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IRC log for #minetest-dev, 2016-12-14

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:08 Fixer i'm suddenly worried about that furnace change
00:09 Fixer right now on CashWorld server i've discovered curious furnace bug, i'm not sure it is in default, i will try to check
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00:10 garywhite What's going on Fixer?
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00:14 Fixer put cactus and sand in furnace to cook it, went to other area, came back, glass was done but cactus was still burning out very slowly, i put 10 sand in it and it cocked instantly
00:14 Fixer maybe it is server-specific problem, no idea
00:29 Fixer YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEES
00:29 Fixer found a gameplay blocking bug in new furnace
00:29 Fixer reproduced in default
00:29 Fixer i call it Instacook
00:30 Fixer will post an issue soon
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00:35 Fixer https://github.com/minetest​/minetest_game/issues/1455 This needs attention
00:37 paramat one for sofar
00:38 sofar maybe, gotta drive home from work first
00:38 sofar could just be lag, too
00:39 Fixer sofar: singleplayer
00:39 Fixer confirmed in singleplayer and on server
00:40 paramat try to reproduce locally and with known latest game
00:40 Fixer paramat: i've just did
00:41 Fixer on Dec 9, 2016 build
00:42 paramat oh just saw those messages
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00:55 Fixer will move from dec 9 to todays build tommorrow, too late to compile
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01:09 Wuzzy lol. diamond axe breaks earlier than mese axe. and nobody noticed it for years
01:09 garywhite lolol
01:11 Wuzzy and i always wondered why chopping down trees eat away my diamonds so quickly
01:11 Wuzzy now I know. :)
01:11 Wuzzy diamond axe = 270 uses. mese axe = 540 uses
01:13 paramat hm
01:14 paramat i think diamond was meant to be superior to mese
01:15 Wuzzy yes
01:17 paramat yeah it's a deeper ore too
01:17 paramat could you open an issue?
01:19 Wuzzy https://github.com/minetest​/minetest_game/issues/1456
01:22 garywhite How many uses should a stone axe have? (I can test if you want)
01:22 paramat thanks
01:22 Wuzzy 60 on normal tree
01:23 garywhite Did you test or no?
01:23 Wuzzy i calculated it
01:23 Wuzzy but due to a bug, you will probably obtain 61 trees
01:24 Wuzzy (this issue is also reported)
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01:24 est31 Wuzzy: I can confirm the behaviour, but dont think its a bug
01:24 est31 minetest is a game, not everything must be straightforward
01:24 Wuzzy ugh...
01:25 Wuzzy 270 uses is as much as a bronze axe...
01:25 Wuzzy all diamond tools are the best ones ... except diamond axe for ... reasons
01:25 Wuzzy so basically you can have the same durability as diamond axe if you just craft a bronze axe
01:26 Wuzzy i am very sure this is just a simple typo
01:26 est31 well, in many games I know the most upgraded thing is not better than the second most upgraded thing
01:26 est31 some tower defense games do this
01:27 Wuzzy diamond axe is WORSE than mese axe, making it a waste of diamonds mostly
01:27 est31 so, then experienced players dont craft it
01:27 est31 only noobs do
01:27 est31 diamond axe mines faster tough, right?
01:28 Wuzzy i hope so
01:28 Wuzzy if not i gonna explode
01:28 est31 well, I have no authority on mtgame issues, I'm only an engine dev
01:28 Wuzzy aha
01:28 est31 so my opinion is only a comment
01:28 Wuzzy btw i do not see any weblate update ...
01:29 Wuzzy afaik the tool quality in Minetest Game was wood>stone>steel>broze>mese>diamond
01:30 Wuzzy est31: so what happened to the translations?
01:30 est31 Wuzzy: https://github.com/minetes​t/minetest/commits/master
01:30 Wuzzy ummmmm
01:31 Wuzzy i actually meant weblate
01:31 Wuzzy the strings ON weblate.
01:31 Wuzzy or are they already up-to-date?
