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IRC log for #minetest-dev, 2014-09-30

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Time Nick Message
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02:10 jordan4ibanez !tell
02:10 jordan4ibanez !hel
02:10 jordan4ibanez !help
02:10 jordan4ibanez Oh wrong channel...
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02:17 VanessaE RealBadAngel: caching cracks meshes?
02:17 VanessaE how many meshes in total are we talking about here?
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09:11 rubenwardy celeron55, broken: http://www.minetest.net/donate
09:18 celeron55_ lol how is that even possible
09:19 rubenwardy I think custom HTML was disabled
09:19 rubenwardy So it displays as plaintext
09:19 celeron55_ yes but how did it get disabled, i haven't done that
09:19 rubenwardy Neutrinos?
09:20 celeron55_ i'm looking at the dokuwiki template that is there, and it specifically has the line if ($ID == 'donate') {$conf['htmlok'] = true;}
09:20 celeron55_ this makes zero sense
09:24 rubenwardy Weird things happen: int doom[1]; for(int x = 0; true; x++) { doom[x] = NULL; }
09:24 rubenwardy x goes 1, 2, 3 and then loops. o_O
09:24 celeron55_ eh what
09:25 celeron55_ i re-saved the page with a whitespace modification
09:25 celeron55_ now it works
09:25 rubenwardy Well done
09:25 celeron55_ i won't even try to guess what has happened
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11:42 Zeno` ok, fixed the broken inventory
11:42 Zeno` well the part that annoyed me anyway
11:42 Zeno` I don't know if the rest is intended behaviour or not
11:42 Zeno` and "annoy" == "clearly broken"
11:52 Zeno` https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/1704
11:53 Zeno` maybe reverting f6321e2 is the best option :(
11:53 Zeno` it seems the PR is totally broken
11:54 Zeno` Mine doesn't fix it either (only fixes it for the craft grid)
12:03 Zeno` kahrl
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12:11 Zeno` anyway this bug is a blocker
12:11 Zeno` it's completely broken and I don't have time to fix a bug introduced to fix a non-existent problem :(
12:12 Zeno` plus I cannot understand the new logic, heh
12:29 kahrl I can't reproduce the problem
12:29 kahrl Zeno`: ^
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12:30 Zeno` you can't?
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12:30 Zeno` place a stack of 99 things in the craft grid
12:30 Zeno` now divide it into two
12:31 Zeno` using RMB
12:31 kahrl works fine
12:31 Amaz So right click the stack, and then click elsewhere?
12:31 Zeno` no, don't click elsewhere just hover over an empty slot
12:31 Zeno` and don't release the RMB
12:31 kahrl well, release the RMB then?
12:31 Zeno` no
12:32 Zeno` just right click on a stack, move mouse over empty slots
12:32 Zeno` without releasing
12:32 kahrl dropping items when RMB is held is intended
12:33 Amaz But what need is there to hold the RMB down?
12:33 Zeno` well it never worked that way before and it's now impossible to craft, say, a locked chest
12:33 Zeno` it's not impossible just very, very annoying
12:33 kahrl I would say it's easier now
12:33 Amaz
12:33 Zeno` no it's not because say you move over the steel ingots in the middle
12:33 Zeno` you pick them up!
12:34 kahrl ok, I don't do that but I agree that part is annoying
12:34 Zeno` they should stay in the middle not be replaced by 1 wood
12:35 kahrl for now you could place the wood first and then the steel
12:35 Zeno` halving is annoying as well for that same reason (when there is only 1 spare slot in the grid)
12:35 Zeno` it should not place "one" item automatically
12:35 Zeno` just because you move the mouse
12:35 kahrl it doesn't, just don't hold the RMB down
12:36 Zeno` most players do not play like that
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12:36 Zeno` they hold down RMB, drag to where they want the half and then release
12:36 kahrl have you done a study?
12:37 Zeno` how can moving an item in the grid (to your hand, and swapping it with what's in your hand) be user friendly?
12:38 Zeno` just because you happen to move the mouse over that item as you're transferring half a stack from the bottom right to the top left?
12:39 Zeno` that's like right-clicking and dragging a folder to a new window (in Windows) but if your mouse happens to cross another window it automatically drops into the non-destination
12:39 Zeno` I don't need to do a study to work out that that's silly :)
12:40 Zeno` I don't expect moving the mouse to drop breadcrumbs in all the windows it happens to cross as I move the cursor
12:40 kahrl I agree f6321e2 is not optimal but reverting it doesn't make things better
12:40 Zeno` it makes things work
12:41 Zeno` anyway, if you like then release it... I can guarantee 100% that you will get many reports of it being broken but *shrug*
12:41 Zeno` at least then you'll believe me ;)
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12:44 Zeno` put more than one item type in the grid
12:44 Zeno` and try and half another item as you move the mouse across the extra item
12:44 Zeno` halve*
12:45 Zeno` it's an exercise in frustration
12:46 Zeno` you have to carefully make sure the mouse pointer does not cross the item that's different to the one in your hand
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12:47 kahrl or just release the RMB :P
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12:52 Zeno` no that doesn't work
12:52 Zeno` *sigh*
12:53 kahrl hm? it does for me
12:53 Zeno` honestly, people do not expect things to happen without them somehow initiating that action
12:54 Zeno` when you copy a file using drag and drop do you press the RMB, release, move mouse and... ??
