Time Nick Message 00:37 NekoGloopMkIII meow 00:37 VanessaE wuff. 00:37 NekoGloopMkIII I have been upgraded. 00:37 VanessaE I see that 00:37 * VanessaE plugs in some HV wire and a few battery boxes 00:38 * NekoGloopMkIII spews 10 kittens from mouth per seconde 00:38 NekoGloopMkIII (everything but my spelling is upgraded) 00:47 khonkhortisan does /knock only work if I can't get in? 00:56 khonkhortisan If I create a new file, do I need a copyright thing on it? 00:58 VanessaE Generally that's a good idea. 00:59 NekoGloopMkIII Or have a single file. 01:00 NekoGloopMkIII Or do what I always wanna do and say "fuck this, I'm not going to liscence it" then do record a "Haters gonna hate" .gif and put it on the forum topic when someone says something. 01:00 khonkhortisan the new volume change menu has three copyrights on it 01:13 onpon4 I've noticed, on 0.4.4, quite frequently, I'll drain a mob's health to 0, but it won't get killed, and this causes a weird effect where there's a lot of stuff I can't do and it freezes if I try to close it. Is this just a bug in that version of Minetest? (I wonder if using the daily builds would be a good idea.) 01:13 khonkhortisan I've hit a worldedit number repeatedly, I don't know if that's related. 01:15 NekoGloopMkIII Perhaps even using the latest stable would? 01:16 onpon4 I would have an easier time with the daily builds because the latest stable hasn't been packaged with Ubuntu. 01:16 onpon4 *for 01:16 tripod getdeb? 01:16 tripod have stable iirc 01:16 jojoa1997 thexyz 01:18 onpon4 tripod: The Debian package is 0.3.1. Ubuntu Precise also has 0.3.1 in the repo, and 0.4.4 is the latest stable version in https://code.launchpad.net/~minetestdevs/+archive/stable/+packages 01:20 onpon4 I would be fine with compiling the source code, but my brother wouldn't have the patience for that. Will 0.4.4 have any problems connecting to a 0.4.5 server? 01:22 ShadowNinja onpon4: locked chests won't work and a few other things but mostly no 01:22 VanessaE it only takes 5 or 10 mins to compile from sources. Just be sure you do not use any version newer than March 10th 01:23 VanessaE (versions between March 10 and at least today are broken) 01:23 khonkhortisan the stl commit? 01:24 VanessaE yeah 01:24 VanessaE that commit broke something in a weird waty 01:24 VanessaE way* 01:24 khonkhortisan Can I undo it locally? 01:25 VanessaE git reset --hard e204bedf1d781e43b8caa334a99319efc5b7ce46 01:25 VanessaE that'll get you back to the last good commit. 01:25 khonkhortisan I'd rather only remove it 01:26 VanessaE I don't think it can be trivially backed out 01:27 khonkhortisan git rebase --onto e204bedf1d781e43b8caa334a99319efc5b7ce46^ e204bedf1d781e43b8caa334a99319efc5b7ce46 didn't work 01:28 khonkhortisan so yeah, not trivially 01:29 khonkhortisan I might have to make a main menu with tabs and a settings menu with the same tabs? 01:31 onpon4 What's the difference between "minetest" and "minetest-game"? 01:32 khonkhortisan minetest is the "game", "minetest_game" is the normal set of mods that goes with it 01:33 NekoGloopMkIII minetest is the interpreter for minetest_game and similar modpacks placed in the games folder. 01:33 khonkhortisan without minetest_game, you have the "minimal development test" set of mods. 01:33 NekoGloopMkIII which could contain horribly broken versions. 01:33 NekoGloopMkIII (highly experimental stuff) 01:37 NekoGloopMkIII (it's the dumping ground for experimental lua code, for all intents and purposes.) 01:39 hmmmm what, minimal? 01:39 khonkhortisan yeah 01:39 hmmmm minimal is experimental? 01:39 hmmmm hahahhahahah 01:39 NekoGloopMkIII Well, contains any existing experimental code. 01:39 hmmmm minimal lags behind minetest_game 01:39 NekoGloopMkIII Not that there ever *is* any, but well... 01:40 hmmmm it's quite the opposite in fact 01:41 NekoGloopMkIII Quite recently (in astronomer time, which is the only way minetest can be progressing "fast"), celeron used it for a experimental tool that would alter nodes on the fly. 01:41 hmmmm well. maybe when lua was first introduced 01:41 hmmmm that's certainly not the case now 01:41 NekoGloopMkIII Not *that* long ago. 01:41 hmmmm you really think minetest develops slow? 01:41 NekoGloopMkIII Indeed. 01:42 hmmmm i personally don't think so 01:42 hmmmm there's so much development going on, my time is almost completely filled with sorting out what to merge 01:42 khonkhortisan I think minetest/minetest develops faster than c55/minetest 01:43 NekoGloopMkIII When has there been a useful change that isn't just support for another thing that nobody will ever use? 01:43 hmmmm uhh 01:43 hmmmm just look at 0.4.4->0.4.5? 01:43 khonkhortisan I'm working on one of those 01:43 hmmmm the difference is night and day 01:44 NekoGloopMkIII I'm talking about the *development*, not the *snapshot made every quarter-year* 01:44 hmmmm that's not a snapshot, it's a new version 01:44 khonkhortisan flatland 01:44 khonkhortisan 6d facedir (still being worked on) 01:45 NekoGloopMkIII Tell me what was changed, on the player's point of view, between 0.4.4 and 0.4.5 01:45 hmmmm well for one, map generates way faster 01:45 khonkhortisan clouds between 0.4.5 and 0.4.6 01:45 hmmmm you can change any of the map generation parameters so you can have limtless possibilities 01:45 onpon4 NekoGloopMkIII: If you think Minetest develops slow, you should take a look at SuperTux. 01:45 hmmmm you can do multi-threaded map generation 01:46 khonkhortisan or bzflag 01:46 hmmmm you have finite liquids 01:46 onpon4 Isn't there a nice menu for mods, too? 01:46 NekoGloopMkIII We can talk about 0.4.6 when it gets here. 01:46 hmmmm you have the server announcement now 01:46 khonkhortisan I still have to try those liquids 01:46 khonkhortisan oh yeah, the server list 01:46 hmmmm L-system trees 01:47 hmmmm debug logging is configurable and can be disabled 01:47 NekoGloopMkIII Trees were not changed to the player. 01:47 hmmmm there are mods which use them 01:47 NekoGloopMkIII So? I mean what changed in the gameplay, what does the average player see changed? 01:48 hmmmm i am talking about the gameplay too 01:48 hmmmm if you want that, you can add in the mod that does it 01:48 onpon4 NekoGloopMkIII: I think being able to choose your mods without moving files around is pretty huge. 01:48 hmmmm the thing is, now it's possible 01:49 hmmmm from what i am understanding here, you think it should just change to some person's whims 01:49 hmmmm and that's all of minetest 01:49 hmmmm and there's no third party addons 01:49 NekoGloopMkIII So, finite liquids, modmanagement, fancy mod-only trees. 01:49 hmmmm i listed way more than that 01:49 hmmmm in fact, it only makes sense to have them in a mod 01:49 NekoGloopMkIII I'm only counting the ones that the average player will ever notice. 01:49 hmmmm so you're saying the average player won't notice the faster map generation? 01:49 hmmmm that they don't have to sit there and wait two whole minutes anymore? 01:50 NekoGloopMkIII The average player likely won't be using fast_move constantly... 01:50 hmmmm you don't have to use fast_move in order to get stuck at a boundary where the map doesn't exist yet 01:50 NekoGloopMkIII Which, btw, should be toned down. That's way too fast for quite a lot of people's liking, if I'm not mistaken. 01:50 hmmmm lol^ 01:50 onpon4 The map is generated on the fly and you see nothingness when it isn't generated yet, right? I've noticed that being slow. 01:51 NekoGloopMkIII hmmmm, I still don't have to go too fast in 0.4.5 to hit the map border. 