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IRC log for #minetest, 2014-03-06

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
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01:13 c107 How do I get the latest?
01:13 c107 I'm on Trisquel 6.0, based on Ubuntu Quetzal or whatever.
01:14 PilzAdam c107, there are PPAs, see minetest.net/download
01:19 c107 PilzAdam: I don't know how to add it...
01:20 PilzAdam !g how to add ppa
01:20 MinetestBot PilzAdam: http://askubuntu.com/questions/21​7179/how-to-add-ppa-repositories
01:21 PilzAdam bye
01:31 c107 Where is the Ubuntu Minetest PPA?
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05:40 ShadowNinja sfan5: I'd like to have one repo for the mapper.  We could use one of ours, but I'd like to add it to the Minetest organization.
05:41 ShadowNinja And we need libmtmap and libmtmap-cpp...
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09:59 john_minetest Hey
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11:41 LazyJ VanessaE, Sokomine, our MT094 isn't writing to the player files. The file permissions were changed to 777 and even still no new data was written to the files. Any ideas?
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12:38 john_minetest ᴛɪɴʏ&BIG
12:38 john_minetest Look, I can write small CAPS
12:38 john_minetest ᴇxᴛʀᴇᴍᴇʟʏ sᴍᴀʟʟ ᴄᴀᴘs ʟᴇᴛᴛᴇʀs :D
12:40 john_minetest http://imgur.com/gallery/5dblPdQ
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12:43 john_minetest sfan5: http://imgur.com/gallery/f7isylQ
12:44 Megaf Hi all
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12:58 sfan5 meow
12:58 sfan5 hi everyone
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13:41 sfan5 !tell john_minetest http://i.imgur.com/0ekIBPl.jpg
13:41 MinetestBot sfan5: yeah, sure, whatever
13:45 CheapSeth ?
13:45 Exio4 !tell exio4 test
13:45 MinetestBot You can tell that to yourself
13:45 Exio4 aww
13:45 Exio4 !tell exio4 test
13:45 Exio4 k
13:47 CheapSeth Is he angry or something? I didn't know bots can grow angry.
13:50 Exio4 she*
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13:52 CheapSeth She? Bots have genders too? x)
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14:08 sfan5 CheapSeth: bots are always female
14:08 * sfan5 pets MinetestBot
14:08 * MinetestBot purrs
14:11 CheapSeth Even Harrison Ford?
14:11 CheapSeth !help
14:11 MinetestBot https://github.com/sfan5/minetestb​ot-modules/blob/master/COMMANDS.md
14:13 CheapSeth !btc EUR
14:13 MinetestBot 1 BTC = 480.8657 €
14:13 CheapSeth Wow
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14:19 sfan5 \o/ bitbucket.org went down
14:20 sfan5 this is the first time I'm using bitbucket in 6 months
14:20 sfan5 and what happens: it goes down
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14:24 Exio4 sfan5, add a DOGE <-> BTC <-> VTC <-> LTC converter
14:24 Exio4 :3
14:24 sfan5 Exio4: add a DOGE <-> BTC <-> VTC <-> LTC converter yourself and send a pull request
14:24 sfan5 :3
14:25 Exio4 if the bot wasn't python i would do it
14:25 sfan5 cmon
14:25 sfan5 python isn't that hard
14:25 Exio4 it sucks though
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14:49 CheapSeth Exio4: what are your arguments (saying python sucks)?
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14:51 Exio4 CheapSeth: its syntax, its weird OOP (that is not that OOP), and a lot of other things
14:51 Exio4 it has nice things anyway
14:51 Exio4 like having nice funcional "things" without fucking up everything
14:54 proller """sux"""
14:56 Exio4 what?
14:58 proller but python is good language for housewifes
14:59 proller and hydrocephalus
15:00 CheapSeth Well, it's true, but it's a bit extreme to say it «sucks»
15:02 Hirato Lua reminds me of basic therefor it sucks
15:02 Exio4 lua has a very nice side, you code in the way you want to
15:03 proller lua sucksier than even python
15:03 Exio4 sucksier?
15:03 Exio4 tf is that?
