Time Nick Message 01:40 MTDiscord how do I get the stack from an '__builtin:item' objectreference? 01:42 MTDiscord ItemStack(obj:get_luaentity().itemstring) 01:43 MTDiscord great, thx 05:36 BoostedMenchers seems that minetest still gets the DPI for fonts the same way it always has 05:36 BoostedMenchers when the X server is configured with the screen's actual dimensions minetest renders the font too large 05:36 BoostedMenchers at least on displays that have a real DPI higher than 96 05:36 BoostedMenchers which is … most modern displays 05:55 erlehmann BoostedMenchers yeah it should use font DPI 05:55 erlehmann not DPI 06:22 erlehmann BoostedMenchers you tested https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/11848 or what? 06:29 BoostedMenchers looking at it 06:36 erlehmann BoostedMenchers i remain a bit sceptical of the 72 dpi claim, but if it works … 06:36 erlehmann v-rob do you have a mac? 06:36 v-rob I do not. 06:37 v-rob However, the definition of a point is 1/72 of an inch, i.e. 72 DPI 06:37 v-rob Or PPI, more accurately 06:37 v-rob But it amounts to the same thing 06:37 erlehmann well it is good that you looked into it i guess 06:37 erlehmann so how about font dpi? 06:38 erlehmann every other application i have tried uses font dpi, not dpi 06:38 erlehmann those are two different settings, at least on X11 06:39 BoostedMenchers the two things I've seen that display oversized fonts with the real DPI configured are GTK2 and Irrlicht 06:39 v-rob Not sure about what that is. All I know is that fonts are generally measured in points (unless you use CSS px or something), and Minetest has been measuring them in some non-existent measurement unit that is kind of like a point but not really. In any case, using points is an improvement, and Unifont works correctly at a size of 12 like it should. 06:41 erlehmann v-rob look at this https://linuxreviews.org/HOWTO_set_DPI_in_Xorg#How_DPI_Values_Are_Used 06:41 erlehmann v-rob, you have linux? 06:42 v-rob I use Windows. I used to have a Linux VM sitting around, but not ATM. 06:42 erlehmann v-rob wait, i give you a screenshot 06:44 BoostedMenchers “This also sets the value reported as physical size of the X screen as a whole (union of all configured monitors). In configurations with multiple monitors with different DPIs, the value has no physical meaning, but it may be used by some legacy clients which do not support RandR version 1.2 to compute a reference font scaling.” 06:44 BoostedMenchers from the xrandr manpage, regarding "--dpi from-output" 06:44 erlehmann v-rob the bottom setting changes font dpi https://mister-muffin.de/p/7mRE.png 06:48 v-rob OK, so from what I can see, Minetest just doesn't check font DPI -- it just uses the system DPI to scale everything uniformly. Hence, my code uses the system DPI and won't reflect the font DPI. However, if you provided some code to get font DPI for X11, it probably wouldn't be too difficult to make it use font DPI 06:49 BoostedMenchers what exactly is the font_require_multiple setting? 06:49 BoostedMenchers the description seems to imply it is a boolean but it takes an integer 06:49 erlehmann the naming could use work lol 06:50 BoostedMenchers an integer >1 06:50 v-rob Unifont is a pixel font, so it only looks good at size 12, 24, 36, 48, etc. If you set that setting to 12, it'll only allow the font to be one of those values 06:50 erlehmann 12 what 06:50 v-rob points 06:50 v-rob The name definitely could use work 06:50 BoostedMenchers pixel font == bitmap font? 06:51 BoostedMenchers ok 06:51 erlehmann the problem is also that unifont is a 16 pixel high bitmap font 06:51 erlehmann so where do i set “16 pixel” as the size? 06:52 v-rob They're measured in points, like said before. If you look at the Unifont page (http://unifoundry.com/unifont/index.html) you can find that the default size is 12 points, which, for this font in particular, will turn out to be 16 pixels tall. 06:53 v-rob It's unfortunate that fonts are measured in points, but points really doesn't correspond well to their actual height. That's why things like CSS em are a good idea. 06:53 erlehmann i have contributed to unifont. i am more thinking about how to actually configure a pixel font base size. 06:54 BoostedMenchers it has font_path, font_path_bold, font_path_italic, font_path_bold_italic… 06:54 BoostedMenchers are you reimplementing fontconfig in minetest or irrlicht :P 06:54 v-rob Also, pixel font != bitmap font. A pixel font is a design, but a bitmap font is a format for storing a font, as opposed to TTF 06:54 erlehmann v-rob, i'll research font dpi. btw, i think it is a thing in windows too. it is called “custom sizing” https://www.top-password.