Time  Nick             Message
09:33 Furi0us_mat      hello everyone, yes it's me again, but this time it's not for code, it's for an exporter and 3D importer problem, as you know ARK is a dinos game, and who says dinos says 3D models, here's the problem :
09:33 Furi0us_mat      I'm using Blender 2.90.0 with a 3D exporter and importer, here it is: https://github.com/joric/io_scene_b3d
09:33 Furi0us_mat      I also have Blender 4.2 on my computer, but I haven't found any importer or exporter for this version. The problem is that the animations are never preserved, which means that if I import a model with animations, the animations disappear, and when my models are put into the exporter, the animations are not preserved.
09:33 Furi0us_mat      I'd like to know which importer/exporter you use.
09:33 Furi0us_mat      (about 16 models of my game have animations removed or bad models, moreover if people know how to make models better than me)
13:09 Furi0us_mat      Hi, I'd like to know how to export a minetest 3D model to b3d.
13:09 Krock            Furi0us_mat: what kind of model have you got? Usually Blender should have you covered
13:09 Krock            there's a plugin to export to b3d which you might need to install first
13:10 Furi0us_mat      well I'm making dino models for my game, using blender 2.90 with b3d exporter and importer
13:10 Furi0us_mat      but the problem is that model animations are not preserved
13:11 ireallyhateirc   most b3d importers fail to import animations
13:11 ireallyhateirc   so if you don't have the .blender file then it's over
13:11 Krock            I've heard of this problem but only for .obj exports. b3d should work if done properly - see 3d_armor models for example
13:12 Furi0us_mat      how to keep the animations as more than 20 dinos just slide across the floor without moving their legs, when they should be.
13:12 ireallyhateirc   https://github.com/GreenXenith/io_scene_b3d/
13:13 ireallyhateirc   this thing works as a good exporter for Blender 3.x
13:13 ireallyhateirc   this thing apparently works https://github.com/assimp/assimp
13:13 ireallyhateirc   as an importer
13:13 Krock            let's hope it does not import ass
13:13 ireallyhateirc   but it is "Assimp - Animation is allegedly hit-or-miss"
13:14 ireallyhateirc   Krock, I'm fine if it does though
13:15 Furi0us_mat      here's the problem: I've tested almost every version of blender with this addon: https://github.com/GreenXenith/io_scene_b3d/
13:15 Furi0us_mat      none of them kept the animations
13:16 Furi0us_mat      with which most minetest 3D models are exported, such as draconis, paleotest, mobs_animal or mobs_monster, ...
13:17 Furi0us_mat      some exporters even decomposed the model (all the cubes ended up all over the place).
13:17 MinetestBot      02[git] 04Zughy -> 03minetest/minetest: Docs: Clarify rotation syntax of `model` formspec element (#14997) 13792fb13 https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commit/792fb13ac646dc8c2739e9f56a8fed566f4960f9 (152024-08-17T13:16:37Z)
13:25 Furi0us_mat      Here is an example of the problem, I would like to use this 3D model: https://sketchfab.com/3d-models/baryonyx-fc859162cc5043d1ade3d63b8c3e73bf
13:25 Furi0us_mat      but the animation is not preserved, and this is the case for many models, including those made by me.
13:29 ireallyhateirc   Furi0us_mat, yeah most modders are bad enough not to provide .blend files in the source code
13:29 ireallyhateirc   .blend files are kind of like source code and exported models are kind of like binaries
13:30 ireallyhateirc   this is a bad combo of using abandonware 3D model format and a community that doesn't know what they're doing :D
13:31 ireallyhateirc   we'll hopefully get gltf fast enough
13:33 MTDiscord        <warr1024> Remember that anything you download from CDB might be "compiled", in the sense that we encourage people to omit files that MT can't use, especially large ones.  Make sure you're getting the source and not just the distribution edition.
13:35 Furi0us_mat      I've done a few things and now I'm getting something I've never had before: https://ibb.co/5vTPQr1
13:35 Furi0us_mat      before it said “no properties”.
13:36 ireallyhateirc   warr1024, I often grab files straight from git repos, yeah
13:37 ireallyhateirc   though the presence of source code is mandatory to get listed on CDB, right?
13:38 MTDiscord        <warr1024> Well, source code is always present in mods to begin with, and CDB disallows things like obfuscation.
13:38 ireallyhateirc   okay, great. was going to ask about that since many JS websites do just that
13:39 MTDiscord        <warr1024> It's still possible for people to just never check their blend files into their git repos anyway, and CDB can't really guard against that.
