Time Nick Message 02:45 paramat minecore doesn't need picks it's already full of holes 12:32 JordachNote8 Beep beep 12:32 JordachNote8 Finished my interview in london 12:32 JordachNote8 Currently on a train home 15:23 Fixer RIP SP 16:03 IhrFussel There was someone named "Jordach" on my server and I'm pretty sure it#s not the real one 16:04 IhrFussel But no bot either (talked in chat) 16:04 Mr_Pardison !seen Jordach 16:04 MinetestBot Mr_Pardison: jordach was last seen at 2018-02-08 12:28:13 UTC on ##minetestbot 16:05 Mr_Pardison yesterday, about 6 am local time for me. 16:07 IhrFussel I already know who it is...but I wonder why they chose that name...is it a common one? Doesn't sound like it 16:08 Mr_Pardison name thief. 16:30 rubenwardy anyone know any good mods for ancient architecture - Greek/Roman 16:41 Krock only castles comes in my mind 16:45 benrob0329 Illuna's VIP server has some Greek builds, might want to ask on #illuna what they use 16:58 rubenwardy did some scouting 16:58 rubenwardy there's darkage, which is mostly medieval-ish 16:58 rubenwardy but has things like marble 16:59 Krock technic worldgen 8) 17:01 Mr_Pardison technic has other stuff which we shouldn't take for granite *ba dum tss* 17:03 rubenwardy huh 17:04 benrob0329 Heh 17:32 Raven262 rubenwardy, you might be looking for this https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=18208 17:32 rubenwardy oh nice! 17:32 rubenwardy perfect 17:32 rubenwardy thanks 17:33 Raven262 Np, It was the first thing that came to mind :) 17:33 Mr_Pardison that looks amazing. 17:33 Mr_Pardison really like what Greek designs look like. 17:40 Megaf I use castles and darkage 17:45 Megaf Hey Jordach 17:45 Mr_Pardison 'ello Jordach 17:45 Jordach i hurt 17:46 Jordach i went to london to do my interview 17:46 Jordach all done properly, i just hurt like fuck 17:46 Megaf define hurt 17:47 Jordach my knees nearly fucked me over 5 mins ago trying to get down 17:47 Megaf Jordach: Tho I'm very happy for you, because you had this opportunity 17:47 Megaf Jordach: how old are ya? You not too young to hurt your knees? 17:47 Megaf fat maybe? 17:47 Mr_Pardison we celebrate later when Jordach feels better as celebrating while not in your best shape isn't good for anyone. 17:48 Megaf well, it's just an interview... 17:48 Megaf I had some as well 17:48 Jordach Megaf: i can walk, just joints upto my knees have always been shit 17:48 Megaf I'm actually working on getting a job from the last one 17:48 Megaf it'd be nice if Jordach and me both get a job 17:49 Mr_Pardison that would be. 17:50 Megaf CBugDCoder: ThomasMonroe: We got some praying to do. :P 17:50 * Jordach has a soft blanket and sits back with some OwOwatch 17:50 benrob0329 Heya Jordach 17:50 Jordach my joints feel like icecubes 17:50 benrob0329 Ouch 17:51 benrob0329 Congrats on the job interview tho 18:10 Fixer Krock: TRIGGERED 18:11 Fixer OOM 18:12 Krock TRIGGER 18:13 Krock Fixer, download RAM now, guys. 18:13 Fixer Krock: technic worldgen and darkage mapgen both suck and crash with OOMs for me, unfortunately :( 18:14 Fixer I don't understand this, why not utilise CPP minetest apis to generate those custom ores? 18:15 Megaf There is a website where you can download RAM 18:15 Megaf here https://downloadmoreram.com/ 18:16 Megaf Fixer: ^ 18:16 Fixer "Cryptocurrency Mining Malware Infected Over Half-Million PCs Using NSA Exploit" 18:16 Megaf and can chose speed and size for the ram 18:16 Megaf From 4 GB to 32 GB 18:17 Megaf Fixer: lovely 18:17 benrob0329 Megaf: it wont work on Apple devices though, too locked down 18:17 Megaf benrob0329: I just used on my mac 18:18 Megaf oh wait, not yet 18:18 Megaf lemme try 18:18 Krock Fixer, perhaps the ore type does not exist as C++ function yet 18:18 Fixer Krock: i'm sure somewhere in lua api there is docs for generating ores 18:18 Fixer yeah, it is in lua, i was wrong 18:19 Fixer but it maybe be better to use lua api 18:19 Fixer and not custom 18:19 Megaf benrob0329: seems to have worked 18:19 Krock there's a generate_ores() function for VManip for custom Lua mapgens 18:21 Megaf whats the Lua function to make more RAM? 18:21 Krock none but there's a garbage collector function 