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2016/11/custom-sizing-options.png 06:55 erlehmann i might be wrong about this 06:55 BoostedMenchers ah 06:55 v-rob Pretty sure that Windows doesn't have font DPI. It has scaling factors that scale stuff universally though. 06:56 erlehmann ok 06:57 erlehmann ok so the standard is standard is 1 pt = 1/72" 06:58 BoostedMenchers I'm still not entirely sure what's happening 06:58 BoostedMenchers the X server by default reports one of it's DPI values as 96 no matter what 06:58 BoostedMenchers they changed it, briefly, and the result was some clients showed oversized fonts (GTK2 and Irrlicht) 06:59 BoostedMenchers it's been reverted 06:59 erlehmann so 12 pt should be 0.16" tall on a 96dpi display 06:59 erlehmann BoostedMenchers that was the *default* 06:59 erlehmann you can still change it 06:59 BoostedMenchers yeah 06:59 BoostedMenchers I have it reporting the real DPI now 07:00 erlehmann and do you get crisp or blurry unifont? 07:00 BoostedMenchers haven't tried 07:00 erlehmann pls try 07:00 BoostedMenchers lets see I have it installed 07:01 BoostedMenchers found the path 07:01 erlehmann i do not agree with v-rob that it is ok to remove pixel font support in a minor release (als note that the current state is broken so that you can end up in a situation where you have no working font), but i do agree with him that there is a significant benefit to having non-blurry fonts work with a single code path and pixel fonts can probably be deprecated if *all* of that works. 07:02 erlehmann als → also 07:02 erlehmann i meant “bitmap fonts can be deprecated” 07:03 erlehmann v-rob btw, how can i prevent the rainbow spam with ttf font, is there any option? 07:03 v-rob Rainbow? 07:03 erlehmann some ppl make every letter a different color using CSMs 07:03 erlehmann it is very hard to read 07:03 erlehmann so i use non-colored pixel font 07:05 v-rob Oh, disabling colorization of fonts. I'm not sure where I stand on that TBH, but it wouldn't be difficult. If the other core devs think that's a good idea, then I can add it to the PR. 07:06 BoostedMenchers I don't see a difference with font_require multiple being 1 or 12 07:06 BoostedMenchers http://menche.us/files/font2.png 07:06 erlehmann BoostedMenchers try 16 07:06 erlehmann or 13 07:07 v-rob Try setting the font to a different size than 12 07:07 erlehmann and turn off antialiasing 07:07 v-rob If multiple is 12 and size is 13, the size should be overridden to be 12 07:07 erlehmann now we do have a problem here, the default font size is 16pt 07:08 BoostedMenchers so multiple=12, size=13, antialiasing off? 07:08 erlehmann v-rob, but if the dpi was wrong, the default should be changed to 12pt 07:08 BoostedMenchers oh antialiasing makes a bit of a difference 07:08 v-rob For Unifont size 12 with the PR, it shouldn't be necessary to disable anti-aliasing 07:08 v-rob The PR changes the default from 16 to 12 07:08 v-rob for font size 07:08 BoostedMenchers wow it's thinner with that off 07:08 erlehmann well that image is surely blurry http://menche.us/files/font2.png 07:09 erlehmann BoostedMenchers can you give a non-blurry image? 07:09 BoostedMenchers yeah that has antialiasing on 07:09 BoostedMenchers which settings? 07:09 BoostedMenchers so multiple=12, size=13, antialiasing off? 07:09 v-rob Yeah, see, that's a problem. Your screenshot says the font size is 12, so that means my PR apparently doesn't work properly on Linux. That's problematic. 