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IRC log for #minetest-hub, 2018-06-06

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:44 tumeninodes ok well. I would like to mention, the ubuntu/mint ppa update for 0.4.17 is messed up, and is going to, and has probably already impacted a lot of end users.
00:45 tumeninodes not sure if it is est31 who should look at it (I know they are not as active now) but their name is attached to those updates. I'm just letting people know
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09:04 rubenwardy Would anyone like to be an editor on CDB? You'll be able to create and maintain packages on behalf of other users, and also be responsible for approving things
09:05 rubenwardy No time commitment
09:07 rubenwardy Also, there's 198 packages currenrly
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09:19 IhrFussel Can you set the rightclick repeat to as LOW as you want potentially making a server lag more?
09:20 IhrFussel I sure hope the engine has some check and a minimum time interval or else RIP
09:22 ANAND IhrFussel, there's no such limitation
09:24 IhrFussel Are the devs crazy? I just had a player who reportedly set that value to something very low and I NOTICED
09:24 ANAND How low exactly? :D
09:25 IhrFussel Combined with the fact that you can stack infinite flowers without having to change the position
09:26 IhrFussel I don't know how low but the max_lag spiked for a short amount of time so the most logical explanation would be the low value for the clicking
09:26 ANAND Hmm... quite possible
09:26 IhrFussel Also topic cheating: Setting it to VERY LOW does definitely allow unfair behavior
09:26 IhrFussel Devs supporting cheating on servers?
09:27 ANAND Unfair behaviour <- agreed
09:27 IhrFussel AFAIK you can set both intervals...left and rightclick
09:27 IhrFussel RIP PvP servers
09:27 ANAND Not left-click
09:28 IhrFussel Are you sure?
09:28 ANAND thankfully!
09:28 ANAND Yes
09:28 IhrFussel Someone mentioned that in an issue once
09:28 IhrFussel Maybe the PvP server used right click for punching or some tool that activates on right click
09:28 ANAND About the right-click repetition interval, #7089
09:28 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/7089 -- 'Right-click repetition interval' should be a server-side setting
09:28 IhrFussel The devs shot that down
09:29 ANAND yea :/
09:29 IhrFussel Maybe not server side per-se but the engine should have a hard coded limit SERVER SIDE
09:29 IhrFussel Ignore the client
09:29 ANAND Yes
09:30 ANAND Even better
09:30 IhrFussel The engine should calculate the time between 2 right clicks from the same player and ignore if it's less than 0.X secs
09:31 IhrFussel And maybe make that setting adjustable
09:31 ANAND Agreed
09:33 IhrFussel Also: Not sure if it's already possible but the engine should know the difference between single right click and holding the mouse button down
09:34 IhrFussel It's just bad design if a client can make the server lag with INTENDED behavior
09:37 rubenwardy Finally have a desktop at work
09:37 rubenwardy Compiling big things so need a 40 core 64GB ram machine
09:37 rubenwardy Also have an issued laptop, i7 (quad core @ 4.3GHz)
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09:43 ANAND oh nice! :)
09:45 rubenwardy Htop is now sexy asf
09:45 ANAND Htop??
09:46 nerzhul the linux to is shit
09:46 nerzhul top
09:46 nerzhul the BSD top is nice, but htop is the only top which make linux top clear
09:47 ANAND oh nice
09:47 IhrFussel 2 devs read what I said and NONE of them even reply to it...I guess that means it's time to open an issue to get more attention
09:49 rubenwardy I actually skipped it
09:49 rubenwardy Lololol
09:49 rubenwardy :P
09:49 ANAND haha
09:57 IhrFussel https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/7418 << if devs ignore this it'll make the whole "what is cheating /hacking" responses by them laughable
10:00 rubenwardy :P
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10:13 Calinou <IhrFussel> The engine should calculate the time between 2 right clicks from the same player and ignore if it's less than 0.X secs
10:13 Calinou problem is, lag spikes can cause two (or more) right clicks to be sent at the same time
10:14 Calinou a more proper way to fix this is adding a client-side minimal value, people can edit it out but it's a start
10:14 IhrFussel Calinou, then the engine should additionally keep track of the dtime
10:14 Calinou doing it server-side isn't reliable due to Minetest's networking :/
10:15 Calinou >Also, setting this very low allows unfair behavior (cheating) since most other players likely don't even know about this setting or cannot set it because their mobile app doesn't contain this setting.
10:16 Calinou I do not consider configuration tweaks to be cheating though
10:16 Calinou I'm not a cheater if I set hardware gamma to 3.0 :-)
10:16 IhrFussel If these configuration tweaks allow behavior that the server owner doesn't want then it IS cheating IMO
10:16 ANAND Mine's 3.5 :D
10:16 ANAND Hmm, you have a point
10:17 IhrFussel The gamma setting could be cheating too on some very specific servers... we are talking about the ability to make server LAG here though
10:18 IhrFussel The gamma setting cannot spam the server with actions
10:18 IhrFussel I will test it now...will set the repeated rightclick to 0.05 (if possible) and watch my max_lag
10:19 ANAND I've tried 0.01 once, it was unplayable
10:19 ANAND In the sense that it took me 5 minutes to get a door to open
10:22 ANAND not to mention, it lagged so badly that the blocks I placed kept vanishing
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10:24 ANAND apparently the server did not register the new blocks, probably they're placed almost simultaneously by the same player
10:33 IhrFussel Ok well the good news is that setting it to 0.01 seconds doesn't seem to increase max_lag by ITSELF ... it can of course still increase the load on a server with already higher regular lags
10:34 IhrFussel And the load it causes depends on the CPU too...not every server owner got a Intel Xeon
10:35 IhrFussel Or better since Xeon isn't that new anymore (2016 I think)
10:40 * rubenwardy is using a Xeon right now
10:40 rubenwardy Sooo good
10:40 ANAND :D
10:40 rubenwardy Kinda want to compile Mt on it
10:40 ANAND IhrFussel, new SKUs of Xeon are still being released afaik
10:41 ANAND Also, CPUs just need to be powerful, new or old doesn't matter when you're talking about 24 hyper-threaded cores running at 2.8 GHz :)
10:43 ANAND New or old does matter however, when the CPU in question is an outlawed dual-core Pentium running at 2.99 GHz (like mine ._.)
