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NoInternet |
Hello |
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theenemystando[m |
hello |
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tf2ftw |
hello |
| 02:57 |
orbea |
rubenwardy: Maybe minetest should also have "eating" added to the list of damage types? e.g. registering a node with something like: on_use = minetest.item_eat(-5, "vessels:glass_bottle") |
| 03:08 |
VanessaE |
small announcement: I've just started an "anarchy" server, VE-Chaos. daconcepts.com port 30010. unmoderated, limited area protection, PVP, some weapons, hostile mobs, mgv7, not a huge lot of mods (but enough to be interesting), interact by default, runs MT 5.1.1 |
| 03:09 |
VanessaE |
it's a bit less hardcore than my skyblock server :) |
| 03:16 |
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MinetestBot |
[git] nerzhul -> minetest/minetest: Add PostgreSQL authentication backend (#9756) e564bf8 https://git.io/Jfqt8 (2020-04-27T04:54:48Z) |
| 05:00 |
MinetestBot |
[git] sfan5 -> minetest/minetest: Fix truncation warning for F1000_MIN, F1000_MAX 515d38a https://git.io/Jfqtu (2020-04-27T04:58:34Z) |
| 05:00 |
MinetestBot |
[git] sfan5 -> minetest/minetest: script: Put getGuiEngine() inside a client-only #ifdef 8a03097 https://git.io/Jfqtz (2020-04-27T04:58:34Z) |
| 05:00 |
MinetestBot |
[git] sfan5 -> minetest/minetest: builtin: Correctly indicate failure in /spawnentity d3f50f2 https://git.io/Jfqtg (2020-04-27T04:58:34Z) |
| 05:00 |
MinetestBot |
[git] sfan5 -> minetest/minetest: script: Fix add_entity returning unusable ref if object deleted in on… f6f6dd1 https://git.io/Jfqt2 (2020-04-27T04:58:34Z) |
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MinetestBot |
[git] SmallJoker -> minetest/minetest: Script: Enforce type checks if not nil (#9748) be71e70 https://git.io/Jfqtw (2020-04-27T05:02:39Z) |
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jas_ |
sweet |
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MinetestBot |
[git] nerzhul -> minetest/minetest: Forbid object:attach(obj, ...) (#9762) 91c4f7f https://git.io/Jfqcf (2020-04-27T09:27:27Z) |
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* twoelk |
doesn't agree with Wuzzy's LegacyModList banner on the minetest wiki |
| 11:20 |
Wuzzy |
why not |
| 11:21 |
Wuzzy |
Hand-editing the list of mod is extremely error-prone and ContentDB is superior to wiki in almost every aspect |
| 11:22 |
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| 11:24 |
twoelk |
for one the cdb has not and probably should not make any reference to historic mods |
| 11:26 |
twoelk |
while hand edited lists can point to old mods that might be usefull to undesrtand current situations, developments or issues |
| 11:27 |
twoelk |
especially the mods-for-learning list contains more than just a list of mods |
| 11:27 |
Wuzzy |
yet none of the pages is laballed as a collection of historic mods |
| 11:29 |
twoelk |
the lists should probably warn that they may be outdated but deleting them is not that helpfull |
| 11:30 |
twoelk |
a lot of entries in the mobs list mention in the individual entries that the mods may be outdated, simply old or might be abondened |
| 11:31 |
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| 11:31 |
Wuzzy |
I'm effectively banned from JT2 now ? |
| 11:32 |
Wuzzy |
I lost the interact privilege |
| 11:32 |
twoelk |
haven't connected there much lately |
| 11:32 |
Wuzzy |
Without interact I can't even eat and I will soon starve |
| 11:33 |
Wuzzy |
I messed around with the safe too often ? |
| 11:33 |
twoelk |
actually haven't done much mt related during corona at all ... |
| 11:33 |
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| 11:35 |
Wuzzy |
Current JT2 server is a test server anyway, but its running for almost a month now and people have built cool buildings already |
| 11:36 |
twoelk |
seems I had one of the few non healthcare, non foodselling etc. jobs that had a rising workload :/ |