13:39 MTDiscord        <warr1024> but if a package doesn't have a public git repo that actually has proper source, it's also less likely that the package itself is of sufficient quality for somebody to care about :-D
13:39 ireallyhateirc   from a limited number of data I can tell that most don't ship .blend
13:40 rubenwardy       CDB doesn't have any rule requiring soruce files for 3d models currently
13:40 rubenwardy       with gltf, hopefully it becomes a non-issue
13:40 ireallyhateirc   3D models are mostly data and are not executed like code->binaries so the issue is minor
13:41 ireallyhateirc   idk where did I read that, but probably the FSF encourages to add "source" files for images, like GIMP files with layers and such
13:41 ireallyhateirc   because that makes everything less painful for everyone
13:42 ireallyhateirc   I always add .blend files for stuff I work on to git repo
13:42 MTDiscord        <warr1024> Even with gltf I'd still want blend files in the source repo, since they're the preferred form for editing and even if gltf can fit a ton of editing-specific metadata, I'd rather not include it in compiled-for-distribution versions
13:42 MTDiscord        <warr1024> but blend files are thicc so I'd still want to exclude them from compiled biulds.
13:42 ireallyhateirc   like I did with my fish models for Exile
13:43 ireallyhateirc   yeah, .blend files have defined materials, UV mapping and such
13:43 Furi0us_mat      and speaking of content DB, I wanted to put my game on content db in February, (in the end I preferred to keep working on it to improve it)
13:43 Furi0us_mat      and I was told that: “please make sure that your game complies with https://content.minetest.net/policy_and_guidance/#31-right-to-a-name the the apis/textures are compatible, else please namespace (for example namespaceprefix_modname) the mod.”
13:43 Furi0us_mat      and I answered this: “I didn't exactly understand what you were asking me, I tried to understand and from what I understood from must: for example add mark_survival_ascended in the name of all mods for example
13:43 ShadowBot        https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/31 -- GUI Tooltips
13:43 Furi0us_mat      mark_survival_ascended_paleotest
13:43 Furi0us_mat      but having read 3.2 I could see the forks, most of the mods in the game have been heavily edited, some things have been added, deleted, modified,...
13:43 Furi0us_mat      moreover, if I change mod names, should I just change the file name or the mod name in mod.conf?”
13:45 MTDiscord        <warr1024> I include "source" for all my media if there's ever a circumstance where I might want to edit them and just altering the "compiled" versions doesn't cover everything.  I've actually got a lot of media where the source includes stuff like scripts that build animation strips or bakes translated text onto images using imagemagick, svg files, etc.
13:45 Furi0us_mat      speaking of content DB, I wanted to put my game on content db in February, (in the end I preferred to keep working on it to improve it)
13:45 Furi0us_mat      and I was told that: “please make sure that your game complies with https://content.minetest.net/policy_and_guidance/#31-right-to-a-name the the apis/textures are compatible, else please namespace (for example namespaceprefix_modname) the mod.”
13:45 ShadowBot        https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/31 -- GUI Tooltips
13:46 rubenwardy       Furi0us_mat: the idea of namespacing is that any brand new mods specific to the game should be prefixed with the game's namespace. Which could be `msa_` or `mark_survival_ascended_`
13:46 ireallyhateirc   Ok so my fish .blend file is 1.3MB while the .b3d is 500KiB
13:46 rubenwardy       it stops games using more general mod names
13:46 rubenwardy       it's fine to use the original names for existing mods though like paleotest as long as it remains compatible with the third party version
13:46 rubenwardy       for example, lots of games ship with `mobs`
13:46 rubenwardy       and that's good as it keeps API compatibility
13:47 Furi0us_mat      i.e. in my game, for example, a new mod would be “artifact” and I'd have to rename it mark_survival_ascended_artifact.
13:47 Furi0us_mat      is that correct?
13:48 Furi0us_mat      but for all existing mods, no need, just rename it, i.e. all the mods? or just the folder?
13:52 Furi0us_mat      I made the change but problem, if I have to add that “mark_survival_ascended_artifact” I get this error :
13:52 Furi0us_mat      https://paste.sqt.wtf/fce61a
13:54 rubenwardy       you need to change all item names as well
13:54 rubenwardy       I'd also recommend msa_artifact
13:55 ireallyhateirc   artifact:artifact_of_the_hunter ->  mark_survival_ascended_artifact:artifact_of_the_hunter
13:55 Furi0us_mat      this is problematic for the whole endgame =L
13:55 ireallyhateirc   the thing before ":" needs to be the same as mod name
13:55 ireallyhateirc   just use "sed" or something?