10:45 IhrFussel ANAND, only singlecore performance is important for MT yes... and usually newer CPUs also have more efficient tech to allow more power per core
10:46 ANAND Oops! of course... >.<
10:46 ANAND Forgot that Minetest still runs on one core only...
10:47 IhrFussel I don't have the Xeon for myself only of course (I couldn't afford a 1,500$+ CPU) ... but I have guaranteed cores that are not used by others (well almost never used by others)
10:49 IhrFussel Before I ran my server on a AMD Opteron from 2010 ... same world, same mods ... max_lag always 1.5 secs or higher
10:52 ANAND Ouch...
11:13 Calinou Xeons aren't necessarily fast
11:13 Calinou some are 8-year old and still used in production VPSes
11:13 Calinou some only have 4 cores or possibly even 2
11:14 Calinou some of them are rebranded i7 CPUs with the IGP disabled too :)
11:14 Calinou (it was a trick to get a cheap i7-3770 a while ago)
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11:18 ANAND Ha lol :P
11:23 Krock rubenwardy, what's to do for the package maintenance? Would be kinda interested
11:24 Krock IhrFussel, the difference between the new rightclick issue and the old is that the server will not tell the client what to use - it just prevents abuse/flood
11:26 IhrFussel Krock, because the "server decides it" idea was shot down by the devs ... maybe my approach makes more sense
11:27 Krock you can clearly see how my opinion differs in these two cases :3
11:27 ANAND :_(
11:30 IhrFussel As long as rightclick flooding becomes impossible I don't mind the exact implementation, but it should be backported to 0.4.X for sure
11:35 Krock IhrFussel, is the disappearing car bug fixed yet?
11:51 rubenwardy Minetest takes 30 seconds to compile from scratch on 40 cores
11:52 Krock Factsthatmakeyoujealous.png
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11:52 Krock possibly not using HDDs to get these speeds
11:53 rubenwardy RAID
11:53 Krock RAID SSD $.$
11:55 * Krock sees VanessaE being busy with importing repos & updating posts
11:55 VanessaE yup.
11:56 * rubenwardy wishes she'd update cdb too
11:56 * rubenwardy needs to make some gitlab repos public
11:56 VanessaE someone else can do that after I'm done.
11:56 rubenwardy Same repo name?
11:56 rubenwardy Could write some SQL to do it
11:56 VanessaE generally yeah
11:57 VanessaE should be little more than s::: to update.
12:02 Calinou rubenwardy: try -j50 or -j60 too
12:02 Calinou (more threads than CPU threads)
12:02 rubenwardy Right
12:02 rubenwardy Will do
12:02 Calinou it can be minutely faster
12:02 Calinou (try 125%, 150% or even 200% of CPU threads)
12:02 rubenwardy Once I've finished compiling LLVM, Linux kernel, and Android
12:03 ANAND Xeon is hyper-threaded, that's 80 logical cores
12:04 Krock what a beast of computer
12:05 ANAND Lucky chap :P
12:05 rubenwardy Don't get to keep it, unfortunately
12:05 rubenwardy Or my laptop
12:05 rubenwardy :D
12:05 VanessaE tell the boss it got stolen :P
12:05 ANAND XD
12:06 rubenwardy Technically not lying
12:08 VanessaE heh
12:28 IhrFussel Krock, nope still happens an not sure how to fix it...or maybe it's a bug in the network code
12:28 IhrFussel and*
12:31 IhrFussel I also don't know when it started happening...could be since I updated to 0.4.17-dev (Dec 4)
12:33 rubenwardy 30 seconds again with -j80
12:34 ANAND Overclock your CPU then 8)
12:38 Fixer Hey, little drums!
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13:02 VanessaE rubenwardy: done.
13:02 VanessaE all my repos have been moved and relevant forum topics updated.
13:04 VanessaE (the "fun" part is gonna be 50 bazillion "git remote set-url" commands to update my local copies :P )
13:06 Krock ./my_powerful_script.sh
13:09 VanessaE heh
13:09 VanessaE too lazy to script it
13:09 VanessaE besides, the important part's done, I can just deal with my local copies as needed.
13:14 lisac https://gitea.io/en-US/
13:14 Fixer We are the Procrastinator generation!
13:14 Fixer lisac: get over it
13:14 Fixer .____.
13:14 * lisac hates MS
13:14 Fixer nobody going to move unless MS starts doing bad stuff
13:15 lisac http://irc.minetest.net/minetest-hub/2018-06-03#i_5320236
13:16 VanessaE Fixer: s/nobody/people are/; s/unless/when/
13:16 VanessaE you know perfectly well MS WILL start doing bad stuff, and shittons of people have already moved.
13:17 VanessaE (gitlab's traffic jumped 300x)
13:17 VanessaE the traffic got so high at one point that gitHUB started to struggle.
13:22 lisac and besides, theres really nothing keeping us on GitHub except habbit
13:22 lisac *habit
13:22 VanessaE yup
13:22 lisac it really has no unique features we need
13:23 Fixer VanessaE: if that happens, then yes
13:24 VanessaE there's no "if", Fixer.
13:24 VanessaE it WILl happen.
13:25 Fixer VanessaE: it will be evident, no need to move now
13:25 VanessaE perhaps, perhaps not, but better to move before MS locks you out.
13:26 Fixer how they lock out our code?
13:26 VanessaE you know one of the things they'll be just ITCHING to do is require a Windows Live or some other MS-only scheme for website lofin
13:26 VanessaE login*
13:27 rdococ Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't GitHub proprietary anyway?
13:27 VanessaE and they could block anonymous git access too if they wanted (limiting such to only logged-in-with-Win-Live accounts)
13:27 Fixer VanessaE: you can still login in skype via live or via original acc iirc
13:27 Fixer i guess the same will be true for GH
13:27 VanessaE Fixer: you're missing the point
13:27 Krock rdococ, independent proprietary is still better than owner by some large company
13:27 Krock s/ner/ned/
13:27 Fixer VanessaE: they can, but they don't do it yet
13:28 Fixer gitlab is private entity as well and can be aquaired by any shitcorp like Google or so
13:28 rdococ Krock: True, but regardless, my point is even if MS does nothing wrong that we should migrate.
13:28 VanessaE better google than MS, Fixer .