01:31 Wuzzy if not you probably just pulled tons of outdated strings :)
01:32 est31 Wuzzy: weblate should be updated as well
01:32 Wuzzy ah. cool
01:32 Wuzzy argh fuck
01:32 Wuzzy this means german translation is still not at 100%
01:33 Wuzzy cuz i thought you would update weblate strings, not pulling everything in
01:33 Wuzzy anyway
01:33 Wuzzy do you know what "to instrument" or "instrumentation" means? these words are used in the advanced settings for the profiler
01:34 Wuzzy example string excerpt: “Have the profiler instrument itself:”
01:34 est31 dont know a german word for it
01:34 Wuzzy i did not ask for a translation
01:35 Wuzzy just explain me what it means
01:35 est31 instrumentation is a method where you change the program so that it can be analyzed by the profiler
01:36 Wuzzy and when I "instrument" something, does this mean I ... well. .. overwrite code?
01:37 Wuzzy i have the feeling tht "instrumentation" is Minetest slang here and not the "normal" english meaning
01:37 Wuzzy and minetest slang is always hard to translate :(
01:38 Wuzzy oh
01:38 Wuzzy it seems i've just found a proper translation! yay
01:41 garywhite wood axe gave me 31 tree
01:48 garywhite Does anyone know if it would be possible to remove someone's ability to have creative on a creative server?
01:49 Wuzzy no
01:49 Wuzzy this is off topic
01:49 garywhite didn't know if it may relate to core
01:51 garywhite sorry
01:52 Wuzzy ok what is “frustum”? example: “Joystick frustum sensitivity”
01:53 Wuzzy or “The sensitivity of the joystick axes for moving the ingame view frustum around.”
02:05 paramat the view frustrum is the pyramid-shaped volume of space that is seen by a player
02:05 garywhite diamond shovel = 820 dirt
02:05 garywhite testing mese shovel now
02:05 Wuzzy garywhite: o_O
02:05 Wuzzy i expected 821 dirt cuz of bug
02:06 Wuzzy are you seriously counting? loool
02:06 Wuzzy oh its pyramid shaped. good to know
02:06 garywhite I have it in survival, & just dug away. Then calculator to use 8 stacks + 28 extra
02:07 Wuzzy weird
02:08 Wuzzy est31: mt fails to build lol. msgfmt stops at locale "sw"
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02:09 * est31 looks
02:09 paramat well, rectangular pyramid
02:09 paramat 'view direction' is probably a fine alternative
02:10 Wuzzy I think the string “Joystick frustum sensitivity” is pretty confusing then
02:10 garywhite & 542 with mese
02:10 Wuzzy 542?????
02:10 Wuzzy wow
02:10 Wuzzy now things are getting weird
02:10 garywhite Yup, is that another bug?
02:10 Wuzzy this is 2 more than i expected
02:11 garywhite Can someone please verify how many it digs? I'd rather have a second opinion to confirm
02:11 octacian The joystick controls really need to be reworked.
02:11 octacian garywhite: what problem are you having?
02:11 Wuzzy results so far: wood axe off by 1. mese shovel off by 2. diamond shovel OK.
02:12 garywhite nothing octacian
02:12 Wuzzy octacian: none, garywhite is just testing all the tools by counting how many they dig
02:12 garywhite Wuzzy found an issue with the axes, so I tested the same shovels
02:12 octacian ohk
02:13 est31 octacian: they need formspec support
02:13 est31 octacian: any wishes for joysticks?
02:15 Wuzzy hmmm i think the easy fix would be to allow to move cursor around with axes or D-Pad while in formspec mode
02:15 Wuzzy old SNES games did this trick
02:15 garywhite I don't think a mese shovel digging 2 more than it's supposed to is something that should be put up as an issue, should it?
02:15 Wuzzy to fake a mouse cursor
02:15 octacian aside from needing formspec support, It's pretty messed up. Moving is all normal, but looking from side-to-side should be done by rotating the stick itself, as with most flight simulators. Using the throttle for looking around, is just weird. I think it should instead control speed, full = sprint, mid = normal, and nothing = sneak. Just some basic opinions.