01:51 hmmmm yeah not everybody has the latest processor 01:51 hmmmm in fact, most don't 01:51 khonkhortisan hmmmm, trees can't be in a mod yet because (moretrees) they don't read mg_flags 01:51 VanessaE even my higher-end machine is slow by today's standards 01:51 NekoGloopMkIII They could if they parsed the file... 01:51 hmmmm khonkhortisan, what...? 01:51 VanessaE (2.8 GHz versus 4+) 01:52 VanessaE khonkhortisan: trees will read from that flag if someone can show me how 01:52 VanessaE moretrees* 01:52 NekoGloopMkIII Yet nobody quite listens to the little child's ideas. After all, he isn't smart enough. Even though he very well is... 01:52 VanessaE patches/pull-requests welcome of course 01:52 khonkhortisan parsing works, but it's not the _right_ way. 01:52 hmmmm w/e. 01:52 hmmmm i don't mean to pick a fight or anything here but 01:53 hmmmm it always seems like nekogloop, especially as of lately, has a holier-than-thou attitude 01:53 NekoGloopMkIII As if you have room to talk. 01:53 khonkhortisan and a holier-than-thou kitten on your head :P 01:53 VanessaE fwiw, I definitely see the improvements in the mapgen and the loading/emerge code - it really shines on my server (until moretrees gets 'hold of it ;-) ) 01:53 hmmmm we're doing a shitload of work and development and you definitely do see it, you only choose not to because you feel like it's irrelevant 01:54 NekoGloopMkIII hmmmm: I see it. Just how much of it will a normal player see? Someone who plays a game to play a game, not to give to it's community. 01:54 khonkhortisan *its 01:54 hmmmm there's way more to minetest than playing a game 01:54 hmmmm anybody could see that 01:54 khonkhortisan switching out mods is a big part of it 01:54 hmmmm if they wanted gameplaying perhaps they should go buy cawadoody or something 01:55 * khonkhortisan just learned a new term 01:55 hmmmm pure, unadultered gameplaying* 01:55 NekoGloopMkIII Minetest should aim for any audience. 01:55 hmmmm minetest in that way is like a fine wine 01:56 hmmmm if you just want something to chug down quick, you won't notice how it's better 01:56 NekoGloopMkIII After all, that's one of the charms of creating a voxel game: Most anyone would find something good in it. 01:57 VanessaE "Minetest Engine is like a fine summer wine that's divine anytime." "What is minetest_game then?" "Every good wine needs a cracker!" 01:57 VanessaE ;-) 01:57 VanessaE (apologies to Jeff Dunham) 01:57 hmmmm not familiar with that guy 01:57 NekoGloopMkIII Adult comedian. 01:57 VanessaE he's a ventriloquist. Fucking hilarious 01:57 hmmmm yeah just read 01:57 hmmmm never got into comedians 01:58 khonkhortisan "arguing with myself" 01:58 NekoGloopMkIII I could tell that much. 01:58 VanessaE yes, I think so 01:58 VanessaE I forget which special it was in (have all four) 01:58 NekoGloopMkIII My guess is the second. 01:58 khonkhortisan I'll go third 01:58 NekoGloopMkIII What, are we betting on horses here? 01:58 VanessaE lol 01:59 VanessaE hmmmm: look up any of his routines with "Sweet Daddy D." One of those is the routine I paraphrased. 01:59 VanessaE also look up any of his routines with Peanut or Walter. 01:59 hmmmm ehhhhh 01:59 hmmmm comedy isn't my sorta thing 01:59 VanessaE trust me 01:59 NekoGloopMkIII I could tell. 01:59 VanessaE it's worth it 01:59 hmmmm i'll take your word for it that it's good 01:59 VanessaE come on. 2 minutes. :-) 02:00 hmmmm alriiight 02:00 NekoGloopMkIII Anyway, I'm surprised nobody brought up the new mese when I asked what was new to the player, heh. 02:00 VanessaE him and Gabriel Iglesias are the two funniest comics in the media right now :-) 02:00 VanessaE (imho) 02:00 khonkhortisan didn't come to mind 02:00 khonkhortisan I haven't dug for it yet, only creative 02:01 VanessaE NekoGloopMkIII: well really, the player sees a new block/item -- "meh, oh yay another new block". But modders can make better use of it now. 02:01 VanessaE so it's more the secondary effect of the change that's more important 02:01 NekoGloopMkIII Well the player sees a new ore. 02:01 VanessaE same reason many of us are bucking for moreores and moreblocks-base to be added to minetest_game 02:01 VanessaE true, they do see a new ore 02:01 VanessaE (so to speak) 02:02 NekoGloopMkIII First let's decide on a decent ingot texture... 02:02 hmmmm lol 02:02 khonkhortisan improved facedir will improve node count (by up to 83% in some places) 02:02 hmmmm i am watching sweet daddy d 02:02 NekoGloopMkIII After all, even mine was just something really halfassed... 02:02 VanessaE hmmmm: I told you :D 02:02 hmmmm he's really good at that 02:02 VanessaE NekoGloopMkIII: I already made the best one there is, bar none. 02:02 VanessaE no one liked it. 02:03 NekoGloopMkIII Yours doesn't fit with the rest of the textures 02:03 NekoGloopMkIII Consistency is as good as greatness. 02:03 hmmmm hahaha 02:04 NekoGloopMkIII ... What? 02:04 hmmmm http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=V07AjvWeOeE#t=159s 02:04 bas080 Hey! omg, changing something that has "always" been. Are we really that progressive 02:04 NekoGloopMkIII I see. 02:04 NekoGloopMkIII bas080, Indeed. 02:04 VanessaE hey, at least I got hmmmm to go look at something funny for change :-) 02:05 hmmmm if you want bigger changes, perhaps minetest isn't for you.... go fork it 02:05 sokomine at least moreores ought to be in default. the few people who might not wish it might still remove it 02:05 hmmmm minetest needs to be unreliable and not pushy when it comes to changing things 02:05 VanessaE "unreliable"? 02:05 hmmmm minetest can't be unreliable* 02:05 VanessaE now that's a new way to put it. 02:05 hmmmm i know, i just read that and i said whaaat... 02:05 sokomine besides...i got a problem with splitting up my mod...now the variables for accessing other mods are not set 02:06 VanessaE oh that's better 02:06 VanessaE lol 02:06 bas080 hmmmm, one day i just might... till then i am C virgin 02:06 NekoGloopMkIII Also, I see that my improved orelump and ingot texturing just got lumped with the other texture changes in the 0.4.5 update. 02:06 hmmmm learn C and stay in school kids 02:06 NekoGloopMkIII (in the changelog) 02:07 * VanessaE just scared the shit out of herself! haahaha 02:07 NekoGloopMkIII Screamer? 02:07 hmmmm hope you were wearing a diaper 02:07 VanessaE whenever I drink soda pop, I have to pour it into a bottle shake it up really good to break down most of the carbonation. I just opened said bottle about 5 mins after shaking, forgot. BAM! as the CO2 escaped :-) 02:08 NekoGloopMkIII Ah. 02:08 hmmmm neat 02:08 VanessaE heh 02:08 sokomine oh 02:08 NekoGloopMkIII hmmmm: Perhaps I'm being a bit blunt with how I'm attempting to tell you my suggestions. 02:08 VanessaE sokomine: we have npcs again. your sanctuary is populated once again 02:08 * sokomine hops around happily 02:09 sokomine sounds very good :-) 02:09 VanessaE NekoGloopMkIII: re: my ingot texture....well to be fair the default ones sucked ass. At least mine look like they're made of some kind of metal 02:09 VanessaE (yours too) 02:09 NekoGloopMkIII hmmmm: I'm only suggesting things. Accept or deny at will, but at least tell me why. 02:09 hmmmm your suggestions are to make lots of visible changes to minetest instead of improving the core so that everything runs smoother, better, and more reliably while not forcing any changes on the user like some other projects *cough GNOME* 02:10 VanessaE hmmmm: here, have something to bring a little *unity* to that cough... 