Time  Nick           Message
00:20 paramat        ~tell Danek edit /games/minetest_game/mods/default/mapgen.lua delete the 'minetest.register_biome' code blocks for each biome, also delete the .._beach and .._ocean biomes for each
00:20 ShadowBot      paramat: O.K.
02:01 DMan           Oldcoder
03:09 OldCoder       DMan
03:13 Tiktalik       hey guys, I just had an interesting idea for a mod
03:13 Tiktalik       a mod that lets you trade away space for resources
03:13 Tiktalik       as in, permanently
03:13 Tiktalik       by using the thing, it would render part of your world eternally unusable and give you stuff
05:58 Hijiri         sounds like there would be too much land to be balanced in singleplayer
05:58 Hijiri         in multiplayer you would be taking away land that other people could use and it would be a race to the bottom
05:59 Hijiri         Could be interesting to have a mod that gives you a permanent personal disability in exchange for something
05:59 Hijiri         like making questionable pacts with evil things
06:00 Hijiri         or you could replace some of your organs with cybernetics to sidegrade your body
06:02 MinetestBot    02[git] 04paramat -> 03minetest/minetest: Builtin: Change error to warning for light_source > 14 132b0492d https://git.io/viHeW (152016-09-21T06:54:22+01:00)
06:02 MinetestBot    02[git] 04everamzah -> 03minetest/minetest: Increase default font size by 1 13aa64322 https://git.io/viHel (152016-09-21T06:53:53+01:00)
06:02 MinetestBot    02[git] 04rubenwardy -> 03minetest/minetest: Warn if container is not closed 1395b79aa https://git.io/viHe8 (152016-09-21T06:52:04+01:00)
06:06 MinetestBot    02[git] 04paramat -> 03minetest/minetest: Builtin: Change error to warning for light_source > 14 135091cb5 https://git.io/viHe7 (152016-09-21T08:04:11+02:00)
06:06 MinetestBot    02[git] 04everamzah -> 03minetest/minetest: Increase default font size by 1 13679c8de https://git.io/viHe5 (152016-09-21T08:04:11+02:00)
08:38 MinetestBot    02[git] 04sfan5 -> 03minetest/minetest: Do not serialize empty NodeMetadata 133a57e52 https://git.io/viHYc (152016-09-21T10:29:17+02:00)
09:03 JamesTait      Good morning all!  Happy Wednesday, and happy International Day of Peace! 😃  ☮
09:44 buttatoes      I need to modify my .config file so minetest works on my low memory mobile device
09:45 buttatoes      I have about 200 Megabits to play with
09:50 Megaf          Good morning
09:50 buttatoes      good morning
09:51 buttatoes      riots in the usa have me unnerved so I'm trying to focus on minetest
09:51 Megaf          I can help you with the config file
09:52 Megaf          Also, I further improve the server for mobile
09:53 Megaf          !server Megaf
09:53 MinetestBot    Megaf: Megaf Server v4.0 | mt.megaf.info:30003 | Clients: 0/20, 0/2 | Version: 0.4.14-Megaf / MegafXploreNext | Ping: 6ms
09:53 buttatoes      thanks for both. are you reducing server quality to achieve improvements?
09:53 Megaf          buttatoes: by the way. Farming is totally fixed now. We can cook potatoes again
09:54 buttatoes      thanks I enjoy potatoes :D
09:54 Megaf          buttatoes: I reducing its performance in some aspects yes, but not overall gameplay quality
09:55 Megaf          DMan is also on mobile, it's important for me that him and other mobiles players have a good experience.
09:56 buttatoes      ok, I was afraid you were making changes just for me
09:57 Megaf          Nope, but I often do make changes for a single person yes.
09:57 buttatoes      The game crashes just as it starts to initialize nodes
09:59 Megaf          daZe used to have a terrible internet connection. So for him I had reduced package size, the distance the server sends blocks and other changes. Totally worth it, he built amazing stuff
09:59 buttatoes      nice
09:59 Calinou        did you publish full mod source code so that Richard Stallman can play on your server? :)
10:00 buttatoes      that's because you're a great admin Megaf. unlike calinou who shut down his light server
10:00 buttatoes      :p joking
10:01 Calinou        it was a waste of server resources to keep my server up
10:01 Calinou        the world was a total mess, nobody protected their builds
10:01 Megaf          Lol Calinou, he could actually join, I'd give my servers source code on request
10:05 buttatoes      one day I'll get back into moding when I decide to be less lazy. maybe godot and blender too so I can bug calinou on all fronts
10:07 Megaf          Heh
10:08 Megaf          Oh man, how I wish I could install more ram on my phone
10:09 Megaf          Because of terribly coded crap software like Skype that alone will eat all the ram itself
10:10 buttatoes      yeah cheap phones suck but I can't see paying good money for something I could drop in the toilet
10:12 Megaf          My phone is not cheap. Just not new :/
10:14 Megaf          Peace JamesTait ! 😁
10:16 buttatoes      AFK, little doggy attack
10:22 Megaf          Must have been a devastating attack.
