Time Nick Message 06:10 independent56_ i wish to remove a large part of the map, bits wich take up mapserver space, despite being useless. i will use the command "//multi //fixedpos set1 -2000,500,500 //fixedpos set2 -30000,-500,-500 //deleteblocks". can worldedit deal with such large areas without breaking? 06:33 BuckarooBanzai i don't think so, it grinds to a halt for me with much lower values :/ 06:36 independent56_ sad 06:36 independent56_ what if i did it on a remote server, ran through SSH? what if i left during the command, leaving it to do porcessing on it's own? 07:06 independent56_ ok... 07:06 independent56_ it works! it is doing it, when i ran mapserver and locked the database, it was hard at work delteing blocks. but there is too many for too little. so i shutdown the server and decided to live with these ugly appendages 12:00 independent56_ BuckarooBanzai: do incremental renders have the same time as inital ones? do incrementel renders take up as much time as the inital ones? 12:04 BuckarooBanzai independent56_: nope the incremental renderings just render the changed mapblocks, should only be a handful every couple seconds 12:18 independent56_ ah yes 12:18 independent56_ i set it to 3 hours in fear of a big render 12:19 independent56_ and now i can run them both together now the inital render completed (after 3 days) 12:19 independent56_ but now it says "021-06-24 13:19:38: ERROR[CurlFetch]: http://127.0.0.1:8080/api/minetest not found (HTTP response code said error) (response code 403)" even though the keys match. 12:56 independent56_ BuckarooBanzai please help me regarding my last IRC message. this bug is preventing me from achiving junction map superheaven. 14:37 independent56_ is there any debug option to see mapblock borders? i want to recover a deleted mountain, but am unsure if it will hurt a small dam. 14:40 independent56_ BuckarooBanzai, i get this error "2021-06-24 15:40:18: ERROR[CurlFetch]: http://127.0.0.1:8080/api/minetest not found (HTTP response code said error) (response code 403)". i am unable to get live statistics for my map, because of this api error. 14:41 independent56_ and the map is running. 15:15 MTDiscord you should be able to work out the boundaries from the coordinates 15:15 MTDiscord I also think I read somewhere that they added the ability to see such boundaries in one of the latest dev versions? not sure 16:05 independent56_ seriously, fuck rubberbanding. it is annoying and gives the illusion of not going anywherer 16:08 MTDiscord There is a feature in 5.5-dev to display mapblock boundaries 16:08 MTDiscord there's a new keybind to toggle it; it doesn't seem to have a default binding, but set it to whatever 16:09 MTDiscord I dont have a "whatever" key /s 16:09 MTDiscord You actually mean screw anticheat that rubberbands you 16:09 MTDiscord Green: it should be between Panic and Any 16:09 MTDiscord I actually used to have a panic key 16:09 MTDiscord I replaced my escape key with a red key with "PANIC" printed on it 16:17 independent56_ config error caused mapserver broke. it should be in the working directory. it wasn't. 16:32 independent56_ yes! yay! the API is working! whoo! 17:04 erlehmann independent56_ disable anticheat or use proper physics factors 17:04 independent56_ hmm 17:04 independent56_ what minetest conf is that? 17:28 independent56_ how do i edit sunset/rise times? i have this mod which syncs to real time, but it is bright day out here and twilight inside 17:35 Krock use the day/night ratio 17:35 MTDiscord I think the in-game sun's position based on in-game time of day is hard-coded and not changeable. If you want all solar observations in-game to match real-world, then you'd probably have to use a non-linear function to map realtime to gametime. 17:35 MTDiscord Day/night ratio ... does that move the sun too? I've never actually used it without a custom skybox... 