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IRC log for #minetest-hub, 2017-05-25

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:10 sniper570 joined #minetest-hub
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00:49 Calinou https://www.youtube.com/us​er/TheMarcAPullen/featured
00:49 Calinou hmm, today I learned that an artist I knew for a long time (from Sauerbraten) still does music today!
00:49 Calinou he even has howto videos it seems
00:49 Calinou the view count is low :'(
00:51 Calinou I know about him since 2008, download all of his albums in MP3 form (except one) on Last.fm back when it was available for free
00:51 Calinou (if anyone wants, ask me)
00:52 Calinou this guy made me like metal :D
00:54 Calinou his full albums are also on YouTube (everything on the same video), it can surely be youtube-dl'd and ripped to audio only but then you'd need to split tracks
00:55 Calinou they probably are of higher quality, at least some of them, the description says that they come from a WAV source
00:58 KaadmY Nice music
00:59 KaadmY Any idea if he allow the music to be distributed/used in games?
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01:15 Calinou KaadmY: yes, it has a CC BY-like license
01:15 Calinou his Bandcamp lists albums as CC BY-SA
01:16 Calinou so, it is freely licensed, even though the license is not that formal (if you read the video descriptions)
01:16 Calinou should be fine, if you give credit, I guess
01:16 Calinou time to make "Beyond" from Random Thoughts the official Minetest score? :D
01:16 rubenwardy wooo, just set up a fancy email address:   ruben@rubenwardy.com
01:17 KaadmY thanks for mail adress can i have money plese
01:17 KaadmY i need money in nigeria, help stuck in airport
01:17 Calinou Hello from minetest prince
01:17 Calinou Your inquiry for mese
01:17 KaadmY hello brother
01:17 KaadmY can i have countr strik
01:17 Calinou RECEIPT FOR FLY PRIVILEGE PURCHASE
01:17 Calinou :P
01:25 Calinou this is Beyond, https://youtu.be/UGWsNDypDxw?t=1626
01:25 Calinou jumpscare included!
01:25 Calinou (I was wondering WTF was happening when I first listened to it)
01:26 KaadmY Yeah LOL
01:27 Calinou :D
01:28 KaadmY > This 16-bit world is yours, I watch you from 200 node viewing distance
01:28 KaadmY > Look up the sky and see no end until 32k nodes
01:32 sniper338 joined #minetest-hub
01:32 shivajiva Gn folks have a good one o/
01:38 Calinou surprisingly, this app seems to be still available…? https://itunes.apple.com/us​/app/cube/id292763299?mt=8
01:38 Calinou (Cube port to iPhone)
01:38 Calinou it dates back in the iPhone OS 2.x era, 3.x at best.
01:38 Calinou it ran like crap back then; 10 FPS was common on medium-sized SP maps with monsters visible
01:38 Calinou I tried it on an iPad 1 once, had 30 FPS most of the time, but it ran at iPhone resolution since it was last updated in 2009-08-08
01:39 Calinou I thought Apple removed all not-IPv6-compliant apps
01:39 Calinou the port does feature multiplayer functionality but it won't work out of the box, IIRC
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04:39 Jordach joined #minetest-hub
04:39 * Jordach meows
05:13 dax left #minetest-hub
05:49 Raven262 joined #minetest-hub
06:08 CWz joined #minetest-hub
06:09 lumidify joined #minetest-hub
06:20 Raven262 Yep
06:25 Raven262 xD
06:31 DS-minetest joined #minetest-hub
07:12 LazyJ joined #minetest-hub
07:13 Raven262 Hello LazyJ
07:13 LazyJ Howdy Raven262 ;)
07:39 nerzhul joined #minetest-hub
07:39 CWz sup
07:42 Shara Morning all
07:42 Raven262 Greetings, Shara.
07:42 Jordach morning from London, Shara
07:42 Shara I see there is more stuff again. :(
07:42 Raven262 Stuff?
07:43 Shara If anyone here is responsible for ddosing him, please stop. It doesn't help.
07:43 Shara And that is all I'm going to say on the topic.
07:44 * Shara hands everyone some doughnuts
07:44 Raven262 As far as I'm concerned from now on, OC exists no more.
07:44 Shara Hmm, what caused that?
07:45 Raven262 ...
07:45 Shara Okay.
07:45 Raven262 I can show you the discussion me an lumidify had on this.
07:45 Shara It's your choice.
07:46 Shara I certainly won't push for anything you don't want to share.
07:48 Raven262 I just want a second opinion of what i did.
07:57 DS-minetest joined #minetest-hub
08:19 Raven262 Fuchs, I have something to report concerning OldCoder and his doings.
08:19 Raven262 A chat log to be more precise.
08:21 Raven262 Ah i forgot the [off]
08:21 Raven262 Red already pasted it but i think it should be brought to closer attention.
08:29 paramat joined #minetest-hub
08:32 Raven262 Greetings, paramat.
08:34 shivajiva Good morning folks :)
08:34 Raven262 Hello shivajiva
08:35 Raven262 Will the [off] hold if i paste multiple lines?
08:36 Raven262 T 1495692184 <OldCoder>4th attempt total
08:36 Raven262 T 1495692188 <OldCoder>Tell our MT friends it failed
08:36 Raven262 T 1495692196 <OldCoder>And I've got legal justification now
08:36 Raven262 T 1495692203 <OldCoder>To do pretty much anything on Freenode
08:36 Raven262 T 1495692221 <OldCoder>I'm discussing shutting down PIA web domains
08:36 Raven262 T 1495692224 <OldCoder>wtih DreamHost
08:36 Raven262 T 1495692229 <OldCoder>the registrar for PIA
08:36 Raven262 T 1495692233 <OldCoder>which now owns Freenode
08:36 Raven262 T 1495692241 <OldCoder>They will dig in their heels; might take a year
08:36 Raven262 T 1495692247 <OldCoder>I'm patient
08:36 Raven262 heh
08:36 Raven262 guess not
08:36 Raven262 But who cares, he already know we have that.
08:36 Raven262 *knows
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10:20 Fixer joined #minetest-hub
10:21 Jordach joined #minetest-hub
10:21 * Jordach meows at Shara
10:47 paramat joined #minetest-hub
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11:01 Krock joined #minetest-hub
11:01 Krock joined #minetest-hub
11:13 nerzhul hi off
11:13 nerzhul haha
11:25 nerzhul hi shivajiva
11:27 benrob0329 Hello all :-)
11:29 benrob0329 export OFF="FALSE"
11:29 rubenwardy claiming that off is a boolean???
11:30 rubenwardy That could get you killed in here!
11:30 rubenwardy :P
11:30 Raven262 xD
11:38 twoelk joined #minetest-hub
11:40 benrob0329 https://youtu.be/7cUL1HKfTK0
12:20 RobbieF joined #minetest-hub
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12:37 Krock why, shivajiva?
12:39 shivajiva joined #minetest-hub
12:40 shivajiva wtf
12:43 CWz joined #minetest-hub
12:50 paramat surely you are notified why? seems odd
12:55 paramat phew
12:55 DS-minetest what is the max_hear_distance of a sound when a player places a node?
12:55 VanessaE depends on the setting of the node
12:56 VanessaE I think typical you'd want like 10 or 15m
12:56 paramat erm
12:56 DS-minetest default doesn't set it
12:56 VanessaE oh the actual placement action
12:56 VanessaE that's only audible to you isn't it?