10:55 Megaf          man, mozilla nightly, version 51, is so much faster then chrome, it's crazy
10:56 Megaf          version 52 actually
10:56 Megaf          52.0a1 (2016-09-20) (64-bit)
12:41 CWz            Megaf, I am at version 38
12:41 CWz            *48
12:42 Megaf          CWz: that's the stable isnt it\/
12:42 Megaf          ?
12:43 CWz            yeah
12:43 * CWz          wonders where's the nightly ppa
12:44 Megaf          I just get the tarball from mozilla
12:48 Megaf          Minetest doesnt work on my phone, it crashes upon launch
12:48 Megaf          Minetest has stopped
12:49 Megaf          I think it's not built for Intel, just ARM, my phone has Intel CPU
13:02 Megaf          lol, I have no idea why or where is coming from but the audio the the Elephants Dream has just begun playing on my laptop
13:02 Calinou        Megaf: yeah we don't have x86 builds currently, IIRC
13:03 Megaf          I just have Quassel, GNOME terminal and Firefox open, and in firefox just messenger.com web.skype.com and gmail open
13:03 Megaf          very very very weird
13:03 Megaf          I have the web IDE open too, and installed the firefox OS simulator
13:03 Megaf          still, nothing explains The Elephants Dream audio playing in the background
13:03 * Megaf        is confused
13:04 Calinou        once I visited a website and My Little Pony fan music started playing
13:04 Calinou        ._.
13:04 Megaf          "Listen to the sounds of the machine"
13:04 Megaf          Calinou: I don't have regular websites opened
13:05 Megaf          maybe it's just an easter egg in firefox dev?
13:05 Calinou        I use Firefox Developer Edition, no issues with that :P
13:05 Megaf          Calinou: closed the IDE and the audio stopped
13:05 Megaf          how crazy is that
13:07 Fixer          Calinou: you was in headphones?
13:08 Megaf          Calinou: when I start the Firefox OS 2.6 TV the Elephants Dream audio begins to play
13:10 Calinou        Fixer: I always have headphones on desktop PC
13:11 Megaf          Freeminer doesnt work either, same thing, "Unfortunetally Freeminer has stopped"
13:11 Megaf          proller: ^
13:11 Megaf          just a second after lunch or launch
13:11 Megaf          !g lunch
13:11 MinetestBot    Megaf: Problem getting data from Google.
13:11 Megaf          lunch and lunch, hm
13:12 proller        yet another bug 8(
13:13 Calinou        Google has no problem getting data from you though 8)
13:14 Volkj          hi all, based on your server's management, how do you felt data safety in databases back-end like redis and leveldb compared to default's sqlite?
13:14 Megaf          I feel pretty good with sqlite
13:16 Volkj          my experience on leveldb, outside faster mapgen on singleplayer, gave me a corrupted map while testing a mod that crashed minetest for its errors. Hoping it wasn't related
13:30 yusf[m]        I'm good with SQLite on 10 player server
13:46 Megaf          sqlite is pretty reliable
13:46 Megaf          in events of crashes
13:56 Calinou        SQLite has synchronous stuff that makes it nuclear-bomb-proof, but also slow
13:56 Calinou        if you disable it, it can be up to 50 times faster
13:56 Calinou        (sqlite_synchronous = 0)
14:04 STHGOM         nuclear bomb proof?
14:07 * Megaf        uses 1
14:07 Megaf          very save against server crashes, not so safe against OS crash, but safe enough still
14:07 Megaf          0 still somewhat safe against server crash but not safe at all against OS crash
14:08 Megaf          2 = bomb proof, chances to corrupt the map are very small
14:08 Megaf          I actually crashed my server a lot in around 3 years that I used 0, never corrupted the map, and had some ugly OS crashes too, map still fine
14:08 Megaf          (as far as I know)
14:09 Megaf          but in the past, with other server, I got corruption even using 2
14:09 STHGOM         so what happens to a corrupted map?
14:09 Megaf          so there's luck too
14:09 Megaf          STHGOM: sometimes the server will not even start, will just throw an error
14:10 STHGOM         ouch
14:19 moparisthebest does anyone know if there is a way to increase the spawn rate for mobf, or the animals_modpack thing?
14:19 moparisthebest I'm assuming at expense of CPU but I'm fine with that
14:19 Megaf          I'm not really sure if actually managed to fix the map
14:20 Megaf          I had other server that would crash every single time a player walked near the part of the map that was corrupted. This was using LevelDB
14:22 Volkj          seems map corruption goes by luck, or better: speed or reliability, choose one
14:22 Volkj          sqlite as more secure but slower, leveldb as faster but more insecure - at least i got that
14:22 Megaf          It's kind like that yes
14:23 moparisthebest wouldn't redis be better than both?