17:37 independent56_ hmm thx 17:39 celeron55 17:37:21 < independent56_> is there any debug option to see mapblock borders? i want to recover a deleted mountain, but am unsure if it will hurt a small dam. 17:39 celeron55 you probably didn't find this given it's not documented anywhere except the source code 17:39 celeron55 the setting is called keymap_toggle_block_bounds 17:40 celeron55 add it like any other keymap_ setting in minetest.conf 17:40 sofar maybe one day we can make the sun position dependent on the player position North/South relative to 0 17:40 celeron55 (for example keymap_toggle_block_bounds = KEY_KEY_O) 17:41 independent56_ i would like to change it in-game, like "v" for map, as a keybind. so i can see the mapblocks for a few seconds then disable them. 17:43 MTDiscord re: sun position, it would be nicer to have it controllable by mod via set_sky ... and even nicer if the shadow shader could then be aware of sun position instead of just assuming it based on time of day 17:43 celeron55 independent56_: yes that'll set it to "o" 17:43 independent56_ great :-> 17:43 MTDiscord I had to do some mildly ugly stuff to disable the shadow shader server-side for a game that has no sun/moon. 17:43 celeron55 but you do need to have a development build 17:44 celeron55 it was added after 5.5.0 17:44 MTDiscord in 5.5 you can just set it in the keybind menu 17:44 MTDiscord Hmm.. shadow shader thing has no on/off option? 17:44 independent56_ aye, i need a dev build, but i'm too lazy to install it. 17:45 MTDiscord wwar: only on the client side, not on the server 17:45 MTDiscord I see 17:45 celeron55 oh wait, it is in the menu 17:46 celeron55 well that's easy then 17:46 MTDiscord Anyway, i will have maximum 5 fps with shadows.. 17:47 celeron55 of course it has, on the first settings page 17:48 MTDiscord wwar: if your performance sucks with shadows enabled then you'd be likely to turn them off anyway. But for someone whose performance with shadows on is fine, they'd probably just leave it on ... but playing on a server with no sun but still having shadows from the sun would look silly. 17:48 MTDiscord Thus it's nice to be able to at least work around them, even if we can't remotely switch them off. 17:49 MTDiscord Silly and even if you have good performance, it will cause fps drop, so you lose fps to make the game look silly 17:49 MTDiscord Telling a player "go log off and change these settings and then come back so things don't look silly or not work right" is not a good experience and I've been trying to find ways to fix those as I encounter them. 17:49 MTDiscord Also yeah, my performance suck 17:49 MTDiscord I've been able to leave shadows set to Very Low and not notice any performance impacts at least. 17:50 MTDiscord Well, evey mt setting require people to relog to change, dont they? 17:50 celeron55 hecks wanted to make the server be able to switch off shadows but he hasn't made a PR yet 17:50 MTDiscord Every* 17:50 MTDiscord Not every setting, but easily arguably too many. 17:51 MTDiscord I believe reloging to change shadow isnt too hard if thats what you mean with > Telling a player "go log off and change these settings and then come back so things don't look silly or not work right.. 17:51 MTDiscord I'd really love to be able to switch texture-packs in-game, even if it means I have to go through an "initializing nodes" progress screen again and destroy and recreate the 3D scene ... at least, so that I can stay connected and still receive chat messages when the display comes back... 17:51 MTDiscord Relogging to change a thing isn't hard, it's just lousy UX 17:51 independent56_ i can't wait until 5.6 is released. obvious reasons (my number) 17:51 independent56_ oh and also, it will have all the features of 5, but with some mystery ones from 6. 17:52 MTDiscord Warr, cant you disable shadows in default of nodecore? 17:52 MTDiscord Independet56, what if mt 5.6 turns out a bad version? :þ 17:52 sfan5 he can't, it's a client side feature 17:54 MTDiscord I have no say in what shaders are run. I can only use some tricks in some cases to make them not have an effect on the visuals. 17:54 MTDiscord At least the parallax and generate normals stuff is gone :-) 17:55 MTDiscord Hmm.. i think it will be pretty helpful if server owners can manage client side stuff for their players in their servers 17:56 independent56_ if it turned out fowl, i would cry. my dreams would be spoilt. 17:59 MTDiscord Server owners and/or game creators should really have a lot of control over at least the default way the games are experienced. Player override of most in-game stuff should only be for things like accessibility needs (which arguably game-creators should be responsible for too). A problem in MT is the way these things are put either solely in the player's control or designed in such a way that it's too easy for players to accidentally 17:59 MTDiscord set overrides without experiencing the game as designed first. 17:59 hecks Toggling shadows without relogging is being worked on and will be included in 5.6, together with server side control. 