12:56 DS-minetest or do even other players hear it when a player places something? >_<
12:57 Krock if you specify a hear distance, it will also be sent to the other players close to you
12:57 DS-minetest and if not?
12:57 Krock then it's only hearable for you
12:57 DS-minetest ok
12:58 paramat can you specify a hear distance for node placement?
12:59 Krock oh. SimpleSoundSpec and 'sound parameter table'  are two different things
12:59 Krock first is for node placements, 2nd for sound_play
13:00 paramat maybe you can in 'function default.node_sound_defaults(table)' > 'table.place = table.place or {name = "default_place_node_hard", gain = 1.0}'
13:00 paramat dunno
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13:10 * twoelk imagines walking past a construction site with many players placing blocks at the same time
13:17 lisac joined #minetest-hub
13:21 VanessaE sofar:  2017-05-25 15:20:56: ERROR[Main]: ServerError: AsyncErr: ServerThread::run Lua: Runtime error from mod 'inspector' in callback on_chat_message(): ...minetest/worlds/Basic_World/w​orldmods/inspector/init.lua:28: attempt to perform arithmetic on field 'y' (a nil value)
13:22 VanessaE (he was near Basic's spawn at the time, so Y shouldn't have been out of range)
13:23 VanessaE "[05-25 09:21] <CWz>  /inspect crashed"
13:33 paramat mod issue?
13:33 VanessaE idk.
13:33 VanessaE it's one of sofar's
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13:37 * Wayward_One peeks in
13:39 CWz eek that stone cold stare
13:40 DS-minetest joined #minetest-hub
13:41 octacian joined #minetest-hub
13:42 Wayward_One lol
13:42 Wayward_One hi all :)
13:42 VanessaE hi
13:42 DS-minetest hi
13:43 * benrob0329 drops a pack of bagels on the table
13:43 * VanessaE slides a toaster next to the bag, and puts out a bowl of cream cheese
13:43 VanessaE (anyone got some lox?)_
13:44 * benrob0329 pulls turkey and cheese out of the fridge
13:45 * DS-minetest gets some water and a fish from a river nearby
13:46 benrob0329 If we had a convention, the food would be...interesting
14:08 cx384 joined #minetest-hub
14:08 benrob0329 https://youtu.be/HfeervqhY9Y
14:09 DS-minetest Jeija is still the best cook of the minetest community https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=znRX_VLuUHg
14:10 * paramat pipes in some liquid oxygen
14:27 sniper338 joined #minetest-hub
14:28 Fixer GTA SA is Legendary
14:28 Fixer can confirm
14:29 Fixer GTA SA MP is even more legendary
14:31 nerzhul +1
14:32 Fixer i had so much fun on SAMP
14:34 Fixer chaos, police vs gungs vs all, plains vs plains vs plaines, suicide bombers
14:34 Fixer tank battles, so epic
14:35 Fixer car vs car full of gang members including on the roof
14:35 Fixer trully epic multiplayer
14:36 Fixer https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VbUMVq4pY94
14:41 benrob0329 Top comment is awesome.
14:44 Fixer i rided the train
14:45 Fixer and followed it as well
14:45 sniper338 joined #minetest-hub
14:46 sniper338 joined #minetest-hub
14:46 benrob0329 Load it uo into gmod and ragdoll rope to it
14:52 Fixer servers: 45885 players
15:06 red-001 sure
15:20 DS-minetest joined #minetest-hub
15:28 Fixer joined #minetest-hub
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16:06 Raven262 joined #minetest-hub
16:13 Fixer https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2uhF_4Yz5o ridiculous
16:17 cx384 lol
16:31 Fixer one more and I will stop https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OuvUgaLxemg
16:33 Calinou <Fixer> GTA SA MP is even more legendary
16:33 Calinou I played a bit of Multi Theft Auto
16:34 Calinou unfortunately, most players are kids and the game is a mess
16:34 Calinou GTA Online (ie. the thing you find in GTA V) is slightly better in that regard, but people are still kids on it
16:34 Fixer had better experience, also, you can troll kids in various ways
16:35 Fixer My Antiaircraft Troll near Hydras was epic
16:36 Fixer PartyServer some years ago
16:38 Fixer AA also had negative side effect of rockets blowing up near me
16:38 Fixer randomly
16:38 Fixer had a lot of fun on that server
16:38 Fixer too bad it died down
16:43 ircSparky Yea I've been downloading GTAV for a few days now
16:43 ircSparky 12.75/68 GB
16:43 ircSparky can someone give me faster internet? :P
16:46 Fixer no
16:46 Calinou ircSparky: I had it but no longer have it, since it does not run in WINE currently
16:47 Fixer install size is insane
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16:47 Fixer GTA SA installed is 4.75GB
16:48 Shara Hello all
16:49 garywhite hi Shara
16:50 ircSparky man, thats a pretty steep difference
16:50 Fixer ircSparky: yep
16:50 Fixer ircSparky: now install like 10 games of such size...
16:51 Fixer what is good about windows is backw compatibility, I can literally run game from 199X without any problems, including 3D ones
16:52 Fixer some games like RTCW needed some patches for new windowses
16:53 benrob0329 And I can use a serial terminal from 1972
16:53 benrob0329 what's your point?
17:00 Fixer backward compatibility
17:00 benrob0329 Like how windows 10 broke most apps?
17:01 Fixer not that crap
17:01 nerzhul i can run a FreeBSD 4.1 program on FreeBSD 11
17:01 nerzhul it was release in 2000 :p
17:02 benrob0329 I should try to compile the original vi from source :PP
17:02 nerzhul benrob0329, easy, it's included in freebsd base haha
17:02 benrob0329 The bsd rewrite it
17:02 nerzhul benrob0329, => https://github.com/qrush/unix
17:02 benrob0329 I'm talking the unmodified dource
17:02 nerzhul just compile that
17:02 benrob0329 *source
17:02 Calinou Fixer: someone told me the original UT2004 Linux binaries still work
17:02 Calinou I never tried; here I just run the game in WINE
17:03 Fixer UT2004 is great game btw, have it for win
17:03 Calinou anyway, one more reason for people to publish source code :P
17:03 nerzhul they publish source code, not graphics, most of the time
17:03 Calinou this is enough to make it work on modern systems and fix bugs and security issues
17:03 Calinou you just have to buy/download the original data somewhere :P
17:03 Calinou doesn't have to be legit, too :P
17:04 benrob0329 nerzhul: http://ex-vi.sourceforge.net/
17:07 Fixer Calinou: say big thanks for IdSoftware, for opening a lot of stuff
17:08 benrob0329 Is the origanal doom open source?