| 11:36 |
twoelk |
er - still have |
| 11:38 |
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| 11:40 |
twoelk |
but regarding the wiki or even both wikis, I simply don't like it if information, even if it is outdated is simply deleted. |
| 11:41 |
Wuzzy |
What's worse than no information is incorrect or misleading information |
| 11:42 |
Wuzzy |
I'm still strongly in favor of deleting all function pages on the Dev Wiki as redundant |
| 11:42 |
Wuzzy |
too many modders seem to rely on it,which causes huge trouble |
| 11:43 |
twoelk |
sorry I totally disagree on the statement - better nothing than something wrong- in regard of information |
| 11:44 |
twoelk |
maybe some more -asofdate- statements should be included though |
| 11:44 |
Wuzzy |
But the dev wiki is the reason for big confusion among modders. they rely on fake API calls which are simply not correct and then are surprised why stuff doesn'T work |
| 11:44 |
Wuzzy |
The API documentation is in lua_api.txt. Period. |
| 11:45 |
Wuzzy |
Hand-replicating API functions for each function in the wiki is and was a terrible idea. its not maintainable at all. |
| 11:45 |
Wuzzy |
its really no surprise why the functions in dev wiki are so horribly outdated. there are simply too many pages you'd have to touch. nobody does that |
| 11:46 |
twoelk |
if you say The only autorative API dokumentation is in lua_api.txt I totally agree with that |
| 11:46 |
twoelk |
but even to fix old mods to current standard it may be usefull to know how it worked bevor |
| 11:47 |
Wuzzy |
the functoins in dev wiki were just ripped from lua_api.txt at one point, then never updated. this is completely wrong |
| 11:47 |
Wuzzy |
Well that argument is pointless as the function docs in wiki are not versioned |
| 11:47 |
Wuzzy |
if you want to have old version docs, use git checkout <version> |
| 11:48 |
Wuzzy |
There are many better solutions to look up old version docs. The wiki is not one of them. |
| 11:48 |
twoelk |
the fragmentation in myriads of subpages is something I have disliked from the start but never fought against |
| 11:49 |
Wuzzy |
thats not really the problem with the wiki |
| 11:49 |
Wuzzy |
ideally the Lua API docs are autogenerated |
| 11:49 |
twoelk |
absolutely |
| 11:50 |
Wuzzy |
then we would even have a fancy HTML doc that is even official |
| 11:50 |
twoelk |
yep |
| 11:50 |
twoelk |
so who does it? |
| 11:50 |
Wuzzy |
nobody, as always |
| 11:51 |
Wuzzy |
i would have deleted the function pages a long time ago, but i can't |
| 11:51 |
Wuzzy |
and the wiki admins cannot be reached ? |
| 11:59 |
* twoelk |
sadly views the backlog of stuff he wanted to do on the wiki |
| 12:07 |
rubenwardy |
<f44336twoelk> for one the cdb has not and probably should not make any reference to historic mods |
| 12:07 |
rubenwardy |
CDB shows results from the forums. Not that that helps currently.... |
| 12:09 |
rubenwardy |
[12:50:08] <558b2fWuzzy> then we would even have a fancy HTML doc that is even official |
| 12:09 |
rubenwardy |
We do: https://minetest.gitlab.io/minetest |
| 12:09 |
rubenwardy |
Needs to some issues to be fixed with search accuracy |
| 12:14 |
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* twoelk |
thinks the autoformated lua_api actually looks quite good |
| 13:05 |
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| 13:36 |
tf2ftw |
how do you get the players name? Seems that all lua api player calls require the player name but I'm not seeing any functions to get that.. |
| 13:36 |
rubenwardy |
player:get_player_name() |
| 13:36 |
tf2ftw |
* the current player |
| 13:36 |
rubenwardy |
there is no current player |
| 13:36 |
tf2ftw |
well then. thanks |
| 13:37 |
rubenwardy |
Minetest mods are multiplayer by default, you're given `player` to get the info from :) |
| 13:38 |
tf2ftw |
ok so something like this should work? minetest.get_player_name(player.name) ? |
| 13:38 |
tf2ftw |
wait - sorry, nvm. I see player:get_player_name() |
| 13:39 |
tf2ftw |