18:26 Megaf We need a few of those in mInetest then 18:33 Krock Megaf, nothing helps minetest if it's an implementation and LuaJIT issue 18:35 Megaf The irony is not strong with this one 18:35 Krock well, a month ago I tried to speed up and reduce the RAM usage by doing dirty pointer accesses in LuaJIT using FFI: https://pastebin.com/raw/WXAydxT3 18:35 Megaf did it work? 18:35 Krock yes but the speed improvement is not noticeable 18:36 Megaf Minetest is pretty speedy already 18:36 Megaf it just takes too much resources for no use 19:07 paramat for technic and darkage just register extra ores and core mapgen will generate them using c++, remove the lua ore gen code 19:11 Fixer yeah, so why don't they REMOVE? 19:12 paramat ask the author 19:13 xerox123 if I make a change while in sqlite3, should the change persist in dummy backend? 19:14 xerox123 because I made something while in sqlite3, quit the game, changed to dummy and the thing isn't there. but when I switch back it's there... 19:16 Fixer paramat: also, will it reduce chance of OOM? 19:16 paramat yes, eliminate because core ore gen doesn't use lua memory 19:17 Fixer niiice 19:21 Fixer paramat: you mean this part and below? https://github.com/minetest/minetest/blob/master/doc/lua_api.txt#L1069 19:22 paramat no the ore API https://github.com/minetest/minetest/blob/master/doc/lua_api.txt#L4985 19:23 Fixer ty 19:24 Fixer paramat: it is suitable both for ores and blocks like big bazalt veins? 19:24 paramat also see https://github.com/minetest/minetest/blob/master/doc/lua_api.txt#L1143 19:24 paramat there is a vein ore yes but it's quite intensive, uses 2 3D noises 19:25 Fixer but it is in CPP? no lua mem limit? 19:25 paramat correct 19:26 paramat it's what core mapgen uses, only the interface is in lua 19:28 Fixer "Chainsaw digs entire forest instead of single tree " lol, nice 19:29 Mr-Pardison Fixer: I made a custom addition to the chainsaw where it would cut down ethereal plant life. 19:30 Mr-Pardison didn't submit it in a PR tho. 19:30 Fixer Mr-Pardison: https://github.com/minetest-mods/technic/issues/375 19:31 Mr-Pardison yeah. 19:31 Mr-Pardison I'm cordial-cobra. 19:31 Mr-Pardison think I should put a PR for it? 19:32 Fixer yes 19:32 Mr-Pardison kewel. 19:33 Mr-Pardison will have to grab it off my flash drive first (which I don't have on me) and then make the PR. 19:33 Mr-Pardison should be up either Monday or Tuesday at the latest. 19:34 * Shara reads issue thread 19:34 * Shara remembers why she doesn't let technic be on her servers 19:34 sofar technic has an open exploit still I think 19:34 Mr-Pardison issue is for it to respect protection. 19:34 sofar formspec exploit 19:35 Fixer Mr-Pardison: i mean, if you have already done PR and you use it and it is kinda fun, wth not to post it :) 19:35 Shara I never even looked at it closley, but it felt full of problems to me 19:35 Mr-Pardison I haven't made a PR yet but will do so by Tuesday at the latest. 19:35 sofar tbh it's only one, and I did a pretty in-depth scan of it 19:35 Mr-Pardison it should be up by Monday. 19:35 Shara It's quite possibly the mod I've been begged to add the most times... but no, never 19:36 benrob0329 I like servers that add content smartly 19:36 Fixer Shara: thats why we need simpler technic, that has basic mashines and tubes, not too complicated 19:36 Shara benrob0329: I try. 19:36 benrob0329 You can have a decent game without using really heavy code 19:36 Shara In all honesty, I didn't have much clue about how to judge good mods from bad when I started, but I took time to learn, and then corrected mistakes. 19:37 Shara Which is why RC has a whole bunch of mods that have been massively edited from the originals. 19:38 Shara Mostly in ways that don't need much maintenance 19:39 Shara Mesecons is probably the mod I use which I'm most cautious about now 19:39 paramat for good reason 19:40 Shara I have most of the nodes requiring a priv in order to be placed 19:40 Shara But the server still gets an occasional "lag machine" built on it 19:40 Mr-Pardison and those of us that have it must be very careful. 19:41 Shara I think servers that add lots of machine type mods (mostly if they are also creative) with no restrictions in place are just asking for trouble. 