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Nick |
Message |
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| 00:06 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> ireallyhateirc: yes, it's possible. for nodes you're semi-arbitrarily limited to 6 materials though. |
| 00:09 |
ireallyhateirc |
so each face is implemented as a separate material? |
| 00:09 |
ireallyhateirc |
well then I know how it works then |
| 00:09 |
ireallyhateirc |
(brain said "then" two times) |
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| 00:52 |
erle |
ireallyhateirc you have to make sure the export contains the separate materials, so better verify |
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| 03:58 |
Blockhead256 |
you should be able to use as many materials as you like on a mesh node, I haven't tested if that's the case though |
| 03:59 |
Blockhead256 |
anyway, a player model is like an entity, and I've used as many as (I think) 9 materials on those before - the linetrack mod boat |
| 04:00 |
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| 05:42 |
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| 05:42 |
unrealapex |
hello |
| 05:42 |
unrealapex |
does minetest work natively on wayland without xwayland? |
| 05:43 |
unrealapex |
using the latest version of minetest, this error saying i can't run it through wayland :/ https://bpa.st/E5LZK |
| 05:44 |
unrealapex |
i'm running minetest on gentoo with the dwl window manager. |
| 05:50 |
swift110-mobile |
Sup folks |
| 05:51 |
unrealapex |
hiya |
| 05:51 |
unrealapex |
do you know if minetest can run natively on wayland? |
| 05:55 |
Mantar |
I think if it can, you'd at least need to compile it with the SDL backend, which is still disabled by default as it causes some issues |
| 06:02 |
unrealapex |
this means i would need to compile it manually correct? |
| 06:03 |
unrealapex |
gentoo appears to have no use flag for sdl |
| 06:36 |
erle |
is there some way how i can mark an incompatible fork of a mod that has the same technical name? it ruins dependencies |
| 06:40 |
erle |
(repixture contains a fork of my “unicode_text“ mod that wuzzy removed features from and added one function to, but this mod is still named “unicode_text” – so any mod depending on “unicode_text” will not work as expected in repixture) |
| 06:42 |
erle |
(compare this to e.g. the various mineclones and tga_encoder, where any newer version of tga_encoder can be cleanly substituted for mods that depend on it for more features, as they are all API-compatible with the oldest version) |
| 07:12 |
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| 09:02 |
Blockhead256 |
erle: ContentDB right to a name rules mean Wuzzy should have to change his fork mod's name |
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| 13:58 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> Blockhead256: I'm not sure if RTAN applies here since it's in a game and games sort of get free reign to break things as they wish. Though I would agree that it would be cleanest if Wuzzy called his fork rp_unicode_text or something. |
| 13:59 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> Okay I just reread the section and it looks like it would apply here; it says "a package uses a name when it has that name or contains a mod that uses that name", and the definition of fork used seems to imply compatibility. |
| 14:00 |
Blockhead256 |
Wuzzy was previously asked to rename all the mods in his tutorial game and complied, so it should still apply the asame way |
| 14:08 |
erle |
tbh i don't doubt that wuzzy will do it *eventually*, i just don't want to be told later that i have tolerated an incompatible fork and then can't do anything about the issues resulting from it. |
| 14:09 |
erle |
luatic i think the “games get free reign to break stuff” is only for stuff that those games themselves introduced. e.g. the mineclone2 case where the internals changed often enough that stuff depending on it broke eventually unless it was merged into the game. |
| 14:10 |
erle |
in the same way i can make a single mod and make a future version incompatible with the older API and break dependents. but that's a different problem. |
| 14:11 |
erle |
(one that i doubt cdb will want to address anyway, given the HUGE amount of work it would cause for reviewers to make sure stuff is compatible.) |
| 14:11 |
MTDiscord |
<grorp> erle: fyi https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/15362 |
| 14:13 |
erle |
grorp oh that's nice. what GPU do you have? and does the PRANG! bug also happen with mesa software rendering? |
| 14:15 |
erle |
like, i wonder if the mesa software renderer just has some different default for clamp/repeat |
| 14:15 |
erle |
or if every GPU has? |
| 14:15 |
erle |
grorp please tell me when your patch is good enough that i can try to test it. |
| 14:28 |
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| 14:36 |
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| 14:37 |
erle |