02:10 hmmmm with all the mapgen work i've done in the past 3 months, it hasn't changed at all... because i make sure nothing changes. beacuse people need the compatibility 02:10 hmmmm also, haha 02:10 hmmmm unity isn't part of the gnome project though 02:10 VanessaE yep I know 02:10 sokomine until i can visit them i'll have to find out how to handle the not-yet-existing global vars of other mods i'm afraid. is there by now a better way than either renaming mods or using minetest.after? 02:10 hmmmm gnome 3.8 has a "classic mode", might give it a whiz sometime. 02:10 VanessaE but it's the same damn issue - change for the sake of change 02:11 VanessaE I mean fuck, at least there's still XFCE for those of us who prefer the desktop+window+taskbar metaphor. 02:11 hmmmm i use xfce 02:11 hmmmm do you use xfce? i forget 02:11 hmmmm or gnome2 02:11 VanessaE 4.10 here. 02:11 VanessaE yeah 02:11 hmmmm yeah 02:11 NekoGloopMkIII VanessaE: defaults used three colors. Mine uses something near 20 or so. Yours uses 100 or more. 02:11 ShadowNinja hmmmm: The rollback file format has to change, currently it looks like a big serialization, do you have any sugestion as to how it should work? 02:11 * sokomine prefers icewm 02:12 VanessaE my mind just does not grok that tablet interface unity/gnome3/et.al are using. Ugggh 02:12 hmmmm hrmm 02:12 VanessaE at least not on a desktop machine. 02:12 hmmmm the rollback thing is pretty poorly designed in the first place i'd say 02:12 hmmmm i'd start from scratch if i were in charge of it 02:12 ShadowNinja yes it sure is 02:12 VanessaE poorly designed? perhaps - but it sure is nice to have 02:12 VanessaE hmmmm: don' 02:12 hmmmm that's totally celeron's stuff though, bug him about it... 02:12 NekoGloopMkIII I like how hmmmm is basically the main dev nowadays... 02:13 VanessaE hmmmm: don't forget, it's "fucking really powerful" or some words to that effect ;) 02:13 khonkhortisan really? 02:13 hmmmm yes 02:13 sokomine a better rollback interface (especially a faster one) would be good. also it would be nice to check a bit easier who has changed a block. maybe not only the last change but those before as well... 02:13 hmmmm i never really took a good look at what changes he made to rollback with that commit 02:13 bas080 hmmmm, xfce i like 02:13 hmmmm xfce is great 02:13 bas080 if you like customizing its perfect! 02:14 hmmmm it's not perfect with multi-monitor support :( i have things set up so it works well enough, but it's still broken in some places 02:14 bas080 too bad gedit does not change to xfce theme colors 02:14 hmmmm you know what they say, right? "if you want something done, do it yourself" 02:15 VanessaE gedit is handy, but irritating at times 02:15 khonkhortisan whichever dev is most annoyed by something is the first to fix it 02:15 hmmmm i would've done it myself but i haven't touched any other project since i started doing minetest 02:15 * ShadowNinja reads rollback.cpp 02:15 VanessaE I'll stick to coding Lua stuff and just little tweaks to C++ 02:15 NekoGloopMkIII While the little guy sits in the corner idly waiting for the bandwagon to hear his cries. 02:15 VanessaE NekoGloopMkIII: which part? 02:16 NekoGloopMkIII ? 02:16 hmmmm you know, it's funny, the reason why i started working on minetest was because the terrain sucked, especially considering how long it took to generate 02:16 VanessaE s/part/cry/ 02:16 hmmmm if i had found a decent map with a big enough flat space for me to build my castle, i would've never delved into the source 02:17 sokomine in that case it is good you didn't find enough space :-) 02:17 NekoGloopMkIII The suggestions that the devs are simply hitting back at me as if it were a game of baseball and I were the pitcher. 02:18 sokomine all people on minetest are strange to some degree. be glad if something happens. if it doesn't...well..either do it yourshelf or convince someone else to 02:18 sokomine regarding the ores...it looked as if they got a bit darker? it looks better than the old version 02:18 NekoGloopMkIII The reason game companies get big and stay big is because they have charisma. Good games help, but if your marketing is shit then you're good as gone. 02:18 * VanessaE watches about 20 npcs walking around in a big "fishtank" 02:19 hmmmm nekogloop, see EA as a counterexample 02:19 NekoGloopMkIII sokomine, The ingots and lumps. Lumps were changed to be shaded-- a lot. Ingots look like metal now. 02:19 hmmmm a company based on almost completely artifical growth 02:19 NekoGloopMkIII hmmmm, They eat the little devs. The little devs are generally more charismatic. 02:19 hmmmm exactly 02:19 sokomine ah, ok. i couldn't pinpoint the changes. the lumps just look better now 02:19 hmmmm if they didn't eat those little devs they'd be dead 02:19 sokomine whoever did it did a good job 02:20 NekoGloopMkIII Therefore, EA, as a whole, succeeds by survival of the fittest. 02:20 VanessaE sokomine: NekoGloopMkIII did. 02:20 NekoGloopMkIII sokomine, thank you. 02:20 sokomine then thanks :-) 02:21 sokomine (do you by any chance would like to do a texture for a barrel? :-)) 02:21 NekoGloopMkIII Hell no. 02:21 sokomine oh :-( a simple one would suffice 02:21 VanessaE sokomine: http://digitalaudioconcepts.com/vanessa/hobbies/minetest/gunpowder-barrel-64px.png 02:21 sokomine if you let me do textures all the world is default:wood... 02:21 VanessaE how about that one? 02:22 VanessaE http://digitalaudioconcepts.com/vanessa/hobbies/minetest/gunpowder-barrel.png 02:22 NekoGloopMkIII 1) I can't do custom, for shit. 2) Realistic things are shit when drawn by me. 02:22 VanessaE larger version 02:22 VanessaE http://digitalaudioconcepts.com/vanessa/hobbies/minetest/images/gunpowder-barrel1.png 02:22 VanessaE http://digitalaudioconcepts.com/vanessa/hobbies/minetest/images/gunpowder-barrel2.png 02:22 VanessaE http://digitalaudioconcepts.com/vanessa/hobbies/minetest/images/gunpowder-barrel3.png 02:22 VanessaE http://digitalaudioconcepts.com/vanessa/hobbies/minetest/images/gunpowder-barrel4.png 02:22 VanessaE try one of these also 02:22 NekoGloopMkIII VanessaE, She means a node texture if I'm not mistaken. 02:22 sokomine hm. i thought more about a beer/wine barrel. more of a simple version. also i only need a texture - the barrel is a nodebox 02:22 VanessaE oh. well shit :D 02:23 sokomine as long as you don't keep too much barrels in one place it works. if you pile them up they get invisible and errors occour (too many nodeboxes i'm afraid) 02:24 VanessaE sokomine: RealBadAngel has an idea to fix that issue. 02:24 VanessaE happens with Jeija's "irregular" mod 02:24 VanessaE and sometimes even with moretrees in rare cases 02:24 sokomine but what do i do about function calls to other mods now? and why got the global var moretrees lost when my mod starts with an r? 02:24 VanessaE it's the total number of poly vertexes being drawn or some such. you run out after a certain point, even if the hardware can handle more. the solution is to add more buffers. 02:25 VanessaE eh? 02:25 sokomine would be nice if that problem could be solved. until then it's sufficient to keep the barrel ratio per chunk low manually 02:25 VanessaE never heard of *that* 02:26 sokomine random_buildings/random_buildings/spawn_lumberjack_houses.lua:8: attempt to index global 'moretrees' (a nil value) 02:26 VanessaE that's weird 02:26 VanessaE unless your mod's being loaded first. 02:27 VanessaE do you explicitly depend on moretrees 02:27 VanessaE ? 02:27 sokomine random_buildings is now a modpack consisting of 3 mods of which random_buildings is one 02:27 NekoGloopMkIII That's because minetest doesn't know its abc's. 02:27 sokomine hmmm....true. maybe i ought to depend on that. though that was what i wanted to avoid 02:27 VanessaE sokomine: I'm afraid that's the only way to fix that 02:28 VanessaE we really need some kind of true soft depend 02:28 sokomine hmpf. and then i'm going to tell people that they ought to remove the moretrees dependency if they havn't got that installed? same with the now new mobf_trader... 