Time Nick Message 00:05 Putz3000 I would like to setup an in-house minetest server preferably running on my fedora Linux desktop system. Do I have to install a server install or just use the normal client install? 00:06 est31 Putz3000, if you have X installed, a client install is ok 00:06 est31 but if not, then you can go with a server install too 00:06 est31 the only difference are the dependencies 00:08 Pilcrow but if you do have a client, you can run it as a headless server anyway, by using 'minetest --server' 00:09 Putz3000 minetest --server is command line command? 00:09 ShadowNinja Putz3000: `minetest --server` is equivalalent to `minetestserver`. The seperate executable is just so that you don't have to install the Irrlicht library and all its dependencies to just build a server. 00:11 Pilcrow so yes, it's a command-line option. --server will allow you to run a server in a terminal, without the need to 'log in' on the server computer. 00:11 Putz3000 OK so if I am understanding correctly I can just install the normal client install and using it launch a server instance. That works for me because sometimes I will want to just play as client. Do I place mods in a different location so users connecting to the server can use them? 00:11 LazyJ If setting-up to run Minetest 24/7, go with minetestserver. If setting-up to play at home with your kids after work and school, regular client minetest and starting a local server from the main menu is the way to go. 00:13 LazyJ Mods - the Minetest "server" provides the mods to the "clients", so who ever connects doesn't have to preload anything but the engine. 00:14 Putz3000 LazyJ: but where do I place/install the mods for the server to recognize them? 00:14 Pilcrow same place as if you were using the server computer for a local singleplayer game. 00:15 Putz3000 oh, in the .minetest/mods folder in my home folder then? 00:15 Pilcrow yep 00:15 LazyJ One of two places, either in the "mods" directory or in the ../worlds/yourworldsname/worldmods/ directory. 00:16 LazyJ If using the /mods directory, you'll have to edit the world.mt file to activate each mod. 00:16 MinetestBot 02[git] 04kwolekr -> 03minetest/minetest: Add -Wsign-compare for Clang builds and fix some signed/unsigned compiler warnings 1311a96e4 http://git.io/vTUva (152015-05-16T20:15:03-04:00) 00:16 MinetestBot 02[git] 04kwolekr -> 03minetest/minetest: SAPI: Accept either ARGB8 table or ColorString to specify colors 13fb36c47 http://git.io/vTUvV (152015-05-16T20:15:03-04:00) 00:16 Putz3000 LazyJ: what would make me pick one over the other? 00:16 LazyJ If using the ../worlds/yourworldsname/worldmods/, then just copying the mods into the worldmods directory is enough. 00:17 Pilcrow the worldmods folder is seperate for each world. so you could have unique mods for each world. if you want a mod to be available in all your worlds, putting them in .minetest/mods will take up less space. 00:17 LazyJ Bingo, what Pilcrow said. 00:20 LazyJ For me, I put mods that I use in every world in the .minetest/mods directory. These are "utility" mods that don't add any blocks to the world but are useful tools. 00:21 exio4 Pilcrow: hi 00:21 LazyJ "WorldEdit", "Ambience", and "Unified Inventory" are examples of "utility" mods. 00:21 exio4 Pilcrow: did you look at the paste 00:21 LazyJ Then I use the ../worlds/yourworldsname/worldmods/ directory to put mods that are unique to that world. 00:21 Pilcrow Putz3000: if you have the client installed on your computer already, I find the easiest way to set it up as a 'server' is to run it normally first, create a world (let's call the world 'flump' for this example), then configure it and sign into it once as singleplayer. then exit and run minetest --server --worldname flump 00:22 LazyJ I have one world dedicated to only the Technic mod and its support mods. 00:23 LazyJ So "Technic", "Mesecons", "Pipeworks", "MoreTrees", "PlantLife", "MoreOres", "Carts", and "MoreBlocks" go into the worldmods directory of that world. 00:23 Pilcrow I tend not to use worldmods much at all... 00:23 LazyJ Then for another world that is vanilla, I just use the utility mods in the ./minetest/mods directory. 00:24 LazyJ For my mod testing worlds, I place the mod I'm testing in the worldmods directory. 00:24 LazyJ Each mod has its own dedicated world so that other mods don 00:24 Pilcrow and hello exio4. I did see the paste. looks like I was massively over-thinking it, last night... :P 00:24 LazyJ don't interfere with the evaluation and testing of the mod. 00:25 exio4 Pilcrow: yeah :p 00:25 exio4 Pilcrow: was that lua code clear enough? I tried to keep it idiomatic on both sides 00:25 LazyJ If you are setting up a world that has mods for little kids but want a world for the grown-ups to play in, then kiddie mods in the kiddie world and the more complex mods in the grownups world. 00:26 LazyJ The more you use Minetest, the more you'll figure out and evolve your setup to suit your needs. 00:26 Pilcrow exio4: yes, it was clear enough. your 'boilerplate' made me smile though; you know what you're doing, but its obvious that you don't use lua very often... ;) 00:27 exio4 Pilcrow: I don't really know Lua 00:27 Putz3000 Thank you all. I have copied/pasted this chat so I can study over it more as I try tackling this. On the surface it seems pretty straight forward overall. The real test I think will be if SELinux try's to interfere from a "locked down port" standpoint 00:27 LazyJ Ok, done typing my wall-o-text. :)- 00:27 Pilcrow heh 00:27 Putz3000 :) 00:27 exio4 Pilcrow: what'd the idiomatic way to do that kind of stuff? 00:28 hoodedice . 00:28 hoodedice sorry about that. bbl 00:29 Pilcrow exio4: s/what'd/what's/ ? 00:30 Pilcrow give me a sec. gotta find that paste again. 00:30 exio4 what would be the idiomatic way to do that kind of stuff? *? 00:40 Pilcrow exio4: well, for one thing, iterating through the numbers can be done much more simply with a for loop. http://dpaste.com/0CTAXKV 00:40 exio4 lool 00:40 exio4 you're so damn right 00:41 exio4 Pilcrow: wait, does that work? 00:42 exio4 and,that gen function now is doing something unrelated 00:42 exio4 for i = min, max do 00:42 Pilcrow oh acually it should be this I think: http://dpaste.com/3X9MH0Q 00:43 exio4 gen becomes completely useless in this specific program 00:43 Pilcrow (this is untested code, lol. step is optional for a for loop) 00:43 exio4 Pilcrow: I think that's wrong 00:43 Pilcrow probably 00:43 exio4 as it'll return the first function that _always_ returns i 00:43 exio4 which will be min 00:44 Pilcrow just a sec, I've gotta think about it a little 00:45 exio4 gen is useless now, you can replace it and just pass it as parameter to the loop 00:45 exio4 unles.. that's just a syntax rule 00:46 Putz3000 Do I need to enable "public" under the server tab when launching a local server instance of the game? 00:48 Pilcrow Putz3000: only if you want it to be listed on the public servers list. if you're just having family/friends connect to your IP, then no. 01:00 Putz3000 Pilcrow: great, thanks 01:13 MinetestBot 02[git] 04ShadowNinja -> 03minetest/minetest: Fix current mod name change missed during rebase 13c00b681 http://git.io/vTUtt (152015-05-16T21:12:03-04:00) 01:21 Putz3000 sorry, another question. If I create a world can "creative" be toggled on/off for that world? 01:23 LazyJ Not while the game is running. 01:24 LazyJ If you use Unified Inventory, that mod adds the "creative" priv which you can grant and revoke on-the-fly but the creative priv isn't quite the same as creative-mode. 01:24 Putz3000 LazyJ: but I could turn it on for a little bit and then when we were done using it I could shutdown, turn it off, and then relaunch the world correct? 01:25 LazyJ In creative-mod you can break the hardest objects with your hand. With the creative priv you don't have to craft items. 01:26 LazyJ Correct. "Creative" and "Enable Damage" can be toggled on/off and relaunch the game any number of times and combinations. 01:26 Pilcrow well, exio4, I thought I understood it, but I still don't. apparently, minetest doesn't understand the code in your original paste either though; running your code as a mod's init.lua just returns 4 instances of 2500... O_o 01:27 LazyJ Setup your Spawnbuilding (and other primary structures, roads, wayfindings, etc) in creative-mode then switch creative-mode off for gathering and crafting challenges. 01:29 Putz3000 LazyJ: Spawnbuilding? - you are not referring to each players house/building but instead a central spawn point? 01:29 LazyJ "Spawnbuilding" if you use a static spawn point. 01:30 Pilcrow exio4: http://dpaste.com/2WDYTGM 01:30 LazyJ It doesn't have to be a building but usually it is some sort of easily identifiable structure or spot. 01:30 Putz3000 the Static spawn point would apply to all players correct? 01:30 exio4 Pilcrow: yes, it is a standalone lua script 01:31 LazyJ Correct. A static spawn point would apply to all players unless overridden by a mod such as the new, default 'Beds' mod. 01:32 Putz3000 LazyJ: I am using the beds mod. so the bed would override the static spawn point and not the other way around? 01:32 LazyJ Correct. 01:32 LazyJ Players have to "sleep" at least once for their individual spawnpoints to be set to the bed. 01:33 LazyJ Just clicking on the bed isn't enough; night has to be changed to day (sleep). 01:33 Putz3000 LazyJ: Have you every played with the teleporter mod? It sounded somewhat interesting 01:33 LazyJ There are several teleporter mods. 01:33 Putz3000 LazyJ: what config file do I need to edit for a static spawn point? 01:33 LazyJ We use a combination of chat-command and push-button teleporter mods. 01:33 Pilcrow exio4: lol I know. actually didn't realize until now that there's an actual 'lua' cli executable. 