02:15 Wuzzy garywhite: it is an issue because it violates the formula in lua_api.txt
02:16 Wuzzy but it is an engine issue which I already posteed today
02:16 Wuzzy for minetest game it is not an issue cuz the difference does ofc not matter
02:16 octacian I think that the mouse cursor should be controlled by the main stick, as with moving. The trigger would be a left-click, while the larger button on the top of the stick should be right click.
02:17 Wuzzy octacian: agreed
02:17 garywhite Wuzzy: Should I add onto #4900?
02:17 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/4900 -- Number of tool uses is off by 1
02:17 Wuzzy garywhite: YES
02:17 Wuzzy please
02:17 garywhite ok
02:17 Wuzzy the more data, the better
02:18 Wuzzy especially the off-by-2 thing is interesting
02:18 Wuzzy and the fact that the diamond shovel is NOT off
02:18 octacian ..and the mini "joystick" at the top, would control the selected item. Up/down would open/close inventory. Just an idea again.
02:28 garywhite ok, comment made to #4900
02:28 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/4900 -- Number of tool uses is off by 1
02:29 est31 Wuzzy: I cant reproduce
02:29 est31 Wuzzy: builds fine for me
02:49 Wuzzy est31: ok maybe it was just me
02:49 est31 can you try again?
02:49 Wuzzy est31: sorry, it seems weblate strings *are* outdated
02:49 est31 and which part fails, make or cmake
02:49 est31 plus, can you upload the error to a pastebin
02:49 est31 Wuzzy: proof?
02:50 Wuzzy in the main menu some settings strings are english only with no weblate equivalent
02:50 est31 ok
02:50 Wuzzy "Fog Start"
02:50 est31 yeah it was recently added
02:50 Wuzzy Client → Graphics → Game → Advanced → Fog Start (lowest entry)
02:51 Wuzzy and a couple of other settings strings
02:51 Wuzzy i hope feature freeze == string freeze :)
02:52 Wuzzy est31: cmake is OK, make fails
02:53 Wuzzy est31: I get this in my console:
02:53 Wuzzy http://lpaste.net/raw/349909
02:53 Wuzzy mstfmt is bitching around
02:53 est31 mhhh
02:53 Wuzzy msgfmt*
02:53 est31 that shouldnt happen indeed
02:54 Wuzzy my gettext versoin = 0.19.8.1
02:54 Wuzzy est31: note: i will not stick around much longer here
02:55 est31 no problem
02:55 est31 Wuzzy: you gave me enough, thanks
02:56 Wuzzy happy bug hunting! cya
02:56 est31 cya
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02:57 garywhite cya Wuzzy
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04:45 est31 https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/4904
05:03 paramat hi hmmmm please could you have a look at milestones #4847 and #4888 ? thought you might have some useful insight
05:03 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/4847 -- Fix unnecessary block loading and duplicating objects by juhdanad
05:03 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/4888 -- Handle multiple deserialization of a block's entities by Rogier-5
05:06 paramat especially 4847 as that is mapgen related
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05:29 garywhite paramat: Are you a core dev?
05:29 paramat yeah, but only because i'm good at mapgen ;]
05:30 garywhite ok, cause someone needs to take a look at #4900
05:30 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/4900 -- Number of tool uses is off by 1
05:35 paramat not a priority for me and not a critical bug
05:36 paramat i'm not sure i agree with nerz adding it to milestones
05:41 paramat in fact i'll remove it, it's not worth dev time at the moment
05:41 paramat uses being very slightly approximate is minor
05:48 paramat the 0.4.16 milestone seems useless too
05:53 garywhite What about no milestone and a minor classification (That way it isn't listed as a pressing issue, but that way it's still on the development radar for whenever someone wants to try to fix it
05:55 paramat 'bug' label does that
05:56 paramat #4682 is possibly worth considering
05:56 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/4682 -- Fix water flooding onto lava by juhdanad
05:57 paramat but then, it's big changes to lighting, potentially dangerous
05:57 garywhite It would need extensive testing
06:06 paramat est31 can #4872 be merged now?
