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IRC log for #minetest-dev, 2014-09-17

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Time Nick Message
00:28 RealBadAngel hi hmmmm
00:28 hmmmm hello
00:28 RealBadAngel saw updated highlighting pull?
00:28 hmmmm yup
00:28 RealBadAngel and?
00:28 hmmmm great stuff
00:29 RealBadAngel any objections or suggestions?
00:30 hmmmm not really, here https://github.com/RealBadAngel/minetest/com​mit/876046e4040a91d610b117cd4704212510d1c260​#diff-c03ca828c6b8a7695f2cd7e52c316a3cR234 you forgot spaces on the left side of the operator
00:31 RealBadAngel ok, anything else?
00:31 hmmmm nope
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00:34 RealBadAngel ok
00:34 RealBadAngel kahrl, ShadowNinja how about you?
00:34 RealBadAngel celeron55 ?
00:39 jin_xi RealBadAngel: i made some progress but its still off https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OKxLbNR1Gao
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00:40 RealBadAngel jin_xi, you are still using wrong texture coordinates
00:40 VanessaE jin_xi: wait, keep that stage of the code!  you just invented weather :)
00:40 RealBadAngel thats why theyre moving with the camera
00:40 jin_xi its 'fixed' with the camera actually
00:40 VanessaE jin_xi: fork that off and use it later.  imagine if AIR was set to use that code
00:40 jin_xi the rest moves
00:41 VanessaE ok maybe not :P
00:42 RealBadAngel gl_TexCoord[0] = gl_MultiTexCoord0; and gl_Position = mWorldViewProj * gl_Vertex;
00:42 RealBadAngel that goes in vertex shader
00:42 jin_xi using gl_FragCoord just to get the pattern to show up atm
00:42 jin_xi ok ill try
00:43 RealBadAngel then gl_TexCoord[0].st are your mapped texture coordinates
00:43 RealBadAngel in fragment shader ofc
00:44 RealBadAngel see nodes shader for examples
00:44 jin_xi well, its no texture but generated by shader
00:44 RealBadAngel textures on the model
00:45 RealBadAngel use those coords to fill texels with your texture
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01:43 ShadowNinja RealBadAngel: If it looks like the video I saw earlier I think that the highlight box shouldn't be as big, it should be just slightly bigger than what it's selecting.  Also, if it's going to be colored the color should be configurable.  I haven't looked at the cod yet though.
01:44 RealBadAngel ShadowNinja, i strongly suggest trying it ingame
01:44 RealBadAngel color is up to texture
01:44 RealBadAngel mod or game can set it
01:44 VanessaE ShadowNinja: it works really well now, and the color cycles slowly and is very subtle now
01:45 VanessaE you just swap out halo.png to change it
01:46 ShadowNinja Building...
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02:19 RealBadAngel ShadowNinja, still building? ;)
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02:27 paramat hmmmm, "hmmmm I wonder if I should make voxel manipulators emerge the exact area specified rather than rounding out to whole blocks" i can't imagine a significant speed increase, any other advantages? i guess it would reduce overlapping voxelmanips
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02:38 RealBadAngel ok, ive made main menu music per game
02:39 RealBadAngel lets check how that disco will work in practice
02:40 VanessaE hah
02:41 paramat hmmmm, i just realised the mapblock shell around a chunk contains much more volume than the chunk itself. For some uses that do not require any volume outside the chunk it would be useful to limit the mapgen object voxelmanip to just the chunk itself
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02:53 paramat hmmmm, oh i just remembered the mapgen object vm is just an extension of the core mapgen vm so reducing it's volume might not speed up 'read form map' time, but perhaps it would speed up 'write to map' time?
02:57 hmmmm it wouldn't speed up or slow down anything
02:57 hmmmm it would just present the exact amount of data that the user requested
03:18 paramat okay in that case i'm feeling neutral about this
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03:51 VanessaE ''tell BlockMen http://paste.ubuntu.com/8362420/
03:51 HLuaBot I'll tell that to "BlockMen" next time I see them around.
03:57 TriBlade9 Hey people, how does one remove a source file from cmakelists for an ifdef?
03:59 TriBlade9 NVM, trying to ifdef the whole file
03:59 TriBlade9 *if
04:05 Zeno` https://github.com/Zeno-/minetest​/blob/refactor_main/src/main.cpp  <-- Should I make this a pull request?
04:05 VanessaE yes
04:06 Zeno` Squash first?
04:06 VanessaE 21 commits?  wow
04:06 VanessaE probably not yet
04:06 Zeno` well I use commits as backups :D
04:06 VanessaE easier to fiddle with stuff if you leave them separate.
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05:30 sfan5 hmmmm: about .mts: 1) you need to write the node list to file before you know it 2) you need to store all {node_id,probability,param1} data somewhere before writing them to file because they need to be put after eachother in the whole
05:31 hmmmm sfan5, perhaps you can maintain an external node list as you go along
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05:31 hmmmm keep an internal buffer rather
05:31 hmmmm then write the file after you're finished
05:31 sfan5 I'm doing that right now
05:31 hmmmm that's fine.
05:32 sfan5 the main issue is 2)
05:32 hmmmm are you saying you'd like the node list to come after the data?
05:33 sfan5 that would be a solution for 1)
05:33 hmmmm how does that not solve 2)
05:34 sfan5 you can't write them node by node
05:34 sfan5 s/them/the data/
05:34 TriBlade9 Guys, how does one remove a source from compiling when a compile flag is off?
05:35 TriBlade9 I tried and ifdef, but that totally failed
05:35 hmmmm what?  sure you can, you can randomly access a file
05:35 sfan5 you can't randomly access soemthing that goes through zlib
05:36 sfan5 TriBlade9: what exactly did you try?
05:36 sfan5 (pastebin the code or smth.)
05:36 hmmmm ahh zlib
05:36 hmmmm forgot about that
05:37 hmmmm yeah, that is true, oh well
05:38 TriBlade9 I've tried #if USE_FREETYPE to disable the whole file
05:39 sfan5 did you include config.h before that
05:39 * sfan5 away for unspecified period of time
05:39 hmmmm TriBlade9, perhaps you want to include -DUSE_FREETYPE=0 in the command line to cmake
05:39 TriBlade9 I have
05:39 TriBlade9 The problem is with the colored chat commit
05:40 TriBlade9 I need to keep StaticText.cpp from compiling when freetype is disabled
05:40 TriBlade9 And I need game.cpp to skip the lines that relate to it.
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05:40 hmmmm hrmmm
05:40 hmmmm shouldn't you create an issue about this?
05:41 TriBlade9 Why?
05:41 TriBlade9 I'm the one developing this PR?
05:41 TriBlade9 Lemme get a paste
05:41 hmmmm well yeah, it's a problem that nobody else noticed first
05:41 hmmmm i'd say it's a bug if disabling freetype doesn't actually disable freetype
05:41 TriBlade9 ...
05:41 TriBlade9 That's not the bug
05:42 TriBlade9 http://paste.ubuntu.com/8362927/
05:43 hmmmm maybe I misunderstood what you were saying
05:43 TriBlade9 Maybe I said it in a way that was hard to understand x] (Common problem of mine)
05:44 hmmmm why do you need to keep statictext.cpp from compiling when freetype is disabled?
05:44 TriBlade9 Anyways, StaticText.cpp is compiling
05:44 TriBlade9 Because it relies soley on Freetype being there. If it is not, then the compilation fails
05:45 hmmmm is StaticText.cpp part of irrlicht or something??
05:45 TriBlade9 No, It's a file added in the colored_chat PR
05:45 TriBlade9 I need to give it a better name :P
05:45 ibloat sfan5, for the MCEdit filter, did you consider just streaming the two compression streams (outdata1 and outdata2) to disk instead of keeping them in memory?
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05:48 Zeno` it looks like it's from irrlicht though
05:48 Zeno` judging by the header
05:49 kahrl TriBlade9: why not make it work with bitmap fonts?