13:28 Fixer acquaired*
13:29 rdococ Fixer: Which is why I advocated migration to notabug.org
13:31 VanessaE point is, get out now, while you still have control.
13:31 VanessaE leaving nothing behind but an empty shell of an account.
13:31 lisac what about self hosting?
13:31 lisac something like git.minetest.net?
13:31 rdococ ^
13:31 Fixer VanessaE: you will loose userbase
13:32 VanessaE More for devs to maintain.
13:32 VanessaE no, better to let someone else handle that.
13:32 Fixer VanessaE: i mean all those github people will need to god damn register on yet another service to commit to this game
13:32 lisac Fixer: most of minetest userbase is downloading from official site, not compiling from Github
13:32 lisac or Play store, I guess
13:32 VanessaE Fixer: oh cry me a river :-/
13:32 rdococ Fixer: What...
13:33 Krock Atlantic ocean crying.. anyone?
13:33 Fixer the fact that everyone is on github helps, I don't to spend with that bullshit registration on every shitzilla just to post 1 fucking bug
13:33 rdococ That's... it takes *sooo* much effort to register for gitlab
13:33 Fixer don't want to spend*
13:33 Fixer time**
13:33 rdococ Ugh, how I hate typing things into a few text boxes
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13:33 rdococ even though I type in IRC all the time
13:33 VanessaE 5 minutes of time and one new line in your passwords file.  come on man
13:33 Fixer i fed up with this shit
13:33 Shara There are people who genuinely will refuse to contribute if it means registering somewhere new.
13:33 Shara We've had people refuse to join github too.
13:34 Fixer every bitch wants me to register to his shit, fuck them
13:34 VanessaE Shara: and nothing of value was lost
13:34 ANAND Calm down please :)
13:34 rdococ Oof...
13:34 Fixer do a proper internet-wide trustable auth thing
13:34 Shara VanessaE: actually you can't know, but on github, probably not, since most people join it
13:34 VanessaE Fixer: you DO realize you can still clone anonymously, right?
13:34 Shara If moving to something more obscure... odds of losing real contributors do increase
13:35 Fixer but I still need to register to post a bugreport
13:35 rdococ For fucks sake, just register...
13:35 Fixer and some people use stuff like bugzilla, jira, mantis, sourceforge insane thing, need to register on all of them and navigate their criptic UIs
13:35 VanessaE Fixer:  in the time you've spent bitching about it, you could have registered already
13:35 Shara Most regular contributors will, but you can easily lose those who would have made one of contributions... (and some of those would become regulars in time)
13:35 rdococ Fixer: Gitlab does not have a cryptic UI...
13:36 VanessaE besides, I think gitlab lets you register via your github account
13:36 Fixer now, that is interesting option
13:36 Shara I'm amused you tell Fixer to register and there is no official plan to move there yet :)
13:36 VanessaE not unlike registering on some random site via facebarf.
13:36 xerox123 > moving when there are no issues
13:36 xerox123 > wot
13:36 rdococ I deleted my facebarf account
13:37 Fixer or openttd, shit, I had to mail some dudes so they can register me in, that is insane
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13:37 Fixer hidden somewhere in deep state interwebs
13:37 rdococ Holy fucking shit, none of this shit applies to GitLab
13:37 lisac We could have mailing lists, that way people don't need a new account
13:37 rdococ I think Fixer is being satirical...
13:37 Fixer mailing lists need UI overhaul, they are super simple, I need more advanced UI
13:38 sniper338 joined #minetest-hub
13:38 rdococ Definitely satire...?
13:39 Fixer i don't use facebook, don't register via it
13:40 Fixer just tired, i don't want back to that time when every bitch wants me to register just to post a bug about spelling error
13:42 Fixer that is my rant for now
13:42 rdococ I tuned out when you said deep state
13:43 Fixer it is obscure meme from trump people
13:43 rdococ Yes, the trump people
13:44 Fixer it is also getting very annoying when some probably paid trolls insert Hillary related stuff on first comments on slashdot
13:48 lisac hmm...
13:48 lisac http://savannah.nongnu.org
13:48 Fixer rdococ: there is also a book called Deep State or smth, probably nice one for guys loving conspiracy
13:48 rubenwardy Ee
13:48 rubenwardy * ew
13:48 Fixer lisac: just no
13:48 Fixer their UI is disorienting me
13:49 lisac hmm there is a nice compass app you can find in the Play Store
13:49 Fixer it does the job, but on github it like super easy, and here I need to use my glasses and reread everything
13:49 lisac and this https://i.redd.it/bs18fsiary111.png
13:50 lisac lol https://johansen.software/github-xp/
13:50 Fixer lisac: possibly
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14:00 rdococ lisac: is that real?
14:01 lisac rdococ: which one?
14:01 rdococ the notification
14:02 lisac don't know, found it on reddit
14:03 rdococ speaking of reddit, https://www.reddit.com/r/ProgrammerHumor/comments/8oyndj/calm_down_microsoft_already_knows_enough_about_you/
14:06 Krock had like a zero less in the upvote count the last time
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14:07 rdococ I'd like to create a social networking site but I'd have no idea where to start
14:22 VanessaE 13
14:22 VanessaE oops
14:22 Krock sudo rm -rf /*
14:23 VanessaE heh
14:23 Krock sorry wrong window 8)
14:23 rdococ how would I get a website of the form rdococ.gitlab.io up and running?
14:23 Krock rdococ, create a gitlab repo like on github, I guess?
14:24 Krock using the website name, if gitlab offers that feature
14:25 VanessaE I think you want https://about.gitlab.com/features/pages/
14:26 rdococ I was just on that
14:26 rdococ I'm stuck at step 4
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14:42 nerzhul Krock: sudo dd if=/dev/random of=/dev/sda
14:43 Krock dd, the 2nd most dangerous command after rm
14:44 Krock why not /dev/urandom though?