06:06 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/4872 -- Update Android build tools to latest version by rubenwardy
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06:23 paramat will merge #4899 in a moment
06:23 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/4899 -- Cavegen: Wider tunnels in mgflat, mgfractal, mgvalleys by paramat
06:25 sofar game#1457
06:25 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest​/minetest_game/issues/1457 -- Furnace: Erase src_time if no more items left in src. by sofar
06:30 paramat merging
06:34 paramat merged
06:35 paramat thanks for that
06:35 sofar It was good to go over the code again in depth
06:45 paramat +1
06:50 paramat 1 week to release
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09:46 nrzkt est31: travis seems to be red due to translations
09:46 nrzkt on a non related PR: /home/travis/build/minetest/mi​netest/po/sw/minetest.po:295: `msgid' and `msgstr' entries do not both begin with '\n'
09:47 nrzkt i think you should do a PR to ensure you will not break other PR for updating translations, please
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12:55 Fixer est31: had compile error probably due to this: http://pastebin.com/raw/zCKDFQvD
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12:59 Fixer oh, it is already reported, nice
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17:48 est31 Fixer: can you try again?
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18:05 Fixer est31: yes
18:11 sofar Fixer: lol, it would be nice if you could LANG=en_US.utf-8 before reporting compile errors ;)
18:12 sofar I'm sure google translate butchers "спроба виконання рецепта для мети"
18:12 Fixer it should be obvious to people who use make and gcc
18:12 Fixer sofar: and it was already reported, so nevermind
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18:13 sofar well, it's a gettext/msgfmt error, so it's not even a gcc error
18:25 Fixer est31: successfuly compiled without msgfmt errors
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18:37 garywhite idk if this is for here or for #minetest (& if this is the wrong channel, I apologize in advance) but, if MT is on Google Play, why doesn't someone post it to the Amazon Appstore? That opens up a new market for Amazon Kindle Fire devices. i.e. for me the only way to use it on my Fire HD tablet is sideload with the APK from the website
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18:41 sofar guys, is there a way to create a new world from the commandline?
18:42 sfan5 ./bin/minetest --server --worldname "new_world" might work
18:42 sofar Thread 1 "minetest" received signal SIGFPE, Arithmetic exception.
18:42 sofar 0x000000000087e272 in PcgRandom::range (bound=0, this=0x7fffffffc290)
18:42 sofar crud!
18:43 sfan5 oh there's an issue for that already
18:43 sofar sfan5: no, doesn't work
18:43 sfan5 however that bug vanished on my machine
18:43 sofar this is 0.4.14
18:43 sofar let's try master
18:44 sofar hmm still there
18:44 sfan5 cool
18:44 sfan5 mod security is still broken
18:44 ReadySetWait I get SIGFPE (floating point exception) when running unit tests...it happens right after the testPcgRandom test
18:45 ReadySetWait 0.4.14-dev-c67f2b2-dirty
18:46 sfan5 oh gettext is also broken ,can't rebuild
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18:53 est31 Fixer:  thanks for testing!
18:54 sfan5 est31: i'll merge #4904 in 10 mins
18:54 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/4904 -- Try to fix build with gettext enabled by est31
18:54 sfan5 and it also fixed the compile errors here
18:54 est31 sfan5: its fixed
18:54 est31 merged*
18:54 sfan5 wait you alre...
18:54 sfan5 oh
18:54 sfan5 *pulls again*
18:55 sfan5 also it seems that we can't leave mod security enabled at release #4909
18:55 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/4909 -- Mod security: Still broken with different --world
18:55 sfan5 it is broken with many "non-standard" configuration
18:57 est31 well shrug its only about defaults
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18:58 sfan5 what do you mean?
18:59 sfan5 also it's still breaking the perfectly valid use case of reading files at runtime
19:00 est31 I'm okay with both disabling it and keeping it enabled
19:05 sfan5 ah
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20:01 sfan5 est31: btw pcgrandom doesn't crash here
20:01 sfan5 my cxxflags are different from the default config though ("-march=native -O3")
20:03 sfan5 oh and i use clang
20:09 sfan5 huh
20:09 sfan5 with this debug build some threading test crashes
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20:27 sfan5 oh well that's caused by c++11 threads
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20:41 sfan5 ugh
20:41 sfan5 hard to solve without an additional mutex
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21:16 tenplus1 any forum devs in here tonight ???