14:23 Megaf          And lots of tools will only work if your map is sqlite
14:24 Megaf          moparisthebest: what would happen if there's any hickup between server and db server?
14:24 Megaf          Minetest is extremely sensitive
14:24 moparisthebest why would there be?
14:25 moparisthebest redis has proven rock solid on loads far higher than minetest could ever be
14:25 moparisthebest and a TCP connection to localhost is as reliable as writing to the filesystem surely?
14:25 Megaf          I don't know
14:26 moparisthebest in my opinion redis is perfect for this kind of thing
14:26 Megaf          I'm actually curious in trying PostgreSQL on a different server over the internet
14:27 Megaf          Redis takes its speed from RAM. It's good if you have loads of it
14:27 Megaf          I don't
14:28 moparisthebest ram is cheap
14:28 Volkj          redisdb security however... it isn't a set-and-forget db
14:28 moparisthebest but yea, different use cases
14:28 moparisthebest why not Volkj ? listen on localhost and done?
14:31 Volkj          yup moparisthebest, needs a bit of attention, giving a pair of links for more  http://antirez.com/news/96   https://www.digitalocean.com/community/tutorials/how-to-secure-your-redis-installation-on-ubuntu-14-04
14:33 moparisthebest Volkj: but neither is any concern if you just listen on localhost
16:58 Megaf          So I just installed win10 on my laptop
16:58 Megaf          It's terrible. I had forgotten how slow and frustrating windows is
16:58 Megaf          Spend a
16:59 Krock          nothing more to expect on a P4
16:59 Megaf          Spend a lot of time in the privacy area just disabling things. Then I disabled a lot of auto start crap
16:59 nm0i           Then disable windows10
16:59 Krock          remove ntldr in C:\
16:59 Megaf          And windows update just stays on searching for updates
17:00 Megaf          And when I go to reboot/shutdown I get that "please wait, installing updates"
17:00 KaadmY         wait
17:00 Megaf          And the same when I start the laptop
17:00 KaadmY         you need to update to reboot..?
17:00 moparisthebest I have a small map on a server (max_block_generate_distance = 500) can I set anything in the server or client to make it send the client basically all blocks at once?
17:00 moparisthebest rather than having to fly around to load the whole map?
17:01 KaadmY         i think map_block_generate_distance is in 80x80x80 chunks
17:01 KaadmY         that's just what i remember, might be wrong
17:01 Megaf          moparisthebest: max block send distance 500
17:01 moparisthebest the map is generated, but it's not all sending
17:01 Megaf          That's the option you want
17:01 moparisthebest max_block_send_distance = 500
17:01 Krock          moparisthebest, that's insane. change back to 10
17:01 moparisthebest that is set, but it's still not loading
17:02 Volkj          P4 still go strong, on their limits (and heat)
17:02 Megaf          But you cave to increase the
17:02 Megaf          The..
17:02 KaadmY         that's 40k nodes btw
17:02 Krock          Volkj, well then. Celeron D family
17:02 moparisthebest also max_forceloaded_blocks = 500, max_simultaneous_block_sends_per_client = 1000, max_simultaneous_block_sends_server_total = 4000
17:02 Krock          gawd
17:02 KaadmY         which is larger than the entire world
17:02 Megaf          Emerge queue or something
17:02 Megaf          3 lines. One of them is disk only
17:02 moparisthebest max_packets_per_iteration = 10240
17:02 moparisthebest ah emerge queue, let me try that
17:03 Volkj          Krock: northwood here, minetest takes half an hour to compile but it's acceptable, kinda
17:03 Megaf          Set to like 20000 to all 3 lines
17:03 Megaf          Simultaneous per client can be 4
17:03 Krock          Volkj, took 20 mins with the 3.06 GHz one I had
17:03 Krock          now it's near to 8 mins with the AMD Athlon 64 4000+
17:03 Krock          (same setup)
17:03 est            Megaf: you made me start my windows VM
17:04 Megaf          est: whoops
17:04 est            I regularly update all things there to not get a virus the instant i start it
17:04 est            seems firefox is broken, and I guess its win10's fault
17:04 Megaf          I'd use VM but my CPU is too slow for that
17:04 Krock          > regularly update all things
17:04 * Krock        uses Win XP
17:04 * Krock        laughts
17:05 Megaf          Firefox stable, opera and chrome going well here on win10
17:05 est            Megaf: do you have enabled virtual extensions?
17:05 moparisthebest I assumed everyone in #minetest would be using linux, why *wouldn't* you be using linux? :/
17:05 Megaf          Debian gnome installed faster then win10 and with only a single reboot after the install was completed. Cool!