I haven't gotten past this error |
| 13:40 |
tf2ftw |
attempt to index global 'player' (a nil value) |
| 13:40 |
tf2ftw |
the code is simple: attempt to index global 'player' (a nil value) |
| 13:40 |
tf2ftw |
local player = minetest.get_player_by_name(player:get_player_name() |
| 13:46 |
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| 13:50 |
calcul0n_ |
tf2ftw, this might return nil if the player is not connected |
| 13:50 |
tf2ftw |
calcul0n_, found how to do it. Thanks |
| 13:55 |
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| 14:22 |
rubenwardy |
get the name from the player, so you can get the player from the name? |
| 14:24 |
sfan5 |
minetest.get_player_by_name(minetest.get_player_by_name(player:get_player_name()):get_player_name())) |
| 14:24 |
sfan5 |
<rubenwardy> We do: https://minetest.gitlab.io/minetest |
| 14:24 |
sfan5 |
if this was one-page it would be perfect |
| 14:24 |
sfan5 |
I do not want to navigate through two menues to search for "node_drops" |
| 14:25 |
rubenwardy |
being multiple pages is good for SEO |
| 14:25 |
rubenwardy |
but you can have a mix in the same generation |
| 14:25 |
sfan5 |
surely an additional page with everything on one can be added |
| 14:26 |
twoelk |
maybe a printable version? |
| 14:38 |
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| 14:39 |
freelikegnu |
is there a way to get the minetest api into the eclipse LDT? |
| 14:40 |
sfan5 |
"into"? |
| 14:41 |
freelikegnu |
I mean for autocompleting, explainging methods, etc |
| 14:42 |
sfan5 |
check where it gets its completions from, and see if you can add custom ones |
| 14:43 |
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| 14:43 |
ANAND |
Maybe a plugin could parse the files in src/script/lua_api? |
| 14:43 |
ANAND |
It's probably a little harder than that though |
| 14:44 |
rubenwardy |
VSCode has autocompletion using GreenDimond's plugin |
| 14:44 |
ANAND |
There are Class methods, etc. |
| 14:44 |
rubenwardy |
https://marketplace.visualstudio.com/items?itemName=GreenXenith.minetest-tools&ssr=false |
| 14:44 |
ANAND |
Wait what? |
| 14:44 |
ANAND |
Nice! |
| 14:44 |
rubenwardy |
it's not very good, but it's better than nothing |
| 14:44 |
rubenwardy |
I blame not very good on Lua though |
| 14:44 |
rubenwardy |
there's also formspec code highlighting |
| 14:45 |
ANAND |
This is very neat |
| 14:45 |
sfan5 |
oh that's very cool |
| 14:45 |
ANAND |
I'm getting it right now |
| 14:45 |
sfan5 |
the engine should probably provide a machine-readable dump of all methods |
| 14:45 |
sfan5 |
to make such projects easier |
| 14:45 |
sfan5 |
s/projects/extensions/ |
| 14:46 |
rubenwardy |
formspec code highlighting: https://rwdy.uk/mlmie.png |
| 14:46 |
ANAND |
sfan5: Agreed |
| 14:50 |
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| 14:53 |
freelikegnu |
I rather avoid VSCode for personal rasons |
| 14:54 |
sfan5 |
there's an OSS version |
| 14:54 |
sfan5 |
you should be able to disable everything regarding auto-update, tracking and "experiments" (as MS calls them) |
| 14:57 |
freelikegnu |
thanks but I'd rather not rely on MS for anything if I dont have to |
| 14:57 |
freelikegnu |
I really have to move off github |
| 14:58 |
rubenwardy |
you're not relying on them, you can change editor anytime |
| 14:58 |
rubenwardy |
VSCodium is the OSS version of VSCode with MS stuff removed and a nice brand |
| 14:58 |
sfan5 |
I don't think that's a very good argument |
| 14:59 |
freelikegnu |
I was just curious about some help with eclipse, not argue about choise of editors |
| 14:59 |
blaise |
gitlab is a better platform anyway |
| 14:59 |
rubenwardy |
I'm not arguing about choice of editors? |
| 15:00 |
rubenwardy |
you can take the list that the VSCode plugin uses and use it in eclipse |
| 15:01 |
rubenwardy |
freelikegnu: https://github.com/GreenXenith/minetest-tools/blob/master/snippets.json |
| 15:01 |
rubenwardy |
Gitlab has a lot nicer features, the pipelines are great |
| 15:01 |
freelikegnu |