05:49 TriBlade9 It's modified from it Zeno
05:50 kahrl small-scale #ifdefs are typically better than large-scale #ifdefs
05:50 TriBlade9 kahrl, my C++ skills are terrible
05:50 TriBlade9 I haven't used C++ for eight years, and have lost most of what I once new
05:50 TriBlade9 *knew
05:50 TriBlade9 Right now I just want to get it to compile with bitmap fonts
06:05 TriBlade9 Any help hmmmm or kahrl?
06:05 hmmmm not really sure where the colored_chat PR is or if we even support that
06:07 kahrl hmmmm: found it, https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/1636
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06:12 TriBlade9 Why would you not support it?
06:13 hmmmm TriBlade9, i'd add if (USE_FREETYPE)    LIST(APPEND minetest_SRCS StaticText.cpp)    endif (USE_FREETYPE)
06:13 hmmmm in CMakeLists.txt
06:13 hmmmm look at src/CMakeLists.txt:490
06:14 TriBlade9 Ah, let me try
06:15 TriBlade9 Ty
06:19 TriBlade9 TY hmm! It seems to be building properly now with freetype enabled
06:19 TriBlade9 Testing with it disabled now
06:22 Zeno` https://github.com/Zeno-/minetest/commit/​ad4e2481912afe05ca694d3560a94afea98982b4
06:22 Zeno` ^^^ probable cause of occasional crashes when launching client
06:23 * hmmmm scratches head
06:24 TriBlade9 Zeno`, Thanks, if that works it would explain (and fix) a lot.
06:24 TriBlade9 I get random segfaults frequently
06:25 TriBlade9 YESSS!!! hmmmm, I friggin love you. That did it. Both modes work now :D
06:25 hmmmm :D
06:25 TriBlade9 Time to clean up and commit
06:25 hmmmm no problem TriBlade
06:25 hmmmm I didn't understand what the problem was at first
06:26 Zeno` I'm pretty sure that's it. Well, 99% sure because the loop runs again *after* I click connect
06:26 TriBlade9 Sorry, I'm not good at explaining things. :P
06:26 hmmmm Zeno`, finished is set to true after the very first iteration is complete
06:26 TriBlade9 I work with chinese people 90% of the time for gods sake, rarely speak english.
06:26 Zeno` hmm as it should be
06:26 hmmmm I'm not sure what this is supposed to do...
06:26 Zeno` because  mymenu() blocks
06:26 hmmmm so what if it blocks?
06:27 Zeno` so I suppose I could rid of kill entirely actually
06:27 hmmmm hmmmm
06:27 hmmmm I'm not sure I understand how your patch solves this
06:28 Zeno` the problem is that *kill is occasionally not updated in time to stop the loop running again after the "connect" button is pressed
06:28 Zeno` *kill is not needed... I'll get rid of it
06:28 hmmmm but how does adding your finished boolean fix that....
06:29 Zeno` because it's set by the same thread
06:29 Zeno` not the engine thread
06:29 hmmmm wait
06:29 hmmmm *kill is set by the engine thread
06:29 hmmmm finished is not
06:29 Zeno` correct
06:30 hmmmm doesn't your patch make it so that loop doesn't work any longer?
06:30 hmmmm after finished is set to true, !finished is false and therefore the while condition is no longer satisfied
06:31 hmmmm so what's the point of a loop at that point..?
06:31 hmmmm i don't know, maybe I'm missing something
06:31 Zeno` well there is no point is there
06:32 hmmmm so you're saying looping over that code is pointless?
06:32 Zeno` atm that is just how it was as copied directly from the original main.cpp before I made it a function
06:32 Zeno` I think so... I'd better make sure
06:33 hmmmm I don't know either but I would assume it's not pointless otherwise it wouldn't be done in the first place
06:33 Zeno` worldpath was originally set twice as well, do I dunno... maybe it wasn't obvious when it was a 1000 line function
06:33 Zeno` I'll keep checking
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06:34 hmmmm Zeno`, let's assume the loop is required, and thus *kill is needed.
06:35 hmmmm in order to actually fix the race condition, you need to read kill in a mutex
06:35 Zeno` correct
06:35 Zeno` maybe
06:36 hmmmm if engine wants to set *kill for that thread, it needs to block until the menu thread is done with processing
06:37 Zeno` actually I really don't think the loop is necessary
06:38 kahrl Zeno`, if you add actionstream<<"hello\n"; at script/lua_api/l_mainmenu:137 and main.cpp:1626 you can see that both are running in the same thread
06:38 kahrl there is no "engine thread"
06:39 kahrl there is the whole async infrastructure in GUIEngine but it isn't used for m_kill
06:39 Zeno` well I have no idea why the loop occassionally runs twice then
06:40 Zeno` I still don't think it needs to be a loop anyway now that hmmm asked me why it was a loop
06:40 kahrl it needs to be a loop because if you play a game and exit to menu, the menu needs to be shown again
06:42 Zeno` that's not in that loop though
06:42 kahrl wait, what loop are you talking about?
06:42 Zeno` by restructured loop
06:42 Zeno` https://github.com/Zeno-/minetest/commit/​ad4e2481912afe05ca694d3560a94afea98982b4
06:43 Zeno` which is a straight copy/paste from the original main.cpp (I haven't actually refactored yet, just broken stuff into functions)
06:43 Zeno` So this is the inner loop
06:43 Zeno` (in the original file)
06:44 kahrl oh, yeah I thought you meant the outer loop
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06:45 kahrl the inner loop contains a lot of error checks that end in "continue;"
06:46 kahrl without the loop it would go straight to starting the game with invalid parameters
06:57 Zeno` well I guess this is an advantage of cleaning it up
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08:46 Megaf Morning
08:47 TriBlade9 Mornin
08:48 Megaf Can someone explain what does this does? item_entity_ttl =
08:48 TriBlade9 Time Till Live or something I assume?
08:49 Megaf Yes, but what kind of entity?
08:49 Megaf I dont understand this entity thing
08:49 Megaf Zeno`: kahrl: help?
08:50 kahrl Megaf, where is that from?
08:50 Megaf kahrl: minetest.conf
08:51 kahrl it specifies how long it takes until an item despawns
08:51 kahrl in seconds
08:52 Zeno` Is it still used kahrl?
08:52 kahrl yes
08:52 Zeno` oh it's in builtin
08:54 kahrl to be more precise, s/item/dropped item
08:54 Megaf kahrl: so now the remove_items = 60 from built it items is useless?
08:54 kahrl I don't understand that sentence
08:55 kahrl what is remove_items?
08:56 Megaf Ok, there's a mod called builtin items
08:56 Megaf It's function is to remove droped items..
08:56 Megaf because back then all  dropped items would just stay on the ground forever
08:57 Zeno` I could use help debugging/testing/etc this main.cpp refactor thing
08:57 Zeno` if not direct help some suggestions at least, I guess
08:57 kahrl Megaf: oh, in that case yes
09:11 kahrl Zeno`: it seems the menu loop now just eats Lua errors instead of displaying them
09:11 kahrl try e.g. setting gameid = wat in some world's world.mt
09:11 kahrl then start that world in the Server tab
09:12 kahrl in master that shows a lua error "... attempt to index local 'game' (a nil value)"
09:13 Zeno` run as client?
09:13 kahrl in refactor_main, that's only printed to errorstream but not shown in the menu
09:13 Zeno` yeah ok, thanks
09:13 Zeno` looking
09:13 Zeno` ok so I do need that loop
09:20 Megaf What about this? max_packets_per_iteration =
09:20 Megaf I undestand what a TCP packet is
09:21 Megaf but that doesnt makes lots of sence to me since minetest uses UDP and theres the word iteration there,
09:21 kahrl UDP uses packets too
09:21 RealBadAngel hi kahrl, can you take a look on https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/1639 ?