17:09 Fixer they open sources some engines, that gave us things like ioquake, etc, Calinou knows better
17:09 Fixer sourced*
17:09 Fixer need to slow down my typing - making lots of errors
17:13 Calinou Fixer: yeah but other companies didn't follow :(
17:13 Calinou benrob0329: yep
17:13 Calinou https://doomwiki.org/wiki/Doom_source_code
17:13 Calinou initially non-commercial only, then GPL
17:14 Calinou tons of source ports, https://doomwiki.org/wiki/Source_port
17:14 Calinou only 5-6 are really worth a look right now though
17:15 benrob0329 Most source mods I've seen are wi dows only
17:15 Calinou no, they almost all work on Linux
17:16 Calinou I can run Zandronum, GZDoom (GPL since last month!), Doomsday Engine, PrBoom+, Chocolate Doom… on Linux
17:16 Calinou on an unrelated note, I compiled eduke32 on Linux and it works
17:16 Calinou music works via a small tweak too
17:17 Calinou the game technically isn't open source (some portions don't allow commercial use) but source is available
17:17 Calinou https://lut.im/59xFCQLGrd/1eCL7qPkEolhlp6t.png
17:17 Calinou (Duke Nukem 3D)
17:20 CWz_ joined #minetest-hub
17:21 Calinou the trend of open sourcing engines unfortunately died because the number of proprietary third-party dependencies increased a lot in the last 15 years
17:21 Calinou and because there's common thinking (not necessarily false) that it makes "piracy" easier
17:21 CWz_ today i learnt my lesson
17:21 Calinou (any game with its engine released is basically DRM-free, you can remove all checks)
17:21 CWz_ never open a 25mb txt file with abiward
17:21 Fixer rabiward
17:22 Fixer Calinou: pfff, cracked exe all the way
17:22 Fixer Calinou: if it is great game with open sourced engine, its legacy will live on for much longer
17:22 Calinou yes
17:22 Calinou good luck telling that to gamedevs who want to sell their latest games and nothing else
17:23 Calinou very few game devs treat their old games with respect; even I is not ideal in this
17:23 Calinou id Software*
17:23 Calinou lol, "even I is"…
17:23 Calinou nice typo
17:23 Fixer sometimes it is goes in reverse, you have assets, and you do open source engine and you then do open sourced assets - OpenTTD
17:23 Fixer and OTTD is awesome
17:23 Calinou reimplementations are possible but they take years to make
17:23 Calinou and to make them work well
17:23 Fixer I hope OpenXCOM will also get open source assets in future, but not sure if there are any plans
17:24 Fixer it is another great thrilling game
17:54 Calinou most reimplementations do not even *plan* having open source asset replacements
17:54 Calinou artists are scarce, even scarcer than 10 years ago because doing art is basically not a hobby for anyone anymore
17:55 Calinou requesting free artists is poorly regarded now
17:55 Calinou artists are scared of free culture licenses, too
18:09 paramat a large majority of artists do it as a hobby, it's very difficult to make a living from it
18:16 nerzhul https://www.sparkfun.com/news/2394?utm_content=548​75643&amp;utm_medium=social&amp;utm_source=twitter
18:16 Calinou paramat: hmm… I'm not convinced
18:16 Calinou the good artists all are semi-professionals at least
18:16 Calinou the shit ones, obviously they're hobbyists, they can't be anything better :)
18:16 Calinou (not that Minetest has very good artists, by the way)
18:16 Calinou (some are decent, but none are great)
18:17 Shara Every project I was involved with... artists are always the hardest thing to find
18:17 Calinou this ^
18:18 Shara You can find okay people for most other roles if you work hard enough, but artists....
18:21 twoelk good art is often quite personal. you don't want to give it away for free and have everybody mess about with it, maybe reversing the exact effect you had carefully designed
18:22 Shara twoelk: exactly
18:22 Fixer i'm glad OpenTTD worked out, totally open source continuation of legend
18:22 Shara I used to draw, and though I was certainly far from among the best, even I didn't like to give drawings away
18:24 nerzhul many guys are doing things as artists, but many of them work as artist, AAA games needs many of them
18:26 red-001 oh lol our friends site has gotten too big to screenshot
18:27 red-001 (he added more stuff to it)
18:27 Fixer Calinou: btw, about texture filtering
18:27 Fixer #    When using bilinear/trilinear/anisotropic filters, low-resolution textures
18:27 Fixer #    can be blurred, so automatically upscale them with nearest-neighbor
18:27 Fixer #    interpolation to preserve crisp pixels.
18:28 Fixer last time I enabled trilinear it was blurry as hell, now where is crisp pixels automatic upscale thing? since it is automatic... where is it?
18:35 Krock # texture_min_size = 64
18:36 Fixer ok, apparently it works but has small effect on crispiness, you need something like  texture_min_size = 256...
18:39 Fixer trilinear + mipmaps = myopia
18:42 red-001 friend*
18:42 red-001 friend's*
18:43 RobbieF left #minetest-hub
18:53 Calinou Shara: good sound designers are also ridiculously hard to find
18:53 Calinou that job is true black magic
18:53 Calinou not just musicians, but people who make sounds from scratch
18:53 Calinou guns, powerups, etc
18:53 Shara Calinou: Yes, I know.
18:54 Shara I've actually considered trying that myself, since I find the idea quite interesting, but don't currently have the equipment for it.
18:55 Calinou you need hardware, software, and tons of theory
18:57 Calinou - What do you call a security gaurd at Samsung stores?
18:57 Calinou - Guardians of the galaxy.
18:57 Calinou heard this today :D
18:57 Calinou guard*
19:00 red-001 I will take note when Guardians of the galaxy 7 come out
19:03 Shara Calinou: I've played around with sound editing quite a lot previously, so it's mostly the hardware (and then of course the test of whether I'd actually have any skill :P)
19:05 Krock Calinou, successfully spread this one. :D
19:05 paramat professional does not equal 'good artist'. many excellent artists cannot make a living from it because that is what the world is like, art is often highly uncommercial
19:05 Calinou most professionals are decent artists
19:05 Calinou some excellent artists are not pros, yes
19:06 Calinou this is by far an exception, not a rule
19:06 Calinou some artwork released for free is of very high quality and stands out from the crowd
19:06 Calinou (example: Misa's Minecraft texture pack)
19:07 Shara Ability to make money as an artist depends on flexibility as well as skill alone.
19:07 Shara I've known at least oen extremely good artist who was so narrow in his focus that he wouldn't try anything else :(
19:07 Shara one*
19:07 Shara So he'll probably never make any money
19:10 paramat depends what you mean by 'good artist', i would not call pop music good art, but it is highly commercial and makes lots of money. 'true art' that is completely true to an artist's uncompromising uncommercial vision is rarely able to make money, and many artists would not want money involved to potentially spoil it through commercial pressure
19:10 Fixer Calinou: eh, I've helplessly tried to locate misa for beta 1.7.3 without luck :(
19:10 Calinou Fixer: Misa herself is 404 anyway
19:10 Calinou apparently not dead, though
19:11 Calinou (since 2013)
19:11 Fixer there were newer packs I had
19:11 Calinou the pack itself is CC BY-NC 3.0, with some fully-proprietary exceptions for eg. random mobs and alternate textures
19:11 Calinou I got permission from her to port it to Minetest back in 2011-09
19:11 paramat i have had very many friends who are talented musicians, none can make a living from it
19:11 Calinou making living from a music is impossible now anyway
19:11 paramat it usually costs them time and money
19:12 Calinou yes
19:12 Fixer paramat: market does not want talent, it needs stuff to sell to "sheeple" with poor taste
19:13 paramat not impossible, anyone can now self distribute and sell through the internet, much better than the old days of corrupt record companies and contracts
19:13 Fixer exception is underground, since it was never about sales imho but about experimenting
19:13 paramat exactly
19:15 paramat and none of my friends were able to make a living from music before the internet either
19:18 twoelk I know a lot of people who earn an extra dime with music but only one actually is capable of feeding his family
19:19 twoelk he does have an extra non musician job in the industry though ;-P
19:22 Calinou paramat: but who will buy enough music from your Bandcamp to make a living out of it?