21:25 celeron55 what's a forum dev?
21:25 tenplus1 someone who handled minetest forums
21:25 tenplus1 anyone with DA POWER to change it
21:29 tenplus1 we have a user on forum who simple forked a mod that was just uploaded and changed a few models without even mentioning the original author, was wondering if it was against forum rules and could be removed
21:30 Shara It's not even really a fork. He reuploaded the whole thing on github under a different mod name.
21:30 sofar does the mod code use the proper attribution?
21:30 sofar is there a license violation?
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21:40 tenplus1 I suppose the only violation is not stating original author in mod itself
21:40 tenplus1 but it's definitely a dick move: http://lolsnaps.com/upload_​pic/d6794448-treenagers.png
21:44 tenplus1 judge for yourselves: https://forum.minetest.net/v​iewtopic.php?f=9&t=16040
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21:47 garywhite Yeah, this is a blatant copy of the other_worlds mod (Didn't you write that one Shara?)
21:47 Shara garywhite, yes.
21:47 Shara I refused his request to switch models because... quite honestly, they look like what Ten says in the thread.
21:48 Shara Totally inappropriate.
21:48 garywhite &  IIRC, not mentioning the original creator is a violation of the Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike license. Moving conversation to #minetest to avoid any issues
21:49 Shara Well, I have nothing further to say on it really. If this is what I get for posting mods in the forums for people, it doesn't really inspire me to post more.
21:50 garywhite That's just a guy that won't read the license for a mod before making changes
21:50 Shara I would like an answer to Ten's question though.
21:51 garywhite what was his question again?
21:51 Shara It wasn't really a question about licenses, but rather about what is considered acceptable on the MT forurms.
21:51 Shara forums*
21:52 garywhite paramat is a forum moderator, I'll shoot it his way when he comes on later
21:53 sofar the forum rules for WIP mods are fairly relaxed
21:53 sofar the mods take action against license violations
21:53 sofar but not against dick moves
21:54 garywhite I'll read through the CC-BY-SA license and the repository, but not mentioning the creator, I believe is a violation of the license. Shara what is your mod's license?
21:55 sofar he's not required to post attribution in the forum
21:55 Shara I have asked for it to be moved out of WIP mods
21:55 sofar he's not misrepresenting the authorship either, as far as I can see
21:56 sofar sorry, it's a dick move but I don't see him fail to attribute in the source code, or misrepresent the origin, or violate licenses.
21:57 Shara I feel I should in the absolute least be mentioned by name in the post.
21:57 sofar "This is a fork of other_worlds." quote (with link)
21:57 Shara paramat and tenplus1 are mentioned by name (using words I wrote myself, as though he is the one speaking them)
21:58 Shara I'm not mentioned, even though it's my mod.
21:58 garywhite Read license.txt on the repository
21:58 sfan5 i don't see a problem anywhere
21:59 Shara I don't think he changed it, other than to kick out Electra's work.
21:59 sofar I see no license violation. Your name is listed and attributed properly too, Shara
21:59 sofar (as an aside, this is exactly why I forbid forks in /minetest-mods/)
22:01 Shara I haven't disputed whether there's a license issue, just to be clear.
22:02 sfan5 well where's the problem then?
22:02 Shara It is, as sofar has concluded, a dick move. I guess I am just surprised the forum allows another person's words to be used like that, as though they were his own.
22:03 garywhite What she's saying is someone plagarized her post
22:03 sofar afaik forum posts are public domain
22:04 sofar I certainly would frown at anyone calling plagiarism over a forum post, sorry
22:04 Shara garywhite, even I wouldn't really agree with you there.
22:04 sfan5 ....but where is the problem?
22:04 garywhite ok, sorry. I may have misread the issue
22:05 * garywhite disappears quietly
22:05 Shara sfan5: It's a dick move, end of. Ten wanted to query  whether it was all within the rules, and left before getting an answer, so I asked for the answer.
22:06 sofar I'm perfectly ok with you replying back on the forum and calling him out on it, btw
22:06 Shara I did
22:06 sofar I know
22:06 sfan5 did he edit his post in the meantime?
