Time Nick Message 00:18 * Pilcrow shakes #minetest to see if anything falls out 00:21 * VanessaE watches as little pieces fall off 00:21 VanessaE dude, is that supposed to be loose like that? 00:22 Pilcrow lol 00:24 * Pilcrow wishes there was a minetest.registered_abms() or something, to figure out how many abms are acting on a node... 00:39 VanessaE there, see? you shook it so hard Zeno` fell out 00:40 VanessaE (it just took a while for the vibrations to reach his side of the channel ;) ) 00:41 Zeno` wahhhhh? 00:41 VanessaE haha 00:41 VanessaE [04-08 20:22] * Pilcrow shakes #minetest to see if anything falls out 00:41 VanessaE [04-08 20:24] * VanessaE watches as little pieces fall off 00:41 VanessaE [04-08 20:24] dude, is that supposed to be loose like that? 00:42 Zeno` I was asleep as well :( 00:42 Pilcrow ^ the fall must've knocked him out. :P 00:46 VanessaE heh 00:46 Zeno` coconuts! 00:47 VanessaE Albuquerque! 00:47 Zeno` $ emacs -batch -l dunnet 00:47 Zeno` bash: emacs: command not found 00:47 Zeno` :( 00:48 Zeno` I'm not going to install emacs just to shake the tree and get killed by a coconut 00:48 VanessaE why do you need an operating system for your operating system anyway? :P 00:48 Zeno` I don't. I need a vim version of dunnet 00:48 Zeno` heh 00:49 Pilcrow Zeno, just type this in bash: ":() { :|:; }; :" ... ok, don't. that'll freeze your computer... :P 00:50 Zeno` :() { :|:; }; : 00:50 Zeno` computer seems ok 00:50 * jin_xi forks 00:50 VanessaE I thought bash generally handled forkbombs ok these days? 00:52 Zeno` I shall try it then 00:52 VanessaE I could be wrong :P 00:52 Pilcrow VanessaE: not that I know of... but I haven't been dumb enough to try in years... ;P 00:52 Zeno` computer still works 00:53 Zeno` bash: fork: Resource temporarily unavailable 00:53 Zeno` Terminated 00:53 Zeno` I survived! 00:53 Pilcrow interesting 00:53 Zeno` see only the brave discover these things 00:54 Zeno` lol 00:54 * Zeno` feels tall and mighty now 00:54 VanessaE Zeno`: why are there tentacles growing out of your power supply 00:54 VanessaE ? 00:54 Zeno` those are tapeworms 00:54 * Zeno` pushes them back inside 00:54 VanessaE heh 00:55 Pilcrow VanessaE: I've seen enough hentai to... wait... ... O_o 00:55 Zeno` I wonder how well bash handles the c version of da fork bomb 00:55 VanessaE and is your screen supposed to be slowly cycling colors like that, outside your screensaver? 00:55 VanessaE :) 00:55 Zeno` yeah, I've already ordered a new monitor 00:55 Zeno` how did you know? 00:56 Pilcrow spycams 00:56 Zeno` 2560x1440 goodness 00:56 VanessaE hehe 00:56 Zeno` I had to buy it to test, umm, minetests dpi handling? 00:57 Pilcrow totally valid justification, Zeno` :P 00:57 Zeno` I thought so :D 00:58 * Pilcrow has never had a monitor that supports more than 1366x768 01:00 sofar Pilcrow: https://github.com/sofar/crops 01:00 sofar Pilcrow: also https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=11795 01:01 jin_xi btw VanessaE could you please confirm the bug with particle spawners? fix is ready. https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/2605 01:02 Pilcrow ah, awesome, sofar. I'll be sure to check it out! :) 01:02 sofar Pilcrow: working on a new mesh model for corn right now 01:02 sofar might be the second crop I add 01:03 sofar I'm not so sure about pumpkins yet... they are not directly edible 01:03 sofar maybe I'll add squash instead 01:03 VanessaE jin_xi: I can confirm that bug, yes. 01:03 Pilcrow ooh, corn. I'm assuming that will be multi-node, like cactus and papyrus? 01:03 VanessaE lemme try your patch... 01:03 sofar 2-node structures 01:04 sofar corn -> corn plant -> grows 2-4 ears of corn -> corn (craft) -> popcorn (cook) 01:04 Zeno` my fork bomb sucks 01:04 sofar maybe I'll leave the ears of corn out, seems an excessive step that's not needed 01:04 Zeno` int main(void) { pid_t t = fork(); if (t == -1) perror("Error"); else printf("%d\n", t); for (;;); } 01:05 Zeno` it's not even a firecracker 01:05 sofar Pilcrow: also, corn will automatically wither and the plant will die if left unharvested 01:05 Pilcrow lol Zeno`, it didn't work? 01:05 Sokomine the wheat in the default minetest game is strange. that's why i added the "machines" in my cottages mod 01:05 Sokomine sofar: that's not very practical 01:05 sofar so corn forces you to weed your land 01:05 Zeno` well it does spawn two processes 01:06 sofar Sokomine: it'll wither very, very slowly if left with corn ears, but fast after harvesting the ears 01:06 sofar it'll be a decent balance 01:06 sofar the idea is to make it a good crop for people who tend to their plants a lot 01:07 sofar but make it less useful if you stick to your mines forever 01:07 Sokomine even those will not be there all the time, and others will pass by the fields.... 01:07 sofar yup, intentional. Like I said corn plants with cobs on them won't wither very fast 01:07 VanessaE seems to work fine, jin_xi 01:08 Sokomine sofar: ah, ok 01:08 jin_xi yes i think its correct. just adds particles to update queue, which seems to have been forgotten 01:08 sofar Sokomine: feel free to suggest other crops you may think work well in the game 01:08 jin_xi well, if you can make a note on the github i'd be ever so grateful so hopefully someone can review and commit 01:09 sofar I'm looking for suggestions 01:09 VanessaE done. 01:09 Pilcrow personally, I'd love to see crops that work similarly to Harvest Moon ones. been thinking about making that mod, myself. maybe with a special node for selling crops and buying seeds, as well... :3 01:10 jin_xi thanks VanessaE 01:11 sofar Pilcrow: which mod is that? 01:12 Pilcrow sofar: it's not a mod, yet. I'm saying I'd like crops that work similar to the Harvest Moon game series. I'm thinking about programming a mod like that. 01:13 Zeno` VanessaE will help you, Pilcrow 01:13 sofar ohh okay. any references around to see for me so I can figure out what you mean? 01:13 Zeno` Get her to do all the hard stuff (like the millions of item defs etc) 01:13 VanessaE ... 01:13 Zeno` :3 01:15 Pilcrow lol Zeno. I'd probably set up a loop for registering the different growth stages. maybe even turn it into an api? :) 01:17 Zeno` oh gosh 01:18 Zeno` loops are overused; I prefer spirals 01:18 Pilcrow sofar: I'm watching something with my sister and can't look for references yet, but specifically for corn, I was thinking a stalk you can take the corn off of, then water the plant and it will make more corn in a few days, without having to re-plant the corn. the first crop takes longer to show up. 01:19 Pilcrow Zeno`: ok, I'll program a trapezoid. how's that? :P 01:19 Zeno` I will write a program now 01:19 Pilcrow ? 01:19 Zeno` using the new methodology I have devised 01:19 Zeno` just thought of it then 01:21 Pilcrow Zeno`: lol. I love it when coming up with something goofy actually inspires an interesting idea... that actually happens to me a lot... :P 01:25 Pilcrow say, wasn't there an old 'seasons' mod at one point? I don't think it works any more, but I think I recall seeing something like that long ago... 01:27 Sokomine anyway...new plants are always welcome 01:30 * Pilcrow wants to turn minetest into Harvest Moon meets Zelda meets Minecraft... :P 01:30 exio4 hi weird people 01:30 sethj Anyone know what happened to the landrush server? 01:30 Pilcrow hello other weird person! 01:31 exio4 aww, hi Pilcrow! 01:31 Pilcrow sorry sethj, I've got no idea... :\ 01:32 sethj It seems to have died :( 01:32 Zeno` I dunno if it will catch on 01:32 Zeno` it's pretty... stupid 01:32 Pilcrow lol 01:32 Pilcrow how stupid? :P 01:32 Zeno` very :( 01:32 Zeno` I thought it would be amazing 01:32 Zeno` but alas, no 01:33 Pilcrow aww. why does it not work well? 01:33 Zeno` well, it works 01:34 Zeno` maybe I need to write a python wrapper to generate code 01:34 est31 wut?? 01:34 exio4 >python 01:34 exio4 >2015 01:34 * Pilcrow is confused by whatever Zeno` is trying to do... :P 01:34 Zeno` https://ideone.com/oQxCvO 01:35 est31 preprocessor does that kinda stuff 01:35 Zeno` pfft 01:35 Zeno` stringification? 01:35 Zeno` I suppose it does 01:35 est31 ? 