14:44 nerzhul Krock yeah, urandom on linux else we will wait the rng too many
14:44 nerzhul dd is more dangerous as random users don't know the command and what is /dev/sda :D
14:45 nerzhul sudo find / -exec sed -i 's/.*//g' {} \;
14:45 nerzhul it's nice too :D
15:06 celeron55 dd is more dangerous because you practically never run it as non-root
15:08 xerox123 https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/PTn37qnWw3/
15:08 rdococ root is dangerous, only eat the stem
15:09 ANAND lol
15:11 xerox123 I keep getting that error (see pastebin)
15:12 * rdococ yays, and hugs xerox123
15:12 xerox123 homedecor moved to gitlab I see
15:13 rdococ I want to create a mod that adds a "totem of undying", except it would be crafted with fish and gold
15:14 * rdococ clones the minetest repo from gitlab~
15:14 BillyS Anyone have any idea what could be causing this funny glitch: https://imgur.com/a/EdSGTbl?
15:15 rdococ looks like a node being placed and removed in your head repeatedly?
15:16 ANAND What node tho?
15:16 rdococ although if that were the case it should be invisible...
15:16 ANAND probably looks like a mese lamp
15:18 xerox123 I see it behind me when I'm running forward using F7 too
15:18 BillyS rdococ, that was my thought too
15:18 BillyS But it doesn't hapen to me
15:18 BillyS *happen
15:19 rdococ suddenly, computer lag
15:20 BillyS Figured it out
15:20 xerox123 it was the goggle glass titanium on my hotbar
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15:21 rdococ o_O
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15:23 rdococ hi me
15:23 rdococ and hi my IP -_-
15:35 IhrFussel I don't get why many of you try to hide their IP...every website you visit will get it, every server you connect to will get it, lots of companies already got it (unless it's dynamic)
15:36 ANAND IhrFussel: on IRC?
15:36 IhrFussel Using a VPN would make more sense because people don't get the impression that you're trying to hide something and instead show a fake IP
15:38 IhrFussel Not just IRC...in general ... I don't get why it's so "bad" to show your IP publicly ... all it does it telling the estimated location and ISP
15:39 IhrFussel The location is mostly completely wrong and points to another city
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15:47 rdococ I know where they ays
15:49 rubenwardy IPs may be static, and you could be ddos
15:50 rubenwardy For anon people they may not want people to know their location
15:50 rubenwardy But don't mind service owners knowing it
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16:10 Fixer install ublock origin, privacy budger, maybe noscript if you a zealot, if you don't watch, their spying is useless, unless they sell you out in different way
16:22 IhrFussel I find this silly, the IP is nothing like your real name, phone number, address, or other private info ... I doubt that a DDos can affect a private connection behind a router
16:24 IhrFussel At least in Germany all private connections are behind a router which doesn't even let you connect from outside unless the person enables port forwarding
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16:31 Calinou IP-based location is not *that* accurate
16:31 Calinou also, the DDoS issue is only really problematic for streamers and the like
16:31 Calinou still, you should use SASL to connect :)
16:31 Calinou so that you're logged into NickServ before you're connected to the server
16:35 rdococ Has anyone else worked on a mod which allows you to enable and disable sets of privs at once?
16:41 benrob0329 rdococ: no, but I'd imagine you build a list of users who have a priv and remove the priv from them, then take that list and reapply it once enabled again
16:42 rdococ I'm working on a metapriv mod (by analogy with "metapackages" that only serve to add packages)
16:43 ANAND That's nice, good luck!
16:47 rdococ Trying to avoid unnecessary for loops
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16:52 rdococ success! I crashed minetest
16:53 rdococ are there still frequent crashes in the latest commit?
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17:00 tumeninodes has anyone, had the same issues I am having with the new ubuntu/mint ppa0 update for 0.4.17? it would be the 64bit xenial build
17:03 sofar VanessaE: I'm removing you from minetest-mods entirely, and restoring the mods you removed from the minetest-mods organization
17:03 sofar if you're willing to discuss this without doing vandalism and want to it over, I'm more than happy to listen
17:04 sofar but removing mods without discussion from minetest-mods is not the way to do this
17:04 IhrFussel rdococ, I think I saw such a mod in the forum...one sec
17:05 Krock rdococ, yet the source of these crashes is not entirely clear
17:07 rdococ My register_on_priv_grant callback doesn't seem to be called?
17:08 IhrFussel rdococ, sorry looks like I misremembered
17:09 Krock rdococ, are you using the most recent 0.5.0-dev version? (builtin inclusive)
17:10 rdococ Krock: I just compiled
17:10 ANAND joined #minetest-hub
17:10 Krock poke rubenwardy
17:10 xerox123 looks like the great fire of London is taking round 2, https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-44389565
17:15 rdococ hm, where is debug.txt?
17:15 tumeninodes left #minetest-hub
17:16 rdococ there seems to be an error in builtin/game/register.lua line 448
17:16 rdococ lines 447 and 448: if not def or not def["on_" .. method] or     not def[priv]["on_" .. method](name, caller) then  -- looks like def[priv] should just be def or vice versa
17:20 VanessaE sofar: er, no vandalism intended.... I just moved everything to gitlab
17:20 Krock rdococ, --> PR
17:20 sofar you deleted 15+ repos from minetest-mods, without even asking
17:20 sofar that is not acceptable
17:21 sofar I've restored them, at least the code
17:21 VanessaE *shrug* I told you ahead of time that I wanted them "returned"
17:21 Krock rubenwardy, is it normal for the CDB to timeout right now? importing a repo doesn't seem to work currently
17:21 sofar there is no *returning* from minetest-mods
17:21 sofar you left, the code stays
17:21 sofar feel free to work on gitlab
17:21 xerox123 can someone please help me with this? https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/X79VSbDMVF/
17:22 xerox123 only happened after I moved to 0.4.17
17:22 sofar feel free to clone everything and develop outside github
17:22 sofar but deleting repos from github? fuck that
17:22 sofar I was on vacation for 5+ days, you didn't discuss anything in detail
17:23 Krock xerox123, activate unifieddyes
17:23 Krock it's not a 0.4.17 fault
17:25 xerox123 oh. thanks :D
17:26 VanessaE like I said, vandalism was not my intent.
17:30 xerox123 that error now leads onto this one: https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/nzCKr9y26p/
17:30 Krock fix homedecor
17:32 Krock xerox123, changed due to bug #7044
17:32 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/7044 -- MetaDataRef:set_int does not check argument types
17:32 Krock change that to :set_string("key", "")
17:33 xerox123 ok
17:33 Shara sofar: why must mods be available there specifically? Why is it an issue so long as they are available?