01:34 LazyJ The static spawn point is set in the minetest.conf file. "minetest.conf.example" is the list of all the possible settings. 01:34 Putz3000 LazyJ: the one I read about allowed you to create teleporter pads and program them with coordinates. then you just walk onto the pad & it teleports you to the pre programmed destination 01:35 LazyJ If you use a static spawn point, go there first to make sure it is a safe landing spot. I recommend placing the actual spawn point one block higher so players don't materialize in the floor and make sure the spawn point is protected so no players can block it. 01:36 LazyJ You can use multiple teleporting mods without affecting each other. 01:36 LazyJ "Travelnet" is the most intuitive to use once set. 01:37 LazyJ For more 'mystical' or sci-fi, the telepads (the mod you describe) fit the theme better. 01:37 Pilcrow exio4: I just put your original paste into a test.lua file. this is my result: http://dpaste.com/2DE4PBF ... still not sure what it's supposed to do. I'm assuming not that. 01:37 LazyJ TPR and Bookmarks are chat-based teleport mods. 01:37 exio4 Pilcrow: do you understand what `count' does, now? 01:38 LazyJ Chat-based teleporters can be used anywhere where teleport mods that require pads or booths have to be found by the players. 01:38 Pilcrow nope. I assumed it would output different numbers. this just confused me more. 01:38 LazyJ TPR allows players to teleport to each other. 01:38 exio4 Pilcrow: do you have the link to the paste? :p 01:38 Pilcrow http://dpaste.com/2YXM2KW 01:38 LazyJ Bookmarks allows admins to set teleport locations that can be used by players. 01:39 LazyJ Or you could grant players the "teleport" priv and they could teleport themselves anywhere. 01:39 LazyJ That's not recommended if you are running a server with players you don't know and trust. 01:40 Pilcrow exio4: oh, btw... one thing I actually _do_ understand is what idiv is supposed to do. idiv(x,2) can be replaced with math.floor(x/2) 01:42 Putz3000 LazyJ: server is family based. how would I grant teleport for all players? I want to be able to go to their computer and quickly punch in their home base coordinates if they get lost 01:42 LazyJ Add the teleport priv to the list of privs in the minetest.conf file. 01:43 Putz3000 LazyJ: same type of thing if I want to allow flying? 01:43 LazyJ Putz3000: default_privs = shout,interact,fast,fly,teleport 01:44 LazyJ "no-clip" allows players to fly through solid objects. 01:44 Pilcrow Putz3000: or, if you want to change privs for each player individually, you can do /grant playername teleport 01:44 Pilcrow Putz3000: and /grant playername fly 01:45 LazyJ As for "home base" coordinates, use the default "sethome" mod. 01:45 Putz3000 LazyJ: so to default enable go to the config file and where it has default_privs just add the elements I want to allow? 01:45 LazyJ Once a player has setup a home base, they type "/sethome" at their home base. 01:45 Pilcrow Putz3000: that's right :) 01:45 LazyJ To return to their home base they type: "/home". 01:47 Putz3000 LazyJ: how does the engine know "/home" = what ever coordinate they started at or is that based on a static spawn point? 01:47 LazyJ Unified Inventory uses two buttons, a red-arrow house for "sethome" and a green-arrow house to "gohome". It's sethome/gohome are independent and separate from the default sethome. 01:47 LazyJ For each player, a player file is created that contains their inventory and last known location (coords). 01:48 LazyJ Depending on the mod used, their "home" coords may be recorded there or in a single file that tracks the "sethomes" of every player. 01:48 Putz3000 LazyJ: so really /home = either static spawn point or last place they slept (bed mod)? 01:48 LazyJ Nope. 01:49 LazyJ The static spawn point is a different location, the bed's spawn point different from that, and the sethome is yet another location. 01:49 Putz3000 LazyJ: so will i find info on the wiki for the sethome command? 01:50 LazyJ I don't know. I haven't looked at Minetest's wiki for a long time. 01:51 LazyJ While in-game, type /help all to see a list of commands and a very brief description of them (usually just the syntax). 01:51 exio4 grr 01:51 Putz3000 OK - so how would I make sure each player is able to pick a "sethome" spot so they can easily teleport to it? 01:51 exio4 Pilcrow: math.floor! I didn't know about it 01:51 LazyJ Type: /help for that specific command's info. 01:51 Putz3000 LazyJ: OK. I can do that. thank you 01:51 LazyJ Each player would have to "sethome" for themselves. 01:52 exio4 Pilcrow: well, basically count, takes a function, and some data structure that can be iteratored over (like a range..) and counts how many elements match the condition, 01:52 Putz3000 LazyJ: that I figured. Just wasn't sure if it was as easy and standing someplace and typing /sethome 01:52 LazyJ If you are dealing with youngin's you might want to setup a teleporter at their homes for them. 01:52 exio4 Pilcrow: I don't really know how to put this in a different way (things being the same is just because the functions happen to math nicely 01:52 LazyJ Yup. Its just as easy as that. 01:53 LazyJ Stand still, type /sethome and it's set for that player. 01:53 Pilcrow exio4: what I'm really struggling to understand is what gen_ actually outputs.. 01:54 exio4 oh 01:54 exio4 it's an iterator 01:54 Pilcrow is that a type of function? 01:54 exio4 for x in gen_(max,min) do 01:54 exio4 end 01:54 exio4 is equivalent to 01:54 exio4 uhh, wrong parameter order 01:54 exio4 gen_(min,max) 01:54 exio4 for x in min,max do 01:54 exio4 end 01:55 exio4 if I understand correctly 01:55 exio4 Pilcrow: yeah, it's a bit weird, now that I look at it! 01:57 Pilcrow 'for x in min,max do' is different than 'for x = min,max do' ... I think the former will only perform the code twice (once for min and once for max), while the latter will iterate through all the in-between numbers. 01:58 exio4 er, I don't know lua 01:59 exio4 gen_ basically returns an iterator, from min to max, using a step = 1 02:01 Pilcrow I tried to plug in some different things, to understand it, but failed. print(count(f, {1,2,3,4,5})) is totally wrong (it expects a function), but print(count(f, function() return 1,2,3,4,5 end)) just freezes the interpreter. 02:07 exio4 http://www.lua.org/pil/7.1.html Pilcrow 02:13 exio4 Pilcrow: if count there had a type, it'd be something like 02:13 exio4 count :: (a -> Bool) -> Iter a -> Int 02:13 exio4 with `Iter a` being a function non-pure function like (() -> a) 02:14 est31 -> is associative isnt it? 02:15 exio4 I assumed (A -> B -> C) is (A -> (B -> C)) 02:15 exio4 (note, thatg ((A -> B) -> C) is different) 02:15 est31 ok 02:15 exio4 it's right associativity 02:16 exio4 I am also too used to currying, so nevermind 02:16 exio4 A -> B -> C would be a function that takes an A, and returns a new function that'll take a new parameter B and and return a C 02:16 exio4 in some kind of vague terms 02:16 est31 yes 02:16 exio4 A -> (B -> C) makes that clear 02:17 est31 yes 02:17 exio4 (A -> B) -> C takes a function from A to B and returns a C 02:17 est31 yes 02:17 exio4 lol 02:17 est31 lol 02:17 exio4 poor est31 :P 02:18 est31 exio4, you are too right for ShadowBot. Make mistakes! 02:18 exio4 wat 02:18 exio4 which kind of mistakes 02:18 est31 where I cant answer with "yes" 02:19 exio4 lol 02:19 est31 :) 02:19 est31 restarting my KDE 02:19 est31 (that ugly bug again ...) 02:19 Pilcrow exio4: well. this is more advanced than I thought. even that explanation link doesn't make much sense to me. I feel stupid. I guess this is another of the many reasons I failed university... -_- 02:20 exio4 don't worry, I am gonna fail too :D 02:21 exio4 Pilcrow: this is not that advanced, it's more like you have never wrote code that way, so it doesn't feel natural :p 02:22 thefamilygrog66 has anyone else been successful getting kaeza's firearms mod to work with 0.4.12? 02:25 Pilcrow thefamilygrog66: I've never tried it, sorry. I've got a custom spin of the old 'throwing' mod, and that's all I've ever needed for projectiles... :P 02:25 exio4 Dan Grossman's course is prety good https://www.coursera.org/course/proglang 02:25 exio4 http://courses.cs.washington.edu/courses/cse341/13wi/#lectures 02:27 Putz3000 LazyJ: another Q (sorry): do I edit the mintest.conf file that is inside the worlds// folder that is inside the .minetest folder in my user folder? 02:28 LazyJ Putz3000, no worries. ;) ./minetest/minetest.conf. 02:29 LazyJ Only if you are getting really specific about a world do you get into stuff in the /worlds/yourworld/ directory. 02:29 thefamilygrog66 Pilcrow: thanks, it's odd - everything seems to work in it, though when I shoot mobs or other players, they don't take any damage at all. hopefully, it's just some minor tweaking... 02:29 Putz3000 LazyJ: thats the folder inside my user home folder correct (linux user)? 02:29 Putz3000 LazyJ: not inside of .bin or .var, etc 02:29 thefamilygrog66 howdy lazy 02:30 LazyJ Putz3000, afaik. I compile my Minetest clients as non-system wide. 02:30 LazyJ Howdy, grog! Long time, no see ;) 02:30 thefamilygrog66 Putz3000, do a Ctrl+H to show all the hidden folders within your home folder, and look in .minetest 02:30 Pilcrow thefamilygrog66: do you have a link to it? If not, I can go find it myself; I'd like to poke around with it. :P 02:31 thefamilygrog66 Pilcrow: Sure! https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=4562 02:31 LazyJ Putz3000, thefamilygrog66 has setup Minetest for "home" use with his family. He may have more insights to add. :) 02:32 Pilcrow exio4: are those links just videos to watch and stuff to read, or would I have to somehow 'enroll' or something 02:32 Pilcrow ? 