02:29 VanessaE minetest.env:force_load_order("moretrees","sokomines_mod") 02:29 VanessaE something like that would be easy to understand 02:29 sokomine in this case, the moretrees variable seems not to have been defined yet 02:29 * sokomine nods 02:29 bas080 http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=4949 hase something like that 02:29 bas080 i think 02:30 VanessaE bas080: wouldn't work here. I'm proposing a function that would alter the default load order without requiring any mods to be changed except the one that needs the altered order (sokomine's mod in this case) 02:31 VanessaE so she shoul dbe able to force moretrees to load first (which would force plants_lib and default by way of the normal dependency mechanism) 02:31 sokomine exactly. and depends.txt does not solve this particular problem. the variable hasn't been defined yet because the other mod has not been initialized 02:31 VanessaE right 02:32 VanessaE so maybe this needs to be a depends.txt aton 02:32 VanessaE atom* 02:32 NekoGloopMkIII if minetest.modpath_exists("moretrees") then minetest.loadmod("moretrees") end 02:32 VanessaE depends.txt: default / force_load_order = moretrees, this 02:33 VanessaE (where "this" is the literal string meaning "the mod that provided the current depends.txt, whatever its name is") 02:33 sokomine yes. that would help 02:33 VanessaE that would be even easier 02:33 VanessaE and wouldn't require interpreting any Lua 02:33 VanessaE since depends.txt is read before the mod is initialized, that's the perfect place for it 02:34 ShadowNinja "// Load whole file to memory", yep I was right 02:35 VanessaE ShadowNinja: the rollback log? gevalt 02:35 VanessaE that log can easily exceed a couple of gigs if you use worldedit at all on a server 02:35 ShadowNinja I don't even know where to start with this 02:35 sokomine sounds bad. rollback is something that imho calls for a database 02:35 NekoGloopMkIII Meow 02:36 VanessaE imho rollback should read from disk in realtime 02:36 NekoGloopMkIII (a database hurr durr ^^^^) 02:36 khonkhortisan also, worldedit can only //load so much at a time before it gets CONTENT_IGNORE holes and chops the load in two 02:36 ShadowNinja whole different issue 02:36 NekoGloopMkIII chunkloading issues. 02:36 khonkhortisan yep 02:37 khonkhortisan chunkloading even when the client has loaded it? 02:37 NekoGloopMkIII It might not be active. 02:38 NekoGloopMkIII The rendering could show a chunk without the client realising it's existance. 02:38 ShadowNinja so how should this be saved? file per date? one big file? 02:38 NekoGloopMkIII (see: night to day (or vice versa) transition being very strange at full render) 02:38 ShadowNinja or even a database 02:38 VanessaE one file per day is the smartest 02:38 VanessaE rotate them out after two weeks 02:39 VanessaE (or when storage exceeds some configured limit) 02:39 ShadowNinja and save in a rollback directory 02:39 ShadowNinja should worldedits be saved? 02:40 khonkhortisan yes 02:40 VanessaE yes, but in some kind of compacted format 02:40 ShadowNinja and they only guess based on nearest, correct? 02:40 khonkhortisan worldedit is dangerous 02:40 VanessaE I'd think it would be easy to detect a worldedit command being executed 02:40 khonkhortisan and deserves a separate undo button 02:40 VanessaE khonkhortisan: +100000 02:40 VanessaE (or a command to the same effect) 02:41 ShadowNinja hmm 02:42 NekoGloopMkIII Whine at Uberi about that. 02:42 NekoGloopMkIII Also, this might be asking a lot, but would it be possible to eventually run mods without unzipping them? 02:49 VanessaE interesting idea 02:53 ShadowNinja even blinkyplants are recorded 02:54 VanessaE eh? 02:54 VanessaE that's dumb 02:55 ShadowNinja there should be a way to specify that something shouldn't be recorded 02:56 VanessaE agreed (I don't know if that's possible now or not) 02:56 ShadowNinja having this much recorded is great but it takes up disk space and takes time to read 03:02 NekoGloopMkIII Perhaps a check to see if the node itself is the one editing its state. 03:34 NekoGloopMkIII http://ompldr.org/vaHJpZw/Untitled.png Don't mind me, just messing with some shaders in my emulator... 03:38 khonkhortisan if a node goes back to its previous state that should count as no change 03:39 khonkhortisan glass -> dirt -> glass | no diff 03:40 khonkhortisan with mesecons, it's the mod changing the node 03:41 khonkhortisan First words of commits: Add, Remove, fix, Clean, Move, Migrate, Update, Re-add, Change, Allow, split, bump, etc. 03:41 khonkhortisan and Merge 03:42 khonkhortisan ...Translated 03:42 NekoGloopMkIII VanessaE, for shits and giggles, look at my above pic. 03:42 VanessaE NekoGloopMkIII: interesting. looks like edge-detect or so 03:43 khonkhortisan yeah 03:43 VanessaE maybe you can write a nice lens flare shader for MT :-) 03:43 NekoGloopMkIII The shader's name is "blinky" 03:43 VanessaE (just to add a nice bright glint to the "sun") 03:43 NekoGloopMkIII And I didn't make it, sorry. 04:01 * khonkhortisan waits for RBA to get back 04:08 bas080 What does this error message mean? https://dl.dropbox.com/u/419967/Chemistry/Screenshot%20-%2003152013%20-%2005%3A07%3A54%20AM.png 04:09 khonkhortisan you're trying to add a node that doesn't exist, or that chunk isn't loaded. 04:10 khonkhortisan Sometimes it just happens, even though the mod is doing things normally 04:10 bas080 ok. that must be the case 04:20 khonkhortisan what's the opposite of HEAD^ ? 04:26 MiJyn khonkhortisan, ^TAIL ? 04:26 MiJyn :P 04:30 VanessaE heh 04:31 khonkhortisan stackoverflow says git checkout $(git rev-list HEAD..master | tail -n 1) 04:31 VanessaE er... 04:33 khonkhortisan If removing an include causes a forward declaration of a variable, should I not remove that include? 04:37 khonkhortisan heh - include guards - heh heh 05:55 VanessaE bbl, bedtime. 05:55 VanessaE night all 06:42 RealBadAngel hi all 06:50 VanessaE and so much for sleep. 06:50 VanessaE hey RBA et.al 06:53 RealBadAngel hehe, hi VanessaE 06:54 VanessaE 'sup? 06:59 RealBadAngel weekend :) 06:59 VanessaE that's always a good sign :-) 07:00 RealBadAngel gettin ready with releasing stargates 07:00 VanessaE cool 07:00 RealBadAngel just a few final touches needed 07:00 RealBadAngel like updating infotext etc 07:01 RealBadAngel and some testing 07:24 celeron55 about the talk 5 hours ago: nekogloop is free to make and distribute his version of minetest with a better game 07:24 celeron55 chances are, if it's well made, that stuff will be merged into minetest 07:25 celeron55 if he is not ready to do that, then everybody can just ignore him; those who make things should rule here 07:29 celeron55 also, the current rollback implementation really isn't much more than a proof-of-concept; it can be ripped apart as needed 07:34 celeron55 it was mostly a weekend project for me with the goal of figuring out if it is possible to put in hooks that allow it to work 07:37 celeron55 oh, then about gnome: there is this project that is a fork of gnome 2 with the goal of actually produce and maintain a sane desktop environment: http://mate-desktop.org/ 07:37 celeron55 so far i've used it at work for a few days in linux mint, and it is very good 07:38 VanessaE xfce ftw :) 07:41 celeron55 xfce is much more unpolished 07:41 VanessaE seems to work pretty well for me. 07:41 celeron55 it's often "good enough", but not as good as things can be 07:43 celeron55 about the softdepend thing: there should just be syntax like appending a question mark to a modname in depends.txt 07:44 VanessaE that's an idea, but a bit less intuitive than my suggestion I think 07:44 VanessaE and less capable. 