17:34 xerox123 Krock: like this?                         this_spawner_meta:set_string("smoky", id)
17:34 xerox123 this_spawner_meta:set_string("sound", nil)
17:35 Krock xerox123, no, like :set_string("smoky", "")  and :set_string("sound", "")
17:35 Krock empty values are garbage and removed
17:35 rubenwardy Github redirects if you move away
17:35 rubenwardy Krock: ctrl-shift-r
17:35 xerox123 ok
17:35 Krock rubenwardy, question is when this happens - only for moving in GitHub or always
17:35 rubenwardy And for massive mods like dreambuilder it will timeout
17:35 rubenwardy Well yeah, sorry
17:36 rubenwardy When you move away within github
17:36 rubenwardy Not when you go to other sites
17:36 * Krock suggests to import the README in the CDB too
17:37 rubenwardy It has lots of additional information
17:37 rubenwardy Usually pointless
17:37 rubenwardy I'll end up having to delete most of it
17:39 Krock oh.
17:39 Krock I also noticed that the title for releases is now limited to 30 characters. noticed it after trying to submit one with 100 :3
17:45 VanessaE sofar: bottom line:  what you have there are, as far as I am concerned, just forks now - what I have on gitlab is upstream and is where all issues, PRs, etc. should be directed. I disagree with your having restored those mods, as I want nothing to do with github anymore, but whatever.
17:45 rdococ on_grant seems to be called regardless of whether the priv was already granted... hm
17:46 VanessaE xerox123: about that homedecor glitch, please file an issue about it on my repo.  I believe someone mentioned it before, also.
17:46 xerox123 github or gitlab?
17:46 VanessaE gitlab.
17:46 Jordach joined #minetest-hub
17:47 VanessaE https://gitlab.com/VanessaE/homedecor_modpack
17:47 VanessaE there we go
17:47 Krock xerox123, both places to ensure it's reported
17:47 VanessaE haven't committed the new URLs to memory yet.
17:47 xerox123 I'll see later, editing a video right now
17:47 VanessaE ok
17:48 Shara Isn't it against mt-mods own rules to have forks? :)
17:49 rubenwardy I don't think it's right to ban divorces
17:50 CWz_ Nice one
17:51 CWz_ VanessaE, are all your mods on gitlab now
17:51 VanessaE yes.
17:51 Krock texturepacks and modpacks too?
17:52 Krock (checklist)
17:52 VanessaE https://gitlab.com/users/VanessaE/projects
17:52 VanessaE everything I have control over.
17:52 VanessaE (that is, everything that I maintain)
17:52 Krock hmm.. NURBCBIGPBFMPUPUCSH
17:53 VanessaE ?
17:53 Krock the project icons. top to bottom
17:53 VanessaE oh heh
17:54 Krock would almost show "BIG... PUSH"
17:55 VanessaE the letters are obvious, but I wonder what the colors mean.
17:56 ANAND https://github.com/KaiGerdMueller/minetest-bot-collection
17:58 nerzhul ANAND: lol a shell script which exec a python script which exec a blob jar
17:58 ANAND Auto-click / auto-eat functionalities all-in-one mod :D
17:58 nerzhul jar can contain anything and is non traceable
17:58 nerzhul like stealike your all data
17:58 ANAND Quite likely
17:58 ANAND Considering the track-record of the author, I wouldn't be surprised...
18:01 rubenwardy What if MS bought github so that people would move to gitlab who use azure
18:01 rubenwardy And also move github to azure so more profit as well
18:02 longerstaff13 joined #minetest-hub
18:03 VanessaE rubenwardy: you just *know* they're gonna demand a Win Live account soon.
18:03 entuland__ joined #minetest-hub
18:03 ANAND That's clever, actually
18:08 IhrFussel Anyone here using the ambience mod by tenplus1 on their server(s) and also hearing random glass break sounds?
18:13 VanessaE maybe you keep walking over broken glass? :)
18:13 Krock my reaction to people asking when 0.5.0 will be out: http://krock-works.16mb.com/u/minetest_050_release_date.mp4
18:14 rdococ now I'm getting a cryptic error message related to minetest.chat_send_all
18:15 ANAND That's one function which just can't throw any errors even if you try to make it :P
18:15 rdococ I get a runtime error from a mod whose name is the empty string
18:15 rdococ And the error itself is literally just 'singleplayer'
18:15 rdococ I'd paste it if I knew where debug.txt was
18:16 ANAND linux?
18:16 rdococ (or where it went, I'm sure it was in the repo folder...)
18:16 rdococ xubuntu 18.04, iirc
18:16 rdococ Client: HexChat 2.14.1 • OS: Ubuntu "bionic" 18.04 • CPU: AMD A4-6210 APU with AMD Radeon R3 Graphics (1.16GHz) • Memory: Physical: 3.2 GiB Total (1.3 GiB Free) Swap: 2.0 GiB Total (1.8 GiB Free) • Storage: 0 bytes / 0 bytes (0 bytes Free) • Uptime: 6d 7h 28m 15s
18:16 rdococ it can't detect my storage
18:16 rdococ lol
18:16 ANAND Try /usr/share/minetest/bin
18:17 rdococ I installed with -drun_in_place
18:18 ANAND not in .minetest/bin ?
18:18 ANAND *minetest/bin
18:18 rdococ nope...
18:19 ANAND Check in ur /home
18:19 rdococ there's no debug.txt or minetest folder there
18:19 rdococ except for the one I made which has clones of the repo in it
18:20 Krock > I installed with -drun_in_place
18:20 Krock RUN_IN_PLACE does not need to be installed. run it directly
18:20 rdococ no, I compiled with that flag
18:21 Krock cd ./bin/ && ./minetest
18:21 ANAND Did you check in <install_dir>/bin? :P
18:21 IhrFussel My server is probably haunted
18:21 Krock IhrFussel, hire ghostbusters
18:21 rdococ ANAND: yes, Krock: you mean with terminal open?
18:21 IhrFussel Players report random glass-breaking sounds and random steel ladder sounds
18:22 Krock rdococ, either that or punch holes into the programming card to feed it to your computing machine
18:23 ANAND IhrFussel: ambience detects the players surroundings to play an appropriate sound. My guess is that one of your mods is messing with this behaviour
18:23 ANAND rdococ: Did you disable logging altogether, by chance?