02:32 thefamilygrog66 Howdy LazyJ, stopped into linuxgaming the other day 02:32 Putz3000 LazyJ, thefamilygrog66: It sounds like its the folder I think it is. I edited it and I think it is working fine but I saw the user name I used listed inside the config file so that had me wondering if maybe there was another more system wide config file that I was missing. 02:33 exio4 Pilcrow: e coursera link means you have to enroll, etc, but it's not needed, the second link gives you the lectures, all the content 02:33 LazyJ I saw that. Sorry I could be around. I finally found a full-time job and it's kicking my butt; dead tired when I get home these days. 02:33 exio4 Pilcrow: it's nice to take the course in the normal offerings because of the forums, though 02:33 thefamilygrog66 Looks like Vanessa made my furniture all curvy! 02:33 Putz3000 thefamilygrog66: basically LazyJ has been answering a ton of questions in an effort to help me setup a home server for the kids and I so we can play in the same world. 02:34 thefamilygrog66 Oh, okay - you're all behind the same router? 02:34 Pilcrow exio4: ah. I'll check it out, thanks. 02:34 thefamilygrog66 Putz3000 ^^^ 02:35 thefamilygrog66 brb 02:35 exio4 Pilcrow: remember to do the homework! :p 02:35 Pilcrow sometimes I wonder how much a certain medical condition actually affected my brain before I got it under control. I've passed out from lack of oxygen to the brain tens of times... that can't be good. I feel like I used to be smarter 5-6 years ago... :\ 02:35 Putz3000 thefamilygrog66: yes. I want to run it on my fedora desktop and just fire it up in server mode for the kids and I from time to time. all in house, no public facing. 02:36 LazyJ Putz3000, if you are starting the Minetest server from inside the client, then your name is added to the config file as the "admin" or "server-op"... the one Minetest is supposed to (cough, cough) obey. 02:38 LazyJ So when you type /grant , those privs are given to that player. 02:38 LazyJ Sort of like being the "root" in-game. 02:39 LazyJ But if any other player, who doesn't have any special privs, tries to grant privs to themselves or others, it won't work. 02:40 Putz3000 LazyJ: but once I launch it via command line the same config file should still be used correct? 02:40 LazyJ Correct. 02:41 LazyJ Once the Minetest server is running, log in and grant privs accordingly to yourself, the other "admins" (I recommend giving Mom high status) and then whatever privs you think the kids are ready for. 02:41 Pilcrow LazyJ: just making sure, if you /grant someone the 'privs' priv, then they can use /grant to give it to others, correct? 02:41 LazyJ Yup. 02:42 exio4 good night 02:42 LazyJ There is also "basic_privs" which only allows the player to grant or revoke interact, fast, and shout. 02:42 Pilcrow bye exio4. sorry for being annoying, lol 02:42 exio4 you aren't annoying 02:42 exio4 duh :p 02:42 Pilcrow eh. I just feel like it then. :P 02:44 Pilcrow heh. don't set default_privs = privs :P 02:44 Pilcrow of course, if you just did that, you'd have to /grant yourself interact... which would be really weird... :D 02:50 LazyJ Putz3000, so when you are in-game, grant *yourself* all of the privs: /grant Putz3000 all 02:51 LazyJ And then every time you add a mod, repeat the command to grant yourself any new privs that the mods may have added. 02:51 LazyJ Also do this when updating the engine and game as good measure. 02:52 Pilcrow thefamilygrog66: well, I poked into the firearms code, but can't figure out what the firearms.event.trigger function is supposed to do, so I don't know why it doesn't damage players/mobs. I tried but failed. sorry. :\ 02:53 thefamilygrog66 Pilcrow, no prob - thanks for looking at it. I'll try to run into kaeza sometime soon and pick his brain. 02:54 * thefamilygrog66 really needs to learn meshnodes... 02:55 * Pilcrow needs to as well... 02:55 thefamilygrog66 my own mods are using them now, or at least forks of them are, haha 02:56 thefamilygrog66 I have to admit that the sofas look pretty slick with their curves and all now. 02:56 Pilcrow ^ it would help if I could get Blender working, but it's nearly impossible in this old, outdated distro. every package I install needs to be manually compiled, and there are a LOT I need for blender; it's just kind of a dependancy nightmare... -_- 02:57 thefamilygrog66 yikes, which distro are you using Pilcrow? 02:57 LazyJ Any forum posts on creating meshnodes in Blender yet? 02:57 thefamilygrog66 LazyJ, I haven't checked, to be honest 02:58 LazyJ Also, is there a setting to prevent Irrlicht from listing, in the logs' startup, every single meshnode loaded? 02:58 thefamilygrog66 the first time I actually saw them being used on my lrfurn mod was when I was on your server recently 02:58 thefamilygrog66 no idea 02:59 LazyJ That list of meshnodes does me no good. I need the log info before and after. 02:59 thefamilygrog66 Is minetest itself generating the list? 03:00 thefamilygrog66 or irllicht 03:00 thefamilygrog66 *irrlicht 03:00 LazyJ idk. 03:00 Pilcrow thefamilygrog66: I'm using an old 32-bit version of Chakra Linux (originally forked from arch)... the repository doesn't exist any more. It would be completely useless, if Arch and its derivatives weren't so good at building packages. I really need to just re-do this computer entirely, but I have no available backup medium right now, and no money to get one, so I'd lose a lot of stuff... 03:02 thefamilygrog66 ah, I haven't heard of chakra. 03:09 thefamilygrog66 LazyJ: Vanessa made a script to import nodeboxes into blender: https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?p=159252 03:11 LazyJ Thanks, thefamilygrog66 ;) 03:12 LazyJ I'm going to have to spend a lot of time on YouTube learning how to use Blender. 03:12 LazyJ Too many irons in the fire, as always... as always. 03:13 Pilcrow thefamilygrog66: do you know the difference between a fixed-release model and rolling-release? as an example, Ubuntu is fixed-released and Arch proper is rolling-release. Chakra is one of the few existant 'semi-rolling' distros; it takes the rolling principle of Arch, but freezes and bugfixes the core libraries such as the kernel, sound server etc. while updating the higer-level packages (what most people would refer to as 'applic 03:14 Pilcrow ^ this allows it to be more up-to-date than, say, ubuntu, while being more stable than Arch. I think it's the best of both worlds. 03:15 Pilcrow the reason _my_ install is so outdated, is because I haven't used this computer in years, but recently switched back to it after my other one started getting some major heat problems... :P 03:16 Pilcrow s/core libraries/core packages/ .... the kernel isn't a library, lol 03:18 Putz3000 LazyJ: OK, on the surface it looks like it will work or at least I appear to have a decent working start on this. I was able to connect from my laptop to the box running as a server and I spawned in the exact spot I had logged out of when I first created the world via gui application. 03:19 LazyJ Putz3000, that's a good start. \o/ 03:20 LazyJ Keep an eye on the minetest.conf file after a few starts and shutdowns. 03:20 Putz3000 LazyJ: next question, is there any way to make my home world or server show up or be able to join simply by entering the world name on the remote client? currently you have to know the physical IP address of the server 03:20 Pilcrow honestly, Ubuntu is a bit of a bad example anyway, as fixed-releases go. it's based on an unstable branch of debian, so when it freezes the development, it freezes with bugs intact. that's one of the biggest reasons I hate ubuntu; it tries to be a figurehead to non-linux users, but it provides them with a system that's sometimes even buggier than windows. thus, linux is seen as a 'toy', incapable of 'real' work, by the majority of 03:20 Putz3000 LazyJ: why, something undesirable might happen in the config file? what should I look for? 03:20 LazyJ Minetest adds things to the minetest.conf file if you toggle something in the menu or change a setting in-game. 03:21 LazyJ Also it's a good idea to leave notes for yourself when and what settings you manually change in minetest.conf. 03:22 LazyJ Minetest's documentation is scattered and to sparten to make heads or tales of. Shear trial-and-error is often what it takes. 03:23 LazyJ Setup a domain name for your intra-net and use that instead of the IP (I haven't done that myself yet so I don't know how). 03:23 Pilcrow heh. guess I got a little ranty. just proves I love Linux though... :P 03:23 Putz3000 Pilcrow: that would explain why one release of Ubuntu seems good and stable and the next release things are broken that was previously just fine. very frustrating. I also feel they have ditched the desktop but can't publicly say or do so...at least not at this time. Their quality control sucks and they seem to not be putting any effort into applying known fixes for some things that are well known and documented issues. 03:24 LazyJ If you in-house server is the only one the family computers connect to to play Minetest, just logging in once is all you'll need. 03:24 LazyJ Minetest will keep that connection info in the client's minetest.conf files. 03:24 Putz3000 LazyJ: thats right (domain). Crap, I should have realized that - I work around networking. Personally I think it would be easier to give my box a static IP and then save it in the clients list :) 03:25 LazyJ If they start hopping around to Minetest servers online, those will be kept in another file and show-up in the server list. 03:25 Pilcrow Putz3000: yeah, I feel ubuntu has its reputation because it _used_ to be good. imho, though, it started going downhill way back in 8.10... 03:25 Putz3000 LazyJ: does the minetest.conf file respect # as a REM statement so I can place notes in the file without triggering an error message? 03:26 LazyJ Static IP, save in clients list... workable solution. 