22:06 sofar not that I can see
22:06 Shara yes he did
22:07 sofar ah
22:07 Shara He's removed the text cerditing Ten and paramat
22:07 sfan5 he's not required to keep that
22:07 sofar if only I was a forum mod
22:07 sfan5 and in the case of forking a mod copying description or something from another post seems legitimate to me
22:07 garywhite You're not sofar, but paramat is ik
22:08 garywhite oh wait...nvm
22:08 sofar I've offered to help out, but the existing admins apparently don't hear my requests
22:08 Shara Well, it looks like there is nothing to be done within the rules anyway.
22:08 Shara sfan5: I am actually glad he removed the text.
22:08 sfan5 what would you want a forum mod to do anyway?
22:09 Fixer added new bug for carts people: https://github.com/minetest​/minetest_game/issues/1458
22:09 rom1504 he would mod
22:09 sfan5 rom1504: thank you for your worthwhile contribution to this discussion
22:09 sofar sfan5: look at the history of the post
22:10 sofar :)
22:10 Shara sfan5: sorry, but this feels a bit beside the point. All I did was request an answer to Ten's query.
22:10 sfan5 Shara: well the answer is: it's not a rule violation
22:10 Shara I got that already.
22:10 Shara I haven't asked for anything to be done
22:10 sfan5 sofar: there's no history for posts
22:11 sfan5 not you but other people seem to expect something to be done
22:12 Shara I know where I stand, and that's all I need. Sure, I think pithy should not have posted, but I don't expect action outside the scope of the rules.
22:15 rom1504 sfan5: :D
22:32 Fixer sofar: i rereported bugs properly and now we have two reports, one has fix, another needs fix
22:35 Sokomine joined #minetest-dev
22:41 Fixer new bug report for extracooking bug: https://github.com/minetest​/minetest_game/issues/1459
22:42 troller joined #minetest-dev
22:50 sofar Fixer: tyty :)
23:13 kaeza joined #minetest-dev
23:20 sofar Fixer: alright, try game#1457 now
23:20 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest​/minetest_game/issues/1457 -- Furnace: Erase src_time if no more items left in src. by sofar
23:21 Fixer ok
23:22 Tmanyo joined #minetest-dev
23:27 Fixer sofar: damn, long cook bug is more complex
23:27 Fixer sofar: it is fixed when sand cooking is done and you approach it -> furnace shutdowns
23:27 Fixer buuut
23:27 Fixer here is bad part
23:28 sofar lol
23:28 Fixer sofar: there were 2-3 cacti remaining so I've put 30 sand in it and fly away - wait few minutes - come back, still cooks the sand... BUT, now this bug again, it still overcooks loots of sand :(
23:29 sofar I'm starting to regret this code
23:29 Fixer hah
23:29 Lunatrius joined #minetest-dev
23:31 Fixer sofar: wait
23:32 Fixer sofar: i will recheck cook time once more
23:33 Fixer rechecking
23:34 Fixer sofar: don't edit anything, i was wrong, just need to recheck once more
23:34 Fixer sofar: your fix should be good, hold on
23:36 Fixer still suspicious, checking :(
23:37 sofar I appreciate your thoroughness
23:37 sofar but I'm not liking the code as is anyway :(
23:38 Fixer sofar: It is overcooking :(
23:39 sofar meh
23:39 sofar I feel like reverting the whole damn patch
23:42 Fixer sofar: i've measured, normally 1 cactus cooks about 5 sand, but here 1 afked away for 1minute and flame from last cactus smelted much more than 10-20, after end of this long cook next cook time was proper
23:43 Fixer sofar: so your patch fixed only part when it is out of sand to cook, but not if it still cooks the sand
23:43 sofar the algorithm does something weird, which I don't lile
23:43 sofar like*
23:43 sofar and so it makes it hard to understand, but it also has some consequences
23:44 sofar including, these bugs
23:46 Fixer sofar: i will upload the gif to show you
23:46 sofar the problem is the fuel_totaltime variable
23:50 Fixer sofar: demo https://imgur.com/a/ZY3wM

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