grorp also i do not understand what is affected by your patch. all 2d sprites? all textures? |
| 14:45 |
MTDiscord |
<grorp> it affects everything rendered via Irrlicht's 2D functions - which makes it very hard to verify or test thoroughly |
| 14:46 |
MTDiscord |
<grorp> Irrlicht is annoying |
| 14:47 |
MTDiscord |
<grorp> erle: you can test it now |
| 14:47 |
erle |
maybe ask irrlicht upstream about possible , the dev is usually super fast about such things |
| 14:47 |
erle |
possible issues |
| 14:48 |
erle |
oki doki, will try to test later today |
| 14:49 |
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| 18:23 |
MinetestBot |
[git] Emojigit -> minetest/minetest: Rename Minetest to Luanti in .github/ files (#15357) d172819 https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commit/d1728199bbfa8bdd5ed975af7756500cb586e6b7 (2024-10-31T18:22:29Z) |
| 18:23 |
MinetestBot |
[git] grorp -> minetest/minetest: Fix some broken icons in the CDB dialog on Windows (#15363) 8b85a62 https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commit/8b85a62310f8757a10fe8f710ffe09a531cbb6d4 (2024-10-31T18:23:02Z) |
| 18:25 |
MinetestBot |
[git] sfan5 -> minetest/minetest: Don't memset SEvent directly (#15359) 5c55386 https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commit/5c5538685e59012727758ebc8228979ef7706700 (2024-10-31T18:24:43Z) |
| 19:03 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> Minetest 5.10.0 release candidate 1 is there, help testing it would be appreciated. See the forum post: https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?t=31095. |
| 19:03 |
ROllerozxa_ |
s/Minetest/Luanti/g |
| 19:04 |
MTDiscord |
<grorp> lol |
| 19:05 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> I was just testing you |
| 19:06 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> (old habits die hard) |
| 19:06 |
ROllerozxa |
indeed |
| 19:08 |
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| 20:01 |
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| 20:21 |
erle |
changing the project name also means where object files end up changes |
| 20:22 |
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| 21:14 |
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| 21:20 |
sfan5 |
reading the RC forum post, I strongly advise we dont care about whatever garbage hardware the Thinkpad R60 has |
| 21:22 |
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| 21:34 |
ROllerozxa |
I would hope erle has something slightly newer to use than an 18(?) year old thinkpad |
| 21:34 |
erle |
not this shit again |
| 21:34 |
erle |
the game works perfectly, the settings are just stupid |
| 21:34 |
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| 21:35 |
erle |
also my newer laptop is an MNT reform and the performance on it is kinda worse? can't test rn |
| 21:38 |
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| 21:42 |
erle |
sfan5 is it really garbage if the game *runs* but only the default settings are bullshit? |
| 21:43 |
erle |
i can bisect this and fix it |
| 21:43 |
erle |
:) |
| 21:43 |
erle |
i mean it should be possible to enable shaders only when you can actually compile a shader, should not be too hard |
| 21:43 |
erle |
i.e. not make it the default if the hardware does not have the capabilities |
| 21:45 |
erle |
also PLEASE stop the “i want to deprecate support for your hardware in particular” thing. i know you don't like me, i just want to play the game again. |
| 21:48 |
[ |
"whatever garbage hardware the Thinkpad R60 has" is far superior to most modern hardware that requires lots of blobs |
| 21:49 |
ireallyhateirc |
the absolute state of free (as in freedom) hardware in 2024 |
| 21:49 |
erle |
[ it is not even garbage if the game *works* and just bad settings make it crash |
| 21:49 |
erle |
i am testing more |
| 21:57 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> defaulting to turning shaders off if they fail to compile sounds like a good idea |
| 21:57 |
[ |
why do clouds require shaders now? |
| 21:57 |
ROllerozxa |
is it a regression or has shaders never worked on this laptop? |
| 21:58 |
[ |
clouds requiring shaders is a regression |
| 21:58 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> anyways erle could you provide the error message from failing to compile shaders? |
| 21:58 |
ROllerozxa |
[: it's a feature, since the shaderless codepaths are going to be removed soon |
| 21:59 |
erle |
i volunteer to maintain the shaderless code paths, how about that? |
| 21:59 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> clouds require shaders? |
| 21:59 |
ROllerozxa |
(I was asking erle if shaders used to work on the laptop, not squarebracket) |
| 22:00 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> can't repro, clouds work fine for me without shaders |
| 22:00 |
erle |
luatic, you need to test that on hardware that *can't* do shaders |
| 22:00 |
[ |
my source for clouds requring shaders is erle's report that they don't work on hardware that can't do shaders and 2024-10-13 19:19:36 +sfan5 something I just noticed is that since clouds now use shaders and we have clouds in the main menu that means Minetest will just not launch if you don't have shader support |