18:23 rdococ 2018-06-06 19:23:05: ERROR[Main]: ServerError: AsyncErr: ServerThread::run Lua: Runtime error from mod '' in callback on_chat_message(): singleplayer
18:24 ANAND mod's code please :)
18:26 rdococ error occurs regardless of whether I have the debug chat messages or not...
18:27 rdococ looks like I fixed that
18:27 rdococ but the mod still doesn't seem to work, hm
18:29 rdococ what, set_player_privs just seems to refuse to work
18:31 rdococ can you not set player privs from on_grant?
18:32 rubenwardy Sounds like a bad idea
18:32 rubenwardy Infinite loop
18:32 rdococ only if a metapriv tries to grant itself
18:33 rdococ although you do make a good point, someone could rig a metapriv to grant itself recursively (either directly or non-directly)
18:34 rdococ ugh, segfault again
18:34 rdococ and my keys (E for inventory) don't save?
18:35 rdococ minetest 0.5.0: the bug releaseâ„¢ (jk, ik it's dev)
18:44 rdococ okay, now the privs keep being granted and revoked from me repeatedly for no reason like an infinite loop that smehow doesn't involve my code
18:51 rdococ looks like I fixed it, hooyay
19:16 garywhite joined #minetest-hub
19:24 tenplus1 joined #minetest-hub
19:24 MinetestBot tenplus1: Jun-04 20:14 UTC <paramat> i'm going to start kicking you instead of warning because you are repeatedly and conciously breaking channel rules, and are one of the worst offenders. refusing to use more than 1 channel is lazy, rude and inconsiderate, this is not your personal channel. sorry to have to discipline :)
19:25 tenplus1 hi folks
19:26 Krock joined #minetest-hub
19:26 tenplus1 hey Krock
19:26 Krock hi tenplus1
19:26 tenplus1 is anyone else having crashes with 0.4.17 on their servers ???
19:26 garywhite hello
19:26 tenplus1 hi gary
19:26 garywhite I keep getting timed out
19:27 tenplus1 damn, so 0.4.17 isnt the great bugfix we were hoping for
19:27 Krock tenplus1, Lua or C++ crash?
19:27 Krock report it
19:27 tumeninodes joined #minetest-hub
19:28 tenplus1 c++, and I did:  https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/7419
19:28 tumeninodes hi tenplus1
19:28 tumeninodes HAAAAAAAAA!!!
19:28 Fixer tenplus1: hi, please provide a backtrace of the crash
19:28 Fixer tenplus1: somewhere on PPA there are debug builds that you can run under gdb
19:29 Krock tenplus1, observed this bug too and didn't expect it to be present ni 0.4.17 too. https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commit/a1598e1b83e2#diff-4e3f0a64f234ea624dbf1b329eb56bd9R157
19:30 Krock caused by calling deprecated function in the Lua code directly without any callbacks
19:30 Krock Fixer, no need for a backtrace in this case
19:30 Fixer okay, nice
19:30 Fixer i hope that can be fixed and point release redone
19:30 sfan5 so why did nobody test backports before it was released?
19:31 tenplus1 hi tumeninodes
19:31 tenplus1 hey Fixer
19:31 Fixer i don't run servers :}
19:31 garywhite I thought you guys fixed the "up-arrow bug" from 0.4.16?
19:31 tenplus1 we need a dev that has a server to test these things on
19:31 Fixer sfan5: maybe minetest needs release candidates
19:32 tenplus1 also what deprecated function ? can it be fixed in lua or does it have to be c++
19:32 sfan5 tenplus1: we have one, he's called rubenwardy
19:32 tumeninodes sorry tenplus1, I see you're having a bad time. But I was over excited to beat you for once
19:32 rubenwardy lol
19:32 sfan5 Fixer: no, maybe server owners should actually participate in the dev process
19:32 sfan5 i thought this was why -hub existrs
19:32 tenplus1 lol tumeninodes, that's ok :)
19:32 sfan5 s/rs$/s/
19:32 tumeninodes there should just be a dedicated dev server for all devs to use to test with
19:33 tenplus1 we spend the evening updating xanadu to 0,4.17 only for this to crash and reset server on a loop... wasnt nice... had to return to 0.4.16
19:33 rubenwardy #dreambuilder      https://i.rubenwardy.com/EaXMu.png
19:33 Fixer sfan5: releasing RC and pushing it to people for few weeks is better IMO, people are scared to run git versions I guess
19:33 sfan5 yes we should have done that
19:33 Krock even with more weeks of testing/freezing phase this hadn't changed anything since the server owners rely on stable releases
19:35 tumeninodes funny thing about bugs..., they multiply
19:35 Krock rubenwardy, time for a megaworld modpack which at least includes dreambuilder and the top 100 mods used on servers
19:35 garywhite 2 questions, 1. I have to report the up-arrow bug again, I take it that should be filed under the program and not mt_game? and 2. It's still on GitHub, right?
19:35 tenplus1 this is why binary builds would have been a great idea for testing rather than hoping ppl wouldb compile it themselves
19:36 longerstaff13 garywhite: Microsoft bis acquiring github
19:36 longerstaff13 is*
19:36 garywhite I know
19:36 sfan5 tenplus1: you host on windows, right?
19:36 tenplus1 hell no...  xubuntu 17.10
19:36 sfan5 hmm
19:36 tenplus1 will update to 18.04 soon tho
19:36 longerstaff13 lol
19:37 sfan5 i remember one popular server using windows
19:37 sfan5 tenplus1: in that case, we don't provide binary builds for linux and have never done so
19:37 sfan5 wouldn't have helped here
19:37 tenplus1 Clip's Server ran windows :)
19:37 tenplus1 that was a while ago tho
19:40 Krock Fixer, coming back to the gdb suggestion. In this case it would only help to see what Lua function is causing the crash - so the mod directory could be grep'ed to see which code line must be changed to work around it
19:42 tumeninodes in other news, I guess I may as well, rebuild my own version of MTG over from scratch using 0.5.0-dev. Rebuilding it from 0.4.16 or 17 just doesn't seem to make sense at this stage
19:42 Shara Really, even I'm not insane enough to host a server on windows :)
19:42 Fixer maikerumine ran on windows
19:43 garywhite I've done it temporarily on my laptop once I figured out port forwarding, it made the fan go to full speed with an external cooling fan attached
19:43 tumeninodes there are some servers which run dev builds (which is insane)
19:44 tenplus1 how stable is 0.5 just now ?