blaise, yep probably gitlab and notabug are probably what I'll be pushing to |
| 15:01 |
rubenwardy |
I've moved to Gitlab because of the CI |
| 15:02 |
rubenwardy |
and also because GitHub is relying on MS |
| 15:02 |
blaise |
which seems to constantly be going down on a minute to minute basis.. |
| 15:02 |
freelikegnu |
thanks rubenwardy I'll try that snippet |
| 15:03 |
sfan5 |
I doubt eclipse understands it in that format, but at least you have something to work with |
| 15:03 |
rubenwardy |
I brought up the plugin to say that it's possible, not to suggest switching |
| 15:03 |
rubenwardy |
yeah |
| 15:03 |
rubenwardy |
the generator script is in that repo, too |
| 15:05 |
freelikegnu |
I was really hoping for a way to somehow use the lua_api.txt as it is updated |
| 15:05 |
rubenwardy |
that's what the generator script does |
| 15:07 |
freelikegnu |
cool |
| 15:08 |
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| 15:37 |
rschulman |
Is the forum really slow/non-responsive for anyone else? |
| 15:38 |
sfan5 |
not just you |
| 15:38 |
sfan5 |
it's been like this for weeks |
| 15:38 |
sfan5 |
unfortunately |
| 15:38 |
sfan5 |
(a solution is being worked on) |
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freelikegnu |
is there a patreon for hosting? I'm happy to contribute $1/mo |
| 15:45 |
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| 15:46 |
sfan5 |
there isn't |
| 15:51 |
MinetestBot |
[git] sfan5 -> minetest/minetest: Fix detection of in-place path_locale when RUN_IN_PLACE=0 ca8957f https://git.io/Jfqry (2020-04-27T15:50:05Z) |
| 15:51 |
MinetestBot |
[git] sfan5 -> minetest/minetest: Add STATIC_LOCALEDIR to BUILD_INFO and move it to version.cpp 13a8ea2 https://git.io/JfqrS (2020-04-27T15:50:05Z) |
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edwardloveall |
Hello. Is there a way I can edit a page on the wiki? I looked around for a sign up or create account link and couldn't find one |
| 17:03 |
Krock |
edwardloveall: PM your email to Calinou |
| 17:03 |
Krock |
the forums would provide information about that... but well, they're kinda down |
| 17:04 |
edwardloveall |
thanks Krack, I'll do that |
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MinetestBot |
[git] Adriankhl -> minetest/minetest: Remove /LTCG from when compiling with clang-cl (#9765) aef59f2 https://git.io/JfqMA (2020-04-27T18:44:52Z) |
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MinetestBot |
[git] sfan5 -> minetest/minetest: Rewrite builtin item entity to use collision info b9377f2 https://git.io/JfqDI (2020-04-27T18:45:46Z) |
| 18:48 |
MinetestBot |
[git] sfan5 -> minetest/minetest: Expose collision information to LuaEntity on_step 3475759 https://git.io/JfqDL (2020-04-27T18:45:46Z) |
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| 20:46 |
tf2ftw |
Hi |
| 20:50 |
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| 20:51 |
tf2ftw |
Is there a list of mod API hooks? I'm looking at lua_api.txt but md saved as a text file isn't the easiest documentation to navigate. Something like Ldoc would be nice http://stevedonovan.github.io/winapi/api.html |
| 20:55 |
sfan5 |
you mean a straight list of methods? |
| 20:58 |
GreenXenith |
There is a ReadTheDocs version of the API http://minetest.gitlab.io/minetest/ (not sure how up-to-date it is..) and there is a PR by Benrob0329 to convert the .txt to .md with better linking |
| 21:01 |
tf2ftw |
the lua_api.txt is nice if you're looking for a walk-through but not great for quick look-ups. |
| 21:01 |
tf2ftw |
GreenXenith, thanks for the link |
| 21:02 |
sfan5 |
it's not? |
| 21:02 |
GreenXenith |
Once you know what youre looking for, lua_api.txt is more than enough |
| 21:02 |
GreenXenith |
ctrl+f == win |
| 21:02 |
sfan5 |
lua_api.txt is a great quick reference, everything on a single page and you can just use your browsers search |
| 21:04 |
tf2ftw |
I guess its not beginner friendly |
| 21:04 |
tf2ftw |
at least not what I'm used to |
| 21:08 |