19:23 Fixer Calinou: market is oversaturated
19:23 Calinou this ^
19:23 Fixer and people expect it to cost like 1usd at most
19:23 Fixer look appshitstores
19:23 Fixer it is mess
19:24 Fixer we ended up in sea of shit with island of good stuff
19:24 twoelk live performance is the way most really make mony
19:24 Fixer for windows it is sysinternals, nirsoft, irfanview, vlc, foobar, etc as examples
19:24 Shara No one wants to pay for art. Many many people want to produce stuff-they-call-art. Result is what we now have...
19:24 paramat Calinou i agree, but it was also near-impossible before the internet
19:25 Fixer also depends on where market is located, its size, etc
19:26 Calinou Shara: "no one wants to pay for art" is a tad wrong, I find
19:26 Fixer who needs brilliant stuff like Ray Coniff today? nah, lets produce FuckMeFuckFuckFuck me with big boobs
19:26 Calinou plenty of artist Patreons get a lot of money
19:26 Fixer singing boobs*
19:26 Calinou it is not entirely wrong; I never pay for culture of any kind, except once last year for a free culture artists
19:26 paramat lol
19:26 Calinou I also used to never pay for software, but I bought some games last year and this year on Steam still
19:26 Calinou (unfortunate…)
19:27 Fixer East Europe never was too
19:27 Fixer i have some geniunly looking stuff, but I'm still not sure if this for real, or nice counterfeat :}
19:28 Calinou yeah, Russian/Ukraine are notorious for acquiring everything illegally :P
19:28 Fixer China
19:28 Fixer even russia is overshadowed by China, by a huge margin
19:29 Fixer Calinou: there were not much legal places to buy after all
19:29 Shara Calinou: It's about the general viewpoint. It doesn't mean no one will pay, but it does mean not enough will.
19:29 twoelk chinese just have a different concept of copyright :-P
19:29 Fixer Calinou: where do you think I got my CD of Half-Life 1?
19:29 Calinou I have no ethical objections to "pirating" things personally
19:29 Calinou I don't see it as something morally wrong; in fact, it even may be the right thing to do in some cases
19:29 Calinou ("cooperation is more important than copyright", Richard Stallman once said)
19:30 Fixer i bought it in store, disc had fancy stickers to show it is "genuine", but everyone knows it was all pirated and sold en mass
19:30 Calinou (Richard Stallman isn't just a man who tells you to say "GNU/Linux" instead of "Linux"; he also advocates for copyright reduction, an activity far less known than "free software" promotion itself)
19:30 RobbieF joined #minetest-hub
19:30 Calinou lots of people will surely disagree with me, or even call me an evil person, but that's how I see it
19:31 Fixer Calinou: also, users-pirates-HARHAR have big advantage in comparison to legal guys
19:31 Fixer Calinou: not just price
19:31 Fixer Calinou: you have no ads, can convert, copy, do whatever you like with it
19:32 Fixer or books
19:32 Fixer immense options here
19:32 Fixer pdfs
19:32 Calinou "arrr! I pirate the things and surf the Web!"
19:32 Fixer there are million leaked scientific articles in wild now
19:32 Calinou also, yes; unlegit media is DRM-free by definition
19:32 Fixer btw
19:33 Fixer people expect: i bought stuff - i do whatever I want with it, but then assholes come in and say you can't cut ads, rewind, convert etc, and that part is pissing off
19:33 Fixer same with OS
19:33 Calinou yes, if more things were DRM-free I would be more inclined to buy them
19:33 Calinou with games though, there is no real alternative
19:34 Calinou multiplayer almost always requires you to buy a legitimate copy
19:34 twoelk one might not mind someone using one's art, but if some company uses it to advertise something one does not stand for - just imagine your work of art for ever associated with something you consider wrong or bad - shudder
19:34 Calinou and many games are Steam-only now
19:34 Fixer Calinou: not always, there are hacked servers :}
19:34 Calinou twoelk: you can claim moral rights violation, even with a free culture work
19:34 Calinou if someone uses your CC BY-licensed music in a beheading video, you can claim moral rights for this, likely
19:34 Calinou you cannot surrender your moral rights and they are perpetual
19:34 Calinou (at least in France)
19:34 twoelk good luck trying that Calinou
19:35 Calinou it still is technically possible
19:35 Fixer Calinou: also, required connection to internet also pisses a lot of people, reasonably
19:35 Calinou this would likely happen with a non-free work anyway; the people making such videos don't care about copyright already
19:35 Fixer not sure about kiddies, but I expect stuff to work out of network, anywhere where I go
19:36 Fixer I simply copy $INSTALLDIR of the game to new location and play
19:37 Fixer a lot of games simply works even without registry info, which is excellent
19:37 Fixer also, there is a lot of abandonware, that should be clearly free to redistr
19:37 Calinou copyright lasts far too long right now
19:37 Fixer yep
19:38 Fixer death + 80 years iirc
19:38 Calinou Julia Reda was on the right track, but she lost traction and what she proposed (life + 50 years) was still far too long
19:38 Calinou right now it is life + 70 years
19:38 Calinou or life + 100 years in France if you "died for France"
19:38 Calinou this is why "le Petit Prince" (a famous novel) did not fall into public domain in 2015
19:38 red-001 Calinou, thats a strange law
19:38 Calinou because its author, Antoine de Saint-Exupéry, fought in WWII
19:38 Calinou so he gets 100 years of copyright after death and not 70 years
19:39 Fixer nobody cares though, that is the reason why the law is too strict, it does not work, since everyone can be sued
19:39 Fixer it must be relaxed, it is out of reality
19:39 Calinou I don't think I'll see copyright reduction in my life anyway
19:40 Calinou so far, copyright has only been extended
19:40 Fixer yeah
19:40 nerzhul Rights are 70 years in france Calinou
19:40 Calinou if you make a work while you are 20 years old, you live until you're 90, you get 140 years of copyright usually
19:40 Calinou 140 fucking years
19:40 Fixer but, it may be realised it swinged into one side too much
19:40 Fixer eventually
19:40 nerzhul yeah your child get money for your work, it's quite sutpid
19:40 Calinou with today's politicians, probably not
19:41 Calinou nerzhul: your grand-grand-children too probablyt
19:41 Calinou sometimes grand-grand-grand-children
19:42 twoelk in the old days artists learned by copying the masters - they might go to jail if they tried to start a career that way today
19:42 Calinou "Good artists copy, great artists steal" —Picasso
19:45 Fixer ah
19:45 Fixer ah
19:46 paramat Shara is your github avatar one of your drawings?