01:36 Zeno` nah it doesn't I don't think 01:36 Zeno` no for the function name part... does it? 01:36 Zeno` not for* 01:36 Zeno` I could have each function call another function! 01:37 Zeno` another random function! 01:37 Zeno` this'll be great 01:38 Pilcrow lol. I think Zeno` has gon insane... :D 01:38 est31 wuts your goal 01:39 Zeno` do I need a goal? 01:39 Zeno` is that why I always go wrong? Not having a goal? :( 01:40 Pilcrow VanessaE: I think you're right; I shook Zeno` too hard earlier... :P 01:40 est31 lol 01:40 est31 yea seems so 01:43 Pilcrow Zeno`: maybe you should just make a function that calls itself, with a random parameter? :P 01:43 exio4 function that call themselves? 01:43 exio4 I like it 01:45 Zeno` hmm, I need a terminating condition 01:45 Zeno` Pilcrow, recursion... well this can result in recursion 01:45 Zeno` which is why I need the terminating condition 01:45 est31 you have one already 01:45 est31 the size of your stack :p 01:46 exio4 he may go with a tail-recursive function 01:46 exio4 and then it gets optimized 01:46 exio4 bam! constant space => no terminating condition 01:46 est31 then turn optimisations off 01:47 est31 most times they only draw your attention at them 01:47 est31 and introduce bugs like this one 01:47 exio4 ... that is not a bug? 01:47 exio4 it's TCO, a known optimization 01:47 Zeno` finished! 01:47 est31 When a programmer writes a self calling function, they might want to use the stack for terminating 01:48 Zeno` tail recursion optimisation would still end in an infinite loop 01:48 exio4 est31: uh? 01:48 exio4 est31: you know that sounds a lot like xkcd's "Workflow", don't you? 01:49 Zeno` https://ideone.com/BgJS3v 01:49 est31 like that one 01:49 Zeno` look at that baby 01:49 est31 NOOO 01:49 est31 it has been copied on my disk 01:49 est31 I mean RAM 01:49 Zeno` oh noes :( 01:50 Zeno` you owe me $10000000 01:50 * est31 feels like an infringer 01:50 VanessaE Sokomine: *poke* 01:50 * est31 runs away 01:50 Zeno` est31, I will allow you to have a copy 01:50 Zeno` just don't sell it 01:51 exio4 too late 01:51 DI3HARD139 hiya 01:51 Zeno` or if you make a nice poem I want to read it 01:51 Pilcrow Zeno`, this code is nucking futs! :D 01:52 Zeno` ught there is a BUG 01:52 DI3HARD139 lol 01:52 Zeno` https://ideone.com/rwbSXp 01:52 Zeno` fixed 01:53 exio4 est31: I don't know how a silly program gives you an excuse to consider TCO a bug 01:53 est31 That program may be silly, but business applications may depend on that 01:54 exio4 wth? 01:54 est31 I mean, you need to be abled to make assumptions 01:54 est31 about how your code behaves 01:55 Pilcrow I don't know the reasoning behind parenthesizing n... but I don't really understand this code much anyway; no real knowledge of C... 01:55 est31 compilers should translate your program into machine code 01:55 est31 not be smarter than you 01:55 Zeno` est31, you've seen my leap year program? 01:55 est31 nope 01:55 Zeno` oh! 01:55 Zeno` let me find it 01:56 exio4 est31: well, I'd like to know how you translate a lazy language which heavily uses closures to machine code and not die while doing that 01:56 Zeno` https://ideone.com/ygwc9k 01:57 Zeno` the method is patented by me 01:57 exio4 I am just saying a compiler's job is to be smarter 01:57 Zeno` but you can use it 01:57 est31 exio4, don't use broken patterns in your language design 01:57 Zeno` it's optimised as well 01:57 Zeno` doesn't use modulo arithmetic 01:58 Zeno` 'cause divisions are slow 01:58 exio4 est31: ...? broken patterns? 01:58 est31 stuff like closures doesnt make things fly 01:58 exio4 est31: you're the first person I see that calls closures a broken pattern 01:58 Zeno` Red Bull does 01:59 Zeno` except it doesn't 01:59 Zeno` I drank one and jumped off my roof 01:59 Zeno` almost broke a leg 01:59 est31 I wont be the last, just wait until people wake up 01:59 Der Hey guys, does anyone know of anywhere that a world can be hosted for free? I'm wanting to start an element type world (fire, water, air, and earth). 01:59 * Zeno` adds his isleap() function to minetest/src/utils/numeric.cpp 02:00 exio4 est31: I'd like to know any 'source' for that? 02:00 exio4 est31: what's the wrong thing with closures? 02:00 Hijiri predictions by nostradamus 02:00 Zeno` Knights of the Lambda Calculus Unite! 02:00 Zeno` ni 02:00 jin_xi a shrubbery 02:00 exio4 they not being "easy to compile" doesn't seem like a cool answer, considering that OOP can be thought as subtyped records of closures 02:00 exio4 (modulo the shiny parts!) 02:00 est31 Its damn obvious. you can be turing complete without them, and passing contexts just makes things go wrong 02:01 Hijiri there is a lot you can be turing complete without 02:01 Zeno` like SQL 02:01 Zeno` wait that's not turing complete 02:01 exio4 SQL isn't turing complete and really useful 02:01 exio4 Brainfuck is turing complete and useless 02:01 est31 also, traditional memory management of C is underrated 02:01 Hijiri and "passing contexts just makes things go wrong" is only a little bit different from the claim that closures are bad 02:01 Zeno` C doesn't specify memory management 02:02 Zeno` outside of the standard's scope 02:02 est31 malloc? 02:02 Zeno` well, I'm not including malloc and friends (and free) "management" 02:03 exio4 considering that carrying contexts in an explicit manner is pretty much idiomatic C... 02:03 Zeno` but malloc etc are all you need 02:04 exio4 I would argue that the only reason to actually use a garbage collector (or a powerful type system like Rust's) is to be able to use function / closures / etc in a really nice way 02:04 * Pilcrow wonders if he logged into #minetest-dev by mistake.... :P 02:04 exio4 I won't deny manual memory management + closures is a bad combination 02:04 Zeno` Pilcrow, the conversation in there is not nearly as exciting 02:04 est31 exio4, garbage collection is one of the biggest ills that were introduced 02:04 est31 ever 02:05 exio4 I don't think so 02:05 Zeno` apart from exceptions 02:05 exio4 garbage collection allow programming languages to evolve 02:05 est31 Its one of those things where compilers and runtimes try to be smarter than the programmer 02:05 est31 programming languages shouldnt evolve, programs should 02:05 Pilcrow heh. this would be more exciting if I understood it, Zeno`... ;) 02:05 exio4 uh? 02:05 exio4 you're trolling right? 02:05 Hijiri and of course, we have established that compilers and runtimes should never try to be smarter than the programmers 02:06 est31 langs are there to give programs space to evolve 02:06 Hijiri which is why we can use it to support this argument 02:06 est31 not the other way round 02:06 exio4 Hijiri: if all we want is compilers that aren't smarter than programmers, we shouldn't have went past ASM 02:06 Hijiri maybe we just need to go back to our roots 02:06 est31 ASM is bad too 02:06 exio4 lambda calculus? 8) 02:06 Zeno` asm? that's a bit advanced 02:07 Zeno` binary baby 02:07 Zeno` all the way 02:07 exio4 that's about smart as we can get 02:07 Hijiri I wire electrodes to my brain and think in just the right way to send the right pulses down the wires 02:07 est31 exio4, dont overexagerrate 02:07 exio4 considering that compiling code nowdays means more than naively writing ASM 02:08 Zeno` poke 53280, 10 02:08 est31 also, if you have good compilers that dont try to do the programmers job, you get ASM automatically from C code 02:08 est31 C is portable ASM isnt 02:08 exio4 that is a lie 02:08 Hijiri the purpose of programming languages is to write programs. Programming languages should make it easier to write programs 02:08 est31 the JVM is tainted 02:09 Hijiri that could mean it's easier to make correct, more performant, etc., but maybe we should start from that point 02:09 est31 by gc 02:09 Hijiri but actually I have to leave 02:09 est31 bye 02:09 exio4 \o Hijiri 02:09 Hijiri bye chat 02:09 exio4 est31: I _still_ don't get your point 02:09 Pilcrow bye Hijiri 02:09 exio4 est31: are you arguing anything that isn't trivial shouldn't be done at all, or..? 02:09 Zeno` nobody has mentioned "reading" programs yet 02:09 Zeno` COBOL is far easier to read than C 02:10 exio4 I wouldn't say that is true 02:10 Zeno` probably because it has more letters it its acronym 02:10 Zeno` Grace Hopper obviously thought through it well 02:10 exio4 est31: now, it is when you say that types are useless, right? 