07:10 BoostedMenchers https://menche.us/files/font3.png 07:10 erlehmann uh 07:10 BoostedMenchers make sure to zoom because the browser will smooth out the PNG when it's zoomed out 07:10 v-rob Actually, do you have a custom GUI scaling or screen density scaling factor applied? That might cause a difference. 07:10 BoostedMenchers I'll set X's DPI to 96 07:11 BoostedMenchers https://menche.us/files/font4.png 07:11 erlehmann BoostedMenchers can you post the screenshots including the exact settings and OS and DPI at which you took the screenshot to the PR? 07:11 BoostedMenchers ok 07:12 BoostedMenchers see it is a lot smaller now 07:12 BoostedMenchers that's what I'm used to seeing 07:12 erlehmann oh LOL 07:12 erlehmann BoostedMenchers, the slashes 07:12 BoostedMenchers I just did `xrandr --dpi 96` before relaunching mt for that shot 07:13 BoostedMenchers those 07:13 BoostedMenchers aren't straight lines 07:13 BoostedMenchers lol 07:13 v-rob Enable antialiasing. Disabling it can cause artifacts. It's a trade-off 07:13 v-rob Artifacts such as the slashes 07:13 BoostedMenchers I just set font-size to 12 07:13 BoostedMenchers no more artifacts, antialiasing still off 07:14 v-rob Cool 07:14 BoostedMenchers https://menche.us/files/font5.png 07:14 v-rob So, I apparently need to do more DPI experimentation 07:14 BoostedMenchers err wait 07:14 BoostedMenchers nvm 07:14 erlehmann ok so this is evidence that the patch does not work right on linux? https://mister-muffin.de/p/QVe2.png 07:14 BoostedMenchers it was on again 07:14 erlehmann the 3 is broken too 07:14 erlehmann but the slashes are funny 07:15 erlehmann v-rob as i said, i am willing to help. i want crisp fonts, *how* i get them is not that important. 07:15 v-rob That's what disabling antialiasing does for Windows as well. As said, you get crisp fonts no matter what with disabled antialiasing, but you get artifacts 07:15 v-rob Turn antialiasing back on 07:15 BoostedMenchers funny, with antialiasing off it looks *better* with font_require_multiple=13 07:15 BoostedMenchers at least the slashes 07:16 v-rob OK, listen up! Antialiasing looks **better** for sizes that are not multiples of 12, but it looks **worse** for non-multiples of 12. That's how it works 07:17 BoostedMenchers ok 07:17 BoostedMenchers lol 07:17 v-rob Err, I mean looks worse for multiples of 12 07:17 BoostedMenchers that seems counterintuitive on its face 07:17 BoostedMenchers wonder what happens when you throw subpixel filtering and hinting into this! 07:19 v-rob This is all in relation to getting crisp pixel fonts, of course. For normal fonts, none of that applies, and you leave antialiasing on. 07:20 BoostedMenchers I find myself unable to form an opinion regarding what could be considered a sane default here 07:21 erlehmann i would call the setting crisp_font_base_size AND make it local to every font 07:22 erlehmann or pixel_font_base_size_in_points or whatever ;) 07:23 erlehmann v-rob something about having no antialiasing producing holes irritates me. why is that the case? 07:23 BoostedMenchers what about a snap_to_multiple boolean setting 07:24 erlehmann snap to multiples of what 07:24 v-rob Here's a chart of antialiasing enabled and disabled for multiples of 12: https://user-images.githubusercontent.com/31123645/145352031-70aa856c-b646-463c-9b4e-a695260a21f3.png 07:24 BoostedMenchers that sets the font size to the closest multiple of 12 to the font_size setting 07:24 v-rob That's what the font_require_multiple does 07:24 v-rob Yeah, it's just badly named 07:25 BoostedMenchers it is not a boolean 07:25 BoostedMenchers ok 07:25 erlehmann it should not be a boolean 07:25 BoostedMenchers does it just overwrite font_size 07:25 BoostedMenchers ok 07:25 BoostedMenchers different pixel fonts might have different values for which they are designed? 07:25 erlehmann v-rob i do not understand why the slashes look so bad bottom left 07:26 erlehmann BoostedMenchers yes. with bitmap fonts (PNG+XML) you got that “for free” because, well, the size of the bitmap font has to be known to cut out the glyphs from the spritesheet 07:26 erlehmann i.e. it does not scale, ever 07:26 BoostedMenchers ok 07:27 BoostedMenchers but Unifont is made to look pixelated but is TrueType 07:27 BoostedMenchers and that's the root of the problem? 