09:23 kahrl RealBadAngel: why if (p == data->m_highlighted_pos_relative)
09:24 kahrl RealBadAngel: why not instead add the mesh at m_highlighted_pos_relative outside the for loop
09:24 TriBlade9 RealBadAngel, have you fixed the light level disco glitch?
09:24 RealBadAngel TriBlade9, yes
09:24 TriBlade9 Yay :D
09:24 TriBlade9 Anyone want to take a look at this? https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/1645
09:24 kahrl (some people call this the for-if antipattern: http://blogs.msdn.com/b/oldnewthin​g/archive/2011/12/27/10251210.aspx )
09:25 Megaf item_entity_ttl = This does not cleans dropped items
09:25 RealBadAngel kahrl, for that i would need to check if its in block range and iterate through it anyway
09:25 RealBadAngel crack is done similar way
09:26 kahrl RealBadAngel, I don't understand
09:26 kahrl what would you need to iterate over?
09:27 kahrl I agree that the cracks are probably not done the optimal way
09:27 kahrl but it's a bit more difficult to change tile materials after the fact than add something to the mesh
09:28 TriBlade9 Question, is it a good idea to make as many things as possible configurable? Or what is the stance on that?
09:28 TriBlade9 For example, if I were to add a config option to change the selection box width
09:29 RealBadAngel TriBlade9, we add config options for almost everything, there will be always some1 who doesnt like the feature or would like it workin another way
09:29 TriBlade9 So can I add some more config options? x]
09:30 RealBadAngel kahrl, pos = selection pos is the condition to show selection, how could i make it outside the loop?
09:31 RealBadAngel hmm
09:32 kahrl RealBadAngel: v3s16 p = data->m_highlighted_pos_relative
09:32 kahrl then the if body
09:34 kahrl TriBlade9: some settings are better suited as Lua API functions
09:34 Megaf Zeno`: One thing that have to change is the multithreading part of minetest, it's really annoying to se my server totally frozen with 3 100% idles cores left
09:34 TriBlade9 kahrl for example?
09:34 TriBlade9 Selection box width?
09:34 kahrl and if a setting can be set in a way that satisfies everybody, just use that instead of adding a setting
09:34 kahrl TriBlade9: no, that's a client thing
09:34 TriBlade9 I'm working with selectionboxes right now, 'cause those don't satisfy me :P
09:35 TriBlade9 Welp, I guess I'll make a PR and see what people think then
09:36 kahrl or for example, if someone made a setting that made selection boxes white, I would probably vote against that because it could be used to cheat (find your way in darkness without torches)
09:38 kahrl not a very effective cheat but a cheat nonetheless
09:38 TriBlade9 Dude
09:38 TriBlade9 That's already in the game afaik
09:38 kahrl is it?
09:38 TriBlade9 v3f selectionbox_color = g_settings->getV3F("selectionbox_color");
09:38 TriBlade9 That's been there for ages
09:38 kahrl haha, it is
09:38 TriBlade9 Yep, here: # Selection box border color (R,G,B)
09:38 TriBlade9 #selectionbox_color = (0,0,0)
09:39 TriBlade9 Oh the irony xP
09:39 kahrl well I won't remove it now, but I didn't vote for that :P
09:40 TriBlade9 Why on earth are 90% of the C++ files in the same directory?
09:40 TriBlade9 Couldn't we sort them into folders a little more?
09:44 TriBlade9 Meh, I shouldn't judge, I do the same sort of things
09:45 kahrl it was considered when the subsystems were defined
09:46 kahrl but it would be change for sake of change and would break all the pull requests
09:46 TriBlade9 Unfortunately you have a point :/
09:47 RealBadAngel kahrl, that doesnt work
09:47 RealBadAngel condition if the highlight is in the block range is needed anyway
09:48 RealBadAngel thx to the way it updates the blocks
09:48 RealBadAngel set or unset is made with passing pos to the mesh generation
09:48 kahrl RealBadAngel: can't you check that outside the for loop?
09:49 TriBlade9 Umm
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09:51 RealBadAngel kahrl, i will do that, ok, but later the way the data is passed to mapblock_mesh has to be changed, simple flag passed should be used not idiotic v3s16(-1337, -1337, -1337)
09:52 RealBadAngel which doesnt help even, because code dont know if its about setting or unsetting crack or whatever
09:57 TriBlade9 u16 vs u32 in configs. Difference is what?
10:04 RealBadAngel kahrl, ok, mesh is made outside the loop now
10:05 RealBadAngel TriBlade9, all coords ingame are u16 i think
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10:07 TriBlade9 Imma use a S16 for this, as I assume it takes a tiny bit less memory than a S32
10:07 TriBlade9 My bad, I meant S16 and 32
10:10 kahrl RealBadAngel: wouldn't it be cleaner code to add a new TILE_MATERIAL_HIGHLIGHT that translates to video::EMT_TRANSPARENT_ADD_COLOR instead of having a flag MATERIAL_FLAG_HIGHLIGHTED
10:11 kahrl brb
10:12 Zeno` kahrl, fixed
10:13 RealBadAngel kahrl, flag is used to animate the selection anyway so its needed
10:13 TriBlade9 Alright guys, Imma go eat dinner
10:13 RealBadAngel on the other hand adding new material would require new shader for it
10:14 TriBlade9 See ya!
10:14 RealBadAngel and i dont want that at this point
10:14 Zeno` took a long time because I tested heaps of other stuff as well :(
10:15 Zeno` had to have dinner as well I think
10:15 Zeno` I dunno what I've done today :(
10:16 Zeno` I see now why the error message isn't "printed". I'd better fix that comment
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10:25 Zeno` proller, https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/1646
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10:25 Zeno` why is it useless?
10:27 proller who will change it and why
10:28 Zeno` would you change it?
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10:30 Zeno` I'd say the people who will change it are similar to people who set crosshair_alpha = 0
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10:32 Zeno` (useful if you've there's something to be displayed right or left of hotbar)   no idea what that means though
10:33 Zeno` actually it's kind of useless
10:33 Zeno` I thought it was able to be set to 0
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10:52 chchjesus So, I'm looking into a bug where, if you double click the scrollbar for a list in the main menu, it will select the item "under" the scrollbar
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10:52 chchjesus And I'm assuming that part of the code is C++
10:52 chchjesus in guiFormSpecMenu.cpp
10:53 chchjesus So it's to do with double clicking and the scrollbar
10:53 chchjesus Anyone got any suggestiobs for what to look at?
10:53 RealBadAngel chchjesus, you should propably talk bout it with sapier
10:54 RealBadAngel he coded that i think
10:54 chchjesus Ah
10:54 chchjesus What time do you reckon he'll be in?
10:54 RealBadAngel !seen sapier
10:54 RealBadAngel wheres that damn bot?
10:54 chchjesus lol
10:55 RealBadAngel idk, propably evenings cet
10:56 chchjesus What would that be UTC?
10:56 chchjesus Eh nvm
10:56 chchjesus I'll google
10:57 chchjesus So he should be here in a few hours
10:57 chchjesus wait
10:57 chchjesus RealBadAngel: Is that Central European Standard time?
10:57 chchjesus It's not like some weird American time is it?
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10:58 RealBadAngel no it isnt
10:58 jin_xi RealBadAngel: i don't get it, i pasted whole shader again (cleaned up). I cant find good info on what i need to do. basically i need tpos to be x and y of every face on a node http://paste.ubuntu.com/8364293/
11:00 RealBadAngel gl_FragCoord.xy
11:00 RealBadAngel why using that?
11:01 RealBadAngel i told u what coords to use
11:02 RealBadAngel tpos = gl_TexCoord[0].st;
11:02 RealBadAngel try that
11:04 jin_xi i get transparent nodes doing that
11:04 jin_xi so my pixels end up in the wrong place it seems
11:06 RealBadAngel do you have a branch with that?