02:11 est31 types should be strong. 02:11 Zeno` strong like tarzan 02:11 est31 or steel 02:11 exio4 yup, we can all agree that Haskell's type system is really cool 02:11 est31 thats shit 02:11 exio4 k 02:11 est31 like the whole language 02:12 est31 function pointers and exceptions were the two bad things in C 02:12 exio4 C doesn't have exceptions 02:12 exio4 but sure 02:12 exio4 if you say so 02:12 est31 sorry you are right 02:12 est31 whatever, they are bad 02:12 exio4 why would function pointers be bad, too? 02:13 exio4 you've been saying "that's shit, it sucks" all the way, without giving us any reason of the why, such that it is a real reason, and no the silly "it's harder to compile than a conditional" 02:14 exio4 which, makes sense, considering that a conditional is a low level primitive, which also suffers from the boolean blindness and blabla 02:14 est31 function pointers let compiler writers design "optimisations" again 02:14 Pilcrow let's all go back to BASIC. line numbers and GOTOs are where it's at! *trollface* 02:15 exio4 that'd be really nice 02:15 exio4 considering that everything is a jump at the low-level 02:15 exio4 est31: what? 02:15 exio4 is it still april fools in your side or what? lol 02:16 est31 basic should get float typed line numbers, thats unused potential 02:16 exio4 lol 02:16 Pilcrow haha 02:16 exio4 I get it now 02:16 exio4 you looked serious dude 02:16 exio4 mfw 02:16 est31 :D 02:16 Chanku Alright I have a question 02:16 Chanku What is the use of Function Pointers? 02:17 est31 you dont know what they are? 02:17 Chanku No 02:17 Chanku Then again my experience with C is basic...and I do mean BASIC 02:18 exio4 they're basically pointers to functions, which you can then call, they're useful when loading dynamic modules (such that they give you a "function" to something useful (or not)), simulating closures and thus callbacks 02:18 exio4 they're basically like a whole new world if you don't know about them 02:18 exio4 Chanku: which languages do you know? 02:19 Chanku Well Visual Basic, A bit of java, Lua, Python, and C 02:20 Chanku TBH I'm a bit better versed in Java and Lua than the others 02:20 exio4 lua! 02:21 Chanku And TBH I learned lua for MineTest :P 02:21 Chanku Speaking of which I need to rebuild and re-setup my Minetest enviroment 02:22 Pilcrow I probably remember more lua than any other language (except if you count bash scripting), since I'm using it on pretty much a daily basis for minetest mods... although I actually learned lua for MegaGlest, lol. 02:23 exio4 Chanku: can you guess what this code would print? http://dpaste.com/0N0AGGW 02:23 Chanku I don't think it would return anything :/ 02:24 Chanku Although then again I am probably wrong, but it doesn't look like it would return anything... 02:24 Pilcrow if anything, I'd think it would return 3... 02:24 Chanku true, but wouldn't you have to put parameters into something and then lfn? 02:24 est31 thats basically function pointers 02:24 Chanku And okay 02:25 * Chanku waits for MineTest to compile 02:25 exio4 Chanku: what do you mean? something() returns a "function" that then takes two parameters 02:25 Chanku yes 02:26 Chanku but you aren't giving any parameters to something() thus parameters are not given to w and/or y 02:26 Chanku unless I'm missing somethin 02:26 exio4 the core difference between function pointers and real high order functions is that function pointers are really limited and constrained (but way easier to implement, obviously) 02:26 Chanku *something 02:26 Chanku which I probably am... 02:26 exio4 Chanku: something()(1,2) 02:26 Chanku Ah alright 02:27 Chanku I wasn't sure if the extra ()'s was actually passing parameters or not :/ 02:27 exio4 something() returns a function, right? so (something()) gives me a function, and I give that function the parameters 1 and 2 02:27 exio4 Chanku: I tried to make it look weird! 02:27 Chanku Well you sure did a good job 02:27 Chanku :3 02:30 Pilcrow I get it. something() returns the actual function lfn, rather than trying to execute that function. then the returned lfn is fed the 1 and 2, so it would output 3... now, if something() returned lfn() instead of just lfn, I assume it would cause errors since lfn would be sent no parameters (and thus, it would try to return nil+nil*nil)... 02:31 exio4 yeah 02:32 VanessaE my G*d, I think even I understood that. :) 02:32 Johnsen2 ... 02:32 Pilcrow btw... does that actually *work* in lua? 02:32 Chanku ^ 02:32 est31 yes 02:33 Johnsen2 VanessaE, too much science and smartness going on here aye? 02:33 VanessaE heh 02:33 exio4 http://dpaste.com/1SXAVEZ 02:33 exio4 this is pretty much what is shiny and that'd be just as easy to do with function pointers 02:33 Pilcrow VanessaE: just curiuos, what languages do you know? 02:34 exio4 VanessaE should learn Haskell for a greater good! 02:34 VanessaE Pilcrow: I've coded in BASIC, 6502 assembly, a bit of Verilog, Bash, Lua, and a touch of javascript. 02:34 VanessaE and C/C++ rarely 02:35 Etzos Learn Lisp before Haskell. It'll make you appreciate Haskell even more. :P 02:35 * VanessaE throws some spare parenthesis at Etzos 02:35 exio4 I am really thinking about going to sleep, too, haven't slept in 20~ hours, and spent over 14 hours at uni \o/ 02:35 Gay or, C#! 02:35 VanessaE C#? fuck no 02:35 Gay True microsoft fanboi 02:35 est31 http://pastie.org/10081603 02:35 Gay use C# 02:35 VanessaE never gonna happen 02:35 exio4 Etzos: Scheme! 02:35 exio4 SICP! 02:35 est31 you can do things like that 02:36 est31 generic graph traversal function 02:36 est31 without much OOP fuss 02:36 Gay but OOP is love 02:36 Gay OOP is life 02:36 exio4 that's actually useful when you play with closures tbh 02:36 exio4 because then you don't need to carry the context around manually :p 02:37 exio4 est31: pretty much anything in the modern OOP land is buzzwords with boilerplate and fancy useless design patterns anyway 02:37 est31 lol you understand me 02:38 exio4 c++ is the new fancy functional language though 02:38 exio4 with its lambdas, generics, :D 02:39 Pilcrow exio4: looking at haskell, the thing I don't like about it is the fact that there's no end/endif/etc. that implies that it relies entirely on indentation to figure out where stuff closes? I don't like that; I think all white space (tabs, spaces, newlines) should be treated the same. that's one of the things I absolutely love about lua, tbh... 02:39 est31 strong typing destroys much 02:39 est31 I hate the off side rule too 02:39 exio4 there's a big difference, though 02:39 exio4 haskell doesn't have what you would call "do two things" in an implicit manner 02:40 exio4 there are no statements at all, too 02:41 est31 its all FUNCTIONS 02:41 exio4 and Haskell's "off side rule" is really really permissive(?) 02:41 exio4 yeah! 02:41 exio4 even "sequencing" IO actions is FUNCTIONS! 02:43 Pilcrow that seems... extremely strange to me 02:43 exio4 Pilcrow: there is no reason to have an explicit `end` at all when all you can have is a single expression in both sides 02:43 exio4 and you must have both sides 02:44 est31 I agree 02:44 exio4 it'd be pretty much boilerplate 02:44 est31 Haskell is one of the few places the off side rule is justified 02:44 exio4 the offside rule in Haskell is _really_ not annoying as you might think, there are things that you would think that don't "get past it" yet they do 02:45 exio4 because all it wants is "just keep things aligned, if you do weird things in the middle, who cares" 02:45 exio4 it is not annoying as Python's, where it wants you to have the code aligned the way Guido wanted you to align it 02:47 exio4 Pilcrow: some example code that abuses a few things just because why not :P 02:47 exio4 http://lpaste.net/7867648859499921408 02:47 exio4 it's really really silly 02:47 exio4 imagine having an explicit end after those guards (which are 'ifs' on steroids, because you can have more than one condition in them, and they also allow you do fancier things 02:48 exio4 and, even if it doesn't look like a static typed language, that code is actually type checked 02:48 Pilcrow I'll say one thing... it's an easy language to read... :) 02:48 exio4 heh 02:49 Pilcrow at least, from the examples I've seen, it is. 02:49 exio4 it really is when you get used to it, tbh 02:49 exio4 it may look scary, sometimes 02:50 exio4 if you see ((<$>) &&& (<*>) ^. (=<<)) >>= (.) 