19:57 Shara paramat: yes
19:57 Shara a very, very old one
19:58 paramat ahh i wondered, it is an intense eye, nice
19:59 Shara Bad quality scan sadly, and the original drawing was quite badly damaged since
20:01 benrob0329 I would pay for music etc if more of it were under free licenses
20:01 Calinou this ^
20:01 Calinou crowdfunding is also a big problem
20:01 Calinou people back things (and you are expected to, too) that are everything but common goods
20:01 benrob0329 Like, I'm planning on buying all of Incompetech's (Kevin M
20:01 Calinou profits are private, and the license is restrictive
20:02 Calinou (no, I am not communist)
20:02 benrob0329 ) music
20:02 benrob0329 No, clearly not
20:03 benrob0329 I'm fine with people making money
20:03 benrob0329 Its somewhat necessary
20:03 benrob0329 But once I buy it, its mine
20:03 Fixer yeah
20:04 benrob0329 I'm willing to pay a bit more for it, but I don't want to worry about drm, videos, multiple computers etc
20:04 Fixer read that story about american farmers buying software from ukraine/poland to unlock JonhDeer bullshit
20:05 Fixer some companies went on bad trip to lets service those mfer-consumers via us only and remove all options, not gonna happen
20:06 Fixer now you have hackers selling for cheap to unlock your DRM, what ya gonna do now with your service? It is indication of different problem, that business itself is dying down, market oversaturation, big competition, less sales, so those fuckers want to lock in, but consumers are very opposed to this and will circumvent no matter what
20:07 Fixer this will end up with ruined reputation
20:07 Fixer toxicity etc
20:08 Fixer some companies instead of selling parts for repair trying to rip off via selling service, this gives very bad reputation for such businesses in long run
20:08 Fixer and USA seems ahead in this kind of bullshit
20:09 Fixer with trump corps are even more aggresive
20:09 Fixer shitty practices in IT that became the norm, to sell privacy of other people
20:14 benrob0329 We just need to convince trump the OS is the future
20:14 benrob0329 *that OS
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20:51 rubenwardy he would probably end up banning it
20:51 rubenwardy cause communism
20:51 garywhite OS?
20:51 rubenwardy open source, I'm guessing
20:52 garywhite "Open source is hurting America's economy, & I don't like that, cause then I lose money on my hotels."
20:52 garywhite #FakeTrump
21:02 Calinou there is a free game on the Humble Store right now, it works in WINE according to the AppDB (gold rating)
21:03 Calinou https://lut.im/mk7avIpaRP/AHFAMt7UTYpAYlth.png
21:03 Calinou open source will advance!
21:04 Calinou https://www.humblebundle.com/store/r​ising-storm-game-of-the-year-edition
21:08 nerzhul lol 14257 install minetest by searching it on play store and... 14 by google
21:08 nerzhul strange stat
21:11 nerzhul wow there is a very common crash on android
21:12 nerzhul https://play.google.com/store/apps​/details?id=net.minetest.minetest
21:12 nerzhul i changed my name on play store :p
21:12 nerzhul generic name + pseudo maybe that can help
21:12 nerzhul oops wrong chan
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21:19 garywhite CNET download.com reports 27 downloads of MT since 1 May
21:19 Fixer lol
21:20 garywhite or 132 downloads in the last 3 months
21:22 nerzhul ridiculous
21:22 nerzhul i don't know if it's easy to distribute it on steam
21:22 nerzhul but i think if we do that we should wait for 0.5 :p no time for this now
21:25 garywhite Also, you have to have someone who's paid $100 for Greenlight or whatever
21:26 garywhite So unless someone wants to sink $100 into this game, I don't think we can put it on Steam
21:26 Shara That's not really a big barrier really
21:26 rubenwardy or 100 giving $1
21:27 Shara Just split it between 5 to 10 people and it's sort of nothing
21:27 nerzhul maybe i should ask for android thiefts xD
21:27 garywhite Correction, they changed it altogether...
21:27 nerzhul i will have 100$ by bounty source for some MT dev, i can use some for that if we want to distribute on it
21:28 nerzhul but before just change those texture to make MT have a better identity, less mtgame genericity
21:28 garywhite We gotta do it quick cause they're replacing greenlight with another method that's gonna (pardon my French) screw everyone over
21:28 Calinou it would be possible to put Minetest on Steam
21:28 Calinou but we won't be ready before Greenlight closes
21:28 Calinou we need a much better UI, better performancez
21:28 Calinou more content in the default game: (read: mobs)
21:29 Shara Or just... other games
21:29 Calinou multiple low-quality subgames aren't going to help anyone
21:29 Calinou quality over quantity, you know
21:29 rubenwardy agreed
21:30 Shara I'm not talking about pure quantity
21:30 Shara I just find MTG messy really, and too without focus
21:30 Shara It doesn't seem to know what it wants to be
21:30 Shara Probably because it's trying to be everything at once
21:30 Calinou minetest_game is getting better but still needs a lot of things
21:30 Calinou you could argue the same about Minecraft
21:30 Calinou it is very sandboxy, no real goal, a shitty end
21:31 Shara Never played it and don't really want to
21:31 Calinou making your game highly targeted at something might not be a good idea, too
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21:31 Calinou remember that it's also a multiplayer game
21:31 Calinou (mainly a multiplayer game, even…)
21:31 Shara Some devs would disagree with you there it seems :)
21:32 Shara Bt it's why I'm not keen on doing anymore MTG PRs.
21:32 Shara But*
21:32 Calinou I don't want Minetest Game to become a RPG or an adventure game really
21:32 Calinou unless that's disableable in some way
21:33 Shara That's not what I would want either
21:33 Shara But almost any content you add to make it feel like a complete game, would make it less fit for other types of play
21:34 red-001 +1 to spending some of the money from bountysource on getting minetest on steam greenlight
21:34 red-001 but then greenlight is being removed afaik
21:34 Calinou it is
21:34 Shara So if we just have one official game, it feels like it needs a lot more content, but also a better way to have that content as options.
21:34 Calinou more content yeah, definitely
21:35 Calinou and more gameplay elements, not just dozens of random useless blocks
21:35 Shara So that you can build whatever kind of game you want from it
21:35 Shara just by turning on off the right features you need
21:35 Shara on/off*
21:35 garywhite To indicate how much harder it will be, please read http://steamcommunity.com/games/593110/​announcements/detail/558846854614253751
21:35 rubenwardy I don't think they should be options
21:36 rubenwardy I think they should be separate mods which you enable/disable/remove instead
21:36 rubenwardy as in,
21:36 rubenwardy still in MTG, just not all in defualt
21:36 Shara rubenwardy: sure, but that is options
21:36 rubenwardy oh yeah, I read settings
21:36 Shara I don't really mind so much about how it's implemented, just so long as it's easy to control
21:37 Shara But the advanatge of settings is updating is easier
21:37 Shara I don't want to need to delete the mobs folder each time I update, if I don't want mobs, for examples
21:38 red-001 wouldn't allowing end-users to disable mods includes with the game fix that?
21:38 red-001 included*
21:39 red-001 nvm it seems thats whats suggested
21:39 Shara Anythign at all that's preserved between updates is fine
21:39 Shara ANything*
21:41 paramat i feel the mods within MTGame should be disableable
21:42 Shara It would be good
21:43 garywhite Except default, that's kind of important for everything
21:43 red-001 maybe add a way for subgames to mark certain mods as "core"
21:44 red-001 meaning the player isn't able to disable them via the menu
21:45 Shara not trusting players to not hopelessly break things? :)
21:47 nerzhul minetest_game should increase content quality, and real mobs is one of our target for the next release (0.5 i mean) the breakage on protocol will permit to have real mobs, not hacky physic mobs :p mobs, skills/spells is required, more intelligent animations too... curent model is too low level
21:48 red-001 oh neat someone is going to finnaly work on decent mobs with a c++ based ai?