17:06 Megaf          est: I guess so. CPU have the guts for that
17:06 moparisthebest do I set all these values in minetest.conf on the server only? or do I need to set something on the client
17:06 moparisthebest it's still only loading around 25% of the map
17:06 Megaf          All server side moparisthebest
17:07 est            Megaf: its a setting in the bios, and usually disabled
17:08 Megaf          est: this laptop bios is pretty helpless
17:09 Megaf          Not many options there
17:09 Megaf          And uefi
17:11 Megaf          JFS and XFS are so much faster than Ext4 on normal use.
17:11 moparisthebest this is what I have set now:
17:11 moparisthebest emergequeue_limit_diskonly = 5000,emergequeue_limit_generate = 5000,emergequeue_limit_total = 5000,map_generation_limit = 500,max_block_send_distance = 5000,max_forceloaded_blocks = 5000,max_packets_per_iteration = 102400,max_simultaneous_block_sends_per_client = 10000,max_simultaneous_block_sends_server_total = 40000
17:11 Megaf          And less CPU intensive
17:11 moparisthebest and it still only loads ~25% of the map :/
17:11 Megaf          Moparisthebest that's a mess
17:12 Krock          moparisthebest, how about the client? does it have set the setting of maximal loaded blocks to unlimited?
17:12 Megaf          Wait till I have IRC in my laptop and I will help you out. I'm on the tablet
17:12 Krock          btw: pastebin.com
17:12 moparisthebest under advanced settings in client I have mapblock limit set to -1
17:12 swift110       cool
17:13 moparisthebest anything else?
17:14 moparisthebest https://www.moparisthebest.com/paste/?2305aa896aa30394#IS6ZXppe4AiYemq65/dtKSWhlMrxWiNvVyko5+IE1bs=
17:14 moparisthebest that's the same config except without the | tr '\n' ','
17:16 Krock          moparisthebest, I'm not using linux (yet) because the directory structure is way different
17:16 Krock          same with commands)
17:16 Krock          (
17:17 Megaf          Actually that's because you use dos commands
17:17 Megaf          Power shell is closer to bash
17:17 Megaf          But I know the feeling
17:17 KaadmY         i use dos and bash
17:17 KaadmY         more used to bash though
17:17 Megaf          Using Solaris was a pain in the butt
17:18 moparisthebest it takes some getting used to but it's worth it, and windows is the odd one out there too
17:18 Megaf          I wonder how easy is to add password to grub
17:18 moparisthebest commands/directory structure etc are the same EVERYWHERE ELSE besides windows
17:19 Krock          no, they're everywere different but in windows
17:19 est            i like having windows 10 with the bliss background
17:19 Krock          (and reactOS, which is windows-alike)
17:19 est            bliss image makes me nostalgic of my first own computer
17:20 est            it had win xp
17:20 est            and the bliss image
17:20 moparisthebest the commands and directory structure are the same on linux/various bsds/mac/solaris etc etc
17:20 moparisthebest and windows/react are the odd ones out
17:21 Krock          est, I've seen an article about this hill about six months ago. It's not beautiful anymore. Brown grass (wheat?) everywhere
17:21 Krock          but it looked so great back then
17:21 est            yeah
17:23 moparisthebest meh yea I give up on these settings now, I'll take you up on your offer Megaf and wait until you get on a laptop, thanks! :)
17:24 Megaf          Almost there
17:26 Megaf          Now, what's my quassel core password??
17:26 Megaf          Calinou: ^
17:26 Krock          magafissocool123
17:26 Krock          there, your pass
17:31 Megaf          moparisthebest: on laptop now
17:31 Megaf          :)
17:31 * Megaf        opens the webbrowser
17:32 Megaf          this is totally broken here https://www.skype.com/en/download-skype/skype-for-linux/
17:32 Megaf          no CSS
17:32 Megaf          and Java Script doesnt seem to be running either
17:32 moparisthebest Megaf: here is most of the config https://www.moparisthebest.com/paste/?2305aa896aa30394#IS6ZXppe4AiYemq65/dtKSWhlMrxWiNvVyko5+IE1bs= any ideas?
17:32 sfan5          skype for linux doesn't work
17:33 sfan5          since ages
17:33 Megaf          moparisthebest: hold on, I will give you the lines that are important and you adjust there
17:39 Megaf          moparisthebest: this should do http://paste.debian.net/plain/832472
17:39 Megaf          it will use a lot of RAM in server and client side
17:40 Megaf          you have to wait until everything loads though, minetest is terrible in parallel stuff, so it takes a while
17:45 Volkj          2¢ idea on multithread: one thread per sqlite file, for map chunk of 1000x1000 wide
17:47 Krock          did you mean 1000^3 wide?