02:50 exio4 (obviously fake code :P) 02:51 Pilcrow in your example, the "|" looks like it's being used sort of like a "case", as opposed to an "if", if that makes sense... 02:52 exio4 Pilcrow: yes, '|' defines a guard 02:52 exio4 a (normal and typical) guardis just a boolean condition, like an if 02:52 exio4 what makes Haskell really cool is the pattern matching, though 02:52 exio4 (not like it is something Haskell specific, but it is a thing most mainstream languages lack) 02:53 exio4 Pilcrow: you should learn some basic Haskell (spend 2~3 playing with the syntax and the "weird shiny things" you may find it to have) 02:54 Pilcrow just checking, haskell is a compiled language, not an interpreted one, correct? 02:55 exio4 Pilcrow: you can compile it (which is what pretty much we all do for 'real code') but you can interpret it, play with it in a REPL and what not 02:55 exio4 and most workflows don't really compile the code until the "last stages" 02:56 exio4 a typical setup is ghci (the REPL) in a console, and the editor next to it, and after saving, reloading the file in the REPL and checking if it typechecks, etc 02:57 exio4 just so you can see how "weirdly" the code can look and actually pass the "off-side rule", look at http://lpaste.net/2950205326156103680 02:58 exio4 it's some old code I had in my ~, it was a compiler for some toy representation or something, I don't remember the specific details of it 02:59 exio4 a fancy thing, I think most if not all those type signatures are optional 02:59 Pilcrow ^ I see warnings, lol 02:59 exio4 they're considered good style because they help you to know more about the function without having to look there 02:59 exio4 yeah, the linter 03:00 exio4 that's my newbie code! don't tell anyone! 03:00 Pilcrow :P 03:00 exio4 by the way, look at the if in the line 50 03:01 exio4 either "side" has to have a single _expression_, because everything is an expression in Haskell, too 03:02 Pilcrow I assume the "||" is an "or"? 03:02 exio4 yes :P 03:02 est31 yes 03:05 Pilcrow haha ok. it seems strange to me that "then" and "else" are typed out as words, while "or" is not... :P 03:05 exio4 || is function a function 03:05 exio4 uh 03:05 exio4 is just a function 03:05 exio4 it is defined within the language 03:05 exio4 True || _ = True 03:05 exio4 _ || x = x 03:06 exio4 well, make it look nice by padding and what not, too :P 03:06 exio4 you can also use ';'s, too 03:08 Pilcrow well. I may have to experiment with this. :) 03:08 exio4 http://dpaste.com/2WMVNZZ this is valid Haskell code 03:09 exio4 note, that using { ; } makes it ignore the layout rules (offside rules, spaces, whatever you call it) 03:10 exio4 and, if you thought that'd be fancy, http://dpaste.com/0ER722J take this one! 03:10 exio4 it's also valid Haskell! 03:10 Pilcrow what's the difference between putStr and putStrLn? 03:11 exio4 putStrLn is basically putStr + newline :P 03:11 Pilcrow ah 03:12 exio4 you'll find Haskell to be overly weird, because, remember, the code is 'pure'! 03:12 exio4 there are no variables changing! 03:13 exio4 we _play_ with code like it actually changed anything, but in reality, it's just calling it the wrong name, because you never have data or variables you had before change, it's really nice 03:13 exio4 (I am talking about the code I pasted which uses a function called "modify" :P) 03:14 Pilcrow so... does that mean you can't do a simple n = n + 1? 03:14 exio4 and, Haskell's purity, lazyness and being expression-based, also gives us 'completely safe' things like if X then F Y else F Z == F (if X then Y else Z) 03:15 exio4 Pilcrow: n = n + 1 doesn't make sense! 03:15 exio4 give me a number that is equal to itself plus one, and you'll see if it is possible or not 03:15 exio4 = means equality, not assignment in Haskell 03:17 exio4 (you can _actually_ have real mutable data in Haskell, but it is really annoying and, if doing naively, is worse than just generating "garbage" 03:17 exio4 ) 03:17 exio4 GHC's (somewhat the 'de facto' haskell compiler/interpreter) garbage collector is really optimized for extremely short-lived data 03:17 exio4 so you may find that the garbage collector (if you look at stats), "copied and freed a few terabytes of ram" 03:18 exio4 even though your program only used 10~mb of constant memory, and the GC only spent a relatively small time doing stuff 03:20 exio4 well, I haven't slept, and I think I already did enough marketing today 03:20 exio4 good night :P 03:20 Pilcrow good night, exio4. nice talking with you! :) 03:23 VanessaE bbl 03:30 Pilcrow BasketBall Lounge? :P 03:36 Pilcrow sofar, you still there? is there a way to get melon seeds to begin with, other than /giveme? 03:36 est31 no 03:37 Etzos Doesn't the post say that it doesn't spawn anything into the world yet? 03:37 est31 he has said that mapgen mods should rely on his world 03:37 ProXavi If any of you want I will be doing a recording of MTZ-Basic in a short while 03:37 est31 mod* 03:39 Pilcrow ah, alright. that's fine. I just wondered if I was overlooking something. 03:52 Pilcrow is minetest.after() interrupted by a server restart? as in, if a mod does minetest.after(60, function() blah end), but the server gets closed and re-opened 30 seconds in, will it continue from 30 and execute the function, or just forget about it? 03:53 sofar Pilcrow: I don't want to implement yet-another-partial-mapgen in this mod 03:53 sofar there are enough mapgens out there, and making them being able to detect presence of the crops mod is trivial 03:53 sofar the other way around is impossible to maintain 03:53 sofar I'd have to account for every mapgen variant 03:56 Pilcrow sofar: that's totally understandable. I just wondered if there was something I missed, that's all. 04:02 Pilcrow why does the irc log make me pink? http://irc.minetest.ru/minetest/2015-04-09 04:22 Etzos Pilcrow: It looks like your name's digest gives a pink result: https://github.com/moritz/ilbot/blob/master/lib/Ilbot/Frontend/NickColor.pm#L45 04:24 Pilcrow I don't understand that code, but thanks for the answer anyways, Etzos. it was just idle curiosity, really... :P 04:25 Etzos Pilcrow: I don't understand it much either. Never learned Perl. But based on comments and references, that's what it appears to be doing. 04:27 Etzos Takes the md5 of the nick, separates it into HSV and then turns that into RGB for display. 04:35 Pilcrow sweet, I just programmed a nice little bash script that searches lua files to find strings, and lists all the files that contain the string... http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=zWL68QEH 04:37 Pilcrow to give an example, if I run it in the root of minetest_game, searching for "soil", it returns the following list: http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=ExzhmSk0 04:40 Pilcrow hello Girl123 04:42 Girl123 hey 04:46 Etzos Pilcrow: Why all the find additions? Why not just use plain grep? 04:50 kahrl_ yeah, I think grep -R --include='*.lua' would do the same thing 04:50 Etzos grep -r -l --include="*.lua" '"@"' . 04:50 Etzos Or -R, if you want to follow symbolic links. 04:54 Pilcrow there was a reason I didn't do that... but can't remember what it was. I think I missed the . at the end, so it just kinda sat there doing nothing, lol. 04:56 kahrl_ on my system it defaults to . 04:56 kahrl_ if you used -r or -R and gave no directory 04:57 Etzos Of course, I believe Lua strings can be either " or ' delimited. So... 04:57 Etzos grep -E "[\"']string to search for[\"']" --include="*.lua" -r -l -I . 