07:27 v-rob Here's the scoop on disabling antialiasing: What it does is disables font smoothing. You will not have smooth fonts if you disable it, period. This is good-ish for Unifont at non-sizes of 12. _However_, it's just an approximation and tries to do its best. As you can see, that doesn't work out too well for the slashes. 07:27 erlehmann unifont is a bitmap font that is forced to use trootype 07:27 erlehmann truetype format 07:27 BoostedMenchers huh what 07:27 BoostedMenchers ok 07:28 erlehmann ttf is a … difficult … format if you want to support unicode, because you are limited in the number of glyphs 07:28 v-rob Now, ignore anti-aliasing for a moment. font_require_multiple is all you need to emulate bitmap fonts: it's a way of forcing integer scaling. 07:28 erlehmann so you need multiple fallback ttfs to support unicode 07:29 v-rob Bitmap is... and even more difficult format for Unicode because they almost always don't support complex scripts, ligatures, other glyph substitution, etc. 07:29 v-rob == Problem 07:29 erlehmann “bitmap” is not a format 07:29 v-rob Bitmap formats 07:29 erlehmann uh? 07:29 BoostedMenchers openbsd's Xorg set ships with *.pcf.gz formatted fonts 07:29 v-rob E.g. the one sfan5 made 07:29 BoostedMenchers for the bitmap ones 07:30 BoostedMenchers hmm there's 100dpi and 75dpi bitmpas 07:30 BoostedMenchers bitmaps 07:30 v-rob Still, if my PR works out properly (and I might just remove the antialiasing and stick with multiples) then there's no need for bitmap fonts anyway 07:30 erlehmann v-rob i am solely bitching about the difficulties unifont as a bitmap font has supporting unicode via ttf 07:31 erlehmann v-rob only if all the other breakage is fixed as well 07:31 BoostedMenchers hooo boy that's a lot of files in there… I guess each bitmap font needs a whole series of gzipped PCF files to cover a decent set of glyphs 07:32 BoostedMenchers but… *should* antialiasing introduce artefacts with multiples of 12? 07:32 v-rob There's no point MT has to support bitmaps, especially if TTF can do everything bitmap can. 07:32 v-rob OK, forget antialiasing. Pretend it never existed. 07:32 BoostedMenchers I assume it'll default to on 07:33 BoostedMenchers ok 07:33 v-rob yeah. 07:33 v-rob I'll remove it from the PR, it's really not helpful. 07:33 v-rob Just use the multiples setting 07:33 erlehmann v-rob right now if you have a pixel font defined in 5.4.1 (i.e. disable freetype at runtime in the GUI settings) and then update to 5.5-dev you get a) a non-working game b) a wrong error message 07:34 v-rob Whoop-de-doo. Change the error message or something. It's not a reason to keep bitmaps. 07:34 erlehmann v-rob, i believe “game does not start because a feature was ripped out without deprecating it and/or automatically fixing it” is bad 07:34 v-rob Like, one line change 07:34 erlehmann i made an issue about the error message being wrong but sfan5 closed it as a duplicate i think 07:34 v-rob How many people use bitmap fonts? Like, approximately you and nobody else 07:34 BoostedMenchers I kinda like Terminus 07:35 BoostedMenchers … not sure I'd use it 07:35 erlehmann i wonder where the upvotes os the PR come, is it me and my 3 alt accounts? 07:35 v-rob Probably people who support Unifont and don't realize that TTF can do it 07:35 v-rob That's all it talks about in the PR description 07:35 erlehmann i am a contributor to unifont, just so you know 07:35 MTDiscord given at least one of those is a person who upvotes basically everything and used to spam emotestill vrob called them out 07:35 BoostedMenchers lol /usr/local/share/fonts/terminus has 238 gzipped pcf files 07:35 v-rob If someone makes a PR to rip out bitmap fonts, then that PR can change the error message/fix people's configurations 07:36 erlehmann if you have unifont and you see emoji, i have made like hundreds of them 07:36 v-rob I'm not sure how that's relevant 07:36 BoostedMenchers not sure how I'd even use Terminus with minetest, or if it supports that bitmap format 07:37 v-rob Unifont is cool, and I'm making a PR to make Unifont TTF work and make bitmap fonts unnecessary. That's kind of the idea here. 07:37 erlehmann v-rob i retract my offer of helping, at least short-term. i absolutely hate the kind of “oh, you complain, that must mean only YOU use the thing” argument. years of software development have shown be that for each bug filed you have approx. 