18:00 MTDiscord I agree with that ^ 18:00 hecks I'm writing the shader variant feature as we speak (a little complicated but necessary; we need to compile shaders both with shadows off and on, and swap the shader program out) 18:00 MTDiscord PR #9315 is an example of the kind of gameplay thing that pretty obviously should start in game-creator control and be controlled by players only as an override. That one is setting at like 1.5 approvals though... 18:00 hecks and the other hard part is that MT currently assumes shaders on nodes and objects don't change ever 18:00 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/9315 -- Require 'basic_debug' priv to view gameplay-relevant debug info (2nd try), require 'debug' priv to view wireframe by Wuzzy2 18:00 MTDiscord That will also help in stoping cheaty csms i think 18:01 MTDiscord That the server/game owners will be able to manage client side stuff even if not full access 18:01 hecks I just obfuscate any strings sent to the client, like definitions or meta. 18:02 MTDiscord I don't mind it being possible to cheat, I just want to see it require actual effort. 18:03 MTDiscord Well, but decreasing cheats in that way (if it does) will be helpful to every server or game with the rule "no cheating/hacking" 18:03 MTDiscord sfan5, IIRC you were there for the last discussion of 9315 (that I'm aware of at least), did you want to weigh in on it? 18:05 MTDiscord Personally, i dont think that basic_debug thing should be something in default.. maybe a mode that adds that? I mean if a server owners wants debug info to be hidden from people thats something they must add a mode for.. 18:06 MTDiscord Owner* 18:06 celeron55 i believe 9315 is ready to merge 18:07 celeron55 need to check the code still maybe 18:09 MTDiscord I checked it over and insofar as I am qualified to judge, everything looked good to me: code, testing, etc. 18:09 celeron55 the code looks good to me 18:09 MTDiscord I just didn't want to be the one in the hot seat to put my name on the merge; I was hoping for something a little less hotly-debated as a first action as core dev... 18:13 hecks this is why we need the developer covenant or whatever 18:13 hecks or rather modder 18:13 hecks we need to define what is an acceptable burden on modders to upgrade the engine version 18:14 hecks (do not confuse with the awful linux CoC) 18:14 hecks basically we should promise the modders we won't break anything without an opt-out and said opt-out should take like a minute to patch in 18:15 hecks in this case the workaround is to just grant people the new priv on register, seems reasonable 18:22 MinetestBot 02[git] 04Wuzzy2 -> 03minetest/minetest: Require 'basic_debug' priv to view gameplay-relevant debug info, requ… 1363fc728 https://git.io/JnFRN (152021-06-24T18:21:19Z) 18:22 celeron55 i wonder what was the last time i actually merged anything 18:23 celeron55 usually someone jumps to do it once i mention something is mergeable 18:23 celeron55 . 18:23 celeron55 -. 18:30 MTDiscord I wouldn't mind publishing like a mod or something to help server operators more easily and automatically handle the opt-out of this thing, too. Like something that just grants basic_debug priv to everyone when they join or something, for server operators who don't feel technically-inclined enough to do it themselves. 18:31 MTDiscord I don't know how big of a problem I should expect it to be, I guess? This could also be handled in MTG, and I would think that if MTG considers this a "regression" that would be sufficient to cut through the permafreeze. 18:53 MTDiscord they can just add basic_debug priv in basic_privs 18:53 MTDiscord Will still gonna grant every player who already registered to the game 18:55 MTDiscord you mean default_privs 18:56 MTDiscord basic_privs are the ones that sub-admin moderators can control 18:56 MTDiscord and the granting to existing players upon join was what I was thinking of the mod for. 18:57 MTDiscord Oops default privs yes 18:57 MTDiscord Also dont default privs and basic privs change with the same cmd 18:59 MTDiscord they're separate settings but they're used for different things, and there's no reason why they would be in sync necessarily 18:59 MTDiscord though arguably it might make sense that default_privs be a subset of basic_privs so your moderators have the ability to strip a new player of ALL privs... 22:08 specing I was pleased to learn that WorldEdit is AGPLv3