21:48 nerzhul minetest.register_mob('default:bee', flying=true, speed=100, spells=['default:attack', 'default:fireball'])
21:48 nerzhul :)
21:49 nerzhul it's what i mean, declare your mobs, have some interesting callbacks , outside of LuaEntitySAO
21:49 nerzhul i think UnitSAO should have a new child, NPCSAO
21:49 nerzhul which is more intelligent than too many lua extruded entities
21:49 nerzhul with many core features
21:50 red-001 sounds like a decent idea
21:50 nerzhul engine and game should work together we are not unity or godot, but a game with mods
21:50 nerzhul and NPCSAO would have some common parts with player, maybe UnitSAO will be more intelligent and permit to enhance a little bit LuaEntitySAO by side effet :p
21:51 nerzhul effect*
21:51 nerzhul imagine just a thing, npc:cast_spell('default:fireball', {x, y, z})
21:51 nerzhul npc:move_to({x,y,z}, speed)
21:51 nerzhul npc:play_animation('default:jump')
21:51 nerzhul could  be better :D
21:53 red-001 what about npc:set_state_trigger("damage",20,"state_flee") ?
21:53 nerzhul what is the purpose of this ?
21:54 red-001 allow c++ to trigger certain events without calling lua
21:54 garywhite Also, adding MT Android version to Amazon Appstore will definitely boost the number of users
21:54 nerzhul yeah it's the goal, a high level lua api
21:54 nerzhul we offer events, not modders to code the whole physic...
21:54 red-001 oh ok
21:55 nerzhul but it's ideas, if it motivates people to work on a new NPC entity, more intelligent for NPC that would be great :)
21:56 nerzhul also at a point i think i should backport my AppleTree modification to minetest permitting to store areas into core engine, permitting to have local PVP for non PVP servers and local passive zones for PVP servers
21:56 nerzhul but i don't know if it's interesting for everybody, i know many decent servers has areas
21:57 red-001 wait builtin grief protection??!!
21:57 * red-001 awaits PR
21:58 nerzhul i have it on my own server
21:58 nerzhul but i'm not using area store
21:58 nerzhul the portage is a little bit complicated as is i think
21:59 nerzhul but, if a feature is everywhere, it mean it's a common feature that make sense to port it, and offer it in a disabled way for modders no ?
21:59 red-001 yeah protection needs to be part of core
21:59 nerzhul on AppleTree all areas are stored into database (owners too) with map, somes are flagged as non PvP like spawn, you leave those areas you can attack players
22:00 red-001 that will allow added client-sided prediction to it
22:00 Shara Hmm, nerzhul, sounds interesting.
22:00 nerzhul this part is not easy
22:00 nerzhul because we cannot sent all areas to clients :p
22:00 nerzhul send*
22:00 Shara I sometimes wonder how many areas a server can handle
22:00 red-001 send the areas with the mapblocks?
22:00 nerzhul if we send them to client it permit to CSM to handle it to show them on screen and modders to customize them
22:01 Dumbeldor https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sYsvgZyLUjY
22:01 nerzhul red-001, quite impossible, areas can cover many many mapblocks, but yes sending them when a mapblock is sent and an area is found on it can be nice, but hsould be very optimized
22:02 Shara I have players moaning at me that 50 areas isn't enough for them...
22:02 nerzhul lol
22:02 nerzhul this limit is in your mod
22:02 red-001 I meant as in re-calculate the areas the client needs to know about when sending a mapblock
22:02 nerzhul yes
22:02 Shara nerzhul: I know.. but FIFTY!
22:02 Shara It scares me that they need this many :)
22:02 nerzhul it depend on what they protect but if they play hundred hours that can be many buildings
22:03 nerzhul it's why i say if we did it it should be very optimized because it can take many memory and CPU usage on calculation
22:03 nerzhul my AppleTree implementation is not optimized for thousands areas
22:03 Shara My creative server has over 3k areas protected... and this is after the admin team spent hours trying to combine some and remove unneeded ones
22:03 nerzhul at each protected action i search first matching area which forbid
22:03 nerzhul lol
22:04 Shara And this server is only about a year and a half old
22:04 red-001 yeah area ids tend to get pretty high
22:05 red-001 on one server I play on they reached the 5000's
22:05 nerzhul many ideas, many hands who wants to help us to contribute, time to make minetest great (and nuke forks :p)
22:05 Shara I also get complaints there's not enough space left to build.... but I just tell them to go to space and pick an asteroid :)
22:05 garywhite Shara: Maybe that's a good thing, it means that people are actually protecting their areas
22:05 red-001 or just protecting random land
22:06 Shara I sometimes find silly kids who protected multiple 1x1x1 areas :)
22:06 red-001 lol
22:07 Shara But hopefully my admins are never giving these peopole high_limit priv, so they can't make so many
22:07 Shara people*
22:08 garywhite Well, how many do they get by default? I have 60 with high_limit
22:08 Shara I can't remember
22:08 Shara It's low though
22:09 Shara I only put it up to 60 for those with high limit last week
22:14 garywhite Also, about the whole overhaul & putting MT to Steam & all that, if MT relies so much on multiplayer, how is the existing MT network of servers gonna be able to support a lot of additional players?
22:15 Shara MT has far more servers than needed for the current amount of players
22:15 Fixer who said it will be steam? that was wild suggestion out of my broken mind
22:15 nerzhul garywhite, it's why i just say, way for next release
22:16 Shara Not many servers are actually busy, when you look at the server list
22:16 nerzhul i will take some time to rewrite entierely the network, it will break underlying protocol, but our model is not good and not resilient to DoS due to slow clients
22:16 Fixer also, MTG still not ready, why 0.5?
22:16 Fixer MTG must move forward massively
22:16 nerzhul 0.5 is not this release
22:16 Fixer most of changes are in engine
22:16 nerzhul we are releasing 0.4.16 last week
22:16 nerzhul next*
22:16 rubenwardy realistically it's not going to happen for 0.5
22:16 Fixer yes, i mean after 0.4.16
22:17 nerzhul honestly i don't know for minetest_game, but it seems the core engine has some development direction (C++11, CSM, mobs, [areas], mod channels for CSM, rewrite the network protocol) but what about mtg ?
22:18 Fixer while it had much progress, it is not revolutionary
22:18 Fixer only evolutional changes, very slight
22:18 garywhite I'm just saying, the average for MT on Download.com is almost 3 downloads a day since January 2013
22:18 Fixer far from goals in that nores doc
22:19 nerzhul download.com is not a reference for game
22:19 garywhite ik, but those are the only download numbers I have
22:21 Fixer garywhite: tbh I doubt anyone in their mind will download of download.com
22:21 red-001 Fixer, well if we get 3 insane people a day...
22:22 Fixer red-001: too thin
22:22 red-001 thats over a thousand crazy people a year
22:23 red-001 .. I'm not sure what point I'm trying to make
22:23 garywhite Well, we want to have people playing the game right? & if we can't use major distribution channels like Steam, then we're very limited on where we can post it
22:23 Fixer garywhite: cnet, download.com was NOGO sites for many years for many people
22:24 Fixer excluding grandpas/mas
22:25 nerzhul on playstore in 1 year we have 2k more persistant installations (not total, they are not stable)
22:25 nerzhul 6k persistant installations
22:26 garywhite Which is why I also suggested Amazon Appstore, cause then that opens MT up to the market of Fire tablets (I had to sideload it onto mine0
22:26 garywhite )*
22:26 Fixer i would worry more about actual playability of MTG
22:26 Fixer you don't even have tools rendered in other people hands...