19:42 Megaf the very reason I never installed Technic is safety 19:42 Megaf I have same simular concirns about Mesecons, tho in Mesecons I can just disable the modules I dont want 19:57 Shara Megaf: restrict by privs if you have worries. That's what I do 20:13 Sokomine rubenwardy: ask twoelk. he has built ancient roman houses 20:16 Sokomine Fixer: darkage is too old for the newer features in the api that support spawning of materials the way darkage needs it. i'm not even sure which fork is most up-to-date. which is a pity because it's a very nice mod 20:19 Sokomine Shara: not much point having technic on a creative server 20:19 Shara Sokomine: you'd be surprised 20:20 Shara For many players it's just about making machines, not about the machines then producing anything you need 20:21 Sokomine Fixer: simpler technic as such doesn't help. it's the actual usage of such nodes that makes it painful. these machine usually generate something from something else, taking materials and time. if it takes a lot of time and requires the mapblock to be loaded, people will build their machine park as close to spawn as they can in order to keep it loaded and "get rich". nobody wants to just stand next 20:21 Sokomine to his machines for ages. so...spawn gets sloooow 20:22 Megaf [20:20:21] For many players it's just about making machines, not about the machines then producing anything you need 20:22 * Megaf hides 20:22 * Megaf hides his machine that is able to build every single craftable item automatically 20:23 Megaf (machine also gathers resources on its own) 20:23 Megaf and its modular 20:23 Megaf and biug 20:23 Megaf big 20:23 Sokomine Shara: making machines that work just for the fun of it is certainly valid. could be done on a small seperate server 20:24 * Sokomine takes sharas build-machine-priv away from megaf and places megaf far away from spawn just to be sure :-) 20:25 Megaf my machine is actually close to spawn so it gets activated more often 20:25 Megaf I went as far as building a city on top of the machine 20:26 Sokomine megaf: that's what i mean. was very prominent on landrush. the place below the mostly inconspicious looking spawn was plastered with underground floors filled with machinery 20:27 Megaf tho the city and machine are after active range from spawn 20:27 Sokomine and vanessaes survival server got a lot of complex machinery that produce almost anything right below spawn. i still think that's what's making it almost impossible to do anything on the server :-( 20:28 Shara I sadly find the VE servers mostly unplayable, or at least whichever ones it is that have those issues. 20:29 Sokomine i don't think that "takes time" is a good approach for machines gameplay-wise. that's also why you need to hit the "machines" in cottages repeatedly and click on a button in the plasterwork machine 20:31 Sokomine yes, sadly. my computer suffers a lot at ve-s. yet it's also the server i like most 20:31 VanessaE Shara: :( 20:34 Shara VanessaE: whichever the server was that I last joined - I can't even join without my client crashing now 20:35 VanessaE looks like it was my Dreambuilder Survival 20:35 Shara I guess it would work from a different name though. Seems to be linked to that one spot (I was using a different name anyway I think) 20:35 Megaf AFAIK VE servers use high res textures 20:35 VanessaE it's up to the engine devs to fix your crashed. 20:35 VanessaE es* 20:35 VanessaE Megaf: nope. 20:36 Shara And I wish they would :) 20:36 Megaf VanessaE: Im quite sure I saw a VE server with high res texture paclk 20:36 Megaf tho this was like, 4 or 5 years ago 20:36 VanessaE Megaf: no, you didn't. 20:37 VanessaE none of my servers have ever run custom texture packs, let alone high res textures 20:37 * Megaf is going crazy 20:37 VanessaE and my oldest server is only like 3y old 20:37 Megaf maybe I was crazy back then and now Im getting better, most likely 20:37 VanessaE heh 20:38 Megaf This week was quite good for me, brain wise 20:41 Sokomine VanessaE: yes. and you say "only". and buildings are kept from the beginning and preserved. that's one of the points why i love your server so much even though i can't really join it anymore 20:41 VanessaE :) 20:41 Sokomine other server owners sadly switch maps like their underpants 20:42 Megaf I had 3 map switches in 6 years 20:42 VanessaE I basically only switch maps if the map file becomes corrupt, or the world becomes so horribly organized that it can't be cleaned up. 20:42 Shara I've never switched. 