03:26 LazyJ Yup. "#" to comment out stuff in minetest.conf. 03:27 LazyJ Works in the world.mt and client list too. 03:27 Pilcrow Putz3000: 8.4 was great. 8.10 had some annoying bugs but mostly worked. then 9.4, 9.10, 10.4, and 10.10 were all complete trash. I stopped checking after that. 03:27 Putz3000 Pilcrow: I started noticing issues that really bugged me (could be old age too though) around the 9.10/10.10 range and of course Unity just tipped it for me. the very locked down nature of unity seems to defy free as in freedom. 03:28 Pilcrow Putz3000: if you don't mind my asking, what distro do you prefer? 03:29 Putz3000 Pilcrow: I have largely been a ubuntu or ubuntu based user with eOS being the most recent. Sadly mostly because I hated RPMs with a passion and loved command line apt-get. but I am honestly thinking fedora may have finally won me over. And RPMs have come a long way from where they used to be. 03:31 Putz3000 Pilcrow: lol, didn't see Q until I had already posted. I am currently using fedora 21 Workstation and am thinking I am largely enjoying it. not a fan of how comlicated it is for nvidea driver but otherwise seem pretty good. I recently looked at openSUSE again and after changing file formats from default it wasn't too bad but still just didn't sit right with me. on the debian/Ubuntu side I don't mind Mint but liked 03:31 Putz3000 aspects of eOS (elementary OS). but I am thinking I may stay fedora 03:31 Pilcrow I definitely have a thing for semi-rolling distros, as the only ones I know of are also my favorites. I love MEPIS (a semi-rolling debian stable; hasn't been updated in a while), PCLinuxOS (a semi-rolling Mandriva; some stability issues last time I tried), and Chakra (a semi-rolling Arch; has been perfect for me, if kept up-to-date)... :) 03:33 Putz3000 Pilcrow: I haven't messed with any of those I think. had never heard of Chakra until you listed it in irc earlier. PCLinuxOS I have heard of...I think I lightly looked at it once long time ago but that was it. have never personally played with rolling releases although thought about. have hung back because if ubuntu breaking things that were broke the last time bugged me I was afraid a rolling release would potentially 03:33 Putz3000 be worse 03:35 Putz3000 Ok guys, I have to run out for a bit so I am shutting down irc for now. thank you all for the help, suggestions, and conversation. my experience in this channel has probably been one of the best in years. 03:38 Pilcrow heh. it's nice when you can have fun conversations on here. Putz3000 seems pretty cool. :) 03:39 Pilcrow that Pilcrow guy, though, he's just fricking annoying. :P 03:42 LazyJ Hehehe... the channel was spared only a couple of my walls-o-text and Putz3000 survived. :0) 03:43 LazyJ Yeah. Nice to have a civilized and friendly conversation. 03:44 Pilcrow LazyJ: it would seem you and I are both 'walls of text'-type people... ;P 04:02 Pilcrow I hope I can catch luizrpgluiz tomorrow; he was trying to figure out how to generate a tree, so I created a simple example mod for him (using the set_node() method)... 04:03 Pilcrow ^ https://github.com/Pilcrow182/alien_trees :P 04:03 VanessaE Pilcrow: he's trying to figure out how to place a tree (by whatever method) with biome capability -- without relying on a third-party mod 04:04 VanessaE and he can't use the engine's deco system (no l-system support yet) 04:06 Pilcrow VanessaE: ah, ok. guess my example is useless to him then. oh well; it only took 10min to throw together anyway... :P 04:06 VanessaE heh 04:06 VanessaE 99 cobble says he looks at your code and *still* doesn't understand how to do it :) 04:07 Pilcrow heh 04:07 Pilcrow 99 cobble, huh? :P 04:07 VanessaE I'ma cheapskate :D 04:07 VanessaE I'm a* 04:08 Pilcrow so, is he trying to get minetest to make trees on_generated, but obey some biome properties directly, instead of by node name? 04:08 MinetestBot 02[git] 04kwolekr -> 03minetest/minetest: Add optional buffer param for bulk data array writes in Lua 133ffb5f5 http://git.io/vTUzz (152015-05-17T00:07:45-04:00) 04:08 MinetestBot 02[git] 04kwolekr -> 03minetest/minetest: Noise: Fix interpolation at negative coordinates 1328b2476 http://git.io/vTUzg (152015-05-17T00:04:51-04:00) 04:10 Pilcrow ^ 0_o I didn't know interpolation was even broken at negative coords... :P 04:13 Pilcrow VanessaE: there's probably better ways to make a simple tree than my example anyway. I'm not a big fan of scematics, and L-System is for big complicated things, but I'm thinking VM could be used for tree-generating... 04:14 VanessaE actually set_node() is the simplest way really 04:14 Pilcrow yeah? 04:14 VanessaE yeah. slowest, of course, but simplest 04:14 VanessaE VM would be faster for this, but harder for him to understand, I think 04:15 VanessaE the really tricky part of course is deciding just where to actually put the structure 04:15 VanessaE terrain evaluation and biome control is Hard™ 04:16 VanessaE (particularly if you wanna do it fast and do so after core mapgen runs) 04:17 Pilcrow yup yup. vm would be harder for me, too; I only have a tentative grasp on vm, really. I can make a simple lua landgen, but haven't actually figured out how to shift it up/down to create things like foatlands, nether, etc... :P 04:18 Pilcrow ^ not that it's particularly complex. I've just never devoted much time with it... heh 04:19 Pilcrow s/with/to 04:19 VanessaE ditto. I've only ever looked into VM's once, and that was when there was an engine glitch that caused snow mod to not work alongside plants_lib many months ago 04:20 VanessaE and then, I didn't really look into it enough to learn much :P 04:21 Pilcrow heh. yeah. I still wonder if using vm to alter a 1x1 area (i.e. a single node) would be faster or slower than using set_node() 04:21 hmmmmm why don't you like schematics? they were basically made for trees 04:24 Pilcrow hmmmmm: I don't know, really. I guess mostly because the official minetest ones are compressed, or binary or something, instead of text... I liked using the old .we files, where I could easily alter a schematic with sed... but I never used those for trees, either... :P 04:25 hmmmmm for what it's worth, you can just define them in lua 04:26 hmmmmm check this out: https://github.com/paramat/biomesdev/blob/9b1a4b8d1d6253736f60df916f1f6219405239ad/tree.lua 04:26 hmmmmm you can also translate an .mts file into the text for a lua table in that format 04:28 Pilcrow hmmmmm: alright then. I suppose I misspoke; I don't particularly dislike them, I just don't use them because they were just never very high on my priorities for figuring out. 04:29 hmmmmm if you want to add some kind of bulk nodes very quickly, you should try to learn more about schematics 04:29 hmmmmm it's worth it because you can do things with schematics you cannot do with anything else 04:32 Pilcrow Alright, hmmmmm. Thanks for the tip! I'll probably figure them out eventually; I do have a few home-spun mods that do that kind of thing, so it would probably be worth it to learn... :) 04:34 * Pilcrow idly wonders if there will ever come a point where there's nothing left to learn about minetest... :P 04:35 Pilcrow ^ if that ever happened, though, I'd probably get bored of it. or contribute to core development. yeah, not very likely I'll reach that point... :P 04:36 hmmmmm it's unfortunate to say, but the only ones who actually understand what's going on are the core developers 04:38 hmmmmm it's ironic, because the original selling point for the lua api was that it was "sinfully easy" 04:38 hmmmmm well, sinfully easy didn't scale up :p 04:41 Pilcrow well, lua has a shallow learning curve, but even it can get complicated. not to mention the extra core functions that are able to be called from lua. with schematics, vm, etc... I feel like I'm getting to the complicated parts of modding now... :P 04:42 hmmmmm the voxelmanipulator in particular exposes some internals of minetest out of necessity you might not have known about 04:46 Pilcrow yeah, I've already seen how useful it can be... it's definitely something I'm trying to get better with. some day I may make a vm clone of paramat's -old- floatlands (the ones in which the islands were small and sort of oval-shaped, and made entirely of floatstone and floatsand with a little mese and float-crystal rarely mixed in)... I really miss that old mod... but it was HORRIBLY slow... :D 04:47 Pilcrow and yes, I know he expanded floatlands and made them vm-based later, but I miss the island shape, etc. of floatlands ~2.0 :P 04:47 hmmmmm it might seem to people like i don't really do anything for minetest, but i'm trying pretty hard to make mods fast 04:48 hmmmmm it's all behind the scenes 04:51 Pilcrow hmmmmm: if people feel like you don't do much, it's probably because most minetest users stick to the lua-side and sort of ignore the core developers. sad, but true... I've seen some of the awesome things you've put work into, at least. I'll often watch the engine commits just to see what new features get added, lol. 04:51 VanessaE we know you're working hard on it 04:51 VanessaE it's just that there are tons of visible, user-facing issues that need dealt with, and not enough people to work on them 04:52 Pilcrow VanessaE: like that entity ghosting bug that keeps showing up, getting squashed, and coming back? :P 04:53 VanessaE Pilcrow: well I wasn't thinking of that, specifically. 04:53 VanessaE what's needed right now, imho, is a bug-squashing period - almost like a feature freeze prior to a release, but without the release. Something that goes on for weeks and weeks 04:54 VanessaE after which normal dev continues. 