22:27 benrob0329 hand's should be fully 3D imo
22:27 nerzhul garywhite, there is f-Droid build
22:28 nerzhul Fixer, tools are not rendered for other players ? cannot remember that :o
22:28 garywhite True, but 99% of people don't know what F-Droid is
22:28 nerzhul also having armor support in core engine permit to make NPC and player having real armor rendering client side, could be nice
22:28 Fixer nerzhul: i mean if you use plain minetest_game, you will appear as tools-less player to others in game
22:29 Fixer you literally need to use a mod for that... weildview or smth
22:29 Calinou lol, Amazon Appstore
22:29 nerzhul just include it lol
22:30 nerzhul Amazon appstore is quite unused
22:30 garywhite Not if you have a fire tablet, then it's pretty much the only source for apps
22:31 garywhite They make a tablet especially for kids, & I know that can only access Amazon
22:31 red-001 what about itch.io
22:31 red-001 *?
22:32 Calinou the ultilmate question: do we care about kids?
22:32 Calinou sorry to say that, but I feel like we should earn more… higher-quality players, you know
22:33 * red-001 is working on creating a page for minetest on itch.io
22:33 nerzhul red-001, at least a page refering our site is the minimum
22:35 red-001 https://red-001.itch.io/minetest?s​ecret=YvQj9iKeQ2pZt1C2Z8FjO1u956M
22:37 Fixer "With a 620003 block playing area"
22:37 Fixer needs correction
22:37 garywhite Calinou: Even then, in this day & age, more & more people are ditching PCs for phones & tablets. I think that the devs should think about looking at getting more mobile coverage in all the major Android stores
22:38 Calinou garywhite: sensible people do not ditch their PCs *entirely*
22:38 Calinou they can use mobile devices on a regular basis (I do!) but most of them won't abandon their PCs entirely
22:38 Calinou our mobile port is shit right now, and it is unlikely to be improved; it is more likely to be entirely removed
22:39 Fixer workstations/notebooks are ditched by people who are ok with viewing their facebook pages and few videos on their crappy phone
22:39 twoelk people don't ditch their pc - rather their first computer is a mobile device and they never move on
22:39 Fixer there is no "death of PC" hype, it lives, still used by people who need it
22:40 Fixer twoelk: depends on age and other factors
22:40 Fixer twoelk: android/ios is crippled OS in many regards
22:40 garywhite My first computer wasn't a mobile device, & I still use my tablet more, mainly my laptop is for work
22:40 Fixer for watching kittens? yep, not much more
22:40 rubenwardy it's not crippled
22:41 Fixer i use my tablet for reading books, watching youtube in bed, ocasionnal shitpost reading near table
22:41 rubenwardy it's just not designed for stuff that a real computer would be good at
22:41 Fixer rubenwardy: exactly
22:41 twoelk my first programmable device was a pocket calculater :-D
22:42 Fixer "PC is dead" hype, now there are tons of assholes who cry with "tablets are dying"
22:42 Fixer hype after hype after hype
22:43 Fixer market oversaturation and boom
22:43 garywhite Heck, my first computer was a PC with a horrible version of Windows...guess which one
22:43 twoelk the market is simply getting more fractured
22:43 Fixer and suddenly tablets/smartphoneshit is not replacing much, you still need real PC to do stuff, sky is not falling etc
22:43 red-001 Fixer, fixed
22:44 red-001 also added download links to windows builds and linux appimage
22:44 Fixer tablet sales are decelerating -> TABLETS ARE DIEING!!11111
22:44 Fixer sky is falling!
22:45 twoelk no, wait, the first programmable device in our family was a knitting machine using something like punch cards :-P
22:45 Fixer twoelk: you was wealthy
22:46 Fixer programmable calculator...
22:46 Fixer too fancy
22:46 Fixer for that time
22:46 twoelk not really but my father loved gadgets like that
22:47 twoelk that calculater taught me the basic basics (pun intended)
22:48 Fixer it was probably expensive as hell
22:48 Fixer calculator is pretty recent invention
22:48 twoelk well, it was second hand
22:48 Fixer started to appear in 70es
22:48 Fixer 70s*
22:48 Calinou I remember the "PC is dead" meme in 2012
22:48 Calinou lol
22:49 Calinou also yeah, tablets are dying off
22:49 Calinou due to larger phones
22:49 Fixer before that there were logarithmic ||||||||||||||||||||||| (how they called i forgot)
22:49 Calinou sadly, there is no good Android tablet right now
22:49 Calinou the Pixel C is nice but 1.5 years old already
22:49 Calinou also fairly expensive
22:49 Calinou (iPad-priced)
22:49 red-001 anyone here have a itch.io account?
22:49 Fixer Calinou: still, i would prefer 10" tablet over 6" brick, much better for youtube/books/pdf/etc
22:50 Fixer telephone is telephone
22:50 Fixer also, i would rather see long battery life
22:50 Fixer not this shit brick shit that bands and dies within 1 day
22:50 Fixer that hardly fits into pockets
22:51 Fixer even 5" is small these days, LOL
22:51 rubenwardy red-001, yeah, https://rubenwardy.itch.io/ although not released anything
22:51 garywhite tbh, I have an Android phone, & it sucks. I don't care for smartphones, considering that you have this big 5" thing in your pocket
22:52 Calinou 10" tablet is much nicer (and more poweful) than 7" or 8"
22:52 Calinou the Pixel C is 10"
22:52 Fixer all brick shit, now do extravagant, make small android smartphone with good battery and hardware keyboard, eh?
22:52 Calinou IIRC, it has the same CPU as the… Nintendo Switch
22:52 Calinou NVIDIA Tegra X1
22:52 Calinou GLES 3.1, Vulkan supported
22:52 Fixer Calinou: i have 10" tablet, not even looking at brick smartphone shit
22:53 Fixer phone is for calls, remembA?
22:53 Sokomine yes. why are no smaller devices sold? or at least no usable ones
22:53 Calinou I'm ok with large phones, I have large hands
22:53 Calinou 5.5" is ideal for me
22:54 garywhite Flip phone is ideal for me
22:54 Calinou you can find 5" phones with some effort but they're not high-end, and thus not particularly borderless…
22:54 Fixer I want 4"
22:55 red-001 rubenwardy, could you take a look and see if this is set up corectly https://red-001.itch.io/minetest/d​ownload/test-pDpdMucarWryaJsM5YbKb​fTTYP-PR95P6yBWrPJw5YsdEQdHCFdjXQp ?
22:55 Fixer i can use 5", but it is the limit for me
22:55 Fixer not because of hands
22:55 garywhite I actually have this as a secondary phone, just have to get a miniSIM from the carrier
22:55 Fixer i dislike to carry huge crap
22:55 garywhite http://www.gsmarena.com/nokia_6085-1705.php
22:56 rubenwardy red-001, I see 3 downloads, w32 w64 and appimage
22:56 rubenwardy although I had to "link my account" first, whatever that means
22:56 red-001 do we have more downloads that don't need a package manager?