07:44 celeron55 any changes to depends.txt can't be made backwards-compatibly though, so if that is a priority, then at the transitional period we could have softdepends.txt in addition to that 07:45 VanessaE there's no way to comment-out something in depends.txt maybe? 07:48 ironzorg i3 > * 07:48 ironzorg I love superlatives 07:48 VanessaE oh well, a separate file is better than nothing 08:58 VanessaE bbl 09:53 RealBadAngel http://pastebin.com/B16s5um7 13:07 PilzAdam Hello everyone! 13:08 ecube hi 13:10 STHGOM howdy! 13:17 PilzAdam spam: http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=75908#p75908 13:20 ecube why is that shpam 13:21 STHGOM random thanks? 13:22 troller because its spam 13:22 PilzAdam the user is already banned 13:22 PilzAdam and its spam because of the "I like video games and online games,the site is http://www.mmogoing.com/ ." 13:25 ecube oh, i wasn't looking at that mmosomething guy 13:26 ecube whatever the bleep he was called 13:27 Kacey hi all 13:30 ecube hi 13:31 NekoGloop meow 13:33 STHGOM howdy pardner 13:37 STHGOM bye 13:54 Kacey stupid internet 15:27 bull3trulz hi 16:05 bas0801 Hey people, what is the best way to check if a mod is installed in lua 16:06 PilzAdam minetest.get_modpath("carts") 16:08 bas0801 if installed returns true? 16:08 PilzAdam it returns the path if the mod is installed and nil if not 16:09 bas0801 PilzAdam, ty! 16:09 PilzAdam so you can do this: if minetest.get_modpath("carts") then [code here] end 16:09 Octupus Hello 16:11 sokomine hi. anyone got an idea why moretrees gets loaded *after* random_buildings after i moved the later one into a modpack with the same name? 16:12 Octupus i havent beeen here for awhile 16:12 PilzAdam minetest loads the mods more or less randomly, so you should always use depends.txt if you want a mod to load after another 16:14 * Jordach wonders why the X-Chat icon oddly notifies for no reason when it actually isnt 16:15 * Octupus is Gonna finish cleaning his house 16:17 sokomine hm. why does that work now and didn't yesterday? maybe really random.... 16:19 bas0801 PilzAdam, pull request is sent. I hope you and others find a good use for the rope arrow and like the re-texturing of the mod 16:21 Jordach hey VanessaE 16:21 VanessaE hi 16:21 VanessaE sorry, wasn't paying attention to this tab 16:22 Jordach i do believe i've started turning mad# 16:22 bas0801 Jordach, welcome to the club 16:22 VanessaE started? :-) 16:22 Jordach VanessaE, that X-Chat icon keep saying i;ve been pinged 16:23 VanessaE heh 16:23 Jordach when im busy, it flashes then stops 16:23 Jordach when i look 16:34 PilzAdam bas0801, you should change the nodebox for the new textures too 16:34 PilzAdam use /giveme throwing:arrow_box to see it ingame 16:35 bas0801 ok am checking 16:35 bas0801 True, i reduced the texture size to 16x16 16:37 VanessaE my server now runs an luajit build of minetest (all done from sources, against commit e204bedf1d[...]) in case anyone cares :-) 16:37 PilzAdam oh, and add paramtype = "light" to the node 16:37 VanessaE All Lua code is now at least twice as fast as before 16:37 bas0801 PilzAdam, to the rope arrow? 16:38 Calinou ^ someone please merge luajit :P 16:38 PilzAdam bas0801, just for setting up the right nodebox 16:39 Calinou oh god, please no 16:39 Calinou the new menu was made to please electricity companies... 16:39 Calinou FPS are not limited 16:39 Calinou 500+ totally useless FPS on my machine 16:39 Calinou please limit it to fps_max... 16:41 PilzAdam ^ ShadowNinja|Away, hmmmm 16:42 Octupus Hi VanessaE , PilzAdam member me ? 16:42 ironzorg you're that guy from github 16:42 Octupus No:/ 16:42 ironzorg with the tentacles 16:42 ironzorg :< 16:42 Octupus No :/ 16:43 ironzorg I've seen enough hentai to know where this is going 16:44 Jordach ^ trolol 16:44 Jordach ironzorg, everybody is fucked 16:44 Jordach RUN 16:45 VanessaE Octupus: of course 16:46 VanessaE ironzorg: no, that's Octo-kitty :-) 16:46 VanessaE Octupus is Octupuslegs. 16:46 ironzorg :) 16:47 Octupus :) At least some1 remembers 16:47 VanessaE why would we forget? 16:47 Octupus i havent been here for awhile 16:47 ironzorg we never forget, we never forgive 16:47 VanessaE Octupus: y u no play on my server no more? :( 16:48 Octupus i dont really play games no more because of my swimming schedule 16:48 VanessaE awww ;( 16:49 Octupus yep and i lost the lastest commit 16:49 Octupus for mt 16:49 Octupus pllus im resetting ma pc right now 16:49 Jordach Octupus, http://github.com/minetest/minetest 16:49 Octupus Guys be back in about 15-20mins 16:50 Octupus gotta reset this bad boi 16:50 VanessaE ok 16:51 markveidemanis What is Pygame? 16:51 markveidemanis utility, program? 16:51 PilzAdam is this question related to minetest? 16:51 Jordach pygame is an extender that allows making games with python 16:52 Calinou it pees on games 16:52 markveidemanis so what do i type in google if i want something similar to it? 16:52 Jordach markveidemanis, installation: sudo apt-get install python-pygame 16:52 markveidemanis i have it, i need something Similar to it. 16:53 Jordach markveidemanis, there is nothing else similar to pygame 16:53 markveidemanis something easier to use 16:53 Jordach markveidemanis, pygame is easy 16:53 markveidemanis if its so easy, teach me 16:53 Jordach http://inventwithpython.com/ 16:53 Jordach there 16:53 Jordach if i can learn from those free books, you can too 16:54 markveidemanis what are the basics 16:54 Jordach markveidemanis, work through it 16:55 markveidemanis liike for making an object move with the mouse 16:55 * Jordach wont say anything else except DIY 16:56 markveidemanis hi Jordach 16:56 Jordach uhu 16:56 Jordach uhuh* 16:56 markveidemanis DIY? 16:57 Jordach do it yourself. 16:58 bas0801 PilzAdam, tiles = ... does not work. tile_images = ... does draw textures 16:59 khonkhortisan one of them is the old way, the other the new. 17:00 bas0801 i have an up to date version so i think tile_images is the new way 17:01 PilzAdam tile_images is deprecated 17:01 PilzAdam use tiles 17:01 khonkhortisan doc/lua_api.txt says tiles 17:01 rubenwardy hi all 17:01 khonkhortisan hello 17:01 bas0801 then why does tiles does not work? i compiled it yesterday from github 17:02 khonkhortisan is it showing as unkn own block? 17:02 Jordach Calinou, whats the fancy term when a ISP is purposely slowing you down? 17:02 bas0801 no. the nodebox texture shows up black 17:02 khonkhortisan we should really change that to unkn own node. 17:03 PilzAdam bas0801, add paramtype = "light" and place a new node after that 17:03 khonkhortisan yeah it needs that 17:06 rubenwardy Jordach: how do you make HexChat list favorite members at the top of the user list? 17:07 Jordach rubenwardy, it doesnt 17:08 rubenwardy how CAN you? 17:08 Jordach dunno 17:08 * Jordach hasnt used it 17:08 * Jordach prefers A-Z sorts 17:09 khonkhortisan I tried join order and I couldn't find people 17:12 Jordach do you know what, BlockMen (forum user) has some really nice ideas 17:15 rubenwardy hi all 17:16 Jordach rubenwardy, theres a word for when your ISP is slowing you down, what is it? 17:16 Calinou http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=75942#p75942 17:17 * Jordach knows the definition, but not the word 17:17 * Calinou laughs like gérard depardieu 17:17 Jordach lol 17:17 Jordach we need a minetest helpdesk 17:18 rubenwardy jordach: http://www.osqa.net/ 17:18 rubenwardy but, we have a http://forum.minetest.net/ 