11:06 jin_xi no i suck at git
11:07 chchjesus git checkout -b "newbranchname"
11:07 chchjesus will create a copy of the current branch you are on and name with with the new name
11:07 chchjesus Oh, and it will switch you to that branch too
11:10 jin_xi ok ill try
11:13 chchjesus git checkout branchname switches between branches
11:14 chchjesus and when you're done, checkout into the branch you want to merge your other branch into, then do git merge "branchname"
11:14 chchjesus But make sure you commit all your changes before merging
11:14 chchjesus ofc
11:28 Zeno` well, I think the new main() is ok now
11:29 jin_xi RealBadAngel: https://github.com/obneq/m​inetest/tree/nodedefshader sry its a big mess and a hack! im using it with a simple mod named colors, ill paste the init
11:30 jin_xi colors init.lua: http://paste.ubuntu.com/8364418/
11:31 jin_xi theres unrelated stuff, like plain rgb nodes and naive haiku nodes (plus whole simple forth in tile.cpp, ignore those).
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11:41 chchjesus Wait
11:41 chchjesus jin_xi: What is Haiku? Is this some instructions parser or something?
11:42 jin_xi yes its this: https://forthsalon.appspot.com/
11:43 chchjesus Why not use glsl or something?
11:45 jin_xi well, i do
11:45 jin_xi atm im passing just glsl to nodes
11:46 jin_xi but i thought it could be a neat way to define procedurally generated textures
11:47 chchjesus Interesting
11:47 jin_xi this page transpiles the forth into js, optimizes the js slightly and then turns it into glsl. i just take that glsl and put it into my nodedef
11:47 jin_xi it all started with an attempt to make plain rgb colored nodes without textures available via nodedef
11:48 chchjesus nodedef? Node definition?
11:48 chchjesus Oh wait
11:48 jin_xi yes
11:48 chchjesus node as in node.js?
11:48 jin_xi no
11:48 chchjesus oh the Minetest nodes
11:48 jin_xi a node is a block in mt terminology
11:48 jin_xi yes
11:48 chchjesus Yeah
11:49 RealBadAngel jin_xi, i will check your code later today
11:50 chchjesus How many of you guys are engineers?
11:50 chchjesus i.e. Elec, Comp or Mech
11:50 RealBadAngel idk
11:51 RealBadAngel im demoscene coder
11:51 RealBadAngel from old days, long past ;)
11:51 jin_xi lol im an allround academic failure
11:51 chchjesus oh, that's a term I was looking for for a while
11:51 chchjesus Thanks
11:51 chchjesus I'm a recent CS grad
11:52 chchjesus I barely passed Comp graphics
11:52 chchjesus and algorithms
11:52 chchjesus I'd like to touch up and improve
11:52 chchjesus jin_xi: You seem to know what you're doing lol
11:52 jin_xi yes, dirty hacks for fun and confusion
11:52 chchjesus Well, Forth of all languages...
11:52 chchjesus I have a friend who raves about Forth
11:55 jin_xi i just use it because it can be so simple... this is no real forth but something vaguely similar
11:55 chchjesus Haha
11:55 chchjesus Yeah, it seems pretty simple
11:56 chchjesus My friend did a forth interpreter in asm
11:56 jin_xi thats more like the real thin
11:56 jin_xi g
11:57 chchjesus Heh
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12:13 TriBlade9 Could anyone possible point me to where player movement variables and timing is handled? I checked player.cpp but it didn't seem to change anything. :/
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12:17 kahrl TriBlade9: localplayer.cpp
12:19 TriBlade9 Thank you
12:24 TriBlade9 What is BS and where is it defined? Weirdest variable name ever x]
12:24 TriBlade9 Sorry for all the questions
12:25 RealBadAngel BS is BlockSize (confusing a bit)
12:25 RealBadAngel BS = 10
12:25 TriBlade9 Ooooh
12:26 TriBlade9 That makes a lot more sense
12:26 RealBadAngel it converts mt world coordinates to irrlicht ones
12:26 jin_xi http://paste.ubuntu.com/8364726/ <- BS
12:27 TriBlade9 Makes a lot more sense than multiplying everything times Bull****
12:28 Zeno` maybe it could be called BLOCK_SIZE
12:29 jin_xi anyone using a decent IDE can follow the symbol and read the comment above?
12:29 Zeno` Every time I see it I think BullShit as well
12:30 TriBlade9 I use Geany or Gedit
12:30 TriBlade9 Big IDE's with long start times are annoying
12:30 Zeno` Why should I have to use an IDE to know what BS is?
12:30 jin_xi i like qtcreator for hacking on mt. in fact i could not do anything without it
12:30 RealBadAngel BS is so often used that source could grow enormously with it havin longer name lol
12:30 RealBadAngel treat it equally as PI for example ;)
12:30 jin_xi just open the cmake file and it opens the whole project and it helps sooo much to understand whats going on
12:31 Zeno` But PI is known
12:31 RealBadAngel BS is our squarish PI ;)
12:31 Zeno` BLK_SZ
12:31 TriBlade9 BS - The MESE of Minetest Development
12:31 Zeno` square pies?
12:31 TriBlade9 Makes no sense and is mostly misleading, but still loved by the devs
12:32 Zeno` Not sure if I want a square pi. I'd rather a quiche
12:32 RealBadAngel you get used to it
12:33 Zeno` bullshit
12:33 TriBlade9 Anyone else notice when you jump and land on a node, you sort of slowly sink in?
12:33 Zeno` :p ;)
12:33 TriBlade9 Player movement is terrible
12:35 Zeno` even BSZ would be more descriptive than BS hehe
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12:35 Zeno` why does BS have parenthesis around it in the #define?
12:37 Zeno` I'm gonna add a #define RBA 10.0
12:39 kahrl ughh
12:40 kahrl why do I keep coming back to this weblate thing, nothing works
12:40 TriBlade9 Which website thing kahrl?
12:40 kahrl weblate not website
12:40 TriBlade9 The Python thingie?
12:40 TriBlade9 My bad
12:40 TriBlade9 It's late x]
12:41 TriBlade9 Perhaps you could do something else?
12:41 kahrl newest episode: the registration form only sporadically sends emails and when you click on the activation link, nothing happens except you get redirected to the login page
12:41 TriBlade9 (Like fix the damned player movement), I can't seem to find the right variables
12:41 TriBlade9 O-o
12:43 kahrl I will watch some Microsoft ® Entertainment
12:43 kahrl er, MC video
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12:44 TriBlade9 x]
12:44 TriBlade9 Player needs to jump a tad bit higher, and about 1/3rd again as fast
12:44 TriBlade9 And not immediately cancel jump velocity on collision with the side of a block
12:45 kahrl it's difficult to change the player movement as people will shout at you when you change it in the slightest
12:45 kahrl not to mention that sneaking (and supporting the sneak glitch) makes everything a thousand times more complicated
12:45 chchjesus Micro$haftcraft
12:46 TriBlade9 :/
12:46 chchjesus lol
12:46 TriBlade9 So mature chch
12:46 TriBlade9 So mature >_>
12:47 TriBlade9 kahrl, I think I found the sweet spot
12:48 Zeno` does git rebase -i HEAD~2  work if you're on a branch?
12:48 TriBlade9 movement_speed_jump+5 suddenly makes jumping feel a lot more smooth when jumping into a block O-o
12:49 kahrl i.e. settings->setDefault("movement_speed_jump", "11.5")?
12:49 TriBlade9 Nope
12:49 TriBlade9 Doing that makes it do glitchy weird stuff
12:50 TriBlade9 localplayer.cpp, line 532, from this: speedJ.Y = movement_speed_jump * physics_override_jump; to this: speedJ.Y = (movement_speed_jump+5) * physics_override_jump;
12:50 RealBadAngel kahrl, i moved mesh generation out of the loop. but material i dont want to touch by now as it requires changes to shaders, i will do that later when adding liquid surface materials
12:51 kahrl TriBlade9: k let me try
12:52 RealBadAngel kahrl, also one more thing, should highlighting be visible when hud off? cracks are
12:52 RealBadAngel while selection boxes are not
12:52 TriBlade9 kahrl, change it to 3 or 4, less noticable
12:52 kahrl RealBadAngel: ok, the material thing wasn't really that much of a problem anyway
12:52 kahrl RealBadAngel: hmm
12:52 kahrl I think it should be off like the selection box
12:52 TriBlade9 ^
12:52 RealBadAngel paramat also said so
12:53 kahrl so that people can make close-up screenshots without highlighting if they want to
12:53 RealBadAngel ok, i will turn highlighting off the same way as selection boxes are
12:53 RealBadAngel anythin more?