04:55 Pilcrow VanessaE: maybe, but there are always so many new feature requests, if all the devs decided to do that, the requests would build up to daunting levels, wouldn't they? 04:55 VanessaE some might say that such requests already *are* at "daunting" levels 04:55 hmmmmm there is an incredible amount of technical debt 04:56 hmmmmm nobody is going to work on that however, it's not scratching their own itch and it's not fun 04:56 VanessaE exactly. 04:56 VanessaE however: 04:56 hmmmmm this is what happens when your developers are all volunteers 04:56 hmmmmm I at least tried something by adding unit tests 04:57 VanessaE wouldn't scratching one's own itch also include making sure that your code is bug-free, seeing as how you would theoretically also experience the same bugs as the average users do? 04:57 VanessaE (not you personally, hmmmmm) 04:57 hmmmmm you'd freaking expect that to be the case! 04:57 hmmmmm but evidently not 04:58 VanessaE unit tests are good 05:01 Pilcrow then again, how often do most core developers get the chance to just play for recreation (i.e. not testing new stuff)? I know even for me as a mod programmer, probably 70% or more of my 'minetest time' is either spent making new code, or testing new code. I kind of forget about the older mods, until something goes horribly wrong... and that's just lua-side... 05:02 VanessaE it's about the same for me 05:02 VanessaE 70-80% of minetest time spent in code instead of in-game just playing 05:03 Pilcrow btw, hmmmmm, your unit tests do seem to be helping people though. just so you know. just a day or two, someone on here was using them. (est31 I think?) 05:03 Pilcrow * a day or two ^[ago] 05:09 hmmmmm cool 05:12 MinetestBot 02[git] 04paramat -> 03minetest/minetest: Mapgen v5/v7: Detect sandstone, enable sandstone brick dungeons 13c0edb8e http://git.io/vTUwX (152015-05-17T06:07:39+01:00) 05:13 Sinkidonk can anyone show me a example of how I can use the texture colorize? I try but I don't know what format they what me to use for the color. 05:18 Sinkidonk is anyone on at this late at night? just what to know before I wait hear for to long thinking someone listening. 05:19 Pilcrow hello Sinkidonk 05:20 Sinkidonk ok people are on this late at night 05:21 Pilcrow Sinkidonk: it's usually kind of slow at this time of night, but minetest has users and developers from all over the place, so there's usually at least -some- people in here... :) 05:21 Pilcrow Sinkidonk: I've never used colorize before, but this might help: http://dev.minetest.net/texture 05:22 Pilcrow looks like textures can be colorized with #RGB, #RGBA, #RRGGBB, #RRGGBBAA 05:22 Zeno` or a named colour 05:23 Sinkidonk yea that look like it will help me at the very least I now know the format that they me to use 05:24 Pilcrow ^ Zeno` would probably know more about it than me. but glad we could help! :) 05:25 Pilcrow btw, hello Zeno`! didn't see you sign in, as I was busy typing! :P 05:26 Zeno` hi :) 05:27 Pilcrow Zeno`: how are you this fine day? (irony: it is neither fine nor day where I am; it's a stormy night, lol) 05:27 Zeno` haha, 05:28 Zeno` I'm tired but ok :) 05:28 Zeno` 3:28PM here btw :P 05:28 Zeno` and kind of drizzling rain 05:30 Pilcrow ah. 12:28AM here and I will be going to bed in about an hour. I'm uh-mur-u-kin, lol. 05:31 Pilcrow hello again Putz3000! 05:31 Putz3000 Hello 05:32 Pilcrow Putz3000: how are you this [fine|stormy] [day|night]? :P 05:32 Putz3000 another question or two :) I edited the minetest.conf file and added the default_priv command that I thought included home but the only user that can use /sethome is my login. Is this a Mac issue you think I need to edit the file differently? 05:33 Putz3000 Pilcrow: night would be wet/rainy but a little calmer than earlier :) 05:33 Pilcrow lol 05:36 Pilcrow Putz3000: as far as I knew, anyone could use /sethome... but I'm not really the person to ask, as I use a mod that does it for me with buttons in my inventory. 05:37 Pilcrow ^ speaking of which, weren't you going to check out Unified Inventory? I think it has sethome/gohome buttons, as well... 05:38 Sinkidonk well thank you Pilcrow, and Zeno for the help would mine if I added your irc names to my mod basically saying thank for showing me that resource 05:38 Putz3000 Pilcrow: bummer :) thanks though. I also have to find out how to submit bug stuff for the Mac builds. I am hoping it plays well enough because most of the machines in the house are iMac's including two really old ones. 05:38 Zeno` in default game you need the "home" priv 05:39 Zeno` Sinkidonk, what does your priv line look like? 05:39 Putz3000 Pilcrow: I did grab and play around with Unified Inventory. It's OK but I think I largely prefer not using it. I don't like everything it does to the inventory window. I also think I lose the purpose of the game if I have everything unless I am only trying to build with it. I know, I am weird. 05:40 Zeno` anyway, just add ,home to it 05:40 Pilcrow Sinkidonk you can add me if you want, but all I did was show you a link. honestly, if it weren't for dev.minetest.net, I probably wouldn't even understand how to mod... ;) 05:41 Putz3000 Zeno: How do I enable that on a server instance? I edited the minetest.conf file in the worlds folder and added a default_priv line that included it but it only works for my login not the other users connecting remotely. 05:41 Zeno` and don't paste your password here if you do happen to paste the line in auth.txt lol 05:41 Putz3000 can I login and just do a /grant home or something like that? 05:42 Zeno` you can do it that way, sure 05:42 Sinkidonk yep that will work 05:42 Putz3000 Zeno: is there a better or easier way? 05:44 Zeno` yeah 05:44 Zeno` well.. you can add default_privs = interact, shout, home to minetest.conf 05:44 Pilcrow Putz3000: Honestly, I agree with you about Unified Inventory. I never did like it much. I use Zeg9's Inventory++, because it's mostly like the default but can have 'plugin' mods for doing more stuff. It doesn't get updated very often, though... 05:45 Zeno` if you do it that way everyone will have the "home" priv automatically 05:45 Zeno` (except for existing users I think) 05:46 Zeno` (for existing users edit auth.txt and change :shout,interact: to :shout,interact,home:) 05:46 Pilcrow ^ ah. yeah. users that already exist won't be granted the new privs. default_privs only affects -new- players 05:48 Putz3000 actually I just looked at my config file and I guess I included everything EXCEPT home. So I killed the server, edited the file and relaunched the server. My guess is it will work now 05:48 Putz3000 OK, time for a father & daughter test run with this thing. see you all later. 05:48 Pilcrow Putz3000: for future reference, Krock's mod-searcher is awesom for finding mods that people mention on irc by name. http://nimg.pf-control.de/MTstuff/modSearch.php 05:49 Pilcrow *awesome 05:49 Putz3000 cool. thank you. 05:49 Pilcrow np. have fun with your daughter! :) 05:50 Zeno` bye 05:50 Putz3000 will do l8tr 05:51 Pilcrow does anyone else use inventory++ any more? I feel like it's gotten almost completely eclipsed by unified inventory... :P 05:52 Zeno` no, but I use Zeg9's craft guide 05:55 Pilcrow yeah? I always thought ui had a better craft guide... at least the nodes are easier to search for. but I like the look and feel of i++ more, and it's easier to expand/customize... 05:55 Pilcrow I just wish someone would split ui's craft guide and node searching into a i++ plugin. I'd do that myself, but figuring out other peoples' formspecs makes my brain hurt :D 05:56 Zeno` When my server was new I really wanted things as lightweight as possible 05:56 Zeno` formspecs are fugly 05:58 Pilcrow I don't care much about making things lightweight, but I want them to -feel- lightweight and easy to manage. I get why people like ui, but it feels big and clunky to use, for me... 05:59 Pilcrow ^ not that it's badly coded, at all. just not to my taste. 06:02 Pilcrow really, I just wish zeg9's craft guide had a text search box, for finding a node by description or node-name, similar to the one in unified inventory. that's the only thing I really feel is missing. 06:03 Pilcrow instead, I've gotta flip through 10+ pages of nodes to find the one I'm looking for. which becomes even worse if I'm trying out a new texture pack or something and don't actually know what the node I'm searching for -looks- like... :P 06:11 thecatplayer hello? 06:12 thecatplayer how does this work? 06:14 hmmmmm oh god i am not good with computers how did i get here 06:15 Pilcrow heh 06:15 Pilcrow I was busy with something 06:16 Pilcrow irc is kind of hard to stumble upon by accident... :P 06:18 * Pilcrow wishes there were such a thing as voice-over-irc... :P 06:20 Sinkidonk I guess it somewhat easy if there was a link to the irc 06:26 Pilcrow Sinkidonk: well, I suppose so, but in order to stumble into here by accident, you'd have to navigate to the minetest website, click/hover-over community, click IRC, and click #minetest... not to mention the fact that if someone was 'not very good with computers', they probably won't have heard of minetest. which makes me wonder how they'd stumble into the main site in the first place... :P 06:26 Pilcrow btw, hello RBA 06:28 Pilcrow haha. someone actually attempted to make a voice-over-irc... http://ecc-comp.blogspot.ca/2014/09/b64oirc-base64-over-irc.html 06:30 Sinkidonk that is a good point 06:41 Pilcrow time for me to go to bed. have a great [day|night] everyone! o/ 06:42 Sinkidonk yep night 07:47 Krock 4 people on the forum have their birthday and the youngest is th only with more than 0 posts. 07:48 Krock somehow strange 08:04 MinetestBot 02[git] 04kwolekr -> 03minetest/minetest: SAPI/Noise: Add PerlinNoiseMap:getMapSlice() function 134c9a8a9 http://git.io/vTTeO (152015-05-17T04:04:17-04:00) 08:43 Matsetes Hi! 08:43 Matsetes Is there any mod that adds something like barrels but pipeworks compatible? 10:29 Megaf Hi all, what is this Initialising Nodes? 