| 22:01 |
erle |
well that last thing depends on how bad the hardware is actually |
| 22:01 |
[ |
*requiring |
| 22:02 |
erle |
ROllerozxa even my T60 could do some shader things, but nothing in minetest/luanti ever worked or worked well with it, so i had them turned off. |
| 22:02 |
erle |
anyway, i am debugging something else now i found |
| 22:03 |
sfan5 |
main menu clouds require shaders so the menu will crash if they dont work unless you edit minetest.conf and disable shaders |
| 22:04 |
sfan5 |
good test for ppl with ancient hw tbh |
| 22:09 |
erle |
well i apretty sure they do not actually *need* to require fancy hardware. (do git log and look who touched the clouds in 2011 if you doubt it) |
| 22:10 |
erle |
look it is easy, i can bisect it and find where the clouds where broken, so people can actually use the game |
| 22:10 |
erle |
were |
| 22:10 |
erle |
(or someone can help if you know where it was broken and maybe explain what you gained from that) |
| 22:11 |
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| 22:14 |
erle |
“let's make a release candidate to see if there are new bugs” – “no, not like that!” :( |
| 22:20 |
erle |
luatic here is the star shader error message (with some german) https://mister-muffin.de/p/pn8C.html |
| 22:21 |
erle |
this is the case “crash when entering a world”, i posted the error for “crash when entering menu” into the RC thread |
| 22:22 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> lol what |
| 22:22 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> is the vertex shader straight up missing the body? |
| 22:22 |
MTDiscord |
<greenxenith> luanti moment |
| 22:22 |
erle |
i have no idea what this is sorry |
| 22:23 |
erle |
last time i wrote some shader code was when rubenwardy claimed an old thinkpad can't do shaders. turns out – the thinkpad T60 could, but it unrolled every loop in shader code. |
| 22:24 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> erle: going upwards from "End of Vertex shader program", I would have expected to find "void main(void) { gl_Position = mWorldViewProj * inVertexPosition; }" there (see stars_shader/opengl_vertex.glsl), but it isn't there |
| 22:24 |
erle |
well |
| 22:24 |
erle |
no idea |
| 22:24 |
erle |
what should i do? |
| 22:24 |
erle |
maybe see if the git repo is broken on my end? |
| 22:24 |
rubenwardy |
Sounds like pretty bad shader support |
| 22:24 |
erle |
luatic btw try unifont as a font. the graphical corruption does not seem to happen with other fonts |
| 22:24 |
erle |
one moment |
| 22:25 |
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| 22:26 |
erle |
luatic i will investigate this |
| 22:27 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> my current guess would be that we're doing some preprocessing and it's throwing it out for some reason |
| 22:27 |
erle |
hmm |
| 22:28 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> sorry i don't feel like debugging this right now, i'm writing an exercise for fun currently :P |
| 22:33 |
erle |
hmm |
| 22:34 |
erle |
luatic there were indeed some shader files just *gone*. i assume updating git repo from some 1 year old version or so could do that? |
| 22:34 |
erle |
or maybe not? |
| 22:35 |
erle |
thanks to everyone who helped and no thanks to everyone whos knee-jerk reaction was to *immediately* say that my hardware is shit. |
| 22:36 |
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| 23:05 |
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| 23:25 |
erle |
sundown in mineclonia (oysterity anarchy server), rendered on “garbage hardware” https://mister-muffin.de/p/xAGG.png |
| 23:25 |
erle |
as you can see, there are clouds! |
| 23:27 |
[ |
is that 5.10? |
| 23:28 |
erle |
i think so? |
| 23:28 |
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| 23:28 |
MTDiscord |
<luatic> it is 5.10-rc1 probably 🤓 |
| 23:29 |
erle |
yeah |
| 23:31 |
erle |
for the record, the oldest well-working experience i can get is currently MESA_GL_VERSION_OVERRIDE=1.4 MESA_EXTENSION_MAX_YEAR=2005 |
| 23:31 |
erle |
(these are given so you can try it out and see it work) |
| 23:32 |
erle |
IIRC you used to be able to go a bit more back in terms of MESA_EXTENSION_MAX_YEAR, but everything seems to *still* run on a potato, except if shaders are enabled |
| 23:33 |
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| 23:34 |
erle |
i mean you can go further back with luanti 5.10-rc1, but then you do not have D24S8 and suddenly have rendering issues (this can be fixed, but i doubt anyone wants to) |
| 23:35 |
erle |
as i said before, it works fine. though the 30gps at 200 view range start to go down as soon as i a) see a huge glass wall b) have the mapgen running on the same machine as the renderer. 200 view range is excessive though. |
| 23:35 |
erle |
30fps |
| 23:36 |
erle |
(in mineclonia, simpler games have not such a complex mapgen) |