04:58 Pilcrow kahrl_: that doesn't work for me. giving it no directory makes it sit there doing nothing, and never exit. 04:59 kahrl_ Pilcrow: ah, that was changed in grep 2.11. http://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/grep.git/commit/?id=faf6ea13b3281a2004f5bfd1487708d1ba50a6c5 05:00 Pilcrow ah, ok. ancient os, ancient grep. mine's 2.9 05:02 Pilcrow but yes, now that I have the directory, that works great. grep -R -l --include="*.lua" "$@" . 05:15 Pilcrow sweet. even better code. I'd had this script for a *long* time, but recently cleaned it up with the code I just posted. it *used* to be http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=7gnNWtEY ... hooray for bad code! :P 05:22 Etzos One does not simply become a script-fu master without writing less good code at some point in time. :P 05:27 Pilcrow heh. honestly, I've scripted a lot. I just don't use grep much... :P 05:30 Etzos To be fair, grep is one of those tools that has just about everything in one. If you don't pour over the man page for it though, you'd never know. 05:33 Etzos *pore over 05:35 Pilcrow ^ I thought "pour over" was right... O_o 05:36 Etzos Nope. It's "pore over". 05:37 Etzos From an older/lesser known meaning of the word "pore" which meant to meditate or study intently. 05:37 Pilcrow interesting. I thought the expression meant you were figuratively pouring your attention into something, as if it were a liquid. 05:38 Pilcrow *shrugs* ya learn somethin' new every day... :) 05:57 Pilcrow just for fun: http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=gthA4dWg 06:27 Pilcrow I'm out. time to sleep. goodnight, guys~ 07:23 Consortium Hi, anybody here? 07:23 ElectronLibre More than 123 people at the moment. 07:23 Consortium For the future of minetest, https://docs.google.com/document/d/1-iDMmTwTCIduEDEil7DWachERj4PSwSbp_zzS6eeH2w/edit 07:24 Consortium ElectronLibre https://docs.google.com/document/d/1-iDMmTwTCIduEDEil7DWachERj4PSwSbp_zzS6eeH2w/edit 07:24 * ElectronLibre hates when he is on tty and someone sends a long URL with a lot of characters. Give him a couple minutes to copy it. 07:25 ElectronLibre I have to copy it manually just wait two minutes. 07:25 Consortium Sorry 07:27 Consortium ElectronLibre its free to edit 07:28 ElectronLibre It's not a problem i'm accustomed to that. 07:28 ElectronLibre Yes I figured it out with the "/edit/" 07:29 ElectronLibre A lot of these nodes can be found in mods. For example our redstone is mesecons. 07:30 Consortium When will minetest expand? 07:30 Consortium To let the mods become part of its library? 07:31 ElectronLibre The dyes glass blocks are found in colouredglass (if i remember correctly), the jubebox has its own mod, all redstone things are featured in mesecons/pipeworks, buckets is a mod by default, shears a in plantlife, bow are in throwing mod by echoes91, and about the ender, you actually have a nether mod. 07:31 ElectronLibre Hmm, as far as I know there is an issue about this, let me find the link (however there are always people arguing because they want and the other one who don't want to add mods). 07:33 ElectronLibre https://github.com/minetest/minetest_game/issues/432 07:33 Consortium The forklifts are industrial 07:33 ElectronLibre (May I edit the document to include links to mods by the way?) 07:35 Consortium Not yet 07:35 ElectronLibre Ok. 07:35 Consortium It is supposed to compare Minecraft mods with minetest developments 07:36 ElectronLibre In fact about 90% of what is written in it is done, in mods. 07:38 ElectronLibre Highlight my nickname when you finished with the list so that I tell you where to find these nodes and which one have not been created anywhere yet. 07:38 Consortium ElectronLibre: MC has over 1000 mods, i am pretty sure minetest hasen't covered all of them 07:39 ElectronLibre Yes, but from what you've listed about 90% is already modded. 07:39 ElectronLibre Or included by default in MinetestGame. 07:39 Consortium ElectronLibre: so i need you to expand the list 07:40 ElectronLibre The only thing I can do is tell you which mods include what, I'm not good at inventing nodes and I never played MC. 07:41 Consortium ElectronLibre: check the Minecraft forums and look at the run-down 07:42 ElectronLibre No thanks, I have planned to work on a lot of things today.. However I'm sure you can post this list (when you will have removed the already existing ones) somewhere on the forum and get responses. Unfortunately, I'm a bit busy at the moment because I have to prepare tests to confirm a strange behavior in one of the Lua builtin's functions :/ 07:45 ElectronLibre Or maybe someone else here will be available to take a look at the nodes contained in the 10000 mods of MC, but I'm not sure.. 08:04 Consortium Hello? 08:22 Consortium https://docs.google.com/document/d/1-iDMmTwTCIduEDEil7DWachERj4PSwSbp_zzS6eeH2w/edit?usp=sharing 09:04 JamesTait Good morning all; happy Cherish An Antique Day! :-D 09:04 ElectronLibre You make us learn at least one thing every day. 09:05 JamesTait Just a shame it's not something useful. :-P 09:06 ElectronLibre Yes, it's not like you're gonna say things like this while dinning with friends, and they will start saying "Wow, he knows a lot of things!". 09:07 JamesTait Occasionally a useful one pops up, but most of them are just nonsense. 09:08 JamesTait And that's fine with me. It's only a bit of fun. 09:12 Krock Forum mods.. please! The Feature Discussion contains much spam 09:22 xenkey Plenty spa 09:22 xenkey M 09:25 Krock I'm not sure if I should prefer regular spambots or Builder123 09:31 Consortium JamesTait: hi 09:31 Consortium I am a new comer 09:31 Consortium I like Minecraft, but hate that the Original developer won't make it GPL after "a few years" 09:31 JamesTait Consortium, o/ 09:32 Consortium Yo, JamesTait 09:33 JamesTait I have feet in two camps, atm. I don't play very often, but when I do I play Minetest. My boys don't mind playing Minetest, but all their friends play Minecraft, so we set up an MCServer server for them. 09:35 JamesTait Apparently someone's working on a FOSS Minecraft client as well, so there's still some hope. :) 09:36 Consortium JamesTait: mind if you help? https://docs.google.com/document/d/1-iDMmTwTCIduEDEil7DWachERj4PSwSbp_zzS6eeH2w/edit 09:39 JamesTait Wow, that's quite a list! 09:40 ElectronLibre About all of them exist, in mods. 09:40 JamesTait Some of the things on there are available in mods. 09:40 ElectronLibre Not some, a lot of them. 09:40 * JamesTait high-fives ElectronLibre 09:40 Consortium It need to expand to cover EVERYTHING in Minecraft mods 09:40 * Consortium hi5 JamesTait and ElectronLibre 09:41 ElectronLibre Can it even be stored on a 1Tb hard-drive? (I know there is a big amount of mods in Minecraft) 09:41 Consortium But i gonna need help, and ideas too 09:42 Consortium ElectronLibre: 1TB could contain all modern mods, but adding the mods that didn't keep up? ~4TB 09:42 JamesTait Mind if I share this doc with my boys? They'll have a better idea of what they normally expect on a server. 09:42 Consortium JamesTait: PM me your gmail 09:42 Consortium Do you have gmail? 09:43 JamesTait I do, for better or worse (two, in fact - I also have an "apps" account for work). 09:47 Krock Why are you talking about mindkraft in a minetest room? 09:49 Consortium Fork their ass into our territory, to make ourselves more favorable to gamers and kids 09:49 Krock Copying/porting is not the best way 09:50 Consortium I know, we need to remake everything, bigger, faster, stronger 09:50 rom1504 more testier 09:51 rom1504 oh that's actually a word 09:51 rom1504 nevermind 09:51 Krock we know what you mean. 09:53 Krock Consortium, you can't bring Nothc to your knees, he left Moo-yang IIRC 09:55 Consortium Krock: Notch promised to Open Source MC, but he sold it instead! His "spirit" is still in Mojang 09:56 Consortium Trying to destroy it with Microsoft... Fat Ass Shall Be Punished 10:04 Consortium So... anything interesting? 10:09 ThatGraemeGuy hrm 10:09 ThatGraemeGuy minetest more crash-prone lately? 