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| 21:28 |
rschulman |
From another beginner modder, tf2ftw is 100% correct. A long ass txt file is NOT the best place to point people who want to learn about minetest modding. |
| 21:28 |
GreenXenith |
Thats why we point beginners to the modding book instead :) |
| 21:30 |
tf2ftw |
GreenXenith, the modding book isn't that great. It's an appreciated start for sure but I'm a dev by trade and would rather see the API docs than a tutorial that feels like it doesn't paint the entire picture. |
| 21:30 |
GreenXenith |
I know it isnt great |
| 21:30 |
tf2ftw |
to be clear - im not trying to complain |
| 21:30 |
GreenXenith |
But its "better" than a "long ass txt file" for some people |
| 21:31 |
tf2ftw |
I appreciate all the info out htere |
| 21:32 |
sfan5 |
I have never read it, but I the modding book is aimed at beginners |
| 21:32 |
rschulman |
What I wish I had found much earlier was the ReadTheDocs version of the API. |
| 21:32 |
sfan5 |
once you have all the concepts down you'll want to get comfortable with lua_api.txt (or a variant of it such as the gitlab thingy) |
| 21:32 |
oil_boi_ |
Oh my god sfan5, what if we had a modding book aimed at intermediate and advanced modders |
| 21:32 |
rschulman |
IMO it should replace the txt file. |
| 21:32 |
GreenXenith |
IMO #9564 and some more love to the documentation is the best solution |
| 21:32 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/9564 -- WIP: Convert Docs To Markdown, Improve Navigation and Linking by benrob0329 |
| 21:32 |
sfan5 |
oil_boi_: do I hear a volunteer writer |
| 21:33 |
oil_boi_ |
sfan5, Yes!! That sounds like an extremely fun project |
| 21:33 |
sfan5 |
I do wonder which stuff falls into "intermediate and advanced" though |
| 21:33 |
rschulman |
And yeah, the modding book is definitely a great resource. |
| 21:33 |
GreenXenith |
Yeah, intermediate/advanced is relative, too |
| 21:34 |
GreenXenith |
The API documentation would be fine if it was consistent and people weren't so fussy about using .md for it |
| 21:35 |
oil_boi_ |
Anything is relative, doing set_node is advanced to anyone that's never programmed before, a book that shows multiple examples on how to utilize functions with other functions, methods with other methods that blend them together would probably make mods in minetest go from cool, to insane |
| 21:35 |
GreenXenith |
A majority of mods haven't even reached the "cool" stage yet :) |
| 21:36 |
oil_boi_ |
:L I don't want to admit that's right but you are right :( |
| 21:36 |
tf2ftw |
I've always felt there are only 2 difficulty categories: "hello world" and everything else. There is a hello world version of everything - basically how to get started. Everything else should be up to the dev to dive into |
| 21:36 |
rschulman |
Yeah, I'm sorry, what on earth is the deal with the .md hate? |
| 21:36 |
rschulman |
Something about windows not being able to open it? |
| 21:37 |
sfan5 |
a .txt file is easier to work with |
| 21:37 |
GreenXenith |
Is it, though? |
| 21:37 |
sfan5 |
however that shouldn't be much of a concern since the install scripts can rename the file |
| 21:38 |
sfan5 |
the ability to link to individual lines is not something I'd like to lose though |
| 21:38 |
GreenXenith |
If you read the PR discussion, you'd see that ability is not lost. |
| 21:38 |
rschulman |
How, exactly? |
| 21:38 |
GreenXenith |
Markdown linking is not limited to headers |
| 21:40 |
tf2ftw |
i take md over txt all day |
| 21:40 |
oil_boi_ |
sfan5, I have an insane idea: when 5.3.0 is released, I do a video series on every single thing documented in the lua_api.txt :P |
| 21:40 |
tf2ftw |
at least there is some type of format/standardization (for the most part) |
| 21:40 |
GreenXenith |
Actually, I take that back. Linking is still limited to headers, but placing headers is obviously not limited. |
| 21:41 |
sfan5 |
GreenXenith: section links is not quite the same |
| 21:41 |
sfan5 |
oil_boi_: that sounds like it'd take .... forever |
