openSUSE again and after changing file formats from default it wasn't too bad but still just didn't sit right with me. on the debian/Ubuntu side I don't mind Mint but liked
03:31 Putz3000 aspects of eOS (elementary OS). but I am thinking I may stay fedora
03:31 Pilcrow I definitely have a thing for semi-rolling distros, as the only ones I know of are also my favorites. I love MEPIS (a semi-rolling debian stable; hasn't been updated in a while), PCLinuxOS (a semi-rolling Mandriva; some stability issues last time I tried), and Chakra (a semi-rolling Arch; has been perfect for me, if kept up-to-date)...  :)
03:32 OldCoder joined #minetest
03:33 Putz3000 Pilcrow: I haven't messed with any of those I think. had never heard of Chakra until you listed it in irc earlier. PCLinuxOS I have heard of...I think I lightly looked at it once long time ago but that was it. have never personally played with rolling releases although thought about. have hung back because if ubuntu breaking things that were broke the last time bugged me I was afraid a rolling release would potentially
03:33 Putz3000 be worse
03:35 Putz3000 Ok guys, I have to run out for a bit so I am shutting down irc for now. thank you all for the help, suggestions, and conversation. my experience in this channel has probably been one of the best in years.
03:37 Wayward_Tab joined #minetest
03:38 FR^4 joined #minetest
03:38 Pilcrow heh. it's nice when you can have fun conversations on here. Putz3000 seems pretty cool.  :)
03:39 Pilcrow that Pilcrow guy, though, he's just fricking annoying.  :P
03:41 chchjesus joined #minetest
03:42 LazyJ Hehehe... the channel was spared only a couple of my walls-o-text and Putz3000 survived. :0)
03:43 LazyJ Yeah. Nice to have a civilized and friendly conversation.
03:43 FR^4 joined #minetest
03:44 Pilcrow LazyJ: it would seem you and I are both 'walls of text'-type people... ;P
03:53 FR^4 joined #minetest
04:02 Pilcrow I hope I can catch luizrpgluiz tomorrow; he was trying to figure out how to generate a tree, so I created a simple example mod for him (using the set_node() method)...
04:03 Pilcrow ^ https://github.com/Pilcrow182/alien_trees  :P
04:03 VanessaE Pilcrow: he's trying to figure out how to place a tree (by whatever method) with biome capability -- without relying on a third-party mod
04:04 VanessaE and he can't use the engine's deco system (no l-system support yet)
04:04 FR^4 joined #minetest
04:06 Pilcrow VanessaE: ah, ok. guess my example is useless to him then. oh well; it only took 10min to throw together anyway...  :P
04:06 VanessaE heh
04:06 VanessaE 99 cobble says he looks at your code and *still* doesn't understand how to do it :)
04:07 Pilcrow heh
04:07 Pilcrow 99 cobble, huh?  :P
04:07 VanessaE I'ma  cheapskate :D
04:07 VanessaE I'm a*
04:08 Pilcrow so, is he trying to get minetest to make trees on_generated, but obey some biome properties directly, instead of by node name?
04:08 MinetestBot [git] kwolekr -> minetest/minetest: Add optional buffer param for bulk data array writes in Lua 3ffb5f5 http://git.io/vTUzz (2015-05-17T00:07:45-04:00)
04:08 MinetestBot [git] kwolekr -> minetest/minetest: Noise: Fix interpolation at negative coordinates 28b2476 http://git.io/vTUzg (2015-05-17T00:04:51-04:00)
04:10 Pilcrow ^ 0_o I didn't know interpolation was even broken at negative coords...  :P
04:13 Pilcrow VanessaE: there's probably better ways to make a simple tree than my example anyway. I'm not a big fan of scematics, and L-System is for big complicated things, but I'm thinking VM could be used for tree-generating...
04:14 VanessaE actually set_node() is the simplest way really
04:14 Pilcrow yeah?
04:14 VanessaE yeah. slowest, of course, but simplest
04:14 VanessaE VM would be faster for this, but harder for him to understand, I think
04:15 VanessaE the really tricky part of course is deciding just where to actually put the structure
04:15 VanessaE terrain evaluation and biome control is Hard™
04:16 VanessaE (particularly if you wanna do it fast and do so after core mapgen runs)
04:17 Pilcrow yup yup. vm would be harder for me, too; I only have a tentative grasp on vm, really. I can make a simple lua landgen, but haven't actually figured out how to shift it up/down to create things like foatlands, nether, etc...  :P
04:18 Pilcrow ^ not that it's particularly complex. I've just never devoted much time with it...  heh
04:19 Pilcrow s/with/to
04:19 VanessaE ditto.  I've only ever looked into VM's once, and that was when there was an engine glitch that caused snow mod to not work alongside plants_lib many months ago
04:20 VanessaE and then, I didn't really look into it enough to learn much :P
04:21 Pilcrow heh. yeah. I still wonder if using vm to alter a 1x1 area (i.e. a single node) would be faster or slower than using set_node()
04:21 hmmmmm why don't you like schematics?  they were basically made for trees
04:24 Pilcrow hmmmmm: I don't know, really. I guess mostly because the official minetest ones are compressed, or binary or something, instead of text... I liked using the old .we files, where I could easily alter a schematic with sed... but I never used those for trees, either...  :P
04:25 hmmmmm for what it's worth, you can just define them in lua
04:26 hmmmmm check this out: https://github.com/paramat/biomesdev/blob/9b1a​4b8d1d6253736f60df916f1f6219405239ad/tree.lua
04:26 hmmmmm you can also translate an .mts file into the text for a lua table in that format
04:28 Pilcrow hmmmmm: alright then. I suppose I misspoke; I don't particularly dislike them, I just don't use them because they were just never very high on my priorities for figuring out.