15:03 Hirato it's right next to bestest in the oxford dictionary
15:03 proller if 0 then print('w'..'at??') end
15:13 Exio4 anyway
15:13 Exio4 * > C++
15:13 Hirato this just in, Exio4 likes PHP
15:14 Hirato more than C++
15:14 Exio4 PHP shouldn't be a language
15:15 CheapSeth You seriously think C++ is what the n00bs call a «bad langage» or are you trolling?
15:15 Hirato C++ is a pretty horrendous language, especially if you use STL or Boost :p
15:19 CheapSeth It's complicated, but it doesn't have any equivalent language
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15:22 john_minetest Hello again
15:24 reactor bye again
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15:39 Exio4 CheapSeth: because it has everything you might think
15:39 Exio4 it is so bloated it is shit
15:43 CheapSeth You mean, in the standard library?
15:44 Exio4 the specs itself
15:44 CheapSeth It doesn't make sense
15:45 harrison dawn splatters the east like a spittlebug on a honeysuckle vine
15:45 harrison the day begins with a frothing of memehopperesque fractal insectism
15:45 harrison insect crew 24 7 365 666
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15:48 john_minetest sfan5: http://asset-b.soup.io/asset/6909/4297_bade.gif
15:50 sfan5 john_minetest: meow
15:51 john_minetest http://asset-d.soup.io/asset/6925/1229_d311.jpeg
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16:16 webshinra Did I hear someone trolling C++?
16:17 reactor No wonder. People do seem to prefer languages that haven't matured enough to the mature and developed ones.
16:19 webshinra like hum, using Cobol instead of C ?
16:20 reactor ...more likely Java instead of FORTRAN or C.
16:21 CheapSeth_ I don't understand the problem with C++
16:21 reactor Oh. And C++, as OOP in general, is overrated.
16:21 CheapSeth_ It was something like "It has everything you might think, it is so bloated it is shit"
16:22 CheapSeth_ I didn't understood
16:22 reactor System programming = C.
16:22 reactor Computations = FORTRAN.
16:23 webshinra not really.
16:23 reactor ...unless you do really need something interpreted.
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16:23 reactor Why not? Both have matured compilters and tools, and a lot of ready solutions.
16:24 webshinra yes
16:25 reactor And hey, they're mostly platform-independent, too. You just need to port the compiler. Jave has the same problem, but writing a virtual machine is probably a more complex task than writing a compiler.
16:25 webshinra in fact, C does not have real avantage over c++, even for system programming
16:27 webshinra reactor: and in fact, porting the virtual machine implie porting the compiler :P
16:29 reactor Includes it, yes.
16:30 reactor Doubles, if not more, the amount of work.
16:31 webshinra And a lot of compatibilities-break between version of the JVM
16:33 webshinra but in fact, java was written to abstract hardware and run the same code on a lot of µ-architecture
16:33 webshinra not really to be portable agaist higtly complex OS
16:35 reactor So ideally, Java VM should be run on bare metal, and an OS should be developed for running within it?
16:35 reactor Pff. We do already have a good abstraction layer for our hardware. It's called UNIX.
16:36 sfan5 reactor: some arm cores support running Java, this technique is called 'Jazelle'
16:38 reactor ...but in UNIX, programs are run on the actual hardware, which varies. Still, if whatever the program is can be compiled, why not?
16:40 webshinra in fact, praticly no-one is actualy running UNIX.
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16:43 webshinra but, reactor if the question is « Is java a good language for video game programming » the answer is «probably not» :p
16:45 reactor I wonder for what it's good, at all.
16:45 reactor Whatever uses it, causes problems.
16:48 webshinra 10 years ago, I would have disagree :p
16:49 webshinra but not anymore
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17:01 john_minetest java is a useless language. It is even more useless than useless languages.
17:01 jsnmtth Are you having to program in java today john_minetest?
17:01 john_minetest Yes. University.
17:02 john_minetest Look, even that language can do much cooler stuff than java: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Befunge
17:03 jsnmtth That is a strange one.
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17:04 john_minetest It is epic.
17:06 jsnmtth Are you working on a project with it?
17:06 john_minetest No. But maybe I will do something cool with it.