17:48 Volkj          usually people don't build so much on height, more widely - 1000x1000 wide including all the heigh from bottom to top
17:49 Volkj          just a though, would give multiple sqlite files but multithread would be useful on servers
17:50 Megaf          [18:48:54] <Volkj> usually people don't build so much on height, more widely - 1000x1000 wide including all the heigh from bottom to top
17:50 Megaf          eh.. Don't go to my server then
17:50 Megaf          we have stuff ranging from -20000 to +25000
17:51 Megaf          yes, people actually dug that deep, people are crazy
17:51 Volkj          it won't give every file of little size, but at least it's better than a single big file
17:53 Volkj          Megaf: wondering how much the spawn rate of ore is influenced by that depth, but it really depends on the mapgen used (and tweaked by servers)
17:54 Megaf          Volkj: I don't think it affects that much
17:54 moparisthebest Megaf: no that didn't load it all either :/
17:54 est            wohoo
17:54 est            its just awesome how slow windows update is
17:54 Volkj          yup, i use to find more mese on lower depths than >20k
17:55 est            if they managed to get windows update fast, people wouldnt hate it as much
17:55 Megaf          moparisthebest: is the server public?
17:55 est            chrome updates are super super fast
17:55 Megaf          [18:55:26] <est> its just awesome how slow windows update is
17:55 est            noone really has a problem with chrome updates
17:55 moparisthebest Megaf: it *can* be, but not that fast upload speeds, I was testing it over lan
17:55 Megaf          I was looking at windows 10 privacy things, and saw the windows update is now p2p, over local network and internet
17:56 Megaf          so if you download an updated, it will seed to other windows machines
17:56 est            yeah but you can disable it
17:56 Megaf          you can make it p2p on the internal network only yes
17:56 Megaf          but p2p on the internet is slow enough already
17:56 Calinou        <Megaf> And when I go to reboot/shutdown I get that "please wait, installing updates"
17:56 Calinou        yeah, it does that a lot
17:57 Calinou        Windows Update is not known to be particularly fast or stable or anything
17:57 agaran         lol
17:57 Volkj          Calinou: tried gnome-software for updates, a button named "reboot and update" appeared. Gnome-software uninstalled
17:58 Calinou        Volkj: it's fine to ask for a reboot after updating
17:58 Calinou        what is not fine is 1) rebooting without user consent, 2) applying updates without user consent
17:58 Calinou        (Windows 10 does both)
17:58 Megaf          not the win10 I installed
17:58 Megaf          I guess not at least
17:58 Megaf          because I told it to notify first
17:58 Calinou        Windows 10 can reboot if you're not in "activity hours", by defaut between 8:00 and 17:00
17:58 Megaf          Ok, managed to install Skype 4 here
17:59 Megaf          works well
17:59 Volkj          sadly yes. Was like a nightmare on every patch Tuesday , checking every patch to not get an hidden updater
18:03 agaran         Calinou: win10 does lot more than just those two..
18:05 moparisthebest ok Megaf burtrum.org port 30000 should be open now
18:05 Megaf          so, full Debian 8 + Jessie-backports GNOME install (Including Inkscape, GIMP, LibreOffice)+ Skype (and it's 32 bit deps) + Quassel (And deps, like VLC), + Opera + Firefox + Chrome = 5.3 GB. Windows 10 install + Chrome + Firefox + Opera + Skype (No graphical/office tool, no nothing, just clean install) = 11 GB
18:06 Megaf          amazing isn't it?
18:06 Megaf          I was actually expecting windows to use much more
18:07 Megaf          oh, and on Windows I'm missing a lot of drivers. On Debian I installed all drivers and firmwares already
18:07 Megaf          moparisthebest: hold on, downloading minetest
18:08 Megaf          moparisthebest: joining
18:08 moparisthebest and the blocks are already generated, and the database is redis
18:08 moparisthebest it loads them fairly fast but I have to fly over them to get them to load, that's what I'm trying to avoid
18:08 Megaf          hows you CPU use there?
18:09 moparisthebest < 50% of one core now, and that's 4 cores
18:09 moparisthebest it's not a very powerful server, intel avalons which are like atoms
18:09 Megaf          ok, again, mt is terrible in parallel stuff
18:09 Megaf          moparisthebest: just joined
18:10 Megaf          moparisthebest: /grant Megaf fly,fast
18:10 moparisthebest done
18:26 MinetestBot    02[git] 04sfan5 -> 03minetest/minetest: Update library versions in buildbot 139fa562f https://git.io/viQoq (152016-09-21T20:16:31+02:00)
18:26 MinetestBot    02[git] 04sfan5 -> 03minetest/minetest: Don't use ZLIB_WINAPI if the required DLL is not provided to CMake 13af4c210 https://git.io/viQom (152016-09-21T20:16:31+02:00)
18:27 Megaf          !server Megaf
18:27 MinetestBot    Megaf: Megaf Server v4.0 | mt.megaf.info:30003 | Clients: 0/10, 0/3 | Version: 0.4.14-Megaf / MegafXploreNext | Ping: 7ms
18:38 moparisthebest anyone know how to set a hotkey to '
18:38 moparisthebest when I try it sets it to - instead?