12:53 kahrl RealBadAngel: nope, didn't notice anything else yet
12:54 TriBlade9 RBA, I had something to tell you about highlighting...
12:54 TriBlade9 Oh, in dark caves, it becomes really hard to see the texture you're pointing at because the cycling colors make it hard to focus long enough
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12:58 TriBlade9 Now how would one make the player fall faster without increasing gravity?
12:58 TriBlade9 (Thinking to myself, don't answer unless you want to x])
12:58 proller increase mass
12:58 TriBlade9 Players have a mass?
12:59 ibloat add another obscure factor somewhere seemingly unrelated
12:59 proller or decrease air viscosity
13:00 TriBlade9 That seems like your name's style ibloat xP
13:00 kahrl TriBlade9: I like it
13:00 TriBlade9 What number did you use?
13:00 kahrl it makes jumping up 3-high stairwells in mines less obnoxious
13:00 kahrl 3
13:00 TriBlade9 Yeah
13:00 ibloat yeah i unroll loops manually
13:00 TriBlade9 It's also not that noticable kahrl
13:01 kahrl I wonder if anyone's workflow is disturbed if the exact jump height changes :P
13:01 kahrl (insert xkcd link here)
13:02 Zeno` I think mine might be
13:03 Zeno` and it's 1172
13:03 TriBlade9 It might break a classic bug that I remember, like water-signs or smth, I forgot what it was
13:03 Zeno` http://xkcd.com/1172/
13:03 TriBlade9 That was back on redcrabs server that I used that x]
13:03 kahrl the sneak glitch?
13:04 kahrl that one still works
13:04 TriBlade9 And people love it don't they
13:05 TriBlade9 Meh
13:05 TriBlade9 I don't understand this code well enough to patch it anyways
13:05 ibloat sneak glitch?
13:07 TriBlade9 Oooh
13:07 TriBlade9 Found how to make gravity faster!
13:07 TriBlade9 environment.cpp
13:08 kahrl ibloat: it's what allows you to climb this thing: http://i.imgur.com/3gSz7n0.png
13:08 TriBlade9 Correction, found how to do some darned weird shit
13:08 kahrl stand in the corner, sneak and jump
13:09 kahrl it can be disabled though
13:09 TriBlade9 Question
13:10 TriBlade9 How does one do order-of-operations when accessing a member var? Eg, this->that*2+1, Invalid: this->(that*2)+1
13:11 kahrl huh?
13:11 kahrl what do you want to do?
13:11 ibloat i see i see
13:11 TriBlade9 Multiply that times two
13:11 TriBlade9 Which is normally done using (that*2)
13:11 kahrl your first version is fine
13:11 TriBlade9 Would it be proper to then do (this->that*2)+1?
13:12 kahrl yeah that would be okay, if verbose
13:12 jin_xi absent operator precedence i think yes, but...
13:12 TriBlade9 Okay
13:12 TriBlade9 Ty
13:13 TriBlade9 Ah, that did it
13:13 TriBlade9 It wasn't compiling because I missed a semicolon on the line before.
13:13 TriBlade9 #TooUsedToJavaScript
13:15 ibloat which technically wants you to use semicoli as well :p
13:15 TriBlade9 Hehheee
13:15 TriBlade9 Proof that I liberally ignore semicolons: https://github.com/TriBlade9/bots.js
13:15 ibloat js is just too damn lenient
13:15 TriBlade9 Buttt...
13:15 TriBlade9 Objects...
13:16 * ibloat goes to coffeescript for his js needs
13:16 * TriBlade9 hates CoffeeScript
13:16 * TriBlade9 hates it because it keeps him up at night.
13:19 Zeno` joined #minetest-dev
13:19 TriBlade9 WB Zeno`
13:20 Zeno` thank you
13:20 Zeno` I am... in Windows now
13:20 Zeno` *shudder*
13:20 TriBlade9 Shammmeee
13:20 TriBlade9 Play MSCraft :D
13:21 Zeno` nah
13:21 Zeno` gosh I don't even remember how to start firefox
13:21 TriBlade9 Umm
13:22 TriBlade9 CTRL+ALT+T
13:22 TriBlade9 type firefox
13:22 TriBlade9 Press Enter
13:22 TriBlade9 Owait, windows doesn't have the command prompt hotkeyed :L
13:22 Zeno` doesn't work. I pressed my special Windows key
13:23 TriBlade9 What windows version? (Just wonderin)
13:23 Zeno` 7
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13:24 Zeno` I can't watch a TV show I want to using Linux (even after changing the user agent for firefox)
13:24 Zeno` Apparently Linux is a mobile device
13:27 RealBadAngel TriBlade9, highlighting wont help you see in darkness, you need light for that
13:28 TriBlade9 RealBadAngel, but I think the highlighter should be a bit dimmer in the darkness
13:28 TriBlade9 Like just enough to be seen, but not glaring
13:28 RealBadAngel its so dark enough that sin of amplitude 10 can go below 0
13:29 RealBadAngel thats why there were disco lights effect ;)
13:29 TriBlade9 okay then, nvm
13:29 TriBlade9 Wanna test something out for me?
13:29 TriBlade9 I need an honest opinion before I PR this
13:29 RealBadAngel ok
13:30 TriBlade9 One sec, tweaking a couple vars a bit before I push
13:31 TriBlade9 Pushing...
13:32 TriBlade9 Timing out...
13:33 TriBlade9 Alright, can you test out https://github.com/TriBlade9/m​inetest/tree/player_movement?
13:33 TriBlade9 It's mainly tweaks to how jumps and gravity work ATM
13:33 TriBlade9 But I want to know if jumping and falling feel smoother and less hacky now, or if it's just my imagination.
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13:34 proller more magic numbers!
13:34 TriBlade9 Exactly proller x]
13:35 proller better use bullet engine
13:35 TriBlade9 I just tweaked stuff until I didn't have the weird step glitch and didn't feel like I was falling in slow-mo
13:35 proller irrbullet or something
13:35 TriBlade9 Butwhy?
13:35 Amaz TriBlade9, I will test that out once I've finished testing your other pulls!
13:35 TriBlade9 Btw, the ratio between those two numbers is related
13:35 TriBlade9 Kind of
13:35 TriBlade9 Thanks Amaz
13:36 TriBlade9 I've been basically changing everything that I felt is lacking/poorly done xP
13:36 Amaz They're all great!
13:36 TriBlade9 :O
13:36 TriBlade9 <3
13:36 * TriBlade9 blushes with pride.. and a bit of gas
13:36 TriBlade9 Thanks Amaz
13:37 Amaz Only one I'm not sure about is the entity box, but that's just because I'm used to the other one. I like it, it just feels strange :P
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13:37 TriBlade9 Indeed it does feel strange, especially since you can't select blocks below entities
13:37 TriBlade9 But that behavior would be too complicated to implement per-entity registration
13:38 Amaz What would be nice, but probably impossible to do, is to have the selection box around the entity, like it is around a nodebox...
13:38 TriBlade9 What would really be best would be mesh-fitting selection boxes like nodeboxes do, that rotate with the entity
13:38 TriBlade9 NINJA'D
13:38 Amaz XD
13:38 TriBlade9 Supposedly RBA is working/going to work on something like that
13:38 Amaz :D
13:39 TriBlade9 RBA is working on everything x]
13:39 Amaz :P
13:39 TriBlade9 Oh shit
13:39 TriBlade9 I just realized I changed a var that I didn't mean to in the player movement pull
13:40 RealBadAngel highlighting for entities is almost rdy, will make a pull for it later today
13:40 TriBlade9 Though it didn't affect anything O-o
13:40 TriBlade9 Awesome :D
13:41 TriBlade9 Does it affect the normal box too?