10 to 100 people (depending on the size of the project) who never file bugs even when they run into them several times a week. 07:37 v-rob It makes our code simpler and makes supporting Unicode possible regardless of font 07:37 erlehmann and it's kind of a standard response by lazy devs too 07:37 erlehmann shown be → shown me 07:38 v-rob Nobody complained when the feature flat out didn't work in the past. It seems likely that no one was using it. 07:38 erlehmann uh, but it did work? 07:38 v-rob I forget the exact versions, but it didn't for many 0.4 versions 07:38 BoostedMenchers whoa I crashed it 07:38 BoostedMenchers 2021-12-08 23:38:37: ERROR[Main]: FontEngine: attempt to use font size 0 07:38 erlehmann how lol 07:39 v-rob Yeah, I don't like how FontEngine just crashes on failure. It could be a little more graceful. 07:39 BoostedMenchers I set a 32x64 font, then went to set font_require_multiple to 32, and it crashed 07:39 erlehmann BoostedMenchers to paraphrase v-rob, “How many people use that font size? Like, approximately you and nobody else” 07:40 BoostedMenchers oooh 07:40 erlehmann LOL ;) 07:40 BoostedMenchers font_size was still 13 07:40 erlehmann hahahahahahaha 07:40 BoostedMenchers and the closest multiple of 32 to 13 07:40 BoostedMenchers is 0 07:40 v-rob Please, don't be toxic. I don't say ridiculous things. 07:40 erlehmann v-rob i was of jokings 07:40 v-rob ok 07:40 erlehmann v-rob you should prob fix the 0 multiple thing though ;) 07:40 v-rob yes 07:41 BoostedMenchers and I'll use a smaller font 07:41 erlehmann If someone makes a PR to rip out bitmap fonts, then that PR can change the error message/fix people's configurations 07:41 erlehmann yes i agree 07:41 erlehmann but no one has done the work 07:41 erlehmann and again, stuff needs to be DEPRECATED if anyone is using it before removing it 07:41 v-rob After my PR, the work can actually be done since bitmaps are then redundant 07:41 erlehmann only if you tell me how i remove the font coloring 07:42 v-rob Like I said, talk to the other devs 07:42 v-rob If they think it's good, I'll add it to the PR 07:42 erlehmann i do not youbt that freetype can do everything better. but it *has* to actually do that. 07:43 v-rob I don't know if disabling a feature games may rely on is really a "feature", so that's why I'm neutral here 07:43 erlehmann i have seen how taking away working code in the name of maintainability works in other projects. first, claiming “we'll fix it eventually” is a lie, most of the time. second, you lose access to the feature. third, people usually remove what they themselves do not use. 07:43 v-rob E.g. a team battle game where nametags of opposing teams are different colors. I don't knoww 07:43 erlehmann it's not about nametags. and also the game so far provides a method to shut that off. 07:44 erlehmann it's about clowns who make every letter a different color. i have problems with contrast perception. 07:44 erlehmann so it is only about chat for me 07:44 v-rob Is this a CSM or server mod problem generally? 07:44 erlehmann also, TTF can surely do that! i do not doubt 07:45 erlehmann it is a general problem with fonts for me if the font color is the color of the sky. 07:45 erlehmann but the sky can be blue or black or red or the color of tv static at least in mineclonia 07:46 erlehmann if letters have different colors at least a few of them match the sky color too closely 07:46 v-rob Font outlines would be the ideal solution, of course. But again, other devs--I will make color disableable if they agree to it. 07:47 erlehmann i kinda dislike the “removing a feature requires nothing, but putting it back in requires a big discussion” 07:47 v-rob I understand that 07:47 erlehmann how about next time stuff is discussed before someone removes something they don't use themselves? 