12:54 Zeno` and then what to place?
12:55 kahrl minetest is not a file manager
12:55 Zeno` never said it was
12:55 Zeno` but people have expectations on how things work
12:56 Zeno` this new behaviour is baffling because I have *never* seen anything similar
12:57 Zeno` I can't even think of a metaphor
12:57 Zeno` you pick up something to move, you hold it
12:57 Zeno` and then release when it's there
12:58 Zeno` that's logical
12:58 Zeno` you don't pick up something, move, and expect it to fall out of your hands
12:58 Zeno` before you reach where you want to put it
12:59 Zeno` even worse the object falls out of your hands and suddenly you pick up what it fell onto
13:16 Zeno` isn't the game supposed to be for the players?
13:40 kaeza any news on weblate/whatever?
13:45 Zeno` WHOA!
13:45 Zeno` Hold the horses!
13:45 Zeno` https://github.com/minetest/mine​test/blob/master/src/debug.h#L75
13:45 Zeno` that does that mean?
13:46 Zeno` I just checked Leveldb and they use assert() correctly
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13:55 VanessaE OH nonononono
13:56 VanessaE that is NOT gonna work
13:56 VanessaE kahrl: you must revert that shit NOW
13:56 VanessaE (or some other dev)
13:57 VanessaE I just fetched and built latest just to see what's going on here.
13:57 VanessaE right click, hold and drag to move half a stack, the intent of that action is to drop that half at its destination when you release the button.  the patch that was committed does NOT work as intended and causes a severe playability regression
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13:58 VanessaE and it's not just the crafting grid, it leaves a trail of single items in every inventory slot it crosses.
14:01 VanessaE well whether that was the intent or not it's a huge playability problem
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14:01 VanessaE no one, and I mean NO ONE expects click-and-drag to do anything but drag-and-drop, and we even use that in the creative inventory.
14:01 VanessaE this is inconsistent and broken in every way that matters to the average user.
14:01 VanessaE revert it or fix it.
14:05 DusXMT I think dragging out a half is neat, but not that it leaves items in the grid it crosses, it's a unique approach
14:06 PenguinDad Am I the only one who's got no problem with this?
14:06 kaeza MC does leave a trail, but only if you right click on a slot *after* grabbing a stack
14:06 kaeza (right click and drag)
14:07 kaeza maybe that's what the patch intended to do?
14:08 DusXMT Or maybe I'm not understanding this (that's quite possible, as for example, it took me a good 10 minutes to realize RMB is the right mouse button)
14:08 VanessaE PenguinDad: right click and drag a stack and move it around over your inventory
14:08 VanessaE just move it randomly
14:08 VanessaE you will suddenly have your inventory totally randomized and G*d only knows what will be in your hand after the move
14:10 kaeza http://youtu.be/quFMqmHJl2o?t=4m30s
14:11 VanessaE kaeza: right, and that doesn't work here
14:11 VanessaE not even close, and I even tried doing exactly that
14:11 VanessaE stacks don't re-combine with this patch
14:11 PenguinDad VanessaE: I never move stacks while holding LMB or RMB
14:11 VanessaE they just swap
14:11 VanessaE PenguinDad: this is a new "feature" that is horribly busted.
14:14 VanessaE ShadowNinja: *poke*  you committed this
14:18 kaeza comments? https://github.com/kaeza/minetest/commit/​7b0a31ce2134cdc01b1b57423eafabedc50bb811
14:18 kaeza needed since builtin was reorganized into subdirectories, so builtin/*.lua does not suffice anymore
14:19 kaeza it seems updatepo.sh was not run in a looooong time
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15:12 zat wat
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16:03 zat someone knows how to change vm->m_data[vi].getContent() != c_place_on so groups are also taken in consideration?
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16:11 hmmmm you want to know how to tell if a node is in a certain group or not?
16:11 hmmmm from within the core
16:13 zat hmmmm: right
16:14 zat so I can specify groups for decorations place_on.