17:19 Jordach which is full of idiors 17:19 Jordach idiots 17:19 Jordach rubenwardy, we dont often get common problems 17:19 Jordach just obscure bugs 17:22 Jordach there, http://dev.minetest.net/Community 17:24 RealBadAngel if somebody would like to test stargates, theyre in technit git. pretty usable in singleplayer mode 17:25 RealBadAngel i need just to polish multiplayer use of them 17:25 Jordach RealBadAngel, whats the multiplayer aspect of them 17:25 RealBadAngel private, public gates 17:25 Jordach aye 17:26 RealBadAngel access to any gate marked public by any player on the server 17:26 * Jordach checks out ironzorg's site 17:26 Jordach nothing there 17:29 Jordach uhuhuhuhuhuhuh 17:29 Jordach thexyz uses Android 17:30 ShadowNinja|Away hmmmm: why hasn't this been merged? https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/485 17:32 ironzorg Jordach: ) 17:32 ironzorg you can't see the private parts ;) 17:32 Jordach fufufufu 17:38 bas0801 how come nodebox so dark https://dl.dropbox.com/u/419967/Throwing/Screenshot%20-%2003152013%20-%2006%3A38%3A14%20PM.png 17:39 Jordach bas0801, add paramtype = 'light' to the node 17:39 bas0801 that is added 17:39 bas0801 sunlight_propagates = true, 17:39 bas0801 paramtype = "light", 17:39 bas0801 fixed = { 17:40 PilzAdam bas0801, have you replaced the node after adding paramtype = "light"? 17:40 bas0801 yes 17:40 bas0801 i have done that PilzAdam 17:40 PilzAdam can you paste the whole nodedef? 17:41 bas0801 http://paste.ubuntu.com/5617169/ 17:41 PilzAdam why are you adding everyhing to nodebox? 17:42 PilzAdam *node_box 17:42 bas0801 should it not be there? 17:42 PilzAdam no 17:43 PilzAdam it has to be directly in the nodedef table, and not in a sub-table 17:43 bas0801 omg, i would have never guessed. ty 17:45 khonkhortisan node_box = { type = "fixed", fixed = { }}, selection_box = the same structure 17:45 bas0801 so paramtype = "light" should be where drawtype is defined 17:45 PilzAdam yep 17:46 khonkhortisan drawtype = "nodebox" 17:47 khonkhortisan oh you do have a node_box, I didn't see that 17:48 khonkhortisan node_box should only contain type and fixed, everything else goes outside 17:48 RealBadAngel soon tiles will go inside... ;) 17:49 bas0801 RealBadAngel. so then you know what tile belongs to what coordinates 17:49 RealBadAngel each box will have own tiles 17:49 markveidemanis !up minetest.org 17:49 khonkhortisan can tiles be a function(pos)? 17:49 markveidemanis sfan5 17:49 bas0801 RealBadAngel, that is nice! 17:49 markveidemanis sfan5|OFF 17:50 RealBadAngel it has them already by now 17:50 khonkhortisan I tried to make an insulated crossover mesecon, and parts of it were exposed where they shouldn't've been 17:50 markveidemanis oh someone type it... 17:50 RealBadAngel point is same tiles are applied to every box 17:51 khonkhortisan that way you can have a box with an inside and outside texture 17:51 RealBadAngel each box in a nodebox definition will come with edges def and tiles part 17:52 RealBadAngel since nodebox can already be larger than one node 17:52 RealBadAngel it will be possible to design trains for example, many parts, with each textured 17:52 RealBadAngel or planes, whatever 17:53 RealBadAngel -0.5 to 0.5 is just a tradition 17:53 Jordach RealBadAngel, why are you doing that when MESHES CAN BE USED 17:53 sokomine sounds very good! 17:53 Jordach make meshees useable as nodes 17:54 RealBadAngel im just applyin fixes to the code im workin on 17:54 sokomine would it be possible to fix coordinates that lead to flickering images automaticly? so that x1 < x2, y1 19:56 jin_xi fornicate the constabulary 19:56 mauvebic lol and hey, at least im using it humour, so if someones not happy they can fornicate with themselves :p 19:56 jin_xi lol 19:56 mauvebic *it in 19:56 Jordach oh dear. oh fucking dear. 19:59 mauvebic http://www.zimg.eu/i/2289263888 20:01 markveidemanis lol 20:01 jin_xi mauvebic: did you try making some custom trees yet? 20:02 mauvebic i copied the moretree models and rigged their saplings to spawn instantly (no abms) but naw, didn't make any trees, wanted to fix palm tree model a bit 20:02 mauvebic since the nodes place diagonally doesnt 'look' right to me 20:03 mauvebic so id have to change it to make an L shape 20:04 STHGOM OldCoder: *sigh* someone need interact on minetest.net 30015 20:05 markveidemanis come on 30010 20:05 Jordach STHGOM, john_minetest can help if he is here 20:05 STHGOM i know 20:06 mauvebic i need to come up with mega-spotlights for the big shit, the tokyo tower has like 200 of my dinky spotlights lol 20:06 ShadowNinja jin_xi: does github have a recent version if your treegen tool? 20:06 OldCoder STHGOM, Do I have any admins left for that world? 20:06 jin_xi not yet, but i have fixed the formspec issues locally. will push now 20:07 STHGOM not many are on ever 20:07 STHGOM Zeg9 in on vacation i think 20:07 OldCoder STHGOM, would you like the job? 20:07 STHGOM sure 20:07 markveidemanis OH SHIT 20:07 OldCoder Are you trustworthy and so on? 20:08 markveidemanis OldCoder, reset my password on 30015 20:08 markveidemanis this is not good... 20:08 OldCoder markveidemanis, Is there a way to do this without a restart? 20:08 OldCoder I can't restart ATM 20:08 markveidemanis probably not 20:08 OldCoder It will need to wait 20:08 STHGOM im not a very good judge at that but i will do whatever you need me to 20:08 STHGOM on the server 20:09 OldCoder STHGOM, you simply need to be friendly but firm with folks 20:09 OldCoder And once you have op 20:09 STHGOM ok 20:09 OldCoder You can't compete with them 20:09 OldCoder Would not be fair 20:09 STHGOM compete? 20:09 OldCoder In the game 20:09 Jordach like building etc 20:09 OldCoder Can't take advantage 20:09 OldCoder Just giving your friends stuff etc. 20:10 STHGOM ok 20:10 STHGOM got it 20:10 OldCoder Allow a few minutes 20:10 OldCoder Is your nick STHGOM in the game? 20:10 STHGOM nope its sparky 20:10 OldCoder Lower case? 20:10 jin_xi ok, pushed 20:11 STHGOM yes 20:12 Octupus i got nothing to do :( 20:12 markveidemanis come on my server 20:12 NekoGloop Fetch 20:16 ecube i love polypi 20:17 ShadowNinja jin_xi: use minetest.formspec_escape(string) 20:17 Octupus hi ecube havent seen you in awhile 20:17 ecube hi Octupus 20:17 ecube and yes you have, I always idle on this chan 20:17 STHGOM what is admin_irc? 20:17 jin_xi ShadowNinja: yeah, will do 20:17 ecube STHGOM: I believe it will let you perform commands from IRC 20:17 Octupus i wonder where lad is 20:17 STHGOM oky 20:18 ecube but you need to auth with it and everything, so it should be secure (to a degree) 20:34 markveidemanis come on minetest.org:30010 20:34 STHGOM why? 20:35 markveidemanis PARTY 20:35 markveidemanis Everyone is invited 20:35 markveidemanis except you, ChanServ 20:38 STHGOM what about minetestbot? 20:38 markveidemanis He is Invited Too 20:38 STHGOM is there cake at the party? 20:39 markveidemanis might be if i can find it in creative 20:39 STHGOM :D 20:39 STHGOM ok i will join 20:39 markveidemanis will nyancake do? 20:39 markveidemanis pumpkin? 