10:23 Consortium Feeling bored... how many of you heard of GG ? 10:24 Krock Gorilla Glass? 10:25 Krock Yes, it seems to be very strong, just not when the phone falls ont he ground. 10:25 Krock *on the 10:26 Consortium Krock: no, GamerGate 10:28 Consortium Krock ? 10:28 Krock stargate, kongregate, .. uhm no, didn't know yet 10:28 SylvieLorxu Krock: Keep it that way 10:28 SylvieLorxu Trust me 10:28 Krock that's an ant. 10:29 Consortium SylvieLorxu: i am neutral, i am not pro-GG 10:29 Consortium Just keep it that way 10:29 SylvieLorxu I refuse to join the discussion :P 10:29 Krock !g gamergate wikipedia 10:29 MinetestBot Krock: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gamergate_controversy 10:29 Krock no, the ant, please. 10:30 Consortium SylvieLorxu: okay, we will never talk about GG 10:30 * Consortium keeps her mouth shut 10:32 Consortium SylvieLorxu: so... anything fun? 10:33 SylvieLorxu Sebkha-Chott will be releasing a new album soon, not sure if that counts as fun 10:33 SylvieLorxu https://vimeo.com/123887091 10:35 Krock http://i.imgur.com/SnUON.jpg 10:48 Consortium Minetest is missing something... right? 10:49 Krock The facepalm feature, yes. 10:51 Consortium Krock why? 10:52 Krock Would be amazing to use while standing in front of a dirt house 10:52 Krock Press F12 and upload it to the 100 other facepalm screenshots :D 10:56 rubenwardy Any recommendations for a VPS service or similar? 10:56 Krock For minetest-server or something else? 10:57 rubenwardy For running a webserver and possibly a minetest-server 10:57 CWz rubenwardy: deezl uses http://www.nfoservers.com/order-virtual-dedicated-server.php for hosting his servers 10:58 CWz there is also digital ocean 11:02 Krock rubenwardy, maybe seperate the webserver and minetest-server? Maybe there's a minetester who can run a server more on his machine 11:03 Jordach rubenwardy, DO is yer best bet 11:04 Consortium We need a parkour mod, right? 11:04 Jordach not really 11:04 Consortium Becuase Assasin'd Creed and Mirror's Edge has em 11:04 Jordach sneak elevators work better 11:04 Consortium *Assasin's 11:05 Consortium Jordach: WatchDogs? 11:05 Jordach two Ubishit games and a decent looking tech demo 11:05 CWz minetest and minecraft are incapable of true parkour. what the minecrafters refer to as parkour is what most gamers call "platforming" 11:07 Consortium CWz: http://www.minecraftforum.net/forums/mapping-and-modding/minecraft-mods/1274224-smart-moving 11:08 Krock "*forum.net/forum/*" dat lol. 11:09 Consortium Jordach: See the link? 11:10 Consortium Jordach: Look at this parkour http://www.minecraftforum.net/forums/mapping-and-modding/minecraft-mods/1274224-smart-moving 11:10 Jordach Consortium, i know what it does 11:10 Jordach but not effectively enough 11:10 Calinou parkour would be done with a C++ client mod 11:10 Calinou it's in theory possible 11:10 Calinou provided you know how Minetest's physics work (hint: they suck) 11:11 Calinou Krock: Notch promised to Open Source MC 11:11 Calinou he didn't; he promised to release it into the public domain once sales have dropped off 11:11 Calinou not only sales haven't dropped off entirely today, Microsoft bought Mojang so that claim is moot 11:11 Consortium >moot 11:11 Calinou rubenwardy, I use PulseHeberg for my server 11:12 Calinou 83 €/year for 4 GB RAM, 4 vCore, 200 GB hybrid HDD storage, 100 Mb/s effective bandwidth 11:12 Consortium Only heretics use the word "Moot" 11:12 Consortium This isn't 4chan 11:12 Calinou JamesTait> Apparently someone's working on a FOSS Minecraft client as well, so there's still some hope. :) 11:12 Consortium This is reddit 11:12 rubenwardy heretics to what? 11:13 Calinou there's no free server to go with it, now that CraftBukkit is dead :P 11:13 Calinou the vanilla server is proprietary, which was why CraftBukkit was always illegal in the first place 11:13 Jordach Consortium, u wot m8 11:13 Jordach >IRC 11:13 Jordach >turns out IRC is le Reddit 11:13 Calinou Consortium, this is reddit! *posts ponies and “Linux games” for karma* 11:13 Consortium Jordach: you... you... 8chan? 11:13 JamesTait Calinou, https://github.com/mc-server/MCServer 11:14 Jordach apparently i earn big karma from /r/blender with each of my renders 11:14 Calinou there are tons of people making alternate servers, but none are really functional or bug-free 11:14 JamesTait It's still got a way to go, but it's being actively developed. 11:14 Calinou anyway, I'll star that repo 11:14 Jordach https://github.com/SirCmpwn/Craft.Net 11:14 Calinou we never know, if we ever see a client 11:14 Calinou [I still bought Minecraft in December 2010…] 11:15 Calinou but haven't played it since January 2014 11:15 Consortium Calinou Jordach you two talk like 8Chan holy shit 11:15 Jordach kek 11:15 Consortium As in 8ch.net 11:15 Jordach jet fuel cant melt dank memes 11:15 Jordach m8 11:16 Consortium jet fuel cant melt dank memes 11:16 Krock I would prefer if the serious talk could continue. 11:16 Consortium It feels like home all over again! 11:16 Consortium Krock: okay 11:17 SylvieLorxu Consortium: Go back to halfchan 11:17 Consortium Lets talk bussiness 11:17 Krock Otherwise everybody will act like in a Kindergarten. 11:17 Consortium SylvieLorxu: What are you? LW 11:17 SylvieLorxu Collaboratively administrate empowered markets via plug-and-play networks. Dynamically procrastinate B2C users after installed base benefits. Dramatically visualize customer directed convergence without revolutionary ROI. 11:17 SylvieLorxu Efficiently unleash cross-media information without cross-media value. Quickly maximize timely deliverables for real-time schemas. Dramatically maintain clicks-and-mortar solutions without functional solutions. 11:17 SylvieLorxu Completely synergize resource sucking relationships via premier niche markets. Professionally cultivate one-to-one customer service with robust ideas. Dynamically innovate resource-leveling customer service for state of the art customer service. 11:17 Krock GOod stuff. 11:18 Jordach [x] rekt [ ] not rekt 11:18 Consortium SylvieLorxu: how do you generate those text? 11:19 Krock One upon a time, rubenwardy wrote a noob generator script which gave a much better output. 11:19 SylvieLorxu Consortium: http://cipsum.com/ 11:20 Krock https://gist.github.com/rubenwardy/4cb29fedb7952e5a4cdf 11:21 Consortium Krock: Minetest can't play chess! It just can't! 11:21 Krock SylvieLorxu, it always starts with a "*ly"word and ends with a noun. 11:24 Consortium Can we program other things into minetest 11:29 ThatGraemeGuy http://i.imgur.com/lLo84rw.png o_O 11:29 Krock a tree! 11:29 ThatGraemeGuy haha 11:29 xenkey lol 11:30 Consortium Brainfuck in Minetest? 11:30 ThatGraemeGuy yeah, how bizarre 11:30 ThatGraemeGuy wtf is that tree doing there 11:30 Krock It spawned there. 11:30 ElectronLibre OH my. 11:30 ElectronLibre I remember these. 11:30 Consortium wtf is that pic??? 11:30 ElectronLibre When was this map created/generated? 11:31 Krock The problem of that server is, moretrees is installed and those trees are sometimes too large and cause those buggy blocks 11:31 Krock (AFAIK) 11:31 ElectronLibre It's exactly that Krock. 11:31 ThatGraemeGuy a bajillion years ago, this is VanessaE's survival server, this..... thing..... is floating above a desert 11:31 Krock /deleteblocks here solves the problem.. except the tree, you must remove it manyually 11:32 JZ403 How would I go about setting up a world where people/companies could sponsor it, in exchange for a sign posted at the world's entrance (advertising the company)? 11:32 Krock That's inefficient since there are 70% kids on todays' servers 11:33 JZ403 Man :( I have this great idea but don't have the money to host it. 11:33 Krock Host your own server on some old laptop 11:33 Krock (If that's your target) 11:33 JZ403 Can't. Using the neighbor's connection. Firewalled in. 11:34 Calinou serious companies aren't going to be advertised on game servers 11:34 Consortium fail? 11:34 * Calinou remembers the “Diesel” Quake Live campaigns… 11:34 Calinou “Hello, you seem to use the railgun a lot, you should shave a bit” 11:35 Krock Wow. good advertisement 11:35 JZ403 I'm wanting to go completely Avatar and have a elements themed world (fire, air, water, earth). Then allow companies to pay to support each group of people (giving them items and whatnot). 