13:41 TriBlade9 (Is that backportable?)
13:41 Amaz :D
13:43 TriBlade9 Nvm, leave that var as it is, makes jumping a bit less prone to stuttering, as far as I can tell.
13:45 Amaz TriBlade9, does the player_movement need to be used on singleplayer, or can it be used on multiplayer? (i.e. is it client side of server side?)
13:45 TriBlade9 It should work for both
13:46 Amaz Okay.
13:46 TriBlade9 But again, that needs to be tested
13:46 TriBlade9 It probably won't work well with servers that have a different value
13:46 Amaz What does it change?
13:46 Amaz Ah.
13:46 TriBlade9 Thanks for the reminder though, Let me test on a server
13:47 TriBlade9 It changes the percieved gravity and the jump height
13:47 TriBlade9 and jump speed
13:47 Amaz Okay.
13:47 TriBlade9 Dont ask me HOw it changes it, I just know those numbers do it, and they make it "just feel right"
13:47 Amaz XD
13:47 TriBlade9 Story of my life
13:48 TriBlade9 But IMO it REALLY helps the world feel more solid
13:48 Amaz Okay.
13:49 TriBlade9 Woot
13:49 TriBlade9 Just tested on VanessaE's survival server
13:50 TriBlade9 No difference from singleplayer as far as I can tell
13:50 TriBlade9 Granted I'm probably about to lag out
13:50 Amaz XD
13:51 Amaz Normally the case for me on mod heavy servers!
13:51 TriBlade9 Heh
13:51 TriBlade9 Try with China internet
13:51 TriBlade9 Anyhow, feel free to test the player movement branch
13:52 TriBlade9 I'm not gonna PR tonight, but I might in a couple of days
13:52 Amaz Okay.
13:52 Amaz That feels a lot smother.
13:53 Amaz *smoother
13:56 TriBlade9 Like it?
13:57 TriBlade9 Alrighty, I'm off to bed. See ya crazy geeks later! (And not crazy geeks.) [And crazy, but not geeks], {And neither crazy nor geeks}
14:02 chchjesus Have any of you guys watched the Steam Dev Days? They have some good videos on Game dev there from people in the industry
14:03 chchjesus i.e. people from Valve, people from AMD, Nvidia, Intel
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14:33 CraigyDavi http://www.downforeveryoneorju​stme.com/servers.minetest.net
14:34 jin_xi its up for me
14:35 Amaz I get It's not just you! http://servers.minetest.net looks down from here. But when I go to it, it displays fine.
14:35 Amaz it = server.minetest.net
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14:37 Amaz Actually, it looks down now.
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15:15 VanessaE So, seems DDoS attacks have come to Minetest.
15:15 VanessaE http://digitalaudioconcepts.com/va​nessa/hobbies/minetest/stats.html
15:15 VanessaE note the three user count spikes between ~7am and 9am local time
15:16 VanessaE logs forwarded to me from when I was asleep show join/part floods typical of such an attack.
15:17 VanessaE seems like we need some basic rate limiting now
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15:20 RealBadAngel kahrl, here?
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15:35 RealBadAngel anyway, https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/1639 is again updated, some optimisations and hide highlighting when hud is off
15:36 RealBadAngel if there will be no more objections, going to merge it this evening
15:38 Amaz Yay!
15:41 * VanessaE looks...
15:48 VanessaE RealBadAngel: one minor glitch
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15:48 VanessaE point at a node, make sure it is highlighted.  Press F1 to turn HUD off, then press it again to turn HUD back on.
15:48 VanessaE the highlight does not re-appear until you point at another node.
15:52 Calinou https://github.com/minetest/master-server → a license should be added to the repository, probably the same as Minetest
15:52 Calinou (there doesn't seem to be any currently)
15:52 Calinou ShadowNinja, ^
15:53 ShadowNinja Calinou: O.K.  I'll add a LGPLv2.1 file.
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15:59 Calinou thanks
16:01 kahrl http://stackoverflow.com/questions/5739830​/simple-log-to-file-example-for-django-1-3 why the fuck does one have to write 45 fucking lines to log everything to a logfile?
16:01 kahrl "simple" indeed
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16:11 kahrl and now all this logfile can bring itself to tell me is "Passed captcha for kahrl@liebt-dich. info"
16:11 kahrl are you kidding me?
16:11 kahrl sfan5: OK, I'm done here, if you want to install Weblate have fun
16:18 sfan5 yay!
16:18 sfan5 how about no?
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16:23 sfan5 ''tell ibloat no, I didn't consider that
16:23 HLuaBot I'll tell that to "ibloat" next time I see them around.
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16:25 rubenwardy Modified: http://www.minetest.net/download
16:27 sfan5 "Thank you for trying out Minetest. Are you a new user? Have a look at our" "TABLE OF CONTENTS"
16:27 sfan5 that lines up perfectly
16:27 rubenwardy How can I do <br />
16:29 rubenwardy fixed
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16:41 jin_xi RealBadAngel: i think i kind of got it now, thanks!
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17:24 jray541 any insight as to what happened to the public list server
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17:38 Megaf Yay, more bugs
17:38 Megaf http://paste.debian.net/121503/
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17:44 ShadowNinja ''tell sfan5 The public server list is down.
17:44 HLuaBot I'll tell that to "sfan5" next time I see them around.
17:45 sfan5 joined #minetest-dev
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17:46 rubenwardy I'd like feedback for this: http://www.minetest.net/playground
17:46 sfan5 ShadowNinja: I'm aware
17:47 Krock Fehlercode: ERR_CONNECTION_RESET
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17:49 ShadowNinja sfan5: Do you know why or when it will be back up?
17:49 sfan5 nope
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18:16 RealBadAngel VanessaE, fixed
18:19 VanessaE ok
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18:20 RealBadAngel kahrl, ShadowNinja are you ok with mergeing highlighting now?
18:22 ShadowNinja RealBadAngel: I don't really like the color cycling in the dark, but I won't stop it because of that.  You're free to merge.
18:23 ShadowNinja Oh, I haven't looked at the code though.
18:23 RealBadAngel ShadowNinja, i can lower its amplitude depending on total ammount of light, now its same for bright places and dark ones
18:24 ShadowNinja RealBadAngel: Yes, I know.  It's just more visible in dark places.
18:24 RealBadAngel review the code and meanwhile i will code your request then :)
18:25 Calinou do you have a video?
18:26 Calinou I'm always afraid as RealBadAngel made it
18:26 ShadowNinja RealBadAngel: How does it look without any color?
18:26 Calinou (it may focus more on fancy-pansyness rather than gameplay looks)
18:26 Calinou avoid colour please
18:26 Calinou there are colourblinds around
18:26 kaeza <--
18:26 RealBadAngel ShadowNinja, plain white (or whatever color your halo.png is)
18:27 ShadowNinja RealBadAngel: I'd like to to be fully opaque with the texture determining the transparency, is that possible.
18:27 Calinou please avoid transitions too
18:27 RealBadAngel transparency is controlle by vertex colors
18:27 Calinou they decrease instant-ness
18:27 ShadowNinja RealBadAngel: And I noticed some whitespace added to the ends of lenes before, don't know if that's still aplicable.
18:28 RealBadAngel texture cannot control transparency with this material
18:28 ShadowNinja lines*
18:28 RealBadAngel ShadowNinja, i will check whites when mergeing
18:28 ShadowNinja RealBadAngel: How do the vertices control the color?
18:28 Calinou sorry for the ad hominem
18:28 RealBadAngel its light, color of it
18:29 RealBadAngel same values for all channels = shades of grey
18:29 RealBadAngel so 255,255, 255 full opaque white
18:29 ShadowNinja RealBadAngel: Maybe make enable_node_highlighting into node_selection = highlight/wirebox.