20:42 Megaf tho I cound as 2 map switch because the first one I count as a total different server 20:42 Sokomine Shara: your server is still a newcommer compared to vanessas :) 20:42 Megaf count* 20:43 Shara Not really if her oldest is only about 3 years 20:43 VanessaE 1 actual map switch in 3 or so years (I don't count the original VE-Creative map, the original server was just for testing) 20:43 Shara Mine's into it's third year you realise 20:43 Megaf Megaf Server, Megaf Till It Ends ands Megaf After The End (AKA Megaf Server v4) 20:43 Megaf Till it Ends and After The End I count as same server with different map 20:44 Megaf reason it has 5 years "only" 20:44 Sokomine VanessaE: yes, and that switch from the very first map to the second one was a very well-done switch. not just "ups, er, let's take a new map" but instead as well-built spawn and roads as possible plus saving of what was worth saving. good maintenance and cleanup. wish all server owners would be that way 20:45 Sokomine Shara: hmm. i'm pretty sure it has to be older than that. your rc-server came a lot later 20:45 VanessaE in any case, it's up to the core devs to make the client gracefully handle what the server throws at it 20:45 Shara Sokomine: Probably depends on map restarts? 20:45 Shara I'm sure I remember people talking about one of the VE servers just having had a map restart around the time I first began hosting 20:45 Sokomine Shara: hm, no. but i'm pretty sure vanessas server is older than just 3 years. with the same map 20:45 Sokomine would have to check old screenshots to be sure 20:45 VanessaE Sokomine: don't forget daily backups, and the well-planned public mains grid on VE-Survival :) 20:46 Shara But I was never sure how long ago the thing they talked about was 20:46 Shara Either way, stop calling me a newcomer. 20:46 VanessaE oh my 20:46 Shara I've been here long enough for you to take me seriously now :P 20:46 VanessaE VE-Creative is 4.9 years old? 20:46 Shara Impressive :) 20:46 Sokomine VanessaE: the daily backups are of high value :-) and that's not the only thing: backups are actually used if needed, griefers are thrown out if possible 20:46 VanessaE (VE-S is 3.2y) 20:47 Sokomine the well-planned public mains grid is rather a step in the other direction :-) i suspect it contributes to me not really beeing able to join :-) 20:47 VanessaE Sokomine: nah, it's much leaner than it used to be 20:48 Sokomine Shara: *g* it's all just relative :) mt as such is a newcomer. redcrab...well, that is old :) or was. sadly does not seem to work any longer 20:48 VanessaE and the overhead lines are high enough that they'll be out of view on the slowest clients (short view range) 20:49 Sokomine Shara: and don't worry. it looks as if your server will work for a long time. it is very close to vanessaes approach of maintaining a server and does fit what i expect of a server very very closely. it's only that it's creative...just really can't handle that as such. creative priv is fine, creative mode is...tricky 20:49 Sokomine VanessaE: i still look in fear at all the produce-everything-machines around spawn :-) 20:50 VanessaE Sokomine: that's ironic coming from someone who maintains a Technic store near the spawn ;) 20:50 Fixer Sokomine: spawn gets slow even without those damn machines 20:50 Sokomine having to switch between too diffrent digging speeds is somewhat tricky for me. it's more about controlling the client 20:50 * Sokomine looks innocently at VanessaE 20:51 Sokomine (need to...er...gather some minegeld somehow :)) 20:51 Sokomine when i built that i thought of small tiny household-machines - mini-networks, not connected :-) 20:51 VanessaE heh 20:52 Sokomine fixer: hm. if there are still other reasons for making spawn slower then those ought to be located and eliminated 20:52 VanessaE in any case, 20:53 Fixer Sokomine: unless spawn is protected entirely, it tends to be slower with time due to digging around and below causing more and more complexity and render 20:53 VanessaE there's really no reason clients should render spawn so poorly just because it has lots of mostly-hidden machines - it's the server running the machines' code, not the client. 