11:35 JZ403 *an 11:35 Consortium Call Kotaku already! (Don't actually do it) 11:39 JZ903 Sorry, got disconnected. 11:39 Consortium K 11:40 Consortium I'm wanting to go completely Avatar and have a elements themed world (fire, air, water, earth). Then allow companies to pay to support each group of people (giving them items and whatnot). 11:41 Consortium But how? 11:44 JZ903 What do you mean Consortium? I'm wanting the spawn area to split off into four paths. . . then each group can make their own world. 11:46 Consortium JZ903: Imbalance 11:46 Consortium Imagine its Harry Potter 11:46 JZ903 ok? 11:46 Consortium Everybody wants to be griffendore 11:47 Consortium Only assholes join Slytherin 11:48 JZ903 I had thought of that but I was going to leave Avatar out of it. Just go with the elements. I used Avatar so show where I was going with it. 11:49 Consortium I know, i know 11:49 rubenwardy Avatar! 11:49 rubenwardy Awesome. 11:50 Krock Without VManip operatoins, it might get a bit laggy 11:51 JZ903 Personally, I wanted to be in the water area myself. I'm also going to allow players to go inbetween areas. This way they can "be the avatar" LOL 11:54 Consortium I think we need to develop Minetest so people can play minigames 11:54 Consortium The walls, MineZ and many others are fun because they are pretty much based on other games 11:54 JZ903 That would be kind of cool. 11:55 Consortium So... that is why need the list 11:55 Consortium More games, more mods, more everything 11:55 Consortium To replace Minecraft as the key to technological education 11:56 JZ903 I wish it would support hyperlinking between worlds. 11:57 Consortium What is hyperlinking? 11:57 JZ903 Go through this door and be in another world. 11:58 JZ903 Like hyperlinking on the web (except in the game world). 11:58 Consortium Oh, that will be awesome! 11:58 Consortium Write that down in the list, please 11:59 JZ903 All the 3D web browsers are getting it. I was surprised that it wasn't included in minetest by default. 11:59 JZ903 What list? 12:00 Consortium JZ903: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1-iDMmTwTCIduEDEil7DWachERj4PSwSbp_zzS6eeH2w/edit?usp=sharing 12:01 JZ903 WOW 12:03 JZ903 Consortium, I think I'll leave the list to you guys but I don't care to drop in and make suggestions from time to time. 12:06 JZ903 one problem the 3D browsers are having with hyperlinking though is item ownership. Can you take what you own across the web or do you start over with each new place you visit? You'd have to have some sort of cross linking for servers owned by the same person. 12:14 Consortium CL type-A: servers are from the same franchise, therefore you can bring things from one to the other 12:15 Consortium CL type-B: Owned by the same people but not allowed to carry things over, therefore items are saved in each server 12:18 JZ903 Is it possible to open links inside a browser by clicking things? I know it would be a lot more fun if I could open instructables and community chats by clicking. 12:23 Consortium What do you mean? 12:28 JZ903 Say I wanted to open this chatroom. . . I would click a sign or something and it would pop open in my default browser. 12:29 JZ903 Or someone wanted to make an in-world tutorial. . . With each step, they'd link to the minetest wiki. 12:29 Krock How about a Ctrl + C, Ctrl + V action? 12:30 rubenwardy The developers don't want such a feature 12:31 rubenwardy Security risk :P 12:31 xenkey Is it? 12:32 rubenwardy They think so 12:33 JZ903 Maybe include an embedded browser without javascript inside minetest? 12:33 Consortium https://docs.google.com/document/d/1-iDMmTwTCIduEDEil7DWachERj4PSwSbp_zzS6eeH2w/edit?usp=sharing 12:34 Krock Consortium, http://irc.minetest.ru/minetest/2015-04-09 Ctrl + F -> "=sharing" 12:35 Krock Create a forum topic if you want attention 12:36 Consortium Krock wat? 12:38 Consortium What is with the link to http://irc.minetest.ru/minetest/2015-04-09 12:40 Krock I wanted to tell you to create a forum topic or do something else then repeating the same link over and over again ;) 12:40 exio4 hai 12:40 Krock then, than? instead of. 12:40 Krock Hi, exio4. 12:41 exio4 JZ903: I think you don't want minetest, but an online game that runs in your browser 12:46 Krock Let's port Minetest to javascript! 12:47 JZ903 exio4: nah. I was an avid secondlife user until everyone left it. There are some features which I would like to see in minetest based around those. One of them was linking to external webpages. It has numerous possiblities (one of which is a security problem if Javascript is enabled). Others include: Community chatrooms, documentation, music, ToS agreements, etc. The list goes on but I don't want to flood the chat. 12:50 exio4 JZ903: ToS agreements? where? 12:50 JZ903 I've heard the phrase, "Minetest is NOT Minecraft" numerous times on this forum. I'm suggesting these things, not b/c I desire to see minetest under another flavor. The basic gist of the game is what I love about it. I'm suggesting these things b/c I think they add valid improvements to the game itself. 12:51 JZ903 ToS agreements (and rules) might be needed by any number of minetest servers for any number of reasons. 12:51 JZ903 *in this chat, sorry not 100% today LOL 12:52 exio4 terms of use agreements is just a fancy term for "don't be a dick" 12:52 Krock ^ 12:52 exio4 but I don't really think copy/paste/opening links would be that bad 12:52 exio4 being able to open randomly links without warning, though... that's a no 12:53 JZ903 exio4: pretty much but as legal systems get more and more laws on their books, I think people will find that a ToS agreement might be needed :(. That being said, all the other reasons for external linking are still in play, even if ToS agreements isn't. 12:54 JZ903 Maybe a warning with the entire link displayed before opening it in the browser? 12:54 exio4 I don't know 12:54 exio4 it has to be annoying enough 12:55 JZ903 I don't think copy and paste is bad. It's just extra work. External linking could solve that, especially if you're looking at a sign that has a URL on it. 13:00 Consortium Krock: which category of the forum should i put my stuff in? 13:00 Krock Feature Discussion? 13:02 Consortium K 13:12 Consortium Krock: https://www.google.com/url?q=https%3A%2F%2Fforum.minetest.net%2Fviewtopic.php%3Ff%3D5%26t%3D11809&sa=D&sntz=1&usg=AFQjCNF3vMMIp4i1b40kc47wiYQazE2x_Q 13:12 Consortium I did it 13:13 Krock congrats for that google link 13:14 Consortium Shit 13:14 Krock Btw, why not add that tic-tac-toe field? :P 13:14 Krock jk 13:14 Zeno` I hope someone else is going to write all those itemdefs and create the textures hehe 13:15 Zeno` why MongoDB? 13:15 Krock Good question ^ 13:15 Consortium What MongoDB? 13:15 Krock LevelDB is a horror to install on windows, I won't imagine MongoDB 13:20 Consortium What is DB for? 13:20 xenkey Date 13:20 xenkey Bade 13:20 xenkey Woops 13:20 xenkey Database 13:20 Consortium I mean SQL is FOSS, right? 13:20 * xenkey facepalms 13:20 xenkey SQL is a language 13:21 xenkey well 13:21 xenkey idk 13:21 xenkey but theres many implementations liek postgresql mysql, 13:21 xenkey etc 13:21 xenkey correct me if im wrong :3 13:23 Consortium SQL is a FOSS programming language, right? 13:24 Consortium Becuase Java is not (at least thats what i think) 13:24 SylvieLorxu It's not so much about the language, it's about the implementation 13:24 SylvieLorxu Java has both a proprietary virtual machine, and a Free one 13:25 SylvieLorxu SQL has a lot of Free database systems that read it, but there are also a few dialects for Microsoft Access and so 13:25 Consortium CLR, JVM, LLVM, Parrot? 