04:29 hmmmmm if you want to add some kind of bulk nodes very quickly, you should try to learn more about schematics
04:29 hmmmmm it's worth it because you can do things with schematics you cannot do with anything else
04:30 ruukasu joined #minetest
04:32 Pilcrow Alright, hmmmmm. Thanks for the tip! I'll probably figure them out eventually; I do have a few home-spun mods that do that kind of thing, so it would probably be worth it to learn...  :)
04:34 alt81442 joined #minetest
04:34 * Pilcrow idly wonders if there will ever come a point where there's nothing left to learn about minetest...   :P
04:35 Pilcrow ^ if that ever happened, though, I'd probably get bored of it. or contribute to core development. yeah, not very likely I'll reach that point...  :P
04:36 hmmmmm it's unfortunate to say, but the only ones who actually understand what's going on are the core developers
04:38 hmmmmm it's ironic, because the original selling point for the lua api was that it was "sinfully easy"
04:38 hmmmmm well, sinfully easy didn't scale up :p
04:41 Pilcrow well, lua has a shallow learning curve, but even it can get complicated. not to mention the extra core functions that are able to be called from lua. with schematics, vm, etc... I feel like I'm getting to the complicated parts of modding now...  :P
04:42 hmmmmm the voxelmanipulator in particular exposes some internals of minetest out of necessity you might not have known about
04:46 Pilcrow yeah, I've already seen how useful it can be... it's definitely something I'm trying to get better with. some day I may make a vm clone of paramat's -old- floatlands (the ones in which the islands were small and sort of oval-shaped, and made entirely of floatstone and floatsand with a little mese and float-crystal rarely mixed in)... I really miss that old mod... but it was HORRIBLY slow...  :D
04:47 Pilcrow and yes, I know he expanded floatlands and made them vm-based later, but I miss the island shape, etc. of floatlands ~2.0  :P
04:47 hmmmmm it might seem to people like i don't really do anything for minetest, but i'm trying pretty hard to make mods fast
04:48 hmmmmm it's all behind the scenes
04:51 Pilcrow hmmmmm: if people feel like you don't do much, it's probably because most minetest users stick to the lua-side and sort of ignore the core developers. sad, but true... I've seen some of the awesome things you've put work into, at least. I'll often watch the engine commits just to see what new features get added, lol.
04:51 VanessaE we know you're working hard on it
04:51 VanessaE it's just that there are tons of visible, user-facing issues that need dealt with, and not enough people to work on them
04:52 Pilcrow VanessaE: like that entity ghosting bug that keeps showing up, getting squashed, and coming back?  :P
04:53 VanessaE Pilcrow: well I wasn't thinking of that, specifically.
04:53 VanessaE what's needed right now, imho, is a bug-squashing period - almost like a feature freeze prior to a release, but without the release.  Something that goes on for weeks and weeks
04:54 VanessaE after which normal dev continues.
04:55 Pilcrow VanessaE: maybe, but there are always so many new feature requests, if all the devs decided to do that, the requests would build up to daunting levels, wouldn't they?
04:55 VanessaE some might say that such requests already *are* at "daunting" levels
04:55 hmmmmm there is an incredible amount of technical debt
04:56 hmmmmm nobody is going to work on that however, it's not scratching their own itch and it's not fun
04:56 VanessaE exactly.
04:56 VanessaE however:
04:56 hmmmmm this is what happens when your developers are all volunteers
04:56 hmmmmm I at least tried something by adding unit tests
04:57 VanessaE wouldn't scratching one's own itch also include making sure that your code is bug-free, seeing as how you would theoretically also experience the same bugs as the average users do?
04:57 VanessaE (not you personally, hmmmmm)
04:57 hmmmmm you'd freaking expect that to be the case!
04:57 hmmmmm but evidently not
04:58 VanessaE unit tests are good
05:01 Pilcrow then again, how often do most core developers get the chance to just play for recreation (i.e. not testing new stuff)? I know even for me as a mod programmer, probably 70% or more of my 'minetest time' is either spent making new code, or testing new code. I kind of forget about the older mods, until something goes horribly wrong... and that's just lua-side...
05:02 VanessaE it's about the same for me
05:02 VanessaE 70-80% of minetest time spent in code instead of in-game just playing
05:03 Pilcrow btw, hmmmmm, your unit tests do seem to be helping people though. just so you know. just a day or two, someone on here was using them. (est31 I think?)
05:03 Pilcrow * a day or two ^[ago]
05:05 TheBonsai_ joined #minetest
05:09 hmmmmm cool
05:12 Sinkidonk joined #minetest
05:12 MinetestBot [git] paramat -> minetest/minetest: Mapgen v5/v7: Detect sandstone, enable sandstone brick dungeons c0edb8e http://git.io/vTUwX (2015-05-17T06:07:39+01:00)
05:13 Sinkidonk can anyone show me a example of how I can use the texture colorize? I try but I don't know what format they what me to use for the color.
05:18 Sinkidonk is anyone on at this late at night? just what to know before I wait hear for to long thinking someone listening.
05:19 Pilcrow hello Sinkidonk
05:20 Sinkidonk ok people are on this late at night
05:20 Zeno` joined #minetest
05:21 Pilcrow Sinkidonk: it's usually kind of slow at this time of night, but minetest has users and developers from all over the place, so there's usually at least -some- people in here...  :)
05:21 Pilcrow Sinkidonk: I've never used colorize before, but this might help: http://dev.minetest.net/texture
05:22 Pilcrow looks like textures can be colorized with #RGB, #RGBA, #RRGGBB, #RRGGBBAA
05:22 Zeno` or a named colour
05:23 Sinkidonk yea that look like it will help me at the very least I now know the format that they me to use
05:24 Pilcrow ^ Zeno` would probably know more about it than me. but glad we could help!  :)
05:25 ac_minetest joined #minetest
05:25 Pilcrow btw, hello Zeno`! didn't see you sign in, as I was busy typing!  :P
05:26 Zeno` hi :)
05:27 Pilcrow Zeno`: how are you this fine day? (irony: it is neither fine nor day where I am; it's a stormy night, lol)
05:27 Zeno` haha,
05:28 Zeno` I'm tired but ok :)
05:28 Zeno` 3:28PM here btw :P
05:28 Zeno` and kind of drizzling rain
05:30 Pilcrow ah. 12:28AM here and I will be going to bed in about an hour. I'm uh-mur-u-kin, lol.
05:31 Putz3000 joined #minetest
05:31 Pilcrow hello again Putz3000!
05:31 Putz3000 Hello
05:32 Pilcrow Putz3000: how are you this [fine|stormy] [day|night]?  :P
05:32 Putz3000 another question or two :) I edited the minetest.conf file and added the default_priv command that I thought included home but the only user that can use /sethome is my login. Is this a Mac issue you think I need to edit the file differently?
05:33 Putz3000 Pilcrow: night would be wet/rainy but a little calmer than earlier :)
05:33 Pilcrow lol
05:36 Pilcrow Putz3000: as far as I knew, anyone could use /sethome... but I'm not really the person to ask, as I use a mod that does it for me with buttons in my inventory.
05:37 Pilcrow ^ speaking of which, weren't you going to check out Unified Inventory? I think it has sethome/gohome buttons, as well...
05:38 Sinkidonk well thank you Pilcrow, and Zeno for the help would mine if I added your irc names to my mod basically saying thank for showing me that resource
05:38 Putz3000 Pilcrow: bummer :) thanks though. I also have to find out how to submit bug stuff for the Mac builds. I am hoping it plays well enough because most of the machines in the house are iMac's including two really old ones.
05:38 Zeno` in default game you need the "home" priv
05:39 Zeno` Sinkidonk, what does your priv line look like?
05:39 Putz3000 Pilcrow: I did grab and play around with Unified Inventory. It's OK but I think I largely prefer not using it. I don't like everything it does to the inventory window. I also think I lose the purpose of the game if I have everything unless I am only trying to build with it. I know, I am weird.