18:40 sfan5          irrlicht doesn't seem to have a keycode for that
18:40 sfan5          or maybe it does but it's not called after the character
18:40 sfan5          s/called/named/
18:40 moparisthebest that sucks for people using the dvorak keyboard layout where ' is where Q is on a qwerty
18:40 agaran         sfan5: is possible to have clipboard working in minetest? so I can paste from X clipboard or cut like seed from chat/output in console in MT and paste in xterm?
18:40 moparisthebest oh, let me try editing the .conf with the keycode name directly
18:40 sfan5          have you tried editing the config to set it to KEY_KEY_Q
18:40 sfan5          ?
18:41 moparisthebest well I need it to be ' I'll find the name though
18:41 sfan5          agaran: complaing to irrlicht
18:41 sfan5          it works on windows
18:41 agaran         sfan5: ok
18:41 sfan5          moparisthebest: http://irrlicht.sourceforge.net/docu/_keycodes_8h_source.html have fun
18:43 moparisthebest sfan5: it doesn't just use standard keycodes and such? :/
18:43 sfan5          what are "standard keycodes" ?
18:44 moparisthebest like the input any operating system would give you
18:44 agaran         moparisthebest: it varies with OS.. irrlight talks on few..
18:45 Megaf          hm, gnome web is pretty much useless as a web browser
18:45 sfan5          well it varies by OS
18:46 sfan5          so obviously irrlicht can't just use what it gets without processing
18:46 moparisthebest at some layer it has to talk to the OS though ?  also I'd assume all OS's have support for the ' key ?
18:46 sfan5          otherwise windows and linux wouldn't really work with the same code
18:46 sfan5          obviously OSs support the ' key
18:46 sfan5          you just have to find out which irrlicht keycode that it
18:46 sfan5          some are named quite strangely
18:47 sfan5          so it might be one of the KEY_OEM_* ones
18:47 moparisthebest it seems like it's not handled if I go by the ui
18:47 moparisthebest because it puts a '-' in there and maps it to the literal - key instead
18:47 Megaf          hm, there's more people here using Dvorak
18:47 Megaf          just can't remember who right now
18:48 Megaf          be right back, going to windows
18:48 moparisthebest actually sfan5  KEY_OEM_7            = 0xDE,  // for US    "'""
18:49 moparisthebest maybe that's it, trying now
18:50 moparisthebest NOPE
18:51 moparisthebest oops sorry for the caps lock
18:51 moparisthebest so irrlicht doesn't use SDL or another library to handle input? it does everything itself?
18:54 moparisthebest what is that keycode supposed to map to?
18:57 moparisthebest for example /usr/include/linux/input.h says #define KEY_A 30
18:58 moparisthebest irrlicht says  KEY_KEY_A            = 0x41,  // A key
19:03 sfan5          moparisthebest: irrlicht has it's own keycode because it needs to work crossplatform
19:03 sfan5          keycodes
19:03 sfan5          also yes
19:04 sfan5          irrlicht is a game engine library itself
19:04 sfan5          it doesn't use sdl
19:04 moparisthebest it looks like there is an SDL driver though? also a Linux one
19:04 moparisthebest ah digging into the source code I see what I think is the cause...
19:05 sfan5          yes but the SDL driver adds more complexity because you're going through yet another layer
19:07 moparisthebest sfan5: is there a way to tell which driver it's going through?
19:07 moparisthebest when I'm running it? like is it a runtime or compiletime choice?
19:08 sfan5          no idea
19:08 sfan5          but i guarantee you it's not running via SDL
19:09 moparisthebest source/Irrlicht/CIrrDeviceLinux.cpp line 1065 has some questionable looking key code
19:09 moparisthebest do you know how I could turn on the logging?
19:10 sfan5          what logging?
19:10 sfan5          anyway i found it
19:10 moparisthebest so things like os::Printer::log("Could not find EKEY_CODE, using orig. X11 keycode instead", core::stringc(event.xkey.keycode).c_str(), ELL_INFORMATION); would print ?