10:29 Megaf Why does it take so long? 10:34 Matsetes Dunno, but charging a world is so long... 11:09 est31 jin_xi, you might want to talk to RealBadAngel. 11:09 RealBadAngel bout what? 11:09 est31 irrlicht particles 11:10 est31 https://github.com/obneq/minetest/tree/scenenodeparticles 11:10 RealBadAngel i wasnt playing with particles at all 11:10 est31 do you know who could help? 11:11 RealBadAngel no idea. but whats the problem anyway? 11:11 est31 I think jin_xi wants feedback about the general approach of their changes 11:12 est31 jin_xi you should update the existing PR, thats better than opening a new one. A new pr is ok if discussion starts to get too long. 11:12 est31 https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/2587 11:13 est31 RealBadAngel ---> http://irc.minetest.ru/minetest-dev/2015-05-16#i_4251981 11:14 jin_xi better look here https://github.com/obneq/minetest/tree/scenenodeparticles than that PR for now 11:14 jin_xi can a PR be updated to use a different branch? 11:14 est31 no 11:14 est31 but you can set the branch to the content of the other branch 11:15 est31 you will have to update it every time you do changes on the original branch 11:15 est31 but will work 11:15 jin_xi what a mess 11:15 est31 why not use the original branch? 11:15 jin_xi was checking out different approaches 11:16 est31 and you want feedback which one to use? 11:16 est31 or have you already decided on one 11:18 technomancy has anyone worked on modding digilines LCDs to allow two of them to work side-by-side? 11:18 technomancy the limitations of 12x5 chars are pretty >_< 12:22 YuGiOhJCJ hello, do you see why my seeds give a bad result on this part of my dirt ? http://yugiohjcj.free.fr/minetest-seed.png 12:25 est31 YuGiOhJCJ, its because of a shadow in the air 12:26 est31 update to latest git, that bug got resolved since 0.4.12 12:26 est31 you'll still have to remove the existing shadow though 12:26 est31 this can be done with worldedit 12:27 est31 select the area and then do //replace air air 12:27 Krock (best is when you do this when the wielditem gets bright again) 12:28 Krock (fly up) 12:36 YuGiOhJCJ worldedit ? you speak of this project ? http://www.enginehub.org/worldedit 12:40 YuGiOhJCJ hmm... maybe this : https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=572 12:41 est31 yes 13:07 YuGiOhJCJ OK the MOD is installed and now I am able to type commands like "/help /copy" so it seems to work but I don't see the WorldEdit GUI in my inventory pressing the "i" key... Is it normal? 13:10 Krock !mod worldedit 13:10 MinetestBot Krock: WorldEdit [worldedit] by sfan5 - https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?t=572 13:11 technomancy I have to know what S-named thing sfan5 is a fan of 13:12 technomancy spiderman? selenium? sicilian pizzerias? 13:13 technomancy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S_Club 13:16 Krock solid silver structured statue surprisingly sold since sunday 13:46 technomancy maaaaan I wish there were an actual terminal working ._. 13:49 technomancy well, a https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Character-oriented_terminal to be specific 14:10 est31 if we get a client scripting API, we can add key press callbacks 14:33 technomancy that would be awesome 14:34 technomancy is that still in the planning stages or what? 14:34 est31 yes 14:36 technomancy well I know it's not exactly a democracy, but that gets all my votes 14:41 est31 its one of the defining features of the next minetest release (at least that's the plan) 14:42 est31 nice features that already are implemented are modding security and srp for authentication 14:42 est31 but those aren't so visible to the end user 14:42 hmmmm i don't think the next version needs to be 1.0.0 or whatever 14:42 hmmmm 0.4.13 14:43 hmmmm i'd do a release, except there are too many bugs that weren't fixed yet 14:44 sfan5 the next release being 1.0.0 would raise too many hopes 14:45 technomancy what's modding security about? 14:45 technomancy sandboxing? 14:45 jin_xi rockclimbing 14:46 hmmmm it makes mods not be able to rm -rf /* or fetch http://badsite.ru/trojan && ./trojan 14:46 technomancy shelling out specifically? 14:47 hmmmm it's a sandbox yeah 14:47 hmmmm shadowninja can explain it best 14:49 est31 when its enabled, we can start discussing about a mod store with lax checking again 14:54 technomancy will it be optional? 14:55 sfan5 yes 14:55 est31 security is already there 14:55 est31 inside the master branch 14:57 technomancy cool 14:57 ElectronLibre Hmm, why is the default value for movement_gravity 9.81? With this value players can't even jump or they kill themselves again the node below them. 14:57 technomancy 9.81 is earth-normal 14:57 technomancy meters per second per second that is 14:58 technomancy maybe the units are screwed up 14:58 sfan5 m/s² 14:58 ElectronLibre Yes, but, try it. 14:59 ElectronLibre You will not even be able to jump one node. 14:59 ElectronLibre I know it is the earth-normal value, but it doesn't work for minetest (default gravity seems to be around 0.5/0.7). 14:59 technomancy guess it's specified in m/s² when it's expecting Gs 15:00 ElectronLibre Anyway, the default value isn't good, and if someone use it he/she will be stuck. 15:01 technomancy is it possible you pulled and reloaded the lua without recompiling the C? 15:03 ElectronLibre No, I always recompile after pulling. 15:03 ElectronLibre And this isn't a recent change. 15:03 technomancy weird 15:03 ElectronLibre Try with this : http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/11187994/ (modname : gravity) 15:04 hmmmm hmm 15:04 hmmmm where should I post an informational post on how to use a new set of lua api functions 15:04 hmmmm on the forum 15:04 VanessaE engine dev 15:05 ElectronLibre And knowing that there is no way to get a player's gravity value, well, I have to use a random one, because the setting's one is broken.. 15:05 hmmmm the target audience is modders though 15:05 Calinou Modding Discussion then 15:05 kahrl ElectronLibre, set_physics_override takes multipliers, not absolute values 15:05 kahrl so the default would be 1 15:05 ElectronLibre Thanks karhl. 15:05 Wayward_Tab Just added movement_gravity = 9.81 tobmy minetest.conf, and it seemed normal 15:06 Wayward_Tab *to my 15:06 Krock isn't it default? 15:06 ElectronLibre My mistake. I didn't see it was a multiplier. 15:06 ElectronLibre Well, it was written.. 15:06 * ElectronLibre hides 15:10 Krock http://usvsth3m.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/gb0F132.gif 15:20 rubenwardy Hi all! 15:20 srifqi Hi rubenwardy 15:20 ElectronLibre Hello rubenwardy. 15:20 Krock hi rubenwardy 15:21 rubenwardy Do they not get it? https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?p=178675#p178675 15:21 rubenwardy I propose extreme bumps should have the post deleted, and the user given a warning by PM 15:21 rubenwardy They do that on other forums 15:22 srifqi How about auto-lock old posts? 15:22 rubenwardy That as well. Or require premoderation for users with under 100 posts 15:22 Calinou premoderation is way too much hassle 15:22 Calinou maybe we could premoderate the first 5 posts, but not more 15:23 rubenwardy I meant require premoderation for users with under 100 posts who are replying to a topic which has not been posted on for over a year 15:24 Calinou that's too complex to implement 15:24 Calinou don't make gas factories just because you can make them :P 15:27 rubenwardy It's good to dream 15:27 Krock http://games.usvsth3m.com/apple-watch/ score 12 15:29 rubenwardy https://www.phpbb.com/community/viewtopic.php?f=70&t=2088095 15:31 Krock +1 15:32 YuGiOhJCJ est31, thank you it works, I have installed the "Minetest-WorldEdit-1.0" MOD on "Minetest 0.4.12" then I have selected the region and I have typed "//replace air air". After that, my seeds give a good result :) http://yugiohjcj.free.fr/minetest-seed-2.png 15:37 est31 gread :) 15:37 est31 t* 15:38 thefamilygrog66 I would like a train mod 15:39 ElectronLibre You have carts. 15:39 thefamilygrog66 I know, was being jerky. 15:40 thefamilygrog66 That said, I would like smooth/non-glitchy carts and other vehicles. 15:44 thefamilygrog66 I know I asked this yesterday, but... 15:44 thefamilygrog66 Has anyone here had any success getting the firearms mod to work with 0.4.12? 15:45 ElectronLibre thefamilygrog66, do you have a link for it please? 15:46 ElectronLibre Nevermind, I've got it. 15:46 thefamilygrog66 oh, cool. It seems to work except that when I shoot other players or mobs, they don't take any damage. 15:47 ElectronLibre Which way do you see it? 15:47 thefamilygrog66 What do you mean? 15:47 ElectronLibre How do you know they don't get damaged? 15:48 thefamilygrog66 I've tested it locally, logged into the same server a few times as different usernames. 15:48 ElectronLibre Ok. 15:48 thefamilygrog66 Also, I've modified the mobs mod I'm using so that it's obvious (read: bloody and loud) when they get hit 15:58 ElectronLibre Players get damages for me, but I can only load the weapons at the end of the list. 16:05 ElectronLibre Which is logic, because the weapons at the beginning of the list aren't supposed to be working ._. 16:16 hmmmm https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?f=47&t=12178 16:17 exio4 https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/krita/krita-free-paint-app-lets-make-it-faster-than-phot?ref=card 16:24 Calinou nice ref 16:25 Putz3000 I have an iMac w/ client connecting to local fedora based Minetest server (doubt that matters). One of the mods running on server is More Ores. My daughter mined enough copper & Tin to make 4 bronze bars. She tried making a Bronze pickaxe but it won't let her. Is a heard of issue or just unique to me? OSX related or Mod related? 16:26 Calinou to make bronze, you use Steel + Copper. 