17:06 john_minetest Lol: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LOLCODE
17:07 Calinou <john_minetest> java is a useless language. It is even more useless than useless languages.
17:07 Calinou because everyone has the time to do C++. (sarcasm)
17:07 john_minetest Java is like C++ but it lacks all the cool features.
17:07 jsnmtth lol
17:07 john_minetest Like pointers.
17:08 Calinou it has many more cool features though
17:08 jsnmtth We use java to break out of the browser sandbox and control hardware on the client ...
17:08 jsnmtth That and to integrate with people that don't understand their own software enough to support it.
17:08 john_minetest java prevents me from writing code with functions.
17:09 john_minetest Also it bitches around when I want to access field[23] when field is only 10 fields large.
17:10 jsnmtth What are the limits of the mintest world?  I noticed it is significantly deeper than I expected it to be.
17:11 john_minetest about 31000 blocks iirc
17:11 jsnmtth How about horizontally?
17:11 john_minetest In every direction
17:12 john_minetest 3100 south, north, west, east, up and down.
17:12 john_minetest *31000
17:12 jsnmtth Ohh ...  I see, is there work being done to expand it?
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17:16 us`0gb I don't think any work is being done to expand it. Most people seem to figure that amount of space is enough. No one even reaches the edges unless they specifically try to do so.
17:17 PenguinDad nore worked on something like that
17:19 proller https://github.com/Novatux/​minetest/tree/unlimited-map
17:20 kahrl it wouldn't have made sense to expand it at all previously because the floating point errors would make the game unplayable if you're far from the center
17:20 kahrl (if you've seen far lands or bust you know what those are)
17:20 proller ше фдкуфвн ашчув
17:20 proller it already fxed
17:20 kahrl indeed, that's why "recently"
17:20 kahrl previously*
17:20 proller https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commi​t/062de11b4cff30861dd4e9eb56f131d821f34b51
17:21 kahrl yep
17:21 proller and need to broke all protocols and formats for it
17:21 kahrl there are more problems though, like coordinate computations in lua
17:22 kahrl those can't be fixed as easily
17:22 jsnmtth I can't access that repo because "git-upload-pack not found", but thank you so much for the info.
17:22 proller make c++ functions with lua api for this computations
17:23 kahrl proller: uh, what protocols were broken?
17:23 kahrl I don't see those touched in the commit at all
17:23 proller incompatible anything
17:23 proller when coords will be in int32
17:25 Exio4 if you really want an 'infinite world', you'll need to use chunks with int64 blocks inside and then shit like that
17:25 kahrl still not infinite :P
17:25 Exio4 yeah
17:25 VanessaE didn't I advocate for a "just go for overkill and be done with it" like, almost 2 years ago? :P
17:25 jsnmtth Exio4: That was what I was thinking.  I'm not super familier with mintest and has assumed that was how it was done.
17:26 kahrl you could use bigints on a turing machine's infinite tape
17:26 Exio4 but the best you could get would be cordinates for chunks, with x = 0 first chunk, x = 1 second chunk in the x axis.. etc, and that each chunk has ... a hell lot of blocks inside
17:26 Exio4 and each block has 16x16x16 nodes
17:26 Jordach Exio4, you mean a foruth dimension table
17:26 Exio4 somehow like that
17:27 Exio4 but with added dimensiones
17:27 Exio4 and more
17:27 Exio4 AND MORE SO WE HAVE REAL INFINITE WORLDS
17:27 Exio4 inb4 25gb per block
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17:28 jsnmtth Is the entire world generation on initialization currently?
17:28 webshinra what's the voxel representation in minetest?
17:28 VanessaE no
17:28 webshinra i mean, the data structure
17:28 Exio4 "on initialization"?
17:28 VanessaE the world is generated in realtime, as you explore it
17:28 Exio4 oh
17:28 Exio4 pre-generating the world
17:28 jsnmtth When I create and load a new world... does it do the procedural calculations on-load, or does it dynamicaly generates parts of the world as it is explored?
17:28 john_minetest https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shak​espeare_%28programming_language%29
17:30 webshinra https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whitespace
17:31 webshinra https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whit​espace_%28programming_language%29
17:32 VanessaE kahrl: did you see sfan5's patches to the C++ mapper?