05:40 nore joined #minetest
05:40 Zeno` anyway, just add ,home to it
05:40 Pilcrow Sinkidonk you can add me if you want, but all I did was show you a link. honestly, if it weren't for dev.minetest.net, I probably wouldn't even understand how to mod...  ;)
05:41 Putz3000 Zeno: How do I enable that on a server instance? I edited the minetest.conf file in the worlds folder and added a default_priv line that included it but it only works for my login not the other users connecting remotely.
05:41 Zeno` and don't paste your password here if you do happen to paste the line in auth.txt lol
05:41 Putz3000 can I login and just do a /grant <user name> home   or something like that?
05:42 Zeno` you can do it that way, sure
05:42 Sinkidonk yep that will work
05:42 Putz3000 Zeno: is there a better or easier way?
05:44 Zeno` yeah
05:44 Zeno` well.. you can add   default_privs = interact, shout, home   to minetest.conf
05:44 Pilcrow Putz3000: Honestly, I agree with you about Unified Inventory. I never did like it much. I use Zeg9's Inventory++, because it's mostly like the default but can have 'plugin' mods for doing more stuff. It doesn't get updated very often, though...
05:45 Zeno` if you do it that way everyone will have the "home" priv automatically
05:45 Zeno` (except for existing users I think)
05:46 Zeno` (for existing users edit auth.txt and change :shout,interact: to :shout,interact,home:)
05:46 Pilcrow ^ ah. yeah. users that already exist won't be granted the new privs. default_privs only affects -new- players
05:48 Putz3000 actually I just looked at my config file and I guess I included everything EXCEPT home. So I killed the server, edited the file and relaunched the server. My guess is it will work now
05:48 Putz3000 OK, time for a father & daughter test run with this thing. see you all later.
05:48 Pilcrow Putz3000: for future reference, Krock's mod-searcher is awesom for finding mods that people mention on irc by name. http://nimg.pf-control.de/MTstuff/modSearch.php
05:49 Pilcrow *awesome
05:49 Putz3000 cool. thank you.
05:49 Pilcrow np. have fun with your daughter!  :)
05:50 Zeno` bye
05:50 Putz3000 will do l8tr
05:51 Pilcrow does anyone else use inventory++ any more? I feel like it's gotten almost completely eclipsed by unified inventory...  :P
05:52 Zeno` no, but I use Zeg9's craft guide
05:54 Etzos joined #minetest
05:55 Pilcrow yeah? I always thought ui had a better craft guide... at least the nodes are easier to search for. but I like the look and feel of i++ more, and it's easier to expand/customize...
05:55 Pilcrow I just wish someone would split ui's craft guide and node searching into a i++ plugin. I'd do that myself, but figuring out other peoples' formspecs makes my brain hurt  :D
05:56 Zeno` When my server was new I really wanted things as lightweight as possible
05:56 Zeno` formspecs are fugly
05:58 Pilcrow I don't care much about making things lightweight, but I want them to -feel- lightweight and easy to manage. I get why people like ui, but it feels big and clunky to use, for me...
05:59 Pilcrow ^ not that it's badly coded, at all. just not to my taste.
06:02 Hirato joined #minetest
06:02 Pilcrow really, I just wish zeg9's craft guide had a text search box, for finding a node by description or node-name, similar to the one in unified inventory. that's the only thing I really feel is missing.
06:03 Pilcrow instead, I've gotta flip through 10+ pages of nodes to find the one I'm looking for. which becomes even worse if I'm trying out a new texture pack or something and don't actually know what the node I'm searching for -looks- like...  :P
06:11 thecatplayer joined #minetest
06:11 thecatplayer hello?
06:12 thecatplayer how does this work?
06:12 est31 joined #minetest
06:14 hmmmmm oh god i am not good with computers how did i get here
06:15 Pilcrow heh
06:15 Pilcrow I was busy with something
06:16 Pilcrow irc is kind of hard to stumble upon by accident...  :P
06:18 * Pilcrow wishes there were such a thing as voice-over-irc...  :P
06:18 alt23771 joined #minetest
06:20 Sinkidonk I guess it somewhat easy if there was a link to the irc
06:21 RealBadAngel joined #minetest
06:25 jin_xi joined #minetest
06:26 Pilcrow Sinkidonk: well, I suppose so, but in order to stumble into here by accident, you'd have to navigate to the minetest website, click/hover-over community, click IRC, and click #minetest... not to mention the fact that if someone was 'not very good with computers', they probably won't have heard of minetest. which makes me wonder how they'd stumble into the main site in the first place...  :P
06:26 Pilcrow btw, hello RBA
06:28 Pilcrow haha. someone actually attempted to make a voice-over-irc...  http://ecc-comp.blogspot.ca/2014​/09/b64oirc-base64-over-irc.html
06:30 CWz joined #minetest
06:30 Sinkidonk that is a good point
06:36 Viper168 joined #minetest
06:37 SouL_|_ joined #minetest
06:41 Pilcrow time for me to go to bed. have a great [day|night] everyone!  o/
06:42 Sinkidonk yep night
06:52 fusion44 joined #minetest
06:55 SouL_|__ joined #minetest
07:09 Krock joined #minetest
07:44 basxto joined #minetest
07:47 Krock 4 people on the forum have their birthday and the youngest is th only with more than 0 posts.
07:48 Krock somehow strange
07:52 Tux[Qyou] joined #minetest
07:55 Calinou joined #minetest
08:00 Yepoleb_ joined #minetest
08:04 MinetestBot [git] kwolekr -> minetest/minetest: SAPI/Noise: Add PerlinNoiseMap:getMapSlice() function 4c9a8a9 http://git.io/vTTeO (2015-05-17T04:04:17-04:00)
08:18 est31 joined #minetest
08:40 TheBonsai_ joined #minetest
08:43 Matsetes joined #minetest
08:43 Matsetes Hi!
08:43 Matsetes Is there any mod that adds something like barrels but pipeworks compatible?
08:46 OldCoder joined #minetest
08:49 alket joined #minetest
09:02 Calinou joined #minetest
09:17 Haudegen joined #minetest
09:27 Megaf_ joined #minetest
09:41 Petrus2 joined #minetest
09:42 Weedy joined #minetest
09:55 Jordach joined #minetest
10:29 Megaf Hi all, what is this Initialising Nodes?
10:29 Megaf Why does it take so long?
10:34 Matsetes Dunno, but charging a world is so long...
10:34 TeTpaAka joined #minetest
11:05 Trustable joined #minetest
11:08 est31 joined #minetest
11:09 est31 jin_xi, you might want to talk to RealBadAngel.
11:09 RealBadAngel bout what?