16:26 Calinou More Ores is basically obsolete 16:26 Calinou I don't suggest anyone using it now 16:26 Calinou it's pretty much a legacy mod 16:26 Calinou back when the game had only 3 ores 16:29 jojoa1997 I remember those day 16:30 jojoa1997 days 16:30 jojoa1997 hi Calinou. How's it going? 16:30 Calinou hi 16:33 Putz3000 Sorry, my bad, she is was trying to make Brass. But I am thinking that making a Brass item is not supported. Would that be correct? 16:33 nore Putz3000: it exists in technic 16:34 nore are you using it? 16:34 Krock brass also exists in homedecor AFAIK 16:34 nore yes 16:35 nore but I can't find a craft for homedecor's brass 16:36 Calinou there are no brass tools 16:36 Putz3000 So it is probably only craftable for something within another mod and not for default in game items such as sword or pick 16:37 hmmmm hmm 16:37 Putz3000 nore: technic? is that another mod? 16:37 nore yep 16:37 nore brass items do not exist in minetest_game 16:37 nore there are only bronze ones 16:37 hmmmm can somebody take the information from that post i just made and format it into the article for PerlinNoiseMap on the dev wiki 16:38 Putz3000 OK, thanks. I will probably pull the more ores mod off the server then. its more pain then its worth. I was just trying to give us more to mine and more qty as I think the game is super stingy on spawning ore qty and types 16:39 Putz3000 Does any one know the best way to submit bug type information for the OS X build? 16:39 Calinou there are enough ores if you go deep (-256 and below) 16:40 Calinou Putz3000, to submit bugs, do it on GitHub: https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues 16:40 Calinou you need a (free) account 16:41 Putz3000 Calinou: even for OSX specific issues for the OSX builds? 16:43 Putz3000 nore: homedecor crafting guide: http://digitalaudioconcepts.com/vanessa/hobbies/minetest/homedecor-crafting-guide/homedecor-craft-guide.html 16:44 nore hm.. 16:44 Putz3000 nore: but I think it is so complicated with what is needed to craft before crafting final product that its so much easier to just enable unified inventory to gain access to all those items. 16:46 Calinou Putz3000, yes, OS X-specific issues go there too 16:46 Calinou please mention if your build is official, self-built or unofficial 16:48 Putz3000 Calinou: honestly I am thinking all of them or somewhat unofficial unless there is an official dirty release. Even what the forum page calls stable still shows in game as dirty :( 16:48 Calinou dirty means it's been modified from release tag 16:48 Calinou nothing bad 16:49 Putz3000 Calinou: oh ok. So what is the actual stable release version of Minetest? My fedora repo install is 0.4.11 but what seems to be called stable on the OSX build is 0.4.12 16:55 Calinou yes, latest stable is 0.4.12 16:55 Calinou almost all distributions have outdated versions 16:55 Calinou blame them for not being rolling release 16:57 gaming What is the other irc server for minetest? The one that most minetest servers are on? Isn't horus.net or something? 16:57 gaming isn't it*** 16:59 gaming nvm 16:59 gravgun (this #minetest is the only real one isn't it?) 16:59 rubenwardy This is the official one 17:00 rubenwardy But there are others on gaming IRC networks 17:00 rubenwardy inchra maybe 17:01 Putz3000 Calinou: I'm not blaming anyone for that. I just wasn't sure which version was really stable vs non-stable from a fedora vs OSX build. Should I look into figuring out how to install 0.4.12 on fedora to upgrade it - would I gain anything? 17:02 CWz That mobs-redo chicken just egg bombed a large area. 17:06 Calinou it wouldn't fix your issue, but you'd have lots of enhancement 17:07 Putz3000 Calinou: OK, enhancement can be worth the work. Do you have any Linux experience? I am curious if it is a big deal to swap out the yum install with a more current one? 17:08 Calinou yes, you need to build it yourself 17:08 Calinou read the https://github.com/minetest/minetest/ readme 17:08 Calinou 1) clone the Git repository 17:08 Calinou 2) install dependencies 17:09 Calinou 3) type: cmake . -DENABLE_GETTEXT=1 -DENABLE_FREETYPE=1 inside the cloned folder 17:09 Calinou 4) type: make 17:09 Calinou and that's it 17:11 Putz3000 Calinou: does step 4 install or is step 5 run installer that step 4 made? 17:15 Calinou the step 3 makes the Makefile, the step 4 uses that Makefile to build the program 17:16 Putz3000 Calinou: Does the Makefile script also place the built program icon in the Applications list? 17:17 Calinou nope 17:17 Calinou for that, use sudo make install 17:18 Putz3000 Calinou: I do make install AFTER step 4 not in place of any of the first 4 steps correct? 17:18 Calinou yes, after step 4 17:18 Putz3000 Calinou: Awesome thank you. 17:19 Putz3000 I again want to thank everyone in this room. You have put up with my questions for past 4 days which has got me up and running as a singleplayer then got me up and running w/ local server that allowed me to bond w/ my daughter for like 4 hours late last night (3am MST :) ) 17:20 Putz3000 So to everyone who answered questions Thank you. And those that may be Minetest developers or Mod developers thank you for all the work you put into this game for people like me 17:36 CWz wow i was able to join singleplayer with another client 17:57 Taoki Hi. Can anyone explain what active_object_count means in register_abm? The Lua API doesn't seem to document this. 17:59 Calinou the number of active objects, probably… 17:59 hmmmm to be completely honest, I'm not quite sure what the purpose of it is 18:00 hmmmm it looks useless. can somebody check out a first-generation mod created by celeron himself and see how it's used? 18:00 hmmmm we can remove it and gain a small performance boost 18:01 Taoki I'm refractoring the spawn function of my simplemobs fork, and I noticed that it existed there... not sure what to do with it. 18:02 Taoki I assume it's how many ABM's of the same type can exist in the world at once? Although that makes no sense either. 18:02 Taoki I think I'm going to remove it. 18:03 hmmmm nope, it's simply, the number of active objects inside of that block 18:04 Taoki Ok. Seems useless yeah. 18:04 hmmmm hrmm. this could have possibly been to make mob spawning more convenient 18:04 Calinou yes, keep it 18:04 hmmmm so there is use. it's just useful in a very specific edge case, and does not belong as a parameter to ABM callbacks to be calculated each and every time 18:05 hmmmm make it a separate API instead 18:05 Calinou it doesn't belong in ABM yes 18:05 Taoki Still can't fully understand what it's meant to do 18:05 hmmmm get_active_object_count_in_radius() 18:06 hmmmm Taoki: this is entirely conjecture, but to limit the amount of mobs spawned in a specific area 18:06 Taoki Ahhh 18:06 hmmmm let's see if simple_mobs or mobf uses it 18:06 Taoki So the spawn won't happen if there are other spawns of the same type in the given radius? 18:06 hmmmm no, just too many spawns in general 18:06 hmmmm or players 18:07 Taoki Simplemobs at least does 18:07 Taoki Ok 18:07 hmmmm well instead of guessing, let's see for sure 18:07 Taoki The limit seems to be set to 1, yet it allows more than 1 mob at once 18:08 hmmmm herm 18:08 hmmmm if you take a look at pilzadam's mob mod, you'll see it is used 18:09 hmmmm this is extremely inefficient though 18:09 hmmmm i don't normally advocate doing this, but do you think we could have modders who do use it to change their mods? 18:09 Taoki I know, the code exists in my fork too. That's why I asked. 18:10 Taoki I think I'll hard-code it to 1 18:13 hmmmm needless to say minetest was not written with efficiency in mind 18:14 hmmmm the way ABMs are implemented makes it necessary to have a C++ -> Lua transition for each and every single node inside the mapblock 18:14 hmmmm perhaps we should just deprecate ABMs altogether and encourage people to use a better framework 18:15 hmmmm one that actually scales 18:15 LedInfrared aside for the fact that it's not coded in java :P 18:15 Taoki I think Minetest is a pretty good engine. Just still unfinished from many perspectives. 18:15 hmmmm frankly i wouldn't be surprised if minecraft were faster than minetest. 18:15 Taoki It's probably as efficient as a voxel engine can be. 18:15 hmmmm it's not. 18:15 hmmmm it really isn't 18:16 Taoki Ok 18:16 Taoki Also, irony makes it that Minecraft has better FPS at the same draw distance and complexisy than Minetest. But this is probably mostly Irrlicht suff. 18:17 Taoki I probably shouldn't bring up the VBO code again :) 18:18 LedInfrared "unfinished" is correct since it's still in development. :P 18:18 exio4 Minetest can be anything but efficient :p 18:18 LedInfrared still more efficient then minecraft 18:18 exio4 hmmmm: I give you that one, which kind of framework do you have in mind for the replacement? 18:18 Taoki exio4: It can and likely will become more efficient. 18:19 hmmmm one which operates on entire mapblocks 18:19 hmmmm not single nodes at a time 18:19 Taoki In its CURRENT stage... well I have to agree 18:19 exio4 Taoki: I am talking about present 18:19 LedInfrared the software render is a nice idea though :P 18:19 hmmmm open up a voxelmanipulator for that block and its neighbors, pass the same LVM to each and every ABM callback 18:19 * Taoki nods 18:19 hmmmm honestly, ABMs are slow because of the sheer amount of unnecessary overhead 18:20 gravgun hmmmm: Optimize! Zoom! Enhance! 18:20 hmmmm if we get it right then we can crank up the active abm range from... 2... to something real 18:20 Taoki My biggest issue with the Minetest engine is the networking. Sometimes it's so slow that it takes minutes to even open a door on a server with relatively okay ping! 18:20 Taoki Many people blame mods however, not sure how often that's the case. 18:20 Taoki I need to test this with more attention. 