18:30 ShadowNinja RealBadAngel: and total black is fully transparent?
18:30 RealBadAngel yes
18:31 ShadowNinja RealBadAngel: But then the box won't show up over black nodes, right?
18:31 RealBadAngel whats inside has nothing to do with the halo
18:31 ShadowNinja RealBadAngel: And you can just use one setHighlighted call here by passing show_hud: https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/1639/f​iles#diff-18513665750ef5adf42b5ec29e14162eR2107
18:32 ShadowNinja RealBadAngel: So the color of the halo determines the transparency?
18:32 RealBadAngel yes
18:33 RealBadAngel about code you linked, i dont get it. it is one call?
18:33 ShadowNinja RealBadAngel: Hmmm, O.K.  I mean one line of code after the conditional.
18:39 ShadowNinja "clamp(...,0 ,255)" should be "clamp(..., 0, 255)".  Otherwise it looks O.K.
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18:44 ShadowNinja sfan5_: http://sprunge.us/NgES?diff
18:45 sfan5_ ShadowNinja: looks good
18:46 ShadowNinja Pushed.
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18:47 ShadowNinja Comments on https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/1623 ?  (I'll fix the typo in the first commit message)
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19:06 RealBadAngel ShadowNinja, check that loop with clamp again
19:07 RealBadAngel i made color phasing depending on total light and also rearranged the loop itself (most of the code went out of it)
19:09 RealBadAngel ShadowNinja, btw i would like to merge your pull that adds more digging particles
19:09 RealBadAngel my next pull will be the setting to disable cracks
19:10 RealBadAngel highlighting + digging particles does look way nicer imho than selection boxes + cracks
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19:15 RealBadAngel VanessaE, can you play a bit with current highlighting code? just in case
19:16 VanessaE ina  bit
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19:17 VanessaE same branch as before?
19:17 RealBadAngel yup
19:17 VanessaE compiling.
19:17 VanessaE I'll play a bit with the result, shortly
19:18 RealBadAngel if everythin is ok i will check for whities and apply the patch
19:28 ShadowNinja RealBadAngel: Sure.  It should use irrlicht particles though, the burst or entities can cause noticable framerate sags on some computers.
19:28 ShadowNinja of*
19:29 ShadowNinja That patch is O.L.D. though...
19:29 RealBadAngel its time has come then ;)
19:30 RealBadAngel on second hand disabling cracks will speed the game a bit and will save some ram
19:31 RealBadAngel so you can spend it on some more particles :)
19:31 ShadowNinja I think john_minetest worked on adding Irrlicht particles.
19:31 RealBadAngel i think it was jin_xi
19:31 RealBadAngel i can look for the code
19:32 ShadowNinja Oh, and there's a segfault bug in particles that triggers when a mod crashes and you reload the world.
19:32 ShadowNinja Didn't look at it closely, but got it in gdb once.
19:32 RealBadAngel https://github.com/VanessaE/minetest/commi​t/87ad2ec5e244fbb29f7d88df0867a525ad94e511
19:33 RealBadAngel here you go with irrlicht particles applied to punching the node
19:36 VanessaE yep, I forked jin_xi's code off so that it wouldn't get lost
19:36 ShadowNinja Ah, jin_xi it was then.  That emits a stream of them I believe.  My patch does cause noticable FPS sags sometimes even on my conputer, which is pretty decent (Intel HD 4000 on Ivy Bridge i5 @ 2.5 GHZ or so).
19:36 VanessaE even with 5000+ particles on my screen, it just wouldn't drop below 60 fps 240m view range.
19:37 VanessaE (10 streamers, with their full height in view)
19:37 ShadowNinja I'll see if I can use that.
19:37 VanessaE and they are the color (texture?) of the thing you punched, too
19:37 RealBadAngel VanessaE, found any issues?
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19:37 VanessaE RealBadAngel: I haven't looked yet
19:38 VanessaE busy
19:38 ShadowNinja Aha!  Adding .patch to that URL works.  :-)  <3 GitHub.
19:39 jin_xi digging particles need physics which irrlicht particles cannot do...
19:40 jin_xi they're more for rain and smoke or similar effects
19:42 RealBadAngel jin_xi, irrlicht particles can do collisions
19:42 ShadowNinja jin_xi: I believe they can if you use a partical affector.
19:42 jin_xi really? ok
19:42 jin_xi there is no collision affector i think
19:42 ShadowNinja I saw someone do it with an olber version of irrlicht, they didn't provide code though.
19:42 jin_xi well, im sure you can do it
19:43 VanessaE there is a collision affector.
19:43 jin_xi but it might involve a lot of digging
19:43 ShadowNinja They wrote their own affector.  Minetest uses a custom colision system.
19:43 VanessaE I saw one on the irrlicht forums..
19:44 jin_xi its not in the class reference
19:45 jin_xi idk, maybe there is a quick fix, but it would be one reason to think about general physics...
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19:56 Calinou https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/1645
19:56 Calinou please don't forget this
19:56 Calinou I would be sad if selection box was disabled by default
19:58 RealBadAngel ok, im done with whities
19:59 VanessaE RealBadAngel: what is whities?
19:59 VanessaE and what I pulled looks good.
19:59 Megaf Coments here please. https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/1648
20:00 RealBadAngel white spaces
20:06 RealBadAngel ok, will just wait for travis and then merge it
20:11 Megaf Ok, Thanks
20:12 RealBadAngel Megaf, ? i meant my pull, not yours
20:12 Megaf oh
20:13 Megaf anyway, my pull request is a little confusing
20:13 Megaf theres lots of comments from previous pull requests
20:15 Megaf anyways...
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20:53 RealBadAngel ok folks, ive made subgames able to play own menu music
20:53 RealBadAngel but imho engine itself should also have one
20:54 RealBadAngel my idea is to play main score on game start
20:54 RealBadAngel and when selecting subgame play its music (if provided)
20:54 RealBadAngel otherwise keep playing engine one
20:55 RealBadAngel hmmmm, kahrl, sfan5, ShadowNinja do you agree on that?
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20:55 RealBadAngel VanessaE ?
20:56 RealBadAngel and whoever is reading now too :)
20:56 VanessaE hm?
20:56 RealBadAngel read above
20:56 VanessaE oh
20:56 VanessaE the music thing?  seems fine to me provided two things:
20:56 VanessaE 1.  the volume level of the music MUST match
20:57 VanessaE 2.  the music should crossfade from one to the other as the user changes from one tab/game/etc to another.
20:57 RealBadAngel ad 1. so they should be normalized, not up to engine
20:57 VanessaE anything else is open
20:57 RealBadAngel ad 2. idk if thats possible at all
20:57 Calinou cross-fading is not trivial
20:58 VanessaE blah
20:58 VanessaE cross fading is easy
20:58 VanessaE don't give me that crap
20:58 VanessaE I've done it myself in software.
20:58 RealBadAngel from what i can see in code its not
20:58 RealBadAngel but i will give it a try
20:58 RealBadAngel but thats not the main point
20:59 RealBadAngel question was quite different
20:59 VanessaE you play two streams, both through a volume multiplier, ramp the multiplier for one up the other down, when one of them hits zero you just turn off that stream and remove the multiplier from the output chain from the other.
20:59 VanessaE RealBadAngel: those two things will have the biggest effect on whether players like in-game music
20:59 VanessaE s/in-game/in-menu/
21:00 RealBadAngel 1st thing is not up to engine at all
21:00 RealBadAngel its up to files provided
21:00 VanessaE Like I said, I've done this myself... in software.  UP hill both ways!
21:00 VanessaE :)
21:00 VanessaE RealBadAngel: that's true but it can still be highly recommended
21:01 VanessaE as in tell game authors to normalize their music to -3.0 dB
21:01 VanessaE etc.