11:09 est31 irrlicht particles
11:10 est31 https://github.com/obneq/mine​test/tree/scenenodeparticles
11:10 RealBadAngel i wasnt playing with particles at all
11:10 Telesight joined #minetest
11:10 est31 do you know who could help?
11:11 RealBadAngel no idea. but whats the problem anyway?
11:11 est31 I think jin_xi wants feedback about the general approach of their changes
11:12 est31 jin_xi  you should update the existing PR, thats better than opening a new one. A new pr is ok if discussion starts to get too long.
11:12 est31 https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/2587
11:13 est31 RealBadAngel ---> http://irc.minetest.ru/minet​est-dev/2015-05-16#i_4251981
11:14 jin_xi better look here https://github.com/obneq/mine​test/tree/scenenodeparticles than that PR for now
11:14 jin_xi can a PR be updated to use a different branch?
11:14 est31 no
11:14 est31 but you can set the branch to the content of the other branch
11:15 est31 you  will have to update it every time you do changes on the original branch
11:15 est31 but will work
11:15 jin_xi what a mess
11:15 est31 why not use the original branch?
11:15 jin_xi was checking out different approaches
11:16 est31 and you want feedback which one to use?
11:16 est31 or have you already decided on one
11:18 technomancy has anyone worked on modding digilines LCDs to allow two of them to work side-by-side?
11:18 technomancy the limitations of 12x5 chars are pretty >_<
11:23 October21 joined #minetest
11:24 Haudegen joined #minetest
12:03 Halamix2 joined #minetest
12:21 YuGiOhJCJ joined #minetest
12:22 YuGiOhJCJ hello, do you see why my seeds give a bad result on this part of my dirt ? http://yugiohjcj.free.fr/minetest-seed.png
12:25 est31 YuGiOhJCJ, its because of a shadow in the air
12:26 est31 update to latest git, that bug got resolved since 0.4.12
12:26 est31 you'll still have to remove the existing shadow though
12:26 est31 this can be done with worldedit
12:26 ac_minetest joined #minetest
12:27 est31 select the area and then do //replace air air
12:27 Krock (best is when you do this when the wielditem gets bright again)
12:28 Krock (fly up)
12:29 GeHa joined #minetest
12:30 Haudegen joined #minetest
12:36 YuGiOhJCJ worldedit ? you speak of this project ? http://www.enginehub.org/worldedit
12:38 Viper168_ joined #minetest
12:40 YuGiOhJCJ hmm... maybe this : https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=572
12:41 est31 yes
12:56 ClaudeRoy joined #minetest
13:07 YuGiOhJCJ OK the MOD is installed and now I am able to type commands like "/help /copy" so it seems to work but I don't see the WorldEdit GUI in my inventory pressing the "i" key... Is it normal?
13:10 Krock !mod worldedit
13:10 MinetestBot Krock: WorldEdit [worldedit] by sfan5 - https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?t=572
13:11 technomancy I have to know what S-named thing sfan5 is a fan of
13:12 technomancy spiderman? selenium? sicilian pizzerias?
13:13 technomancy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S_Club
13:16 Krock solid silver structured statue surprisingly sold since sunday
13:22 ElectronLibre joined #minetest
13:46 technomancy maaaaan I wish there were an actual terminal working ._.
13:47 Megaf joined #minetest
13:49 technomancy well, a https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki​/Character-oriented_terminal to be specific
13:51 Enke joined #minetest
13:53 JordachB joined #minetest
14:10 est31 if we get a client scripting API, we can add key press callbacks
14:12 hmmmm joined #minetest
14:20 The_Loko joined #minetest
14:33 technomancy that would be awesome
14:34 technomancy is that still in the planning stages or what?
14:34 est31 yes
14:36 SouL_|_ joined #minetest
14:36 technomancy well I know it's not exactly a democracy, but that gets all my votes
14:41 est31 its one of the defining features of the next minetest release (at least that's the plan)
14:42 est31 nice features that already are implemented are modding security and srp for authentication
14:42 est31 but those aren't so visible to the end user
14:42 hmmmm i don't think the next version needs to be 1.0.0 or whatever
14:42 hmmmm 0.4.13
14:43 hmmmm i'd do a release, except there are too many bugs that weren't fixed yet
14:44 sfan5 the next release being 1.0.0 would raise too many hopes
14:45 technomancy what's modding security about?
14:45 technomancy sandboxing?
14:45 jin_xi rockclimbing
14:46 hmmmm it makes mods not be able to rm -rf /* or fetch http://badsite.ru/trojan && ./trojan
14:46 technomancy shelling out specifically?
14:47 hmmmm it's a sandbox yeah
14:47 hmmmm shadowninja can explain it best
14:49 est31 when its enabled, we can start discussing about a mod store with lax checking again
14:54 technomancy will it be optional?
14:55 sfan5 yes
14:55 est31 security is already there
14:55 est31 inside the master branch
14:57 technomancy cool
14:57 ElectronLibre Hmm, why is the default value for movement_gravity 9.81? With this value players can't even jump or they kill themselves again the node below them.
14:57 technomancy 9.81 is earth-normal
14:57 technomancy meters per second per second that is
14:58 technomancy maybe the units are screwed up
14:58 sfan5 m/s²
14:58 ElectronLibre Yes, but, try it.
14:59 ElectronLibre You will not even be able to jump one node.
14:59 ElectronLibre I know it is the earth-normal value, but it doesn't work for minetest (default gravity seems to be around 0.5/0.7).
14:59 technomancy guess it's specified in m/s² when it's expecting Gs
15:00 ElectronLibre Anyway, the default value isn't good, and if someone use it he/she will be stuck.
15:01 technomancy is it possible you pulled and reloaded the lua without recompiling the C?
15:03 ElectronLibre No, I always recompile after pulling.
15:03 ElectronLibre And this isn't a recent change.
15:03 technomancy weird
15:03 ElectronLibre Try with this : http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/11187994/ (modname : gravity)
15:04 hmmmm hmm
15:04 hmmmm where should I post an informational post on how to use a new set of lua api functions
15:04 hmmmm on the forum
15:04 VanessaE engine dev
15:05 ElectronLibre And knowing that there is no way to get a player's gravity value, well, I have to use a random one, because the setting's one is broken..
15:05 hmmmm the target audience is modders though
15:05 Calinou Modding Discussion then
15:05 kahrl ElectronLibre, set_physics_override takes multipliers, not absolute values
15:05 kahrl so the default would be 1
15:05 ElectronLibre Thanks karhl.
15:05 Wayward_Tab Just added movement_gravity = 9.81 tobmy minetest.conf, and it seemed normal
15:06 Wayward_Tab *to my
15:06 Krock isn't it default?
15:06 ElectronLibre My mistake. I didn't see it was a multiplier.
15:06 ElectronLibre Well, it was written..