16:15 hmmmm oh, you're modifying decorations... it would be nice if you made a specific option to check for a group or a certain node
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16:15 hmmmm checking for presence in a node group is a much more expensive operation
16:17 zat hmmmm: I dont want to have to register many decorations for biomes with different surfaces
16:18 hmmmm check out INodeDefManager::getIds()
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16:32 zat hmmmm: you are in charge of v7 or mapgens in general?
16:32 hmmmm anything that has to do with map generation
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16:48 zat hmmmm: okay I did it
16:49 zat now groups are taken in consideration
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16:53 zat hmmmm: what do you think, is this change commitable?
16:54 hmmmm i don't know unless i see the change
16:55 zat I'll find how to get a patch file
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17:12 ShadowNinja kaeza: Have you tested your patch and made sure the other projects in src (eg, SQLite3) don't mess it up?
17:13 VanessaE ShadowNinja: please see the above ...discussion about the right-click-drag commit ...
17:14 ShadowNinja VanessaE: Seen, doesn't seem like a bug to me.  Having a seperate rightclick action necessary to activate that could be done though.
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17:14 VanessaE ShadowNinja: try it out yourself
17:14 VanessaE it's busted.  bad.
17:15 kaeza ShadowNinja, it doesn't, but for some reason it's dropping some texts
17:15 ShadowNinja VanessaE: Seems to work fine for me.
17:16 VanessaE it doesn't.
17:16 VanessaE pick up half a stack but hold the button.
17:16 VanessaE drag.
17:16 ShadowNinja I think that you usually don't want to swap stacks with that though, so that could also be changed.
17:16 VanessaE watch it leave a trail everywhere and randomly swap with what's in your pointer as you drag
17:16 VanessaE this is BAD.
17:16 VanessaE this WILL generate complaints.
17:17 kaeza eh scratch that; the texts were disabled before
17:17 ShadowNinja VanessaE: I don't have a problem with that, but I'll agree to the two above changes.
17:17 VanessaE ok.
17:18 kaeza ShadowNinja, results of run are here: https://github.com/kaeza/minetest/commit/​19f27f41bbd69c341627a76042229318e54e4d86
17:18 ShadowNinja kaeza: So, all good?
17:19 kaeza (that is, if you care to review a 25K lines patch)
17:20 ShadowNinja kaeza: Eh, I'll trust you on whether or not it works.
17:21 kahrl ShadowNinja: we should merge (or reject) the remaining translation pull requests first
17:22 ShadowNinja kahrl: The updatepo.sh change can be merged before or after, actually running it will have to be later though.
17:22 kahrl yeah, the 25K figure made me think the patch did both
17:22 ShadowNinja kaeza: All good and ready to merge (just the updatepo.sh change)?
17:22 kaeza yep
17:23 ShadowNinja kahrl: He linked the updatepo.sh commit seperately.
17:23 kahrl ah, ok
17:23 ShadowNinja (A long time ago, it's https://github.com/kaeza/minetest/commit/​7b0a31ce2134cdc01b1b57423eafabedc50bb811 )
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17:27 kahrl kaeza: re: weblate, I managed to set it up on my test machine, but it still has some issues
17:27 kahrl http://dev.minetest.net/Installing_Weblate is what I did
17:27 kahrl it hasn't been put into production yet
17:28 kahrl actually, I think weblate 2.0 might come out soon(TM) so we might wait for that
17:29 ShadowNinja kahrl: Does https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/1598 look O.K.?  That's the only one that does more than update a translation file.
17:30 ShadowNinja kahrl: Also check the other pulls at https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pulls?q=i​s%3Aopen+is%3Apr+label%3A%22%40+Translation%22 -- They all look good, but I don't know any of those languages.
17:30 kahrl 2d7a78eb56 should be skipped
17:30 ShadowNinja kaeza: Merged your patch, BTW.
17:30 kahrl (that's a commit in #1598)
17:31 ShadowNinja kahrl: If the rest good?
17:32 kahrl looking
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17:39 kahrl I don't really like passing gettext()-ed format strings to (sn)printf
17:39 kahrl it seems like a security issue waiting to happen
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17:40 kahrl I don't if there's an easy better way though
17:40 kahrl don't know*
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17:44 kahrl the rest seems fine
17:44 kaeza kahrl, ah ok, good to know
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18:27 zat hmmmm: for the beginning of DecoSimple::generate http://pastebin.com/bEDjjrrY
18:27 zat I hope I didn't mess up with the CONTENT_IGNORE part
18:29 zat ok I actually messed it up... when place_on is a group, c_place_on is CONTENT_IGNORE
18:31 hmmmm sure, great stuff, but I hope that bit of code is compartmentalized for only the case where place_on is a group
18:36 zat it actually works for both cases
18:36 zat would it be better if I made it work the old way if its not for a group?