20:54 Sokomine fixer: sounds convincing. but that'd affect other areas with complex structures as well? maybe it's just less obvious there. or less complex 20:54 Sokomine VanessaE: i suspect it's the frequent updates. you can't send the mapblock with spawn to the client once and then hope it's done. all those mapblocks change constantly and need to get sent, processed and displayed by the client 20:54 Fixer VanessaE: minetest actually renders shitton of stuff below and above and behind buildings 20:55 VanessaE Sokomine: that'd be fine if there were visible changes taking place all the time, but there just aren't 20:55 * Sokomine eyes all the traffic lights, machines, displays and the like 20:56 VanessaE Fixer: yeah, I know it does. That really REALLY needs addressed. 20:56 VanessaE Sokomine: only one display screen, and only a dozen or so lights that change only every few seconds 20:57 VanessaE whatever's slowing the rendering down must, by definition, be in the dozens-of-times-a-second domain, not every few seconds 20:57 Sokomine every few seconds - that's still something :-) and those machines in the underground aren't fixed either. some grow plants, harvest them, turn them into other materials...lots and lots of metadata changing 20:58 VanessaE if the server is sending mapblock updates dozens of times a second, that's also an engine problem. 20:58 Sokomine hm. could be. still, i doubt that all these frequent updates make it easier 21:00 VanessaE not to mention, dozens-a-second would just plain kill your network bandwidth 21:00 VanessaE so no. 21:00 VanessaE since that isn't happening, this is a client problem 21:02 Sokomine hmm 21:03 VanessaE Sokomine: remember, RBA once said the signs are being composited and re-rendered continuously in realtime rather than being cached 21:03 Sokomine maybe not dozens-a-second. still...frequently. maybe in the range of 2 seconds or so? the plants grow, the nodebreaker eats them, pipeworks sends the nodes on, machines process it, chests receive the output...that does mean quite frequent changes. not mulitple per second but many 21:03 VanessaE (as in all the [combine and related compositing strings) 21:03 Sokomine oh 21:04 VanessaE idk if that's actually accurate, but if he said it, it has a grain of truth 21:04 Sokomine certainly 21:04 Mr-Pardison fixer: will have that PR up by tuesday. 21:04 Mr-Pardison g2g cya 21:05 Jordach you know those spy kids movies with iris scanners and all that sci-fi 21:05 Sokomine he was the expert in that area. i don't think too much has changed in that area since then 21:05 VanessaE and remember, those are static signs, they never change unless someone walks over and edits one. 21:05 Jordach i just realised we have that *now* 21:07 Sokomine VanessaE: maybe it all sums up 21:08 Sokomine Jordach: don't remember if i ever saw more of that film than a part. wasn't that intresting iirc. what else apart from iris scanners was shown there? such scanners can be seen in many movies, not even really sf 21:09 Jordach Sokomine: we've not had comsumer grade iris scanners that are actual sci-fi style with near instant recognition 21:10 benrob0329 #Minetest-Chat 21:10 Jordach my phone can look at me in near darkness and unlock itself by having my iris' checked 21:10 Jordach ^ normies only :^) 21:11 benrob0329 Unless you want people to complain about the logs... 21:11 Sokomine Jordach: ah. wouldn't allow my phone to do that 21:11 Sokomine hmm. having one that follows your eye movements instead of doing an iris scan might be intresting. and use that for steering in mt :-) 21:12 Calinou Chuck Norris does not get authenticated by his phone. Instead, his phone is authenticated by him. 21:12 Calinou sorry, 2011 called 21:12 VanessaE Sokomine: possibly. plus frequent technic metadata updates cause mapblocks to be re-sent/re-rendered. sadly I can't do anything to fix any of it. 21:12 VanessaE plus I won't generally touch technic's code. that whole damn mod needs rewritten from scratch. 