15:06 * ElectronLibre hides
15:08 Shackra joined #minetest
15:10 Krock http://usvsth3m.com/wp-conten​t/uploads/2013/08/gb0F132.gif
15:12 thefamilygrog66 joined #minetest
15:14 rubenwardy joined #minetest
15:20 srifqi joined #minetest
15:20 rubenwardy Hi all!
15:20 srifqi Hi rubenwardy
15:20 ElectronLibre Hello rubenwardy.
15:20 Krock hi rubenwardy
15:21 rubenwardy Do they not get it? https://forum.minetest.net/vi​ewtopic.php?p=178675#p178675
15:21 rubenwardy I propose extreme bumps should have the post deleted, and the user given a warning by PM
15:21 rubenwardy They do that on other forums
15:22 Tripwire joined #minetest
15:22 srifqi How about auto-lock old posts?
15:22 rubenwardy That as well. Or require premoderation for users with under 100 posts
15:22 Calinou premoderation is way too much hassle
15:22 Calinou maybe we could premoderate the first 5 posts, but not more
15:23 rubenwardy I meant require premoderation for users with under 100 posts who are replying to a topic which has not been posted on for over a year
15:24 Calinou that's too complex to implement
15:24 Calinou don't make gas factories just because you can make them :P
15:27 rubenwardy It's good to dream
15:27 Krock http://games.usvsth3m.com/apple-watch/ score 12
15:29 rubenwardy https://www.phpbb.com/community/​viewtopic.php?f=70&amp;t=2088095
15:31 Krock +1
15:32 YuGiOhJCJ est31, thank you it works, I have installed the "Minetest-WorldEdit-1.0" MOD on "Minetest 0.4.12" then I have selected the region and I have typed "//replace air air". After that, my seeds give a good result :) http://yugiohjcj.free.fr/minetest-seed-2.png
15:37 est31 gread :)
15:37 est31 t*
15:38 thefamilygrog66 I would like a train mod
15:39 ElectronLibre You have carts.
15:39 thefamilygrog66 I know, was being jerky.
15:40 thefamilygrog66 That said, I would like smooth/non-glitchy carts and other vehicles.
15:40 srifqi joined #minetest
15:44 thefamilygrog66 I know I asked this yesterday, but...
15:44 thefamilygrog66 Has anyone here had any success getting the firearms mod to work with 0.4.12?
15:45 ElectronLibre thefamilygrog66, do you have a link for it please?
15:46 ElectronLibre Nevermind, I've got it.
15:46 thefamilygrog66 oh, cool. It seems to work except that when I shoot other players or mobs, they don't take any damage.
15:47 ElectronLibre Which way do you see it?
15:47 thefamilygrog66 What do you mean?
15:47 rcmaehl joined #minetest
15:47 ElectronLibre How do you know they don't get damaged?
15:48 thefamilygrog66 I've tested it locally, logged into the same server a few times as different usernames.
15:48 ElectronLibre Ok.
15:48 thefamilygrog66 Also, I've modified the mobs mod I'm using so that it's obvious (read: bloody and loud) when they get hit
15:58 ElectronLibre Players get damages for me, but I can only load the weapons at the end of the list.
16:05 ElectronLibre Which is logic, because the weapons at the beginning of the list aren't supposed to be working ._.
16:06 jojoa1997 joined #minetest
16:14 ElectronLibre left #minetest
16:14 srifqi joined #minetest
16:14 Putz3000 joined #minetest
16:16 hmmmm https://forum.minetest.net/vi​ewtopic.php?f=47&amp;t=12178
16:17 exio4 https://www.kickstarter.com/projec​ts/krita/krita-free-paint-app-lets​-make-it-faster-than-phot?ref=card
16:18 jojoa1997 joined #minetest
16:19 gravgun joined #minetest
16:22 SouL_|_ joined #minetest
16:24 Calinou nice ref
16:25 Putz3000 I have an iMac w/ client connecting to local fedora based Minetest server (doubt that matters). One of the mods running on server is More Ores. My daughter mined enough copper & Tin to make 4 bronze bars. She tried making a Bronze pickaxe but it won't let her. Is a heard of issue or just unique to me? OSX related or Mod related?
16:26 Calinou to make bronze, you use Steel + Copper.
16:26 Calinou More Ores is basically obsolete
16:26 Calinou I don't suggest anyone using it now
16:26 Calinou it's pretty much a legacy mod
16:26 Calinou back when the game had only 3 ores
16:29 jojoa1997 I remember those day
16:30 jojoa1997 days
16:30 jojoa1997 hi Calinou. How's it going?
16:30 Calinou hi
16:31 gravgun joined #minetest
16:33 Putz3000 Sorry, my bad, she is was trying to make Brass. But I am thinking that making a Brass item is not supported. Would that be correct?
16:33 nore Putz3000: it exists in technic
16:34 nore are you using it?
16:34 Krock brass also exists in homedecor AFAIK
16:34 nore yes
16:35 nore but I can't find a craft for homedecor's brass
16:36 Calinou there are no brass tools
16:36 Putz3000 So it is probably only craftable for something within another  mod and not for default in game items such as sword or pick
16:37 hmmmm hmm
16:37 Putz3000 nore: technic? is that another mod?
16:37 nore yep
16:37 Dartmouth joined #minetest
16:37 nore brass items do not exist in minetest_game
16:37 nore there are only bronze ones
16:37 hmmmm can somebody take the information from that post i just made and format it into the article for PerlinNoiseMap on the dev wiki
16:38 Putz3000 OK, thanks. I will probably pull the more ores mod off the server then. its more pain then its worth. I was just trying to give us more to mine and more qty as I think the game is super stingy on spawning ore qty and types
16:39 Putz3000 Does any one know the best way to submit bug type information for the OS X build?
16:39 Calinou there are enough ores if you go deep (-256 and below)
16:40 Calinou Putz3000, to submit bugs, do it on GitHub: https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues
16:40 Calinou you need a (free) account
16:41 Putz3000 Calinou: even for OSX specific issues for the OSX builds?
16:43 Putz3000 nore: homedecor crafting guide: http://digitalaudioconcepts.com/vane​ssa/hobbies/minetest/homedecor-craft​ing-guide/homedecor-craft-guide.html
16:44 nore hm..
16:44 Putz3000 nore: but I think it is so complicated with what is needed to craft before crafting final product that its so much easier to just enable unified inventory to gain access to all those items.
16:46 Calinou Putz3000, yes, OS X-specific issues go there too
16:46 Calinou please mention if your build is official, self-built or unofficial
16:48 Putz3000 Calinou: honestly I am thinking all of them or somewhat unofficial unless there is an official dirty release. Even what the forum page calls stable still shows in game as dirty :(
16:48 Calinou dirty means it's been modified from release tag
16:48 Calinou nothing bad
16:49 Putz3000 Calinou: oh ok. So what is the actual stable release version of Minetest? My fedora repo install is 0.4.11 but what seems to be called stable on the OSX build is 0.4.12
16:53 gaming joined #minetest
16:55 Calinou yes, latest stable is 0.4.12
16:55 Calinou almost all distributions have outdated versions
16:55 Calinou blame them for not being rolling release
16:57 gaming What is the other irc server for minetest? The one that most minetest servers are on? Isn't horus.net or something?