| 21:42 |
sfan5 |
for example https://github.com/benrob0329/minetest/blob/md_api/doc/lua_api.md I can't link to exactly the line with "get_look_yaw()" here |
| 21:42 |
oil_boi_ |
sfan5, Yeah I'm gonna scrap that idea after unlocking my scroll wheel and flinging it, only to have it still take 25 seconds to scroll down the entire doc :< :< :< |
| 21:43 |
GreenXenith |
Id do it |
| 21:43 |
rubenwardy |
the modding book increases in complexity and does cover advanced concepts like LVMs, but yes - it's a guide and not a reference |
| 21:43 |
GreenXenith |
Someone made a video that covers every single Blender shader node |
| 21:44 |
GreenXenith |
I could totally do the same thing but for the Minetest api |
| 21:45 |
GreenXenith |
Its only 8000 lines |
| 21:47 |
jas_ |
oh my gaahhhhd |
| 21:51 |
GreenXenith |
Euf, I just scanned through Benrob's .md API ... I prefer how the .txt looks :I |
| 21:51 |
rubenwardy |
oil_boi_: the book is aimed at beginner and intermediate modders. What would an advanced one even contain? |
| 21:52 |
GreenXenith |
Markdown really bloats everything up |
| 21:52 |
oil_boi_ |
multiple ways to show how to pass through data into other api calls |
| 21:52 |
rubenwardy |
what does that mean? |
| 21:52 |
rubenwardy |
like contexts? |
| 21:52 |
oil_boi_ |
One second |
| 21:52 |
GreenXenith |
That sounds like a Lua thing |
| 21:53 |
GreenXenith |
And a not very advanced thing, at that >u> |
| 21:53 |
GreenXenith |
Really, advanced modders shouldn't need a guidebook |
| 21:53 |
rubenwardy |
the philosophy of the modding book is to be a collection of chapters which can be read individually, but together cover the core parts of the API |
| 21:54 |
rubenwardy |
yeah, once you get to that level you should be reading a reference |
| 21:55 |
rubenwardy |
It aids the goal of "doing 'hello world' and then diving into anything else". It's largely inspired by ReadTheDocs and the game programming patterns book |
| 21:55 |
GreenXenith |
I started modding before the modding book even existed .. so I don't think I've ever actually used it as a reference :] |
| 21:55 |
rubenwardy |
as did I :D |
| 21:55 |
rubenwardy |
I've seen Jeija use it though, that was cool |
| 21:57 |
oil_boi_ |
Oh, I just realized that if there is no creativity then no matter what you show someone they will emulate what you showed them |
| 22:02 |
oil_boi_ |
Also rubenwardy I've used your book, it is helpful |
| 22:17 |
oil_boi_ |
Also I've discovered something extremely unfortunate, it seems the player look height is 1.625 when in reality the camera is at approximately 1.485 |
| 22:21 |
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| 22:32 |
GreenXenith |
I just made a one-liner to read the lua_api.txt at ~750wpm ... so you could read the entire thing in 1.5 hours |
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nephele |
oil_boi_, based on what? @camer height |
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| 23:07 |
oil_boi_ |
nephele, your actual camera, using raycasting to override engine raycasting selection |
| 23:12 |
oil_boi_ |
nephele, https://youtu.be/0nbz9Bq_H6U discovered while doing this poop |
| 23:12 |
oil_boi_ |
!title |
| 23:12 |
MinetestBot |
oil_boi_: Crafter - Gravity Gun - YouTube |
| 23:14 |
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| 23:47 |
oil_boi_ |
I have a reasonable question: How to hide a player's nametag? |
| 23:49 |
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| 23:49 |
GreenXenith |
oil_boi_: set_nametag_attributes with transparent colorstring |
| 23:50 |
oil_boi_ |
Omazing, thank u |
| 23:50 |
oil_boi_ |
No seriously thanks |
| 23:57 |
oil_boi_ |
GreenXenith, you've made the world a better place yo https://github.com/oilboi/Crafter/commit/c041d642eb08102c9256ebe40905613a5444bdd7 |
| 23:57 |
GreenXenith |
Make sure you save the previous state and restore it when not sneaking |
| 23:59 |
oil_boi_ |
GreenXenith, it's done automatically |
| 23:59 |
GreenXenith |
(x) doubt |