21:12 Calinou I still remember these jokes :-) 21:12 Jordach Sokomine: we can do that now! https://tobiigaming.com/products/ 21:12 Megaf !server flat mind = flat blown -> ???? != ??? '??? 22:22 Amaz :D 22:22 Krock Mr_Pardison, look out for the repository owners, whether someone is active 22:27 Fixer !tell Mr_Pardison i see a saw charge change, it should probably be out of this PR 22:27 MinetestBot Fixer: I'll pass that on when Mr_Pardison is around 22:43 benrob0329 IhrFussel: "it all CG because I definitely know about such things" is all I hear. So sad 22:45 benrob0329 Half of them probably aren't even legit, because its become a meme at this point 22:46 red-001 yeah that camare feed from the car felt a bit werid since it wasn't really what you expect, since space is serious business (tm) (r) 22:47 IhrFussel benrob0329, it looks a lot like CGI, but it could be real...I watched a video comparing the weather of different locations (clouds) to the one in the footage and it matched 22:48 benrob0329 >where's the moon 22:48 benrob0329 Hate to tell you this, but the moon is a lot smaller than you think 22:50 red-001 "how can we hear music if it's in space?" -- some flat earther, somewhere on a spheroid 22:52 benrob0329 Oh gosh 22:52 benrob0329 That can't be legit 22:52 red-001 well the world is clearly a flat surfrace mapped into a torus 22:53 paramat VanessaE meh, stop blaming the devs for everything :] part of the blame is the sheer complexity of your servers, and all the mesh updates. we're always trying to improve performance 22:53 paramat "there's really no reason clients should render spawn so poorly just because it has lots of mostly-hidden machines" yes there is :] 22:56 paramat hmm i hope there isn't on-topic chat at -chat, because then i'll have to monitor that and we're back to the same problem 22:56 paramat we need an 'offtopic' channel for only offtopic 22:58 Shara paramat: never going to happen 22:58 red-001 yeah 22:58 VanessaE paramat: mapblock updates should be cached server-side 22:58 Shara But if I notice anything in -chat you need to know about, will tell you 22:58 red-001 that isn't how people talk 22:59 VanessaE more than one or two a second to each client is overkill and you know it. 23:01 VanessaE and besides, if the server has to send something to the client that slows down the renderer, that's the client's fault for not handling it properly. 23:04 VanessaE paramat: so. tell me something: let's assume RBA's claim that "[combine" and other compositing operations are being re-processed client-side every frame. assuming there's no other choice but to use compositing, what would be the correct solution, given all the manpower, time, etc. it would take to do it right? 23:06 VanessaE (to me, the solution is simple: perform the compositing one time only, and "re-render" only the completed, static image) 23:06 paramat IhrFussel Elon's quote about the car says it well: "You can tell it's real because it looks so fake, honestly. We'd have way better CGI if it was fake. The colors all look kind of weird in space. There's no atmospheric occlusion; everything's too crisp" 23:07 VanessaE haha 23:07 VanessaE paramat: don't panic ;Z) 23:07 VanessaE ;) 23:08 red-001 plus its a car in space surely space x would fake something more believable 23:10 VanessaE red-001: I still think Elon shoulda made the mannequin animatronic ;) 23:10 red-001 then livestream it on youtube with jump scares 23:11 VanessaE not THAT kind :P 23:11 VanessaE I was thinking more along the lines of a simple wave or something :) 23:12 VanessaE (or as others have made the comparison, to take the similarity to "Heavy Metal" a bit further) 23:12 paramat a client cannot ignore updates, so slowdown is inevitable. also, updates have to be sent, caching them probably has issues 23:13 paramat no idea about compositing =) 23:13 paramat servers have to take *some* responsibility for overloading MT 23:14 paramat but yes much engine work is needed too 23:15 VanessaE paramat: mapblock updates should be cached server-side, and received updates can be just stored up client side if it decides there's not enough time to process the update 23:15 VanessaE there's no reason, for example, that you couldn't delay processing an update by say half a second. 