16:57 gaming isn't it***
16:59 gaming nvm
16:59 gravgun (this #minetest is the only real one isn't it?)
16:59 rubenwardy This is the official one
17:00 rubenwardy But there are others on gaming IRC networks
17:00 rubenwardy inchra maybe
17:01 Putz3000 Calinou: I'm not blaming anyone for that. I just wasn't sure which version was really stable vs non-stable from a fedora vs OSX build. Should I look into figuring out how to install 0.4.12 on fedora to upgrade it - would I gain anything?
17:02 CWz That mobs-redo chicken just egg bombed a large area.
17:06 Calinou it wouldn't fix your issue, but you'd have lots of enhancement
17:07 Putz3000 Calinou: OK, enhancement can be worth the work. Do you have any Linux experience? I am curious if it is a big deal to swap out the yum install with a more current one?
17:08 Calinou yes, you need to build it yourself
17:08 Calinou read the https://github.com/minetest/minetest/ readme
17:08 Calinou 1) clone the Git repository
17:08 Calinou 2) install dependencies
17:09 Calinou 3) type: cmake . -DENABLE_GETTEXT=1 -DENABLE_FREETYPE=1 inside the cloned folder
17:09 Calinou 4) type: make
17:09 Calinou and that's it
17:11 Putz3000 Calinou: does step 4 install or is step 5 run installer that step 4 made?
17:12 SouL_|_ joined #minetest
17:13 KnightArm0 joined #minetest
17:14 Lunatrius joined #minetest
17:15 Calinou the step 3 makes the Makefile, the step 4 uses that Makefile to build the program
17:16 Putz3000 Calinou: Does the Makefile script also place the built program icon in the Applications list?
17:17 est31 joined #minetest
17:17 Calinou nope
17:17 Calinou for that, use sudo make install
17:18 Putz3000 Calinou: I do make install AFTER step 4 not in place of any of the first 4 steps correct?
17:18 Calinou yes, after step 4
17:18 Putz3000 Calinou: Awesome thank you.
17:19 Putz3000 I again want to thank everyone in this room. You have put up with my questions for past 4 days which has got me up and running as a singleplayer then got me up and running w/ local server that allowed me to bond w/ my daughter for like 4 hours late last night (3am MST :) )
17:20 Haudegen joined #minetest
17:20 Putz3000 So to everyone who answered questions Thank you. And those that may be Minetest developers or Mod developers thank you for all the work you put into this game for people like me
17:20 blaze joined #minetest
17:26 Enke joined #minetest
17:36 CWz wow i was able to join singleplayer  with another client
17:42 Etzos joined #minetest
17:46 tyteen4a03 joined #minetest
17:53 Wayward_Tab joined #minetest
17:57 Taoki Hi. Can anyone explain what active_object_count means in register_abm? The Lua API doesn't seem to document this.
17:59 Shackra joined #minetest
17:59 Calinou the number of active objects, probably…
17:59 hmmmm to be completely honest, I'm not quite sure what the purpose of it is
18:00 hmmmm it looks useless.  can somebody check out a first-generation mod created by celeron himself and see how it's used?
18:00 hmmmm we can remove it and gain a small performance boost
18:01 Taoki I'm refractoring the spawn function of my simplemobs fork, and I noticed that it existed there... not sure what to do with it.
18:02 Taoki I assume it's how many ABM's of the same type can exist in the world at once? Although that makes no sense either.
18:02 Taoki I think I'm going to remove it.
18:03 hmmmm nope, it's simply, the number of active objects inside of that block
18:04 Taoki Ok. Seems useless yeah.
18:04 hmmmm hrmm.  this could have possibly been to make mob spawning more convenient
18:04 Calinou yes, keep it
18:04 hmmmm so there is use.  it's just useful in a very specific edge case, and does not belong as a parameter to ABM callbacks to be calculated each and every time
18:05 hmmmm make it a separate API instead
18:05 Calinou it doesn't belong in ABM yes
18:05 Taoki Still can't fully understand what it's meant to do
18:05 hmmmm get_active_object_count_in_radius()
18:06 hmmmm Taoki:  this is entirely conjecture, but to limit the amount of mobs spawned in a specific area
18:06 ElectronLibre joined #minetest
18:06 Taoki Ahhh
18:06 hmmmm let's see if simple_mobs or mobf uses it
18:06 Taoki So the spawn won't happen if there are other spawns of the same type in the given radius?
18:06 hmmmm no, just too many spawns in general
18:06 hmmmm or players
18:07 Taoki Simplemobs at least does
18:07 Taoki Ok
18:07 hmmmm well instead of guessing, let's see for sure
18:07 Taoki The limit seems to be set to 1, yet it allows more than 1 mob at once
18:08 hmmmm herm
18:08 hmmmm if you take a look at pilzadam's mob mod, you'll see it is used
18:09 hmmmm this is extremely inefficient though
18:09 hmmmm i don't normally advocate doing this, but do you think we could have modders who do use it to change their mods?
18:09 Taoki I know, the code exists in my fork too. That's why I asked.
18:10 Taoki I think I'll hard-code it to 1
18:13 hmmmm needless to say minetest was not written with efficiency in mind
18:14 Miner_48er joined #minetest
18:14 hmmmm the way ABMs are implemented makes it necessary to have a C++ -> Lua transition for each and every single node inside the mapblock
18:14 hmmmm perhaps we should just deprecate ABMs altogether and encourage people to use a better framework
18:15 hmmmm one that actually scales
18:15 LedInfrared aside for the fact that it's not coded in java :P
18:15 Taoki I think Minetest is a pretty good engine. Just still unfinished from many perspectives.
18:15 hmmmm frankly i wouldn't be surprised if minecraft were faster than minetest.
18:15 Taoki It's probably as efficient as a voxel engine can be.
18:15 hmmmm it's not.
18:15 hmmmm it really isn't
18:16 Taoki Ok
18:16 edwardbedward joined #minetest
18:16 Taoki Also, irony makes it that Minecraft has better FPS at the same draw distance and complexisy than Minetest. But this is probably mostly Irrlicht suff.
18:17 Taoki I probably shouldn't bring up the VBO code again :)
18:18 LedInfrared "unfinished" is correct since it's still in development. :P
18:18 exio4 Minetest can be anything but efficient :p
18:18 LedInfrared still more efficient then minecraft
18:18 exio4 hmmmm: I give you that one, which kind of framework do you have in mind for the replacement?
18:18 Taoki exio4: It can and likely will become more efficient.