20:40 markveidemanis skycity or skytown platform 20:45 NekoGloop Make a cake out of wool 20:47 Uberi the Mesecons Laboratory is up and running! http://uberi.mesecons.net/ 20:48 ShadowNinja Advice: Don't try to power a 16x16x16 area of mese blocks with mesecons 20:49 ShadowNinja Speaking of mesecons, the luacontroller needs to use minetest.formspec_escape(string) on code and errmsg 20:50 ShadowNinja Uberi: ^ 20:51 Uberi I know ShadowNinja, I already made the change 20:51 Uberi but I can't commit it until more people are using a version that has it 20:55 Jordach commit it anyway 20:56 Jordach people dont need to be spoonfed on updating mods 20:56 Jordach silent updates happen too# 20:56 Uberi it's not even in a stable release yet 20:56 Uberi most people don't want to compile their own minetest 20:57 ShadowNinja do something like if not minetest.formspec_escape then minetest.formspec_escape = function(s) return end end 20:57 ShadowNinja er return s 20:58 ShadowNinja or do the [ to ( conversion 20:58 * khonkhortisan put an "include guard" on a class defined in two headers 20:59 Uberi hmm, but there's no point since the engine still doesn't support escaped values 20:59 Uberi if you write code with [ or ] in it, it still ruins the luacontroller 21:00 ShadowNinja just convert [ to (, like it does now 21:00 ShadowNinja same for ] 21:01 Uberi wait, did I already commit that? 21:01 Uberi lemme check 21:01 Kacey hi all 21:02 Uberi hey Kacey 21:02 ShadowNinja hi Kacey 21:03 Kacey wait till you guys see what i made 21:03 Uberi huh, I forgot to commit the part that changes [ to ( and ] to ) 21:03 markveidemanis Hi Kacey 21:03 Uberi one moment I will do it now 21:03 markveidemanis Come to my server, party preperations :D 21:04 Kacey http://ompldr.org/vaHJxeQ/screenshot_116413015.png 21:04 Kacey 4 bit decoder to 7 segment display 21:05 Uberi nice one Kacey 21:05 Uberi how big is it? 21:06 Kacey all luacontrollers 21:06 Kacey no idea 21:06 Kacey i will measure later 21:06 Uberi mine is 5x6x7 IIRC 21:06 STHGOM Uberi: you like mesecons? 21:06 Kacey cnote's was small but you need space between luacontrollers to update them (thanks to ShadowNinja for finding that out) 21:07 Uberi STHGOM: you could say that :P 21:07 STHGOM haha 21:07 Octupus Hi Kacey 21:07 STHGOM i made a bot, would you like to see it? 21:07 Kacey hi Octupus 21:08 Uberi sure thing! 21:08 Uberi you should also check out the new Mesecons site I made today, uberi.mesecons.net 21:08 Kacey sure 21:09 Uberi ShadowNinja: https://github.com/Jeija/minetest-mod-mesecons/commit/e1211729ccea38a2ef5a77c544ae122ff40db14a 21:09 STHGOM i saw it 21:09 STHGOM so would you like a world? 21:09 STHGOM or a pic? 21:09 Uberi both, preferably :) 21:10 STHGOM heehee 21:10 STHGOM what mods do you have? 21:10 Uberi Mesecons, Worldedit, InvPlus in my standard game 21:10 Kacey Uberi, uberi.mesecons.net should be like a forum or multi-person blog 21:11 Uberi Kacey: yeah, but I dunno how to set that up 21:11 Kacey google it 21:11 Uberi I'm just writing the HTML and JS directly 21:11 Kacey aah 21:11 STHGOM i will use justbamit.com 21:12 STHGOM justbeamit.com 21:12 STHGOM ok? 21:12 Uberi ooh, neat service 21:12 Uberi sure thing go ahead 21:12 STHGOM http://www.justbeamit.com/xtze9 21:13 Kacey i know how you could set it up Uberi 21:14 Uberi STHGOM: er, I think something went wrong :/ 21:14 Kacey use PunBB and lock everything so that only a few people can post new topics, like privs 21:14 STHGOM http://www.justbeamit.com/cvrru 21:15 Uberi Kacey: nah, punbb templates aren't flexible enough for the kind of thing I'm planning to have it be 21:15 Uberi maybe some sort of blogging software though 21:15 BrandonReese Uberi, have you worked with Wordpress before? 21:16 Uberi not very much at all, BrandonReese 21:17 ShadowNinja Uberi: it is still commented out, let me show you what I want 21:17 Uberi ShadowNinja: no no, I know what you mean 21:17 Uberi I'll change it 21:18 BrandonReese Uberi: It's easy to setup, requires PHP and MySQL but that's pretty standard. They have thousands of free templates. 21:18 Kacey wish i could use xor in luacontrollers 21:19 Uberi BrandonReese: I wrote my own style this morning though, so not sure about that 21:19 Uberi Kacey: port.a = pin.b ~= pin.c 21:19 Kacey ? 21:19 Uberi XOR is true when inputs differ 21:20 Kacey what does ~ mean in lua? 21:20 Uberi therefore, pin.b ~= pin.c is pin.b XOR pin.c 21:20 Uberi Kacey: ~= is the NOTEQUALS operator 21:21 Kacey huh 21:21 Kacey ooh well the way i am using them, xor will not be needed 21:21 Uberi anyways, if you need it that's how you do XOR 21:21 ShadowNinja Uberi: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/5617714/ 21:22 STHGOM waitwaitwait 21:22 BrandonReese Uberi: If you're comfortable writing your own html/css then the only thing you'll probably gain from wordpress or any blog/cms is it helping you organize your posts 21:22 Uberi step ahead of you, ShadowNinja: https://github.com/Jeija/minetest-mod-mesecons/commit/5fd1cf5c806352b65892d0354e7f1da9be4af59d :P 21:22 STHGOM http://www.justbeamit.com/5pijj 21:22 Uberi STHGOM: it still says download is starting 21:23 ShadowNinja my code is a lot shorter and cleaner 21:24 Uberi yes, but it breaks future checks for the availability of formspec_escape 21:24 Uberi for instance, if a mod is loaded later, it has no way of knowing that it wasn't the real thing 21:25 ShadowNinja good point 21:26 Uberi anyways I didn't test it since I'm on a 0.4.5 server right now, so see how it goes 21:28 Uberi STHGOM: man this is pretty slow, how about ompldr.org? 21:32 Jordach Uberi, wordpress would have been good for this type of thing 21:33 Uberi Jordach: maybe, but it works doesn't it? 21:33 Jordach (and not hard to conver either.) 21:33 Uberi if it ain't broke, don't fix it :P 21:33 Uberi STHGOM: 1.8kb/s... 21:34 Uberi might as well send the file via smoke signals 21:34 STHGOM ihaha 21:34 STHGOM just keep on doing it 21:35 Uberi make that 1.2 kb/s 21:36 Jordach Uberi, i get better speed on my torrents 21:36 Jordach (2kb/s) 21:37 Uberi :O 21:37 Uberi that's like carrier-pidgeon grade speeds right there 21:38 Jordach Uberi, http://www.zimagez.com/zimage/screenshot-150313-213748.php 21:38 Jordach i might as well as decode the torrent with a British Colossus 21:39 Uberi heheheh 21:39 Jordach challenge 21:39 Uberi accepted 21:39 Jordach MAKE A COLOSSUS WITH MESECONS 21:39 Uberi :O 21:39 Uberi I wonder if the designs were ever declassified 21:40 Jordach Uberi, there is one on display in the same park as they were operated 21:40 Jordach (a completely rebuilt one) 21:40 Jordach yes, i do belive their design is public domain 21:41 Jordach http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colossus_computer#Reconstruction 21:42 Uberi mmm, probably doable with one or two luacontrollers 21:42 Jordach Uberi, nope. youre doing this with wires 21:42 Uberi :O 21:43 Jordach Uberi, go and use microcontrollers 21:43 Jordach because Lua is cheating 21:43 Uberi no way I'm using ucs again 21:43 Jordach theyre much better 21:43 STHGOM is it possibe to make a micro-mesecons? 21:43 Uberi that's just painful now in comparison with luacs 21:43 Uberi STHGOM: hmm? 21:44 Uberi 0.9kb/s btw, STHGOM 21:44 STHGOM mesecons that are 1/4th there normal size? 21:44 Uberi nope, not practical at the moment 21:44 ShadowNinja Uberi: [string "t={\[1\]={"test"}}..."]:1: unexpected symbol near '\' 21:44 ShadowNinja you are escaping it too soon 21:45 Uberi hmm? will investigate 21:46 Uberi oh I see the problem 21:46 ShadowNinja I had this issue, you have to set the code meta first 21:46 Uberi yeah I am pushing right now 21:47 Uberi https://github.com/Jeija/minetest-mod-mesecons/commit/3c3e45c7ea9fff498274104de7e2cc934c493e5c 21:47 Uberi STHGOM: it's at 0.8kb/s and falling, I think it's stopped 21:48 Uberi STHGOM: how about rghost.net instead? 21:48 STHGOM what do you suggest? 21:48 Uberi it should be a lot faster that way 21:49 STHGOM i have bad internet 21:50 Uberi does rghost work? 21:50 STHGOM haha, i quit online minetest and it goes fast 21:50 STHGOM justbeamit 21:51 Uberi huh, it's completely stopped on my end 21:51 Uberi says the download was cancelled 21:51 STHGOM hmm... 21:51 STHGOM 75%? 