17:32 VanessaE he's trying to make it leveldb-capable
17:33 Calinou webshinra French spotted
17:33 sfan5 s/trying/succeded/
17:33 VanessaE (and perhaps add some abstraction for the libmtmap thing too)
17:33 sfan5 kahrl: https://github.com/sfan5/minetest-mapper-cpp
17:33 VanessaE oh he's here \o/ )
17:33 sfan5 VanessaE: abstraction is done already
17:33 webshinra Calinou: french speaker at last.
17:33 sfan5 but I may need to change some thing for libmtmap
17:33 sfan5 libmtmap would make sqlite3 slower
17:33 VanessaE cool
17:33 VanessaE guess I missed the memo :)
17:34 sfan5 (because I need to get blocks between some numbers)
17:35 VanessaE sfan5: there's one glitch in the C++ mapper that would need fixed some day:  if the map database is open and has a read (or write?) lock on it, the mapper aborts that section and writes a white stripe to the image at that point
17:35 proller us`0gb, on road server road built to 25000+ , no problem to reach 31k
17:36 VanessaE (I think the python mapper just keeps trying to read the locked-out blocks until it succeeds, hence it never has those "holes" in the map)
17:36 sfan5 VanessaE: didn't https://github.com/sfan5/minetest-mapper-cpp/c​ommit/c497397111451ac09d015b43560d3fdf0be79c70 fix that?
17:36 VanessaE AH
17:36 VanessaE I didn't see that either
17:36 VanessaE told you I didn't get the memo :D
17:37 sfan5 iqualfragile pointed me to that commit in mireq's repo
17:37 us`0gb proller: Okay, my bad then.
17:37 sfan5 I didn't send you a memo
17:37 sfan5 there is nothing to (not) get :P
17:37 sfan5 s/:P//
17:37 us`0gb That's a pretty high road though. It doesn't seem practical for transportation.
17:38 VanessaE nice
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17:53 proller int32 okay for planet-size map, int64 for galaxy map, but need custom gravity points
17:53 jsnmtth proller: That is an amazing idea!
17:56 proller us`0gb, 0,0,0 start, goes to 25k by x, top point at 11k by y, you can run with fast to end (20+ minutes)
17:57 us`0gb Ah, running. I always forget that exists as you need a privilege for that.
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17:58 rubenwardy !title http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u8I6qt_Z0Cg#t=186
17:58 MinetestBot rubenwardy: Rocky&#39;s Printer - Eye of the tiger on a dot matrix printer [HD] - YouTube
17:58 rubenwardy They use an old printer to play "eye of the tiger".
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17:59 PilzAdam Hello everyone!
17:59 proller us`0gb, on this server it enabled by default
18:00 proller and it have awesome landscape ;)
18:00 us`0gb Hello PilzAdam!
18:00 us`0gb Also goodbye though. I'm off on a job hunt.
18:00 rubenwardy Hi all
18:00 rubenwardy Hi PilzAdam.
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18:40 MinetestBot GIT: CiaranG commited to minetest/minetest: Stop wasting time in abm - performance improvement db98ef6b45 2014-03-06T10:18:36-08:00 http://git.io/PG6wKw
18:43 harrison in Soviet Union job hunts YOU
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21:25 sfan5 VanessaE: http://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comme​nts/1zq46b/if_you_could_insert_a_single​_rubber_duck_into_any/cfvycyy?context=3
21:26 VanessaE haha
21:26 proller joined #minetest
21:26 sfan5 here's another one: http://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comme​nts/1zq46b/if_you_could_insert_a_single​_rubber_duck_into_any/cfvz39u?context=2
21:27 sfan5 or this one http://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comme​nts/1zq46b/if_you_could_insert_a_single​_rubber_duck_into_any/cfvxt84?context=2
21:27 Sokomine hm. rubberduck races for mt oceans? :-)
21:28 sfan5 http://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comme​nts/1zq46b/if_you_could_insert_a_single​_rubber_duck_into_any/cfvyswe?context=3
21:28 Sokomine github seems to come with support for a wiki for repros. is there a way to host images for documentation as well? imagur does not work for me
21:29 Jordach Sokomine, enable JS
21:30 Sokomine no, sorry. no js
21:30 Jordach :P
21:30 sfan5 oh hey look
21:31 sfan5 pixiv redesigned their page
21:31 * Jordach isn;t going to host shit for people
21:31 Sokomine understandable. although it's not "shit" but images that document mods
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21:40 specing VanessaE: how fast is the mese sand pneumatic tube supposed to work?