18:19 hmmmm one which operates on entire mapblocks
18:19 hmmmm not single nodes at a time
18:19 Taoki In its CURRENT stage... well I have to agree
18:19 exio4 Taoki: I am talking about present
18:19 LedInfrared the software render is a nice idea though :P
18:19 hmmmm open up a voxelmanipulator for that block and its neighbors, pass the same LVM to each and every ABM callback
18:19 * Taoki nods
18:19 hmmmm honestly, ABMs are slow because of the sheer amount of unnecessary overhead
18:20 gravgun hmmmm: Optimize! Zoom! Enhance!
18:20 hmmmm if we get it right then we can crank up the active abm range from... 2... to something real
18:20 Taoki My biggest issue with the Minetest engine is the networking. Sometimes it's so slow that it takes minutes to even open a door on a server with relatively okay ping!
18:20 Taoki Many people blame mods however, not sure how often that's the case.
18:20 Taoki I need to test this with more attention.
18:21 hmmmm instead of confirming there is a problem it's much more helpful to solve the problem
18:21 hmmmm we don't have enough people coding real solutions to things
18:21 gravgun Taoki, you need to... Mine-test this!
18:21 Taoki Indeed
18:21 * gravgun gets out
18:21 hmmmm so like
18:21 Taoki =)
18:21 hmmmm we have the occasional contributor who just scratches their own itch
18:21 hmmmm implements a very specific feature they wanted
18:22 Taoki Hopefully I can try to help more with the code too. Minetest is virtually the onlt C++ code which is clean enough for me to understand and work with.
18:22 hmmmm we have the occasional contributor who is great at coding, and fixes some bugs
18:22 hmmmm but the problem is they're all very part time and occasional
18:23 exio4 maybe if we got a successful kickstarter... :p
18:23 sofar eugh.... all that work and override_day_night_ratio() doesn't do what I thought it did :((((
18:24 Erthome joined #minetest
18:24 Taoki I think Minetest will get far. Could get even farther if there was even more development, of course
18:26 jin_xi Taoki: did you ever try pathfinding again recently? the weird 'optimization' is gone and some bugs fixed, so it should be better now
18:26 Taoki jin_xi: I need to do that, yeah. Tried it briefly and didn't seem to get as many errors, but mobs couldn't follow the points properly.
18:26 Taoki I might need to tweak the following code
18:27 LedInfrared it would probably do better then manic digger
18:27 LedInfrared anyone remember that?
18:28 jin_xi one thing about mt is that often you'll hear phrases like 'but thats probably due to irrlicht' or 'for when we want to switch to ogre'
18:28 Taoki Yeah... a very simplistic engine :) Was a bit fun
18:28 Wayward_One joined #minetest
18:29 jin_xi but i think no matter what the 3d engine, if its used as half assedly as minetest does it hardly matters
18:29 LedInfrared anyone remember the whole OUTRAGE about manic digger? XD
18:29 Taoki LedInfrared: People offended that someone else dared to make a game similar to Minecraft? Haha, yeah
18:29 Taoki That existed / exists about Minetest too up to some point
18:30 Haudegen joined #minetest
18:34 gravgun That's why I'm making a clone of THE original game
18:34 gravgun Infiniminer
18:35 exio4 as long as you don't clone humans, I think it is ok
18:35 gravgun Hum that was part of my plan :/
18:35 gravgun Right now I'm expanding the engine to support "infinite" worlds
18:36 gravgun And at the same time implement a block (node) metadata store
18:36 gravgun Hopefully I locally use git, so if something breaks, detached HEAD, copy, paste
18:37 exio4 as a matter of fact, pretty much the only Minecraft server I happened to play has a few worlds, and pretty much 'all' of them were restricted to 6000x6000(x256) worlds
18:37 exio4 +-3000 in both directions
18:38 gravgun That's like 10x less than MT
18:38 gravgun int64_t lolol
18:39 Viper168 joined #minetest
18:40 Erthome joined #minetest
18:40 roboman2444 joined #minetest
18:53 CoconutOfDeath joined #minetest
18:58 crazyR joined #minetest
18:58 crazyR joined #minetest
19:04 Wayward_One joined #minetest
19:17 sythe joined #minetest
19:27 Halamix2 joined #minetest
19:29 Haudegen joined #minetest
19:32 Amaz joined #minetest
19:34 LazyJ joined #minetest
19:54 mlk joined #minetest
20:12 alket joined #minetest
20:19 Taoki Hmm... is it wrong to change the speed and yaw of entities (mobs) frequently, from a networking perspective? Like if mobs change their rotation each frame, will that mean a greater packet flood on the network?
20:19 VanessaE probably will, yes
20:19 Calinou a network frame is 0.1s by default
20:19 Calinou keep in mind that some people will change it
20:19 Calinou so do not make your stuff network-dependent
20:19 Calinou it could also behave worse in local games
20:20 VanessaE reminds me of a hack kaeza did once to support movable players' head, it sent head position info every tick, caused a 100 kB/sec network flood :)
20:20 Taoki I can only test this properly on local which is why I'm asking
20:21 Jordach joined #minetest
20:22 Taoki I'll probably add an angle and velocity difference tretshold to prevent this
20:22 Calinou test on local game, and on server + client
20:22 Calinou (separate processes)
20:22 Calinou start a dedicated server on your PC, connect to it using client tab
20:22 Calinou test both
20:23 * Taoki nods
20:26 Jordach damn my laptop sounds like a jet
20:33 ElectronLibre left #minetest
20:33 catninja joined #minetest
20:33 catninja this is the minetest-dev-ish channel?
20:34 VanessaE this is general discussion
20:34 VanessaE #minetest-dev is for core development stuff.
20:34 ecutruin joined #minetest
20:35 luizrpgluiz joined #minetest
20:36 catninja VanessaE: well I seem to have joined the inchra #minetest that was full of serverchat
20:36 VanessaE you're there too, yeah
20:36 catninja so scrap the dev part, but something more serious
20:37 catninja VanessaE: You have servers that run the serverchat to irc-mod right?
20:37 VanessaE yep
20:39 catninja I was wondering if someone had any idea why I suddenly got the irc content in the chat msg'd to me from the server. I seem to have disconnected without the server registering it and then I started getting the server msgs
20:39 catninja Interesting bug
20:39 VanessaE that happens to me, too
20:39 VanessaE no idea why though - but if you msg the bot to "logout" then the echoes go away
20:40 VanessaE (it only happens if you are also logged-in from IRC for the purpose of routine server commands)
20:43 Jordach eh
20:43 Jordach i'm getting real ready to leave now
20:43 VanessaE ?