22:56 Fixer garywhite: i''ve seen even smaller one, it was perfect but rain destroyed it
22:57 Sokomine Calinou: too big for me
22:57 * Sokomine nods to fixer and wants even smaller ones
22:57 Fixer my friend uses actual Nokia 3230
22:58 Fixer or some model close to it
22:58 Fixer no, not that
22:58 red-001 so it looks ok?
22:58 Fixer oldschool one
22:58 garywhite 3310?
22:58 Fixer 3230 was mine, not long ago
22:58 * twoelk misses his old Nokia that would last for weeks with a single charge
22:59 Fixer garywhite: yes, 3310
22:59 Fixer or 3410
23:00 Fixer this one http://keep-talking.net/nokia/3410-silver.jpg
23:00 red-001 oh it someone else wants to check if it's working as expected https://pastebin.com/PaDrxKix
23:00 red-001 if*
23:01 Fixer garywhite: and it worked for like >10 years, still works
23:01 Fixer i had 3310 back in the day
23:03 garywhite I remember my parents had some kind of old Nokia phone like the 3310, dunno if it was though, & to put it simply, it was so long ago that Cingular was still a wireless company
23:04 Fixer i still have rotary phone for emergency if needed
23:04 Fixer it does not require power
23:04 Fixer from 220V
23:04 Fixer just from phone line itself
23:05 garywhite I wish we could use that, but our stupid VoIP wants something like $30 for the battery for our modem that just HAS to control our Internet & home phone
23:06 red-001 https://red-001.itch.io/minetest?password=password
23:06 Fixer i was user of analog telephony at the time, it was problematic
23:06 twoelk the phone that has outlived all our others and is still being the most used -> http://www.aller-leih.com/static/images/productim​age-picture-bp-telefon-15426_JPG_600x600_q85.jpg
23:07 Fixer i have something like that, but different colour
23:08 Fixer red-001: below MINETEST you should add description of the game
23:08 Fixer what it is, etc
23:08 twoelk only problem is when some robot wants you to press a number
23:08 Fixer twoelk: robot?
23:08 Fixer ah
23:08 Fixer too much 4chan >_>
23:09 Fixer twoelk: i've used it before robot time
23:09 Fixer i don't really call to robots these days
23:09 Fixer it is problematic
23:09 Fixer takes ages
23:09 Fixer fuck em
23:09 twoelk telephone robot -- if you want service blah press the one, if you want blup press the two
23:09 Fixer yes
23:09 Fixer this crap
23:10 twoelk I hate them
23:10 Fixer we largely avoided that crap and had actual human
23:10 Fixer but now there is a lot of this crap
23:10 Fixer sure, it is in some ways convinient, but takes much longer
23:11 twoelk not convinient for the caller
23:11 red-001 Fixer, done https://red-001.itch.io/minetest
23:11 Fixer twoelk: there is no better way to do it right now
23:12 red-001 I managed to find out how to making it public and unlisted
23:12 Calinou "If you buy MINETEST you will get additional mod implementing FIXER into the game!"
23:12 Calinou instant best-seller.
23:13 Fixer featuring minetest ad: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WjRjqYGNeQU
23:14 red-001 Calinou, oh btw I'm using your appimage for it if thats ok with you
23:14 Calinou red-001: it is not up-to-date :(
23:14 Calinou it was compiled in Februrary 2017
23:14 Calinou lots of fixes since then
23:14 rubenwardy remember when a video called "THE WORST GAME EVER - MINETEST" was the featured video on our homepage?
23:14 Calinou I have a 0.4.15 AppImage around I think, not sure if it's online
23:14 Calinou rubenwardy: hmm, I might
23:14 Calinou "The worst game ever" also was an unofficial tagline for Cube 2: Sauerbraten at a time
23:15 red-001 I'm using a link to your site if thats ok, if you prefer I can upload it to itch.io servers
23:15 Calinou better do that, yeah
23:15 Calinou I have a large amount of unmetered bandwidth but it's not infinite either
23:15 Calinou so let itch.io's servers suffer the Itch Hug of Death :P
23:15 Fixer rubenwardy: i rarely visited the homepage...ooo***
23:16 Fixer rubenwardy: How you name the ship (c)
23:16 twoelk the word infinite is overrated
23:16 Fixer yes
23:16 Fixer compared to MC - insanely overrated
23:17 Fixer but OK for 95% of players
23:17 Fixer you can fit most of population in 1000x1000
23:19 twoelk hm, red-001, should the download links work?
23:19 red-001 yes
23:20 Fixer Calinou: i would avoid calling your game worst in the world, I would rather put PEPE in it...
23:21 twoelk I get the -thanks for downloading- popup but nothing else happens
23:22 Fixer enable javascript :trollface:
23:22 red-001 twoelk, which one are you trying to download?
23:22 twoelk tried all three
23:22 red-001 huh maybe it's better if I upload all the file to itch.io servers
23:23 red-001 twoelk, could you see if the appimage works once you refresh the page?
23:24 twoelk ok appimage seems to work now but not the windows versions
23:24 Fixer twoelk: firefox blocked popup window, probably because of that
23:24 Fixer download works
23:25 Fixer but it is blocked because it is popup, or some of my firefox addons block it
23:25 octacian joined #minetest-hub
23:26 red-001 alright I uploaded all the files to itch.io servers so it will download faster
23:27 red-001 (itch.io forces you to wait when downloading an external file for some reason)
23:27 twoelk all seem to work now :-)
23:27 red-001 alright I will list it on itch.io then
23:28 red-001 done
23:29 red-001 I will work on intergrating minetest with itch.io some other time
23:38 Fixer twoelk: i have red phone :} fancy
23:38 Fixer rotary one
23:39 twoelk mine is green as in pic
23:42 twoelk telephone guy let me have it when he replaced it with a newer one for the flat I had rented. He said they where being thrown away anyway so I got it for free
23:43 twoelk it's been with me some almost 30 years now
23:44 Fixer C Y B E R N O S T A L G I A
23:45 Fixer my red one should be quite old
23:45 Fixer he is also buggy
23:45 Fixer after call i loose sound sometimes
23:45 Fixer need to check insides
23:46 twoelk it's somewhat battered and falling appart - but does the job - and amazingly has the best sound
23:49 twoelk it's interesting watching my young nephews trying to dail with it for the first time, pressing the numbers in the holes :-D
23:49 Fixer yeah, too much touch screens
23:50 Fixer i had so much problems with calling, my line was shitty, needed to recall many times
23:50 Fixer that is all gone, dialup is also gone
23:50 Fixer i'm glad it is
23:50 Fixer analogue line + dialup was horrendous
23:51 Fixer once had 4 people on same line
23:51 twoelk :-O
23:51 Fixer i mean during talk
23:52 Fixer other couple of persons somehow integrated into our conversation
23:52 Fixer 4 people on line
23:52 Fixer wtfing
23:53 Fixer probably some rare bug on station
23:53 twoelk fun like that hardly happens anymore
23:53 Fixer yes
23:53 Fixer and rain...
23:53 Fixer amount of noise
23:54 Fixer usually connected at 28.8K or slightly higher
23:54 Fixer when it went digital, dialup speed upped to 45K, if good day
23:55 twoelk I remember visiting our telephon switching station and being shown a hall full of mechanical relais - that noise
23:55 Fixer 4kbyte/sec
23:55 Fixer good night!
23:56 twoelk 0/
23:57 * twoelk is probably afk for several days
23:57 twoelk left #minetest-hub

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