21:52 STHGOM 76%? 21:53 Uberi nothing here :/ 21:54 STHGOM hmm 21:54 STHGOM 78% 21:54 Uberi the downloaded file itself isn't here either 21:55 ShadowNinja Uberi: annother feature request, have luacontrollers turn into an inactive state instead of burning out and loosing all of the code on them 21:55 ShadowNinja and give them an owner 21:55 Uberi inactive state? can do 21:55 Uberi owner? not sure what you mean 21:56 ShadowNinja like locked signs 21:56 Uberi I'll see if I can apply it to microcontrollers too 21:56 Uberi ShadowNinja: what for? 21:57 ShadowNinja so that greifers can't tamper with your code 21:57 Uberi hmm, you should keep them in a room made out of locked chests 21:58 Uberi I don't think the locked luac fits with the general theme of Mesecons 21:58 ShadowNinja a fly hack requires changing one line of code, and there is lag... 21:58 Uberi since the griefers can also just place/dig random wires in your circuit as well 21:58 ShadowNinja but a protection mod can stop that 21:59 Uberi ShadowNinja: the protection mod doesn't work on modifying metadata? 21:59 ShadowNinja can a mod catch all formspec sends and see what node they are from? 21:59 Uberi yeah 21:59 STHGOM ok i did gohst 21:59 Uberi got a link STHGOM? 21:59 STHGOM no 22:00 STHGOM im not sure how it works 22:00 Uberi you copy the link in your address bar, like rghost.net/2375478348943, and paste it here 22:01 Uberi ShadowNinja: if you ask me, it's more of a concern for the protection mod to handle 22:01 Uberi a mod is more than capable of detecting and blocking that 22:02 ShadowNinja I shall see... 22:02 Uberi but the real problem is the fly hack 22:02 Uberi how does it work? I am going to see if it is fixable by a mod 22:03 ShadowNinja how do I catch all formspec sends? 22:03 ShadowNinja no, it is far from fixable 22:03 ShadowNinja the most you can do is make it harder to do 22:03 Uberi hold on lemme search lua API 22:03 ShadowNinja and it is client-side, mods are only server-side 22:04 Uberi ShadowNinja: but how does it work? 22:04 Uberi perhaps it is possible to check if the player's feet are on the ground 22:05 Uberi and trace movement to check for passing through walls 22:05 PilzAdam bye 22:05 Uberi o/ 22:05 Uberi ShadowNinja: basically, you will need to override all on_receive_field properties in all registered nodes to check for protection 22:06 ShadowNinja it works by removing the if m_gamedef->checkLocalPrivilege("fly") 22:06 ShadowNinja would register_on_player_receive_fields work? 22:06 ShadowNinja ah, I think so If function returns true, remaining functions are not called 22:06 Uberi I dunno, I considered it but it might only be for the player's inventory 22:08 ShadowNinja hmm, any get formspec position function? 22:09 Uberi formspec position? like on the screen? 22:09 Uberi centerofscreen - formspeccenter 22:09 Uberi (top left corner) 22:10 ShadowNinja no, as in if it was a formspec attached to a node like a chest the nodes positon 22:10 Uberi so given a formspec string, you want the location where it was used? 22:11 Uberi that doesn't work because multiple nodes may have the same formspec string 22:11 ShadowNinja I get something called formname, I think that has to be unique 22:11 Uberi yeah 22:12 ShadowNinja that all got changed recently to allow detached formspecs 22:12 Uberi the identifiers are all still unique though 22:13 ShadowNinja hmm, wont help: should follow "modname:" naming convention 22:13 ShadowNinja feature request! 22:13 ShadowNinja until then I don't think it is possible 22:14 Uberi what, what's wrong with it? 22:14 ShadowNinja at least not in a way that isn't extremely hacky 22:14 ShadowNinja I need the position of a formspec if it has one 22:15 Kacey !up menche.servegame.com 22:15 * ShadowNinja starts looking up the c++ side of formspecs 22:16 Kacey Minetestbot is mia again 22:16 Uberi ShadowNinja: but the identifier for a node formspec IS the position! 22:16 ShadowNinja oh! 22:17 Uberi well, actually the metaref 22:17 Uberi but if you have the metaref, most of the time you got it from a position 22:18 ShadowNinja wait, so it is a reference to the node meta? 22:18 ShadowNinja like from get_meta(pos) (or something like that) 22:19 khonkhortisan !exec(MinetestBot & echo <>) 22:19 Uberi no no, the formspec string is set using metaref:set_string("formspec", "...") 22:19 Uberi it's associated with the metaref, is what I'm saying 22:20 Kacey back 22:20 Uberi o/ 22:20 ShadowNinja yes, but I need to get position in register_on_player_recive_fields 22:20 Uberi oh I get it now 22:20 Uberi hold on lemme check 22:21 Uberi yeah it only works for player forms 22:21 Uberi not for node formspecs 22:21 * ShadowNinja wishes github had a commit search function 22:22 ShadowNinja I think I will have to code it myself 22:22 Uberi ShadowNinja: use lua to override on_receive_fields when it's not nil 22:22 Uberi in all registered nodes 22:22 Uberi cornernote gave an example of overriding nodes a long time ago 22:23 ShadowNinja That is hacky 22:24 Uberi it is, but it works :) 22:24 BrandonReese all of the good stuff is hacky 22:25 khonkhortisan The right way to override a node is to get the previous node definition and only override the settings you actually need to change 22:44 * Kacey is going to finish his project 22:57 WiredOnLinux VanessaE 22:58 WiredOnLinux does your minetest server have to run on port 30000 for it to be on the public list? 22:59 khonkhortisan the answer should be no. If it is yes, someone has to fix it. 23:00 Kacey uuum... 23:01 Kacey why are signs not infinite when the signs mod is installed? 23:02 khonkhortisan stack_max? 23:02 Kacey idk 23:02 Kacey something is up though 23:04 khonkhortisan neither has stack_max, signs mod removes the attached_node group 23:05 khonkhortisan it looks like I can't forward declare two classes on the same line 23:06 Kacey they aren't infinite though 23:13 Kacey afk 23:31 NakedFury hello 23:46 ShadowNinja Uberi: ServerError: LuaError: error running function 'on_step': ...bin/../mods/minetest/mesecons/mesecons_mvps/init.lua:36: attempt to compare nil with number 23:46 Uberi one moment ShadowNinja 23:46 ShadowNinja on using a movestone on my server 23:47 Uberi hmm, maximum seems to be nil 23:47 Uberi can you check your settings.lua? 23:48 Uberi does it have MOVESTONE_MAXIMUM_PUSH defined? 23:48 ShadowNinja I use vanila git 23:48 Uberi it's in mesecons/settings.lua 23:48 Uberi aw no what happened to it 23:48 ShadowNinja and no 23:48 Uberi oh, there's the problem 23:49 Uberi I changed it in my Minetest copy but not in the actual repo 23:49 Uberi lemme just do a dirdiff to catch anything else I might've missed 23:49 ShadowNinja Annother thing... 23:51 Uberi yep that was the only thing missing 23:53 Uberi https://github.com/Jeija/minetest-mod-mesecons/commit/5f9e655c13e7ce0946845646e9a6f11cba853bbe 23:56 ShadowNinja This doesn't work, it seems the problem is with sending two digiline signals: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/5618022/ 23:57 Uberi yeah I ran into the issue yesterday with my tic tac toe display 23:57 Uberi the problem is the second time the code runs, the first is interrupted 23:58 khonkhortisan why use interrupts? 23:58 ShadowNinja do you know how to fix it? 23:58 khonkhortisan for loops? 23:58 Uberi ShadowNinja: I don't have push access to the digiline repo 23:58 ShadowNinja only way to make it run more than once other than a mesecon timer 23:58 Uberi khonkhortisan: yes, all loops are forbidden in luacs 23:59 ShadowNinja well do you know how to fix it? 23:59 Uberi but I will take a look and see if I can find the problem