20:43 Jordach i miss polish
20:43 Jordach the API got lost
20:43 catninja VanessaE: and the ecoes come back when you login again
20:43 catninja hmmm
20:43 Jordach performance is horrifying
20:43 VanessaE catninja: yeah
20:44 Jordach and the devs hold a dick waving contest about licenses every few days
20:44 VanessaE er, ok
20:45 Jordach fact: i get with 4gb allocated to MC with 179 mods 60fps at 1080p: MT doesn't do that even with low settings with ~30 mods
20:46 jin_xi VanessaE, kahrl re particles faucet bug: it goes away if you add && 0 to the check in line 446, collision.cpp
20:46 VanessaE jin_xi: you mean #2690
20:46 VanessaE ?
20:47 jin_xi yes
20:48 VanessaE how far along are you with your -to-irrlicht rewrite?
20:48 VanessaE (I've not been following to closely)
20:54 rcmaehl joined #minetest
20:57 jin_xi VanessaE: tbh i don't know if i like that combination of 'how far' and 'rewrite'
20:57 VanessaE heh
20:57 VanessaE well I just wondered how it was going.. :P
20:58 jin_xi as far as i see it it's more like some research into the matter in the hope someone competent would like to connect the dots
20:58 jin_xi might well be its all completely stupid
20:59 jin_xi but yeah this development model does not work. i was hoping i could submit half assed PRs/Bug reports someone(tm) could look at and quickly fix properly but that does not seem to work out very well
20:59 jin_xi so i might need to reconsider my abilities to contribute
21:00 VanessaE :(
21:00 jin_xi ... anyways, checked out homedecor for testing, nice piece of work
21:00 VanessaE thanks :)
21:01 Pilcrow joined #minetest
21:12 Taoki Also: I updated my pathfinding system in order to test it even more easily. What I noticed is that, pathfinding is even more broken than before x.x
21:13 catninja if someone connected to your server and said that they used the same name as another player on another server, because they liked that player; would you grant them interact?
21:13 Taoki In the past, it worked at least sometimes. Now it only works through a miracle
21:13 kaeza_ joined #minetest
21:15 Tuxedo[Qyou] joined #minetest
21:16 jin_xi weird
21:17 luizrpgluiz hi, I remembered that I had made a mod for ceramic decoration
21:17 kaeza_ joined #minetest
21:17 Erthome joined #minetest
21:18 jin_xi Taoki: i found paths well and consistently using Dijkstra, but i only did set node along the path, never tried making a mob follow it
21:19 jin_xi A* and variants will often produce messy blobs of nodes, which i suspect was the reason for the broken line of sight optimization
21:19 Calinou I don't bother with pathfinding with mobs
21:19 Calinou dumb mods are part of the game
21:19 jin_xi which would happily throw away any found path if there is LOS between start/goal
21:20 jin_xi Calinou: there can be other games on mt engine
21:20 Tux[Qyou] joined #minetest
21:21 Calinou https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.ph​p?f=47&amp;t=12178&amp;p=178792#p178792
21:21 Calinou does this make Lua mapgens faster?
21:21 jin_xi use less memory mainly
21:21 Taoki Aha... that one seems to work a bit better, yeah
21:22 kaeza_ Greetings
21:22 jin_xi Taoki in this issue is some messy lua code to visualize paths, its good to get a feel for it
21:22 jin_xi https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/2614
21:23 Taoki nice
21:23 jin_xi one problem i think is paths with restricted height, below trees
21:23 jin_xi so mobs cant pass
21:24 jin_xi i think pathfinding needs additional parameters, like nodes to avoid and headroom needed
21:24 Taoki Well, with the Djirka engine, mobs can at least go around trees with path finding
21:26 jin_xi flocking mobs that 'create' paths like desire paths and so reuse and build up paths could be nice
21:26 jin_xi or if you could say how much a mob can climb/how steep a path can be
21:26 Tux[Qyou] joined #minetest
21:27 Taoki One question though: Does the formula only create corners, or add every node along the way? Since what I need here is the second solution, otherwise mobs get caught up
21:27 jin_xi add every node
21:27 Taoki Ah :/
21:27 Taoki I probably need to extract the corners myself then
21:28 jin_xi yes, the idea is good but LOS is not the way to do it
21:30 Jordach joined #minetest
21:30 OldCoder joined #minetest
21:31 JordachB joined #minetest
21:32 catninja OldCoder: you joined here but your client disconnected from other channels?
21:32 phantombeta joined #minetest
21:35 OldCoder I needed to reset my connection catninja
21:37 catninja OldCoder: hm but the private msg to you has the right parameters but you did not reappear in the conversation. Strange, but I cannot say that I'm that familiar with IRC/irssi to be certain
21:42 Xenoth joined #minetest
21:53 Pilcrow sofar: what were you expecting override_day_night_ratio() to do?
21:58 Pilcrow ^ were you expecting it to make the day/night cycle longer/shorter? or perhaps make nights longer than days and vice versa? I think there is a way to do the former, but not the latter (that I know of)...
22:31 Hirato joined #minetest
22:34 Enke joined #minetest
22:40 Player_2 joined #minetest
23:06 exio4 RealBadAngel: some of us are waiting for fresh brains
23:14 OldCoder brains it shall rains
23:24 YvesLevier is there a way to put our wheat in bales to entrepose in the granery?
23:24 YvesLevier Heya btw :)
23:25 guest__ joined #minetest
23:26 Pilcrow exio4: no brains for you!  :P
23:26 exio4 </3
23:26 Pilcrow only livers.
23:27 * Pilcrow is reading about the Sega Dreamcast for no reason...  :P
23:35 Pilcrow OldCoder: why were you a 'guest'?  :P
23:35 alt88218 joined #minetest
23:36 OldCoder Pilcrow because I restarted my Internet connection
23:37 OldCoder When I connected to IRC, the previous me was probably still here
23:37 OldCoder When he timed out, I switched nicks
23:38 Pilcrow OldCoder: yeah, I kind of figured that was the case. I was mostly just wondering why your alt nick is 'guest__'  :P
23:42 luizrpgluiz left #minetest
23:44 YvesLevier VanessaE: does your textures work with :
23:44 YvesLevier [Mod] cottages [cottages] (medieval, farming, country life)
23:44 YvesLevier by Sokomine » Sat Mar 16, 2013 02:54?
23:45 VanessaE some stuff works there, yes
23:45 OldCoder Pilcrow, I think it isn't; not sure about what happened there
23:45 VanessaE HDX needs some love.
23:45 OldCoder It is lovely
23:45 OldCoder There
23:45 Pilcrow OldCoder: heh. strange things happen, I guess
23:46 OldCoder There are stranger things in Heaven and Earth Horatio
23:47 LazyJ joined #minetest
23:47 OldCoder Than are dreamt of in your philosophy
23:49 Pilcrow OldCoder: isn't it 'there are more things'?
23:50 Pilcrow props for quoting frickin Shakespeare though, lol

| Channels | #minetest index | Today | | Google Search | Plaintext