13:56 Furi0us_mat      it's problematic for the overseer, it's already present on the map, and changing all the blocks that make up the arena is annoying, fortunately I mostly changed stuff on existing mods (so they're not new).
13:57 ireallyhateirc   you have aliases for that
13:57 ireallyhateirc   a little painful but not impossible
14:01 Furi0us_mat      I was sure about the aliases, for example here's the overseer registration code: https://paste.sqt.wtf/88cd9b
14:01 Furi0us_mat      I should add msa_endgame, but since it's already present on the map, I can do it like this (does it work on entities?) :
14:01 Furi0us_mat      https://paste.sqt.wtf/514152
14:12 ireallyhateirc   not sure, ever tried with entities
14:26 Furi0us_mat      ok well it's going to be hard for me, no for the entities it doesn't work =L
14:27 ireallyhateirc   I think you'd need to replace existing entities with entities with a new name
14:27 ireallyhateirc   idk if that's possible though
14:36 AwesomeAdam54321 Does minetest's code still use singletons?
14:37 Krock            AwesomeAdam54321: there's a few
14:51 MinetestBot      02[git] 04rubenwardy -> 03minetest/minetest: Use JSON file for credits (#14956) 13b0ad9a6 https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commit/b0ad9a6c3321c58044c5bcb5d2c0d904487d14fa (152024-08-17T14:49:53Z)
14:55 Furi0us_mat      for namespaces, is it the same for edited mods and new mods or only NEW mods?
14:56 rubenwardy       it depends on how much you edit
14:56 rubenwardy       light edits should keep the same name for compatibility
14:56 rubenwardy       if you edit so much as to break the API, then new name
14:57 rubenwardy       Minetest uses mod names for dependencies. The idea behind all these rules isn't to make life harder for you, it's to make the dependency system more reliable
14:58 Furi0us_mat      for the mod “default” it has been edited, the map is practically made of these blocks, is it for you a lot or a little: https://paste.sqt.wtf/13f8d2
15:01 Furi0us_mat      If we were to make the system more modular, we'd have to use modules in a different way than having to copy the whole thing into our folder. A bit like package.json(.lock) or composer.json(.lock). You'd have to be able to tell that your games called on this or that mod. If I understand your request correctly, I'll have to redo the entire map,
15:01 Furi0us_mat      because the data is in the map.sqlite file... what do you think of it? do you have a solution for editing the map.sqlite file? I can open it and list the elements, but I can't edit the binary column.
17:49 MinetestBot      02[git] 04j-r -> 03minetest/minetest: Add shared mods path to get_modpaths 131fb49e9 https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commit/1fb49e9ca7c66251503be47608243f124061bf44 (152024-08-17T17:48:40Z)
17:49 MinetestBot      02[git] 04Emojigit -> 03minetest/minetest: Translate access denied strings (#14842) 135acc273 https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commit/5acc2736db4583a4e7c23484ef3d89d4bf931b7b (152024-08-17T17:48:54Z)
17:51 MinetestBot      02[git] 04sfan5 -> 03minetest/minetest: Irrlicht cleanups (mostly getting rid of `core::array`) 135d22626 https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commit/5d226268df764c36fc4d550c3c0bc980c7e34f0d (152024-08-17T17:49:11Z)
17:51 MinetestBot      02[git] 04lhofhansl -> 03minetest/minetest: Remove SAO::onAttach() and SAO::onDetach() 133df070f https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commit/3df070f352520c3678e509f7c096977b62d2e3bf (152024-08-17T17:49:38Z)
19:04 MinetestBot      02[git] 04cx384 -> 03minetest/minetest: Add whitespace checks to ci 13c65444c https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commit/c65444c43b3aa446a57aa72bb887b83441925aad (152024-08-17T19:02:54Z)
19:04 MinetestBot      02[git] 04cx384 -> 03minetest/minetest: Fix whitespaces 1303e600a https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commit/03e600a721c79d5cdce699123e698cd380abcf1c (152024-08-17T19:02:54Z)
19:23 MinetestBot      02[git] 04cx384 -> 03minetest/minetest: Fix trailing whitespace from #14945 1348845de https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commit/48845de46ef400e532f2108dfb9ff9a3107bd66a (152024-08-17T19:22:26Z)