07:47 BoostedMenchers probably somewhat offtopic to current discussion but selecting a .pcf.gz bitmap font is somewhat catastrophically broken https://menche.us/files/lol-boom.png 07:48 BoostedMenchers I'll stick with the OTF 07:48 v-rob I think bitmap fonts breaking was an unforseen consequence of the Irrlicht ripping. That could have been done better. 07:48 BoostedMenchers which still looks a bit "funny" with antialiasing off 07:48 erlehmann it was entirely foreseen according to sfan5 07:48 BoostedMenchers I wanted the pixelly look one gets from antialiasing being off, though :< 07:49 v-rob Well, I might be wrong. I wasn't directly involved myself. 07:49 erlehmann i remember i accused him of accidentally breaking it and he said no it was deliberate? 07:49 erlehmann i would have to look it up again 07:49 erlehmann v-rob and just to be clear, i agree with deprecating bitmap fonts. but removal should only happen once freetype can actually do stuff. 07:49 v-rob Yup 07:50 v-rob Hopefully, my PR can make that work. 07:50 erlehmann to be fair the whole irrlichtmt situation is kind of a mess with not requiring proper code reviews or reasonably-sized commits and not having it as a submodule 07:50 erlehmann but that's another thing 07:50 v-rob Yeah, I stay in my realm. GUIs 07:51 erlehmann and by “not requiring proper code reviews” i mean if someone gives me a PR with 200k lines removed, i'll probably call them and scream at them for an hour and not approve it the next day without checking any details 07:51 erlehmann IMO that should have been many small patches, so they can be individually reviewed and tested 07:52 erlehmann v-rob regarding GUIs, what are your plans to prevent unicode attacks? 07:52 erlehmann like, say, zalgo text 07:52 BoostedMenchers I have the weirdest font issue 07:52 BoostedMenchers well a weird font issue 07:52 erlehmann good, because you are talking with ppl who are majorly into font issues 07:52 erlehmann like, at leats waist-deep 07:52 erlehmann at least 07:52 BoostedMenchers when I launch minetest from a terminal, Unicode strings render correctly 07:53 BoostedMenchers when I launch minetest from any application launcher, it's all "Invalid UTF-8 string." 07:53 erlehmann lul 07:53 erlehmann check locale 07:53 erlehmann v-rob in case you do not know http://eeemo.net 07:53 v-rob Honestly, I probably won't do anything about zalgo text. There's already too many ways for servers to go "ha ha sucker" to the client. Say, render tons of text at a font size of 500. 07:54 BoostedMenchers LANG is en_US.UTF-8 07:54 erlehmann v-rob, ok but what if some asshole zalgos the chat 07:54 erlehmann > There's already too many ways for servers to go "ha ha sucker" to the client. 07:54 erlehmann they all need to be removed 07:55 v-rob One thing at a time, I say. Once we get big font issues out of the way, then we can focus on the smaller issues. 07:55 erlehmann i think it is much more likely that a player will drop zalgo than a server operator 07:55 v-rob True. 07:55 erlehmann oh i just wanted to know if you have a plan 07:55 BoostedMenchers can I write a CSM that reads from /dev/urandom then just drops it raw into chat 07:55 v-rob I think mod security won't let you 07:55 erlehmann recently on oysterity we had some griefer (Mr_Anderson) spam duped echest at spawn 07:56 erlehmann BoostedMenchers try using a hacked client like waspsaliva 07:56 AwesomeAdam54321 BoostedMenchers: If you could, it would never actually send the chat if it doesn't stop 07:56 erlehmann to fight anderson we did two things 07:56 AwesomeAdam54321 *chat message 07:56 erlehmann first, the dupes were not perfect copies, you now can not place duped echests 07:57 erlehmann second, fleckenstein provided a patch so that 10k echests do not lag the game anymore 07:57 BoostedMenchers welp it's midnight here … my blood caffeine content is probably still high 07:58 erlehmann i think Mr_Anderson is our most valuable bug-finding asset, with a heavy pronounciation on “ass” 07:58 v-rob oof 07:58 erlehmann i mean heavy emphasis 07:58 erlehmann he likes to crash servers 07:58 erlehmann so we fix it 07:58 erlehmann we are playing a game, but half of it is not in minetest, but in git 07:59 v-rob Delightful person. 