13:25 SylvieLorxu As far as I know, the syntax itself isn't really licensed, but the application running/compiling it is 13:27 Zeno` SQL is a standard 13:27 Zeno` not a FOSS language (although there are FOSS implementations) 13:29 Consortium Zeno`: name some FOSS language 13:34 JZ903 I have added Mongo b/c of the speed of use with multiple servers and services needed for a full-pledged game. It is very good with those and it quite easy to install if you know what you're doing. 13:36 Calinou Consortium, Rust, Go, Dart, … 13:36 Calinou the reference implementations are free/libre 13:36 Calinou so is the documentation/specifications usually 13:38 Consortium Calinou: Is Red FOSS? 13:38 Calinou what's red? 13:38 Consortium red-lang.com 13:39 JZ903 What is Red? 13:39 Calinou doesn't seem to work 13:39 Calinou every time someone with a PhD sneezes, a new programming language is created 13:40 Calinou :) 13:40 Consortium http://www.red-lang.org/ 13:41 Consortium Calinou: This is the shit 13:43 Krock It's open source. It's possible to download it 13:44 Consortium Full Stack + Modular/Extensible-Syntax + CLR + JVM = Perfection 13:50 rom1504 yes but can it store blue ?? 13:56 Consortium What pun is this? 13:56 rom1504 a red one 13:56 rom1504 :))))) 14:05 Krock Zeno`, can you delete posts on the forums? 14:12 Zeno` the forum or github? 14:12 Zeno` on the forums, nope 14:12 Zeno` oh 14:13 Zeno` Krock, have you compiled minetest since yesterday? 14:13 Zeno` because there have been some changes to freetype detection and neither hmmmm nor I could work out if it would break msvc builds or not 14:14 Zeno` but it was merged. so if it breaks we will need to add a workaround 14:14 Krock Robert_Zenz, not yet 14:14 Krock Zeno`, ^ 14:14 Zeno` lol 14:14 Zeno` ok :) 14:15 Krock Zeno`, I'd suggest to look at the IRC log of yesterday. I successfully compiled it 14:15 Krock Commit c758fd73 14:15 * Zeno` looks at the commit log 14:15 Krock s/commit/IRC/ 14:16 Zeno` ah ok it's all cool then I guess 14:16 Zeno` d2fc98e was the commit that was in doubt 14:16 Krock Ah. 14:30 Consortium Krock 14:30 Krock Yeah, what's up? 14:31 xenkey Etzos: hi? 14:31 Consortium Why is the IRC getting quiet? 14:31 Krock Because no-one was talking 14:36 exio4 pretty much 14:38 Consortium Gonna go to sleep... see you tomorrow 14:38 Consortium The docs is always open 15:00 Wuzzy Where is debug.txt on Windows 8? 15:02 ElectronLibre It is where you launched minetest.exe from. 15:03 ElectronLibre (the root of your Minetest directory or ./bin/ usually) 15:03 Krock The working directory of minetest.exe, yes. 15:08 Krock C'mon. There's still some old spam laying somewhere in the Minetest forums I thought it would start smell after a half day. 15:12 VanessaE *sniffs* where? 15:12 VanessaE :) 15:14 Krock https://forum.minetest.net/viewforum.php?f=5 15:14 Krock 5 exemplares of spam 15:14 Krock There's also some at Geral Discussion 15:14 tim_flatus Just had a markers crash, something to do with the new nearsorter functionality. I can't see where 'factor' is defined. Sokomine has anyone else seen this or have I made some sleep deprived mistake? 15:15 Krock A mod crash? Is there any error log? 15:15 tim_flatus I just posted here - https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=8175&p=175682 15:16 tim_flatus Just because I didn't sleep last night and am probably missing a braincell. 15:16 Krock hmm areas.lua:7 15:18 tim_flatus Well, the whole stanza 15:18 Krock The problem is, something defined "factor" to a non-numeric value 15:19 tim_flatus No, the problem seems to be that it isn't defined at all. 15:19 Krock vector.interpolate = function(pos1, pos2, factor) 15:19 Krock https://github.com/Sokomine/markers/blob/master/areas.lua#L116 15:19 Krock It is defined. 15:21 YvesLevier We are about to recieve a municipal "ok" to extend Saint-Camille in minetest to our township. We got a rendez-vous with township tomorrow. 15:21 YvesLevier Thanks to all :) 15:21 YvesLevier VanessaE: ^ 15:21 Krock Eeks. I hate that table sorting method 15:22 VanessaE cool 15:22 Wuzzy Krock: “working directory of minetest.exe”. Does that mean “%WHERE_MINETEST_IS_INSTALLED%\bin\debug”? 15:23 Wuzzy oops, I mean \bin\debug.txt 15:23 tim_flatus OK, I am missing a braincell then krock as I don't understand how that translates to line 7. 15:24 ElectronLibre It means where you launched it from. 15:24 ElectronLibre Usually it's \bin\ 15:27 tim_flatus Because vector.interpolate only seems to take 2 args rather than the 3 it has beeng given. Doesn't the '0.5' just drop out? 15:45 MarisD ~tell VanessaE Hi can you change my password in VE Vanilla? Name: VanillaVan Thanks, -Vanilla 15:45 ShadowBot MarisD: O.K. 15:49 tim_flatus ug 15:49 MarisD hi, aflatus. 15:50 MarisD afflatus* 15:50 tim_flatus thi 15:50 * tim_flatus gives up 15:50 * MarisD what tim said 15:51 tim_flatus Do you play on my server? 15:53 tim_flatus missed ok 15:55 Builder123 Hello, All. 16:01 Krock Wuzzy, yes, bin\debug.txt 16:02 Krock tim_flatus, interpolate always needs 3 values 16:02 * Krock goes afk 16:02 tim_flatus So it should be vector.interpolate = function(pos1, pos2, factor) 16:03 Wuzzy thx 16:06 Hijiri wait, minetest hashes passwords before sending them? 16:07 Hijiri that's what the doc seems to imply 16:09 tim_flatus Thankyou Krock, so I was right in the first place - 'factor' wasn't defined. 16:10 tim_flatus lol 16:31 Krock !tell tim_flatus The funny thing was, I had the fixed versio in front of me and just didn't get where the fail actually is. 16:31 MinetestBot Krock: I'll pass that on when tim_flatus is around 16:32 Krock Yeah, thanks, MinetestBot! 16:47 Krock Liek a pro: https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?p=175646#p175646 17:13 luizrpgluiz hi 17:21 Krock hi 17:34 Salbei https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=3188 17:34 Salbei Anyone use this on his server? 18:05 Krock There's a newer version: https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?t=9637 18:19 Krock ^ Salbei 18:36 Salbei Krock: thanks 19:19 Krock np 19:58 Krock Jordach, answer those damn question! :P 19:58 Krock +s 20:07 Krock https://c2.staticflickr.com/4/3471/3391551453_32cc937189.jpg 20:41 Megaf_ Hi 20:42 xenkey hi 21:14 Etzos xenkey: ping 21:14 xenkey hey there 21:14 Etzos Sorry. I've been super busy these past few days. 21:15 xenkey That's alright, things happen. 21:15 xenkey I'm going to bed soon. Are you free tomorrow? 21:15 Etzos Yep. 21:15 Etzos At least most of the day. 21:15 xenkey I so have some 10 mins (I need them to fix me raging and rm -rfing my web interface thing) 21:16 * xenkey gets mad sometimes ^.^ 21:16 Etzos The double-edged sword that is rm -rf. XD 21:16 xenkey Yup 21:16 xenkey Had to rebuild a whole chroot 21:16 xenkey not so fun 21:17 Etzos I can imagine. 21:18 xenkey Think is, my web server needs it 21:18 xenkey So (please don't tell anyone) I mounted the root filesystem inside a chroot 21:18 Etzos Sounds safe. 21:18 xenkey Yup 21:20 xenkey No way too hacky 22:26 Jordach evryo 22:26 Jordach everything is fine 22:26 * Jordach can't fly a plane with a flight stick 22:52 Megaf_ Jordach: why not? Perhaps your stick is not suitable for you or your simulator. 22:53 Jordach Megaf_, it's fine 22:53 Jordach i haven't got muscle memory pinned down 22:57 Megaf_ Perhaps. What stick to you have? 22:58 Jordach Saitek 3D Cyborg Gold (sealed unit from first manufacture) 22:59 Megaf_ Jordach: We can't blame the stick then 22:59 Megaf_ You got yourself a good one 23:00 Jordach Megaf_, she's elderly (10+ years old) 23:00 Jordach it has drivers for XP only :D 23:00 Megaf_ It doesnt matter 23:01 Megaf_ btw, have you tested it on linux? You could play FlightGear there 23:02 Jordach ugh 23:03 Jordach i don't like commercial flight sims 23:03 Jordach combat flight sims all the way 23:04 Megaf_ Then IL-2 is a fantastic choice 23:04 Megaf_ Maybe not... 23:15 Megaf_ 🐧 23:16 Megaf_ I am a beautiful person who is the best way to get the best way to get the best way to get a chance to win the game and the rest of the most important thing to remember to bring it to you 23:17 Megaf_ Lol. Those words were only suggestions from my tablets keyboard 23:26 Johnsen2 !server CsMr 23:26 MinetestBot Johnsen2: No results