18:37 zat it would be more efficient I think
18:42 zat hmmmm: http://pastebin.com/6K2KdvNB
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18:56 hmmmm hrmm
18:56 hmmmm zat, while that is good code, and what I asked for, I just thought of a better way to do this
18:57 hmmmm perhaps there should be a c_place_on vector
18:58 hmmmm see the thing about it is, performance matters a lot here because this loop is happening thousands of times per call, and there are hundreds of calls per second
18:58 zat hmmmm: that wauld me much better yes lolololol
18:58 hmmmm but
18:58 hmmmm correct me if I'm wrong
18:58 zat yes, I always prefer comparing integers too
18:58 hmmmm place_on is currently a string, right?
18:58 hmmmm err rather, expected to be a string when read from Lua
18:59 hmmmm if it's read in as a table, or there's a group, then it becomes a vector
18:59 zat place_on_name in a string
18:59 hmmmm yeah
18:59 zat c_place_on is the id
18:59 zat in... is*
19:00 hmmmm so I'm thinking of something like this:
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19:02 hmmmm place_on = ["group:soil", "default:water", "default:stone"]
19:02 hmmmm just as an example
19:02 hmmmm err... that's Python...  s/[/{/
19:03 hmmmm so then the place_on vector would contain all the IDs of soil, water, and stone
19:03 hmmmm or if it's just
19:03 hmmmm place_on = "group:soil", then it'll be a vector as well
19:03 hmmmm yeah, okay, for simplicity's sake I guess you'll have to use a vector every single time
19:04 hmmmm although you never really know what will be more beneficial without profiling it
19:06 zat I doubt there would be even a noticeable difference
19:06 hmmmm of course there won't be a "noticable" difference, but most things aren't noticable until they're scaled up which is when it starts to hurt
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19:08 zat hmmmm: your idea is good, but... honestly....
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19:08 zat no idea where to start lol
19:09 hmmmm ModApiMapgen::l_register_decoration
19:09 hmmmm see deco->place_on_name?
19:09 hmmmm well first of all std::string place_on_name should turn into std::vector<std::string> place_on_names
19:10 hmmmm lua_getfield(L, index, "place_on");
19:10 hmmmm if (lua_isstring(L, -1)) {
19:10 hmmmm std::string name = getstringfield(L, index, "place_on");
19:11 hmmmm if (name.substr(0, 6) == "group:") {
19:11 hmmmm ndef->getIds(name, result_vector);
19:11 hmmmm err
19:11 hmmmm ndef->getIds(name, deco->place_on_names);
19:11 zat im not getting it lol
19:11 hmmmm erm
19:11 zat are you busy?
19:12 hmmmm yes sorta
19:12 hmmmm I would just do it myself if I weren't
19:12 hmmmm oh shit
19:12 zat ¿¿
19:13 hmmmm you can't do ndef->getIds there, you need to just keep it into a place_on_names vector
19:13 hmmmm and then resolve them with getIds in resolveNodeNames
19:13 zat it shouldnt be like that
19:13 hmmmm if you can come up with a better way I'd love that
19:14 zat I mean, integer ids shoud be always retrieved at startup time (by my standards)
19:14 hmmmm consider the fact that node aliases don't take effect until after the registration phase entirely
19:14 hmmmm and that nodes may be defined after that file gets loaded and that line of code executed
19:16 hmmmm as a result of the problems this caused, whenever you go to register some sort of node to do something in the lua api, you store the string name of it.  if it's performance intensive, put the part where you translate it from a string to an integer id in a resolveNodeNames()-type function
19:16 iqualfragile_ idea: python api4minetest4life
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19:20 VanessaE ew.
19:31 zat hmmmm: a cache for that sounds fine
19:31 zat feed the cache as soon as new nodes are registered
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23:25 MinetestForFun Hi, my server runs on the lastest dev version of minetest, so only clients with 0.4.10-dev + version of minetest can connect to my server, is it possible to show a message when a client with the bad client version try to connect in my server, for explain to the player "he needs a more updated version of minetest" ? (i don't know if a variable of "minetest_version exist", and if my idea is possible)
23:26 MinetestForFun (my idea is a windows like the no_bad_names mod, but i need to check the client version of minetest)
23:27 kahrl MinetestForFun: you might want strict_protocol_version_checking = true in minetest.conf
23:28 kahrl (protocol versions are not exactly the same as minetest versions though)
23:29 MinetestForFun i've try the "strict_protocol_version_checking = true in minetest.conf", but it's not adequate, many clients in 0.4.10 can't connect to my server
23:30 kahrl the client version can't be checked with the mod api, not reliably at least
23:31 MinetestForFun ok, at least, i am sure... :/
23:32 MinetestForFun thank you for yours answers
23:32 MinetestForFun your answers*

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