18:21 hmmmm instead of confirming there is a problem it's much more helpful to solve the problem 18:21 hmmmm we don't have enough people coding real solutions to things 18:21 gravgun Taoki, you need to... Mine-test this! 18:21 Taoki Indeed 18:21 * gravgun gets out 18:21 hmmmm so like 18:21 Taoki =) 18:21 hmmmm we have the occasional contributor who just scratches their own itch 18:21 hmmmm implements a very specific feature they wanted 18:22 Taoki Hopefully I can try to help more with the code too. Minetest is virtually the onlt C++ code which is clean enough for me to understand and work with. 18:22 hmmmm we have the occasional contributor who is great at coding, and fixes some bugs 18:22 hmmmm but the problem is they're all very part time and occasional 18:23 exio4 maybe if we got a successful kickstarter... :p 18:23 sofar eugh.... all that work and override_day_night_ratio() doesn't do what I thought it did :(((( 18:24 Taoki I think Minetest will get far. Could get even farther if there was even more development, of course 18:26 jin_xi Taoki: did you ever try pathfinding again recently? the weird 'optimization' is gone and some bugs fixed, so it should be better now 18:26 Taoki jin_xi: I need to do that, yeah. Tried it briefly and didn't seem to get as many errors, but mobs couldn't follow the points properly. 18:26 Taoki I might need to tweak the following code 18:27 LedInfrared it would probably do better then manic digger 18:27 LedInfrared anyone remember that? 18:28 jin_xi one thing about mt is that often you'll hear phrases like 'but thats probably due to irrlicht' or 'for when we want to switch to ogre' 18:28 Taoki Yeah... a very simplistic engine :) Was a bit fun 18:29 jin_xi but i think no matter what the 3d engine, if its used as half assedly as minetest does it hardly matters 18:29 LedInfrared anyone remember the whole OUTRAGE about manic digger? XD 18:29 Taoki LedInfrared: People offended that someone else dared to make a game similar to Minecraft? Haha, yeah 18:29 Taoki That existed / exists about Minetest too up to some point 18:34 gravgun That's why I'm making a clone of THE original game 18:34 gravgun Infiniminer 18:35 exio4 as long as you don't clone humans, I think it is ok 18:35 gravgun Hum that was part of my plan :/ 18:35 gravgun Right now I'm expanding the engine to support "infinite" worlds 18:36 gravgun And at the same time implement a block (node) metadata store 18:36 gravgun Hopefully I locally use git, so if something breaks, detached HEAD, copy, paste 18:37 exio4 as a matter of fact, pretty much the only Minecraft server I happened to play has a few worlds, and pretty much 'all' of them were restricted to 6000x6000(x256) worlds 18:37 exio4 +-3000 in both directions 18:38 gravgun That's like 10x less than MT 18:38 gravgun int64_t lolol 20:19 Taoki Hmm... is it wrong to change the speed and yaw of entities (mobs) frequently, from a networking perspective? Like if mobs change their rotation each frame, will that mean a greater packet flood on the network? 20:19 VanessaE probably will, yes 20:19 Calinou a network frame is 0.1s by default 20:19 Calinou keep in mind that some people will change it 20:19 Calinou so do not make your stuff network-dependent 20:19 Calinou it could also behave worse in local games 20:20 VanessaE reminds me of a hack kaeza did once to support movable players' head, it sent head position info every tick, caused a 100 kB/sec network flood :) 20:20 Taoki I can only test this properly on local which is why I'm asking 20:22 Taoki I'll probably add an angle and velocity difference tretshold to prevent this 20:22 Calinou test on local game, and on server + client 20:22 Calinou (separate processes) 20:22 Calinou start a dedicated server on your PC, connect to it using client tab 20:22 Calinou test both 20:23 * Taoki nods 20:26 Jordach damn my laptop sounds like a jet 20:33 catninja this is the minetest-dev-ish channel? 20:34 VanessaE this is general discussion 20:34 VanessaE #minetest-dev is for core development stuff. 20:36 catninja VanessaE: well I seem to have joined the inchra #minetest that was full of serverchat 20:36 VanessaE you're there too, yeah 20:36 catninja so scrap the dev part, but something more serious 20:37 catninja VanessaE: You have servers that run the serverchat to irc-mod right? 20:37 VanessaE yep 20:39 catninja I was wondering if someone had any idea why I suddenly got the irc content in the chat msg'd to me from the server. I seem to have disconnected without the server registering it and then I started getting the server msgs 20:39 catninja Interesting bug 20:39 VanessaE that happens to me, too 20:39 VanessaE no idea why though - but if you msg the bot to "logout" then the echoes go away 20:40 VanessaE (it only happens if you are also logged-in from IRC for the purpose of routine server commands) 20:43 Jordach eh 20:43 Jordach i'm getting real ready to leave now 20:43 VanessaE ? 20:43 Jordach i miss polish 20:43 Jordach the API got lost 20:43 catninja VanessaE: and the ecoes come back when you login again 20:43 catninja hmmm 20:43 Jordach performance is horrifying 20:43 VanessaE catninja: yeah 20:44 Jordach and the devs hold a dick waving contest about licenses every few days 20:44 VanessaE er, ok 20:45 Jordach fact: i get with 4gb allocated to MC with 179 mods 60fps at 1080p: MT doesn't do that even with low settings with ~30 mods 20:46 jin_xi VanessaE, kahrl re particles faucet bug: it goes away if you add && 0 to the check in line 446, collision.cpp 20:46 VanessaE jin_xi: you mean #2690 20:46 VanessaE ? 20:47 jin_xi yes 20:48 VanessaE how far along are you with your -to-irrlicht rewrite? 20:48 VanessaE (I've not been following to closely) 20:57 jin_xi VanessaE: tbh i don't know if i like that combination of 'how far' and 'rewrite' 20:57 VanessaE heh 20:57 VanessaE well I just wondered how it was going.. :P 20:58 jin_xi as far as i see it it's more like some research into the matter in the hope someone competent would like to connect the dots 20:58 jin_xi might well be its all completely stupid 20:59 jin_xi but yeah this development model does not work. i was hoping i could submit half assed PRs/Bug reports someone(tm) could look at and quickly fix properly but that does not seem to work out very well 20:59 jin_xi so i might need to reconsider my abilities to contribute 21:00 VanessaE :( 21:00 jin_xi ... anyways, checked out homedecor for testing, nice piece of work 21:00 VanessaE thanks :) 21:12 Taoki Also: I updated my pathfinding system in order to test it even more easily. What I noticed is that, pathfinding is even more broken than before x.x 21:13 catninja if someone connected to your server and said that they used the same name as another player on another server, because they liked that player; would you grant them interact? 21:13 Taoki In the past, it worked at least sometimes. Now it only works through a miracle 21:16 jin_xi weird 21:17 luizrpgluiz hi, I remembered that I had made a mod for ceramic decoration 21:18 jin_xi Taoki: i found paths well and consistently using Dijkstra, but i only did set node along the path, never tried making a mob follow it 21:19 jin_xi A* and variants will often produce messy blobs of nodes, which i suspect was the reason for the broken line of sight optimization 21:19 Calinou I don't bother with pathfinding with mobs 21:19 Calinou dumb mods are part of the game 21:19 jin_xi which would happily throw away any found path if there is LOS between start/goal 21:20 jin_xi Calinou: there can be other games on mt engine 21:21 Calinou https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?f=47&t=12178&p=178792#p178792 21:21 Calinou does this make Lua mapgens faster? 21:21 jin_xi use less memory mainly 21:21 Taoki Aha... that one seems to work a bit better, yeah 21:22 kaeza_ Greetings 21:22 jin_xi Taoki in this issue is some messy lua code to visualize paths, its good to get a feel for it 21:22 jin_xi https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/2614 21:23 Taoki nice 21:23 jin_xi one problem i think is paths with restricted height, below trees 21:23 jin_xi so mobs cant pass 21:24 jin_xi i think pathfinding needs additional parameters, like nodes to avoid and headroom needed 21:24 Taoki Well, with the Djirka engine, mobs can at least go around trees with path finding 21:26 jin_xi flocking mobs that 'create' paths like desire paths and so reuse and build up paths could be nice 21:26 jin_xi or if you could say how much a mob can climb/how steep a path can be 21:27 Taoki One question though: Does the formula only create corners, or add every node along the way? Since what I need here is the second solution, otherwise mobs get caught up 21:27 jin_xi add every node 21:27 Taoki Ah :/ 21:27 Taoki I probably need to extract the corners myself then 21:28 jin_xi yes, the idea is good but LOS is not the way to do it 21:32 catninja OldCoder: you joined here but your client disconnected from other channels? 21:35 OldCoder I needed to reset my connection catninja 21:37 catninja OldCoder: hm but the private msg to you has the right parameters but you did not reappear in the conversation. Strange, but I cannot say that I'm that familiar with IRC/irssi to be certain 21:53 Pilcrow sofar: what were you expecting override_day_night_ratio() to do? 21:58 Pilcrow ^ were you expecting it to make the day/night cycle longer/shorter? or perhaps make nights longer than days and vice versa? I think there is a way to do the former, but not the latter (that I know of)... 23:06 exio4 RealBadAngel: some of us are waiting for fresh brains 23:14 OldCoder brains it shall rains 23:24 YvesLevier is there a way to put our wheat in bales to entrepose in the granery? 23:24 YvesLevier Heya btw :) 23:26 Pilcrow exio4: no brains for you! :P 23:26 exio4