23:15 Fixer but that Jeija video is not Minecraft, but Minetest 23:16 paramat what if the updates are constantly high-rate? it can't catch up. also, memory use 23:17 VanessaE paramat: then it can discard old updates if there's something newer for the same mapblock. 23:17 paramat anyway, i'm no expert :] 23:17 paramat hmm well at least there's a channel where excessive offtopic can be moved too, that's good 23:18 VanessaE I'd say the current discussion is as on-topic aas it can get. 23:18 paramat ah good point 23:18 paramat (about discarding) 23:20 Sokomine so if the client doesn't redraw the mapblock every time it receives a change but just from time to time? might help to some degree. the block the player is standing on plus adjacent ones would still need immediate updates (imagine player digging/building) 23:21 VanessaE Sokomine: that's my point yes. 23:23 paramat worth an issue 23:24 paramat ugh there are capitals in the name of the chat channel 23:24 VanessaE paramat: another point, as you know my servers use a lot of entities. entities are slow to render compared to a node with the same model, even if the entities are just sitting in one place, non-animated, totally static. Solve that, the compositing issue (if true), the mapblock updates question, the private metadata issue, and make the view range automatic again, and I'll bet it'll make things good agian. 23:25 VanessaE well, and the occlusion culling problem too 23:27 VanessaE these problems have existed for years, and us modders have done our best to keep up, but those ^ are things we just cannot work around. As server owners, we can't avoid the heavy mods, or we lose traffic. that's why I blame the devs. 23:28 Shara Hah, paramat - that bugged me too! 23:30 Shara But VanessaE has some very good points. My survival server has been intentionally kept as light as I possibly can keep it, while still having just enough to catch players attention... but it has hit plenty of problems 23:30 Shara Hi tumeninodes 23:31 tumeninodes HI Shara 23:31 VanessaE > mentions heavy mods 23:31 VanessaE > "too many nodes" joins channel 23:31 tumeninodes Hi Vanessa 23:31 Shara Heh 23:31 VanessaE your timing is impeccable, tumeninodes :) 23:31 tumeninodes it's a gift 23:31 Shara But there can never be too many nodes! 23:31 tumeninodes nope..., just one 23:32 IhrFussel I implemented a "hack protection" now ... if a user tries to connect too many times within a short timeframe, the login is blocked for 1 minute 23:32 tumeninodes eh, my joke was premature 23:33 tumeninodes paramat, would love to talk more about that stairs/water issue I mention before. I have no idea how to integrate it into the stairs mod 23:34 tumeninodes I will be back and forth from keyboard very randomly 23:37 IhrFussel The skywars server has anticheat disabled?? Lol...I see Android users taking blocks from far away 23:44 garywhite Can someone tell me if Minetest Android is written in C++/Lua just like the PC/Mac/Linux versions? 23:45 red-001 yes 23:45 red-001 IhrFussel, huh how? reading the log? 23:46 garywhite Someone seems to think that this tool from Google to turn the APK for MT into an iPhone app 23:47 red-001 speaking of that pretty sure multicraft has code for running on IOS in thier repo 23:48 red-001 can we backport thier code or did they go GPL? 23:49 IhrFussel red-001, no, the only way to do it purely via Lua is just counting the number of connect attempts within X secs and *assume* that it's likely a "brute-force" attack 23:57 paramat VanessaE entities can never be as lightweight as a node obviously. view range is manual so a player can alter it according to the environment, so that is a non-issue 23:58 paramat "As server owners, we can't avoid the heavy mods, or we lose traffic" yes you can and some servers do. servers can be good without poorly coded overkill mods