19:10 sfan5          oh that, no idea
19:10 sfan5          ' is U+0027
19:10 sfan5          % grep U+0027 /usr/include/X11/keysymdef.h
19:10 sfan5          #define XK_apostrophe                    0x0027  /* U+0027 APOSTROPHE */
19:11 sfan5          % grep XK_apostrophe <(wget -qO- https://raw.githubusercontent.com/zaki/irrlicht/master/source/Irrlicht/CIrrDeviceLinux.cpp)
19:11 sfan5          KeyMap.push_back(SKeyMap(XK_apostrophe, KEY_OEM_7));
19:11 moparisthebest can I put that in minetest.conf directly somehow?
19:11 moparisthebest that's not the right key though, somehow, it doesn't work anyhow
19:13 sfan5          KEY_OEM_7 is the format for minetest.conf, yes
19:13 sfan5          then you'll need to figure out how dvorak and X11 work together
19:13 moparisthebest yea that doesn't work though
19:14 moparisthebest pressing ' sends the right keycode otherwise I couldn't type '
19:14 moparisthebest can you set a hotkey to the ' key with your keyboard layout? it doesn't work with regular qwerty either, for me
19:16 sfan5          no
19:16 sfan5          the problem is that irrlicht receives the shift independent from the pressed key
19:16 moparisthebest there is no shift with that key though
19:16 moparisthebest if I run xev, it shows X gets it correctly
19:17 moparisthebest state 0x10, keycode 48 (keysym 0x27, apostrophe), same_screen YES,
19:17 moparisthebest XLookupString gives 1 bytes: (27) "'"
19:17 moparisthebest XmbLookupString gives 1 bytes: (27) "'"
19:17 sfan5          i use qwertz
19:17 sfan5          is qwerty that different?
19:18 moparisthebest it's not a keyboard layout issue even, it's just that the ' key does not work
19:18 moparisthebest with minetest/irrlicht
19:18 sfan5          for me it's a keyboard layout issue
19:18 sfan5          since ' uses shift
19:18 moparisthebest what is it if you don't hold shift?
19:18 sfan5          also xev probably handles keys differently than irrlicht
19:18 sfan5          actually no ignore that
19:18 sfan5          a #
19:18 moparisthebest xev just prints what X gets
19:18 moparisthebest can you use that as a hotkey?
19:19 agaran         how to specify other prefix than /usr/local when compiling minetest?
19:19 sfan5          it turns into - and doesn't work
19:19 sfan5          so no
19:19 sfan5          that's definitely a bug
19:19 moparisthebest yep that's what happens to me too sfan5
19:19 sfan5          agaran: -DCMAKE_INSTALL_PREFIX=/usr iirc
19:20 sfan5          KeyMap.push_back(SKeyMap(XK_numbersign, KEY_OEM_2));
19:20 sfan5          hm
19:20 sfan5          while minetest.conf says keymap_zoom = -
19:20 sfan5          (why isn't it using the irrlicht name, is that new?)
19:20 agaran         sfan5: thx, let's see.. :)
19:21 moparisthebest and yea you are right if KeyMap.push_back(SKeyMap(XK_A, KEY_KEY_A)); is right then it *looks* like KeyMap.push_back(SKeyMap(XK_apostrophe, KEY_OEM_7)); would be right
19:21 moparisthebest except the whole not working thing :)
19:21 sfan5          uh
19:21 sfan5          it doesnt accept KEY_OEM_2
19:21 sfan5          now *that* could be an mt bug
19:22 moparisthebest what if you put it in the config file manually?
19:22 sfan5          it interprets it as "K"
19:22 sfan5          as in KEY_KEY_K
19:22 sfan5          oh that explains it
19:22 sfan5          man who wrote this shitty code stuff
19:23 sfan5          moparisthebest: "-" means that minetest has no idea what key you're taking about
19:23 moparisthebest ah yep mine does the same
19:23 sfan5          an error
19:23 moparisthebest that's what I thought, but turns out pressing the - key makes it do it anyway :)
19:24 moparisthebest ha you know the worst part?
19:24 moparisthebest all that code diving, and turns out I can literally set
19:24 moparisthebest keymap_drop = '
19:25 moparisthebest in minetest.conf and it *just works* :)
19:25 moparisthebest but yea, that's some funky behavior
19:25 sfan5          my god this code is horrible
19:25 sfan5          if it wasn't so late i would start re-writing it this instant
19:26 moparisthebest I take it it has a hard-coded list of the keys, and if it doesn't match one, it puts -
19:26 moparisthebest but then parsing it if it doesn't recognize it it just takes the first character?
19:26 moparisthebest something along those lines anyway?