19:44 Ruslan1 joined #minetest-hub
19:44 Shara garywhite: I've done small test servers on windows before, but I'd never run my actual real public MT servers from it
19:45 tumeninodes I've had no issues with it, not sure I'd rely on it for a server though, with many players
19:45 tenplus1 o/ shara
19:45 Shara Hi 11 :)
19:45 tenplus1 so the question is, will 0.4.17 have these bugs fixed and be re-released as stable 0.4.17.1
19:45 tumeninodes Hello madam Shara :D
19:45 Shara Hi tumeninodes :D
19:46 tumeninodes you mean a bug fix for the bug fix?
19:46 tenplus1 this was meant to be a stable release
19:46 tumeninodes bug fix release
19:47 tumeninodes to fix quirky things
19:47 tenplus1 oh this wasnt quirky, it was full blown crash loop
19:47 Shara Well, lack of testers will lead to this...
19:48 Shara But then ease of testing is an issue
19:48 rdococ yay, 0.4.18
19:48 tenplus1 typically with 0.4.16 I tested dev versions on server as each deb came out and I was happy using it... with 0.4.16 nothing came out until the final release
19:48 Shara I assume you mean with 0.4.17?
19:48 Shara (for the second)
19:48 tenplus1 ah yes
19:48 tenplus1 my bad
19:49 Shara We did actually update Dark Lands (or sniper did, because he's more awesome about this stuff than I am).. but I've been too busy to watch closely for errors.
19:49 tenplus1 this is why we need pre-build binaries for testers, compiling yourself is a pain in the ass and most ppl cant be bothered doing it each update
19:50 Shara Though I think if there had been major issues someone would have yelled at me.
19:50 garywhite Minetest 0.4.18 Beta 1
19:50 tenplus1 lol gary
19:50 tumeninodes idk, I completely moved all my folders, then did an update via ppa, and had weird shtuff going on. Had to wipe folders, uninstall and reinstall 2 times till it is all "normal" now I guess
19:53 tumeninodes there were some changes I thought we're in 0.4.17 but realize now I was mistaken.
19:55 tumeninodes tenplus1, have you tried using Calinou's portable build for 0.5.0?
19:55 tenplus1 for linux ?
19:55 tumeninodes yes
19:55 tumeninodes https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?f=42&amp;t=3837
19:55 tenplus1 not yet, portable would be kewl, run on place ?
19:55 tumeninodes that is what rubenwardy pointed me to
19:56 tenplus1 ohh, compile yourself build, gotcha...
19:56 tumeninodes and updating is  simply pull and make j-(how many cores)
19:56 tenplus1 0.5 has daily builds for ubuntu/mint I can install and test
19:57 tenplus1 no need to compile, only issue is now many servers using 0.5 and I cant connect to xanadu using it
19:57 tumeninodes ahhh
19:58 tumeninodes I have .minetest 0.4.17 , and minetest 0.5.0, which makes me happy
19:59 sfan5 hm
19:59 sfan5 there is no server that runs on windows in the top 40
20:00 rubenwardy good
20:00 rubenwardy XD
20:00 rdococ IIRC, latest 0.5.0-dev build has an error in builtin/game/register.lua:448. would do a PR but I'd probably fuck it up.
20:00 tenplus1 heh
20:01 tumeninodes how many windows servers are there?
20:01 Krock too many
20:01 tumeninodes ha
20:01 rdococ it should be "not def["on_" .. method](name, caller) then" as opposed to "...def[priv]..."
20:01 tumeninodes oh , that's good to know rdococ, thanks
20:02 tenplus1 did you post issue or pull to fix it ?
20:02 rdococ Was planning to post it as an issue
20:02 sfan5 tumeninodes: a quick calculation says about 21
20:03 rdococ but couldn't find an issues section on gitlab?
20:03 rubenwardy it's a mirror
20:03 tenplus1 *shudder* gitlab
20:03 tenplus1 no sir, I don't like it
20:03 rdococ ah
20:03 rdococ rubenwardy: so it's tsetenim
20:03 tumeninodes that's a pretty low count considering how many servers but, pretty reasonable for a mostly Linux project
20:04 Krock rdococ, no it's Wᴉuǝʇǝsʇ
20:04 tumeninodes bugtest
20:05 rdococ ʇsǝʇǝuıɯ
20:05 tumeninodes is the Russian?
20:05 tumeninodes :P
20:05 rdococ ʇuck
20:05 rdococ yʇy!
20:06 tumeninodes I'm gonna piss everyone off and go with sourceforge ; )
20:06 tenplus1 why not, was the biggest before github :)
20:07 tumeninodes deal with it 8^)
20:07 tenplus1 am thinking of notabug.org , I find it familiar and fast/simple to use
20:07 tumeninodes if no one has checked lately, sourceforge has made some changes and is trying to cashin on this whole thing too
20:08 tumeninodes https://sourceforge.net/
20:08 tumeninodes a migrate tool n everthang
20:09 rdococ lol, I wonder what other sites are trying to cash in on this
20:09 Gael-de-Sailly joined #minetest-hub
20:09 Mr_Pardison joined #minetest-hub
20:09 tenplus1 hi Gael-de-Sailly
20:09 tenplus1 hi mister
20:09 rubenwardy VanessaE: congratulations
20:09 Mr_Pardison Hiya the
20:10 VanessaE ?
20:10 rubenwardy this is package 200:   https://content.minetest.net/packages/VanessaE/nixie_tubes/
20:10 Mr_Pardison *10+1
20:10 VanessaE oh heh
20:10 tumeninodes Hi Vanessa (big hug) yes, it's awkward.., just go with it
20:10 tumeninodes :D
20:11 VanessaE hugs are fine :)
20:11 Mr_Pardison Everyone needs a hug every so often
20:11 tumeninodes hugs are awesome..., unless they're not
20:11 tenplus1 hi Vanessa
20:11 VanessaE hi
20:12 tenplus1 are your servers on 0.4.17 yet ?
20:12 VanessaE they're late 0.4.x, but not 0.4.17-release
20:13 VanessaE *checks*
20:13 VanessaE 3d0617c9 (Feb. 2)
20:13 tenplus1 yeah, xanadu is back on 0.4.16 july 19th
20:13 VanessaE ok, maybe not so late.