07:59 erlehmann well, i recently trolled him 07:59 erlehmann he started killing noobs at spawn a few hours ago 07:59 erlehmann so i started minetest with --random-input 07:59 v-rob :DDD 08:00 erlehmann and auto respawn 08:00 erlehmann the guy is so focussed on killing and griefing he can not distinguish a real player from a literal random walk 08:00 erlehmann he left after some time hihiu 08:00 v-rob Nice 08:01 erlehmann btw, --random-input should be customizable with a seed i think 08:01 erlehmann for testing 08:01 erlehmann and also i think it should be slightly adjusted, because it moves so fast right now that it rarely digs a node 08:01 erlehmann but otherwise i like it 08:02 v-rob Anyhow, the discussion went all over the place, but I did learn a few things that I can do to improve the PR. 08:02 v-rob I hop I didn't come off as rude or slighting at any point since that wasn't my intent 08:02 v-rob *hope 08:03 erlehmann v-rob i think the “only you use that point” is the rudest thing you said (i think it never really means “only you use it” literally, it means “i do not care for people relying on this, in particular: you”). otherwise, i appreciate how you are trying to fix the font rendering and DPI issues. 08:04 erlehmann i learned a few things too 08:04 v-rob Sorry about that one then, I'll try not to say things like that again 08:04 erlehmann thx 08:05 erlehmann BoostedMenchers v-rob which font formats does freetype take actually? i was not aware of pcf support 08:05 erlehmann maybe some of them have the base size included 08:05 erlehmann i mean bitmap formats must have 08:05 erlehmann then the patch of v-rob could read it from there 08:05 v-rob If it's available from the Freetype API, then yeah 08:08 erlehmann i mean that would be one good way to solve it 08:10 BoostedMenchers TTF and OTF both work 08:11 BoostedMenchers that PCF wasn't complete garbage, maybe it just read something wrong 08:15 erlehmann can you load BDF? 08:15 erlehmann BDF definitely has a size property 08:15 erlehmann PCF should have too 08:17 BoostedMenchers unsure 08:17 BoostedMenchers I don't have any 08:26 erlehmann BoostedMenchers, are you on linux? 08:27 erlehmann BoostedMenchers, better question, have access to an xserver? 08:27 BoostedMenchers openbsd 08:27 BoostedMenchers yeah it uses Xorg 08:27 erlehmann try the fixed font 08:27 erlehmann Xorg will not start without it 08:27 erlehmann so you must have it 08:27 erlehmann (mandatory fonts are fixed and cursor) 08:28 erlehmann uh hmmm 08:28 erlehmann i have none 08:29 erlehmann BoostedMenchers http://unifoundry.com/pub/unifont/unifont-14.0.01/font-builds/unifont-14.0.01.bdf.gz 08:30 BoostedMenchers 2021-12-09 00:30:24: ERROR[Main]: FontEngine: Cannot load '/home/menche/unifont-14.0.01.bdf.gz'. Trying to fall back to another path. 08:31 erlehmann uh 08:31 erlehmann what 08:31 erlehmann the PCF version working? http://unifoundry.com/pub/unifont/unifont-14.0.01/font-builds/unifont-14.0.01.pcf.gz 08:32 BoostedMenchers yup 08:32 BoostedMenchers renders fine too 08:32 BoostedMenchers wait 08:33 BoostedMenchers renders fine *in some places 08:34 BoostedMenchers https://menche.us/files/crunch.png 08:34 BoostedMenchers it thinks it's very short 08:35 BoostedMenchers oh 08:35 BoostedMenchers renders perfectly when I set font_size to 12 08:35 BoostedMenchers when it was scrunched like that it was 16 08:35 BoostedMenchers huh 08:35 BoostedMenchers antialiasing is disabled and there are no visual artefacts 08:36 BoostedMenchers https://menche.us/files/workingfont.png 08:38 BoostedMenchers switching to the TTF version of unifont and leaving all other settings as-is results in slightly icky slashes, as before 08:40 BoostedMenchers as in https://menche.us/files/font4.png 09:12 erlehmann BoostedMenchers, hey comparign pcf and ttf version of unifont is great 14:02 erlehmann BoostedMenchers i can load unifont as pcf and it renders fine. i might have found my solution for crisp pixel fonts, but it needs testing. 18:57 Krock Is this IdleRPG ?