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21:01 RealBadAngel also, http://incompetech.com/music/royalty-​free/index.html?keywords=the+descent
21:02 RealBadAngel ive picked this score to be Minetest main title
21:04 Calinou no consensus?
21:04 RealBadAngel you had more than a year to pick the tune
21:04 RealBadAngel enough
21:05 RealBadAngel and dont try even saying it is not good enough :)
21:14 Calinou there was no forum topic about it
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21:51 Megaf I got a new bug for you, one I think it's easy to fix
21:51 Megaf https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/1649
21:54 kaeza RealBadAngel, the song is nice, but IMHO, it's too dark for MT's theme
21:59 RealBadAngel kaeza, too dark, too loud, too much bass, too this and too that, there was a year for all that
22:00 RealBadAngel and there always be haters
22:02 RealBadAngel but seriously, it has cinematic feel
22:02 RealBadAngel and kinda promise that something big gonna happen
22:02 RealBadAngel and that fits
22:11 jray541 I installed all three curl dev packages and it made it so my server pops back on the server list.
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22:38 paramat RealBadAngel, remember that c55 is the audiovisuals manager so you need to get his approval for node highlighting =)
22:39 RealBadAngel all i need are votes of devs
22:39 RealBadAngel i do have 3 of them
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22:40 RealBadAngel besides, celeron55 doesnt code anything related to audiovisuals
22:42 RealBadAngel it looks like im the only one here that cares enough bout it to code anything
22:46 RealBadAngel paramat, btw, why it seems like you dont like anything smooth and eyecandy?
22:47 paramat well he's busy, and obviously does care otherwise he wouldn't take issue with your changes
22:47 paramat yeah true i don't like eyecandy :)
22:48 RealBadAngel still, all those eyecandies are optional
22:48 RealBadAngel so i take being against them simply as a pose, just to be against anything
22:50 paramat i think you do need approval of the audiovisuals manager
22:52 RealBadAngel point me any other dev that codes audiovisuals
22:52 RealBadAngel please?
22:52 paramat it's okay to be against an option if it's not needed or isn't suitable for Minetest's character
22:52 paramat um ...
22:54 * VanessaE hides
22:54 RealBadAngel highlighting  is needed, and there are way more folks that do love it than haters
22:54 paramat yeah cool i'm kinda neutral about that
22:54 RealBadAngel so, have you found any audiovisual coder out there?
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22:59 RealBadAngel but back to the music, there are a few choices
23:00 RealBadAngel maybe we could create a poll to choose one
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23:08 TriBlade9 Guys, what Type is getS16?
23:08 paramat music for a game should be decided by the game developers, however i feel Minetest game is too neutral to have any one piece of music, music could be good for other more unique games though
23:09 RealBadAngel bullshit
23:09 RealBadAngel game without music is just a mistake
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23:10 TriBlade9 Umm
23:10 VanessaE as long as the music can be turned off in the config, I'll be happy.
23:10 TriBlade9 At what stage can I set a static const?
23:10 TriBlade9 for a setting?
23:10 VanessaE (because I frequently have other stuff playing e.g. my own music)
23:10 pitriss game without music is 1000 times better than with music.. I preffer to listen my own than some neutral woodoo screaming from game
23:10 TriBlade9 ^^
23:10 ShadowNinja TriBlade9: It's a "s32 *(getS16)(const std::string &name) const"
23:11 ShadowNinja TriBlade9: It *returns* a s32.
23:11 paramat ^ this is why we need c55 as audiovisuals manager ;) you know his opinion on this and should respect it
23:11 ShadowNinja TriBlade9: (Signed 32-bit integer).
23:11 RealBadAngel VanessaE, to turn off the music one uses slider in menu
23:11 RealBadAngel not a dumb setting
23:11 VanessaE good enough.
23:12 ShadowNinja I'm O.K. with menu music, but it has to be something very neutral and mellow.
23:12 RealBadAngel there wont be music that would fit every one of you
23:12 pitriss if there will be different slider than the one for sound effects, good..
23:12 RealBadAngel never
23:12 RealBadAngel each one of you have different tastes
23:13 RealBadAngel if we will try to fit every taste out there minetest will never have any music
23:14 TriBlade9 ^
23:14 pitriss yes thats why it is better choice than with music..:) everyone can play its own one
23:15 RealBadAngel bullshit again
23:15 VanessaE it IS better to have some music than total silence.
23:15 jin_xi i think its ok for games to have music but i think engine does not need its own tune
23:15 VanessaE choosing the music is the hard part though
23:15 RealBadAngel point me ANY game out there without music
23:15 gentoobro minesweeper
23:15 jin_xi nethack
23:16 RealBadAngel yup, thats what im talking about
23:16 RealBadAngel real games do have music, sfx etc
23:16 pitriss everyone I was playing have possibility or I didn't played it:)
23:17 pitriss there was no game with music that was not boring after few hours playing
23:17 TriBlade9 Guys, just use Two Steps From Hell or Audiomachine for the main menu music
23:17 TriBlade9 It will be so epic that no one could hate it, because they'd be too busy winning a war
23:17 jin_xi scummVM does not play engine music i think and its what you expect imo
23:17 jin_xi music starts when you start the game you're running
23:18 pitriss It just need spossibility to be turned off without turning off sound effects and it will be okay even for me
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23:19 _3SidedSquare Might it be usefull to differ music to various mods?
23:19 ShadowNinja _3SidedSquare: Mods can play mucis, but this is for the main menu, which doesn't have mods.
23:19 ShadowNinja music*
23:19 _3SidedSquare Ah, sorry, came into the conversation mid-way
23:20 TriBlade9 Quick question
23:20 paramat Minetest is an excellent game without music
23:20 TriBlade9 Where would be the correct place to put a top-level static variable in game.cpp? Before the function that uses it or at the top?
23:21 pitriss paramat: :1
23:21 pitriss +1
23:21 pitriss damn i have typo day again, sorry
23:22 RealBadAngel paramat, so especially for you there will be a slider or a checkbox to DISABLE the music :)
23:22 RealBadAngel so you can live without music happily ever after ;)
23:23 TriBlade9 Imma just guess that you put it on the top then...
23:23 paramat thanks! but i'm against even the option hehe
23:24 pitriss RealBadAngel: promise that this slider will keep sound effects like digging sound and walk sounds enabled (to keep having audible feedback)
23:24 RealBadAngel music and sfx will be separate
23:24 ShadowNinja TriBlade9: Uh, why do you need one?
23:24 TriBlade9 So that the settings only get loaded once, not once per frame?
23:24 ShadowNinja TriBlade9: You should avoid globals if at all possible sanely.
23:25 TriBlade9 Oh
23:25 TriBlade9 Sorry, my C++ knowledge is dead
23:25 pitriss ok.. fine for me.. But still i think it is wasting of your time..:) I know many ppl who don't play on servers due ambience sounds:)
23:25 TriBlade9 How exactly would be the best way to do it then ShadowNinja?
23:25 ShadowNinja TriBlade9: No, make it a static variable local to that function.  static function variables are only initialized once.
23:25 TriBlade9 o
23:25 TriBlade9 ./derp
23:27 ShadowNinja TriBlade9: Like void foo() { const static int bar = foo2(); } int foo2() { dstream << "foo2" << std::endl; return 1; } int main() { foo(); foo(); }  -->  "foo2" printed only once.
23:28 ShadowNinja Just make sure it's an initialization and you don't do, eg, static const int x = 0; x = foo();
23:29 TriBlade9 Okay
23:29 TriBlade9 const static int or static const int?
23:29 TriBlade9 I did static const bool, compiled fine
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23:34 ShadowNinja TriBlade9: Doesn't matter.  Just make sure it's the right type.
23:35 TriBlade9 Okay, fixed it all ShadowNinja, thanks :D
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23:46 VanessaE http://pastebin.com/9m9PaTur
23:46 VanessaE is this of any use to anyone?
23:47 VanessaE (the rest of the "memory map" is available if desired)
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