20:13 VanessaE but, they're stable, no reason to update right now.
20:14 tumeninodes afk
20:15 rdococ #7421
20:15 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/7421 -- on_grant and on_revoke callback bug
20:16 rdococ OOH, nixie tube mod!
20:17 tenplus1 saw that, looked pretty good :)
20:18 rdococ the idea of tiny vacuum tubes is also cool
20:18 VanessaE you never noticed it before, rdococ?
20:18 rdococ ?
20:18 VanessaE nixies.
20:18 rdococ yes, they do resemble vacuum tubes
20:19 VanessaE I mean the mod
20:19 rdococ how old is the mod?
20:19 VanessaE um..
20:19 tenplus1 20 years and 3 days
20:19 rdococ ah
20:19 VanessaE about 2 years
20:19 VanessaE almost to the daty
20:20 VanessaE day*
20:20 tenplus1 damn I was so close
20:20 VanessaE June 9 2015
20:20 rdococ ooh, in 3 days it'll be the mod's birthday
20:20 Gael-de-Sailly so 3 years?
20:20 Krock tenplus1, just a zero off
20:20 VanessaE huh, yeah almost 3 years
20:20 Krock it's 2017 where VanessaE lives. TIme zones.
20:20 rdococ happy early birthday to nixie_tubes
20:21 tenplus1 yeh...  better watch my offtopic, Paramat has already said he'd kick my ass
20:21 VanessaE no, gitlab just rounded the interval down :P
20:21 Krock like literally
20:21 rdococ if paramat kicks your ass then I'm using paramaters in my functions
20:21 tenplus1 lol
20:22 Krock rdococ, keep all relevant information in a global table called "minetest"
20:22 Fixer_ joined #minetest-hub
20:22 rdococ lol
20:22 VanessaE so I guess this is the wrong place to mention random crap about my 3d printer, like how it just finished a part. :)
20:22 * VanessaE pokes tenplus1
20:22 VanessaE :)
20:22 rdococ 3d print a 3d printer
20:22 Krock when it's built with pistons everything's fine
20:22 tenplus1 so long as the 3d printer is running in minetest, let's talk :PP
20:22 * tenplus1 wishes he had one
20:23 VanessaE there's one on my creative server I think :)
20:23 rdococ if 3d printers can't print themselves, that's kinda sad. humans can print themselves and they're not even printers!
20:23 rdococ okay, well, it's not an exact replica but you get my point.
20:23 tenplus1 what did you print Vanessa ?
20:24 VanessaE tenplus1: some bearing mounts... for the printer that printed them ;)
20:24 VanessaE (doing some upgrades later)
20:24 Mr_Pardison Lol
20:25 * tenplus1 would so print a million keyrings :D
20:26 Mr_Pardison I would print some helpful mobs.
20:26 tenplus1 aww, a mini lava flan night-light... that woudl be soo cute
20:26 VanessaE I printed pipeworks pipes a while back :)
20:27 tenplus1 can place him next to vanessa's pipeworks prints
20:27 tenplus1 yeah, saw those :) kewl
20:27 VanessaE https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2640546
20:27 VanessaE (just to try to steer this back to MT-related :) )
20:28 tenplus1 VanessaE: I made a part for 3d pipeworks: https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:1778066
20:28 VanessaE heh
20:30 benrob0329 minetest toys when? :PP
20:30 rdococ > minetest lego mesecon wire that actually works <
20:31 tenplus1 hi benrob, also yeah. that woudl be a kewl thing... we'd prolly all buy some
20:31 Mr_Pardison Lego my eggo
20:31 rdococ a mesecon brick would come in shapes such as straight, t junction, etc. and would have two copper tubes to make a circuit
20:31 Mr_Pardison Id buy some
20:32 rdococ although if you have wire that goes to a dead end you'd have to cap it off with something to connect the two wires so it forms a complete circuit
20:33 tenplus1 dungeon master sentry toy that makes a sound when someone enters :DDDD
20:33 rdococ dun dun yay
20:33 Mr_Pardison I would sooooo get that
20:33 tenplus1 mese monster bath toy to float around and squirt out water
20:34 rdococ real life luacontrollers
20:34 rdococ with digiline lego support
20:34 tenplus1 yeah, teach kids electronics the simple way
20:34 tenplus1 comes complete with lagg :P
20:35 rdococ it'd be fun to have a slightly more realistic electric system
20:35 rdococ e.g. if they actually had to be complete circuits
20:36 Mr_Pardison rdococ: for technic cabling to work, there has to be a switching station.
20:37 tenplus1 ooh, dirt monster garden ornament.... and sand monster kitty litter item
20:38 tenplus1 nite folks o/
20:38 tenplus1 left #minetest-hub
20:42 rdococ Mr_Pardison: technic isn't for computing though, it's for transferring energy to machines
20:42 rdococ there's no, say, technic 'and' gate or whatever
20:43 Mr_Pardison Yeah. Just said as an example of wiring
20:50 longerstaff13 joined #minetest-hub
20:52 lisac http://www.darklegacycomics.com/548
20:52 lisac ooops
20:52 lisac wrong channel
20:53 Mr_Pardison Hello lisac
20:53 lisac hey Mr_Pardison
20:55 rdococ Hello. Two lifeforms registered as present.
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21:15 Mr_Pardison joined #minetest-hub
21:15 rdococ lisac: that page crashes the tab
21:19 Mr_Pardison joined #minetest-hub
21:29 Mr_Pardison joined #minetest-hub
22:11 garywhite I have an issue. Does this sound server or client-side: When I enter a 0.4.17 server on my 0.4.17 client, the server lags & crashes out, but when I was using 0.4.16 just a few hours ago, no issues.
22:26 longerstaff13 I'm having no issues and I have 0.4.17 on my laptop
22:28 mransom joined #minetest-hub
22:29 rdococ longerstaff13: I think the problem is the 0.4.17 server
22:33 rubenwardy https://github.com/rubenwardy/rubix_kernel
22:36 longerstaff13 rdococ: oh probably
22:37 longerstaff13 yeah cause the server keeps crashing when players other than garywhite join
22:37 longerstaff13 only some players though
22:37 longerstaff13 s/other than/aswell as/

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