21:41 VanessaE should be within a matter of a second or so if the dropped item is within the control radius
21:41 VanessaE mese sand tubes have a radius you can configure with a right-click; not sure what the default is
21:42 VanessaE depends though on how much else your server is doing e.g. other sources of lag
21:46 specing does the item have to be dropped?
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21:53 specing the shipment went through the autocrafter
21:53 specing and flew away
21:54 specing proller: ^
21:54 specing Ah it reappeared in there
21:54 specing weird
21:54 specing graphics glitch?
21:54 proller i dont know
21:54 proller btw tbm installed!
21:54 proller https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=4015
21:55 specing AWWWWCOOOOOOOOOOOL
22:00 proller also i want enable flowing dirt
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22:05 TUB joined #minetest
22:05 TUB hello
22:05 TUB anyone familiar with the luacontroller?
22:05 ShadowNinja TUB: Yep.
22:06 ShadowNinja proller: " Do not enable this machine on multiplayer, can be a severe source of grief."
22:06 TUB great
22:06 TUB what is ocal sda_port = "c";?
22:06 TUB *local
22:06 proller COOL!
22:07 specing proller: k, all tunnels have stone roofs I think
22:07 proller ShadowNinja, fix ipv6 server !!!!!!!!
22:07 proller specing, but some have sand-dirt
22:07 ShadowNinja TUB: It creates a local string variable named sda_port and assigns "c" to it.
22:08 TUB ohh
22:08 ShadowNinja proller: What's the issue with it?  You were trying a IPv4 address, right?
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22:09 proller by default ipv6_server broken
22:09 proller it cant bind to ::
22:10 ShadowNinja proller: With bind_address unset and IPv6 enabled what does it do?
22:10 specing proller: oh right
22:10 specing proller: have to fix those
22:11 specing proller: just flowing dirt or sand too?
22:11 proller and sand
22:15 specing hmm, then more problems
22:15 specing but sand is ok, sand can be used to make glass
22:17 proller btw at -30500 sand transforming to glass ;)
22:21 specing proller: solved one sand cave in problem
22:21 proller solve it when it starts flow
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22:28 proller but after restart
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22:38 TUB what is mem.sda_prev = false;
22:38 TUB ?
22:39 PilzAdam TUB, what?
22:40 TUB what is mem.sda_prev = false;
22:40 TUB in luacontroller?
22:41 PilzAdam ah, you are talking about Lua controllers
22:41 TUB yes
22:41 TUB i am not familiar with lua syntax
22:42 PilzAdam is it a syntax or semantic question?
22:44 TUB uh both
22:44 PilzAdam syntactially it just means, "set the field sda_prev of the table mem to false"
22:44 TUB so what is mem?
22:44 PilzAdam dunno, I havent used the Lua controller in a while
22:45 PilzAdam probably some kind of memory of the controller, to store stuff
22:46 TUB ohh
22:46 TUB ok thanks
22:46 TUB sda_prev is a variable?
22:47 PilzAdam yea, one field in the table
22:47 TUB ohh
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22:48 specing proller: I'd rather do it before it starts flowing down
22:49 specing proller: I already fixed 3 leaks
22:49 specing Im near 8000 moving forward and fixing
22:49 specing Dont turn on flowdirt before its fixed or its going to be ugly
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23:00 specing another leak fixed
23:03 jsnmtth How do I see my Frames Per Second?
23:16 PilzAdam jsnmtth, F5
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23:21 jsnmtth PilzAdam: thx ... I found a lot of conflicting information on the net, but nothing that worked.
23:22 PilzAdam it was previously shown in the window title, but some weird window managers couldnt handle that
23:24 jsnmtth Yeah ... I saw the forum posts stating that it was removed.
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