19:27 sfan5          i dont even know
19:28 sfan5          keycode.cpp:260-295
19:28 moparisthebest the other thing that wouldn't work was the / key for command
19:28 sfan5          ;_;
19:28 moparisthebest but that works too if you just set it to a literal /
19:28 sfan5          yes what you're doing works because of the
19:28 sfan5          bool KeyPress::operator==(const KeyPress &o) const
19:28 sfan5          and
19:29 sfan5          // it's not a (known) key, just take the first char and use that
19:29 sfan5          (line 291 - 295 in keycode.cpp)
19:30 moparisthebest ah so explains both why - gets put in there and why it ends up using the literal - key
19:30 moparisthebest yea, that's an, interesting, way to do it
19:31 moparisthebest though I see why, irrlicht didn't provide human readable names for the codes except for in the comments
19:31 moparisthebest if it did, it'd just use that and be done
19:32 moparisthebest I guess maybe it didn't because those some could need localization? idk
19:32 sfan5          yeah keycode.cpp deals with 1) parsing KEY_KEY_A into data 2) describing keys with human readable stuff 3) comparing keys
19:33 moparisthebest so the actual fix for those two keys is replacing "-" in that lookup array with "'" and "/"
19:33 moparisthebest but of course that's right for my keyboard, and not yours
19:33 moparisthebest fun. stuff.
19:34 moparisthebest still it should probably fallback to machine-readable KEY_OEM_7 or whatever versus not-working '-' ?
19:50 sfan5          yes it should
19:51 sfan5          i've decided
19:51 sfan5          fuck it
19:51 sfan5          i'm rewriting keycode.cpp
19:54 moparisthebest ha sfan5 sorry about that :P
20:12 agaran         recompiled dev release (not a head.. rather a bit old but post 4.14) and it seems to work bit more smoothly than release but maybe thats because of more optimal flags when compiling on same host
20:32 Calinou        yeah the difference is usually less than 1% faster
20:32 Calinou        when compiling yourself vs using a pre-made build
20:45 agaran         Calinou: i did recompile to check if it helps for random teleport to -xmax,y,-zmax
21:43 sfan5          moparisthebest: https://github.com/sfan5/minetest/tree/keycode_rewrite
21:43 sfan5          night~
22:44 redblade       hi
22:44 redblade       i've been noticing a phenomenon lately on my server
22:44 redblade       i'm wondering if there's an unofficial client that's doing this
22:45 redblade       people join and follow this pattern: NameXXX or NameYYYY
22:45 redblade       as their username
22:45 redblade       sometimes i've seen duplicate usernames with different numbres
22:45 redblade       i'm wondering if anyone had more info
22:45 redblade       i'm guessing it's an unofficial client
22:58 Fixer          redblade: unofficial client
22:59 redblade       what's it called?
22:59 redblade       do we know?
22:59 Fixer          redblade: i'm not sure, could be "Exploration" smth
22:59 Fixer          redblade: minetest android clone
22:59 redblade       are these accounts a danger? my server is currently 0.4.14-dev
23:00 redblade       i upgraded to dev when the tree griefer bug was fixed
23:00 Fixer          redblade: don't think so
23:01 redblade       exploration is a commercial version of "exploration lite"
23:05 redblade       oh god
23:05 redblade       i dont know if this is minetest but
23:05 redblade       https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.playcoolzombiesportgames.mine.craft.pocket.lite.exploration.voxel.story.ExplorationLite.adventure.world.girl.girls.princess
23:05 redblade       Girls Craft: Mine Exploration
23:05 redblade       Great game for girls! Feel like a princess! Play one of the best free games for teenage girls!
23:06 redblade       Build whole city with SPA, Nail Salon, Pet Shop, Make-up & beauty salon!
23:06 Fixer          redblade: don't bother, there are lots of them
23:07 redblade       I HATE THIS APP THERE ARE NO CUTE ANIMALZ!!! PLUS the castle is HUGE and it has 1 room with a tree in it. ARE U SERIOUS!! Plz make it better!
23:08 redblade       So annoying This is an annoying game and each time I press the menu it freezes and came up an ad also why don't they just give us the entire block so annoying
23:09 redblade       coming soon:
23:09 redblade       Multiplayer - girls game edition
23:09 redblade       Crafting items and weapons (maybe it isn't minetest then?)
23:10 redblade       there was someone on the message board who had a github for imitations, i gotta go find it
23:12 redblade       This other game entitled "Cute Craft Exploration: Girls" has the exact same description
23:13 redblade       but instead of being developed by "Play Cool Zombie Sport Games", it's developed by "Tiny Dragon Adventure Games: Craft, Sport & RPG "
23:13 redblade       https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.tinydragonadventuregames.mine.craft.pocket.lite.exploration.minecraft.voxel.cat.creative.build.world.girl.girls.cute.cube
23:14 redblade       Worldcraft: Exploration 3D
23:14 redblade       Craft Exploration Survival
23:14 redblade       there are dozens of similarly named "exploration" games
23:17 redblade       review for "megacraft":
23:17 redblade       HE STOLE!! He stole off exploration craft!thats the original game!!
23:54 Fixer          it is known
23:55 Fixer          fuck them
23:56 CanadianLuv    Anyone online